The season 6 return of a character confirmed!

ravenI’m just going to go ahead and put this all beneath a cut because we’re headed deep into Spoiler Country, including the return of a Game of Thrones cast member who has been absent for a couple seasons.

Thanks to a new season 6 report from Los Siete Reinos, we’ve learned…

Blackfish

YES! THE BLACKFISH HAS RETURNED!

Okay, I’ll calm down  now.

Last seen ducking out of the Red Wedding for a well-timed bathroom break, Brynden Tully aka The Blackfish has been missing since season 3. Catelyn’s uncle, played by Clive Russell, has been considered alive according to interviews, and fans have been anxiously awaiting his return.

Los Siete Reinos says their sources confirm Russell was seen filming as the Blackfish this week in Corbet, Northern Ireland.

We reported in September that Jaime Lannister and Bronn would be journeying to the Riverlands together; happily the new spoilers confirm this! They also report that scenes with Nikolaj Coster-Waldau and Jerome Flynn were shot there.

There were scenes involving an assault filmed, with the Blackfish possibly defending the garrison and shooting flaming arrows. We’ll be seeing Jaime and the Blackfish having an argument, as well.

Fans have been wondering if a Blackfish return was in the cards for a while now, particularly since a Riverrun set was spotted in the works in Corbet. Wooden structures built by the set hinted at possible siege engines. The siege of Riverrun, and the role the Blackfish plays in it, is part of A Feast for Crows, the 4th ASOIAF novel.

The scenes mentioned by Los Siete Reinos so far are in line with the siege and Jaime and Blackfish’s disagreements from the novel. The new twist is Bronn’s presence; the show is apparently continuing the partnership between Bronn and Jaime into season 6.

EdmureWith the Blackfish returning, can we hope for Edmure as well? Catelyn’s younger brother (played by Tobias Menzies) has been a hostage off-screen since the Red Wedding. Menzies has been busy with Outlander since his Game of Thrones days, but I’d love to see Edmure back if only to provide some resolution to that part of the story.

There’s a fresh photo of the tents outside Riverrun. They’re set up on the grounds of Linen Mill Studios- in the other photos in the set linked, you can see the studio buildings and the same ship/green screen Game of Thrones has used for most of the ship scenes for the past few years. It may not have anything to do with the siege, or it might- there is no way to tell at this point.

tents

With the Blackfish’s return, I’m basically frothing at the mouth for season 6. What do you think of these new developments, readers?

 

popcorn

417 responses

Jump to (and Always Support) the Bottom

    1. WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

      But…. how will they explain how BF has held RR for so long? It’s been months and months. Guessing the fresh water flowing through the castle and the incompetence of the Freys will factor in.

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    2. YEAAAAAH. At last, we’ve got some confirmation.

      Regarding the set, as I said in the previous thread, It’s such an impressive set that it almost confuses me! They REALLY spared no expense. It looks even more elaborate than Hardhome. So it’s gotta be consequential and big, not just a brief thing with no major dramatic payoff, or else I can’t see why they would go to these lengths —almost 30 Lannister tents and 50 Frey tents, all that siege artillery and the enormous tower / gallows, a reportedly functioning drawbridge, the gates of Riverrun, and an interior set comprising at least two big courtyards. Is it just me or does this scream “big setpiece” to anyone else? Certainly bigger than anything that happened in Jaime’s AFFC few chapters in Riverrun. If I had to hazard a guess, I’d say that whatever we’re getting at Riverrun isn’t just from AFFC, but also from TWOW —or at least invented material. The report implies there will be some action, which is already more than the books, while we will also have the conversation between Jaime and the Blackfish that so many book fans were waiting for.

      Bearded Onion,

      It’s been years since the Red Wedding by this point, not months. At least in the show, anyway. It’s not exactly “1 season = 1 year”, as some claim (especially not season 4), but the timeframe is certainly larger than in the books. They could explain that the Blackfish has only recently taken back the castle. Or maybe it’s one of those sieges that go on for years; not exactly unheard of.

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    3. Jaime’s plot this season is shaping up to be very interesting. It may be the one I’m looking forward to the most.

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    4. Awesome, so glad he’s back. That was the longest bathroom break ever haha. And I’m assuming Jaime and co. are going to King’s Landing first? Is Cersei gonna send him there? The timeline for all this is a little weird.

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    5. When i read the headline on facebook, i was like chanting “Blackfish! Blackfish” followed by a big “YEEEEEEEEEEEEES!” when i read the news as a whole..

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    6. Since Jaime’s Season 6 involvement in the Riverlands now involves the Blackfish, I would expect some variation of the Lady Stoneheart storyline (LS herself, Arya filling her role, Beric filling her role, etc.) being adapted now, as that’s where his story is headed in Winds.

      I also think that we’ll see Edmure again (Outlander spoilers incoming), as the main cast of Outlander leaves England at the end of Season 1. While I haven’t read those books and I don’t know how involved his characters are in the second book, I imagine he should have enough the opportunity to take a week or two off from (his character) raping everyone to film his limited role in GoT. Slap on a fake beard, film a bathtub scene (with one of the BWB from Season 3?), a Riverrun surrender scene and a gallows scene (which could be done at a distance, with a stand-in) and that’s all his AFFC material, so it shouldn’t take more than a couple days, I should think.

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    7. Maceless Fan: And I’m assuming Jaime and co. are going to King’s Landing first?

      Jaime will

      still be in King’s Landing by episode six. So whatever happens at Riverrun will happen in the last 3 or 4 episodes.

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    8. Luka Nieto,

      It depends, we could see the siege starting early and Jaime joining it later. I doubt they will bring in so many character and a big set like that for just a couple of episodes

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    9. Excellent news. I for one am particularly gleeful at the thought of seeing the Jaime/Blackfish confrontation on screen as well as Jaime’s reaction to having to work with the Frey’s. (Or even Bronn’s reaction to the Frey’s for that matter!)

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    10. Holy mother of Fishes .. the BlackFish Returns ..

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    11. What comes AFTER frothing at the mouth? Coma? If so, I’m there. Now to last another three months until first trailer that we can pick apart.

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    12. This might be my favorite development for all of season 6. The actor was pitch perfect in season 3, so very happy he’s returning!

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    13. Siege of Riverrun = fucking CONFIRMED.

      I just wish they’d done this last season in place of Dorne… but dammit, better late than never. GET HYPE.

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    14. Luka Nieto,

      Could be Walder Frey since we know him, or

      Brienne could encounter the BwB in one of the first episodes and be kept prisoner so we could see the siege from a distance before seen it upclose. Bran visions is an option but I tend to discard it.
      I bet on Brienne, She is a big part of Jaime storyline before and after the siege.

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    15. It’s been years since the Red Wedding by this point, not months. At least in the show, anyway. It’s not exactly “1 season = 1 year”, as some claim (especially not season 4), but the timeframe is certainly larger than in the books. They could explain that the Blackfish has only recently taken back the castle. Or maybe it’s one of those sieges that go on for years; not exactly unheard of.

      I’d say it’s maximum 2 years, probably more around region of 18 months since the RW on the show. Which isn’t so unrealistic when you take into account the fact it’d take the Freys a few months to mobilse and set up siege camp outside Riverrun. Also (and more to the point), Riverrun is pretty impervious to a siege due to green fork and IIRC they harvested all the crops in the Riverlands and stored them in the castle. Not to mention the fish they can take from the river so they’d be able to withstand a siege for several years I’d have thought.

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    16. Robb Snow,

      I guess the Riverrun stuff is irrevocably connected to TWOW material they will start delving into this season, and they couldn’t find a way to stretch it out for two seasons. This way they gave Jaime (and Bronn) something to do, and introduced the Dornish faction as well —who, going by Arianne’s TWOW released chapters, will unite with a certain someone in the books, and I guess with the only existing candidate in the show, given the absence of this ‘certain someone’ in the show. That doesn’t mean the Dorne storyline last year wasn’t lackluster (Doran, there were a few revelatory speeches you just HAVE to give in Season 6!); I’m just saying I’m sure they had their reasons.

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    17. Luka,

      I think there’s only one courtyard in Riverrun (the one near the drawbridge). The other set looks to me like the streets of Volantis set from last season (if they kept it aroud but they still have the set of the Mud Gate).

      The castle and the fields before it are still pretty darn big.

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    18. Bronn is a great character, but I think he’s overstaying his welcome on GOT. Payne was a better companion in terms of character development for Jaime, but it couldn’t work onscreen, as well as Wilkinson being sick. I don’t think we need another buddy cop road trip. Has GRRM ever said we’ll see Bronn again in the books? I guess he’s just Jaime’s Addam Marbrand/Payne stand in for now. Maybe he’ll even die in this action stunt from the report.

      On the other hand, we’ll get that based convo between Jaime and Brynden, hopefully including the bit where Blackfish said he only game out to see the stump, and shooting an arrow into Jaime’s horse. I hope they don’t Garry Stu Jaime like they did with Tyrion. I want to see Jaime as a diplomat, a commander, the guy you don’t fuck with from AFFC. I want to hear him threatening Edmure saying he’ll send his son to him in a trebuchet.

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    19. Hell yeah! Brynden Blackfish Tully is back, so now hopefully one angry lady aswell. Just kidding. 😀

      I’m hyped like never before.

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    20. Luka Nieto,

      Yeah I can’t really see where this would have fited in S5, just too much other stuff happening. They are proffesionals I’m sure they had their reasons.

      Alltough I quite liked Dorne, I took it for what it was, a littlle side-story, not something that can stand on it’s own. The best moment for me tough was by far Myrcella dying, can’t wait to see how Jaime will be from now on, how Cersei will react,..etc. To me this was quite a nice story.

      (I know, I know this is herasy or that I’m incapabile of understanding how bad what I watched is,…etc. If you wish to repky too me, with the sole purpose of insulting me because I enjoyed this, then please don’t.)

      On-Topic: Clive Russell is an amazing actor and I’m delighted to see him back. 🙂

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    21. Dragonslayer: I think there’s only one courtyard in Riverrun (the one near the drawbridge). The other set looks to me like the streets of Volantis set from last Season if they kept it aroud.

      I think you’re right. At least, the other courtyard is separated from the one connected to the gates. So, even though I can’t tell if it’s the Volantis set, it does look like it’s separate. So sorry about that.

      Still an amazing Riverrun set, right?!

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    22. Luka Nieto: That doesn’t mean the Dorne storyline last year wasn’t lackluster; I’m just saying I’m sure they had their reasons.

      The subtlety of Dorne is amazing. I feel that the “Bad pussy” comment will matter in S6 as Jaime and Bronn are forced to deal with the Myrish swamp.

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    23. So if this is the siege of Riverrun, where is Edmure?

      Methinks one side or the other must be holding someone as leverage to up the stakes. But odd that there are no sightings of Tobias Menzies yet.

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    24. Luka Nieto,

      I suppose, but I still wish they’d at least done a better job with Dorne than they did. With a few tweaks to the dialogue and overall plot, Dorne would’ve been… acceptable. But I won’t beat that dead horse much more.

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    25. So, does this rule out the Blackfish leading

      the BWB or his involvement with them? Hmm… I have no idea where they are headed with this. I can’t see the climax to this storyline being the Freys finally taking Riverrun. Something major has to happen here. But absent the BWB’s involvement, I’m struggling to guess what that will be.

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    26. I hope that now popular myth that GoT is forgetting characters can finally die.

      I have (nice) argument with another person few weeks ago about that.

      Every season they return someone “from the past”.

      I said back then that I’m 100% sure that we will see BF in S6, and now I say we will see Edmure in S6 as well.

      Gendry maybe S7 if not S6.

      I’m not sure that this version of the story needs BwB again, but I liked those actors.

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    27. Robb Snow,

      Agreed. A few writing passes, one more week of filming, and I would have liked Dorne much more. The middle part especially. I like how it began, and how it ended (despite the absence of Doran’s revelations), but the middle part, the actual conflict, was a clusterfuck. Jaime could’ve infiltrated at night, for example, and have a ship prepared at harbor. This way, Jaime would’ve had a less idiotic plan and the fight could’ve been more dynamic, I believe.

      sati,

      Oh, I agree that

      Brienne will go there eventually (maybe sent by Sansa to look for Arya, who was last seen down south, hence redirecting her to her book plot, more or less?). Maybe that’s just the shipper in me hoping Brienne and Jaime will reunite by the end of the season… but I still believe it will happen. However, she’s currently in the North. The question is if we will see Riverrun before Jaime goes there, presumably around episode 7 or 8, and I can’t imagine what would bring Brienne there so quickly. We haven’t heard anything about Brienne, though… so I may be missing something obvious, of course.

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    28. Awesome! Hope that means Edmure and Roslin Frey are back too. What a beauty she is and their relationship is the one good thing to come from the RW.

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    29. mau:
      Robb Snow,

      It’s Dorne. They can’t do a better job if creator himself has done a bad job with that place.

      Dorne was actually half decent in the book. D & D turned it into a revenge filled dreck. Dorne is absolutely undefenable in the show. Siddig and Oparei are the only thing that it had going for it. People are actually going to argue against this, lmao

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    30. On my honor as a Tully, on my honor as a Stark, hell yes! This is awesome. Also, what is that whistle I hear in the distance? The LSH Hype train a comin’! 😛

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    31. Between the picture over on the twitter feed from the Michigan/Michigan State game and this news, my weekend began with a big laugh and an even bigger smile. Thanks, WotW!!! 🙂

      Oh, and simply because I have little to no self control…

      LORD STONEFISH (or whatever that nonsense was) CONFIRMED!!!

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    32. Fred:
      Clive Russell was

      already seen with Michelle Fairley last weekend in Belfast. Can’t wait to see both of them returning.

      Are you referring to the random and completely unsubstantiated twitter post? As has already been said regarding that particular tweet…

      Pictures, or it didn’t happen.

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    33. mau,

      Personally, very much like in the show, I loved how the Dornish plot began and how it ended —”The Captain of the Guard” (our introduction to Doran and the Sand Snakes) and the last part of “The Princess in the Tower” and the whole of “The Watcher” (Doran’s revelations) were great. But the middle part, the conflict, with the Queenmaker plot, was… just so mediocre. It was too meandering and boring and, worst of all, ultimately pointless, without consequence, just as the conflict was the show. That’s my opinion, anyway.

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    34. mau: No.

      Perhaps not in your opinion, but in the opinion of others, myself included, yes. I may not have have liked Arianne, at all, but I enjoyed other parts of Dorne from the books.

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    35. Nymeria Warrior Queen,

      Did you enjoy any of it in the show? If you didn’t like Arianne, I guess you weren’t fond of the Queenmaker plot, which was the whole middle part, the whole conflict, of the Dornish plot in the books. I didn’t like it either. But I very much liked how it began and how it ended; and I liked the equivalent parts in the show for the same reason (though I was disappointed Doran wasn’t as… speech-prone as in the books, let’s say), just as I disliked the middle part for the same reason.

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    36. mau,

      This is the most tired argument. Just because it wasn’t that great in the books does not make it excusable when the show makes it worse. They took the one interesting character(Doran) and did nothing with him. They made him into a useless fool, who was outmaneuvered by Ellaria and the SS, while sending his only child into the hands of the Lannisters. I won’t discuss the SS and Ellaria, as that has been beaten into the ground already, but the real tragedy was the misuse of Doran, and that never seems to get mentioned.

      And Mihnea, before you jump down my throat, this is just my opinion, just to make it clear.

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    37. Bah, I think some people won’t give up on LSH until the final episode of the final season ends… and maybe not even then!

      Anyway, I think Dorne in the books was mostly a dull affair. It does pick up some steam once the Queenmaker sideshow is finally done and Doran reveals his true plans. I’m hoping show Dorne will rebound in a similar manner in Season 6.

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    38. sati,

      Oh, I thought the Tweet only mentioned “another GoT actor”. Thanks!

      I still see no evidence of LSH, but again… who knows. Personally, I’m not really looking forward to such a plot development. I certainly wasn’t in the books.

