Game of Thrones films finale in Itálica & Lannister boots on the ground (SPOILERS!)

Photograph by @GuiArteSVQ

Photograph by @GuiArteSVQ

On the second day of Game of Thrones filming in Southern Spain, the Itálica set itself remains as tightly shut as yesterday, very much in contrast to the leaky sets in the Basque Country the last few weeks. However, we still bring you spoilers involving Lannister men and the placement of what may be the most vital scene in the season. Also, the last stragglers arrived this evening: Now we have a full cast in Seville!

Many in the community deduced the sequences shot this week in Seville must take place around the season finale, but as of last night the possibility turned into certainty: Jeremy Podeswa, who is directing the season premiere and the finale, is now in Itálica. What’s more, this time we don’t have to rely on paparazzi to ascertain this, as Podeswa himself uploaded pictures of the beautiful Andalusian sunrise to his Facebook page.

Furthermore, Watchers on the Wall sources reveal that, at the very least, Peter Dinklage and Conleth Hill were filming today, and that someone we expected would film in Seville but hadn’t been seen in the city arrived at long last: Anton Lesser. Finally, the last remaining piece of the puzzle, Lena Headey, was sighted this evening with Conleth Hill:

Besides them and two-thirds of the cast, who else will take part in this critical location? Whether a battle breaks out or not, the parties involved come prepared to fight one: Today, @yeahclarke shared these behind the scenes photos from an unknown source, which show dozens of Lannister pieces of armor ready for the extras in Seville:

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If you aren’t caught up: This week’s shoot is for at least one major climactic sequence. Itálica’s amphitheater and Seville’s Royal Shipyards will depict the dilapidated dragonpit. This is even more exciting once you realize everyone and their mother will be involved. In fact, of the twenty-three starring cast members, thirteen are confirmed to have a role at the dragonpit, accompanied by four guest stars. With seventeen major characters, the Dragonpit will be the most crowded location in the history of Game of Thrones. Currently, we can’t know if they will all share the screen or if more than one scene is being filmed in the same location. Either way, this is a historic confluence of characters: Cersei, Daenerys, Jon Snow, Tyrion, Jaime, Davos, Missandei, Sandor, Theon, Brienne, Varys, Bronn, Jorah, Euron, Qyburn, Pod, and Gregor (aka the FrankenMountain.)

The mere act of mapping out the relationships between all these people would be madness, but I hope Benioff and Weiss were able to exploit as many of them as possible. Can an encounter between Cersei and Tyrion possibly end up without violence? May Bronn joke around with his old pals Tyrion and Pod, or will it be too inappropriate even for him? Will Theon face his uncle Euron proudly or will he retreat to his Reek self? Will Sandor finally have an opportunity to confront his hated brother, who is not much more than a zombie now? Share your thoughts on the countless possibilities in the comments! But remember: Unreported spoilers from the leaks belong exclusively in the forums.

338 responses

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    1. Lena’s still in London. Now bingewatching Stranger Things. Don’t they only have 5 days to film the dragonpit scene? Perhaps she’s not part of it after all.

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    2. Lena Headey’s still in London, now bingewatching Stranger Things. Don’t they have 4 days to film the dragonpit scene? Perhaps she’s not part of it after all.

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    3. It is strange that both Arya and Sansa are absent esp Sansa who spent 4 seasons at KL. We haven’t heard anything of Arya this season. For sure Cleg B.

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    4. I’ve only checked these things periodically, but one thing that’s stuck out – I haven’t seen any evidence of Littlefinger being very involved in any of these filming stories. Is that true? Wonder if he meets his fate prior to the finale.

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    5. Curious about Tarly father. He was supposed to play a part now that the Tyrells disappeared or was he a prop for Sam the slayer? It would be pity not to use him. And what about Elaria the Snakes and Olena? At least some of the Snakes should be there…

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    6. You might want to change the layout of the forum, because it’s bad, then people would be more willing to discuss spoilers there instead of here.

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    7. Mind reeling with all these characters there!

      All their past transgressions, crimes, grudges, emotional fallout… Jayz, it’s gonna be huge!

      As a Jaime fangirl, I’m concerned that he seems to still be “team Cersei” at this point. (all those Lannister armour for the extras etc. and NCW being in Sevilla… End of S7, ffs! 🙁 But maybe this confrontation turns him? (pretty please?)

      In the books,

      Jaime ditched Cersei at the end of the fourth book, while he was at the retaken Riverrun and she was held by the faith, before her walk of shame. He then goes off with Brienne (whom he trust) without a second thought, for a potential meeting with LSH.

      I can understand the show wanting to do their break-up more dramatic and sudden, not the slow build-up it was in the books. I just hope they finally get there!

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    8. This would appear to be an opportunity to trim down the cast in one fell swoop, though we’re likely looking at multiple scenes in this one location. I wouldn’t mind Team Cersei getting wiped out in the next-to-last season so that everyone else can hustle up North-aways. Very worried about losing some second-tier faves in the process, though – especially Theon, Brienne, Davos and Varys.

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    9. It’s sure not looking good for Grey Worm is it. One would think he’d be present at such a gathering, especially considering the other attendees.

      I wonder if the other cast members that aren’t part of this are a little jealous.

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    10. The famous scene in Dragonpit maybe include some interior scenes with Queen Cersei which can be done in NI so Lena is not necessary to be in Italica…….

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    11. Clob:
      I wonder if they other cast members that aren’t part of this are a little jealous.

      Surely they are! This may well be the biggest scene ever (in terms of character development/impact) of the biggest tv show ever.

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    12. Flayed Potatoes,

      Could potentially serve as a secret meeting place for Cersei/Euron and subsequently an invasion touch point for the Targaryen/Northern/Dornish/Tyrell (hell everyone not Lannister or Euron-led Greyjoy) representatives

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    13. We had HairWatch, KitWatch and now Lena. Filming at Italica goes for a few days, so she might be needed later on?

      EDIT:Thanks Myname, Lena is there too.

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    14. OptimusCrime:
      dothrakian raven,

      Sanza is in charge of winterfell while jon is gone

      Def agree! I think (spoiler tagging just in case!!)

      the Stark kiddos are hanging out in WF

      for most of the season. That’s where you’ll find LF. Or, more hopefully, his dead body. :O 😀

      Also, I’ve officially given up trying to avoid spoilers. If only I could channel the strength of posters like Mihnea or Dee Stark Alas, I have no willpower. Lol!

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    15. kaka:
      lena headey isn’t in seville. are you guys sure cersei is supposed to be in this scene?

      Luka said up on top currently they cannot tell if they all share a scene. It is surprising that Lena is not there yet. and Mark Gatiss, he is in Seville. Will he be at the Dragonpit or KL? Not enough info to get a clear picture.

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    16. Yep, people gon dieee! It can’t be an anti-climax and it shouldn’t be as we’re nearing the end.

      The Northern arc is such a mystery at this point. Love how Tyrion, Dany, Jon and co are having a party in the warm South whilst the Starks are about to get ripped apart by the WW.

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    17. Clob,

      Yeah, I’m starting to think something must happen to him. I can’t think of a plausible location for him to be other than this scene. Maybe Dany left him back on Dragonstone or something, but that seems odd when they’re going out of their way to get every character who can plausibly be at this scene there.

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    18. BlueRoseofWinterfell:
      The famous scene in Dragonpit maybe include some interior scenes with Queen Cersei which can be done in NI so Lena is not necessary to be in Italica…….

      I could picture Qyburn trying to sneak Cersei away from the mayhem through tunnels under the city while Euron is battling Team Dany. But Varys knows the underground passages better than anyone, and could lead Tyrion to head them off. That’s a confrontation I’d like to see – as long as the Mountain is otherwise occupied.

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    19. Sansa is probably still in Winterfell. She won’t step foot in Kingslanding anytime soon. She’s probably ruling while Jon’s away..Now, I don’t understand why theyd leave her there alone? Or maybe she sent Brienne off with Jon/Davos to watch over them? Cause she knows how Cersei is. Gah! I wanna know everything!

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    20. Shaz,

      They are not having a party and I guarantee you that Jon Dany and Tyrion are worrying more about the ww than Sansa and Lf up in winterfell.And they aren’t about to get ripped appart the wall still stands.Jon is doing this for his family also all humanity lol.

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    21. Heather:
      Sansa is probably still in Winterfell. She won’t step foot in Kingslanding anytime soon. She’s probably ruling while Jon’s away..Now, I don’t understand why theyd leave her there alone? Or maybe she sent Brienne off with Jon/Davos to watch over them? Cause she knows how Cersei is. Gah! I wanna know everything!

      If Bran arrives before Jon leaves, Jon is going to feel like Bran is the rightful Lord of Winterfell and that he’s free to pursue other priorities, I think. Presumably he leaves a force of Wildlings and Vale soldiers behind for their defense.

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    22. Mark Gatiss is in Seville?

      Newbietothegame: Luka said up on top currently they cannot tell if they all share a scene. It is surprising that Lena is not there yet. and Mark Gatiss, he is in Seville.Will he be at the Dragonpit or KL?Not enough info to get a clear picture.

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    23. Jenny,
      We don`t know very much about Winterfells story to tell that Danny,a conqueror from the south who lived all her life far away from Westeros cares more than Northern people who lived very close to the danger of WW.

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    24. afeastfordances:
      Clob,

      Yeah, I’m starting to think something must happen to him. I can’t think of a plausible location for him to be other than this scene. Maybe Dany left him back on Dragonstone or something, but that seems odd when they’re going out of their way to get every character who can plausibly be at this scene there.

      I’ve been looking back and he hasn’t been in much of the external shooting at all. Some from the early episodes on Dragonstone. I suspect he doesn’t make it.

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    25. I think there will be diferent scenes on the dragonpit, 17 characters together is crazy. And maybe a bigger one with the main players.

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    26. Sansa is a going to die this season, hence her exclusion here is my prediction, she’s not needed for the final battle and someone has to die otherwise this will be quite a boring season!

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    27. H.Stark,

      All these actors are filming at the same time and it’s all for the finale cause of Jeremy being there but it’s different scenes?Are they going to be splitting time in the dragonpit in the finale?Is the dragonpit the new big brother confessional lol?It’s a lot of characters yes but you can divide them in three factions or even two if you want.It will make for great tv.

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    28. Jon Snowed,

      Okay? Arya, Bran, Gendry, there are several other people who are not in this scene. That doesn’t mean they’re all dying. Sansa is probably back in Winterfell, she’ll never go back to KL if she can help it. Besides, someone has to stay in Winterfell.

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    29. Luka said

      The mere act of mapping out the relationships between all these people would be madness

      Yeah, that’s what I’ve been thinking, lol. GRRM’s and D&D’s insidious way of making all our favourites having links to not-so-favourites and each and everyone having some beef with their allies or potential allies. It’s not simply a story of the “good guys” vs. the “bad guys”.

      Jon, Dany, Tyrion, Cersei, maybe others, have been somewhat “whitewashed” because the incredible moral complexity of the books is just too much for a TV show.

      That said, the show is presenting the viewers with moral dilemmas. For instance, the Hound, who rode down and killed an innocent child (Mycah), yet protected and mentored Arya. Tyrion killed his father – we watchers may have “hated” Tywin and symphatised with Tyrion, but kinslaying is still one of the gravest crimes in Westeros, only breaking guest right (looking at you, Freys!) is worse.

      Almost everybody has a gripe with somebody even in their own camp, let alone potential allies. For example, Ellaria and the Sand Snakes killed Tyrion’s beloved niece Myrcella. He killed Jaime’s father, Jaime killed Dany’s father, Cersei (sort of) killed Jon’s father (Ned – I’m not sure the Rheager thing will come out this season). Melisandre tried to burn Gendry and burned Shireen but resurrected Jon.

      Get the drift?

      And all these people have to unite to fight the WW threat. I’d say Cersei is not for uniting, she’ll insist she’s the Queen to the bitter end. Euron has his own agenda. The question is, can the others unite agaist the WW threat? The Northern lords might not like their newly proclaimed king going south to negotiate with some “foreign whore”. Littlefinger will exploit the situation to the full. (I just hope Sansa finally gets smart, leads him on and then exposes him and oversees his spectacular downfall (that might be S8 stuff) because LF is Sansa’s to take down.)

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    30. BlueRoseofWinterfell,

      Dany will be spending most of the season with Jon according to filming pictures so yes she will find out about the ww and will be involved in that plot whereas I bet everything Lf and as a result Sansa will be continuing their games and mention the ww like once and I’m being generous.

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    31. Jenny,

      Yes, it will look great. But maybe we see smaller scenes too, it would make sense to make the most of every actor and not just having there standing for one line.

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    32. Clob: It’s sure not looking good for Grey Worm is it

      or Yara. Damn. If Theon is there, and Euron is there, then Yara should be, if she’s alive. Well, cast members did say a while back that there were some sad scenes.

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    33. talvikorppi,

      If you think about it, the fact that the show insisted on changing and delaying Jaime’s arc so much gives a big hint. Obviously the show tries to make Jaime-Cersei break-up as surprising as possible, Jaime-Brienne love story as subtle as possible, and keeps Jaime unpredictable and conflicted as long as possible, for a reason. Actually the books do these too, but the show exaggerated it.

      According to me, this shows that Jaime will have a big impact on the endgame, there will be surprising developments in his storyline, and the show is trying to make it as sudden, as dramatic, as shocking as possible. It may be a hint showing that Jaime is the valonqar, and the show simply tries to hide it until that moment. Or Jaime-Brienne romance will have an impact on the endgame, and that’s why they try to keep it subtle. Or Jaime will play a role in defeating WW, if not Cersei, and that’s why they insist on keeping Jaime and his storyline unpredictable.

      I’m convinced that especially the show deliberately kept Jaime and his arc ambiguous and controversial for the surprise factor.

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    34. H.Stark,

      Oh yeah of course I bet we will have several conversations.There is so much potential Tyrion and his siblings Theon and Euron I hope he stands up to him and I can’t imagine Cersei’s reaction to Jon and Dany and my faves Jaime and Brienne.I also want Tyrion Bronn and pod to recreate the old group lol.The hound and Brienne should put aside their differences and just kill the mountain together on the spot lol.

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    35. Jenny,

      I don’t think it’s the whole season, my assumption is he meets her about half way through. They film everything separately, and in the pictures Jon is leaving Dragonstone. Idk though.

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    36. Firannion: I could picture Qyburn trying to sneak Cersei away from the mayhem through tunnels under the city while Euron is battling Team Dany. But Varys knows the underground passages better than anyone, and could lead Tyrion to head them off. That’s a confrontation I’d like to see – as long as the Mountain is otherwise occupied.

      Oh he will be. Otherwise occupied I mean. Harma Dogmeme doesn’t seem to be around to say it so I will. CLEGANEBOWL CONFIRMED – GET HYPE!!

      All we need now are giant killer penguins riding flying zombie nazi sharks to swoop in and kill everyone and that will be a finale no-one will ever forget. Obviously it would use up practically the whole of S7 and 8’s budgets combined, but as there will only be about 3 people still alive in the whole of Westeros after that, they won’t need it anyway 😀

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    37. Luka Nieto:
      Aemon,

      No. Mark Gatiss’ scene is probably early in the season. This one is in the finale. Newbietothegame must have been confused.

      I wonder what Tycho Nestoris will be up to this season. I’ve always been intrigued by the Iron Bank’s role in the ‘bigger picture.’ The fact that the IB and the Faceless Men are headquartered in the same city does not seem like a coincidence.

      Perhaps he will try to collect an overdue loan payment from Cersei – and then what? Engage a FM agent who just happens to be in Westeros? Or send their most elite assassin, who also happens to have business in Oldtown?

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    38. It’s hard to imagine Cersei living through this season. Then again, it’s was just as hard to imagine her and Euron being able to withstand any military force the size that Dany has under her command by land or sea for more than 5 minutes. But here we are with them seemingly still having some chips to play on the table late in the season, so who knows. I just hope that the writers realize that it’s going to take something absolutely bonkers happening for Cersei putting up a fight being believable, like a magic horn or Dany somehow losing 75% of her army before the fighting begins.

      Gotta think they’ll wrap up the Lannister-Kings Landing bit this season, regardless.

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    39. Heather,

      He is arriving in Dragonstone in a Mylod episode which makes it ep two or three lets say three for the minimum scenario.He is leaving in a shakman episode with Davos and considering Davos is doing his bit in Kl in ep 5 I would say they leave after that in ep 5 too.And they are together again in the finale as we can see.So that would make it four episodes or even more as far as we know.So yeah that’s most of the season.

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    40. Jenny,

      As i said before is something that we don`t know because we don`t know many things about Winterfell this season…..Yes according to the pictures Jon will spent a lot time with Danny in Dragonstone….all we know LF plans but how sure you are that is also Sansa`s plans ?????? Sansa is a Stark she can understand winter much more than Danny..she is not leader she can fight like Danny but she can be helpful in other things …….

