Melanie Liburd joins the cast of Game of Thrones

Melanie LiburdThe casting news just won’t quit this week! Another new Game of Thrones addition has been spotted, this time in Peñíscola, Spain where the cast is filming.

English actress Melanie Liburd was identified by Watchers on the Wall reader Gravemaster, and her casting verified by an Instagram posting (shown below the cut). In the posting, Liburd says, “Flying back to London then on to Spain to film Game Of Thrones. Holy *%#@ dreams actually do come true! I’m so excited I feel like jumping up and down!!”

Liburd has appeared in several American series such as CSI, Dracula, The Grinder and Kevin Williamson’s Stalker.

It’s not presently known what role Liburd is playing in season 6. The actress is filming in Peñíscola with the likely Meereenese storyline, so that narrows it down somewhat. There are a few roles remaining unfilled that she fits the bill for, and could theoretically visit Meereen. Of particular note are the Red priestess (possibly named Kinvara), and the young widow. Kinvara seems like the best bet at this time.

Liburd’s Instagram postings about Game of Thrones and Peñíscola:

And the original group photo where Melanie Liburd was spotted:

134 responses

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    1. It’s always nice to see how relatively unknown actors and actresses react when they get cast in such a big project. It obviously means a lot to this person. Good for her!

      Cue the Lindaaaa rage.

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    2. As far as I am concerned, we found our Kinvara, our Benerro/Moqorro analogue! Hopefully someone can confirm it soon. I’m quite excited and curious about the role she and her religion will play in Dany’s story arc, and in the show in general, next season.

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    3. D’Arcy,

      She’s in Peniscola, so she’s most likely filming scenes for Meereen. Before reading the article I did think she could be a former Khaleesi.

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    4. D’Arcy:
      I would assume she may have that widow role we previously saw an audition tape for?

      I think they were also looking for a red priestess for Meereen scenes at some point? might explain why she’s hanging out with Conleth and Nathalie.

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    5. That’s our Kinvara. Keep going like this and I will become a R’hllor follower.

      I’m really interested to see how R’hllor will potentially influence Daeny and Kinavara’s interaction with our Dragon Queen. Both of our main heroes will have a Red Priestess by their side at the end of the season. I don’t expect Mel’s death…not yet.

      BeautyBrienne,

      Patiently waiting for first trailer. It’s gonna be a looong wait. 🙁

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    6. Cubicz,

      She’s with Varys and Missandei if that group photo is anything to go by so I doubt that’s the case. I reckon it’ll just be somebody totally new. I mean, it’s Winds of Winter content, right? At least some of these new actors must be playing characters the book readers don’t know about!

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    7. Despite having an eye-rolling name, ‘Stalker’ was actually a pretty good show, and I’m pissed I didn’t get to find out what happened. Welcome, Melanie!

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    8. Geralt of Rivia,

      that would be very interesting about both having a Red Priestess in their camp..maybe that will be what brings them together??

      she is a beauty isnt she..very exotic…will fit in well with the Essos storyline me thinks

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    9. I think what distinguishes Melisandre from many of the other Red Priests/Priestesses is that Mel is from Asshai, a very frightening place. For that reason, I think Kinvara will probably be a ‘good’ version of Mel, if that makes sense?

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    10. Galli: For that reason, I think Kinvara will probably be a ‘good’ version of Mel, if that makes sense?

      Given that they belong to the same religion, they probably will have similar beliefs about what is “good” and what is “evil.” We do not have much indication that there is a lot of theological breadth to the Red Church: they genuinely do seem to have some “supernatural” power prodding them in some general direction.

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    11. selena,

      Not sure.

      I wouldn’t be suprised by some cryptic messages from Kinvara towards Daeny about Jon and most of all warning about White Walkers. Kinvara is for sure convinced that Daeny is AAR like Moqorro in the books. Mel will be concentrated too much on Jon for many reasons.
      After his rebirth (that’s what we expect) she would be 100% believe that Jon is Warrior of the Light and she was blind towards Daeny’s presence before. Never mentioned her and I don’t expect that this will change in the future. Maybe R’hllor is doing it on purpose. He surely works in mysterious ways, but maybe R’hllor needs both or maybe all three of them (with the main concentration being Jon and Daeny). Not forget about intense look that Red Priestess gave Tyrion in Volantis. I get the impression of her seeing something in Tyrion. maybe Kinvara will touch on this aswell. They will have some scenes together.

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    12. I’ve never seen her in anything, but I have to say, she is gorgeous.

      Side note. Why do people always have to bring up Westeros or Elio or Linda for zero reason around here? It’s been happening in almost every article lately. It’s kinda weird.

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    13. Geralt of Rivia,

      Good point Geralt. I found it bizarre that with news of Daenerys getting to Castle Black, Melisandre was seemingly oblivious. Strange considering she could read Jon Snow’s mind and quote from his dead Wildling lover, Ygritte. How did Mel not receive knowledge of a Targaryen queen hatching dragons? Unless she DOES know and for some reason, disregards it….

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    14. I dont think Dany, or her advisors, will really consider Kinvarra and her religion to be a force to be reckoned with unless she proves her value / power / influence in a big way…

      Maybe she’ll just display her authority and talk about the thousands and thousands of former slaves praising her God and that will be enough to convince Dany to keep her at her side, but I’d like it if she proves her worth by some more… “visual” (magical) means…

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    15. Galli: I found it bizarre that with news of Daenerys getting to Castle Black, Melisandre was seemingly oblivious.