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    39. Nick_scryer,

      The actress who plays Roslin is on The Musketeers now; I’m not sure whether they’re in production at the moment or not.

      Given this show’s often ambiguous relationship with the passage of time, I’ll be interested to see if Edmure’s child is mentioned in the show, and whether the kid has been born or not.

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    40. The Blackfish resurfaces – excellent! Finally, some inspired revenge on the effing Freys, a possible safe haven for Sansa, maybe even Arya eventually, a worthy opponent for Jaime. And though unlikely to happen, wouldn’t you love an exchange between Blackfish and Bronn?

      He’s a crafty, wise, tough old man but with a definite soft spot for his neice Catlyn and great respect for Robb. He won’t have taken the Frey treachery lightly, nor that of Roose Bolton. Some shit is definitely gonna’ go down! About time.

      As far as Edmure, the last we saw of him, he was being hoisted away by the Frey women during the wedding ceremony, talking about releasing the beast in his pants. The last we heard of him was in the conversation between Roose and Walder while the women were cleaning up after the massacre. Walder gleefully says Edmure spent his honeymoon in the dungeon, or something like that.

      People think that Edmure will be shown with Blackfish, but how could that happen unless someone freed him from the dungeon? Didn’t read that far, so I have no idea what happens in the books. I wouldn’t mind seeing Edmure, even if they show him still at the Twins. I imagine he would have gotten to consummate the marriage with Roslin, before they ripped him from his wedding bed. Walder would want to make sure that happened.

      Good news! What a season this is shaping up to be.

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    41. I liked Dorne, quite a bit more then in the books. I completly detested Dorne in the books for various reasons.

      But can we for goodness sake not bring this here. It is off-topic. It will derail the thread for no reason, and we will only hear the same old arguments from 5 months ago, from both those who disliked it and does who liked it.

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    42. sati:
      Luka Nieto,

      Always eager to help with that particular hype train

      I am unapologetically in the lead car of that particular train. I find it kind of odd that people who like that particular character and storyline (what we have of it so far) are so openly mocked here. Totally get that people don’t like it but anytime someone even casually mentions being pro-LSH, people get apoplectic and/or dismissive. We are all unique snowflakes who like different things. I hated the book Greyjoys but I don’t poop on the pro-Kraken brigade every time they post.

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    43. Timelines are inevitably going to be warped. You just cant avoid that with an adaptation of this size. Viewers just need to go with it i suppose. Normally Riverrun would have been long starved in a siege by now but they ll come up with something for sure.
      Frey for sure would want HIS castle.
      I wonder if we ll see Edmure again too. As well as his beautiful bride Roslin whose presence on the show was just far too short (though she is probably shooting Musketeers just like Tobias is shooting Outlander).

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    44. Laura,

      My resistance is only that I think it was pushed back too far.

      I realize the character didn’t do anything in AFFC or ADWD, and the show could have delayed her introduction to season 6, assuming she finally becomes important in TWOW, but I argue that they should have simply moved up her TWOW storyline, or at least part of it, to season 5, and had this Riverrun stuff in season 5. Now, if she does appear, they will be bringing her back the same season as Jon, who most people assumed was the whole reason they cut LS in the first place.

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    45. Laura,

      The hour feels a bit late to introduce Stoneheart to me, as

      I honestly don’t expect her story to continue past the next Brienne/Jaime chapter or two in Winds.

      I’m also not a fan of Stoneheart’s, err… condition in the books, or at least in relation to a possible show counterpart. I actually somewhat agree with Alex Graves that it would be a disservice to Michelle Fairley to bring her back to play as little more than a (mostly) voiceless zombie. If (and it’s a damn big if) they include her in the show, I hope she’ll be in much better physical condition and be able to speak at least somewhat clearly.

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    46. I guess one of the reasons they didn’t put Riverrun in Season 5 was that they would have shown spoilers of Winds.

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    47. Luka Nieto,

      I liked the look and feel of Dorne in the show, and I liked where it seemed like it was going, it just didn’t seem to quite get there, if that makes any sense. I would have liked just a few more minutes with the Sand Snakes, and of course Doran’s speech. I particularly wanted a bit more of Nymeria (I think my bias is obvious there).

      sati:
      Nymeria Warrior Queen,

      It is substantiated by that news you are commenting on.

      I’m not sure how this news substantiates a random tweet without even a picture, but, hey, if that’s good enough for you, so be it. It remains a random, unsubstantiated tweet to me.

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    48. First of all thank you for the news…. this is one of my favorite stories in the books and i am glad that i will watch this!!!

      I don’t think they will bring LS, they will bring Walder Frey and Arya…and an outlaw band and Tullys and that’s more exciting for me!
      Actors also talk about the hound all the time…. and there was a vision from Bran for his sisters. I don’t even know where this is going but i want to watch it. 🙂

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    49. Im ecstatic… yeah! I loved BF character…. but I don’t think they are going to bring LSH into the series at this late date. That should’ve/would’ve been established at least in season 4 or 5… I don’t get D&D bringing her into the storyline now.

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    50. Blackfish shooting Freys. Don’t think it can get much better than that.

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    51. Tyrion Pimpslap:
      Laura,

      My resistance is only that I think it was pushed back too far.

      This.

      Too much time has passed for

      LSH to make a really valuable comeback, and with the assumed return of Jon and possible others thought to be departed (Sandor?), it may as well be a case of “Hell, why not bring Robb and Ned and Oberyn and everyone else back since it’s Resurrection Row?” I just don’t know how they could do it and not have it feeling slightly like a jump the shark moment after 3 years. I very much hope that she’s not in the cards, especially as the character is a tragic and depressing shell.

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    52. Sue the Fury: If it didn’t appear in this article, you need to cover it.

      Yes…I apologize for my myrish swamp comment. It really should have been covered in spoiler tags…or something else.

      Speaking of fishy things…Go Team Tully!

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    53. Nymeria Warrior Queen,

      Completly agree with you here, even tough I had quite a bit of fun with this storyline, (still my least favourite story this season, the others where simply stunningly good)
      We really needed more scenes/screen-time.

      Hope will have more this season. 🙂

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    54. How they can bring back BF? Some speech about “you killed my family, prepare to die!” thing? Doing political stuff with northern/Vale/Riverrun lords? BF fighting the Freys on a castle? BF with the BWB pulling a LHS?

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    55. Is there a reason that the Red tents look so orderly and the other tents are placed all haphazard and of different sizes and shapes?

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    56. Great news.

      I still have the faintest of hopes that Genna Lannister might still make it in if the Riverlands is to be featured at some length! Love to see her putting the fear of god into Freys!

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    57. Thronetender,

      The red tents are most likely the Lannisters so it makes sense that they are orderly laid and ”clean”, while the others are most likely the Freys tents, who are probally sieging the castle for quite a while, so they are ”dirtier” more ”used”.

      EDIT: Or what Luka said.

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    58. Thronetender: He won’t have taken the Frey treachery lightly, nor that of Roose Bolton. Some shit is definitely gonna’ go down!

      Wouldn’t it be an interesting alternative to have the Blackfish be the one to take revenge on Walder or Roose, rather than the more obvious Starks?

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    59. Tyrion Pimpslap:
      Laura,

      My resistance is only that I think it was pushed back too far.

      If the were gonna do Stoneheart well…

      she will have to come off as “Gollum level tragic”. even through any satisfying sweet vengeance. I have total confidence with the right makeup and acting caliber, Michelle Fairley could concievably knock it out of the park.

      Silent acting is the purest form of acting 🙂

      Robb Snow:
      Laura,

      I don’t expect her story to continue past the next Brienne/Jaime chapter or two in Winds.

      In the books at least, I’m starting to think not.

      I think Brynden Tully, Jaime Lannister, Brienne and the Brotherhood” are gonna wreak havoc in the Riverlands and beyond

      Season 6 is making me think it will be substantial plot. We’ve got the clues in “Feast” (tom of sevenstreams!)

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    60. Luka Nieto,

      I thought the Freys were supposed to be rich as well, what with collecting all the crossing fees over the years. Are there just too many of them to support properly or haphazard because there are no stand-out leaders with organized minds? Walder is completely mad, for sure.

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    61. Firannion,

      Given how many people from a variety of families lost people at the Red Wedding, I’d like to see as many of them involved as possible. However, I would be really disappointed if the Starks weren’t somehow part of it,

      even if the Stark revenge in the Riverlands manifests itself as Nymeria and her wolf pack. Of course, I’m chomping at the bit for Nymeria and her wolf pack.

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    62. Thronetender,

      It’s just a visual storytelling device. The Freys have money, but they aren’t Lannister-rich, and they aren’t “classy.” They are portrayed as very nasty people. Also, they’ve presumably been on that siege for months or maybe even a year or two by now, while the Lannisters just arrived there. As I said earlier, it’s just a visual shorthand. Basically, what TheTouchOfFrost said:

      TheTouchOfFrost: It’s a good visual tool as the siege is a shambles until Jaime gets there.

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    63. Sue the Fury: Because the Lannister tents are quality and tidy, and the Freys are kind of trashy and undisciplined, maybe.

      Oh – ok. The Lannister tents may be quality, not so sure about the people.

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    64. On another note- has anybody noticed that the sails on that ship they use are black with some red in there (if I’m not mistaken)?

      Can’t zoom in close enough to make out what it is though.

      When was that ship last used? Wasn’t it for Arya’s journey to Braavos? It’s definitely been remodelled since then and those sails are also a different shape.

        Quote  Reply

    65. Hodor’s Bastard: The subtlety of Dorne is amazing. I feel that the “Bad pussy” comment will matter in S6 as Jaime and Bronn are forced to deal with the Myrish swamp.

      Your tongue is jammed into your cheek so far that I can see the bump from here!

        Quote  Reply

    66. So… this is something that hasn’t been discussed here, but now that there will be a Siege of Riverrun, with the Blackfish, Jaime and Bronn in there… What if Walder Frey is there too? I mean, if the Freys are there, it would make sense (in the context of the show) for Walder to go there, as he is the only Frey we truly know (and the only one an average show watcher would recognize.) We know Walder Frey will be in the season, so maybe he’s at the siege?

        Quote  Reply

    67. SlayerNina: How they can bring back BF? Some speech about “you killed my family, prepare to die!” thing?

      I wouldn’t mind that one bit! Princess Bride or Angry Blackfish, it’s a good line.
      And plenty good enough reason to bring him back.

        Quote  Reply

    68. Sean C.: Given this show’s often ambiguous relationship with the passage of time, I’ll be interested to see if Edmure’s child is mentioned in the show, and whether the kid has been born or not.

      This jogs my memory of the casting calls for babies and toddlers. I don’t recall anyone guessing Edmure’s heir, but we might be in for more heartbreaking bonding with a possibly doomed child again.

        Quote  Reply

    69. Luka Nieto: What if Walder Frey is there too? I mean, if the Freys are there, it would make sense (in the context of the show) for Walder to go there, as he is the only Frey we truly know (and the only one an average show watcher would recognize.) We know Walder Frey will be in the season, so maybe he’s at the siege?

      While I wouldn’t mind seeing old Walder, seeing that his evil is so excellently played by David Bradley, I can’t imagine he’d deign to put his old bones down in a tent. Not when he can be putting them down on a new young wife. Do you think he’s found one yet?

        Quote  Reply

    70. Well, as a non reader (which means I have no idea what the Blackfish’s return means story-wise) I’was hoping this would be about Benjen Stark. Or Gentry, for that matter. I’ve been wondering where he’s rowing to all this time.

        Quote  Reply

    71. Thronetender: I can’t imagine he’d deign to put his old bones down in a tent.

      That’s the only thing that makes me doubt the idea. Walder isn’t the kind of guy who personally leads a siege. Maybe he’s just visiting. I don’t know… he’s in the season, but where does he fit, if not the siege?

        Quote  Reply

    72. Luka Nieto:
      So… this is something that hasn’t been discussed here, but now that there will be a Siege of Riverrun, with the Blackfish, Jaime and Bronn in there… What if Walder Frey is there too? I mean, if the Freys are there, it would make sense (in the context of the show) for Walder to go there, as he is the only Frey we truly know (and the only one an average show watcher would recognize.) We know Walder Frey will be in the season, so maybe he’s at the siege?

      I think even if book Walder isn’t ever in the Riverlands, the show will have him be there. He is the “face” of the Freys.

      We know about a character resembling Merret Frey being cast, right?
      The shooting dates coincide with Riverland production next, when we take in account the delayed week.

      http://watchersonthewall.com/game-of-thrones-casting-another-frey-for-season-6/

      Looks like 2 weeks of upcoming filming for that character, at least.

        Quote  Reply

    73. SlayerNina,

      Why spoil 3 things when you can only spoil 2?
      Plus, I doubt the WoW spoilers are going to end at BF return. I think

      a main character’s goint to bite the dust in the Riverlands.

        Quote  Reply

    74. Nymeria Warrior Queen: Given how many people from a variety of families lost people at the Red Wedding, I’d like to see as many of them involved as possible.

      Now you’ve got me picturing a ‘Murder on the Orient Express’ sort of denouement! But I suppose they already sort of did that with ‘For the Watch.’

        Quote  Reply

    75. Wishful thinking theory re: Gendry. Perhaps, having no where else go, Gendry heads to Riverrun to find Arya. The last he knew, the BWB were taking her there. He has a marketable skill, so perhaps he becomes a smith in the Tully household. This provides a path to reuniting Gendry and Arya.

      Come on GOT, throw us shippers a bone. We have watched murder, rape, castration….give us a little something to smile about.

        Quote  Reply

    76. Luka Nieto: Walder isn’t the kind of guy who personally leads a siege. Maybe he’s just visiting. I don’t know… he’s in the season, but where does he fit, if not the siege?

      Maybe someone brings news to him at the Twins as to the status of the siege. You are right, I wouldn’t recognize any other Frey. They would have to make sure the audience knew for sure that an actor was portraying a Frey. I kind of remember the one Frey who went to Riverrun when Robb was there, to demand that Edmure marry a Frey girl, but I didn’t catch his name. Was that one the Black Walder I”ve seen other posters talk about?

        Quote  Reply

    77. Luka Nieto: Walder isn’t the kind of guy who personally leads a siege. Maybe he’s just visiting.

      As others have stated, I doubt Walder could travel much, but if he was visiting (or if the Frey “capital” somehow shifts from the Twins to RR) then this would be as good a place as any for that Frey fucker to snuff it. I would applaud loudly if it came at the hands of BF, a BwB bloke, Sweetrobin, or a passing large wolf. He’s gotta go, hopefully painfully.

      (Dunk should have pushed him down the well 90 years ago!)

        Quote  Reply

    78. Love it! Now we need an Edmure confirmation. I wanted Bronn to sing him a song.

      Did the outlaws that were being cast way back finish filming or could they be part of this? Because the Blackfish couldn’t have taken Riverrun alone. Maybe the Brotherhood?

      Either way, this season has a ridiculous amount of long-term payoff. It’s a shame we didn’t get Illyrio last season, he’s pretty much the only character missing at this point (BWB and Benjen aside).

        Quote  Reply

    79. Hodor’s Bastard: I would applaud loudly if it came at the hands of BF, a BwB bloke, Sweetrobin, or a passing large wolf. He’s gotta go, hopefully painfully.

      Arya’s going to the Riverlands.

      She ain’t there to sight-see, at a guess 😛

        Quote  Reply

    80. jentario: he’s pretty much the only character missing at this point (BWB and Benjen aside).

      There wasn’t really a necessary place for Benjen to come back yet, neither in the show or the books. The same goes for the Brotherhood in the show, at least until this season, in which they return to the Riverlands. However, I agree; not having Illyrio was a missed opportunity. Don’t get me wrong, I loved that Varys took his place! But Illyrio could’ve been at his manse, instead of just being name-checked. Basically a cameo would’ve sufficed, for me.

        Quote  Reply

    81. For those wondering about Tobias Menzies’ time commitment to Outlander: If S2 follows the second book reasonably closely, Black Jack and Frank probably won’t get all that much screentime, as Claire and Jamie are off to France for a while.