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    41. Cersei has all her enemies at Kings Landing. All her humanity died with her last child. There is wildfire planted in the capital. I would NOT want to be in Kings Landing now. She wants to destroy her enemies. I am actually very concerned. This is the finale.

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    42. BlueRoseofWinterfell,

      I know Sansa can be helpful in other things and I believe she will be in season 8 but she has to take care of Lf first and I doubt very much it wil concentrate on ww.Also Dany is more central to the ww plot even though she doesn’t know about them yet she will be crucial.

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    43. Ser Joshua,

      Cersei is a goner. It is hard for me to write that because I love her character. ” When you play the game of thrones you win or you die” –Cersei. She’ll never relinquish the throne and then play nice with

      Jon and dany

      to save the realm.

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    44. Heather:
      Sansa is probably still in Winterfell. She won’t step foot in Kingslanding anytime soon. She’s probably ruling while Jon’s away..Now, I don’t understand why theyd leave her there alone?

      She’s not alone. She’s in Winterfell, surrounded by Stark-Arryn soldiers and the royal court.

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    45. Making the 8: Jeremy

      Probably, smartly out of the way in the Vale

      By and large this makes sense, eg they have to refine the focus for the climactiv battle against WW so they are going to kill a lot of people off like Sept of Baelor last season

      My guess in spectacular style involving Dragonfire!

      Only way Cersei and presumably Euron would go up against Dany is if they have one of the Dragons (my guess has always been Viserys, other option is Tyrion)

      Wonder if Jon Snow ends up riding Rhaegal (who I think he’ll take over) at this battle, a bit like Dany in Meereen

      My guess would be if there is only five days, we would have external shots take place on location and there would have to be quite a bit of studio work involved for a lot of close-ups and fine tuning for the scene etc – eg the myriad of interpersonal stories would take up a fair amount of time

      This will be like the Wall battle where the entire episode was focused on it, except the very end with perhaps the White Walkers smashing their way through the Wall

      (Jon Snow wouldn’t have Northern Army down South otherwise – I reckon he must make some kind of deal with Dany at Dragonstone to help her take KL in return for helping with the WW’s up North afterwards)

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    46. BlueRoseofWinterfell,

      I agree. I think Sansa is a survivor and in my opinion even Arya or Daenerys is more likely to die than Sansa. She isn’t one of my favourite characters, I think she has been foolish, selfish, spoiled, unreliable and useless but I feel like she will survive. She came so far against all odds, despite the fact that she doesn’t have any skill to protect herself…because she always does whatever is necessary to survive. She gained a lot of experience in life despite her age, she started showing sings of maturity. She replaced her mother, Catelyn, as the mother figure.

      Yes, she can’t fight in wars, but the wars will end. Then being a skilled warrior, being immune to fire, having magic swords or dragons etc. won’t be useful anymore. During times of war, being a proper lady, having the qualities to be a good wife, a good mother etc. are not important. But during times of peace these are important. Honestly, I can’t see Arya, Daenerys, Brienne, Yara etc. settling down, sitting at home and raising children. But I can see Sansa as a wife and mother.

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    47. Did we ever find out what the scene Benioff and Weiss alluded to last year is? The one scene that was originally a small scene inside the sept, but expanded to a huge spectacle with hundreds of extras and moved to the streets of KL?

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    48. Even if this sequence is in the last episode , and it gonna be a BIG one, seems, there should (will) be an even bigger sequence , involving a lot of cold and snow to end the season, yet to be shot.
      With all this activity , they still shooting until the end of Feb?

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    49. Jack Bauer 24:
      Did we ever find out what the scene Benioff and Weiss alluded to last year is? The one scene that was originally a small scene inside the sept, but expanded to a huge spectacle with hundreds of extras and moved to the streets of KL?

      We’ll find out when they film in Cáceres city, I assume.

      Also, the scene wasn’t originally inside the sept, obviously. There is no sept anymore. It was inside the Red Keep.

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    50. talvikorppi: How tall are Rory and Gwen, lol! Liam isn’t a midget, he’s way taller than Kit.
      Thanks for the pictures.

      Rory is 6’7″, Gwen is 6’3″ and loves wearing heels. ?

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    51. I think that Cersei will ambush everyone at that meeting… Everyone will be gathered there for whatever reason, and then boom! in storms the whole Lannister army…

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    52. innocence,

      Yeah, I broadly agree. Having Jaime ditch Cersei in S4 or S5 of the show would not have worked for the show. I understand why the show made Jaime “Cersei’s lapdog”, though, you have to remember Cersei is nice to him (unlike the books) and never asks him to do controversial stuff in the show. She sends him away (Dorne in S5 and Riverlands in S6) when she does controversial stuff. Nikolaij (who seems one of the actors who undrestand their character best) has said in interviews that by now Jaime is scared because every time he leaves KL, sometihing bad happens with Cersei.

      Poor misguided Jaime, and poor NCW, who, as an actor, had a brilliant S3, with a promise of a redemption arc, and then a holding pattern for a couple of seasons. His scene with Tobias Menzies last season was so good, brilliant, those two guys just acted away off each other. NCW might be a pretty face and Jaime “the most handsome man in Westeros”, but NCW is such a great actor. He does the sleazy arrogance but also the cynicism and even vulnerability, and the wit and sense of humour so well. Perfect for Jaime Lannister, the controversial character that he is.

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    53. Irina Stark,

      Irina, this is not the first time I’ve had to delete your comment because of spoilers from the leaks. Even if you don’t care about the many people who want filming spoilers but don’t want to be spoiled as much as the leaks spoil, you must care that I have to delete so many of your comments.

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    54. Sean C.,
      The royal court… Makes me rather think of some flowery seat in the south 😀 Yet, you’re right, of course.

      And I wonder how many of the Lords we’ve seen will stay at Winterfell and if some of them will even take court offices? Groom of the Stool anyone? 😀

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    55. dothrakian raven,

      Well, I would not show up if I were her: she was a prisoner, who suffered inmensely there. Cersei would probably send the Mountain and/or Qyburn to kill her!! And then there is the uncomfortable situation with her first husband, who did not harm her, but belongs to the family that shattered her world…

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    56. Jenny,

      Sorry! Lol I completely forgot that this was a shorter season. So yeah, Jon will probably be at Dragonstone a good bit. And yeah, Danys lucky. The only thing shes good for is the dragons. That’s it..if you can’t tell, she’s not my favorite character.

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    57. Can’t wait for this scene, this may be a unpopular opinion but I really wish Jamie and Dany would have a heart to heart talk. What was done to her family was wrong but not Jamie stopping her father, even she knows what a monster he was. I’d love to see them talk things through and her telling him he did the right thing protecting the innocent by killing her father. I think it could be quite beautiful as even though they’ve never met they have quite a history. It will probably never happen but I wish it would.

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    58. Steamboat Jimmy,

      I don’t think she has the number of soldiers to actually pull that off .. That’s a bit of a stretch.
      It’s gonna be a clusterf*ck regardless, way too many big personalities in one spot, it can’t possibly go smoothly.
      Maybe Drogon goes all crazy on them and burns them all !

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    59. Steamboat Jimmy: I think that Cersei will ambush everyone at that meeting… Everyone will be gathered there for whatever reason, and then boom! in storms the whole Lannister army…

      That would be cool and then Drogon! and its turn out the lights.

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    60. selena: this is soo awesome.. but at the same time a little sad.. they all know its coming to an end and are enjoying the “rockstar” life lol

      I’d have been trying to sidle up to Liam while Kit was creating a diversion for all the younger, prettier women… ; )

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    61. innocence:
      talvikorppi,

      According to me, this shows that Jaime will have a big impact on the endgame, there will be surprising developments in his storyline, …

      It’s interesting that you brought this up, because in the books,

      there’s quite a bit about Jaime feeling guilt about not being able to protect Rhaegar’s children. He doesn’t feel guilt about killing the Mad King (Jaime hated his guts) but he feels guilt about Rhaegar’s children and not protecting them – he thought they were safe, even while his father’s mad dogs Gregor Clegane and Amory Lorch went into their chambers and murdered and raped them. That was not something Jaime had signed up to. He killed a mad king but he never thought to kill the children. But later he had to suck it up because his father, Tywin Lannister, approved of the deed. No wonder Jaime’s so cynical.

      Given this background, and Jaime’s newly found obsession with honour and knightly vows, Jaime might want to protect and serve a Rhaegar’s child. Even be a kingmaker on his behalf – that’s what the books point towards. References to “kingmaking” (by ancient KG) when Jaime reads the White Book and talks about it with Ser Loras. That could be foreshadowing.

      I’m not sure it’ll go down that way in the show, or even the books, if they ever get published. Just a thought.

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    62. innocence,

      She isn’t one of my favourite characters, I think she has been foolish, selfish, spoiled, unreliable and useless but I feel like she will survive.

      Yuk yuk!

      She came so far against all odds, despite the fact that she doesn’t have any skill to protect herself…because she always does whatever is necessary to survive

      I’m very, very suspicious of anyone who thinks absolutely nothin is worth dying for.

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    63. Am assuming that Jon leaves Sansa in Winterfell to rule; partly because “There must always be a Stark in Winterfell”, and partly because given what happens when Starks go south he realized she was better off in the North.

      IF all of these characters are filming scenes for the finale (have we seen any directors other than Podeswa in town?) then that would suggest that they all make it that far. Season six seems to have cut out a lot of characters and plot not required in the end game, and I would guess that we’d have fewer recurring character deaths in the first few episodes compared to season six. Though given the number that died early season six, that wouldn’t be too difficult (if we are looking for more than a couple of characters to make it to season eight).

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    64. Mel,

      If Jaime wanted to protect the innocent, he would have put a sword in the back of his pointy-headed son, Joffrey; or, alternatively, kept his **** out of Cersai’s ****.

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    65. So one of the biggest, if not THE biggest scene of the entire series to date in the finale of the season being filmed! I am surprised at the sheer number of people still alive by then! Good for them! But Cersei too. :sigh: I am now starting to think that Cersei will be around like a bad penny in the 8th season too. I am so tired of her smug evilness; after so many seasons and so much of her, she has become quite one-note.

      It looks like quite a face-off between the Lannisters and Daenerys and their respective supporters. Plus The Bank and the IronBorn. And of course, Jon Snow. Very curious about Sandor Clegane around. And quite strange that Littefinger is absent when something momentous is going on.

      Perhaps so many of the cast gathered in one spot – leads to a big cull? Like the Red Wedding, and Cersei’s “trial”?

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    66. Mel: Can’t wait for this scene, this may be a unpopular opinion but I really wish Jamie and Dany would have a heart to heart talk. What was done to her family was wrong but not Jamie stopping her father, even she knows what a monster he was. I’d love to see them talk things through and her telling him he did the right thing protecting the innocent by killing her father. I think it could be quite beautiful as even though they’ve never met they have quite a history. It will probably never happen but I wish it would.

      Okay, but will Jaime leave out the part where he was happy to let his son, a BIGGER monster than Aerys (because Joffrey started quite young, 😉 ) continue as the King? Where was Jaime in protecting the innocent from his own monster son? I think it would be rather interesting if it ALL came out. don’t you? 😀
      GoT is so full of these delicious ironies. There was Jaime, telling his tale of killing the monster Aerys, to Brienne. Yet, another side of him tried to kill Bran to cover up his affair with his sister, which was also treason against the King, and turned a blind eye to his own son, the horrendous monster King.

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    67. Mel,

      I don’t feel like that’s needed. He killed her father (for his own reasons) and his family brutally killed the rest of her family and tried to kill her as well. If he gets close enough to her, he might try to depose her the same way he did Bran. Jaime told us loud and clear last season that he would do anything for Cersei and without a doubt, Cersei wants Dany dead. It would be wise of Dany to steer clear of Jaime or Cersei might get her wish.

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    68. Stephen,

      No
      He’s just smart enough to stay away from such trouble.
      This scene looks like it’s going to go down like the sept of baelor scene.
      It looks like him and sansa are the only ones smart enough to stay away from it

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    69. I’m having a mental breakdown re the Hound. Rory McCann very rarely spitted which makes it difficult to determine storylines. Not sure if D&D were great at handling his storylines at times, so if anything involves Gregor I think it really has to be done well considering it has shaped him so much as a character in books and show…
      And I refuse to get over the fact that Conan Stevens is not playing the Mountain..

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    70. I just wonder what will be happening in that goddamned Dragonpit. Has Cersei offered Team-Dragonstone to settle it “the old way” in a trial by combat? She has her wight-Mountain and probably she is eager to see him in action: I can imagine her going this way. As for Team-Dragonstone and Jon in particular, he might see the trial by combat as a way to solve the problem. Of course, Cersey will be planning some mischief in case the Mountain fails, but I assume Team-Dragonstone will have an ace or two up in their sleeve as well.

      And I also wonder about the viewers of this show. I mean, Italica is an arena, and every arena calls for viewers, but extras will be playing only Lannister soldier’s as far as I understand. Somehow I don’t see Cersei staging the show of her life in an empty theater. Maybe the masses will be brought on the screen by means of CGI afterwards? Or the Lannister men will suddenly turn into Faceless Men at some point? That would be a nice mirroring of the Daznak Pit, but hardly it will happen.

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    71. Kay: Okay, but will Jaime leave out the part where he was happy to let his son, a BIGGER monster than Aerys (because Joffrey started quite young, ? ) continue as the King? Where was Jaime in protecting the innocent from his own monster son? I think it would be rather interesting if it ALL came out. don’t you? ?
      GoT is so full of these delicious ironies. There was Jaime, telling his tale of killing the monster Aerys, to Brienne. Yet, another side of him tried to kill Bran to cover up his affair with his sister, which was also treason against the King, and turned a blind eye to his own son, the horrendous monster King.

      To be fair, Jaime wasn’t actually in KL when Joffrey became King and was finally able to exert power — he was fighting against the Starks, then captured and held prisoner by the Starks, and then traveling back to KL with a stop at Harrenhal on the way. Joffrey didn’t live very long after Jaime returned. Joffrey’s existence can be placed squarely on Jaime, but the inability to rein him in I think is more on Cersei and Robert.

      But, yes, undoubtedly the thing that makes Jaime one of my top 3 faves is that he is flawed and grey and clearly half the time battling away his good instincts and the other half battling away his bad ones. Plus NCW plays him brilliantly! I hope Jaime finally breaks it off with Cersei this year for good and pledges the Lannister troops to the North to help battle the WWs.

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    72. Steamboat Jimmy: I think that Cersei will ambush everyone at that meeting… Everyone will be gathered there for whatever reason, and then boom! in storms the whole Lannister army…

      I am not sure she would be able to do something like that, Drogon will properly be very close by. If something happened Drogon could just sweep in and burn them all.

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    73. Kay,

      Jaime was a prisoner during all of Joffrey’s reign In the books and there barely two weeks in the show so I don’t think we can put that on him.

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    74. If Cersei is “one-note”, what are Dany and Jon? Zero-note?

      This series would be crap without Cersei. Showrunners understand this.

      Kay:
      I am surprised at the sheer number of people still alive by then! Good for them! But Cersei too. :sigh: I am now starting to think that Cersei will be around like a bad penny in the 8th season too. I am so tired of her smug evilness; after so many seasons and so much of her, she has become quite one-note.

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    75. Jack Bauer 24,

      They are both professionals and she’s being paid 500k per episode this season – I don’t know about you but if it was me I’d suck it up and do my job for that kind of coin. She’s also involved in a nasty custody battle and last I read she lost her case and has been ordered to return her son to the US once her filming ends in February. It’s in her best interests to show up and do her job as she can spend more time with her son that way.

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    76. Inga,

      But you think that it’ll end similarly to the events in season 3 episode 9? Or season 6 episode 10? I don’t see how this could end well considering how many of the characters here hate each other….

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    77. Kay: Okay, but will Jaime leave out the part where he was happy to let his son, a BIGGER monster than Aerys (because Joffrey started quite young, ? ) continue as the King? Where was Jaime in protecting the innocent from his own monster son? I think it would be rather interesting if it ALL came out. don’t you? ?
      GoT is so full of these delicious ironies. There was Jaime, telling his tale of killing the monster Aerys, to Brienne. Yet, another side of him tried to kill Bran to cover up his affair with his sister, which was also treason against the King, and turned a blind eye to his own son, the horrendous monster King.

      Jaime was barely present for Joffrey’s reign.

      There’s also a distinction to be made between killing a king to present mass genocide as a Kingsguard, and killing a king who is evil but somewhat controlled by the small council etc.

      Has nothing to do with Jaime’s evil deed re: Bran, but I don’t get the argument that it’s some black mark because he didn’t kill Joffrey. By that logic you can state the same about Tyrion, Varys, or anyone else who had the means.

