Iain Glen hopes to survive Game of Thrones; Myrcella’s death scene gory plans

Jorah

While promoting his new movie, My Cousin Rachel, Iain Glen naturally also answered a few questions concerning Game of Thrones in an interview with the Irish national broadcaster RTÉ. He dearly hopes Ser Jorah gets to survive until the end of the show (don’t we all?), but also admits that he has no idea about his character’s ultimate fate. Even if Jorah’s luck runs out sooner rather than later, Glen (who praised season 7 highly last month) is happy with his run on Thrones:

But even if I’m for the chop very shortly I would feel like I did pretty good. I survived pretty long.

Follow the link for a short video clip from the interview.

At MCM London Comic Con, NEll Tiger Free talked about her experience playing Myrcella in the latter seasons of Game of Thrones. Apparently, the original plans for her death were much gorier, with practical effects including not just fake blood, but chunks of bananas standing in for Myrcella’s … brain. Definitely some nasty poison, that. Ultimately, as we know, the show did not choose to go in that direction – and I, for one, am thankful for it. Enjoy the full video embedded below (hat tip to the reader GS).

91 responses

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    1. Oh, my dear Iain, you and me both.

      I am super excited about My Cousin Rachel! It’s one of my favourite books, and Iain Glen and Rachel Weisz are such lovely lovely people. ❤

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    2. He is always been my pick for surviving the series and be as 1000th LC of newly created NW ..

      The show should never have given him that greyscale in the first place or he should have been cured by Red priest like victarion so that he would have been on the side of daenerys when she lands in westeros

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    3. she really should not being chewing gum when doing an interview. jeez you would expect at least table manners from a lannister

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    4. Well, if Jorah didn’t make it through Season 7, Iain would certainly know. So either he’s trolling us or Ser Friendzone got yet another reprieve.

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    5. Pigeon:

      I am super excited about My Cousin Rachel! It’s one of my favourite books, and Iain Glen and Rachel Weisz are such lovely lovely people.

      Had friends over for tapas, drinks and channel surfing the other night, and, being a huge fan of Ms. Weisz, when that trailer came on I was as giddy as a schoolboy. Seeing Iain in it was sweet icing on the cake.

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    6. dragonbringer:
      He is always been my pick for surviving the series and be as 1000th LC of newly created NW ..

      The show should never have given him that greyscale in the first place or he should have been cured by Red priest like victarion so that he would have been on the side of daenerys when she lands in westeros

      My thoughts exactly! Either he has made it, or he’s a liiiiiaaaaaarrrrrr!!!!!

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    7. Possibly the only Dorne sequence in the show that mattered to me. I’m still seething from show!Ellaria’s tender yet deadly goodbye kiss, which led to one of the saddest (albeit contrived) scenes of S5.

      Given that Myrcella has lost an ear and her face is quite disfigured from Arianne’s misguided schemes in AFfC, I wonder what atrocity lies ahead for Myrcella in TWoW. Poor girl.

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    8. Jorah was there since the first season. That – is – a good run for a secondary character. i hope he has a good death.

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    9. I really hope he survives the show, one of my all time favorite characters. I can’t help but wonder though if he will have the same fate in the books as in the show. In the books he never had Greyscale another character they omitted from the show did, also when Jeor was dying he made Sam promise to find Jorah and tell him if he joined the Night’s Watch he would be forgiven but that also never happened on the show. So I can’t help but wonder if Jorah will have the same fate in the books as the show or if the show is gonna go in another direction with whatever his end will be.

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    10. mau,

      I’m not sure that GRRM knows how most of the minor characters’s fate in the books will go,that’s why it’s taking so long to write the final books,he has a mapped ending but doesn’t know how to reach there because he is not willing to cut some corners .

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    11. dragonbringer,

      He has always been my pick for surviving the series and be as 1000th LC of newly created NW…

      Assuming that the Night King is defeated, why would the Night’s Watch be re-created? There would be no White Walkers or wildlings to guard against, as the latter are now (presumably) allied with everyone else who’s living.