      We have no reason to think that Melisandre knows Daenerys’ history. Also, just because Maester Aemon got the news about Daeny, it does not follow that Stannis et al. got that news: we don’t know what contact Stannis’ people have with the rest of the world anymore, and Aemon might well be (or have been) too cagey to share that information. And if they have gotten word, well: it would be very easy to dismiss it as rumor and propaganda; after all, hasn’t R’hllor shown them that Stannis is the one who is going to do that?

      Now, R’hllor might have shown Melisandre stuff about Daeny in the fire: but she probably already has misinterpreted that information to be about Stannis in the past. R’hllor’s visions seem to be a lot of allegorical images rather than a close-captioned HD stream with rewind.

      All of that written, it does seem that R’hllor is sending the same general message to a lot of his clergy. The different interpretations probably reflect differences in knowledge among those clergy.

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    16. How can I focus on frivolous speculation and daunting battle/invasion scenarios with a casting like this??? Too damn distracting!!

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    17. Galli,

      Melisandre whole heartedly believes herself to be a ‘saviour’ of sorts, and seems very genuine, as we saw in her point-of-view. Perceptions of her as ‘evil’ come from an aversion towards her religious beliefs both in-world and out. I see no reason why this new priest will be much different.

      George hasn’t called Melisandre his most misunderstood character for nothing. I see a lot of people waiting for her ‘comeuppance’. I really don’t see her getting anything of the sort, though I really don’t see a scenario where she doesn’t die. Melisandre is another example of a nuanced ‘grey’ character. She is notably more ‘evil’ in the show, though.

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    18. Quinton,

      I agree with you about Melisandre, but I think there is this aura of evil around her actions – call it a sense of the insidious, of the occult, that doesn’t necessarily correlate with her actual intentions. Thanks to the brilliant Carice van Houten, Mel is still an enigmatic fascinating character to watch all these seasons later. And having a new Red Priestess is incredibly exciting. I do love watching those servants of R’hillor. Do you think Quaithe will ever grace our screens again?

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    19. I’m pretty sure it’s David Walton and his wife Majandra Delfino between D&D in the group shot.

      David:
      http://www.movpins.com/big/MV5BMTU5NTQwMTc1Nl5BMl5BanBnXkFtZTgwMjk1ODUzMTE/david-walton-at-event-of-break-point-(2014).jpg

      Majandra: http://www.contactmusic.com/pics/ln/20140916/nbc_vanity_fair_160914_03/majandra-delfino-nbc-vanity-fair-2014-2015-tv_4376842.jpg

      Edit: if i had to bet, i’d say that she may have a role and he is just a plus one.

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    20. Quinton: George hasn’t called Melisandre his most misunderstood character for nothing.

      Indeed: I had to give him $5 to say that.

      Quinton: She is notably more ‘evil’ in the show, though.

      I think that only appears to be the case because she so willingly burns Shireen: but we can expect that to happen in the book, too. Book!Melisandre also is quite keen to burn people, and she gets quite upset when her god is denied his barbecue! But another part of it is the “unwritten” aspects of how characters behave: many people fill in blanks differently from each other, and GRRM’s comments no doubt stem from many people filling them in quite differently than he would have had them do.

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    21. Noooo! Carice has competition for the most beautiful Red Priestess on the show, and now along with Nathalie, the actress with the mostess (is this a word?) We know Ms Liburd has talent, in Nina we trust.
      She makes me feel like singing…”Whoaa, black Melanie, bam ba; damn.”

      Hodor’s Bastard,

      …”Too damn distracting!!

      Amen, brother, can we all say Hallelujah!

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    22. Wow, she’s stunningly beautiful. I have to admit I’m not familiar with Ms. Liburd’s previous work, but she sounds so genuinely enthusiastic to be a part of the show! I hope that she’ll be excellent as Kinvara (if that’s indeed who she’s playing, and as others have pointed out, the circumstantial evidence points in that direction).

      The High Priestess has been one of the new season’s most intriguing characters to me from the moment that leaked audition reel surfaced.

      She appears to be the High Priestess of the Red Temple, with additional titles like the Flametruth and First Servant of the Lord of Light. That means that she’s likely to provide a few answers about the faith of R’hllor’s “official” position while remaining a thoroughly enigmatic presence herself. In that audition, Kinvara also told Tyrion that she plans to summon her best priests to Meereen to circulate the message that Daenerys is the “One Who Was Promised”. I’m very interested to see whether such an influx will prove to be a stabilizing force in the city, or plunge it further into chaos. Furthermore, I’ll be curious to see how Daenerys, fresh off her sojourn with the Dothraki, responds to such heady claims once she returns.

      Perhaps, by contrast, she’ll also afford us a new perspective on Melisandre during a time when our resident Red Priestess’s faith is at its lowest ebb.

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    23. Jared,

      I hope that Kinvara can help us fill in some blanks about Mel, as well. I’m particularly fascinated to learn what Melisandre’s relationship to the Red Priest organization as a whole actually is at this point. She seemed to be an emissary of theirs when she told Thoros that their High Priest gave him a specific mission in Westeros, but according to GRRM, hasn’t she herself come on “her own agenda”? Is she a rogue agent?

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    24. Coleman,

      Very nice! She definitely has the “beautiful, intense, and magnetic” part pinned down.

      I’m a little worried about the increasing presence and influence of followers of the Red God in the story however. I certainly don’t deny that their magic is legit and the Lord of Light seems to exist in some form, but… there’s something undoubtedly ominous about the whole thing. I could never bring myself to completely trust in the Red God or his followers, and I really hope Jon and Dany won’t either. :S

      (I’m not counting Mel’s actions here because so far her penchant for human sacrifice and blood magic is just limited to her, and may not be representative of the religion as a whole)

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    25. Galli: I found it bizarre that with news of Daenerys getting to Castle Black, Melisandre was seemingly oblivious. Strange considering she could read Jon Snow’s mind and quote from his dead Wildling lover, Ygritte. How did Mel not receive knowledge of a Targaryen queen hatching dragons? Unless she DOES know and for some reason, disregards it….