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    78. purpleofhair:
      Mel,

      I don’t feel like that’s needed. He killed her father (for his own reasons) and his family brutally killed the rest of her family and tried to kill her as well. If he gets close enough to her, he might try to depose her the same way he did Bran. Jaime told us loud and clear last season that he would do anything for Cersei and without a doubt, Cersei wants Dany dead. It would be wise of Dany to steer clear of Jaime or Cersei might get her wish.

      That’s assuming the above isn’t bluster to get Edmure to surrender the city without bloodshed. Cersei commanded him to kill Sansa and instead he gave Brienne his sword and ordered Brienne to protect her.

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    79. Aemon: If Cersei is “one-note”, what are Dany and Jon? Zero-note?

      No idea. But Tyrion is most certainly not one-note. IMO, only! But it’s all down to personal preference, and I can no longer stand Cersei.
      Alicia,
      Jenny,
      Jaime was not present for much of Joffrey’s reign, sure. But he was certainly around during Joffrey’s growing up. And if Joffrey hadn’t been poisoned but had lived on to reign, would Jaime, as a father, been able to kill him? That is where the irony lies, IMO and what I was replying to in my earlier post; can he really act all noble and high and mighty about killing one mad King, when his own son was another monster and would have been probably worse, given how young he was when he started?

      JaimeNotJamie: There’s also a distinction to be made between killing a king to present mass genocide as a Kingsguard, and killing a king who is evil but somewhat controlled by the small council etc.

      Of course. Plus the other distinction which I have been harping on about. A mad King who apparently wasn’t all mad when he was younger, but grew totally paranoid later and was about to cause mass genocide, and the other, under the somewhat sobering influence of his small Council and still quite young, and yet quite a psychopath. It’s not a black mark that Jaime didn’t kill Joffrey; it’s simply delicious irony that Jaime, who killed a mad King in his youth, grew up and had a psychopath son who became King, and his sister/lover already caused mass genocide in burning down the Sept! 🙂

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    80. Jenny:
      Kay,

      Jaime was a prisoner during all of Joffrey’s reign In the books and there barely two weeks in the show so I don’t think we can put that on him.

      Also, in the books, as well as the show, Cersei never let Jaime to be a “father” to Joffrey (for obvious reasons), not even a “favourite uncle”. Jaime has no relationship with his children. In the books, Tyrion is Myrcella’s and Tommen’s favourite uncle. Joffrey was all Cersei’s creation.

      The show has Jaime returning to KL before Joffrey’s wedding (in the books he only returns after) and there’s the scene where Joff belittles and mocks Jaime (and Meryn fucking Trant agrees with his king). Joff obviously echoes his mother’s sentiments (Joff was a big mummy’s boy) as Cersei was antagonistic towards Jaime at that point.

      Whatever, but Jaime cannot be blamed for Joff. He had nothing to do with how Joff turned out – except some DNA. Maybe the incest gave Joff defective genes. It didn’t to Myrcella or Tommen, both of whom are described as sweet children in the books. Myrcella also as quite brave and clever. (Some of Joff’s defining characteristics were his cowardice and stupidity…)

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    81. JaimeNotJamie: .Cersei commanded him to kill Sansa and instead he gave Brienne his sword and ordered Brienne to protect her.

      Which he is supposed to do. That’s his job according to the oath he swore Catelyn. Instead he pawned off that job on Brienne. He also swore that he would not harm Cat’s family. But there he is threatening to catapult Edmure’s baby over a wall. On the show he’s also responsible for the Blackfish’s death and ensuring that the backstabbing Freys remain in power in Riverrun. Jaime Lannister is not a good man.

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    82. talvikorppi: Also, in the books, as well as the show, Cersei never let Jaime to be a “father” to Joffrey (for obvious reasons), not even a “favourite uncle”. Jaime has no relationship with his children. In the books, Tyrion is Myrcella’s and Tommen’s favourite uncle. Joffrey was all Cersei’s creation.

      But did not Jaime try to murder Bran to protect his children? I thought that was the excuse used to try defend Jaime’s attempts to murder little kids.

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    83. There may be someone else there. Now that Rory’s arrived, you have to wonder if Arya is lurking about. She would almost certainly be in another guise, hence, no Maisie. Yet. It would be logical for Sandor and Arya to have partnered to take down the Mountain and Cersei. Ideally, it will be in the nick of time, just before Cersei can pull one of her shenanigans and ruin the whole alliance. Boring Sansa can sit at home as the Stark in Winterfell–someone has to avenge Ned. If you play the game of thrones, you can win and still die.

      Luka’s point about 17 major characters being present got me thinking. In S1 E1, Robert, Cersei, Jaime, Joffrey, Sandor, Tyrion, Ned, Catelyn, Robb, Jon, Arya, Bran, Sansa, and Theon were all at Winterfell. Of MAJOR Season 1 characters, only Dany, Drogo, Littlefinger, Tywin, and Varys weren’t present. Considering how small the featured cast was back then, to have 13 very important players in one location had even more impact. But probably nobody noticed because it was the very first episode. Unsullied were trying to figure out who was who and what was going on, while we Sullied were trying to memorise the faces of the unknown actors of so many characters (especially POVs) from the books. Those first episodes, Sean Bean and Peter Dinklage were my anchors. Everyone else was new.

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    84. purpleofhair:
      JaimeNotJamie,

      There is no reason to assume in this case. Dany should steer clear of Jaime or he will kill her like he did her father.

      Wh-a-a-a-t?

      If anything, Dany is more likely to kill Jaime. Not personally but maybe have one of her bloodriders swing his arrakh.

      OK, I get that some people think Jaime might still be so in thrall to Cersei that he’d try to kill Dany on Cersei’s behest and request, but no. He’s super uncomfortable with Cersei’s demands and commands and doesn’t carry them out. Cersei ordered him to kill all their enemies, he retook Riverrun without bloodshed and pardoned everybody. And that look he gave Cersei in the finale when she crowned herself after mass murder…

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    85. SerNoName: But did not Jaime try to murder Bran to protect his children? I thought that was the excuse used to try defend Jaime’s attempts to murder little kids.

      Some Jaime fans use that. I think he flung Bran out the window to protect Cersei. Remember, he first saved Bran. He only flung him out after looking at Cersei, and said, with loathing, “The things I do for love”. That doesn’t sound like he was altogether happy about it. Sure, he did it, but with some loathing. At himself, at Cersei, at the spying little sneak.

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    86. Must be great to be a local in Seville right about now. Nice to see that the whole gang’s finally in town. Now we just need the local paparazzi to up their game.

      Seriously, people, RW 2.0? Do you have any idea how much plot armor is packed into that amphitheater? An asteroid the size of Dorne wouldn’t be able to take that place out.

      Has no one considered that these characters could just as easily be doing trust exercises and talking out their feelings in there? “Raise your hand if you have ever felt personally victimized by Cersei Lannister.” (Every hand shoots up, including Jaime’s.)

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    87. SerNoName: Which he is supposed to do. That’s his job according to the oath he swore Catelyn. Instead he pawned off that job on Brienne. He also swore that he would not harm Cat’s family. But there he is threatening to catapult Edmure’s baby over a wall. On the show he’s also responsible for the Blackfish’s death and ensuring that the backstabbing Freys remain in power in Riverrun. Jaime Lannister is not a good man.

      That’s a fairly linear take on things. Debating whether Jaime is a “good” man wholly misses the point of his character. “One good deed does not erase…”

      Regardless, insinuating that Jaime charging Brienne with that mission is pawning it off on her is silly. If you’re so constrained by an interpretation of adherence to oaths, you’d also note that if he left KL on a wild goose chase for Sansa he’d be breaking his oath as a Kingsguard member. He did what he reasonably could do.

      Regardless – all that is besides the point. My answer citing that was that Jaime isn’t some rabid dog of Cersei. He elected to defy her wishes with Sansa. That’s my point and it’s a correct one.

      I’m sure if he saw Dany on a battlefield as an enemy combatant he would try to kill her and she would likewise attempt to do to him. The idea that he’d murder her during a parlay in some plot hatched by Cersei – which is what I was addressing – is not supported by any evidence we have as to his character in the show or books. “Good” man or not has no impact on that.

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    88. Stark Raven’ Rad:
      There may be someone else there.Now that Rory’s arrived, you have to wonder if Arya is lurking about.She would almost certainlybe in another guise, hence, no Maisie.

      I highly doubt they would give Arya a major dramatic part in a sequence and not have Maisie in it.

      Pretty Crow: Could also be that Sansa is still wanted by the crown for her supposed role in Joffrey’s murder. I’m sure Jon could have protected her if she were to accompany him South but that may be a situation that just needed to be avoided by her staying in WF.

      Sansa is no more danger going south than Jon himself is. They’re both rebels against the Iron Throne, and would be executed if caught.

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    89. SerNoName: … But there he is threatening to catapult Edmure’s baby over a wall.

      I can’t help it if you willfully misunderstand the show (and books, if you’ve read them). That scene begins with Jaime being genial and concilatory, offering good terms (considering they’re at war) but Edmure flings everything and his kingslayer reputation at his face. So Jaime plays the Kingslayer, the role Edmure wants him to play. Yeah, I’ll trebuchet babies, I’m a monster.

      Jaime achieved his objective without bloodshed. Contrary to Cersei’s wishes, I might add. Blackfish’s death is only on him. He could’ve fled with Brienne and Pod to fight another day but the old, stubborn fool chose to go down in a futile fight. How is that Jaime’s fault?

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    90. elybe:
      Has no one considered that these characters could just as easily be doing trust exercises and talking out their feelings in there? “Raise your hand if you have ever felt personally victimized by Cersei Lannister.” (Every hand shoots up, including Jaime’s.)

      Haha, love that vision. Group therapy sessions, all sitting around crosslegged in circles. Jaime: “… and I guess I’ve always been used by my sister.” A Dothraki clears his throat and hesitantly says, “Used?… Yes, I was a bloodrider to khal Porno before our khaleesi and… Khal Porno, he used me. It is known. Jaime the Andal, we are brothers.”

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    91. talvikorppi: Some Jaime fans use that. I think he flung Bran out the window to protect Cersei. Remember, he first saved Bran. He only flung him out after looking at Cersei, and said, with loathing, “The things I do for love”. That doesn’t sound like he was altogether happy about it. Sure, he did it, but with some loathing. At himself, at Cersei, at the spying little sneak.

      According to GRRM he did it to protect his family, including his children:

      Bran has seen something that is basically a death sentence for Jaime, for Cersei, and their children – their three actual children. So I’ve asked people who do have children, “Well, what would you do in Jaime’s situation?” They say, “Well, I’m not a bad guy – I wouldn’t kill.” Are you sure? Never? If Bran tells King Robert he’s going to kill you and your sister-lover, and your three children. 

      JaimenotJamie:

      Regardless, insinuating that Jaime charging Brienne with that mission is pawning it off on her is silly.If you’re so constrained by an interpretation of adherence to oaths, you’d also note that if he left KL on a wild goose chase for Sansa he’d be breaking his oath as a Kingsguard member. He did what he reasonably could do.

      It’s not like he really gives a damn about his KG oaths. KG are supposed to be celibate. He has been committing adultery and incest with the Queen. He killed the previous king. His KG oaths don’t have any value at this point.

      JaimenotJamie:

      Regardless – all that is besides the point.My answer citing that was that Jaime isn’t some rabid dog of Cersei.He elected to defy her wishes with Sansa.That’s my point and it’s a correct one.

      He still went to RR on Cersei’s wishes and threatened Edmure with killing his child, got the BF killed and gave RR back to the Freys. In both the books and the show, Jaime thinks that Sansa is probably dead and Brienne is on a pointless mission.

      talvikorppi: I can’t help it if you willfully misunderstand the show (and books, if you’ve read them). That scene begins with Jaime being genial and concilatory, offering good terms (considering they’re at war) but Edmure flings everything and his kingslayer reputation at his face. So Jaime plays the Kingslayer, the role Edmure wants him to play. Yeah, I’ll trebuchet babies, I’m a monster.

      Jaime achieved his objective without bloodshed. Contrary to Cersei’s wishes, I might add. Blackfish’s death is only on him. He could’ve fled with Brienne and Pod to fight another day but the old, stubborn fool chose to go down in a futile fight. How is that Jaime’s fault?

      No, I am willfully misunderstanding anything. Jaime threatens to catapult Edmure’s baby so that Edmure gives in to his demands. So what if Jaime was trying to do it without bloodshed. He was still acting against Catelyn’s family.

      So BF’s death is on the BF? What nonsense. So the BF trying to defend his home against the traitorous Freys and the Lannisters who raped and plundered the Riverlands is wrong? I guess Jon and Sansa should have also given up and left WF to the Boltons as well.

      So Jaime – the guy who was responsible for a war that led to thousands dying because he could not keep it in his pants – is not the bad guy? It’s the Black fish? Wonderful.

      Jaime Lannister is a lying, cheating, child murdering, coward whose one good deed till date involved saving Brienne from a bear and sending her off with Ned’s sword to save Sansa. There’s nothing redeeming about this fool.

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    92. elybe,
      Heheheh…. brilliant! Oh and the icebreakers! Hi my name is Jon Snow and I know nothing folks… umm…this dragon is trying to chew my slippers. ?

      Hello, room service? this room is a tad breezy (standing in middle of pit).

      Hello room service? Can I get a side of kick to go with my Davos soup…?

      Heh… I’m terribly silly. But it’s also late in NY and after a tarte tartin, brain is in food coma mode.

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    93. Hype is too REAL! Can you imagine Dany, Jon, Cersei, Tyrion and Jaime all together in the same scene, not to mention Sandor, Theon, Brienne, Varys and Mountain too..well, this will literally BREAK the internet. Oh boy. This scene will be the most EPIC thing ever.

      btw, i love the fact that Jon will spent most of the season with Dany..Season 4 and Season 6 were my favorite seasons..but Season 7 already seems will be my new favorite!

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    94. Anon,

      Just because you don’t like people who think or feel that nothing is worth dying for, it doesn’t change the fact that they have a much better chance to survive than others. They may be less sympathetic, but they live longer.

      purpleofhair,

      First of all, Jaime doesn’t do everything for Cersei. He just says so. If you really believe that “Jaime told us loud and clear last season that he would do anything for Cersei”, you didn’t understand the story and you will be very surprised next season and in the final season. The show made Jaime keep saying that he would do anything for Cersei until the 6th season finale, despite it’s different in the books, because probably the show wants to make it surprising and shocking when he abandons or even kills Cersei in the end. For example, Jaime deep down loves Brienne romantically but he can’t admit it yet. So if you only listen to his words you wouldn’t see this yet, but if you pay attention to subtext, to what he does, how he acts and looks, it’s clear and you would guess that there will be a romantic development between them at one point. So, despite saying that he loves Cersei and would do everything for her, he will actually stop loving her next season, start openly loving another woman and switch sides eventually…that’s the writer’s intention, that’s what his storyline is about, it’s about change.

      Therefore, you shouldn’t base your expectations and guesses on what he said, he is a complex character unlike one-layered simple characters in the show and can’t be understood with shallow viewing. He can try to kill Daenerys if he has to, of course, but not because Cersei asked him to do, because it’s a war and Daenerys tries and intends to kill him too. Daenerys killed as many people as Jaime killed. But I don’t think they will kill each other, Jaime will switch sides in the end and Daenerys will understand and forgive him at one point.

      SerNoName,

      Jaime is my favourite character and I think he is a great man. But he is a love-hate character, he is the favourite of half of the fandom (especially book fans), but the other half tends to dislike or some even to hate him (especially hardcore Stark-Jon-Daenerys fans). So, in fact arguing about Jaime has always been a pointless argument because if you still dislike the character you just won’t see him from another angle and be prejudiced whatever he does in the future, even if he saves the world. And people who love the character will keep loving and defending him whatever you say, because like I said they see him from different angles. But I assure you that at the end of the series Jaime will be a hero, people will cry for him, that’s the thing with redemption arcs…conventionally speaking, he was a bad guy in the beginning of the story but he changes and finishes the story as a good guy, as a hero.

      I said “conventionally speaking”, because the concepts of “good” and “evil” are actually artificial. As you can see, you say “he is evil because he is a murderer”, another says “no, he had his reasons, I would do the same thing too”. You say “but he said this, he said that”, the other says “it’s not what you say, it’s what you do”. Someone you hate may be the other’s idol. Someone who hurt you deeply might have saved another’s life. What is good to you may not be good according to me. There is no good and evil in the nature, those are concepts made up by humans.

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    95. I’m not sure if I’m the first to say this but Valonqar could be Jon Snow. He is the youngest child of Rhaegar. Therefore he could be the Valonqar that would kill Cersei.