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    12. Jorah is and always has been a walking dead. Redemption arc… Serving until the end, that is necessarily mortal for that specific kind of closure.

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    13. Gucci Robert,

      I agree. I mean Cogman said last year that everything with Sandor Clegane is show-original, because GRRM gave them nothing.

      And it is obvious that Sandor’s storyline is original in the S7 as well, because there is no way that he will travel to the North with BwB.

      They have a completely different mission in the books.

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    14. Catspaw Assassin: Had friends over for tapas, drinks and channel surfing the other night, and, being a huge fan of Ms. Weisz, when that trailer came on I was as giddy as a schoolboy. Seeing Iain in it was sweet icing on the cake.

      Yes, she’s just so….sigh. Love her. She was on the Graham Norton show last night or the night before, and was talking about how her horse in a movie (not sure it was this movie) had previously been a Game of Thrones horse, so had been trained to ‘die’ when the left reign was pulled a certain way. So of course while filming she happened to accidentally pull a bit too hard on the left and down they went. LOL. Both were fine, but apparently there was quite the shocked silence!

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    15. mau:

      Gucci Robert,

      I agree. I mean Cogman said last year that everything with Sandor Clegane is show-original, because GRRM gave them nothing.

      And it is obvious that Sandor’s storyline is original in S7 as well, because there is no way that he will travel to the North with BwB.

      They have a completely different mission in the books.

      Hmmm… The only interview I remember with Cogman was from EW (linked below and quoted in a number of other articles), where he told James Hibberd, “It’s a little hard to talk about because the subplot is a riff on something that’s in the books, but it’s not totally in the books.” Like Gucci Robert, I’d also like to know where he said that “GRRM gave them nothing,” because it’s pretty damn clear in the book that he’s alive.

      Who knows what GRRM has in mind (does GRRM know what he has in mind?) for how this particular character arc will play out, but it doesn’t seem contradictory to me to have Sandor travel North with the BwB. After all, he a) had purposely chosen not to be knighted, so the company of men who had either abdicated their titles or never had a chance to earn them wouldn’t have bothered him; and b) had originally planned to join Robb’s service when he delivered Arya to the Twins, so continuing to look North makes sense. (After whatever happens on the Quiet Isle, if we ever get the full written version of events.)

      To me, in terms of adaptation from the insanity that Books 4 and 5 are, Sandor joining the BwB actually makes more sense than the Sandor-vs.-Brienne fight, which was never believable to me. (I do realize I’m in the minority.)

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    16. Wolfish,

      “GRRM gave them nothing” was my comment. But Cogmam did say that the way Sandor returned to the show was original.

      And if you saw S7 leaks it’s clear that those events with him won’t and can’t happen in the books.

      Maybe he did gave them some plot points, but from the way S6 and S7 were written it’s obvious that 90% of the show is original.

      If you go through every storyline in S6 it’s clear that they used either books one way or another or they created original scenes. Very few plot points are from the future books. Mainly climaxes.

      For example Arya never killed Walder Frey in the books or not yet, but it’s clear that that scene was inspired by existing book event and won’t happen in the future books.

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    17. Leaks.

      Sam will cure him, he will make it to the end. Hopefully returning home, that is what he always hoped for. To see home.

      Wolfish,

      What if the war with white walkers will have to resolved with a pact? Last time they fought, white walkers survived and for 8000 years slept on the ice. Not entirely defeated.

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    18. Geralt of Rivia,

      Sam will cure him, he will make it to the end. Hopefully returning home, that is what he always hoped for. To see home.

      (Am I correct in thinking that was a spoiler?)

      Hopefully with the help of Maester Jim Broadbent, doing his patented befuddled professor routine that we all know and love him for, and which his oft-time director Mike Leigh probably finds cringeworthy.

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    19. mau:

      And if you saw S7 leaks it’s clear that those events with him won’t and can’t happen in the books.