      At this point I would guess that Melissandre, like most people in Westeros, discounts a female as being the Chosen of her Lord. 😉 She probably can’t fathom that her Lord wouldn’t choose a male to fight the WWs. I also believe that she has read her tea-leaves very wrong and has mistaken dragonblood for King’s blood (since the dragonlords were the Kings once) and therefore, keeps burning people left and right for king’s blood. All in all, she has genuine intentions, but somewhere in translation, she got some vital things wrong. For me, her most fitting end, if she survives this season, would be to die serving her Lord by being a snack for Drogon and sibs.

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    26. Galli,

      I subscribe to the whole ‘Melisandre is undead’ theory. It all seems to add up and would be a nice twist. I’ve seen rumours floating around that the actor who played Maester Cressen even went as far as to say she was 400 years old! There might even have been an official interview where he mentioned it, but I can’t be bothered digging it up. Waiting for someone to rip the ruby neckpiece off her throat and see if her glamour holds …

      Unfortunately, I don’t think we’ll see Quaithe again. The show has severely played down/omitted most of the story’s prophecies; I don’t even think we got the Azor Ahai/Lightbringer prophecy, which would be strange given its seeming significance to the overarching story. I was really surprised we got any of Cersei’s prophecy in S5, given that it was arguably one of the weaker/less needed prophecies in the saga.

      Unless Quaithe plays a bigger role in the story than spouting wisdom, I don’t see her appearing again.

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    27. Robb Snow: I could never bring myself to completely trust in the Red God or his followers, and I really hope Jon and Dany won’t either.

      I think that this really is the million galleon question. The Red God might not like the White Walkers very much – seems rather certain that it does not – but that does not make it a “good” thing. One thing that Jon’s, Daeny’s and Tyrion’s (as well as Arya’s) experiences have taught them: look at what both sides are doing. If that isn’t critical, then I’ll eat…. um…. a hat. Preferably a chocolate hat. Dark chocolate. With almonds.

      man, I hope I’m wrong now.

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    28. Jared:

      …she plans to summon her best priests to Meereen to circulate the message that Daenerys is the “One Who Was Promised”

      I’ve enjoyed the suggestions raised thus far about “Kinvara.”

      Although I have not seen the audition, it seems like the Red Temple may be split regarding TOWWP. Even wise Aemon was stunned to realize that “the one” may not be gender-specific (like a dragon).

      If “Kinvara” is indeed a “Moqorro analogue” sent by Benerro (the Volantis red priestess last season?) to “consult” Dany, the jury is still out for me whether “Kinvara” actually will meet Dany in her resumed khaleesi role. When she meets with Tyrion though, do you think the conversation will be simply regarding Dany…or will Jon 2.0 be brought up? [Is Mel really operating as a rogue red priestess (as Galli suggests above)?] Maybe by mid-season, after a bit of resurrection and lightbringing, the word has got out to the Red Temple that there are TOWWP options out there? Maybe “Kinvara” will discuss with Tyrion the prophesy surrounding both Jon and Dany? (which would elicit an amazing reaction by Tyrion, I’m sure)

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    29. Galli: but according to GRRM, hasn’t she herself come on “her own agenda”? Is she a rogue agent?

      I doubt that she is rogue, per se. I think it more probable (given what we’ve learned) that she is sufficiently high up in the Church that she basically can set agenda on her own.

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    30. Hodor’s Bastard,

      I’d love to speculate freely, but I’m basing all of my guesses about Kinvara’s potential role in Season 6 around the leaked audition scene. If you’re curious about its contents, I transcribed the video for WOTW shortly after it leaked, but before it was taken down (there are a few mistakes and some degree of uncertainty about which characters are speaking which lines, but the overall picture of the scene seems clear). http://watchersonthewall.com/game-of-thrones-season-six-audition-surfaces-online/

      Assuming that the scene in question is real dialogue from Season 6 (I believe that it is), then Kinvara specifically claims that “Daenerys Stormborn is the One Who Was Promised”. She goes on about her and her dragons at great length. She does not mention Jon – however, word has reached Meereen of Stannis’s defeat at Winterfell, and Varys alludes to Melisandre leading him astray. Kinvara claims that even honest servants of the Lord make mistakes. While there’s no way to be sure, the scene appears to be from the first half of the season, since Dany has not yet returned to Meereen. Kinvara and the other Red Priests may not be aware that Jon exists, or that he has been revived from the dead. If they are, then it seems that they’re keeping that information to themselves.
      As to whether or not Kinvara will meet Dany, I have no idea. It may depend on what state Meereen is in when Dany returns. If it’s been tentatively stabilized by the Red Priestess’s claims about her status as a savior, then Kinvara would likely be able to secure an audience with her rather easily. If Meereen is under siege or embroiled in civil war and Dany has to sweep in with her newly-won Dothraki horde to clean it out, then Kinvara may not be around to see her return. In the absence of Quentyn, there may even be a small chance that Kinvara is the one who decides to release Rhaegal and Viserion and gets fried for her trouble. That would be a terrible waste, but somewhat fitting – a literal baptism by fire, if you will.
      I’d lean towards the former possibility, if only because I suspect – both in the show and the books – that the servants of R’hllor will eventually play a key role in Dany’s story, for good or for ill (Unfairly or not, I suspect Victarion is little more than a vector to get Moqorro and the Iron Fleet to Dany before the lumbering brute gets himself killed during the Battle of Meereen).