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    96. innocence,

      I agree with you, I’ve always been a big Dany, Jon, Tyrion fan but I’ve also always loved Jamie. His done some pretty shitty inexcusable things but he is a very complex character and that’s why he is enjoyable. He always seems to be struggling between his love for Cersei and being a honourable Kingsguard. I think after the mad king he gave up for a long time cause he tried to do the right thing and everyone called him dishonorable and a kingslayer but you see when Joffery was looking in that knight book that Jamie stills want to do memorable honourable deeds.

      The author has explicitly said his story isn’t about good vs evil, he makes characters who even though they have good intentions at heart sometimes do terrible deeds aka Dany and Tyrion etc. All the characters are grey, and that makes them so much more complex and more interesting to watch. Though as much as I adore Jon, I’d like to see more grey from him as well as his probably the character we’ve seen the least amount grey in.

      Good and Evil don’t exist in this show or the books, the author even said he doesn’t consider the WW as good or evil either. It’s more about humanity and all the mistakes and flaws we have.

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    97. We need to keep an eye out for Maisie. I think it’s possible one of these people is actually her wearing a face. I see her arriving at King’s Landing in the finale after a Stark reunion at Winterfell.

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    98. Thi Targaryen:
      Hype is too REAL! Can you imagine Dany, Jon, Cersei, Tyrion and Jaime all together in the same scene, not to mention Sandor, Theon, Brienne, Varys and Mountain too..well, this will literally BREAK the internet. Oh boy. This scene will be the most EPIC thing ever.

      When S6 ended I never imagined Jon’s story would take him to King’s Landing in S7. Seriously, the thought never crossed my mind. And yet, there he will be, in the wretched city where his father, grandfather, and uncle were murdered, and where his other father once lived. Mind. Blown.

      And then to learn Dany and Cersei are going to meet?? And Theon will be there too?? And the Mountain and the Hound are going to cross paths??? And Brienne & Jaime will see each other again? And Tyrion will reunite with Pod & Bronn? I could have maybe imagined all that happening throughout the season but all of this in one episode?? Yup, this will be on a scale of heretofore unknown epic proportions, lol.

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    99. Thronetender,

      Guessing I might be in the minority but, and maybe cause I’ve not read the books, but their deeaths wouldn’t bother me that much. Someting wrong with me maybe…but I never came to care very much about these character. I like them, but didn’t spend enough time to get to know them really to be broken up thinking about their demise. Maybe depending on how it happens I might be sad. I’m thinking t this point only more of main characters death would matter to me.

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    100. ygritte,

      Kit is like rest of the cast. really nice lad, humble and genuine.

      Thi Targaryen,

      As Jon and Dany shipper you must be. Partially, Iam happy for you and partialy I’m happy too to see them interact, but I would imagine better things for him and no dance around someone else, making hearty eyes and stuff, but we don’t have to choose it. D&D do and they decided this way.

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    101. Asoiaf fan,

      Well now that would cause fury in the fandom and a black mark against Martin if in S7 finale all our favorite characters die by Cercei’s hand in one fell swoop and all of season 8 is basically watching her, Jamie and a few stragglers like the Stark girls try to fight off the WW lol. Come to think of it, Bran is supposedly such an important character yet his screen time has been majorly lacking. Something tells me he comes into play big time in the last season.

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    102. Geralt of Rivia,

      I’ve been hearing about this “dancing around” making eyes at Dany and I’m perplexed. Jon Snow does not dance, and if he did what kind of music will be playingin Westeros? Lol. What is the context? As an aside, I don’t know how to feel about these two having romance. Part of me likes it and feels it’s inevitable but another part thinks they don’t seem right for each other, personalities don’t mesh for me.

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    103. Geralt of Rivia,

      Well lucky for you he’ll be doing plenty of other things than making flirty eyes and dancing around so you don’t have to worry.That’s ridiculous I don’t remember anybody complaining that during ygritte all Jon was doing was making eyes at her and I assure you this will take less time in his overall storyline only because both of them have plenty of other shit to do.

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    104. elybe,

      I can’t believe people really think this would be another sept blow up lol.One that would really repetitive but most importantly the sept only had minor character we are talking about the five top tier actors in the cast here,the protagonist of the story.They ain’t going anywhere.

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    105. Jenny:
      Geralt of Rivia,

      Well lucky for you he’ll be doing plenty of other things than making flirty eyes and dancing around so you don’t have to worry.That’s ridiculous I don’t remember anybody complaining that during ygritte all Jon was doing was making eyes at her and I assure you this will take less time in his overall storyline only because both of them have plenty of other shit to do.

      Actually I did dislike the way the show did Jon’s book 2/3 story on the show. In the books, it’s Jon slowly learning about the different Wildling tribes and their ways, traveling across the vast beautiful landscape and being conflicted over being an oathbreaker. On the show it was essentially a Jon/Ygritte romcom. Jon’s season 3 plot was one of the most boring of that season.

      Hopefully the Jon/Dany stuff will be better because we are nearing the end and because Jon needs to do more than fooling around with Dany. His possible interactions with characters like Tyrion indicate that he will be doing more and it looks like he will be trying to get allies and dragons down south. So I don’t think there’s anything to worry about.

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    106. Jenny,

      I actually disliked some of stuff they did with Jon and Ygritte. Rose is a wonderful actress but that was not my taste. Different people, different opinions. Others do love it and that’s fine.

      I do hope so that both of them will do actually relevant things and be responsible as leaders. Things we heard are not exactly encouraging but we’ll see.

      I’m in opinion that romance at this point is a bit unnecessary but others might have a different opinion or not their relationship should be heading there. I think Jon represents far more than just a love interest, he’s her only family relative. Nice bond, actually supporting each other and be there for one another is beautiful, meaningful and something she lacked. She wants family and place to belong. We’re not gonna agree on this, as we both want something different.

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    107. ygritte,

      I actually dont believe she will blow everyone up. Maybe my wording was misleading. Of course I dont believe only a few stragglers will remain while most others will be blown away. But Cersei is not going down without a fight and she is not an individual who can EVER be negotiated with in my opinion. She indirectly was responsible for Jon’s father’s beheading and Sansa was a prisoner of hers for years. She just blew up her enemies. I will be extremely disappointed if all that story telling for 6 seasons gets thrown out the window. Unless I’ve been watching a different Game of Thrones this past year than some others, Cersei in power is a scary thing. But I guess anything can happen. It is only speculation and I’ve never read the script. I also feel Bran is a central character but filming continues until February and we have only just begun.

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    108. I agree there are other people missing from the scene but Sansa dying seems logical given that we know there must surely be a main character death and Sansa is not one of the core characters (Jon, Dany, Tyrion, Bran and Arya) from GRRM original story. Of course she may leave but lack of filming also supports her death this season. Sophie also hinted some characters will be saying good bye this season.

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    109. Geralt of Rivia,

      We heard the same things we just interpret them differently.They will be doing plenty of other things the characters are central to the plot and this is still game of thrones.Romance has never been a big part of it.Dany finding family in Jon is heartwarming even though not really realistic.They don’t know each other from eve and he will be really conflicted about his origins also not a very dramatic story I’m afraid.There is much more potential this way.Acutally I’ve never particularly wanted a romance between the two of them but I just realized that’s where the story was going and have taken it for granted for some years and have no problem with it.I know you don’t like it but hang in there I think GRRM has in mind a spectacular ending for both of them lol.

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    110. I was convinced Cersei would die this season but now it seems far more likely that she beats Dany in a battle early in the season and Dany never takes Kings Landing – instead she turns her attention north.

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    111. SerNoName,

      Fair enough.Actually I do remember book fans being unhappy about Jon’s arc in season 2 and 3 even though I loved 3 two was kinda meh.But I would say Jon and Ygritte are maybe the most popular couple from the show and the general audience loved it so that’s what I was talking about.But yeah Jon and Dany will be completely different.

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    112. Pigeon,

      Exactly: this time Cersei will lose and, if Qyburn fails to create a wight-dragon to evacuate her at the right moment, she will die as well. Too many potential valonquars will be gathering around her (BTW that’s why I think that Cersei might survive till S8 for tears to drown her before the one true valonquar comes).

      Jonah Salomon,

      Regarding whether this Dragonpit sequence will be more like the Red Wedding or incineration of the Sept, I think neither of them is a right parallel. What I expect is a trial by combat (all the tyrants love public trial shows) and the crowd turning against Cersei after her wight-mountain is taken out. I just lost regarding who might be on trial. Sansa has not been spotted, neither has Yara. But on the other hand, Cersei will have plenty of other convicts. With all these little birds flying around, her detention facilities should be stuffed: I can imagine Atarazanas Reales filled with people to the limit, if the shipyards are indeed standing for a dungeon as I assume. And eventually Cersei will have to dispose some/most of these convicts to free space for new ones. So, why not to offer them a trial by combat with the wight-Mountain as her champion? That would be a good challenge for Team-Dragonstone-United: Jon is the best swordsman who ever walked (according to the rumors), so ether he will have to come and fight the Mountain, or ruin his reputation, and it’s obvious that Jon will come seeing that as the last chance to dethrone Cersei before the WW hit hard. I expect both parties to have Plan B as well (IMO, Jon might be counting on a public revolt). However, I think that there will be many more champions volunteering to fight the Mountain, like Sandor, Brienne, and first of all Jaime, and that will undermine whatever mischief Cersei will be planning.

      And one more idea regarding the Iron Bank. We have discussed that Cersei might try to pay her debts by engaging into slave trade (and I have found this theory rather plausible), however, that wasn’t the way how monarchs used to solve the problem of insolvency in real history. In real history they simply mortgaged their lands: mostly individual territories, but sometimes an entire realm could be mortgaged as well. I could give a few examples when insolvency caused changes in the political map of Medieval Europe. So, I can imagine Cersei rendering some or all of the Seven Kingdoms to the Iron Bank. The only question, how the Iron Bank will rule them.

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    113. Also, I wonder what Jon thinks of the capital. He is the most like Ned out of all his family and his clothing and hair style point to that in an indirect way . All the backstabbing and behind the back talking while smiling to your face made Ned long for the north. I remember Ned hated it in the south but he was duty bound. Jon’s grandfather and uncle were murdered under the mad king. His father figure Ned was beheaded under the Lannister regime. On the other hand he is part Targaryen. If this is the finale, I wonder if Jon knows this fact by this point.

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    114. Asoiaf fan:
      Also, I wonder what Jon thinks of the capital.He is the most like Ned out of all his family and his clothing and hair style point to that in an indirect way . All the backstabbing and behind the back talking while smiling to your face made Ned long for the north. I remember Ned hated it in the south but he was duty bound.Jon’s grandfather and uncle were murdered under the mad king.His father figure Ned was beheaded under the Lannister regime. On the other hand he is part Targaryen. If this is the finale, I wonder if Jon knows this fact by this point.

      Yeah, bad things happen to Starks who go south; Brandon and Rickard died on the orders of Aerys, Lyanna died in childbirth in the red mountains of Dorne, Ned was beheaded outside the Sept of Baelor, Robb was butchered at the Red Wedding, Sansa was beaten and tormented by the Lannisters, and Arya became filled with vengeance. His Targaryen blood will hopefully help Jon survive better than his Stark relatives, but I cannot decide if he will know the truth before going south. I hope that he does, because I think it would add another dimension to any meeting with Daenerys – does he feel he needs to tell her, or does he think it simpler to keep her in the dark?

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    115. Jenny,

      When I saw S2 and 3 for the first time, I wasn’t particularly bothered by the Jon-Ygritte romance (before reading the books) even though the storyline did not seem too important compared to what was going on elsewhere. It was after reading the books that I realized that a lot of the good stuff had been omitted to make room for this romance. That’s when I realized that his S2 arc could have been much better and it started bothering me lol. People who do not have the books for comparison, I assume, would not have much problems with the Jon Ygritte romance.

      However unlike seasons 2 and 3 where this romance was made the driving force of Jon’s story, S7 will have to focus on the bigger story and any romance will take up minimal screentime. This is not something we need to worry about for next season, imo.

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    116. Jon Snowed,

      I think so too, not necessarily beat Dany but she won’t lose or die anytime soon. Cersei won’t be going anywhere.
      And I think Jon will actually be the one to turn Dany’s attention to the North, either by persuation or reason and their love will spring along the way. He needs her for the WW and she needs him to seize the Throne. It’s a two way street and beautifully balanced plot.

      Inga,

      Haha, that’s true, a Dance Of Dragons ! I’d love to see him dance with Dany or at least smile at her. He needs to smile more, in the words of our dear Emilia Clarke: “He’s so pretty !”

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    117. Jon Snowed,

      I’ve thought sometimes Sansa might turn out to be the “younger more beautiful” one who takes all that Cersei holds dear (Maggy the Frog prophecy) in which case I can’t see her getting bumped off. I did get a bit of vibe of Elizabeth I of England in the Sansa on horseback scenes last week (Elizabeth I was a redhead – as was her unfortunate cousin, Mary Queen of Scots). If they are going back to the “There must always be a Stark at Winterfell” mantra it would make sense for Sansa to stay there if Jon is going away.

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    118. This is exactly what I am thinking as well. There was some filming in Dragon stone for the next season that shows how angry Jon is towards Theon, who at least has a redemption arc. I can’t imagine what Jon will feel about this place. Even though I feel he is trying to bring together various diverse groups of people in order to work together, (according to Dan and Dave) any time a Stark goes south it concerns me. Reading the books really gives you a sense of who these people really are, and how they really would react toward other characters as well as other locations. This is why I am looking forward to the actors being in character when the season starts. I think he has some characteristics of Rhaegar, who in the books was described as sullen, sulking, stoic, melancholy. He almost reminds me of a younger version of Jorah in some ways, who in the books is described as serious, but very loyal to those he loved. But Jon reminds me the most of Ned which is why I worry. But I personally don’t think Jon will die this season. Far from it, actually.
      Alba Stark,

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    119. Watchers reported that Euron would be taking care of the sandsnakes, I’d guess Olenna also falls this season either by Cersei or by Euron. Given the amount of characters in this scene it probably gives us an outline who dies in the earlier episodes (Sansa, Sandsnakes, littlefinger, Yara etc.)

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    120. Dame of Mercia: the Sansa on horseback scenes last week

      Anybody notice my ho-ho “deliberate” mistake – should be “last season” not “last week”.

      Dear Moderators, do we have a slight glitch on the board? I did click “Edit” to try and fix my “deliberate” mistake but I just got a blank box not containing my comment.

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    121. asoiaf fan:
      This is exactly what I am thinking as well.There was some filming in Dragon stone for the next season that shows how angry Jon is towards Theon, who at least has a redemption arc.I can’t imagine what Jon will feel about this place.Even though I feel he is trying to bring together various diverse groups of people in order to work together, (according to Dan and Dave) any time a Stark goes south it concerns me.Reading the books really gives you a sense of who these people really are, and how they really would react toward other characters as well as other locations.This is why I am looking forward to the actors being in character when the season starts.I think he has some characteristics of Rhaegar, who in the books was described as sullen, sulking, stoic, melancholy.He almost reminds me of a younger version of Jorah in some ways, who in the books is described as serious, but very loyal to those he loved.But Jon reminds me the most of Ned which is why I worry.But I personally don’t think Jon will die this season.Far from it, actually.
      Alba Stark,

      I don’t see him dying this season either – he is one of five characters I see as definitely having the plot armor required to make it to season eight (the others are Daenerys, Tyrion, Bran and Sam).

      Jon is very much like Ned, and I feel like in season six there was a huge effort in terms of costume and hair to emphasize the similarities between the two of them. I have always found it ironic that Jon, the one who isn’t Ned’s biological son, is more like Ned than his trueborn sons.

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    122. Alba Stark: IF all of these characters are filming scenes for the finale (have we seen any directors other than Podeswa in town?) then that would suggest that they all make it that far. Season six seems to have cut out a lot of characters and plot not required in the end game, and I would guess that we’d have fewer recurring character deaths in the first few episodes compared to season six. Though given the number that died early season six, that wouldn’t be too difficult (if we are looking for more than a couple of characters to make it to season eight)

      Podeswa is doing E1 and E7 , guessing this has to be an episode in E7. But supposedly the BIG action episode is E6 is Alan Taylor, I don’t know if he’s been seen around production yet? So who ever survived E6 is at this sequence in S7 which may be the opening sequence of S7 , since I am thinking the closing of S7 is in the North and they will film that later, maybe as late as February! Those not there , who probably are involved in the end sequence in S7 , the Stark Girls, Gendry, Sam, (Grey Worm?), Edd?, who else?, are seeming in the North, I guess.
      Be interesting if anyone sees Unsullied soldiers , since one might expect Dany to have an contingent of both Dothraki and Unsullied, I guess. Can’t see a new ‘commander’ of the Unsullied as a character.
      Of course Melisandre and LF’s whereabouts are a bit of a mystery , right now,

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    123. I have a feeling Jon finding out his parentage and possibly that he is the heir to the Iron throne is in the final season but I feel we the audience may find out towards the end of this season like we did with the TOJ.