      May I take this opportunity to say that it’s nice to hear some spoilery news that we can pretty much all feel happy about, for a change? Regardless of whether we identify primarily with the show-is-better or books-are-better camp?

        Quote  Reply

    82. Luka Nieto,

      Oh, you’re running with that leak, are you? Very, very interesting.

      Arya, Jaime, BwB, BF, Nymeria (!), W Frey, and Bronn all at RR??!! Nuts, I say!

        Quote  Reply

    83. Thanks for the thoughtful responses to the LSH conundrum. I always feel bad when I post and people act like I’m a big dummy for being a fan. And I do very much agree that the perfect spot to introduce* has passed and now that even casual show fans know who she is, the impact would be lost. But, I do tend to have my Stark Filter on much of the time, so sometimes the mere thought of her appearing at any point makes me giddy, logic be damned.

      *end of “The Children,” right after Arya boarded the boat to Braavos

        Quote  Reply

    84. Speaking of Gendry

      as I was doing my reread I was thinking how perfectly, imo, it would work for him to turn back up in the Riverlands, with the outlaws, or as someone mentioned on another thread, if there’s a stop at the Inn at the Crossroads. It would be just like D&D to have Gendry start out as Gendry, take on the role Edric Storm plays in the books, then have him come full-circle back to whatever Gendry’s character does in the books.

        Quote  Reply

    85. Hodor’s Bastard: As others have stated, I doubt Walder could travel much, but if he was visiting (or if the Frey “capital” somehow shifts from the Twins to RR) then this would be as good a place as any for that Frey fucker to snuff it. I would applaud loudly if it came at the hands of BF, a BwB bloke, Sweetrobin, or a passing large wolf. He’s gotta go, hopefully painfully.

      Big hearty laugh over that one! So, maybe he is there, complaining and moaning and belittling all his offspring as usual, but more so because he’s in a small, cold tent and not in the master bedroom of Riverrun.

        Quote  Reply

    86. Nymeria Warrior Queen,

      Yes, I could see him rejoining the BwB…but they did give him away (to an almost certain death via Mel) in the show, which should give him pause. However, after trying Hotpie’s gravy at the IatC, he may forgive everyone. Add another familiar face to the RR story in S6!

        Quote  Reply

    87. Hodor’s Bastard,

      Actually we published that spoiler way before that fake leaker posted anything. That “summary” included basically all our published information for the facsimile of truth, and then included their bullshit.

        Quote  Reply

    88. Hodor’s Bastard,

      No, the leak was complete BS; well, technically not “complete” BS, as it wasn’t only made up stuff: to give it some credibility, it was mixed with news WOTW and other sites had reported. Surprise, surprise, none of the stuff they made up has been confirmed, and some of it has been contradicted, while what they based on WOTW’s news has only been corroborated. In fact, that part of the fake leak was based on something WOTW itself reported based on their own sources.

        Quote  Reply

    89. jentario:
      Did the outlaws that were being cast way back finish filming or could they be part of this? Because the Blackfish couldn’t have taken Riverrun alone. Maybe the Brotherhood?

      People need go get over this idea that the Blackfish takes back Riverrun. He’s had it the whole time (in the books and the show). Every army leaves behind a garrison. He didn’t just magically stumble upon some outlaws who would be willing to desperately defend a castle for some nobleman they don’t know.

        Quote  Reply

    90. Hodor’s Bastard,

      A good gravy can heal many hurts and right many wrongs!

      Seriously, though, you’re right that Gendry would have reason to be reticent about joinging back up with the BWB. However, if some of the cast of characters within the Brotherhood have changed, it may make him more likely to be willing. Also, the need to right the wrong done to one of his only friend’s family may help override whatever hesitation he still has. I don’t know. I’m actually beginning to feel greedy, given all we’re getting, I’m making noise about Gendry and

      Nymeria

      .

        Quote  Reply

    91. Yes! It is great to see Clive Russel back and I’m sure he will not disappoint.

      *This is my first comment on this page. I left westeros.org a couple months ago (I used a different name there) because I couldn’t stand all the rant and hatred. I recently found this page and now I’m sure this will be the only GoT page I will follow.

        Quote  Reply

    92. Just out of curiosity: if LSH were to make it into the show, would you all prefer the show to retain her “zombified” appearance and speech capabilities (or lack thereof), or would you prefer her to be a bit more, err… “alive”?

        Quote  Reply

    93. Sue the Fury,
      Luka Nieto

      I appreciate the correction. That is a huge “spoiler fact.” I must admit I never accepted it but I will. You two are fucking amazing. 🙂

      Also, given what NWQ speculated about Gendry, I am now publicly hoping that Arya and Gendry (as a hardened survivor, possibly with the BwB) run into each other at some point in this upcoming season. How could they not?

        Quote  Reply

    94. Robb Snow: would you all prefer the show to retain her “zombified” appearance

      Zombie Cat. It wouldn’t be a come-down for Michelle Fairly at all – not with the world-wide social media freakout that would happen if LS showed up somehow. She could pull it off. Just the sight of that face would get Stark fans newly enraged and Howling Howling (no spoilers here) for Frey and Bolton blood.

        Quote  Reply

    95. Matt,

      If this is true, why would the crown take so damn long to deal with it? And we heard multiple times in the show that the Freys have Riverrun. Suddenly saying the Blackfish has had Riverrun all this time just wouldn’t make sense at this point. The show didn’t build up to it at all.

        Quote  Reply

    96. Robb Snow:
      Just out of curiosity: if LSH were to make it into the show, would you all prefer the show to retain her “zombified” appearance and speech capabilities (or lack thereof), or would you prefer her to be a bit more, err… “alive”?

      I think there’s a middle ground between “perfectly fine” and “The Walking Dead” that could be skated. Pale, sickly, with a slit throat and resulting croaky voice while holding the flap closed would do it for me. Doesn’t need to be more “zombie” than that.

        Quote  Reply

    97. Robb Snow,

      Although I enjoy her savage undead rage on the page (she was dead too long, with gut-wrenching last visions before death, and should not have ever returned!), Cat needs to remain dead in the show. But I would applaud a Bran vision of any post-RW spiritual rage that he might discover in the riverlands area! 🙂

        Quote  Reply

    98. Robb Snow,

      If LSH appeared and she was basically the original character yet with a vengeful streak, I’d almost be okay with LSH… though it’s still too late —bringing her back now seems a bit pointless, considering she’s been dead for almost as many episodes as she ever was alive; especially as it would happen in the same season which will have certain developments at the Wall. For me, however, that would still be much better than a faithful rendition, which I could only ever interpret as an undead mute vendetta machine, an instrument of vengeance brought to life by the needs of the plot and nothing else, and as a walking theme —and however valuable GRRM believes this theme is (and I agree with him on that), it’s all a bit lost if a theme is all there is and she is utterly devoid of character, which as of yet she certainly seems to be (or at least the character as we knew her).

        Quote  Reply

    99. I seriously thought it was going to be Illyrio when I clicked the link, but WOW! The BF returns!!! And Tobias Menzies won’t have jack (see what I did there?) to do for Outlander so yippy kai yeah em effers! BF is BACK!!

        Quote  Reply

    100. No, I think it would be a bad idea to bring her back now, zombie or no zombie. Having two characters come back from the dead would seriously damage the realism of the show. Who would take any character’s death seriously again. I know I wouldn’t.

        Quote  Reply

    101. Sou:
      No, I think it would be a bad idea to bring her back now, zombie or no zombie. Having two characters come back from the dead would seriously damage the realism of the show. Who would take any character’s death seriously again. I know I wouldn’t.

      What about Beric Dondarrion? He was already brought back from the dead like it was nothing. So if Jon is back he’s the 2nd character being brought back from the dead hurting the realism of the show, right?

        Quote  Reply

    102. Tywin of the Hill,

      Now that you mention Lame Lothar, how does this dialogue sound?

      – LL: Ser Jaime, your presence is an honor for all of us.
      – Jaime: Lame Lothar. I’ve heard you’re the one who put a knife through Robb Stark’s wife. I’m sure you two had to fight for hours until you finally slayed that mighty pregnant woman ?
      – LL: Some would say a cripple and an unarmed woman make for an even match. ?

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    103. Tywin of the Hill: Two Freys went to Riverrun, “Black Walder” Rivers and Lame Lothar. Lothar was the one that stabbed Talysa, while Rivers cut Catelyn’s throat.

      With the last name of Rivers, Black Walder is a bastard then? Thanks for the answer about those two – especially the info about their roles in the RW. I hadn’t realized which Frey did what to whom, but now I know to watch for those two and cheer extra loudly if they get chomped or Bronn’d or whatever.

      Was it ever actually confirmed that the casting call for the character you guys thought was another Frey, actually was another Frey? Or who was cast, if not a Frey?

        Quote  Reply

    104. Thronetender: With the last name of Rivers, Black Walder is a bastard then?

      Yep. In the books they were two different characters: Black Walder Frey (“That one was not named for the colour of his beard, I promise you”) and Bastard Walder (“That one is more dangerous than any of his trueborn brothers”). For some reason, the producers decided to merge them.

      The Tattered Prince,
      Sounds good to me.

        Quote  Reply

    105. Given the inclusion of the Siege of Riverrun, Blackfish, etc., I’m curious what people think

      Arya’s

      return to the Riverlands might involve. Didn’t

      Maisie

      say that she had finished filming weeks ago?

        Quote  Reply

    106. keltia,

      My thinking is

      she just barely makes it to the Riverlands this season due to the distances involved. But it will be moving her into position for something major in season 7: Arya’s assassination of Walder Frey. Preferably at his wedding. Which could possibly take place at Riverrun.

      For the symmetry of the thing.

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    107. Yessss! Clive owned the Blackfish, the actor played the role so perfectly, no other could take over that role. I would prefer SF to LS any day; have a feeling that after whatever happens at RR, Jaime will learn about Sansa’s troubles and ask the BF and BwB to help him assist in finding and rescuing her. That’s the impetus which sends Jaime north and his eventual reunion with Brienne, and we have badass Clive along with Bronn, what a threesome.

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    108. Lord Parramandas,

      Welcome! We bicker on occasion but overall it’s definitely better than the board you mentioned. And Sue + her team have great sources and therefore have the best info of anyone! Hope you enjoy it here.

        Quote  Reply

    109. keltia,

      Now that I think about it… IIRC she said something like “due to some issues I finished filming earlier than I thought” or somethig like that and we all wandered what it meant.
      Is it possible that her arrival in the Riverlands was pushed to next season due to some other scene/character tho whom the production decided to give more screen time?
      Or maybe they hade issues with filming in Iceland with NCW and decided not to shoot there Arya scenes and push it to next season.
      Sue the Fury, what do you think?

        Quote  Reply

    110. jentario,

      We never heard that the Freys actually held Riverrun. It was mentioned twice that Walder Frey was now the Lord of Riverrun – by Walder himself in “Mhysa” (the morning after the Red Wedding, when there was no possible way for his army to have taken the castle yet) and by Brienne in “Mockingbird”. However, all that means is that Tywin Lannister had awarded Walder the title of Lord of Riverrun as his reward for carrying out the Red Wedding. He can be recognized as the Lord of Riverrun without the Freys ever having assumed possession of the castle. Petyr Baelish is, by royal decree, the Lord of Harrenhal, but he has never set foot in that castle either.

      If the showrunners had wanted to cut the siege entirely, they could have made it explicitly clear that the Freys had physically taken Riverrun long ago. But they are not contradicting themselves in any way by introducing the siege now. It fits with their well-established pattern of not introducing new characters or plotlines until the season in which they’re going to be relevant.

      Personally, I don’t think it’s a stretch to believe the Freys have been fruitlessly besieging Riverrun for the past two seasons. With all the other Northern and Riverlands armies dead, they have no other major military threats to deal with (yes, Bryan Cogman mentioned on Twitter a few years ago that the Greatjon was still roaming free in the Riverlands, but that was never actually established within the show itself. With the introduction of the Smalljon this year and Clive Mantle unlikely to return, I expect that explanation will be dropped). Frankly, the Freys have nothing better to do at the moment, and Walder is just stubborn enough to keep pressing his claim even though the Blackfish is solidly entrenched. So, this year, Walder finally loses patience and sends a letter to the crown asking (or rather, peevishly demanding) that the Crown come help him claim what is “rightfully” his. Cersei or Kevan gets tired of his nagging and sends Jaime to deal with it. We get a blended version of the AFFC storyline and whatever comes next in TWOW.

      Seems straightforward enough. A few “Previously On” clips should be enough to remind any casual viewers who have forgotten about Riverrun and the Blackfish.

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    111. The Tattered Prince:
      Tywin of the Hill,

      – Jaime: Lame Lothar. I’ve heard you’re the one who put a knife through Robb Stark’s wife. I’m sure you two had to fight for hours until you finally slayed that mighty pregnant woman ?

      I might be going out on a limb here, but I think it’s a reasonable assumption that Jaime Lannister would know that the past tense of ‘slay’ is ‘slew.’

        Quote  Reply

    112. Luka Nieto,

      You’re right. D&D usually give major characters like her clear season long arcs. I just don’t know what she can do in a couple of episodes except arrive and maybe take a first step toward some goal. But who knows? Seems like we have little info on her since the Waif street chase.

      Edited to add: Just spitballing here, but maybe she could be reunited with Nymeria to finish her season 6 arc. Thematically her season 6 journey would be realizing she can’t ever become “No One”. She must leave the FM and embrace her identity as a Stark. And nothing symbolizes that better than her long lost direwolf.

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    113. Sunfyre: Seems like we have little info on her since the Waif street chase.

      But that was episode 7 right? She has three more episodes. Let’s assume she takes an episode off to travel. Hell, even if she just has a single episode in the Riverlands… why take her there this season if she isn’t doing anything there this season? If they didn’t want to give her something to do but wanted to take her to the Riverlands, they would end the season in a parallel to Season 4 —with Arya taking a boat back to Westeros. But that wasn’t the report —the news specifically said we’d see her in the Riverlands this season. They wouldn’t just have here arrive and… that’s it. So whatever the reason is for her to go there, I’d say she will at least try to acomplish it this season.

        Quote  Reply

    114. davyJones,

      Jaime has six chapters in the Riverlands in AFFC and ADWD, and only three of them take place in Riverrun, which is what’s being adapted here; and there’s likely some TWOW and/or invented material as well. So, if they did cut a lot of stuff out, I can honestly say I am happy —and they probably did, considering this has to happen in the last three or four episodes. There’s also the fact that D&D know the story of the last two books and we don’t. If they had cut the Riverlands plot entirely, that tells me that it won’t be ultimately very consequential and could easily be cut. Now that they haven’t, I can get more excited about it, because now it’s more likely to be relevant.

      At any rate, there’s nothing wrong with changing one’s mind; it’s not a sign of weakness. So I don’t really get the accusation (not that it was directed at me, of course, but I do sympathize with the mindset you describe.) I’m quite happy to change my opinion on stuff. Anyway, I always liked the Riverrun stuff with Jaime well enough; it’s his three chapters around the Riverlands that have a hell of a lot of padding, something he shares with the love of his life… —I mean, Brienne.

        Quote  Reply

    115. davyJones,

      I’m not celebrating Riverrun being in if it happens exactly the way it does in the books, especially at this stage of the story. However, I think it’s probable that they are leading up to something we’re not anticipating, something that isn’t actually at the end of AFFC and is somewhere in WoW territory. If that’s not what is happening, and it is in fact just ending where AFFC ends, I will definitely be disappointed with how they structured things, for sure.

        Quote  Reply

    116. The Tattered Prince,

      I did a quick search on this and found that in the US (but not the UK), “slayed” increasingly is being used (along with “slew”) as the past tense of “slay.” It takes a certain amount of courage to speak/write in another language and I commend you for it.

        Quote  Reply

    117. Sunfyre:
      Luka Nieto,

      I just don’t know what she can do in a couple of episodes except arrive and maybe take a first step toward some goal….Thematically her season 6 journey would be realizing she can’t ever become “No One”.She must leave the FM and embrace her identity as a Stark.And nothing symbolizes that better than her long lost direwolf.