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    31. You know this honestly starting to line up with that old

      Ragnarok theory from a few years ago. That suggests Jon will exist to be a vengeance filled beast hell bent on hurting the people who hurt him and his family all while having his strings pulled by Melisandre and that he won’t be the Jon of old and unable to fight against having his strings pulled. And that Dany will fall victim to the impressionable red gods as well not being able to see through them. And that both Jon and Dany will wind up sort of anti-heroes even perhaps bordering on villainous with the common folk who come to fear both of them. This theory suggests that’s where Tyrion comes in, trying to convince both Jon and Dany to stop listening to the red gods. And that Bran and Bloodraven will play their part and get involved in the entire mess. Basically there is no good ending. It’s having to choose between two poison apples.

      Whether the story ultimately winds up like this or not, I have to hand it to that guy who came up with this a few years ago. At the very least there are some elements we are starting to see here in spoilers, that are making that theory seem a whole lot more possible than I ever thought it was.

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    32. Jared,

      Geez… I do remember that article and your transcription…Thx for the refresh! (info overload) Enjoyed it (both times) and your revisited thoughts.

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    33. Suspect this is Kinvara

      Hopefully this is a substitute for Moqorro, as I don’t mind them making the effort to fit in other racial groups into the cast and this can often be tricky given it is based on medieval Europe. In the case of Moqorro though it is changing a black man into a black woman so no biggie

      If it is a substitute for Benerro though I will have a bit more of an issue given R’hlorrism strikes me as a patriarchal religion similar to Fot7, and it fits Melisandre more that as a maverick or even heretic of sorts within R’hlorrism she is a woman

      Worth noting that when I say that I suspect Otherism is actually a matriarchal “religion” or society with the Night’s King acting as its Champion/General so the Patriarchal/Matriarchal theme would be keeping with the Fire/Ice split etc

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    34. Ghost’s Lunch,

      From the audition scene we know she’s the High Priestess, so really she’s a Moqorro/Benerro composite character. With probably a bit of Quaithe thrown in there for good measure too.

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    35. Yaga:
      doug,
      That theory doesn’t hold up. Melisandre only cares about destroying the White Walkers, and Dany isn’t Stannis.

      We don’t know that. Dany has never been confronted by a strong religious fanatic like Mel.

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    36. Hodor’s Bastard,

      Kinvara is Moqorro and Benerro. She is Benerro, because she is the High Priestess of the Red Temple of Volantis; and she’s Moqorro, because she goes to Meereen to consult (and convert) Daenerys. You should read the audition.

      Coleman,

      I like her!

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    37. Wimsey,

      It’s not just that she willingly burned Shireen, but that she was smiling ear-to-ear when she did it. I can’t see book Melisandre doing the same. Plus, Book!Melisandre also has other good qualities, like keeping Devan by her side so that Davos wouldn’t lose another son, or advising Stannis to parley with Renly and to spare Davos after he tried to kill her

      and GRRM’s comments no doubt stem from many people filling them in quite differently than he would have had them do.

      So GRRM changes his opinions about his own characters because of the fans?

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    38. Maybe I missed this and people already knew, but apparently the set in Plaza de Santa María has been confirmed to be a Meereenese granary. Definitely not the set for a battle (not that that had been a possibility for a while.) How a granary fits into the plot, I have no idea. I’m sure Tyrion will have something to do with it; as he said to Daenerys, “there is more to politics than killing”.

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    39. Wonder why they’re going for so many red priestess’s but barely any red priests?! Obviously Thoros but no sign of Moqorro in the series so far.

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    40. TheTouchOfFrost,

      I’m pretty sure Kinvara is Moqorro; a Red Priest sent to Meereen to council and probably convert Daenerys (and if Liburd is playing Kinvara, both Kinvara and Moqorro are Summer Islanders too, though that’s kind of secondary.) And Moqorro is sent by Benerro, the High Priest of the Red Temple of Volantis —a role that we also know for a fact Kinvara has absorbed, as she is introduced in the audition script as the High Priestess of the Red Temple of Volantis.

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    41. Quinton: I’ve seen rumours floating around that the actor who played Maester Cressen even went as far as to say she was 400 years old! There might even have been an official interview where he mentioned it

      It was an interview with with Oliver Ford Davies on Flicks and the City – quite a long time ago now.

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    42. She is SMOKING hot. Wow. Hope she has a significant role cause I will NOT get tired of watching her on screen!

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    43. Luka Nieto:
      Maybe I missed this and people already knew, but apparently the set in Plaza de Santa María has been confirmed to be a Meereenese granary. Definitely not the set for a battle (not that that had been a possibility for a while.) How a granary fits into the plot, I have no idea. I’m sure Tyrion will have something to do with it; as he said to Daenerys, “there is more to politics than killing”.

      Has to do with controlling the food supply, food and water supply control are absolutely pivotal to stability and absolutely political (eg feed your allies and starve your enemies – or use the threat of it to keep antagonists in line, alternatively attack and cut supply lines to populace to encourage them to revolt in favour of a different regime – like the Harpies)

      Sounds like there may be a starving populace

      4 possible scenarios
      *Internal struggles (Harpies vs Slaver Burgeoise/Dany establishement)
      *Collapsed economy post-invasion
      *Besieged from outside
      *Supplier problems

      Meereneese economy was based on the slave trade, not sure there is much scope for agriculture so as a mega city it is not hard to perceive it as coming under pressure if surrounding city-states opt to blockade

      Even if there is no blockade, the Mereeneese economy may not support citizens being able to afford it, have to remember that each of Astapor, Yunkai and Meereen have had uprising, which in the real world at least always means mass lootings so that’s three cities I can think of where they will all need food imports. Whoever supplies Slavers Bay (Lamb men?) would make a killing while there is a supply glut until grain can be secured from afar (assuming their is no naval blockade)

      Unless of course the supplier starts getting pillaged by the Dothraki which would mean a substantial knock-on effect

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    44. Luka Nieto: You should read the audition.