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    124. Agree it would also make a great dynamic if Jon and Dany team up against the white walkers, have some sort of relationship then later find out they are related and Jon potentially has a better claim to the throne, that could make an interesting twist between them both.

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    125. Alba Stark,

      I agree. But I always felt Martin uses alot of irony as well as foreshadowing in predicting future events. Example is in book 2 when Theon’s uncle tries to teach Theon about learning to kneel and learning humility. If that chapter isn’t foreshadowing I don’t know what is. Also, I believe there is alot more to come this season. All we know so far is outside Dragonstone and Sevilla filming (very little). It is only really scratching the surface. What about the crypts in winterfell? What does Sam learn? And most important is Bran. He is the central character. I feel all this outside filming as well as the large finale gathering at Sevilla is taking away all of that. There is the crucial story, the actual heart and soul of this that still remains a mystery to me at least.

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    126. Jon Snowed,

      Luka Nieto,

      That would be amazing !! What do you guys think their reactions will be ? How will Dany handle the situation ? If she will be in love with him by that point, what will she choose to do ? I keep thinking about her vision at the House Of The Undying. She chose her dragons over the Throne and she chose to leave Drogo behind.
      Is there a chance she will give up the Throne and let Jon rule after all she’s been through to get it ? I can’t imagine her being okay with playing second fiddle unless the man who takes her place is someone who she genuinely loves/respects, that’s why I think it’s super important for them to form a strong bond in S7 !

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    127. Jon Snowed,

      Martin based most of his morality during the Middle Ages, specifically War of the Roses. Dany and Jon being end game doesn’t fit that mold. One of the reasons King Richard III was so reviled is due the strong rumors that he was involved with his niece and intended to marry her. Cousins were different because they were peers and you could get a dispensation from the church. So I find it curious that they’re going in that direction, I am finding it harder and harder to want to watch the last 2 seasons of GOT. It’s nothing to do with morals, it’s that I expected that based on the books – Martin would kind of cleanse the world of mad Queens/Kings and their deviant ways and although maybe not a happy ever after ending maybe an ending that gives hope for a better future. I can see now that it’s likely the ‘wheel will just keep turning but with new faces replacing the old’.

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    128. I personally feel at least one of them may die before the end, either self-sacrifice or even in some form Nissa Nissa if we go back to the books. I certainly feel that Jon’s parentage will be important in the end game and an ending where he’s reluctantly ruling the seven kingdoms (if there is even an iron throne) sits well with what GRRM describted that said there is equally the possibility that it ends up being Dany. I just don’t see them together as a happy couple at the very end – even if they are for a period leading up to it.

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    129. dothrakian raven,

      I don’t find it weird that Sansa is not in this scene. She was captive in Kings Landing and treated like crap by the Lannisters. Why would she go down to Kings Landing again, why would she even leave the North? Remember the line there must always be a Stark in winterfell. Jon obviously is leaving Winterfell

      guessing she will be left in charge. Arya said she is going home, guessing she just misses Jon. Same with Bran he is at the wall and is clearly headed back to Winterfell. he will hear about the battle and head for home as well.

      .

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    130. Jon Snowed,
      Except that all those thing you claim are anything but certain.
      GRRm’s original outline is of no use to predict the show.
      There is no lack of filming, because filming has just started and will be ongoing until next year.
      Characters say good bye every season, so nothing new.

      What’s left is that you can’t think of anything to do for the character, so she must die early on. That’s not really a convincing argument.

      But even with Sansa dying, there are still too many characters around at the end of S7. I don’t want S8 to become a slaughter fest where two people die every episode. Balon and Roose both dying in “Home” was already too much IMO. It takes away from the single death.

      Maybe we are just too bloodthirsty and come spring, more characters than we thought will be alive. Personally, I think one of the two Messiah figures Jon and Dany will bite it, then definitely Cersei, maybe Jaime, maybe even Bran and some of the secondary or tertiary characters, definitely Littlefinger, some of the Snakes, Cerseis entourage of horror, maybe Jorah.

      There have to be people left to rebuild Westeros: Tyrion, Theon, Sam, the Stark kids, Brienne, Edmure… Why not?

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    131. You know something, Jon Snow: Def agree! I think (spoiler tagging just in case!!)

      for most of the season. That’s where you’ll find LF. Or, more hopefully, his dead body. :O ?

      Also, I’ve officially given up trying to avoid spoilers. If only I could channel the strength of posters like Mihnea or Dee Stark Alas, I have no willpower. Lol!

      I agree, I don’t think Jon is going to discover who his father is this season which kind of it a downer. As to having the strength to avoid spoilers…I tried and caved long before you did. Not sure if it’s the spoilers or it’s just great people here I missed..:)

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    132. Stephen,

      I think Baelish will be in the north primarily this season. Seeing Jon leave he will feel it is easier to play sansa. We haven’t seen him, Sophie or Maisie. Mainly because any outside scenes they have will probably be filmed later when more snow is present or anything they filmed is on the Winterfell set which is closed off.

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    133. Jenny,

      Yeah, but it makes sense to finally have a big scene with as many of the main characters. One there hasn’t been one since the beginning discounting the Purple Wedding – not because it is hard to do a scene like that but because all the characters are elsewhere.

      I think this is not a fighting scene, this a scene about trying to unite Westeros to take on the Wights and to set the game of thrones to the side. Yes, there will probably be multiple scenes with all these characters but I do believe they all end up in the same scene at least once.

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    134. Newbietothegame,

      Its nice to know there are others out there who can see where I am coming from so I won’t feel like the minority here. Last year I discovered this site for clues and spoilers since there was no more book material. The info by the monitors was very accurate and I looked forward to speculating based on source material. Now I feel like I am on another planet at times. It’s a bit frustrating at times but I just deal with it. WOTW still provides very accurate info but maybe I should stop reading comments. It is my own fault since I get tempted and then I feel as if I don’t even know who these characters are anymmore.

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    135. kathy:
      Jon Snowed,

      It’s nothing to do with morals, it’s that I expected that based on the books – Martin would kind of cleanse the world of mad Queens/Kings and their deviant ways and although maybe not a happy ever after ending maybe an ending that gives hope for a better future.I can see now that it’s likely the ‘wheel will just keep turning but with new faces replacing the old’.

      You don’t listen to anything GRRM says, do you? 😉
      But yes, I believe there will be some hope to rebuild and make Westeros a slightly better place.

      Also, there’s a bit of Henry VII, Alexander the Great, and even Cleopatra in Dany. The Wars of the Roses between the Yorks and Lancasters end with an outsider, Henry VII, taking the throne at the end and marrying a York who he’s related to with a better claim to the throne than him. Apparently, Henry’s sigil seems to have a red dragon, a white dog, and a small lion on top. Funny coincidence right?

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    136. Ser Joshua,

      I don’t think the Kings Landing stuff will be wrapped up at all. I believe Cersei will live through this season and will actually still be on the Iron Throne come seasons end. The show is called game of thrones and the only person playing the game the whole time who will be a big bad is Cersei. What I mean is the story is officially turning its sights on the Wight Walkers. That will be handled and then Cersei will be dealt with to complete the Game of Thrones. Unless Jamie kills her at the very end

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    137. Stargaryen,

      Season 8 in a nutshell:

      Eps 1-2: Deal with the apocalypse.
      Eps 3-4: Wrap up the game of thrones.
      Eps 5-6: A series of council meetings which will thoroughly outline the new ruler’s tax policy. Suck it, Tolkien.

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    138. Endgame speculation – not spoilers:
      I agree with other posters that one if not both Dany and Jon will die by the end saving the realm. I even like the idea of Cersei taking them out in the season finale just because it would be so GRRM. But I’m doubtful of that.
      Jaime will abandon Cersei for sure and has to have a hero arc. Guessing he will die in battle in the arms of the woman he loves (Brienne.) Brienne will survive, become queensguard to Sansa (or whomever’s left) and write about Jaime’s good deeds in that book. She’s the only one who knows all he’s done.
      I agree that Sansa parallels Queen Elizabeth and will be the final younger, more beautiful queen to take the throne from Cersei, after being faked out by both Margery and Dany. Jaime’s death would be the last thing to hurt her, other than taking her power. There are so many possible valonquar options to guess. I wouldn’t even be surprised if it’s a Greyjoy who does it. Or Arya wearing Jaime’s face.
      Bran will be integral to winning the war against the WW. He still has to fly so he’s for sure warging a dragon. Possibly an ice dragon. Though it seems Jon is marked to fight the Night’s King, maybe there’s an even greater evil for Bran to battle. He is the magic character, after all.
      Arya I’m not sure about. She could die, or she could roam the planet killing. She doesn’t seem the type to settle down after all she’s learned and seen. I suppose she could have an epiphany, decides she no longer wants that life and marries Gendry.
      Those left will rule their ancestral homes in a more democratic society under the one queen as per Dany’s vision. Tyrion, Sam, Theon/Yara, etc.
      Or I could be wrong about everything. We’ll find out in 2 years!

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    139. I have a question…
      Is there any word or indications that they are going to use the Teatro Romano Santiponce down the road from Italica? There were pictures of it put up when we first got word they’d be filming in the area but I haven’t seen anything about activity at that site…

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    140. Stargaryen,

      I don’t see that happening, Tyrion and Varys are there and they know Cersei oh so well. Surely they would advice against such an alliance.
      Unless the situation in the North has become so dire that there is no time to deal with Cersei at that point.
      That would leave their southern flank exposed while dealing with the WW. A bad strategy.

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    141. Cheevs,
      Agreed. I don’t know if there are many people who actually want to see some of the relationship between Sandor and Gregor other than Cleganebowl. Can’t happen now in books or show, pretty positive they wouldn’t even do a flashback now as there are more directly influential characters and Thor is just too young as McCann’s elder brother. I really would have loved to see SOMETHING more from the Cleganes as a pair, but oh well.
      I also really hope there are no more ‘interactions’ between Arya or Brienne and Sandor. I thought we had a chance to see him develop on his own, but now I also think thats the end of that as there are a pile of characters here…sigh. Can’t wait to see if he returns in the books.

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    142. This huge scene has got to be some sort of alliance to fight the Whites. Not that Cersi will believe it but i can see Jon Snow getting between a heated dispute between Queens saying he fought them north of the Wall, he has seen the damage they will bring. I want Jon to stand up be a boss and lay it out; and then when questions about the Wildlings says he died for that decision but the Wildlings would have only added to the numbers of the dead had they stayed north of the Wall.

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    143. Stargaryen,

      I agree with you about a deal to fight the walkers. To keep Littlefinger relevant you need some alliance against the Whites to allow for manipulation and scheming behind the scenes while the War goes on. I think the schemers will be in a good position during a wartime scenario especially against the Whites. Using fear to draw loyalty the the Throne leaving Dany and Co as even more outsiders. Even if Dragons win the war the Queen will take the credit; propaganda etc. A war like this is what Cersi needs to have people forget about the Faith and her power grab

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    144. HunterMac87,

      Using fear to draw loyalty the the Throne leaving Dany and Co as even more outsiders. Even if Dragons win the war the Queen will take the credit; propaganda etc. A war like this is what Cersi needs to have people forget about the Faith and her power grab

      I agree, which is why that deal doesn’t work for me.

      Cersei is weaker than Dany. Why would Dany agree to such a deal? Out of the goodness of her heart? I get that she’s the Mary Sue and will do the right thing, but giving up her claim in the name of humanity goes too far, even for this particular Sue.

      Then there’s the tragic fact that Cersei none too stable atm. Even if Tyrion doesn’t know that, he would know that Cersei is untrustworthy. For him to allow Dany to make such a deal is, again, unbelievable.

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    145. I would love to see a scene like this: Cersei is about to have the upper hand on Tyrion but before a killing blow could happen Jaime jumps in to save him and ends up purposely killing Cersei to end the maddness.

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    146. Inga,

      Doubt we will see a ballroom dance in GOT but I’m sure he would excel at that as well. I was m ore so getting a humorous mental image of Jon dancing the jig around Dany while she sits with either nose up in the air or making “googly” eyes at him 🙂

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    147. Aargh, no new post, no new filming spoilers today! C’mon, I need my daily fix! lol!

      Aryamad,

      Wouldn’t Jaime saving Tyrion be a bit repetitive? He already did it in S4. Much more interesting would be Tyrion saving Jaime, especially because in the show Jaime apparently wants to kill Tyrion for killing their father (S5 convo with Bronn).

      (In the books,

      Tyrion also wants to kill Jaime (for the Tysha thing) so I’m really looking forward to their reunion, if GRRM ever gets around to actually publishing the books. In the show it’s of course different, with Tyrion defending his brother to Dany and telling her why Jaime killed Dany’s father (in the books, only Brienne knows). That could be setting up for Jaime not becoming immediate dragonfood in S7.

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    148. ygritte,

      What a coincidence that you say that since there will indeed be a dance in The Winds of Winter. Maybe George is losing it.? The show is past that point though and not really in the proper situation to hold such a thing.

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    149. Jenny,

      Although Jon Snow might not be Fred Astaire (update: Usher), when asked by a reporter, Maisie said that she and Kit were the best dancers in the cast.

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    150. talvikorppi: Aargh, no new post, no new filming spoilers today! C’mon, I need my daily fix! lol!

      You joke, but today is the first day we have no report during a filming day since production kicked off in Spain weeks ago, in Bermeo. I assure you, if we had something, I’d love to share it 😉

      The actors all arrived, we know who the director is, and, unless other sources pan out, I’m afraid that’s all we’ll get; with the set so well closed off there is no way we’ll get spoilers as juicy as those in the Basque Country. We’ll probably have to wait until Malpartida for that.

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    151. To me the true problem is that D&D have spent a lot of time to build many story lines between all those charaters. I can’t even metion all of them.
      It would be anticlimatic to put them all in the same place if a lot of drama isn’t involved.
      If I see Tyrion and Cersei, or Tyrion and Jamie, or Jamie and Brienne, or Jon and Cersei in Kings Landing (the city where Ned was killed), or Euron and Theon, or Sandor and Gregor I do expect something drammatic to happen, becouse D&D wanted me to think so. It’s where the story they’re telling leads us all. So it would be a tremendous waste, a huge missed chance to put them together just to talk. Whatever the matter may be.
      Especially in a season finale.

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    152. tea,

      Can’t talking alone be dramatic enough? Is violence a prerequisite for drama, somehow? What a strange thought. With all these characters who share a complicated past and complex intertwined relationship dynamics together in the same scene, I’d rather see them talk than merely beat each other to death. I’d venture the claim, in fact, that violence scenes are more often bereft of drama than talking scenes.

      Newbietothegame,

      Sorry, read again. That’s not what I meant. Quite the opposite. I edited it.

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    153. ygritte,

      Thank you so much! I read some really good theories about future events on this site today from fellow posters, and it keeps me thinking. However, in my humble opinion, the last I checked, team Dragon stone consisted of Dany, Tyrion , Varys, missandai, the Dothraki, 2nd sons, you get the idea. Jon has another team which consists of Davos, Tormund, etc. He was chosen by the northerners to be their king in the north and he isn’t fused into another team at this point, or ever maybe. I don’t know the future of this show so I can’t say. There might be some alliances forming next season (spoilers) but unless I am watching an alternative Game of Thrones from another universe, the last I checked, Jon is not a part of the dragon stone team and the same goes for Theon. These other groups might be in an alliance together. He will be interacting with many new people and some old ones too. I also am going to eat my hat if Jon, Tyrion, or anyone believes that Cersei, who thinks the world is out to get her and who is as insane as Aerys, is someone who can be reasoned with. Or maybe there is another Cersei out there who I wasn’t aware of but the Cersei I have been watching for 6 seasons is as dangerous as Aerys. she enjoys watching people burn. Reason with her? Again, I will eat my hat.

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    154. Stargaryen,

      Is it possible that someone makes it known at the assembly in Dragonpit about Jon’s parentage? Like, maybe LF steps out of the shadows, declares Jon is Targaryen and in his view true heir to throne. Siding with Jon and co. assessment of what needs to be done. Jon is stunned, the crowd murmurs, one of the dragons lands at Jon’s side (fanfic I know.) With LF on Stark (Jon,Sansa) side and Varys having gone over to Targaryen Dany, having these two masterminds in the shadows essentially manipulating for different outcomes must mean something for them (I know LF is not really on Jon’s side, but he’s smart enough to realize at that point he can have more agency with Jon as the ruler than the all powerful Dany whom he does not know. He can get on Jon’s good side somehow, it’s possible. Anyway, probably nothing will become of anything like this because there’s not enough show time left to delve more into the nitty gritty of politics regarding these peripheral characters 🙁

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    155. ygritte,

      I can rather imagine other way round: Dany dancing the jig around Jon. Jon is that type of a guy: he likes to pretend to be passive. And we are entitled to get at least one ballroom dance in GOT: one way or another reincarnated Tycho Nestoris will crash the party demanding his due and the Jon and Dany will have to concentrate on the tax policy.