      Nymeria would work for that, and so would encountering Gendry: some hopeful sign to remind her that she is not No One and present her with second thoughts about what her mission is. I think she’ll still want to cross someone off her list, but she’ll also have to consider that there might be something to live for besides revenge.

        Quote  Reply

    118. Firannion,

      I feel like she hasn’t really become no one and she will def get needle b4 she heads to riverlands so the first thought of her past life will probably be jon

        Quote  Reply

    119. Jared,

      When Edmure and BF appeared in S3, we never heard about them before, we never heard that they were fighting for the Starks.

      This won’t be that different.

        Quote  Reply

    120. tkk,

      Great (and quite timely) find. We’re now left to wonder what she’ll be up to in that last bit of filming coming up. Thanks for posting this.

        Quote  Reply

    121. davyJones: people said they were glad AFFC Jaime was cut

      Uggh…don’t remind me. I applaud every attempt in S5 & S6 to highlight the relevance of AFfC. I sometimes wonder if Jaime/Bronn in Dorne and Sansa/Brienne in WF were inserted for budget and/or sensational purposes, in order to delay the stunning riverlands effect in S6 (which as Luka predicts will likely be a combo of AFfC & TWoW).

        Quote  Reply

    122. tkk,

      I was wondering about that, since she said back at the Emmys that she was almost done and she’s been off-work for a while, based on social media, etc.

      Do we have any indication what/where the “technical glitch” was, and what story it delayed? Something in Northern Ireland, probably interiors? Though it must have been a hell of a problem if it scrambled the shooting schedule that much.

        Quote  Reply

    123. I really enjoyed Jaime’s Riverlands stuff… although I might be a bit biased since he’s actually one of my favorite characters in general. His character arc is one of the most dynamic and interesting overall, and he’s played to perfection by Nikolaj Coster-Waldau. I’m looking forward to him and Clive Russell having a war of words… hopefully they won’t change it too much from the book version.

        Quote  Reply

    124. Spec on Arya’s story below

      Aside from pissing off Jaqen, Arya seems quite content to be in Braavos and she has no real ties to Westeros anymore. She knew Jon was at the wall and that Sansa was out there somewhere. But none of that kept her in Westeros. She’s going to have to get new or concrete info that will get her back to Westeros and it’s going to have to be big/revelatory. To me, this has to be Nymeria. I do think that her blindness is going to explore warging with cats like in the book. Then, toward the end of the season, I think she is going to have a wolf dream. Now, that alone could get her back to Westeros but I would imagine it will also be something she sees in the dream that has her abandoning Essos and heading straight home. Either that, or something she hears from the troupe about her family. Maybe someone acts out Sansa’s marriage and/or escape from Ramsay and Winterfell and that’s enough to compel Arya to act.

        Quote  Reply

    125. Laura,

      I agree 100%. I think it will be a mix of the troupe story involving her family and the dreams you mention. Maybe something else too, who knows. There has to be a trigger, as you explained.

        Quote  Reply

    126. So let me sum up. We are, in Season 6, getting:

      –Max Von Sydow
      –The Blackfish’s return
      –More huge battles
      –A certain pirate of the islands
      –The Dothraki
      –More freaky red priestesses
      –HODOR
      –Northern Lords
      –Samwell Tarly’s family
      –And Ian fucking McShane.

      So yes. I’m excited. Beyond belief.

        Quote  Reply

    127. Firannion: The Tattered Prince:
      Firannion,
      English is not my first language.

      That’s okay – I see lots of native English speakers get that one wrong as well!

      The fact that you are brave enough to contribute very well to a site that isn’t in your first language says a lot of good things about you. I’m one of those fussy nuts that likes to pride myself on proper usage, (I’m a word-nerd of the kind that actually owns one of those 12″ thick dictionaries that used to be on pedestals in libraries) and I would have messed up that one myself. That’s why if someone catches me making a grammatical mistake and corrects me nicely, I’m grateful. Or if I read something like this that reminds me of the grammar rules.

        Quote  Reply

    128. About Starks and their warging abilities.

      I thought that only Bran will be a warg on the show to make him special in that sense, but maybe I was wrong. Maybe they meant for the time being and there might be others over the course of the show.

      Here is the thing. I believe that Robb did warged into Grey Wind in the books (those were his last words instead of show version mother) like (Ghost to Olly) with Jon. Show changed that for a reason. I mean, if Arya is going to have wolf dreams, shouldn’t Jon too and be a warg on the show? Perhaps they exclude that part from the show for a reason? Arya’s blindness will trigger her warging abilities like in the books, Bran’s fall from that tower or what I believe George will do with Jon in the books = being only wounded and this trauma will cause him to realize his potential as a warg (everything point to that in the books). Varamyr (another warg) was supposed to be casted and involved in Hardhome, but mysteriously nothing come of that.

      I’m just guessing here (be nice and gentle 😀 ), but is it possible that they scratched that with Jon and favour resurrection (thus parallel with Dany, leaning towards his true purpose/heritage and those are dragons) instead of warging, but kept Arya’s wargining abilities because of Nymeria/her pack role in the future? That her warging abilities will be useful to her more than to Jon? That Ghost might be sacrificed and Jon will not needed that on the show?

      I hope it make sense.

      Laura,

      Yeah good thoughts.

        Quote  Reply

    129. The Tattered Prince:
      Firannion,

      English is not my first language.

      I’m always so impressed when I read someone who writes as well as you say English is not their first language. Your English is much better than many for whom it is their first language.

      Oh, and thanks for that snippet of dialogue. It definitely gave me a chuckle. 🙂

        Quote  Reply

    130. Luka Nieto,

      Greatjon of Slumber:
      So let me sum up. We are, in Season 6, getting:

      –Max Von Sydow
      –The Blackfish’s return
      –More huge battles
      –A certain pirate of the islands
      –The Dothraki
      –More freaky red priestesses
      –HODOR
      –Northern Lords
      –Samwell Tarly’s family
      –And Ian fucking McShane.

      So yes. I’m excited. Beyond belief.

      You forgot Richard E Grant and

      SNOWBOWL!

      (okay, maybe you didn’t forget, but these are the things I’m most excited about anyway!)

        Quote  Reply

    131. tkk,

      This is what WOTW reported back in August:

      Rory McCann was seen recently staying at a hotel in Belfast commonly used by HBO and Game of Thrones cast members during filming.

      Currently, McCann has no other projects scheduled, or any other reason to be in Belfast that we’re aware of. Book readers have their theories as to how the Hound- or rather, Sandor Clegane might return. But it wouldn’t be the first time Game of Thrones has diverged from the original story if they choose a different version for the return of Sandor Clegane.

      Not exactly conclusive. I want to believe, buuut…. I’d rather wait and see, and if he appears in season six, I will be suitably surprised 😛

        Quote  Reply

    132. Tyrion Pimpslap,

      Yes. After so many years of debating about it, analyzing every detail and exploring all the possibilities. Many theories of what the hell happened down there and who was truly born there. I’m glad that we’ll get those answers. It’s like Dany and Tyrion meeting. If George can manage to publish Winds before season 6. Good and if not. He’ll miss golden opportunity, bigger than Dany/Tyrion meeting and show will be quicker. It’s going to be epic and show will deliver with that. No doubt in my mind.

        Quote  Reply

    133. It’s been years since the Red Wedding by this point, not months. At least in the show, anyway. It’s not exactly “1 season = 1 year”, as some claim (especially not season 4), but the timeframe is certainly larger than in the books. They could explain that the Blackfish has only recently taken back the castle. Or maybe it’s one of those sieges that go on for years; not exactly unheard of.

      …it’s *allegedly* one TV season = one year, but they’ve been very sloppy about it. Frankly I think they’re just plain not paying attention.

        Quote  Reply

    134. Thronetender:
      Luka Nieto,

      I thought the Freys were supposed to be rich as well, what with collecting all the crossing fees over the years.Are there just too many of them to support properly or haphazard because there are no stand-out leaders with organized minds?Walder is completely mad, for sure.

      They didn’t get New Rich by spending money, but by being miserly and hoarding it.

        Quote  Reply

    135. I think the reason the put the siege of riverun off to season 6 is quite obvious if u take into account spoilers from the northern war . In my head this is how it’s gonna play out … The blackfish and whoever is left at the castle causes a huge distraction thus bringing the lannister and Frey army to riverun leaving the rest of the North to take down the boltons . Perhaps at the right moment the blackfish and co sneak away (for another well timed piss … Cud be a shit this time) making the lannisters feel they’ve won except they head north and join the northern war … Sort of like a sacrifice of 1 castle to win the larger war taking place for WINTERFELL … Remember all those banners from the northern war filming …. Did any1 see a Tully banner …. After all it is a war of many multiple armies … I won’t be surprised if they take the twins and destroy the bridge too … With stannis’ ships they no longer need the bridge to go south

        Quote  Reply

    136. Lord Parramandas,

      Welcome, reasonable person! There is occasionally bickering here, but for the most part it is civil as most of us won’t tolerate the vitriol, and the mods do a FANTASTIC job of keeping it under control. Also the occasional ribald joke, but I haven’t seen Rygar around in a while, so…Take your vow and join the Watch! 🙂

        Quote  Reply

    137. iridium,

      So many things to get excited about for next season – regardless of whose arc or which continent you care about most! Not sure where exactly my tipping point was, but I’ve got hype now.

      Do we know for sure that the troupe will be traveling to Westeros with Arya, or was that just speculation? With so many spoilers and rumors in the air at once, it’s getting harder to remember which is which.

        Quote  Reply

    138. Firannion,

      fewer. heehe. im sure you write better than most english speakers. i commend u as well, like another poster said 🙂

      is anyone else interested in a thread abouy where we r from or about our WotW ‘names’?

      i find it quite fasinating(sp?) that so many posters r from all over the world & that i get the se of many posters wrong. anyone else?

      thnx sue & all for this site that brings all of us together for the love of GoT

      bf hype! hope hot pie makes an appearance @ some point to 😀

        Quote  Reply

    139. Firannion,

      im definately hoping that she does realize there are other things besides revenge to live for. also hoping her & nymeria meet up

      her encountering gendry again would be icing on the cake. has there been any news of that actor filmong this season?

      hotpie reunion would put a smile on my face as well

        Quote  Reply

    140. Shane snow,

      i hadnt thought of her wamting to go to jon 1st!?

      that presents so many more possibilities.

      i love the anticipation of not knowung what one of my fav characters is headed for. so excited!!

        Quote  Reply

    141. Sean C.,

      maybe it was an issue w/the ‘direwolf’ dogs or cgi?

      i know its extremely hard, production wise, but i’d love to see sone great arya/nymeria scenes

        Quote  Reply

    142. Greatjon of Slumber,

      So many fun lists! Has anyone speculated about the “Big VFX trick” planned for S6 (after supposedly waiting for a few seasons)? Did I miss a post? With what event could it possibly be associated?

      1) A devastating fire scene?
      2) A massive battle scene?
      3) A complicated Bran vision?
      4) An intense warging scene?
      5) An intense weather (snow!) scene?
      6) An underwater (escape) scene?
      7) A complicated dragon or direwolf interaction scene?
      8) An extended castle or bridge scene (like the CB 360 scene)?
      9) A disturbing death? Or undeath?
      10) A naked unsullied, Varys or Theon full frontal?
      11) A raven attack, all screeching “Corn!” ?
      12) Penny riding a pig on a ship?
      13) Tyene and Bronn and Lollys group love?

      Just wondering. Any thoughts?

        Quote  Reply

    143. So now that we are happily sure that Blackfish has not been recast, who do you think the “Distinguished Man. He’s in his 60’s to mid-70’s. They’re looking for someone white-haired with aristocratic features, capable of great intensity. He must have a great deal of natural authority.” as mentioned in an earlier thread today will be? Another Northern Lord? Even though a lot of people thought most of the Northern lords had been killed at the RW, apparently there are still a few distinguished old fighters left, maybe from houses that book readers know about but haven’t been mentioned in the show. At least I hope so.

        Quote  Reply

    144. Greatjon of Slumber,

      After a disappointing season 5, it looks to be back on track. I have a theory that while writing season 5 they thought it was going to be 7 seasons, but now that 8 is confirmed they have time to properly tell the story 🙂

        Quote  Reply

    145. First the Iron Islands and Euron, now the Riverlands and the Blackfish. Who would have thought they’d include everything but do it in a slightly different order for television?

      … oh yeah, that’s right, many of us did. Including those of us who still think we’ll be seeing LS by the end of season six. Yeah yeah, I know I know… but there’s gonna be a lot of crow-eating if it happens 😉

        Quote  Reply

    146. keltia:
      Great comments to this article today — not a single argument over whether Blackfish is waterproof.

      Well, we could start one, if it seems too dull here without the usual squabbling!

      I for one am inclined to believe that the Blackfish is an excellent swimmer, but not waterproof, scaly, able to breathe through secret gills or an actual fish. Nor do I believe the tinfoil theory that Varys is a merman (I don’t even want to know the rationale behind that one, frankly).

      But those (I hasten to add, lest I be flayed) are merely my opinions. Your mileage may vary.

        Quote  Reply

    147. Luka Nieto,

      Reckon you might be right, they are probably doing a “Blackfish re-takes Riverrun” plot and merging it with whatever the TWoW plotline around Riverrun is

      Makes sense from a filming standpoint to condense it all

      Thing there is though given they have put such expense etc into it and it is temporary so I reckon this will be used for much of the season

      starting with the AFfC storyline, but probably ending with a potential Lannister/Frey Riverrun based Red Wedding MkII as mooted to happen in TWoW by the end of the season

      Will be quite something with a Bo6A in the North and this Riverlands stuff

      And what will be happening in KL, reckon they will be thematically covering the fall of the Lannisters, eg being pushed out of RL and KL at same time and being pushed back to CR for season 7 onwards

      Only thing that is slightly tricky is how they can justify Jaimie leaving KL with all the issues with the High Sparrow and Tommen etc, Cersei probably kicks him out for letting Myrcella die perhaps?

        Quote  Reply

    148. Unbowed Unbent Unhodor,

      I have an opposite but similar theory. I think they were told they’re getting 8 seasons while writing season 5 and needed more material. So they needed to extend a bunch of story lines to fit more seasons while pushing the intended stuff (riverlands, bastardbowl, etc) on to season 6. This is why we got Dorne with Jaime, Hardhome, and Sansa in Winterfell. Now in season 6 they’re all back on track.

        Quote  Reply

    149. Thronetender

      Given the leadership bagge Jon is carrying (deserter, bastard, friend of Wildlings, crazy man who thinks he’s seen the Others) I can see there being a scene where the Northern lords get into a hot debate about whether or not to support or follow Jon. This could be the strong character who steps forward and says “Get over it. We’re doing this”!

        Quote  Reply

    150. sati:
      Sou,

      Realism of the show? We already saw resurrection in that show, seasons ago.

      Sure, but it’s one thing resurrection happens once every 2-3 seasons and another to have two in just a couple of episodes. It would just take all credibility out of every other death of an important character from now on.

        Quote  Reply

    151. Jared,

      Thank you for being the only other person here who believes this.

      I don’t know why so many think the Blackfish taking back Riverrun makes sense. They’re all hung up on “1 season = 1 year” and obviously don’t understand how long a siege can last and it’s driving me absolutely CRAZY.

        Quote  Reply

    152. Looper,

      The problem was not that they needed more material. There was certainly no shortage of things for them to adapt from the books at the beginning of Season 5.

      The problem was that Feast and Dance are full length novels covering the exact same time period, which essentially makes them more like a massive single volume (and they can in fact be read that way) than two separate ones. Adapting them faithfully would’ve resulted in a much slower, plodding Season 5 that people would’ve probably liked even less than what we ended up getting due to the lack of forward momentum, and we likely wouldn’t even end up at the point we are now until the finale of Season 6.