      Yes, as you can clearly read above, Jared set me straight. Although I think the scene, as written, is a bit lame (using a red priestess to numb the anxious population) and expository, I find Kinvara’s defensive redirection of Varys’ concern regarding Stannis/Mel interesting. It seems to support my original assertion that the Red Temple is divided on the issue of TOWWP (if they do indeed communicate). Trusting this woman will be loaded with concern regarding ulterior motives, imo.

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    45. Luka Nieto:
      Maybe I missed this and people already knew, but apparently the set in Plaza de Santa María has been confirmed to be a Meereenese granary. Definitely not the set for a battle (not that that had been a possibility for a while.) How a granary fits into the plot, I have no idea. I’m sure Tyrion will have something to do with it; as he said to Daenerys, “there is more to politics than killing”.

      At a guess.

      City is under siege
      Tyrion has been stockpiling food and rationing it.
      City inhabitants riot and break into the Granary to get food.

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    46. Hodor’s Bastard,

      Tyrion has long since learned that if use only people you trust, then you will have almost no people to use. But, ultimately, this is smething with which he, Daeny and Jon will have to deal.

      And as for differences in exact interpretations of scriptures, well, even theologically cohesive religions suffer from that routinely! Cersei had it wrong: lacking mercy does not make you a god, lack of clarity does! 😀

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    47. Yaga,

      Actually, he burned her for tactical reasons. Stannis needed something from a god, so he made a deal with the devil. That is military morality to the “t.”

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    48. Wimsey,

      He wouldn’t have done that if he didn’t believe the god / devil existed, though. I’m not interested in discussing this topic further, though – I just noted that to have Dany fall for religious koolaid would be boring to me, personally, because we already had a character like this.

      Coleman,

      Counterguess. The Harpy, or Yunkai agents, want to weaken the city; they burn the granary.

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    49. I think she will fill the Red Priestess gap left by Mel beautifully. I’m almost 100% sure that Mel will give Jon a kiss of life early in the season, which will essentially transfer some of her soul or spirit into Jon. Hence her visions in the show of meeting Arya again and walking on the battlements of Winterfell. She’s seeing these things through Jon’s eyes!

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    50. Yaga,

      The other problem with that conjecture is that SoI&F is not that sort of story. The culmination of the series will (in big part) be based on the evolution of Jon (and Daeny, Tyrion, Arya and Bran) from Thrones -> Spring; Jon and the others cannot metamorphose into something completely different. By the same token, this is why Arya cannot become “no-one”: she has to remain Arya Stark, even if she evolves along Way from Thrones Arya; this is why Bran cannot lose himself entirely to the weirwood; etc.

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    51. Yaga:
      Wimsey,

      He wouldn’t have done that if he didn’t believe the god / devil existed, though. I’m not interested in discussing this topic further, though – I just noted that to have Dany fall for religious koolaid would be boring to me, personally, because we already had a character like this.

      Coleman,

      Counterguess.The Harpy, or Yunkai agents, want to weaken the city; they burn the granary.

      I personally want to see Dany to go full-on Aerys and Fire & Blood on Westeros, essentially becoming an antagonist. It will be trope-subverting and awesome. I think becoming religiously fanatical is right in line with Dany’s personality.

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    52. Yaga: He wouldn’t have done that if he didn’t believe the god / devil existed, though. I’m not interested in discussing this topic further, though – I just noted that to have Dany fall for religious koolaid would be boring to me, personally, because we already had a character like this.

      Tools are tools: why invent new ones? Moreover, this is not a random tool: the crux of the series probably will hinge on Daeny, Jon and a few others (Bran, Arya & Tyrion) coming to grips with what the White Walkers and R’hllor really mean and really want, and what is best for all forces concerned.

      So I would suggest re-viewing R’hllor and his church in the same way that you view the White Walkers: I honestly think that is where this has been headed since the 2nd book.

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    53. K Noelle:
      I think she will fill the Red Priestess gap left by Mel beautifully. I’m almost 100% sure that Mel will give Jon a kiss of life early in the season, which will essentially transfer some of her soul or spirit into Jon. Hence her visions in the show of meeting Arya again and walking on the battlements of Winterfell. She’s seeing these things through Jon’s eyes!

      Nice theory and probable… but I’m one of those who think Mel will remain till the final act.

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    54. K Noelle,

      Daeny is the 1A protagonist, not an antagonist. Everything that happens to her from Thrones -> Spring will be big in the end.

      Having her turn into an antagonist is not “subverting a trope” as antagonists and protagonists are not tropes: instead, they are story elements. Instead, it would just be arbitrary plot that undermines almost any character-driven story.

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    55. Wimsey: Daeny is the 1A protagonist

      What is a 1A protagonist as opposed to a 1 or 2 protagonist? I am not a literature person and your classification is new to me.

      K Noelle: It will be trope-subverting and awesome.

      Of course! As long as Jon follows every possible and imaginable trope known to fantasy fans. We must have balance. 😉

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    56. Kay,

      Heh, it is not a formal classification: it is a joke inspired be Futurama! Instead of Universe 1 and Universe 2, they settled on Universe 1 and Universe A. Basically, Jon and Daeny are co-Number 1 protagonists: so, 1 and A!

      Typically, they would be called the primary protagonists. However, there are other primary protagonists (Tyrion, Arya and Bran), so I have taken to calling the top pair 1 and A to distinguish them. If there is a literary terminology distinguishing among primary protagonists, then I do not know it. (Usually there is only one primary, anyway.)