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    156. asoiaf fan,

      Perhaps this is where Sansa and Jon are at odds with each other. She tries to warn him in E1 he shouldn’t go south and can’t reason with Cercei but he wants to try anyway? As for Dany and Jon hook up and all be on same team from S7 on out, I agree something’s off there, that’s all nice and Disney like but there has to be friction between these two factions right? I mean, it’s a sad commentary but I think it would be boring if they just all get along and the beautiful blonde queen and brave handsome king ride away into the sunset on 2 majestic dragons while everyone else feasts together amid the ashes of evil queen Cercei lol.

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    157. ygritte,

      That is kind of funny actually. But honestly I really have no clue what will happen but even jon being willing to trust someone who was indirectly responsible for beheading his father, holdong his sister hostage, basically wanting his entire family dead…this isnt someone i would believe is capable of reason. Oh I forgot she blew up the sept. How could Ileave that out?

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    158. Asoiaf fan:
      ygritte,

      That is kind of funny actually. But honestly I really have no clue what will happen but even jon being willing to trust someone who was indirectly responsible for beheading his father, holdong his sister hostage, basically wanting his entire family dead…this isnt someone i would believe is capable of reason. Oh I forgot she blew up the sept. How could Ileave that out?

      You two are cracking me up. Love
      Tongue-in-cheek humor.

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    159. Luka Nieto:
      tea,

      Can’t talking alone be dramatic enough? Is violence a prerequisite for drama, somehow? What a strange thought. With all these characters who share a complicated past and complex intertwined relationship dynamics together in the same scene, I’d rather see them talk than merely beat each other to death. I’d venture the claim, in fact, that violence scenes are more often bereft of drama than talking scenes.

      Newbietothegame,

      Sorry, read again. That’s not what I meant. Quite the opposite. I edited it.

      I don’t think dramatic means and can only mean bloodshed. What I’ve tried to say it’s that I do wait for intese scenes – at least emotionally – if I think of any of those possible meetings. In this sense it may be anticlamatic just put them all in the same room (or arena) just to discuss. I guess (since they will be probably be in the same room/arena at some point that reason may not be that big meeting. many things will happen in between and then the meeting has to be the climax.

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    160. tea: I don’tthink dramatic means and can only mean bloodshed. What I’ve tried to say it’s that I do wait for intese scenes – at least emotionally – if I think of any of those possible meetings. In this sense it may be anticlamatic just put them all in the same room (or arena) just to discuss. I guess (since they will be probably be in the same room/arena at some point that reason may not be that big meeting. many things will happen in between and then the meeting has to be the climax.

      I agree , from the outside , if all these characters are in one place at one time, seems, it would be after something big has happened, like in Episode 6 (A battle around KL?), and would be talk about what to do next, maybe the surrender of KL? , plus maybe it’s gotten through thick heads that the menace from beyond the wall is greater than any other conflict and needs to be talked about…

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    161. GotThrone?,

      I’m not thinking so. While this is suspected to be in the season finale, I’m looking at the remaining series episodes as closer to one long(er) season split in two. I say that because all of the storylines will be coming together in large part during season 7 and moving toward the series climax starting just a few episodes later in 8. There shouldn’t be an ending to S7 when most of the characters come to an individual juncture that sets them on separate paths as much as previous seasons, or have a bunch of them die. So, having said that, I’m not expecting this to be a “big bang scene” at the end of the season but more of a large place setting to move us into the final season 8. We have to remember that prior to 6×10 the other finales were mostly of this nature after big stuff in e9… If we do look at S7 & S8 as one season then episode 7 would essentially be like midseason as well.

      I’m thinking the BIG stuff will happen prior to this and actually be a catalyst for it to happen in the first place. All sides could be pretty beat up and/or depleted by this gathering…

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    162. Asoiaf fan:
      ygritte,

      That is kind of funny actually. But honestly I really have no clue what will happen but even jon being willing to trust someone who was indirectly responsible for beheading his father, holdong his sister hostage, basically wanting his entire family dead…this isnt someone i would believe is capable of reason. Oh I forgot she blew up the sept. How could Ileave that out?

      Does all of that matter to Jon right now? He’s one of the only main characters that knows what’s really the real issue. He can try to play the Game Of Thrones but at what cost? It doesn’t matter when Doom is at the doorsteps.
      Jon knows this, you can make more enemies, divide and likely die or you can try to gather Westeros before tearing each other apart. I can see this being an Issue with Sansa whom probably would want all revenge not knowing what Jon has seen
      Danny has the same choice! Kill the House Stark and all the other lap dogs in revenge for her father or try to understand.

      The enemy of my enemy is my friend

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    163. ygritte,

      “I think it would be boring if they just all get along and the beautiful blonde queen and brave handsome king ride away into the sunset on 2 majestic dragons while everyone else feasts together amid the ashes of evil queen Cercei lol.”

      That’s why I want Jon’s parentage to become a public knowledge in Ep 701. If a beautiful blonde Dragon Queen simply meets a brave and handsome HITN, the dragon ride into the sunset will be inevitable. However, if they meet as long lost relatives and both with the claim to the Iron Throne, there relations will be much more interesting IMO. Marriage wouldn’t be the only way to forge an alliance, Dany may see Jon as brother she always wanted but a potential rival nonetheless; Jon in turn may see Dany as another sister with a habit of being “occasionally awful” and exercise his right of the head of the dynasty, etc. There would be sharp edges and disillusionment and personal sacrifices and that’s the story I would like to watch. So, I keep my fingers crossed on Littlefinger: he should be able to connect the dots and pushing Jon onto the Iron Throne would be in his interests at the moment.

      As for potential parlay with Cersei: I do agree that she is not negotiable and not because she is bad, but because her priorities are vengeance and destruction, not survival. However, I can imagine Cersey offering a parlay simply to humiliate her rivals. And as for Jon… He wanted Olly to swallow the massacre of his family for a greater good and hanged him for not being able to do that. Hence, it would be fair enough to put Jon into Olly’s position: no commander should ask his people to do anything he wouldn’t be able to do himself.

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    164. Inga:
      ygritte,

      However, I can imagine Cersey offering a parlay simply to humiliate her rivals. And as for Jon… He wanted Olly to swallow the massacre of his family for a greater good and hanged him for not being able to do that. Hence, it would be fair enough to put Jon into Olly’s position: no commander should ask his people to do anything he wouldn’t be able to do himself.

      Pretty sure he hung the little shit for stabbing him in the heart after doing the best he could for him, but whatever.

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    165. Inga,

      I don’t know, all of the spoiler stuff including the pictures in the threads here and the “stuff” that can’t be talked about… The ‘missing’ individuals that should be at this gathering when we have no idea where they could be… All of it seems to indicate that a lot has happened in the first six episodes. On top of that, a handful of the 17 characters don’t seem to have a natural reason to be there imo, unless the war is over AND it has something to do with the NK and his army…

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    166. Inga:
      ygritte,

      And as for Jon… He wanted Olly to swallow the massacre of his family for a greater good and hanged him for not being able to do that. Hence, it would be fair enough to put Jon into Olly’s position: no commander should ask his people to do anything he wouldn’t be able to do himself.

      Say what? Jon hanged Olly because he was guilty for the mutiny and killing the LC. Simple as that. He explained why the Wildlings had to be brought and while Olly didn’t agree, killing the LC is treason (also see: the mutineers at Craster).

      Jon ‘swallowed the massacre of his family’ for the greater good for six seasons. He picked the watch over avenging his father and going off to war to Robb like he wanted to, and he had to swallow again when his sisters were taken prisoners, when Bran and Rickon were presumed dead after Theon sacked Winterfell, and when the Red Wedding happened. He also sent ravens in season 5 to the Boltons to ask them to help the Night’s Watch even though he didn’t want to (again, he had to swallow said massacre). So Jon is actually asking others to do things he could do himself.

      Pigeon,

      lol yes

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    167. Inga:

      1) That’s why I want Jon’s parentage to become a public knowledge in Ep 701.

      2) Marriage wouldn’t be the only way to forge an alliance, Dany may see Jon as brother she always wanted but a potential rival nonetheless; Jon in turn may see Dany as another sister with a habit of being “occasionally awful” and exercise his right of the head of the dynasty, etc.

      3) So, I keep my fingers crossed on Littlefinger: he should be able to connect the dots and pushing Jon onto the Iron Throne would be in his interests at the moment.

      1) How can it become public knowledge? Bran? Howland Reed? Littlefinger? Who would believe them? Why would someone believe them? Jon is a man who doesn’t even want (or like) his resurrection to become public knowledge lol.

      2) Daenerys is the head of House Targaryen. Everyone knows of her existence and there is no doubt about her origins/legitimacy. Oh and she has dragons, which haven’t been seen in over a hundred years. However, to tie it back to my first point, in my opinion, the likeliest and most logical way to for Jon’s parentage to become public knowledge is through Dany. It would be much easier to convince her than the entire realm. Especially considering that it is through her POV that we think R+L might have been a mutual romance instead of Robert’s “version” of things.
      – I don’t feel the need to address the “occasionally awful” part as I don’t know what you’re trying to get at lol

      3) I doubt Jon would allow Littlefinger to manipulate him to pursue something that he doesn’t want and would hurt his best interest. Staking a claim on the IT likely means starting a war, which would be inexcusable on Jon’s part considering he knows what’s coming. Jon may be dumbed down in the show, but that would seriously be completely out of character for him.

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    168. King Podrick,

      Actually I must disagree. Cersei believes they are all her enemies. She is paranoid as is referenced in the books. She gets turned on by burning people. (The books).I know it is sick but that is who GRRM wrote. She reminds Jamie of King Aries in a Jaimie chapter. I didn’t write this stuff. Due to her paranoia, she cant be reasoned with. Her only humanity died with her kids. The writers inferred this in season six. Its not about revenge. Its not about it mattering to John. It is not about playing game of thrones. Was anyone able to rationalize with mad king arys? Rhaegar actually wanted to meet with all the houses to get his father off the thrown. Arys also blewup his enemies. He also thought tyron, rhaegar, his own wife were out to get him. Every one has the right to their own opinions but I would be shocked if Jon even tried to reason with someone like that.

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    169. GotThrone?: True…But I don’t see how all these characters could get together without it turning into something. Knowing D&D, there’ll probably be something shocking.

      Yeah. I don’t think all of them will walk out alive. But who’s going to die? Not the plot-armoured Jon, Dany or Tyrion. Jaime in the arms of the woman he loves (Brienne)? Well, at least that might mean Brienne surviving… But I have a hunch Jaime still has things to do in the real war (and he has to meet Bran and confront what he did!).

      Theon? Nope, he seems like the only hope of a peaceful coexistence with the Iron Islands (with Yara MIA, presumably dead 🙁 ) Cersei? She’s so wonderfully horrible D&D might still keep her. Plus she’s the face of human folly and greed even in the face of an existential threat.

      Maybe we should expect favourite “second tier” characters dying. Sandor? (After he takes out his brother, please!) Pod? (Please, no, no, no!) The Mountain? (Yes, please!) Qyburn? (Yes, yes, yes!) Bronn? (I don’t really care). Davos. No, not Davos, no, please, no…

      Davos’s death would potentially impact the fandom most. Everybody loves Davos! He’s one of the few truly good characters in this show. Wise, courteous, honest, loyal… So, too good to live, in GoT.

      (And I’ll get my caveats in, before some people will point them out. Yes, I know not literally everybody loves Davos. Just a huge chunck of the fandom. I know there are people who do not like/love Davos, for whatever reason. Davos stood by when Stannis committed atrocities. Yes, he was a smuggler, a criminal, before Stannis raised him, so you could argue he’s grasping and ambitious. You could argue that Davos isn’t perfect, and you’d be right. He isn’t. He’s still one of the better persons in Westeros.)

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    170. Asoiaf fan,

      First don’t confuse book Cersei with show Cersei different people.She is no where near mad king aerys levels.Yeah she blew up the sept with her enemies inside but is it that different with what Tywin did at the red wedding?She can be reasoned with as far as they know.If Tyrion who is her brother and knows her best would give the go ahead why wouldn’t Jon try it out?They are appealing to her self interest not trusting her and the apocalypse is a pretty solid reason to try a parlay or a truce.When has Cersei ever shown she is mad in the show?

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    171. In my “defence of Davos” above I forgot to mention one thing that makes all show-watchers love Davos. Namely, Davos found Jon’s dead body, organised taking it inside, then asked Melisandre to try and do her thing. So, in the show, Jon’s alive thanks to Davos. And Mel, of course.

      In the books,

      Davos is nowhere near when Jon gets murdered. He’s presumably on Skagos, looking for Rickon. Mel is at Castle Black. When GRRM publishes the next books (hahaha), we’ll know how it really happened. But Davos won’t be there.

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    172. Jenny,

      LOL, out of people you count on Tyrion to give the go ahead? As for Cersei, blowing up the Sept and killing a lot of people (not just the ones she wanted dead) and truly enjoying it does it my opinion. She confessed to Septa Unella that it felt good. She is sick and twisted.

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    173. Jay Targ,

      Well, if anyone is to reveal Jon’s true parentage early in the season and make it publicly known, it should be Littlefinger: he has his own agency and he can spread the word and he won’t ask for Jon’s permission either. Of course, such trick would put Jon into a very uneasy situation and complicate potential alliance with the Dragon Queen which he needs desperately.

      As for why Littlefinger would do that, it’s simple. If Dany seizes the throne and Jon shows no initiative to aspire her right (why should he?), Littlefinger will have no other choice but to say by-by to his dream. But that’s not his way: he needs chaos to use it as a ladder. And Jon’s true parentage reveal would create chaos: Dany has 3 dragons, but she is a foreigner and she has no respected supporters that could vouch for her (Sand Snakes are an abomination, and Ollena is just an old crone in pursuit for vengeance; it is known). On the other hand, Jon is a native, he was staying away from the feuds and concentrating on the real enemy, etc. In fact, Jon may become a very compelling candidate and undermine Dany’s campaign unintentionally paving path to Cersei’s victory.

      But that said, I do agree that Jon will do his best to prevent chaos. Maybe one of his motives to go to Dragonstone will be sorting things with Dany in person and of course they will forge an alliance eventually (that has been spoiled already). I just want them to forge this alliance with full awareness of who they are and what they are. Is that too much to ask for? We’ll see.

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    174. talvikorppi,

      Well so does smiling smugly while you burn all your enemies.So does killing hundreds of peope under guest right or assasinating every single member of a rival family.She is not the first one to do an atrocious act but not all those people are considered mad.Look I’m not saying she isn’t going cray cray or isn’t stupid but that’s the audience perspective.To the characters she can justify it by saying if she didn’t do that she would be dead which she would be cause she would have lost the trial.That’s not enough reason for anybody to not set up a parlay with her.She isn’t king aerys yet.

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    175. Newbietothegame,

      No what I’m saying is that in the Event there is need of a talk and they have in their midst Tyrion who knows her better than all of them and he believes it can be done than why wouldn’t they try it out and believe him?And why would Tyrion believe it can be done.Maybe because the Cersei he knew wasn’t that far gone and thinks she is not that stupid and can see what’s in her interest.

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    176. Jenny:
      talvikorppi,

      Well so does smiling smugly while you burn all your enemies.So does killing hundreds of peope under guest right or assasinating every single member of a rival family.Sheis not the first one to do an atrocious act but not all those people are considered mad.Look I’m not saying she isn’t going cray cray or isn’t stupid but that’s the audience perspective.To the characters she can justify it by saying if she didn’t do that she would be dead which she would be cause she would have lost the trial.That’s not enough reason for anybody to not set up a parlay with her.She isn’t king aerys yet.

      Well, you paint all the other folks on the show as idiots. The reasoning that she had to do it or she would be dead would get a follow-up question why would that be? Why would her life be so important that sooo many had to die?
      But by all means, let’s have them all abandon common sense to fit into your story.

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    177. Jenny,

      talvikorppi,

      I agree. This is not a person who can be rationalized with. So in the finale, what do you think Jamie was thinking when he gave her that look after she crowned herself, after she blew up their uncle and their allies? So you dont think jamie thought of the mad king? She stated she loves burning people. She tried to have Tyrion killed. And why would Tyrion even suggest reasoning with the person who is obsessed with getting him killed? For the real enemy? Why didnt jon try to explain to ramsey about the real enemy threat? Why didnt he sit down with that monster?maybe because ramsey was in the way of the real threat, the WW. So he had to get rid of ramsey so the north could unite. So you dont think that it might be the same with cerei? So i guess cersei isnt a monster then? Her own Self interest? She is diabolical. She believes they are all her enemies. Her only self interest is killing her enemies. Maybe i am watching a different show since I cant even understand how any character could fathom approaching the person Cersei is now and attempt to reason with her. We will find out when the show airs. So we will agree to disagree.