      So the writers decided to heavily alter the events from the books instead, cutting out and rearranging and cramming together things until they got what they thought would make for the most interesting TV. I’d say it worked mostly, but it left a bitter taste in some book readers’ mouths and resulted in a somewhat less tight story overall.

      Now with most of the bloat of Feast and Dance behind us, things should hopefully get back on track a little. They’re still doubling back to a few things from Feast and Dance that Season 5 forewent, but thankfully they’ve saved the best for last (or what I consider the best at least) while still moving more into Winds territory. It’ll hopefully be a huge improvement over the last season (even though I still loved S5 to bits) and perhaps even result in the best season so far.

        Quote  Reply

    153. I still have some doubts about Arya returning to Riverlands. I know that it was reported by Sue’s sources… but Arya returning by the end? Maybe it is just Arya having dreams via Nymeria in Riverlands… I see Arya going to Meereen or Volantis with Daenerys. No need to jetpack her back to Westeros.

        Quote  Reply

    154. You know what I was missing last season?

      “No. Put this in the fire.”

      PS: It feels so good to make a book spoiler again.

        Quote  Reply

    155. Everyone is talking about Riverlands and I’m just overly excited about the ship and the green screen.Silence?What is hype may never die!
      Well,I’m excited about Riverlands too,I want a rope around a certain neck.

        Quote  Reply

    156. I’m with you here- as I said in my previous post, Riverrun can easily withstand a siege for quite some time given the fact it’s surrounded on three sides by the green fork, and also as they harvested the entire Riverlands crops and took them into the castle before the siege in the books. A brief explanation on the show to that effect is more than enough to explain it.

      Matt:
      Jared,

      Thank you for being the only other person here who believes this.

      I don’t know why so many think the Blackfish taking back Riverrun makes sense. They’re all hung up on “1 season = 1 year” and obviously don’t understand how long a siege can last and it’s driving me absolutely CRAZY.

        Quote  Reply

    157. That ship is a permanent fixture at Linen Mills studios but it has been remodelled with a black sail with some red pattern (from what I can make out) 😉

      Ser Gerold Dayne:
      Everyone is talking about Riverlands and I’m just overly excited about the ship and the green screen.Silence?What is hype may never die!
      Well,I’m excited about Riverlands too,I want a rope around a certain neck.

        Quote  Reply

    158. The Dragon Demands: …it’s *allegedly* one TV season = one year, but they’ve been very sloppy about it. Frankly I think they’re just plain not paying attention.

      Actually, they’ve been pretty consistent, except for little Sam. It is not allegedly “1 season = 1 year.” Who is this alleged by? And I mean in the show’s crew. The first season can easily span a year, and that’s still possible in the second and the third. The fourth, no way —no more than half a year could’ve possibly passed, and I’m being generous. Every explicit mention of time corroborates this smaller timeframe. Season 5 seems to return to a more leisurely pace and a larger timeframe, though I doubt it’s supposed to span a whole year.

        Quote  Reply

    159. Firannion,

      Oo Firry, I hope you are joking about the squabbling. Intelligent debate I encourage but something that would (in my country at least) rival Messrs Jeremy Corbyn and David Cameron going at it hammer and tongues in the House of Commons I can do without. I hadn’t heard the Blackfish had scales or gills one – the Varys is a merman theory sounds nuts – mind you he does wear winklepickers (roach-stompers) – could have a couple of fins stuffed in there (no, not seriously).

        Quote  Reply

    160. Unbowed Unbent Unhodor,

      Though you’re not the only one to have that idea, I’m afraid it makes little sense. It comes from the perspective of a viewer who doesn’t know how the story ends, while D&D very much knew the rest of story already. If they thought that, say, Riverrun was more important than Dorne, they would’ve done it instead of Dorne in Season 5. The same goes for everything else. There is nothing pointing to the idea that they are correcting themselves.

      Robb Snow above explained why they did what they did: A Feast for Crows and A Dance with Dragons are full-length novels, in which each storyline in each book has a beginning and an end, yet they run concurrently in the timeline. There were many ways to adapt them —one was to adapt them faithfully, in two seasons, which would make no sense, as the pacing would’ve been incredibly slow and literally all storylines would’ve been left without a climax, halfway through their story. So they did the only thing that made sense: avoid a few storylines completely (Young Griff, Riverlands, Iron Islands) and compress a few others (Stannis, Dorne), which allowed them to otherwise properly tell the same story as those two books for most storylines. Now, for season six, they have the possibility to catch up with the Riverlands and the Iron Islands, while they otherwise mostly tell the stories of TWOW. In the end, when the whole show is done, the only lost storyline will be Young Griff.

      Hodor’s Bastard,

      It could very well be a highly technical thing, nothing that relates to the plot in a revealing way. Not as fun to speculate about, I know, but that’s precisely why it’s more likely. The same goes for the now famous set malfunction —I doubt there is a dramatic story behind it. It could be anything, from a problem with an elaborate rig which could only be built by a tricky subcontractor to having difficulty with permits for a location.

        Quote  Reply

    161. H.Stark,

      That Spanish magazine was wrong about the lighthouse being the location, thankfully.

      Tywin of the Hill,

      Since Jaime will be in King’s Landing for at least the first six episodes of the season, wouldn’t it make more sense that we see this exchange in person, instead of through correspondance? By the end of Season 6 Cersei can’t be in the same situation as she is in the end of Season 5 & ADWD, right? Maybe Jaime leaving to the Riverlands is the equivalent of the burning of the letter.

        Quote  Reply

    162. By the way, according to this article at the Mesa Roldán Tower there will be 40 extras and 7 characters. That alone cross Oldtown or Braavos off the list, because there aren’t even 7 characters there. So it has to be either Meereen or King’s Landing, right? It looks more like Essos, of course… and according to the article Peter Dinklage visited the set, so yeah —Mesa Roldán is Meereen.

      They’re filming today and tomorrow, and it’s a pretty open space, so hopefully we get some photos and/or videos!

      Tywin of the Hill,

      Wait… You’re saying that the actors interacting is worse than doing it with a letter? In the book, I get that, but in the show, an audiovisual medium, it makes so much more sense for that moment to take place with both characters present. “Show, don’t tell”, and all that 😉

        Quote  Reply

    163. Matt: Ugh, no. That’s not how it’s gonna go down. I give up.

      Yeah on one level it wouldn’t make sense but neither did Littlefinger marrying Sansa Stark to Ramsay Snow and taking her out of the Vale and then leaving her in Winterfell

      As we’ve seen the adaption challenges are such that the show often shoe-horns characters into certain situations to keep them on plot track, eg Tyrion going up to Tywins chambers to ask a stupid question

        Quote  Reply

    164. Unbowed Unbent Unhodor,

      I don’t think so. It is obvious from the way they wrote season 5, that 7 seasons wasn’t really the plan.

      The way they ended Dany’s storyline in S5 clearly points to return of the Dothraki.

      The way they ended Sam’s storyline clearly points to appearance of Tarlys and the Oldtown.

      They mentioned The Hound last year for no reason, because they planned to have him in S6.

      David Bradley knew long ago that he will return to S6. And that means that D&D wanted that plot in the Riverlands to take place now.

      Also, they clearly knew that they will put Northern lords in S6 and that was the reason why they wrote “the North remembers” last year, together with mentions of dissatisfied lords from the North

      And the actress who played Yara said last year that she is still part of the show, so they also knew that they want Greyjoys in S6.

      So, no. They didn’t change anything from their original plan.

        Quote  Reply

    165. Am I the only one that thinks Blackfish sucks? He hasn’t really done anything at all in the show or the books to warrant this kind of love. He is stubborn, that’s it.

        Quote  Reply

    166. Unbowed Unbent Unhodor,

      And another important thing is that this already happened many times before. Some fans clearly think that some characters or plots must happen in the order GRRM wrote them, but D&D were changing that order from S1.

      Blackfish and Edmure appeared in S3, and not in S1.

      Oberyn was part of S4, not S3.

      Ramsay, Jojen and Meera appeared in S3, not S2.

      Styr appeared in S4, not S3.

      And now we know that Euron will be part of S6, not S5. The same applies to Northern lords, Tarlys, and others…

      Fans should wait before they judge D&D’s decisions.

        Quote  Reply

    167. Luka Nieto,

      Why can’t everyone accept that Benjen has disappeared (as in probably dead) and will never come back. It happens all the time in everyday life, and GrrM builds his stories with pinches of harsh reality in them.

        Quote  Reply

    168. Luka Nieto: ut Illyrio could’ve been at his manse, instead of just being name-checked. Basically a cameo would’ve sufficed, for me.

      I agree. But better name-checked than recasted.

        Quote  Reply

    169. Luka Nieto:

      Wait… You’re saying that the actors interacting is worse than doing it with a letter? In the book, I get that, but in the show, an audiovisual medium, it makes so much more sense for that moment to take place with both characters present. “Show, don’t tell”, and all that

      But in the book

      Cersei was desperate for help, and Jaime bassically gave her the middle finger. It was a statement of how Jaime had matured in 4 books. The Jaime of GoT ( the first book) would have left everything to get back to her, but this time, he wasn’t gonna be Cersei’s puppet.
      He was the Lord Commander of the Kingsguard, his duty was to impose order in the realm, and Cersei had brought this on her own.
      Since she’s probably not going to be as desperate this season, the effect won’t be the same.

        Quote  Reply

    170. Oskaras,

      You are not the only one. I don’t get it as well. What did he do that was so fantastic? Besides being hypocrite sycophant to Rob, bullying Edmure, kicking the peasants from Riverrun only to have to give Riverrun anyway (but who cares about the poor peasants who died killed by enemies or died of starvation). Even his insults thrown at Jamie weren’t really that funny.

        Quote  Reply

    171. Tywin of the Hill,

      Cersei is in the same situation as in the books —awaiting trial. There’s no reason she won’t be as desperate; if anything, she’ll be worse off, as Myrcella’s dead in the show. So, what makes you think she won’t be as desperate? Also, if Jaime gives Cersei the middle finger in person, how does that change the situation? Again, if anything, it could only improve it, making it more of a middle finger and marking the change in Jaime even more dramatically.

        Quote  Reply

    172. Tywin of the Hill,

      There will always be a reason for Cersei to be desperate.

      But to be honest, I think that both GRRM and D&D are pushing too hard. I really can’t enjoy in emotional torture of Cersei.

      I want her to have revenge, to kill Margaery or Olenna or HS.

      I’m really rooting for her now. Tragedy after tragedy is just too much.

        Quote  Reply

    173. Dame of Mercia:
      Firannion,

      Oo Firry, I hope you are joking…I hadn’t heard the Blackfish had scales or gills one – the Varys is a merman theory sounds nuts

      I was speaking (typing) entirely in jest, perhaps feeling a bit giddy over the absence of said squabbling for a bit. The Varys-as-merman notion apparently is a real thing out there, but the speculation about Brynden Tully being some sort of werefish I just made up on the spot – which is not to say that there isn’t someone on some online forum already making that argument in earnest!

        Quote  Reply

    174. Lord Parramandas,

      Welcome! I’m just like you, I was a frequent poster on Westeros.org, under a different name, but I could no longer stand the hate and people insulting, many times mods themselves, hard working people who stay 250+ days away from family and home, just to bring us this amazing show.

      Criticism is welcomed if it is written in a polite manner, but insults cross the line.

      Any thing else I don’t really know what too say, we do have some people who would integrate better at Westeros.org, but they are quite few. Most of the times it’s really nice people who disscuss/debate a show they like.

        Quote  Reply

    175. Mihnea,

      It’s fair until a point what you say but I also saw plenty of topics on westeros.org where everyone can talk politely and have usefull debates.Sucks when haters want to ruin it for everyone,agree to that.I got used to stop reading when I see posts that only bring hate without real arguments,I feel much better now.

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    176. Ser Gerold Dayne: It’s fair until a point what you say but I also saw plenty of topics on westeros.org where everyone can talk politely and have usefull debates.

      Westeros.org has really great book debates. There’re a lot of knowledgeable people there sharing their theories, so that part is always fun. The show discussion, though… that can rarely be described as “polite” or “constructive”.

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    177. I must be going mental, because no matter how many ways I turn it around in my head, I just keep coming back to: this looks like the siege at Riverrun from the books, but it isn’t. The setting is the same, the people are the same, the circumstances are different. Someone different (not Cersei) is going to send Jaime to Riverrun. Some different set of circumstances are going to make it a necessity. Whatever argument/conversation Jaime has with Blackfish is not going to be the same as it was in the books. Or maybe it will have elements of that conversation, but the end result will put us squarely in Winds territory. I have precious little to go by except my own gut instinct and my own knowledge of how the show likes to structure things differently from the books. And the end of AFFC, the way it is in the books right now, simply does not jive as “season finale” material when they will be moving into Season 7 thereafter and said material is in Book 4. Something is different. We’re missing some key piece of information somewhere (obviously).

      This isn’t knocking anyone who wants to see the AFFC material, and what I said above is strictly my own opinion based on a gut instinct. It’s just to me, nothing feels right about doing the siege of Riverrun the way it is on the page right now during Season 6. They must be consolidating something, somewhere… somehow. lol.

        Quote  Reply

    178. kit_hepburn,

      I agree. It may be an unsubstantiated gut feeling, but I honestly believe it to be true anyway —the characters and the setting and the premise are the same; this is, without a doubt, the siege of Riverrun and Jaime will go there to lift it. However, I can’t imagine the show won’t go into TWOW territory also, be it by mixing up the lifting of the siege with some event from TWOW or by just portraying that event after the siege is done. However it pans out, I doubt that book readers will be completely prepared for what’s coming.

      Part of it is that, if they don’t get into TWOW stuff with Jaime and the Riverlands this season, this storyline will be heavily desynchronized with the others by season 7. There’s another possibility, of course: that there won’t be much of Jaime and the Riverlands in TWOW, so they’d be condensing it all with the AFFC material precisely to avoid Season 7 to be have severely desynchronized timelines. We’ll just have to wait and see.

        Quote  Reply

    179. Luka Nieto,

      She’s not in the same situation. She’s free, for starters, and I think that by the time Jaime leaves the capital her trial would have concluded. Even if it hasn’t, she already has a badasss champion (FrakenMountain), so she doesn’t need Jaime’s help at all.
      Plus, Jaime’s refusal to help Cersei serves as a climax to his whole Feast for Crows arch. If they go the “Rejection first, siege later” route, they lose that, making the siege just an afterthought.

        Quote  Reply

    180. Ser Gerold Dayne,

      The books section is as good as always (well there are still some theories that are universall truts for them)

      It’s the show section that was really, really bad and seeing as people are still leaving, looking for better places, I say it’s still the same. (I can’t confirm tough, haven’t been there since EP2 or 3)

        Quote  Reply

    181. Luka Nieto,

      They have only 3 episodes for this. 7, 8 ans 10 *. I don’t think there is enough time for something big from TWOW to happen in the Riverlands in S6.

      And they really have no reason to rush anything. Obviously, many people like that plot, and they will give it to them.

      *E9 will be in the North IMO, just like S2E09 and S4E09.

        Quote  Reply

    182. Mihnea,

      Book section is boring. I personally just can’t discuss 4, 10, 20 years old books with a passion.

      I don’t think that GRRM will write the end of this story, so everything about the books just seems pointless to me.

      I like to discuss the books only in relation to the show.

        Quote  Reply

    183. Mihnea,

      Agreed. More of a Hardhome type of scenario.

      mau,

      I don’t know. I still think we can expect something big.

      A theory among some book readers is that there will be a Red Wedding 2.0 in Riverrun, early on TWOW, with the Blackfish and probably the Brotherhood being involved in a mass assassination of Freys. If these theorists are right, I think we may see some of this, or at least the seeds for it, in season six.

        Quote  Reply

    184. mau,

      That’s why I said they consider some theories as truth, Stannis is a very good example here. I agree with you, most of those disscussions are, too me, quite boring.
      But they are polite.

      The show section is where they all go when they feel the need to bash others and feel superior.