      If you go through every storyline in S6 it’s clear that they used either books one way or another or they created original scenes. Very few plot points are from the future books. Mainly climaxes.

      Hmmm… I did see the leaks, but maybe I’m being daft (It wouldn’t be the first time!): I actually don’t see why it’s clear that those events “won’t and can’t happen in the books.” After seeing S6 I figured that 1) in the books Sandor would eventually finish convalescing and 2) something might happen on the Quiet Isle similar to what happened with Brother Ray and his Merry Band of Unmilitant Faithful. (I do realize that would take some effort, as the Quiet Isle is challenging to reach.)

      On that note, I grant your second point: GRRM and D&D are, by and large, taking different roads to the same destination. As long as there are no more Dorne-style snafus…

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    20. Geralt of Rivia,

      But then… that wouldn’t be a proper ending, dammit!

      Seven books and 73 hours of TV for a pact and the continued necessity for a Night’s Watch? Oh, they’d better not.

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    21. mau:
      Gucci Robert,

      I agree. I mean Cogman said last year that everything with Sandor Clegane is show-original, because GRRM gave them nothing.

      While I am glad to have Rory McCann back for the end, a contrived redemption story – the kind we’ve seen a million times before – was not ‘original nor is it feather in Cogman’s (or the show’s ) hat.

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    22. somehow someway I think Jorah is going to

      find a cure for greyscale and I won’t be surprised if J and lady D… travel back to Valyria to heal the sick and make the Valyrian Freehold thrive again.

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    23. Wolfish,

      Why it doesn’t negate the fact that wall still stands as a Border for westeros and guarding its as one of the most important duty ..

      It will also ensure that people don’t forget what’s been and what’s been lost so people can live happily in the future. .

      Before buying unsuliied There is a passage in dany chapters where she asks missandei what exactly the unsullied are useful after she had won the war ..she replies they are best at guarding the places…
      Thus I predict that either dany makes a NW and appoints jorah as LC and gives him a valyrian sword and unsullied to hold fort or after dany dies the surviving unsuliied and jorah will take up the black and do the duty..

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    24. mau,

      I don’t think that will apply to jorah unlike sandor Grrm as spent time on jorah’s redemption and he actually set up couple of things
      1),dany promising him to take home and gifting a great sword .
      2)jeor asking Sam to tell jorah to take up the black ..

      I know the show didn’t include jeor asking that to sam but that doesn’t negate the possibility of Sam bringing it up in the future when he sees jorah as it happened on the show. ..
      I know these aren’t enough but as a sidekick to dany he would have mapped an ending to jorah ..

      Well we all know jorah won’t die of greyscale because he never gets one ..we know that Sandor and Beric going north is also a show only thing because its never going to happen in the books ..but since these aren’t main characters so these changes won’t affect the story except for the fans who think that they will become major

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    25. dragonbringer: and unsullied to hold fort or after dany dies the surviving unsuliied and jorah will take up the black and do the duty..

      Ok, I’ll bite…Who knows what the Unsullied will be used for if they survive after the war? They are a single generation army with no hope of continuing their lineage (no pillars and stones), they are men without a country, there will be no further recruitment (!!), and they probably don’t have too many other skills. Without Dany, they will most likely return to menial duties, serve as guards or in some military, go to the Wall to live their remaining days (assuming the wall is going to be relevant) or be shipped back east.

      Who would they follow/trust if Dany and show!Missandei perish is a good question. Unlike the Dothraki horde, they could be considered refugees….maybe? In any case, the Dothraki and Unsullied will face serious integration challenges with or without Dany in the picture.

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    26. Hodors Bastard,

      I would like to see someone attempt to ship them and dothraki back to essos ..

      That’s the thing though ..if dany dies then decision to take up position at wall will be their own Choice not on someone else orders and that’s enough to take on dany’s legacy ..they have been clear that dany is the only leader they will serve .
      they are perfect for the job because they can’t further their lines and not have a family ..its going to be either NW or something similar to goldcloaks for the unsuliied. .
      Dothraki unlike unsullied have a family and can have family they will settle and integrate within westeros after all the population of the westeros would have been severely weakened by the wars

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    27. Catspaw Assassin,

      Yes it is. Citadel plot is really curious and something I am looking forward to. It has that Harry Potter vibe to it.