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    178. Newbietothegame,

      Because people in the show do all kinds of atrocious things to save their skins?I’m not saying that answer would make peope think she was justified or did an understandable thing.They would think she was cruel and dangerous but she is not proper crazy aerys style yet.

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    179. Flayed Potatoes,

      No offense to Jon. I do remember how he signed the letter to Ramsay Bolton and what it cost him: yes, he passed that trial. But that doesn’t mean the showrunners won’t make him pass it once again. As I have written above, I can imagine Cersei going into parlay just to mock her opponents, especially Jon. Something like “Oh, you want to save the Seven Kingdoms from grumpkins and snarks? OK, I’ll give you my army, but my firstborn son was brutally murdered by your cousin Sansa… Well, you may say that she is innocent, but I want a fair trial by combat: you against my champion the Mountain. Or would that be too much of a challenge for the best swordsman who ever walked?” Sorry for fan-fiction, but life without filming news is so boring.

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    180. Jenny:
      Newbietothegame,

      Because people in the show do all kinds of atrocious things to save their skins?I’m not saying that answer would make peope think she was justified or did an understandable thing.They would think she was cruel and dangerous but she is not proper crazy aerys style yet.

      We can agree to disagree. So let’s put some tinfoil on. Everyone will agree to a meeting, but Dany, Jon will insist on neutral grounds, not the Red Keep. So everyone will meet at the Dragonpit, which, what I gathered from the filming spoilers, has tunnels. Sneaky Cersei will put some wildfire into those tunnels and plans to blow the place up. Just as she did with the Sept.. Getting rid of the KitN and Dany and the brother she hates since he was born because her mother died giving birth in one big boom. That is how Cersei’s mind works.

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    181. Inga,

      Okay but why would anyone take Littlefinger’s word for it? Or any of his “agents” word? Barring any kind of crackpot, the man has no evidence to prove this. Wouldn’t people also question the timing of this reveal (Another Targaryen coming out of nowhere. Except this one has no proof nor the looks of a Targaryen)?

      I’m not sure Jon would be seen as a “native” anywhere besides the North. Just look at Randyll Tarly’s reaction to Gilly. Jon would be seen as the man who let the wilding through the wall. And on top of that he’d be seen as a deserter of the Watch. His PR would probably be as bad as Dany’s in this regard. If this is Littlefinger’s plan, I just can’t see it gaining any traction for the reasons stated above.

      On your last point, I don’t think you’ll get that (them knowing they’re related). In my opinion, the story would be more compelling if this reveal happened after Jon and Dany form some sort of relationship/alliance.

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    182. talvikorppi,

      Agree I love Davos too, him and Shireen were the only two I liked from Stannis Camp.
      I feel the same way about Davos that I do about Jorah. Two men that have made mistakes but both came out of it better men and would do anything for the people they are loyal to, when being their moral support pushing them in the right direction. I want both of them to survive this show and find some semblance of happiness.

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    183. Mel:
      talvikorppi,

      Agree I love Davos too, him and Shireen were the only two I liked from Stannis Camp.
      I feel the same way about Davos that I do about Jorah. Two men that have made mistakes but both came out of it better men and would do anything for the people they are loyal to, when being their moral support pushing them in the right direction. I want both of them to survive this show and find some semblance of happiness.

      I am so with you, I am not afraid to admit that I cried when Shireen was killed. I would do the same if Davos and Jorah would be offed.

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    184. Newbietothegame,

      What I don’t get about Cersei choosing the dragon pit is that place she’s probably never been and strategically doesn’t it put Cersei at a disadvantage? The Dragon Pit is open and more available for Dany’s dragons to attack her enemies while a closed in space would put Dany at the disadvantage because if her dragons attacked, her own people would be caught in the crossfire and walls would collapse on them.

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    185. Newbietothegame,

      I’ve seen some pretty horrifying things on this show but Shireen being burnt alive was by far the worst for me. I’ll unfortunately always remember that. My best friend covered his eyes because it was so disturbing to him.

        Quote  Reply

    186. Mel:
      Newbietothegame,

      What I don’t get about Cersei choosing the dragon pit is that place she’s probably never been and strategically doesn’t it put Cersei at a disadvantage? The Dragon Pit is open and more available for Dany’s dragons to attack her enemies while a closed in space would put Dany at the disadvantage because if her dragons attacked, her own people would be caught in the crossfire and walls would collapse on them.

      My last post about Cersei was pure tinfoil. I don’t know the reason for the location except that there is a (supposed) meeting with all those characters in attendance. If this is a meeting of all the ruling or powerful people to talk about the threat of the WW, why are Sandor or Theon there? What are they bringing to the table? There must be more going there.

      I have to learn to stop replying to folks who read the leak. I think their opinions/comments/judgment are somewhat tainted by it.

      Let’s keep our fingers and toes crossed our “boys” are making it through the next season.

        Quote  Reply

    187. ygritte,

      Iam in agreement with you. When it comes to Jon, it must be tango. I think he can be a good dancer. 😀

      Jon Snowed,

      Sansa won’t be dying. Actually most likely to survive this whole thing. As Tyrion said “Lady Stark, you may survive us all.”

      Jenny,

      You mean romance is not part of it? Like story or their relationship? Not sure I’ll follow you there. In general story there is and in their relationship might be.

      Dany could find family in Jon because that’s what she wants after all. It could go into romance territory but really family, stability and have someone seems much more benefitial for both of them. Especialy, after Viserys was a fool to her and Jon was never really a Stark or constantly being reminded even by Kings of Winter that he doesn’t belong there at the feast, when he had dreams.

      I just look at this from this angle what they need most but I guess romance, then finding out they’re related might be better for D&D and George. We’ll see but ordinary romance seem like shame to do because they deserve more than this but it’s a part of the story.

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    188. Jon Snowed,

      Could be like this.

      Irina Stark,

      Dany worked too hard for everything to just handed it to Jon, who wouldn’t even want in the first place.

      Dany would want to marry him or continue Targ line with another. More betting on them marrying or wat she would wanted. Jon would reluctant to do it, sort of being angsty and moody about this. Just imagine you’re not son of Ned, but Rhaegar. You’re Targ maybe even legitimate and sleeping with you’re aunt. Ice zombie are comin for them.

      Flayed Potatoes,

      Dany more than Jon. Day is more to the likes of Henry Tudor, Genghis Khan, Alexander the Great. Jon is more to Elizabeth of York.

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    189. Dragonpit meeting on going with all 17 major characters present…

      Drogon shows up. Starts torching the whole place like crazy…

      *Dramatic music starts as you watch your favorite characters burn to death while wiping your tears*

      Venue totally in flames while dragons roam above the area…

      Dany comes out of the flames unburnt and naked…

      Screen goes black…

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    190. Inga,

      I agree, knowing they’re related upon meeting would create the kind of drama I prefer as well. I want the whole hearts in conflict thing going on.

        Quote  Reply

    191. Mel,

      Same 🙁 And If I remember correctly the young actress even stopped by here after the season end and said a few kind words to posters who praised her performance.

        Quote  Reply

    192. Inga:
      Pigeon,

      I wonder who was the third guy. The new Dothraki face?

      He’s definitely pretty, I don’t know who he is though. I’m sure that one of the detectives here will find out! ?

        Quote  Reply

    193. Newbietothegame,

      I couldn’t guess why Sandor is there. But Theon could easily be there because the people not on dragonback need boats to get to KL from Dragonstone. I am guessing Theon is Dany’s Ironborn leader with Yara gone and a ship captain. So it makes perfect sense for him to be there. Sandor being there is the bigger surprise and that one is hard to pinpoint.

      I am speculating the dragonpit is used because Dany has a dragon with her. Maybe that is where the dragon goes instead of the Red Keep. Maybe Tyrion knows there is no wildfire under the pit and it is a safer location. I don’t really care why the Dragonpit was used I am sure there is a decent reason.

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    194. Mel,

      Well, that is why I am saying this is not a battle scene. I believe the dragonpit is used as a neutral location. Also, Dany is not using it to ambush Cersei. I believe it is an agreed upon parlay. I don’t think Cersei picks the dragonpit and I am not sure why people think it is her that does. If dany wanted Cersei done for she can attack the Red Keep and I bet Jamie will state as much. So no harm in going to dragonpit.

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    195. Stargaryen,

      I speculate that something North of the Wall happened in Episode 6 and this is a meeting after that.
      I am guessing no one has seen Alan Taylor about? He has E6.
      Seems … something big is gonna be shot in Norway? Iceland? After the first of the year?
      … and I still expect some big VFX segment to close out E7 and season 7.

        Quote  Reply

    196. asoiaf fan,

      Your missing the point of most people’s argument. it isn’t the fact that team Jon or Dany think Cersei can be reasoned with. It is the fact that they must be in a situation to have to reason with her for the betterment of all of Westeros. They need her army and support to defeat the wights so they cut a deal with her or the Lannisters. Which she will eventually break like we all thought she would but they are clearly in a position where they need her help to defeat the wights.

      To much focus on questioning why other characters would trust Cersei instead of focusing on why they need to work with Cersei.

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    197. ygritte,

      Why must there be friction between Dany and Jon? I don’t understand why there has to be. And Dany and Jon having an instant connection and chemistry is absolutely not out of left field because they are from the same blood.

        Quote  Reply

    198. Stargaryen,

      If jon came to Kings Landing with his full host, what do you think the consequences would be for the north, leaving them vulnerable? If i were Jon, with the real threat up north, I wouldnt be too comfortable with that choice. That is a probable explanation as to why he doesnt have his army. That being said, you dont know for certain, non of us do,that this wont include some sort of battle. Also this is not about beating Cersei at Kings Landing, it isnt about playing the game of thrones, it is about getting rid of the thing that is standing in the way of the bigger threat, the White walkers. How could the south and the north be united with the likes of Cersei, who still controls the gold cloaks, who can release wildfire etc.

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    199. ygritte:
      Clob,

      Is that in the excerpt of the WoW that he released awhile back then? I have not had occasion to read that. Was it interesting?

      Yeah, the Alayne I sample chapter. I really didn’t care for it, but I’m not a Sansa fan and don’t care for most of her chapters so keep that in mind. Beyond that though, George introduces even more minor characters into the story for some reason. I already had a hard time finding any interest in the Dorne additions but it appears he’ll just keep expanding I guess.

      excerpt:

      Ser Harrold looked confused. “Please. One dance.”

      Charm him. Entrance him. Bewitch him. “If you insist.”

      He nodded, offered his arm, led her out onto the floor. As they waited for the music to resume, Alayne glanced at the dais, where Lord Robert sat staring at them. Please, she prayed, don’t let him start to twitch and shake. Not here. Not now. Maester Coleman would have made certain that he drank a strong dose of sweetmilk before the feast, but even so.

      Then the musicians took up a tune, and she was dancing.

      Say something, she urged herself. You will never make Ser Harry love you if you don’t have the courage to talk to him. Should she tell him what a good dancer he was? No, he’s probably heard that a dozen times tonight. Besides, Petyr said that I should not seem eager.

      Here’s the link to the entire chapter if you’re interested:
      http://archive.is/WPDo4

        Quote  Reply

    200. Asoiaf fan,

      Your message makes it sound like when Cersei looks into the mirror she see the Mad King. Look I get the fact that Cersei is becoming the villain. The books and the show did a great job making her a full fledge villain. But she is far from the Mad King and his tendencies. She even went to the Tyrell’s the past season, people she saw as enemies and chose to work with them to free Marg. Yes, her intentions were political but Cersei does know it can’t be the Lannisters against the world, they will lose. She is better at politics than the Mad King.

        Quote  Reply

    201. Jenny,

      Tyrion is not the King of Dragons. Just cause he is there does not mean he approves. It is Dany and guessing Jon who give the approval to try a parlay, not Tyrion.

      Tyrion easily could disapprove, Dany say to bad we are going to try it, and then tyrion will obey and say lets go.

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    202. Newbietothegame,

      Parlaying with the woman who has dragons that can easily burn you to help stop the apocalypse down doesn’t make sense?

      Hoenstly, probably would be the best decision Cersei ever made.

        Quote  Reply

    203. Inga,

      See this is the most realistic cause for violence in the dragonpit scene. Everyone else is just simply stating oh how can there not be violence or why would Cersei Parlay but never provide supporting information. Cersei requiring someone fight for some past indescretion. Jon says fine I will stand for Sansa and Cersei says here the Mountain. That is when Sandor stands up and say I will fight for Sansa. All the while Sansa has no idea this is even happening. Boom we have Clegane Bowl!

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    204. Stargaryen,

      Cersei wants her enemies dead. She only cares about her blood. Its all over the tv show. She reaches out to the tyrells to get what she wants for her own blood. In the end she wants marg dead. She always did. Maybe dany refuses to listen to her advisors, i really dont know. All i k know is anyone who would try to reason with her about the greater threat in the north might also believe that the sun rises in the west and sets in the east. Thats how i feel.

        Quote  Reply

    205. Stargaryen:
      Newbietothegame,

      Parlaying with the woman who has dragons that can easily burn you to help stop the apocalypse down doesn’t make sense?

      Hoenstly, probably would be the best decision Cersei ever made.

      Sorry if my post indicated that I meant Cersei. OF course Cersei would, she is all about self-preservation.

        Quote  Reply

    206. Stargaryen,

      Thank you for confirming that you read the leak. I do not understand why leak readers try to have discussions with people who did not read it and won’t read it.
      Of course you will discredit our opinion.

        Quote  Reply

    207. Clob,

      I liked the chapter seeing Sansa finally use the power she has to get something = attention from Ser Harold. Also, you see alot of politics in Sansa’s mind and from Baelish.

        Quote  Reply

    208. Newbietothegame,

      Gotcha, yeah I must have misunderstood. Not picking on your comments your comments just happen to align more with the subject I am wanting to talk about. Friendly banter back and forth on the troubled character known as Cersei

        Quote  Reply

    209. Newbietothegame,

      Well you are discrediting my opinion without reading the leaks so what is the difference? I read the leaks so I am not allowed to discredit while providing support the leaks didn’t provide? Whether I read the leaks or not i still said what I said to refute what you said. You think Cersei is the Mad King. I don’t think she is like the Mad King. Yes there are similarities. But no where near. You think a parlay doesn’t make sense and isn’t Cersei’s nature. I disagree because this is a special situation. Hence why so many main characters are in the scene. I think Cersei will def. do a Parlay and sherk on her deal later. Cersei breaks agreements before she kills. So she needs to make the agreement first in order for her to break it later. basically we just disagree on why or why not Cersei is potentially doing something. That has nothing to do with the leaks, just disagreeing with the opinion. Nothing more.

        Quote  Reply

    210. Stargaryen,

      Knowledge of what is in the leak does not make for a balanced discussion though.
      I mean, you had to use that source to drive your point home in your replies.
      It’s okay, to each it’s own.
      I’ll add you to the name of posters I ignore.

        Quote  Reply

    211. maria,

      I dont think it will be her giving up her claim just suspending it trying to focus on the North as that is the real threat. Dany is probably confident that she will be able to take control after.. or with dragons there its part of the deal Cersi goes home alive everyone focuses on the North.. but in the meantime scheming etc. It would also be interesting if Tyrion mercifully asked Dany to spare Cerci, leaving her alive to scheme another day causing problems down the road idk but I dont see it being simple change of power either violent or not. The schemers will stay alive to save for a bittersweet ending.. because if you think this story has a happy ending, then you haven’t been paying attention. 😉

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    212. Stargaryen,

      I am baffled about quite a bit of your argument, actually. How well do you really know these characters? First of all, i never said she tried to directly kill tyrion. EVER. 2nd, she wants Tyrion beheaded Before Tyrion killed their father. That was the reason for the trial by combat. Also cersei is convinced tyrion poisoned joffrey. Tyrion is the younger brother who will kill her, she believes. Of course she wants him dead. Perhaps you are confused about some of this? I only base my speculation on the books, show, and interviews from the above. To be fair, i could rewatch those episodes or reread the chapters in my spare time. It has been awhile. I will stand by this however, my beliefs arent based on what i want to happen, but instead on actual book and show material. And remember , if she sits down with the tyrells to get what she wants ,it doesnt mean she wont kill them later and as we can see, she did. So much for sitting down and ha ving a heart to heart with cersei. So until i see otherwise, my argument stands.

        Quote  Reply

    213. Stargaryen,

      Stargaryen, that’s not a theory. You read the leaks. In fact, you have repeatedly admitted it. I deleted this comment and all the following ones in which you presented “your theories”… when in fact you were merely parroting the leaks, which may I remind you can only be discussed in the forums.