        Quote  Reply

    185. Javi Marcos has said in Los Siete Reinos that

      Jaime’s going to be on a place that’s not Riverrun by episode 10

        Quote  Reply

    186. mau,
      I grant you that’s the easy change to make sense of. But you think the way the siege in Riverrun resolves itself in the books is how the season is going to end? What happens that is of such longterm import that D&D saw fit to substitute completely with Dorne during Season 5, and then delay that moment until the end of Season 6?

      Jaime threatens Edmure with a trebuchet? Blackfish escapes again?

      It just doesn’t compute for me. It’s not enough a part of the big picture of things, and I think they *must* be headed towards the big picture at this stage of the game. I mean… think about the spoilers for what is going on up north!

      I look at what Tywin of the Hill is saying here:
      Tywin of the Hill,

      To the last line under your spoiler – that is why I think the circumstances or the outcome of that siege are totally different, as I said above. It’s unlikely they will use the

      letter burning

      at the end of the season. So there’s gotta be something else. Otherwise, the end of the season/siege is going to land squarely as anti-climax. Which, as I said, to me feels WEIRD this late in the game.

        Quote  Reply

    187. mau,

      I don’t say you are wrong. And I would not be suprized about that actoully happening, but I still think we will get at least some scenes from other stories, at least the big ones, like Dany maybe.

        Quote  Reply

    188. Luka Nieto,

      I think we could see that in S7, but S6 is too early. And there is just not enough time in just 3 episodes for all that(siege of Riverrun, some kind of transistion, RW 2.0)

      And I’m sure Arya will have a role in the death of Walder Frey, so that clearly can’t happen in S6.

      I just think that D&D will give much more screen time to the Freys before killing them, just like they did with the Boltons.

      And Walder Frey is a great character. They will make him more imortant before his death I’m sure.

        Quote  Reply

    189. Tywin of the Hill:
      Javi Marcos has said in Los Siete Reinos that

      Really? If this site can confirm that… it’s very interesting…. Where can he be and why?
      If Jaime get’s into his TWOW story it will be really great because we will finally get to see what happens after the cliffhanger we have from the last two books! *Please don’t let him die. 🙂

        Quote  Reply

    190. mau,

      I agree it could be rushed (though who knows, maybe there’s a lot of screen time devoted to the storyline, even though it’s only in the last three episodes or so), but I also believe Jaime’s story and the Riverrun plotline has to have some sort of dramatic climax —more than lifting the siege, I mean.

        Quote  Reply

    191. Luka Nieto:
      mau,

      I agree it could be rushed (though who knows, maybe there’s a lot of screen time devoted to the storyline, even though it’s only in the last three episodes or so), but I also believe Jaime’s story and the Riverrun plotline has to have some sort of climax.

      With information we got about Jaime and E10, could they really do a LSH in S6E10?

        Quote  Reply

    192. mau,

      They could. I don’t think they will, though.

      An equivalent, though? That seems more likely to me. I just want Brienne and Jaime to meet again, regardless of circumstances and location.

      Tywin of the Hill,

      I see.

      He also claims the Riverrun stuff happens in episode 7, one episode after he deals with the Faith in King’s Landing. Though he clarifies that is unconfirmed.

        Quote  Reply

    193. Mihnea,

      I don’t know, but they are really faithful to the Riverlannds plot. Jaime, siege of Riverrun, Freys, Blackfish, maybe Edmure, Meribald, outlaws,..

      And we know that Jaime won’t be at the Riverrun in E10,…

      LSH is the only thing that is missing.

      I’m really torn on this issue.

        Quote  Reply

    194. Tywin of the Hill: But in the book

      Yeah these are all good points

      Instead the showrunners seemed to have become too close to Lena Headey or something because they are reversing the dynamic

      Wouldn’t be the first example of Cersei whitewashing now would it, they have basically done the same with her relationship to Margaery and that’s without going into the absurdity of “zero Gold Mine output” to some

        Quote  Reply

    195. Firannion,

      Thanks for the clarification. I had heard of the Varys is a merman theory before though I did think it was weird though maybe not wonderful. I think I mentioned it on the tinfoil theory forum thread. Nothing wrong with a sense of humour, Firry!

        Quote  Reply

    196. mau,

      I don’t mean so much an equivalent to LSH but another circumstance in which Jaime and Brienne could meet. What could it be, I don’t know.

        Quote  Reply

    197. What do I think? I don’t see a point of Jaime’s storyline from last season. Was it only to give Myrcella death that *show* fans will care about? Tear Jaime and Cersei apart? I only see it as D&D wanting to engage him into something with pushing Riverlands to next season.
      The more I read about 6th season’s storylines the better I feel about it, though.

        Quote  Reply

    198. Mihnea,

      Minhea, if this is not too personal, what is your mother tongue? Please do not take this bad, but you always spell certain words according to your pronunciation of them, and I was just wondering. I am not being judgmental or anything (I am not a native speaker either as I’m sure you can tell), just being curious. Don’t answer if you don’t want to, it’s ok.
      Mihnea,

        Quote  Reply

    199. Sou,

      Based on his name I believe he can be a lucky one,borned in “the land of choice”.Not sure though,never asked him.He can answer if he wants to.

        Quote  Reply

    200. Sou,

      Yes, my language is Romanian in wich we write the same way we say the words. I find myself doing that preaty often!! Do correct me please! I always try to get better! 🙂

      I’m learning English by myself, for work. When I was in school they where teaching us Russian. 🙁

        Quote  Reply

    201. Sue the Fury: Yes, Jaime will be in more places than Riverrun by season’s end.

      Wow…I read that as “Jaime will be in pieces by seasons’s end” for some reason.

      Seriously, I doubt Jaime will receive a polite tap on the shoulder while he dozes. He will get kidnapped or captured by a certain fun bunch near RR…

        Quote  Reply

    202. Ser Gerold Dayne,

      No, I’m born in the country and time when we where worshiping our great and wonderfull leader, for all his great achivements in saving us from the capitalist dogs who try to steal the country from the people.

      This is not even a joke. That is what we where tought in school
      We couldn’t learn English then, because it was the language of the decadent and corrupt ”West”. Russian? Now that is a noble language…

        Quote  Reply

    203. Mihnea,

      Movies with people in the west sleeping in cardboard boxes,those are the times.Didn’t catch them myself,I have to settle for the new sets of reds.
      Sorry for off-topic.

        Quote  Reply

    204. It seems clear to me that the Riverrun arc will culminate with the theorised RW2. They’re clearly planning something huge for that otherwise why go to the effort/ expense of building that massive set? Jaime only needs to spend one/two episodes at RR as he dealt with the siege fairly quickly in the books. Brienne can easily meet with him there or on the road back to KL where TWOW material kicks in.

        Quote  Reply

    205. So I finally decided to post here after months and months of lurking. I am super-stoked that the Black Fish is back! I, too, used to go to that other website. I stopped quite a while ago, as it appears that there is no room for people who haven’t dissected and analyzed every chapter of every book. Anyway, I need to figure out the spoiler effect before commenting further (especially with regard to someone’s post about how Jaimie and Brienne possibly reunite–fascinating!). This is an awesome fan site, and I love getting all the latest sneak peeks for season 6!

        Quote  Reply

    206. Just a little (har har) spec on Jon and LSH

      First, I wonder if most of those who are vehemently anti-Stoneheart were also vehemently anti-Cat, specifically did they hate Cat because she “couldn’t love a motherless child?” I feel like those who shout the loudest about hating LSH are Jon Snow super fans. Now that’s ok, and we don’t want to get too much into what I believe was the mistreatment of Cat as a character in the show, but I really do get it. Jon is the hero and a “brother” to her children and she was quite abrasive to him for something that clearly wasn’t his fault.

      My interest in Lady Stoneheart, aside from loving that sweet, sweet avenging of dead Starks, is rooted in who she has become. She is a monster, a tool of revenge and destruction. But she does those things *because* she loved so much. So there’s an interesting (to me) dichotomy there. She is a seemingly soulless vessel, existing only to take revenge on those who have wronged her and her family. So what happens if and when she is actually reunited with someone from her family? Does she soften? Is her quest for revenge over? Or was she so far gone that she is just a shell of their mother? Will one of her children have to put her out of her misery?

      As I’ve said before, I do agree with the timing not being optimal, but I could see them pulling it off, story-wise, and making it interesting. If nothing else, LSH could stand in stark contrast (hehe) to Jon. She’s an after school special showing what can go wrong with resurrection/messing with R’hllor. I could almost see them going for a one-two punch and introducing them “together.” Jon is resurrected and amidst the “celebration” you have Davos questioning Melisandre about bringing him back, asking what will he be like now that he’s been dead. Melisandre reassures Davos that Jon Snow will be exactly as he was before and telling him there’s no need for worry as we cut to a group in the woods, about to hang a certain Frey and introduce their hooded leader…ok, so I am not a writer, but just pointing out that it could be done without “taking away from” Jon’s own resurrection story and actually be a counterpoint to it.

      As for the person (I think it was Luka N) above who asked how LSH fans would prefer her to appear in the show, I come at it from a Tyrion’s scar vantage point. I wouldn’t want her to be as grotesque in the show as she was in the book. Michelle Fairley already has that smoker’s voice, so I would want her to still be able to speak, but minimally. I would want her soullessness to be conveyed through her dead eyes and complete lack of compassion. In the same way that we’ve seen Cersei as a villain and still managed to eke out sympathy for her during her walk, I’d want show Stoneheart to be someone we once saw as a fierce mama bear protector and now we see as almost evil in her quest for revenge, which would be highlighted nicely by her encountering noble and good-hearted Brienne and Pod and threatening to kill them.

      I also feel like people get very upset by the fact that the LSH hype train rolls on, but it’s kind of hard for it not to. Someone in the show has to take revenge on the Freys and it has not become clear yet who that is. With the seeming cut of Wyman Manderly, who I suppose could have taken on that role alone, it makes it even more murky. Perhaps it will be the Umber, but I doubt it as I think it’s Boltons on his mind. It could be the Blackfish, but it seems like he is otherwise engaged. It could be Arya and that could be why she is heading back to Westeros. It could be whomever is in the outlaw band in the Riverlands. It definitely could be a lot of different people but because it hasn’t been established yet, the speculation will continue.

      Having said all that (phew!) I am also perfectly content with her exclusion from the show at this point, if it doesn’t make narrative sense or impact the end game. There is a small amount of time left to wrap up an immense amount of story, and as a fan, my loyalty resides more with telling a great story that makes good sense than any one character or House.

        Quote  Reply

    207. Laum,

      I don’t know that Jamie’s storyline HAD a reason last season except to make him more loveable, like you said, to appease show fans. Jamie has become the Knight we wanted him to be in the books. I think the real reason he was even there was because NCW needed to have a reason for his enormous paycheck!

        Quote  Reply

    208. mau,

      I’d like to know the answer to that too, Sue?
      Huffington Post ran a story today “confirming ” that Lady Stoneheart will be in the show.

        Quote  Reply

    209. Mihnea,

      Thanks for answering! No, your english is great, no need for corrections! And as a friend previously said, it’s great that so many of us, from so many countries, get to exchange views here.
      And, you know, I’d love to be able to speak russian..
      On topic, someone mentioned Styr before… can anyone remind me what that was??

        Quote  Reply

    210. Laura,

      I had no problem with Cat, nor am I a Jon Snow superfan. I just tend to think, in terms of a visual medium, there is no need for LSH. As time continues to pass, I feel more strongly about it. Had she appeared at the end of season 4, it would have been fine. I wouldn’t have been over the moon about it, but I wouldn’t have been gnashing my teeth about it, either. As someone pointed out upthread, though, having her appear now, given we know

      Jon won’t stay dead (yeah, i’m sure I didn’t have to put it under spoiler code…hahaha…I just try to err on the side of caution

      , it seems as though it would be overkill to have 2 resurrections so close together. There is no question in my mind both the Freys and the Boltons need to have vengeance taken upon them and their houses for the RW, but I don’t think LSH is a necessary element of it. Many families lost people at the RW, thus I feel many people can contribute to being an instrument of revenge. I’d love to have

      people start getting offed like they were in Winterfell in the books. I think it would be interesting to see it in the Riverlands, too. What if Frey’s just started randomly appearing dead outside Riverrun? I’d love that.

        Quote  Reply

    211. Laura: So what happens if and when she is actually reunited with someone from her family? Does she soften? Is her quest for revenge over? Or was she so far gone that she is just a shell of their mother? Will one of her children have to put her out of her misery?

      I agree with you that some of the more intense anti-LSH sentiment probably derives from the fact that show-Cat had much more emphasis on how mean she was to Jon, as opposed to book-Cat where that is an exception (and not without justification) to her otherwise devoted-mother personality.

      I don’t have any particular investment either way in whether or not she comes back on the show (though I think that Fairley did a terrific job with the character). But even if it only happens in the books, I would find it much more resonant than even Arya killing Walder Frey to have Arya be the one to give her undead mother the gift of the Many-Faced God, truly out of love this time. And ‘You know where the heart is’ would take on whole new levels of meaning if it happened in the show. Audiences would dissolve in tears at that scene, guaranteed!

        Quote  Reply

    212. Sou,

      Oh, I don’t know Russian anymore, haven’t used it anywhere outside of those years in school.
      I guess I would have, as most students where going to Moscow for university.
      But alas, the revolution came, and the 90s really put people off, going there for studies.

      I don’t really understand this question. You mean who was Styr? He was the Thenn, Jon killed in S4 EP9.

        Quote  Reply

    213. Geralt of Rivia,

      It really does look like Sunspear would in my mind. I just think Meereen is more likely.

      Laura,

      I don’t dislike LSH because I disliked Cat; I dislike LSH in part precisely because I really liked Cat, especially as portrayed by Michelle Fairley.

        Quote  Reply

    214. This is exciting! The actor who plays him does have a uniquely strong onscreen presence…

      In the books does Blackfish have a big role? I just remember him being the gay uncle of Cat that refused to marry a woman and start a family so he became kind of a loner…

        Quote  Reply

    215. Arthur,

      BF is gay?

      I never really got that, from neither the show or books.

      To answer your question tough, I would not consider him a ”major” character. He is quite a nice character, but I think people exagerate a bit with him. Of course this is just my opinion.

        Quote  Reply

    216. Mihnea,

      That’s the subtext, according to some. Despite liking the character a lot, I never thought about it until I saw someone pointing out the possibility, but it does make a lot of sense to me.

      Arthur,

      He appeared more in the books than in the show (since the first book), but he isn’t a major character.

        Quote  Reply

    217. Mihnea,

      I don’t know for a fact he’s gay but I personally picked up settle hints from GRRM’s writings that he was gay.

      Maybe just how I interpreted it but it does explain the reason he refuses to get married and do the “traditional” high lord type family intermarriage thing and why his family is mad at him.

      Again, just how I interpreted it, I’m not saying it’s fact.

        Quote  Reply

    218. Awesome news about the BlackFish! I wonder if we will hear anything about Richard Dormer or Paul Kaye appearing near the Riverrun set? I am looking forward to the Jaime/Blackfish negotiations. Let’s keep our fingers crossed for Tobias Menzies. I am wondering if the possible arrival of the Vale army will turn the tide at Riverun?

      Has anyone been following former UnSullied StillShimpy’s read through of the series? She is on a Storm of Swords at this moment, approaching the Red Wedding to be exact, and her insights really highlight aspects of the story I never considered before. It appears that she may be a Daynenite and also provides a good reason for being so. What if Lyanna’s “promise me” refers to Ned to tell everyone that she did not go willingly with Rhaegar that in reality it was her choice but because of the all the bloodshed that followed she feels her passionate indiscretion/love has stained the honor of her family and her own personal honor? Shimpy then suggests that Lyanna died from sepsis whilst her child passed away as well. Thus allowing Ned, with great grief to bring Ser Arthur’s sword back to Starfall where he and Lady Ashara console each other in their grief. The product of that union being Jon. It’s really the first argument for the Dayneites that I have considered over R + L = J. I also liked the idea that Jon is special because of the circumstances that made him an outsider, and its because of his status is that he is able to see the world different from others.