      Wolfish,

      I do think white walkers will have to be defeated but the question is if entirely or not? Previously in the war agaisn them First Men and CotF won, yet they’ve survived it. So many questions about the Long Night and War of Dawn. What really happened back then and what has to be done this time around. Sam or Bran might find out more about it.

      firstone,

      Leaks.

      Why would Jon travel to restore Valyrian Freehold? Not like he has any emotional connection to it, or that he’d care enough to do so. You just can’t expect Jon to all of sudden identify himself with Targaryens. We’ll find out he’s legit but while he might do certain things to take an advantage of it, to fully identify himself with this part of his heritage is a bit of strech.

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    28. Geralt of Rivia:

      firstone,
      Leaks.

      You mean,

      when he finds out he’s a Targaryen it’s not going to be like an Ancestry.com commercial… where we see Jon saying, “I found out I’m 50% Andal and now I want to go explore my heritage”? 😉

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    29. Flayed Potatoes,

      Oh yeah I totally forget about that part ..i agree with you its going to happen for sure considering they didn’t have dany promise him a sword in the show ..

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    30. lucy,

      I don’t think you understand what he meant by original,as in in show only and not in the books . Nothing is original in fiction anyway,everything has been done before in one way or another .

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    31. lucy,

      Also i don’t know exactly what do you mean by “contrived”,how exactly is it contrived for Sandor to want to become a better man when he hated what he was before his whole life ? Are we even watching or reading the same story ?

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    32. Wolfish,

      Sandor in the books won’t go with BwB to fight the WW. That won’t happen. LSH is the leader of BWB and she doesn’t care for the WW. And I’m sure that the climax of S7 is also show-original.

      Yara and Theon won’t make an alliance with Dany. Ellaria as well. So their storylines will be completely different in the books.

      Olenna could support Dany in the books.

      What I want to say is that majority of the show is now either original or loosely inspired by future books. And that’s a good thing.

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    33. Gucci Robert:
      lucy,

      I don’t think you understand what he meant by original,as in in show only and not in the books . Nothing is original in fiction anyway,everything has been done before in one way or another .

      That’s true – GRRM has been open about having been inspired by things like the Black Dinner/Massacre of Glencoe and by Maurice Druon’s “The Accursed Kings” series of historical novels. E Nesbit wrote about an ice dragon in her “Book of Dragons” which was published as long ago as 1901 and girl bonds with dragon has been done before in, for example, the kids’ series of books (and TV cartoons) about “Jane and the Dragon”. In the old (as in the even before this old dame’s time) film “The Wicked Lady” (the Margaret Lockwood one, not the Fay Dunaway remake) Barbara (ML’s character) and her friend go to have their fortunes read early on and that reminded me of the Maggy the Frog fortune telling with young Cersei (not exactly because in TWL the fortune teller tells Barbara that she (Barbara) is so awful that she (fortune teller) doesn’t want to tell her fortune). A lot of the coincidences between these earlier works and GRRM’s work is probably just that – coincidence, and even if not I think GRRM is a smart cookie to have taken inspiration from history, myth, maybe old ballads and woven them into a tale which draws readers in.

      Now as for whether show Sandor having a redemptive arc would be unoriginal – if the “gravedigger” theory in the books is true (and I think it is), the brother who found Sandor near death says that “the Hound” is dead, so it is hinted in the book that Sandor (if the gravedigger is he) is at least trying to improve.

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    34. Hodors Bastard,

      It has crossed my mind that maybe book Myrcella might die because her wound festers. For a long time I hoped that the (book) golden shrouds (for Myrcella and Tommen) might refer to the meaning of a shroud as part of a sailing ship’s rigging but I doubt that now. Also, knowing that GRRM likes to spring surprises, when it was looking as if Shireen was being set up for sacrifice (and let’s be honest it’s been implied in the books too) I kept hoping that something would happen so that she would be saved.