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    57. God of tits and wine:
      *fingers and toes crossed that she’ll be working at LF’s establishment*

      Nah, she’d be wasted as a background prostitute. She needs a meatier role. I like the red priestess speculation, although my first thought was Sarella.

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    58. If Sarella was in, she would have been mentioned this season by either the SS, Ellaria or Doran.

      I’m around 85% sure she will not apear in the show.

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    59. If Ms. Liburd does play the red priestess, and S6 features a scene of just her and Natalie Emanuel hashing how How Things Are Going to Be Around Here, I will forgive D&D for everything.

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    60. Wimsey,

      Thanks! 🙂 So in which universe would you place Tyrion? He seems to be in both 1 and A! From my own understanding to date, Daenerys, Jon and Tyrion are all huddled together at #1 in the GoT universe. Bran is important but he is not primary.

      Mihnea
      I agree. No new Sand Snake. Could Nymeria take Sarella’s role? She was quiet and intelligent. Observant.

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    61. Kay,

      Tyrion seems to be a very close 3rd. So, I.5? 😉

      As for Bran, GRRM started the tale around him, so I think that he (Bran) will remain important. That written, he has become somewhat marginalized. Arya has remained prominent, however.

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    62. Wimsey:
      Kay,

      Heh, it is not a formal classification: it is a joke inspired be Futurama!Instead of Universe 1 and Universe 2, they settled on Universe 1 and Universe A.Basically, Jon and Daeny are co-Number 1 protagonists: so, 1 and A!

      Typically, they would be called the primary protagonists.However, there are other primary protagonists (Tyrion, Arya and Bran), so I have taken to calling the top pair 1 and A to distinguish them.If there is a literary terminology distinguishing among primary protagonists, then I do not know it.(Usually there is only one primary, anyway.)

      That… is why you fail.

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    63. GeekFurious: That… is why you fail.

      heh, I’ve failed occasionally in life, but never for that reason! Indeed, quite the opposite: most of my success has come from working it out for myself. However, in this case I am sure that I am reinventing wheels, and doing so in an inelegant fashion to boot. After all, even if most tales have one primary protagonist, it is far from unheard of for there to be 2+ leads. Thus, I would be very surprised if literary scholars do not have exact terms for different types and “levels” of protagonists.

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    64. Tywin of the Hill: It’s not just that she willingly burned Shireen, but that she was smiling ear-to-ear when she did it. I can’t see book Melisandre doing the same. Plus, Book!Melisandre also has other good qualities, like keeping Devan by her side so that Davos wouldn’t lose another son, or advising Stannis to parley with Renly and to spare Davos after he tried to kill her

      I can absolutely see book Melisandre gleefully burning Shireen. Moreover, while it is always interesting to see different people’s interpretations of characters, I don’t view Melisandre keeping Devan by her side, nor sparing Davos as reflecting any “good qualities.” I don’t think she keeps Devan by her side to spare Davos the loss of another son, she keeps he there as a means of keeping Davos in line…I have you son under my sway, you should tread carefully. As for sparing Davos, she only spared him because she saw he had a purpose/would be of some use. As for suggesting a parley with Renly, I think she was merely using that thought as a tool of manipulation to guide Stannis to the decision she wanted and he ultimately made.

      As for preferring the other woman for the Red Priestess. Yes, she was attractive, as well, but her reading was not good…at all.

      Kay: I agree. No new Sand Snake. Could Nymeria take Sarella’s role? She was quiet and intelligent. Observant

      As the discussion about who would show up in Meereen was happening yesterday, I thought, hmmm…what if Nymeria went. She is the more “diplomatic” Sand Snake, and it would help explain why she wasn’t sent to sit on the council in KL.

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    65. Coleman,

      Thanks for the link, makeup does wonders, especially with the right flawless facial structure. I have seen all those episodes and didn’t realize the roles were played by the same actress.
      Wonder if the Kinvara character pulls a Mel, believing it to be Dany and in actuality it’s Tyrion the Red god is sending her there for.

      I’ve been theorizing if there is a link between the dragons color and their respective rider, Drogon = Targ (Red/Black), Viserion = Lannister (Gold/White), Rhaegal = (Green/Bronze), but Stark doesn’t match, Tyrell and Reed House colors do though, unless the color green is representative of one with green sight which then indicates Bran as a rider.

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    66. tyjon,
      Would not white better match snow?

      Nymeria Warrior Queen,
      Perhaps Ellaria will send Nymmeria and Doran will send Trystane!

      That written, I more and more see Meereen as the most probable destination for Ellaria and the SS. Daeny is the enemy of their enemies, after all. And I doubt that the think that Doran has the gall to support Daeny as well: they clearly view him as both weak and essentially a collaborator.

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    67. Mihnea,

      Luka Nieto,

      Possibly. I just wonder why the show changes things like this when the original character could have been adapted just fine into the role. I can see why they have to introduce certain new characters for some roles but with both Moqorro and Benerro free for that role then it’s a head scratcher. Particularly in the case of Moqorro as good roles for male black actors in the show have been few and far between and have pretty much been limited to inconsequential characters ( Salladhor Saan, Areo Hotah, Cock Merchant) with Xaro Xhoan Daxos being the only one who actually impacted the plot in some way. Moqorro was quite a unique character and it’ll be a shame we don’t get to see an incarnation of him on-screen.