      Any thoughts?

      PS: The StillShimpy posts are really entertaining but if your a show fan I recommend you have a thick skin because there is a lot of show/book comparison in the thread and some of the more embittered Book Walkers are really enjoying the fact that Shimpy is at a loss at the show’s adaptation process, exultantly proud that it can be frustrating to read simply because they can’t think of a reason why the story would be altered. I am not saying its wrong to criticize, but its not even considered the changes that have to be made for an adaptation to work. A ten episode only adaptation at that! That said, she appreciates the overall story that George has written much more than she did before. She even likes Jaime and Stannis now!

        Quote  Reply

    219. Joshua Atreides,

      If Ashara Dayne was Jon Snow’s mother, she would have been mentioned in the show (she’s not, not even once!) and more in the books (she is only mentioned once in Catelyn’s POV, never by Ned, certainly not even when he was imprisoned and should, logically, be thinking about things like the mother of his bastard son, not his dead sister and his promise to her, and then later by Selmy). The timeline also doesn’t make sense, as Robb and Jon are the same age in the books, so logically, they would have to have been conceived around the same time, give or take a few weeks. Not eighteen plus months.

      There’s also no reason to keep Ashara Dayne as Jon’s mother a secret from anyone, let alone Jon.

      Plus I deeply dislike the trope of “My sister just died, you just lost your brother, let’s bang!” GRRM already did a version of that with Jeyne and Robb.

        Quote  Reply

    220. Luka Nieto,

      Until I read someone else pointing it out, it hadn’t occurred to me, either. Of course, ever since college, when I decided I absolutely could not tolerate being a lit major, since every fucking class everything we read got reduced to, in essence, this or that has homoerotic undertones, and/or is misogynistic, I think I tend to block anything like that out. However, on my reread, since the idea had been brought to my attention, I can see how the argument could be made for him being gay.

        Quote  Reply

    221. Sue the Fury:
      Maggie,

      Hmmm he might be referring to the spoiler that I told him, actually.

      Yes, Jaime will be in more places than Riverrun by season’s end.

      Thanks for the answer!

      Hodor’s Bastard: Wow…I read that as “Jaime will be in pieces by seasons’s end” for some reason.

      I wish not “in pieces”!! I like both Jaime as character and the actor who plays him…
      I will miss them so much both :-/

        Quote  Reply

    222. Sou: On topic, someonge mentioned Styr before… can anyone remind me what that was??

      Styr was the bald Thenn cannibal guy in the raiding party with Ygritte, who bugged her about her relationship with Jon. I believe he’s the one that came up with comments about her Ginger Minge – Jon put an axe in his head near the end.

      In Hardhome, the character Loboda was also a Thenn, who denounced Jon and gave Karsi a hard time about his ancestors spitting on him if he broke bread with a crow. Hence Karsi’s lines “so would mine, but fuck em, they’re dead,” and “I fucking hate Thenns.” But poor Loboda at least redeemed himself at the end by trying to help. Styr was a jerk to the end.

        Quote  Reply

    223. Geralt of Rivia,

      I would think it is Sunspear, since they’ll have to have at least a few exterior Dorne scenes and I don’t think any have been filmed so far.

      Don’t get your hopes up for House Dayne, though (aside from the flashback).

        Quote  Reply

    224. Is speculation considered spoilery? I have some new thoughts about where Jaime’s arc might be headed, and why I think so. They aren’t based on anything I’ve read before, but I don’t want to cover them up if I don’t have to. When is speculation considered spoilery?

        Quote  Reply

    225. Geralt of Rivia,

      YES, PLEASE!!! We need to know about the Daynes! That’s really why I’m looking forward to the ToJ flashback, not the confirmation of the parentage question which seems to be a done deal for most of us. To see the Sword of the Morning (and his actual sigil) is going to be EPIC for me! Glad to know that there are others looking forward to this.

        Quote  Reply

    226. Dutch Maester,

      Just a personal wish of mine, but flashback is better than nothing. If there is by some miracle more to House Dayne in the show, I will be beyond thrilled. Gerold, Arthur, Edric, Ashara (her death among other things about her), their ancestrial sword Dawn etc. Only thing that is missing for me in this glorious show. 100 times more interesting than SandSnakes and it would certainly in my mind improve Dorne (maybe not for others).

      Joshua Atreides,

      If I look into books Ashara mights seem as an option but, did the show mentioned Ashara or ever hinted at possible connection to Jon? Someone ever doubted Daeny’s parentage? I know that this is not what you mean here, but quite a few fans see this r+l=d is a viable and more plausible option than r+l=j. It would be weird if for first 5 seasons we get nothing and all of sudden Ashara is Jon’s mother. It would seems forced and out of nowhere. No to mention that Ned is in my book 95% not Jon’s father which is kinda shame, because I would like him to be truly his son. That’s what he wanted all his life. Even my friends who’s watching only show are suspicious of this whole honorable Lord Ned Stark having a bastard with another woman.

      Exit81,

      I saw Preston Jacobs different take on this. That in fact it’s Brandon and Ashara and not Ned. She had a thing for Stark boys. That Jon might older than Robb and thus making it possible. Ned kept this as a secret because of inheritence to Winterfell and that Jon might wanted to push his claim or something like that. I watch that video once. Brandon and Ashara weren’t married and truborn will always had a stronger claim than a bastard, and it’s simply not in Jon’s nature. I think Barristan mentioned that Ashara had a stillborn daughter, but Iam not sure.

        Quote  Reply

    227. Mihnea,

      The fandom has two pet theories to explain why he refused to marry and why his relationship with his brother is so strained. One is that he’s gay, as mentioned by Arthur. The other is that he was in love with Catelyn’s mother, and when he couldn’t have her he refused to love another woman.
      I prefer the second one, because we’ve seen a lot of gay men getting married (Renly, Lyn Corbray, Laenor Velaryon…) without trouble.

        Quote  Reply

    228. Ashara D:
      Ashara,

      Oh no! Are there 3 of us now?

      There can be only one “Ashara D!” 🙂

      (yes, in addition to loving your posts, and your SN being one of my favorite characters (even though we know very little about her), I just made you a Highlander, too.)

      Count me as another who can’t wait to see House Dayne represented (and, yes, I’d feel that way ever were it not for the delicious Luke Roberts). There ain’t nothin’ like a Dayne!!!

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    229. Arthur: This is exciting! The actor who plays him does have a uniquely strong onscreen presence

      That is another reason I liked the idea of BF – the personality exuded in the few scenes he was in. Even though he’s not a major character, still it’s something on a positive side happening to the Starks/Tullys, something that bodes good things for them, rather than more treachery and degradation. He’s at least a possibility of some strong retribution for all that’s happened to them, from the time of Littlefinger’s plotting, onward through the Lannister-based death warrant carried out by the Freys. Something good has to happen for the Starks. All this disaster is getting a little boring.

        Quote  Reply

    230. Ashara D,

      It’s so funny. I’ve never ever cared one bit for House Dayne, like at all :P. To imagine that people are fans of such an incredibly small, small part of the books is beyond me.

        Quote  Reply

    231. Laura,

      I think Cat was actually one of the more shrewd members on Team Stark. She was kinda mean to Jon, sure, and she did screw up by taking Tyrion captive (although that’s not entirely her fault either as she’d been deceived by Littlefinger), but she gave no shortage of sound counsel to Robb (that he of course ignored because he was such a prideful idiot), and I’d say she was actually kinda justified in releasing Jaime given the circumstances.

      She’s definitely flawed (like every other character in the series), but it’s a pity some people find as much fault in her as they do. I think she was a great character. You could even say her flaws make her that much more interesting.

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    232. Luka Nieto:
      YEAAAAAH. At last, we’ve got some confirmation.

      Bearded Onion,

      It’s been years since the Red Wedding by this point, not months. At least in the show, anyway. It’s not exactly “1 season = 1 year”, as some claim (especially not season 4), but the timeframe is certainly larger than in the books. They could explain that the Blackfish has only recently taken back the castle. Or maybe it’s one of those sieges that go on for years; not exactly unheard of.

      No it hasn’t. It’s been around four months.

      S4 was clocked by Arya. Reasonable assumptions about the walk/riding time from the Twins to the Bloody Gate to the Saltpans would be less than two months. The King’s Landing plot also is consistent with this – Oberyn arrives a week or two in advance of the wedding, the trial occurs a few weeks after.

      S5 is best clocked by Stannis. “We leave in a fornight” plus marching time (a month?) plus snowstorm time (a couple weeks) again puts us right back into the same two months or so. Jaime’s plot also only needs a couple months, as everything in Dorne happened over a week or two at most, so you just need travel time, which is on the scale of weeks.

      People whine about Gilly’s baby, but it is actually all the OTHER child actors that are way off, because they age a year per season (or more if they are re-cast!).

      Too be fair, this is an issue rooted in the books. GRRM hasn’t contradicted himself, but he is vague about time (and distance) making it difficult to figure how much has elapsed.

        Quote  Reply

    233. Joshua Atreides:

      Has anyone been following former UnSullied StillShimpy’s read through of the series? She is on a Storm of Swords at this moment, approaching the Red Wedding to be exact, and her insights really highlight aspects of the story I never considered before. It appears that she may be a Daynenite and also provides a good reason for being so. What if Lyanna’s “promise me” refers to Ned to tell everyone that she did not go willingly with Rhaegar that in reality it was her choice but because of the all the bloodshed that followed she feels her passionate indiscretion/love has stained the honor of her family and her own personal honor? Shimpy then suggests that Lyanna died from sepsis whilst her child passed away as well. Thus allowing Ned, with great grief to bring Ser Arthur’s sword back to Starfall where he and Lady Ashara console each other in their grief. The product of that union being Jon. It’s really the first argument for the Dayneites that I have considered over R + L = J. I also liked the idea that Jon is special because of the circumstances that made him an outsider, and its because of his status is that he is able to see the world different from others.

      Any thoughts?

      PS: The StillShimpy posts are really entertaining but if your a show fan I recommend you have a thick skin because there is a lot of show/book comparison in the thread and some of the more embittered Book Walkers are really enjoying the fact that Shimpy is at a loss at the show’s adaptation process, exultantly proud that it can be frustrating to read simply because they can’t think of a reason why the story would be altered. I am not saying its wrong to criticize, but its not even considered the changes that have to be made for an adaptation to work. A ten episode only adaptation at that!That said, she appreciates the overall story that George has written much more thanshe did before. She even likes Jaime and Stannis now!

      I read her posts way back when she was Unsullied, but it seems her train of logic hasn’t changed all that much. On one hand, she is very smart and really likes to think about what she’s reading/watching. She certainly made me think with some of her more pointed criticisms. But man, she can be so fixated upon her pet peeves — and there are A LOT of those — that it becomes extremely wearying extremely fast.

      Also, unfortunate to say, she’s a real, you know, book p****t. Every single, and I really mean every single, thing that’s different in the show is a reason to express ample WTFs.

      A very unenjoyable read. She does have a sense of humor though.

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    234. Dutch Maester:
      Rygritte,

      It is not Jason Momoa. Most definitely not. Clickbait article.

      It’s so not Jason Momoa the day the “story” came out, people were making fun of it, and how if that was Jason Momoa, all men with long, dark hair and a certain build must be Jason Momoa, in fact, all Dothraki were Jason Momoa.

        Quote  Reply

    235. Laura,

      Agree with many of your points, and would be happy if LSH was included but not devastated if she wasn’t. I think if they do decide to bring her in, S6 is the right time, for the reasons you mentioned (parallels with Jon).

      So here’s where I should point out I’m a pretty big Jon Snow fan. And I liked Cat. I think her harshness towards Jon was a flaw that actually made her character more interesting. I’m not sure I would agree that book!Cat was any less unkind to Jon than show!Cat – even the Blackfish (hey, look, I’m on topic!) says that Cat had spoken ill of Jon (and equated him to Theon!!). I think the message from both book and show is that Cat didn’t like Jon and treated him with contempt/coldness. She recognised it was probably unfair, and I found that facet of her character to be very humanising.

        Quote  Reply

    236. Oh man, I saw this article late last night and have been trying to catch up on the comments since. Glad to see the hype, because, yes, Brynden!

      I’ve never been a fan of the Blackfish sexuality theories. They reek of the stale stereotype that lifelong bachelors must be gay, or some tired trope that chivalry means never loving again after losing a true love. There are way more sexualities and possible explanations as to why a stubborn guy would refuse to marry against his will. For lack of any stated reason, the most obvious explanation is just what is given in context: he’s stubborn and said no to being told what to do.

      If anything, I read the character as one whose sexuality is notably not a part of his outward identity. I enjoyed Varys introducing a skeptical Oberyn to asexuality, but this isn’t even that. Brynden is just comfortable and confident enough in his own leathery skin that he’s gonna do his own thing and care what people say about his bedroom activities about as much as he cared to watch if he sniped his brother’s funeral boat. He knows he’s a badass and doesn’t suffer fools…or their speculation.

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    237. Kilgore Tully: There are way more sexualities and possible explanations as to why a stubborn guy would refuse to marry against his will. For lack of any stated reason, the most obvious explanation is just what is given in context: he’s stubborn and said no to being told what to do.

      If anything, I read the character as one whose sexuality is notably not a part of his outward identity.

      All this could still be true of a gay person. Mere stubbornness seems more likely to have manifested as him telling his family that he’s not going to accept a particular unwanted arranged marriage, not that he refuses to marry any woman at all, even one of his own choosing. To be willing to endure such a profound alienation from his family for so many years bespeaks something deeper than mere orneriness, in my opinion. The gay explanation seems to fit Occam’s Razor best. And I like it for precisely the reason that it is such a nice counterweight to the show’s rather stereotypical depiction of Loras as someone defined mostly by his sexuality. The Blackfish clearly has bigger fish to fry than his preferences in the boudoir.

        Quote  Reply

    238. It’s weird how we all took LSH’s appearance as almost inevitable back in, say, season 4, based solely on book chronology, but when when none of the real world prerequisites necessary for her storyline or inclusion in the show (i.e: casting of outlaws, seige of Riverrun, confirmation of Frey’s back, Frey son cast etc….) had been met.

      Now here we are in season 6, where most, if not all all of those conditions have for the first time been confirmed and we’re all so fatigued by three years worth of false starts & red herrings, that even those of us who wanted her now regard her inclusion as incredibly unlikely.

      Talk about topsy turvy!

      Which isn’t to say she WILL make it in eventually, just that with everything else immediately corresponding with the LSH plotline seemingly making the mix for season 6, it sure will make the elephant in the room a damn sight more conspicuous by its absence ….

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    239. Joshua Atreides: Thus allowing Ned, with great grief to bring Ser Arthur’s sword back to Starfall where he and Lady Ashara console each other in their grief. The product of that union being Jon. It’s really the first argument for the Dayneites that I have considered over R + L = J. I also liked the idea that Jon is special because of the circumstances that made him an outsider, and its because of his status is that he is able to see the world different from others.

      Any thoughts?

      So Ned

      hangs around at Starfall for 9 months till the baby is born?

      Then what Ashara kills herself when Ned says “right I’m heading back to the Wife now and taking our son with me?”

        Quote  Reply

    240. Firannion,

      This is the exactly logic that bugs me. We are told nothing about his sexuality. The only thing the speculation is based on is that he refused a political marriage. He wasn’t alienated from his family; he quarreled with his brother for a few years before moving away with his niece.

      If anything, refusing to get married in Westeros means less about sexuality than in the real world; we’ve seen how easy, even expected, it is for nobles to separate their political marriages from their sex lives. If someone of Brynden’s position refuses a marriage, it’s not because he prefers to get his jollies elsewhere, it’s because he actively dislikes the idea of that marriage.

      So what if it could be true of a gay person? It could be true of an asexual person. It could have been true of a noble deeply in love with a whore (though perhaps not if Hoster were anything like Tywin…). It could be true of a polyamorous person. It could be true of someone into something foul. It could be true of a stubborn straight guy. It could be true of a drunk, a weirdly dedicated beekeeper, or anyone so deeply obsessed with anything that marriage would be a distraction.