        Quote  Reply

    214. innocence,

      Just because you don’t like people who think or feel that nothing is worth dying for, it doesn’t change the fact that they have a much better chance to survive than others. They may be less sympathetic, but they live longer.

      Fine.

        Quote  Reply

    215. Dany’s alliances are with broken people: the alliances Varys brokered with the Sand Snakes and Olenna. And the Dany brokered Yara/Theon alliance.

      Dany has no alliance with the Iron Islands unless Yara and Theon prevail against their uncles. And, it may be that chugging ale can’t cure trauma, despite Yara thinking that it does. If the uncles beat them, then Dany is virtually back to square one.

      The sand snakes can start wars, but I don’t know if they can finish them. They don’t seem to align with Dany’s caring philosophy. They’re just trying to avenge a single person: Oberyn. Even if they do well at war, then what? Can they rule well?

      Olenna, is a fragile, elderly woman grieving the loss of her whole family. I don’t know if she’s really prepared for this fight.

      Dany will have some heavy lifting to do, just as she would have if the Mereneese slaves didn’t prevail against the masters.

        Quote  Reply

    216. Stargaryen:
      Asoiaf fan,

      Your message makes it sound like when Cersei looks into the mirror she see the Mad King.Look I get the fact that Cersei is becoming the villain.The books and the show did a great job making her a full fledge villain.But she is far from the Mad King and his tendencies.She even went to the Tyrell’s the past season, people she saw as enemies and chose to work with them to free Marg.Yes, her intentions were political but Cersei does know it can’t be the Lannisters against the world, they will lose.She is better at politics than the Mad King.

      But Cersai put Margery in the dungeon to begin with!

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    217. I think the first time Daenerys and Cersei meet face-to-face it would be cool if Dany were to arrive on Drogon with that bitchin’ Djawadi music from when she beat the Masters. Cersei always has that smug ‘I’m better than you’ face on for everyone. I can’t imagine she would continue to feel so superior in the face of the lovely Targaryen in sweet-ass battle gear sitting astride a massive, roaring black beast.

        Quote  Reply

    218. Stargaryen,

      They need her army and support to defeat the wights

      This is a problem!

      The living fought wights twice, and twice the living had to make a frantic retreat: Fist of the First Men and Hardhome.

      All that came out of those fights was MORE wights!

      How could Jon and company still be thinking the way to beat wights is MORE MEN??!!

      More men means more wights! Why would they be preserving the Lannister army so that they can die on a battlefield and be converted? Will it take them some time to realize that some people, even when given evidence, will NOT unite to fight the wights?

      Maybe this is what D&D meant by groups of altruists versus groups of selfish people.

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    219. Anon: How could Jon and company still be thinking the way to beat wights is MORE MEN??!!

      They have zero chance with less men though. Two thousand living couldn’t beat four thousand living… Ten thousand living will simply be mowed over by tens of thousands of unfeeling, uncaring supernatural creatures. I’d think the best they can do is get everyone they can and fight as smartly as they can to avoid as many casualties as possible, while burning the ones they do have immediately. They have to figure out how to prevent the NK & Others from creating wights in the meantime, which probably means destroying the blue fella.

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    220. …Mance asked Jon how many crows went to the Fist of First Men and Jon said 300. Mance asked Jon if he knew what those men are now.

      So, it’s been drilled repeatedly into Jon’s head that throwing bodies at wights is not the solution.

      Jon himself observed that he and Mormont fought the wights and they both lost. Surely he knows that something has to change about their approach. Facing off with wights like he faced of with Ramsay will not work.

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    221. You’re right, it won’t work to go into the wilderness and fight them toe-to-boney-toe. They can’t fight them in formations on a field like they do a living army. They need to fight ‘wisely’ – create traps, use lots of fire, in other words try to eliminate them in large mobs from range as Daenerys does what she can from the air. It would be a lot of group coordination.

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    222. Clob: They have zero chance with less men though.Two thousand living couldn’t beat four thousand living…Ten thousand living will simply be mowed over by tens of thousands of unfeeling, uncaring supernatural creatures.I’d think the best they can do is get everyone they can and fight as smartly as they can to avoid as many casualties as possible, while burning the ones they do have immediately.They have to figure out how to prevent the NK & Others from creating wights in the meantime, which probably means destroying the blue fella.

      Bran and Jojen seemed to think Bran alone could beat the wights. Jojen implied that He, Hodor, Meera and Ghost were just supports for Bran. But Bran didn’t complete his training so he may have only partial success.

      I agree that they have to fight smart, if there’s going to be any fighting at all. I would hope that they don’t face the wights on a battlefield and do the ‘knights dance’ of hacking and slashing because they’ll definitely get “mowed”, just like you said.

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    223. Stargaryen:
      Clob,

      I liked the chapter seeing Sansa finally use the power she has to get something = attention from Ser Harold.Also, you see alot of politics in Sansa’s mind and from Baelish.

      this is why I like her chapters, all the players showing their hands, and she is the reporter and the student at the same time, she’s observing the good,bad and ugly.

        Quote  Reply

    224. First things first: Dany needs Jon, and Jon needs Dany. Period.

      Dany does have allied in westeros, but they are all lacking legitimacy and in weak positions. I would argue that the Reach is not weak, but Lady Olenna is not a Tyrell by birth, and other families, like Tarly or Hightower, could easily try to gain territory now.

      (The leaks keep getting mentioned because they keep getting confirmed; of course, we do not have the context of all the scenes we saw pictures, but it is material to speculate.)

      I see as only plausible that Dany would encounter difficulties at first. And is only logical that she starts winning the minute she leads her armies herself, because Dany is good at inspiring her troops, nobody can say otherwise.

      But Dany wants to be seen not as a conqueror, but as a liberator; to do that she needs to gain support, not only battles. The tactic seems to isolate Cersei even further; I am okay with that. I personally wish they would get rid of cersei by this season, because I am more interested in the dynamics of the unified front against the WW and in the revelations of all mysteries and secrets so far. But i understand keeping Lena Heady a bit longer.

      Dany cannot but to seek Jon, as he represents more than half of the territry she wants to rule; Jon cannot but to seek Dany, because she has dragons and a huge army. Not to mention dragonglass.

      The whole thing about this ” super meeting” sounds weird and I promise you can become underwhelming as a cinematic piece. Maybe what is important is its aftermath: Cersei going even bonkers, Dany realizing the Iron Throne is nothing and heading North and Jaime finally seeing the light.

      Now, what I really, really wanted was Drogon attending this meeting and getting bored and showing Cersei and Euron what ” Fire and Blood” truly means.

      PS: this is not spoiler, but speculation!

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    225. Greetings from the “House of No One” from YT, G+, and Facebook!
      We have been preparing to produce video and other content in relation to GoT S7, and plan to reference the good work here at WotW vigorously! Great job, WotW crew!

      I feel that we all need to look back to the history and lore of the Seven Kingdoms in order to gain perspective on the upcoming story and consequent ending. GRRM didn’t lay out all that backstory for nothing, and the GoT show must also abide by SOME of the backstory “rules” to keep it genuine. Keeping that in mind, my partner and myself have delayed posting GoT theories while we consider what the latest leaks and spoilers mean in regards to what our projections might be for S7. My partner, Valar Morghulis, is a book reader and more analytical of the developed characters and backstory. While I myself, Valar Dohaeris, am a multi-book-excerpt reader, and multiple GoT episode watcher …. I have also taken GRRM’s backstory into consideration. We want to be more realistic and less “tin foil” when our theories and predictions are presented. Therefore, we will be producing fewer postings than others but, the content should be closer to what will actually happen. Still, it’s all just “guessing” as to what is in B&B’s and GRRM’s heads.

      As for Tyrion, I think you must consider what was said about “kinslaying”. Kinslaying is a major taboo in the Seven Kingdoms. So much so that, even if one accidentally slays a relative they receive the curse, and don’t face a good or natural end. Now look at Tyrion … he seems to have obviously killed his father, but no curse seems to be following him. In fact, his life is on the upswing. If we follow the rule of the curse of the kinslayer, I would have to venture to say that Tyrion is not really Tywin’s son, and not really a Lannister. Think about it … I think that the A+J=T theory may be correct, and all that it implies. It certainly would explain WHY Tyrion’s life is not in the dumper, and why he’s not suffered a bad death yet. Tywin was not his father, so there is no curse.

      As for Littlefinger, I have my own idea as to what his fate is, and I’m predicting right now that he isn’t long for the world of Westeros. Littlefinger has not been eliminated by now, because of his scheming and secrets, and the fact that key players don’t know for sure what he’s been up to, or how much he triggered the entire War of the 5 Kings in his zeal to acquire the Iron Throne … except Sansa, his Achilles heel. He sees her as a proper Queen to his kingship, just as he viewed her mother that way. There’s just one thing he never counted on … someone knowing EVERYTHING he’s done or will do … Bran. I do believe that Bran will be Petyr’s undoing. I think he’s going to have one mega-vision about Littlefinger that he will then share with his family … and consequently Robin Arryn, whom the Starks will embrace as their cousin who was also hurt by Petyr – he killed both of his parents. This is just a guess, of course, but a fairly educated one that the Starks and young Lord Robin will put an end to Littlefinger and his scheming ways once and for all. He could get thrown through the Moon Door, or perhaps Arya will use her skill set to devise a fitting end for him. Either way, I expect Petyr Baelish to get his come-uppance in S7, and it will be very satisfying, I believe. Just remember – Bran sees ALL, and what can result from that once shared with the correct players, and you’ll get a more realistic view of what is coming our way.

      While I’m still mulling over the particulars about what is to transpire in Kings Landing, I’m keeping in mind that Daenerys will attempt to spare the common people of bloodshed, perhaps by tipping them off to leave the city before things “get real”. She also knows that, via Tyrion, Cersei has already proven herself crazy enough to use Wildfire on the city, and that the caches of it placed by King Aerys still exist. Setting dragons and their fire upon Kings Landing would most certainly trigger those explosions, except in one place – the Dragon Pit. As a traditional Targaryen landmark, even Aerys would not place Wildfire under the Dragon Pit. Why would he… to kill non-existent dragons? So, when the ca-ca hits the fan in Kings Landing, the Dragon Pit will be one of the few structures not destroyed by Cersei and her craziness. Remember Dany’s vision in the House of the Undying where she saw the throne room destroyed? That could be Cersei’s doing. So the Dragon Pit may be one of the few structures still standing in Kings Landing at the time of her coronation as the new ruler of the Iron Throne, as well as a sentimental and traditional one for her as a Targaryen. Still, it’s ALL just guesswork at this point, albeit educated guesswork.

      And as for Sansa and the rest of the Starks … Sansa is ruling the north as Wardeness, I would suspect; with the help of Arya, the Knights of the Vale, Stark bannermen, Brotherhood Without Banners and The Hound, and reunited Tully forces. The North has their hands full preparing for the great war to come, while King Jon is away gathering help and weapons to fight the WWs and The Others … spreading the word about the impending darkness to come. This is WHY Jon has gone south, and consequently runs into Dany while on a dragonglass expedition to Dragonstone. That meeting changes the complexion/strategy of Dany’s plans for Kings Landing, because she knows they need EVERYONE to fight the WW’s and The Others – she can’t simply go in and decimate the people and the land, which Tyrion is already advising her against anyway.

      These and other theories will be more fleshed-out when we start posting videos, but those are the most relevant to this discussion and posting.

      Respectfully,
      Valar Morghulis – Valar Dohaeris
      The House of No One
      https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfzN75womt9JA9Ho2BLsZXw/featured

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    226. Valar Dohaeris,

      Interesting! Thanks for sharing.
      I have been of the view (for quite a while) that Tyrion is not Tywin’s son. But your take on a clue, that the kinslaying curse hasn’t befallen him yet, is a good one.
      Bran the all-seeing being LF’s final undoing, is a good one too! Especially since Bran, the Starks, and LF are all converging soon.
      About the dragon pit for the Great Meet-Up, I wonder if Daenerys chooses the spot after being told by Tyrion about the wildfire caches all underneath main KL buildings and the fate of the Sept. That way, if need be, she can unleash a controlled Dracarys in the pit, ensuring that the rest of KL and its ordinary citizens don’t burn.

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    227. Priscila,

      I do agree on most of the things you have written.

      The only thing I question is whether Dany is indeed so good at inspiring her troops. So far her message has been “Fight for ME, I’ll lead you to victory.” As long as she is victorious, that’s OK, but, as soon as problems occur, either Dany or Tyrion will have to change that into “Don’t fight for the queen, fight for yourselves.” It won’t be that important for the Unsullied as fighting for Dany has always been in their own interest, but it might be important for the Dothraki who decided to follow Dany solely because she showed them strength. I think that their legends about the ghost grass that overruns all and everything might come into play (and IMO the ghost grass is nothing else but snow).

      As for the damned Dragonpit parlay, I am more and more convinced that it will be initiated by Cersei (intending to set a trap or to win time at least), and I think that Jon and Dany will simply be unable to refuse. Just think of it how often parlays are imposed in our real world just because parlaying is supposed to be politically correct and yes that enables bad guys to use parlaying for their own advantage, but such are the rules of the game and good guys always find ways to win eventually. And our protagonists are no fools as well: Tyrion knows Cersei, Jon got a few valuable lessons from Ramsay and sir Alliser Thorn, Dany has experience of organizing revolts from within, and they will have Gendry and Davos on their side. Moreover, the Iron Bank/Faceless Men may back them up as well. So I believe they will manage to outsmart Cersei, and she will either die or escape to Casterly Rock.

      The question that bothers me most of all at the moment is Ep 6: it should be epic taking into account the choice of the director, but what kind of story it’s going to deliver? I have been very critical about the leak initially, but the only alternatives I could think of for Ep 6 have been Dany’s big ambush-battle and/or some major wrap-up in the Riverlands and/or rather the Vale (the later could explain both Jon’s departure and filming in Iceland, IMO), but maybe it’s just pointless to search for alternatives? Anyway we will be able to get a better insight after we know which of the directors will be filming the ambush-battle sequence and whatever is to be filmed in Iceland.

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    228. Personally I believe the final battle will take place in King’s Landing. It makes sense from a strategic standpoint. It removes open combat, which favors the Wights. They wouldn’t be able to swarm as easily in tight streets and could be corralled into areas that favor the living. Daenerys would find it easier to burn large groups of them if they were tightly packed together. Her dragons could melt the snow from the streets, making it easy for people to move around, unlike an enormous open area, where it would be at the very least impractical. It has a functioning port, so they can fall back to the ships if necessary. Live to fight another day.

      They could take the nuclear option and blow up the Wildfire caches located around the city, if they felt the battle was lost. Vaporizing a massive portion of the Wights in the process. If the bodies were turned to ash, then the Night King wouldn’t have any fodder to replenish the ranks.

      They might realize King’s Landing is an excellent staging ground, but they need Cersei to vacate it first. But she’s not going to hand it over without proof of the threat they’re facing.

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    229. “… “guessing” as to what is in B&B’s and GRRM’s heads…”

      Correction: B&B’s was meant to be “D&D’s”
      (didn’t catch it until it was too late to correct it, lol)

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    230. Inga,

      Interesting that you question Dany´s leadership skills, because for all her misshaps, inpiring people is something she excells. Think about all other leaders in Westeros and beyond: Dany is the only one who is actually delivering speaches and creating big moments with gusto.

      Jon is the hero who never seeks power, but has bestowed upon him. Cersei does not even care because she thinks she is better than everyone else, while Jaime and Tyrion have self hate issues. Euron, for all we know of him, is just an evil pirate who likes to boast his homicidal tendencies. Granted, Dany is just learning how to rule and she commits big mistakes, but hey, so did Jon.

      I really think her big mistae in the beggining will be trusting her military advisors and allies to do the fighting for her while she focuses in Westeros politicking. If the leaks are to be trusted, she just starts winning the war the moment she herself leads her troops , which IMO is great, because I am tired of Danny saving the day, coming out of nowhere with her dragons. I think it is in the TV show best interest to show Dany as a capable military leader instead of this Deus Ex Machina.

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    231. SerNoName,

      Do not dismay… if this story has taught us anything, it’s that if there’s “no body”, there may be “no death”. [wink] And from the perspective of RH’llor, what is dead may not stay dead. We may not have seen the last of the Blackfish. Being presumed dead until a better day could be a very good plan. But, if Brynden is indeed dead, his death will be avenged soon enough.

      As for Jaime … I believe his newfound honor, facilitated by the influence of Brienne, will indeed have him playing the role of Valonqar to Cersei, in an attempt to save Kings Landing from a insane Wildfire spree. I don’t, however, believe that he will kill her before she commands the use of the Wildfire, and they both will be consumed by an explosion of the Red Keep. I don’t see either Cersei or Jaime making it to S8.

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