      Kay,

      I think all bets are off with the Sand Snakes. After what happened to Myrcella then I don’t expect anyone from Dorne will be welcome on the Small Council and even if by some miracle it does happen , Trystane has already been earmarked for the role. Quite honestly don’t know what they’re going to do with them (must admit to not really caring much either). With Ellaria still about that’s 4 characters pretty much occupying the same role. Think we need ourselves a snake cull. On the surface there is only really one role open to them (no search for Darkstar and no KL council) at the moment and that’s Oldtown. Only reason I’d want to see them there is if they feed them to Euron! I know the show can make more stuff up but I struggle to see what they could do for them? The fact that they are weak characters anyway and need to be tagged onto another’s plot yet where could they realistically fit in? Perhaps one goes to broker a deal with Dany…kind of taking Quentyn’s place? Or will that be Trystane? Ahhh Dorne. What a mess you are!

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    68. I think people take the original proposal for ASOIAF as well as the chapter counts for each individual character very literally when deciding who the protagonists are on the show. I’d argue that yes, Tyrion is definitely a main one, Jon as well, yes to Daenerys, but after that it gets totally murky. Arya from the original outline seems to have been split up into Arya/Sansa, Bran is important but not so much so when you count his actual screentime (and they fact they just lifted him out of Season 5 completely). There are just so many characters, and as a result, so many ways that they split their time between them, it’s really not easy to distinguish just by watching alone who a protagonist is. Plus the show has rotated and varied who is featured the most each season (eg. Jon’s stuff was great this past season, not as interesting in other seasons). I’m just saying I think people take for granted that it’s all going to come down, in the end, to the FAB FIVE that everyone defines as the main characters. Maybe the books will to some extent, but I’m skeptical about the show. I suspect the scope of this final act is going to be way bigger, and highlight way more characters than we’re currently assuming. I’m not even convinced that the five everyone talks about are the ones who are going to still be alive by the very, very end of everything, when the credits finally roll. I have serious doubts about both Daenerys and Arya for example. I guess we’ll see.

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    69. Good lord. If Kinvara partly takes on the role of Moqorro, this makes it even more likely that my theory of

      Joractarionnington will come to pass, and Jorah will be healed by her, thus encompassing all three characters of Jorah/Jon Connington/Victarion in various degrees.

      I mean, it’s crazy, but the first 2 already happened…..

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    70. God of tits and wine,

      Ugh.

      —-

      No clue who she would play but she’s a beauty! 🙂
      As a non-book reader, I would love if the show focused some more on Rhllor and that religion. It is very interesting to me. Hopefully we will be getting that.

        Quote  Reply

    71. TheTouchOfFrost: Particularly in the case of Moqorro as good roles for male black actors in the show have been few and far between and have pretty much been limited to inconsequential characters ( Salladhor Saan, Areo Hotah, Cock Merchant) with Xaro Xhoan Daxos being the only one who actually impacted the plot in some way.

      And how many black actresses are there? I count one, who plays Missandei. If Liburd is playing Kinvara, and if her role is as relevant as I suspect, that would be a welcome addition to the show, as much if not more than a black actor —there have been few, but “few” is more than “literally one”.

      As for omitting Moqorro, the same people who complain about making up Kinvara instead of just having Moqorro would of course complain if they turned Moqorro into the High Priest, amalgamating him with Benerro. Which is what they did with her, creating in turn a whole new character out of it, instead of rellying on the superficial factors of certain characters from the books (such as Moqorro’s name and gender.) Makes sense to me. Granted, they could’ve called her Moqorra or Benerra or something, but Kinvara works too.

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    72. TheTouchOfFrost: Think we need ourselves a snake cull. On the surface there is only really one role open to them (no search for Darkstar and no KL council) at the moment and that’s Oldtown.

      Given that we don’t know what happens in Winter, we can hardly make that statement! I think it much more probable that they will be connected to some other plotlines that really kicks into gear in Winter.

      Luka Nieto: Granted, they could’ve called her Moqorra or Benerra or something, but Kinvara works too.

      I cannot speak for anyone else, but I don’t remember there not being someone named Kinvara in Winter, too. Wait! I can speak for everyone else on this matter! (15 years from now, when Winter finally comes out, are those of us who still remember “Game of Thrones” going to be surprised when names appear that we have not read in the books before? I hope not!)

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    73. Luka Nieto,

      And Missandei is a regular character who has even developed a plot of her own (as shit as it is). There have also been plenty of non-white female characters in the show too.
      They missed the boat on female black characters when they let Ros take some of the role of Chataya and Alayaya but people would moan that they were prostitutes if they’d been included.
      For me having another beautiful Red Priestess is getting a little boring. Moqorro would have been more interesting. I wouldn’t get your hopes up too high for Kinerva. I suspect she’ll be as disposable as the other made up characters that have been introduced. If they’d blended Moqorro and the Dusky Woman then it could have been interesting but with no Victarion it’s unlikely.

      Wimsey,

      I’m not convinced. I think whatever they may be involved in winter will either be changed for the show or pale into insignificane. In all honesty, can you see a path where all 3 SS and Ellaria will become relevant in the remaining 2 seasons of the show? At the moment, for me, Dorne is just excess fat that needs trimming. They need Doran, Trystane and maybe one or two of the snakes. Streamline it. They would benefit from that greatly.

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    74. TheTouchOfFrost: And Missandei is a regular character who has even developed a plot of her own (as shit as it is).

      But it is not “shit”: it’s something that you happen to not like!

      TheTouchOfFrost: I’m not convinced. I think whatever they may be involved in winter will either be changed for the show or pale into insignificane. In all honesty, can you see a path where all 3 SS and Ellaria will become relevant in the remaining 2 seasons of the show?