      It’s more a comment on our society that in the absence of a sexual identity others think, “Huh, must be gay.”

        Quote  Reply

    241. Ashara:
      mau,

      I’d like to know the answer to that too, Sue?
      Huffington Post ran a story today “confirming ” that Lady Stoneheart will be in the show.

      Eh, I just read the article in question, and it seemed to me like they were merely speculating.

      Speculating with a very… LSH-suggestive cover image, mind, but speculating nonetheless.

        Quote  Reply

    242. Kilgore Tully,

      It wasn’t A political marriage that he refused, though; it was marriage, period. That’s why I think that it’s a reasonable assumption that he just wasn’t into women. And yes, maybe that could mean asexuality or an obsession with beekeeping, but I think it makes more sense to exercise Occam’s Razor on this. Statistically speaking, most men who aren’t into women are into men. That doesn’t necessarily throw any shade on people who fall into much less common categories.

        Quote  Reply

    243. Ashara D,

      “Oh no! Are there 3 of us now? :-(”

      I never noticed you before a few weeks ago! Since Nymeria doesn’t seem to welcome me as a “Highlander,” I’d be more than happy to change. No disrepect meant to you, My Lady.
      House Dayne seems to be beloved. There should be many representatives! But that doesn’t seem to be too popular.

        Quote  Reply

    244. Firannion,

      Hoster and Brynden explicitly fought over Hoster wanting Brynden to marry Bethany Redwyne because the Redwynes are one of the richest and most powerful houses in the Reach. It was definitely political. Then they fought a few years, then Brynden moved away, and then they didn’t talk anymore.

      If we really want to get into statistics and play with Occam Brand™ razors, we should stop at the big statistic that most men are attracted to women. In that case, where the assumed straight guy moved away from the one person who could conceivably force him to marry, the odds are Brynden spent his time pulling all the Vale tail he could get.

      Look up Hother “Whoresbane” Umber. We know about a paragraph about the guy, and included in that is that he hates the nickname because the whore was a man, and that this is only mentioned in whispers. We know so much more about Brynden, yet no whispers, no hints. GRRM chooses this sort of info carefully; I really think the point of Brynden’s non-marriage is just that he doesn’t want to be tied down.

        Quote  Reply

    245. I’m kinda with Kilgore Tully on this one. I don’t think it’s fair to make assumptions about a person’s sexuality based on a simple lack of “evidence”, especially something flimsy like refusing to marry – and more specifically, arranged marriages. I’m willing to bet a lot of people in Westeros aren’t very keen on arranged marriages… the Blackfish just happens to have the gall to outright refuse them! And I say more power to him.

        Quote  Reply

    246. Kilgore Tully,

      Certainly he is a slippery one. Perhaps we will find out more of his backstory in the books to come, and perhaps not. So far, his sexual preference (or lack thereof) only seems particularly significant within the context of how it may have impacted his status in the line of inheritance for House Tully. Still, I would welcome the inclusion in the story of a gay character whose gayness was far from his or her defining characteristic.

        Quote  Reply

    247. Hodor’s Bastard: I fear Occam’s rationale regarding Benjen’s sexuality.

      Hmmm…one might make deductions about his long absence that give new meaning to the term “the Other woman.” But I don’t think that they’d be a simpler explanation than his being just plain dead.

        Quote  Reply

    248. Joshua Atreides:
      Awesome news about the BlackFish! I wonder if we will hear anything about Richard Dormer or Paul Kaye appearing near the Riverrun set? I am looking forward to the Jaime/Blackfish negotiations. Let’s keep our fingers crossed for Tobias Menzies. I am wondering if the possible arrival of the Vale army will turn the tide at Riverun?

      Has anyone been following former UnSullied StillShimpy’s read through of the series? She is on a Storm of Swords at this moment, approaching the Red Wedding to be exact, and her insights really highlight aspects of the story I never considered before. It appears that she may be a Daynenite and also provides a good reason for being so. What if Lyanna’s “promise me” refers to Ned to tell everyone that she did not go willingly with Rhaegar that in reality it was her choice but because of the all the bloodshed that followed she feels her passionate indiscretion/love has stained the honor of her family and her own personal honor? Shimpy then suggests that Lyanna died from sepsis whilst her child passed away as well. Thus allowing Ned, with great grief to bring Ser Arthur’s sword back to Starfall where he and Lady Ashara console each other in their grief. The product of that union being Jon. It’s really the first argument for the Dayneites that I have considered over R + L = J. I also liked the idea that Jon is special because of the circumstances that made him an outsider, and its because of his status is that he is able to see the world different from others.

      Any thoughts?

      PS: The StillShimpy posts are really entertaining but if your a show fan I recommend you have a thick skin because there is a lot of show/book comparison in the thread and some of the more embittered Book Walkers are really enjoying the fact that Shimpy is at a loss at the show’s adaptation process, exultantly proud that it can be frustrating to read simply because they can’t think of a reason why the story would be altered. I am not saying its wrong to criticize, but its not even considered the changes that have to be made for an adaptation to work. A ten episode only adaptation at that!That said, she appreciates the overall story that George has written much more thanshe did before. She even likes Jaime and Stannis now!

      I red StillShimpy’s thoughts on unsullied before where she is doing her read? Is there a place for it in the same site?

        Quote  Reply

    249. Firannion,

      Whoa…I didn’t expect that response but I guess there are many “Occams” with respect to Benjen. 🙂 We need to ask BR for the truth regarding Ned’s little bro. I’m sure one of his eyes tracked him.

        Quote  Reply

    250. Mihnea:
      Ser Gerold Dayne,

      No, I’m born in the country and time when we where worshiping our great and wonderfull leader, for all his great achivements in saving us from the capitalist dogs who try to steal the country from the people.

      This is not even a joke. That is what we where tought in school
      We couldn’t learn English then, because it was the language of the decadent and corrupt ”West”. Russian? Now that is a noble language…

      lol,

      Have a slight feeling eastern Europeans will develop a similar attitude to the E.U (West) in the years to come if the spat between the Slovakians/Hungarians and ze Germans/Brussels Bureaucrats is anything to go by

        Quote  Reply

    251. Sue the Fury:
      Maggie,

      Hmmm he might be referring to the spoiler that I told him, actually.

      Yes, Jaime will be in more places than Riverrun by season’s end.

      It is known. He himself in the Riverlands and his former Right Hand in King’s Landing. It is known.

        Quote  Reply

    252. Greatjon of Slumber:
      So let me sum up. We are, in Season 6, getting:

      –Max Von Sydow
      –The Blackfish’s return
      –More huge battles
      –A certain pirate of the islands
      –The Dothraki
      –More freaky red priestesses
      –HODOR
      –Northern Lords
      –Samwell Tarly’s family
      –And Ian fucking McShane.

      So yes. I’m excited. Beyond belief.

      TOJ

        Quote  Reply

    253. Firannion:
      Kilgore Tully,

      Still, I would welcome the inclusion in the story of a gay character whose gayness was far from his or her defining characteristic.

      A lovely notion to settle this on! I agree completely.

      My strong opinions on the interplay of sexuality and identity almost certainly stem from my dad coming out when I was very young. For one thing, I’m very accustomed to the idea that marriage status doesn’t equal sexual preference, but I also just hate when anyone’s sexuality is made a bigger deal than it is (and, really, it’s almost never, ever relevant).

      The most important lesson the most important man in my life has ever taught me is that you have to be true to yourself. Ironically [in this conversation], I love the Blackfish for that exact reason. He is what he is.

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    254. Tyrion Pimpslap,

      Chinoiserie,

      She’s on previously.tv.com’s GoT/A Song of Ice and Fire/Climbing the Spitball wall.

      Mr Fixit,

      Yeah she has become an utter purist. I think her SJW tendencies take over when she engages in any text and if the adaptation doesn’t justify the use of her pet peeves then game over. I also find that she knows that she has a growing audience and despite a certain humility in her writing, I feel she tries too hard to be funny. So I take her with a grain of salt. Also, her insistence that a character is much different from the book portrayal because said actor hasn’t read the book is ludicrous, as such nuances are dictated more by writing and direction than by performance. And while Shimpy has shown some fairness to the adaptation every now and then, its the slavering show haters that mingle around her thread at the first whiff of blood that sucks the fun out of the commentary. We get it guys, stop pushing your impressions on Shimpy so that she compares the series the way you have.
      And yet Shimpy’s view on the series is not nearly as cringeworthy than Gingerella. Ye Gods by far the worst Unsullied poster. Whenever she is emotionally challenged by the series or taken out of her personal criterion for why she watches, she emotes way too much. It’s like reading a tumblr about “Olicity” and other such television “ships”. Not to mention her hatred for the depiction of the White Walkers and the wights visual renderings really grind my gears. Maybe CGI is like comedy: you never know how certain people will react. To be fair a friend of mine whom I thought would find the WW depiction right up his alley found their portrayal “lame”. Enh, in the end it’s different folks, different strokes right?

        Quote  Reply

    255. Laura,
      Personally, I dislike LSH because I feel like there are too many returns of ‘dead’ characters and faux cliffhangers in the latter books, which feel cheesy to me, and she’s one of the trend. There’s Mance-faux-Mance, Arya’s blindness, LSH, Jon, Sandor Clegane… I’m also against the Hound returning to the narrative, for exactly the same reason. These things should be rare.

      Joshua Atreides:
      Has anyone been following former UnSullied StillShimpy’s read through of the series?

      I don’t care about the opinions of particular fans. Well, unless they are Sue and have Access to Secret Knowledge they can’t share yet. Said Secret Knowledge might potentially taint Sue’s opinions, so it’s worth paying attention to them.

      Someone else mentioned Preston Jackobs – personally, I find the cult of celebrity to be between risible and unsettling.

      Arthur,
      BF might be just asexual? I have no idea why people assume ‘gay’ where a person could just not be interested at all!

      Personally, I never assign a sexuality/sexual preference to a person unless enough evidence gets pushed in my face that I have to reevaluate. I wonder, why would you do the reverse?

        Quote  Reply

    256. Ghost’s Lunch,

      Well here in Romania we bassically have something like that, the overwhelming majority of people like the EU, they are the ones we credit for starting the anti-corruption campaign that has destroyed 60-65% of our political ”class”.
      Also people have 0 faith in our politicians, so if the EU says something they obey, otherwise they will loose huge procents in the next elections.

      Even the refugee vote is something that our prime-minister deeply regrets, he really misjudged how people would react, so much that he switched his policy on the refugee problem 180 degrees, even apologiesing on national television for voting against what the EU wanted.
      We really like to consider ourselves ”western” so going against what the west want/says is best, is no less then political suicide.

      Damn, really sorry for the long off-topic, politics are a passion of mine and I let myself go a bit.
      Won’t happen again!

        Quote  Reply

    257. Joshua Atreides,

      About “Promise me, Ned.” [SPOILER] He didn’t start thinking about broken promises until he was imprisoned. In fact, the first time he thought about Lyanna’s promise me, Ned was much price he had to pay to keep them for 14 years.[/SPOILER]

      As for A+L=J or N+A=J, the fundamental question that this theory cannot answer sufficiently is: why keep it a secret then? R+L=J is only theory that can sufficiently answer that. There are still some flaws to the theory but it just makes sense really when you think about it.

        Quote  Reply

    258. Oh great, after the great Daenerys as fire-resistant or fire-proof argument, now the Blackfish gay or just stubborn one.
      It is not that important, is it.
      But still, it is funny to see that sexual orientation (even one based on third-party perception) can be used to identify someone (even a fictional character) that obviously has a much more complex identity. I am not sure that labelling is the best way to go about it. I am sorry if I am not making myself very clear, but it is just that it seems funny to identify the Blackfish as “the gay uncle of Caitlin Tully” just on a presumption based on his not marrying. I’m sure there are a dozen things to say about the Blackfish without adding perception on his sexual orientation.
      To be clear, this is not about criticising the first person who brought this up; it is just about commenting that sexual orientation apparently weighs a lot in people’s minds (even when it’s sexual orientation as perceived by others). I would probably be not so happy about labelling even if the Blackfish was president of the Song’s LGBT community.

        Quote  Reply

    259. Alright, so they’re simply taking Jaime back to his book story…. which I guess is great, those are some of my favorite chapters, seeing Westeros through Jaime’s eyes is always nice. But, does this mean that his arc in Dorne was just a distraction because they wanted to put off his Riverland story??? Why? Instead we got probably the worst stuff in all of the show’s history.

        Quote  Reply

    260. Vlad,

      I think he was there to introduce viewers to the Dornish storyline. I love Jaime and Bronn but I don’t think they were the best people to introduce us to Dorne. Their storyline there felt too contrived to be effective. I think if they had gone with Ellaria, it would have been better. Maybe. I don’t know. But I guess the showrunners think Ellaria isn’t an established enough character to make us care about Dorne.

        Quote  Reply

    261. Vlad:
      But, does this mean that his arc in Dorne was just a distraction because they wanted to put off his Riverland story??? Why? Instead we got probably the worst stuff in all of the show’s history.

      It was just a way for them to introduce Dorne.Problem here is that the Dorne characters where not properly used.And Jaime in Dorne was a way to make Myrcella die in her fathers arms.Makes everything even more tragical for Jaime and Cersei.And their kids.

        Quote  Reply

    262. Vlad,

      There’s nothing wrong with the concept of sending Jaime to Dorne. It was the execution of the storyline that was the problem. But let’s not discuss that again.

        Quote  Reply

    263. Love it! Love the tully family since they are strong alliance to the stark and were close to Robb. Hope Edmure comes back aswell and that they dont die since I like em a lot.

        Quote  Reply

    264. Still not a huge fan of this casting choice. Clive Russell portrayed Blackfish as a generic thug. Oh well, at least Jaime’s story is now back on track.

        Quote  Reply

    265. Wasn’t Bronn asked – by Tyrion – to ensure that Shae left on a ship for Pentos? Next thing we know, Shae is testifying against Tyrion at trial. Is there some duplicity with Bronn and Tywin? Bronn did tell Tyrion that he’d work for the highest bidder.

      Or, it could be that Shae was intercepted by Tywin, in some other way, though I can’t imagine how. Or, maybe she got off that ship by herself – but how?

        Quote  Reply

    266. Anon,

      The first thing Tywin said after Joffrey’s murder was “stop all ships in the port!”, so the Lannister soldiers simply managed to stop Shae’s ship before it left the bay.

        Quote  Reply

    267. Could be, Tywin of the Hill.

      In season 5, episode 2, Jamie meets Bronn on the beach to ask him to sail to Dorne to retrieve Myrcella. Jamie hands Bronn a scroll that rescinds his betrothal to Lollys. Bronn tells Jamie that that wasn’t the “deal” he made with his sister. Apparently, Cersai and Bronn made a deal – offstage. It seems Bronn got an arranged marriage, but what did he do for Cersai in exchange? I’m guessing it was deliver Shae to her, so she could, in turn, deliver Shae to Tywin.

      Cersai had pointed out her brother’s “whore” to their father. Tywin told Cersai to have the whore brought to the Tower of the Hand after the wedding.

      So, I don’t think Shae ever made it onto that ship.

        Quote  Reply

    268. Now that LIttle Finger is in control of the Vale, Harrenhal, and looking to be Warden of the North I have a feeling he will be finally shown as the real bad guy in this series. Since episode one he has been manipulating and gaining power. I’m thinking once the Riverlands are empty fighting in the North he will use the Knights of the Vale to take over pretty much everything down to and including Kings Landing. He wants the Iron Throne but instead of taking it he is using years and years of manipulation to get that seat. I see him just about to take it when Dany shows up.

        Quote  Reply

    269. I’m very glad they are keeping Bronn in the picture. With the Vale now under Littlefinger’s control and the majority of the army on the march I would love to see Bronn do what he said to Tyrion when pointed out the place was “impenetrable”. A few good men along with himself and some climbing gear and they can take the Vale back. I really hope he gets the chance.

        Quote  Reply

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