      I suspect that they will prove to be a link to something of significance. What, I do not know: but I have not read Winter. Now, obviously it won’t be stuff that the SS themselves do in Winter – I expect that whatever the SS do there will just be gratuitous plot-for-the-sake-of-plot – but it will be stuff that is important in Winter. Otherwise, the show would have written out Ellaria by making her assassination of Myrcella a suicide mission.

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    75. Wimsey,

      I still think that Jon, maybe Daeny or Arya will not survive the final battle. There will be some casulties among our protagonists.

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    76. Wimsey,

      Otherwise, the show would have written out Ellaria by making her assassination of Myrcella a suicide mission.

      Gosh, I wish they would have.

      I guess we just have to wait and see. I hope something of interest will happen with Dorne and it is not just going to be filler. BTW, did we hear about any Dorne filming yet? I can’t keep up 🙁

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    77. Wimsey,

      OK, I think it’s shit. I can’t exactly hear anyone calling out for more MissandGrey either!

      I can see what they were trying to do with Nym and Tyene in KL by positioning them for when Dorne makes it move but I think it would be a bit daft now if they were to head off to KL as they’d not be welcome there and wouldn’t be able to have a place on the small council plus Jaime and Bronn know Tyene’s face (and other bits!) now so the chances of her rising to a position of power in the church are unlikely. Obara going off with Swann…who knows what’s going on. Perhaps away to off Balon (which is a shame as I like him as a minor character) but why do it is such a long-winded way. Again, this is all considering Doran trusts them which he doesn’t really have any reason to as they’ve already proven to be unreliable, impulsive and let’s face it pretty stupid. You can make a case for one goin to Oldtown in place of Sarella potentially. But I’m not sure how the rest can fit in with the plot going forward unless they leave them on the backburner. I’d prefer if they just killed Ellara and Obara off and let the other two less annoying ones take whatever roles they need to.

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    78. TheTouchOfFrost,

      OK, I think it’s shit.I can’t exactly hear anyone calling out for more MissandGrey either!

      My friends like it. Many show-only viewers like it. I like it. Or for the majority, they simply don’t care. The only people I saw hating this little 10 min side-story is book-readers.

      It’s allright not to like a story, but calling it ”shit” just because you do not agree with it is quite childlish.

      There are things called ”opinions” if you didn’t know.

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    79. Mihnea,

      Here we go with the “if you don’t like a part of the show you’re a book purist” crap again. I thought you weren’t talking to me anymore anyway?!
      I think it’s shit. Remember, there are things called ”opinions” if you didn’t know. The scenes between the two are boring. It’s done nothing to make me care anymore about the characters and it’s time and effort that could be better spent elsewhere. Missandei and Greyworm are both one dimensional characters of no consequence. They could have adapted them both much better without a corny romance story. Missandei , in particular, is hugely disappinting. She’s gone from being a smart, interesting character whom is Dany’s closest council to Irri 2. Only reason I can see for ageing her up was to sexualise her at the expense of building her character.

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    80. TheTouchOfFrost,

      You can dislike a scene/story. That does not make you a purist.
      The intensity of the hate towards this sub-plot makes you a purist.

      Also the disregard of what other people think of this story. You indirectly insult us, by seing this is story is ”shit”.

      The character was aged up, because they needed someone who could easly learn the lenguages Missandai speaks.

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    81. So I can’t hate a scene without being a purist. I’m sorry but that’s ridiculous. You’re putting people in boxes again.

      I said “I think it’s shit”. Other people can think what they want. If they’re offended by my opinion then they’ve got no one to blame but themselves.

      Rubbish. Anyone who’s worked with children or languages can tell you that children acquire language much more efficiently than adults.

      And you’re still talking to me.

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    82. TheTouchOfFrost: I can’t exactly hear anyone calling out for more MissandGrey either!

      Actually, several posters here (myself included) have said that we like those scenes and that we think that they add a bit to Daeny’s story: it is useful to see that the people for whom Daeny is fighting are people. Now, this is not the same as clamouring for more such scenes – personally, I think that they are in appropriate proportion to the rest of the show – but it’s far from universally condemned, either.

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    83. TheTouchOfFrost: I can’t exactly hear anyone calling out for more MissandGrey either!

      I like it a lot. My whole family like it too. And several posters above me. It’s great not only for the sake of witnessing the relationship blossom (though it is incredibly cute) or for the growth of the characters as individuals, but also because it’s crucial for a protagonist such as Dany to be surrounded by rounded characters with lives of their own. Characters who feel like real people.

      That said, I’m not calling for “more” of it in the sense of more minutes per season. If you meant calling for the relationship to be developed further, at pretty much the pace it has been for the last few seasons, I very much want them to do so.

        Quote  Reply

    84. Wimsey,

      Luka Nieto,

      Well, everyone I speak to can’t stand it. If it does it for you then fair enough but I think there were better ways of making the viewer care about the characters. Honestly find their courting sickly sweet. I honestly don’t care if either of them live or die which is odd as book Missandei is one of the minor characters that I genuinely care what happens to. Yes, surround Dany with characters with their own lives but give them something more interesting than some bizarre angsty teen romance. Much rather watch them wrestle with their new found freedom and how they deal with it after being institutionalised for so long. Would have liked to have seen Missandei in a more advisory role too yet all she seems to do is translate and have painfully dull chats about boys with Dany. Just glad Tyrion turned up and Jorah came back as Mereen was becoming increasingly dull.

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    85. wow, she’s hot.

      Lord of Boobs: One can hope for more gratuitous nudity next season.

      100% with you

      I was expecting to see Rila Fukishima’s character again, I thought for sure she would be female Moqorro (truth be told, I kinda like her 🙂 )

      And it seems like religion-politics will play a big part this season, with Tyrion using the Red priests to support Daenerys, and Margaery apparently doing the same with the faith of the Seven.

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