      Also, in my earlier post I should have made it clear that it is Sandor in his “Hound” identity that is said to be dead – of course book Sandor’s new persona as the Gravedigger is very much a mystery as to where he will go.

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    35. Something tells me a new trailer is going to drop soon … The official HBO game of thrones channel on YouTube has another private video uploaded … we just have to wait till they take down the first trailer and I don’t mean the teasers

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    36. Wolfish,

      Leaks.

      He’ll understand and will have to make a peace with this whole situation about his heritage, but I really don’t think he will pursue his Targaryen side to that point. Bran and Sam will find about his heritage but Dany is the Last Dragon, last true Targaryen. Jon just happens to share their blood of Old Valyria and the First Men in purest form. In his mindset still a Northmen.

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    37. I’m curious about Jon Snow’s Long Claw, if that will be given back to the Mormont’s? Since this was the ancestral sword of Bear Island, but against this was given to Jon for a reason, hard to say. In a sense I cant see Jon part ways with Long Claw and to get another sword like Heartsbane. I could see Jonah take Heartsbane as part of the fight in the war, but Heartsbane seems like it is a broadsword isn’t it? Almost like a 2 handed sword but not as big as Ice? If so, would need to be quite the warrior to wield such a beast repeatedly.

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    38. mau,

      Leaks

      When you say the climax to season 7 do you mean the meeting at the Dragonpit?Or the end with Jon being a legit Targ,he and Dany having sex and the wall falling with a wight dragon?If it’s the first then I agree it won’t happen in the books but the ending scenes I think will happen in some form in the books.

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    39. Dame of Mercia: It has crossed my mind that maybe book Myrcella might die because her wound festers.

      Hmm, maybe Myrcella does perish in the background, as you suggest. Was Darkstar in secret collusion with the SS? Was his sword dipped in a vicious long term poison? Will Nymeria do the macabre deed on the way to KL (or as she presents Myrcella to Cersei)? Regardless, I have this ludicrous hope that Tyrion and Myrcella will get to see each other again and….compare scars. 😕

      Regarding Tommen…he is soooo young in the books. Will he take his own life? Or will he be pushed out the window by evil Ser Pounce?

      Regarding Shireen…ugh…even though we know its coming, I’m still riveted by the motivations behind her “sacrifice.” Jon has just been stabbed, the Ides of Marsh are in the shadows, the PL is going to be read by others, Mel is doubting her faith, Val is saying the child is cursed, Selyse is listening and nutty, Tormund is on his way to Hardhome, Tycho is on his way to CB from Stannis, Bran is becoming omnipotent… (who knows what will transpire…but it won’t be Stannis making the call). It’s fascinating and quite knotty. 🙂

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    40. mau: Maybe he did gave them some plot points, but from the way S6 and S7 were written it’s obvious that 90% of the show is original.

      Yeah, he gave them basic plot points but I doubt he gave them sincere and set-in-stone motivations for those plot points (they were probably in flux or else he would have published the damn thing by now). Hence, D&D can be super creative on the path to the endgame and own their adaptation. Furthermore, I don’t believe GRRM was crystal clear on the entire endgame either…an outline from 1993 can’t possibly matter anymore. Unless he’s completely motivated by greed, he’s gonna save a few things for himself. Plus, at this point, D&D are more than capable to finish the story on their own terms (given budget and talent in front and behind the camera). I’ll ‘forever’ wait (sadly) to compare and contrast the pathways to ragnarok.

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    41. dragonbringer: …if dany dies then decision to take up position at wall will be their own Choice not on someone else orders…they have been clear that dany is the only leader they will serve…
      Dothraki…will integrate within westeros after all the population of the westeros would have been severely weakened by the wars

      That’s quite a strangely-passive position there and my attempts to sway you toward chaos have gone unheeded! 🙂

      Post-war integration results in Westeros (assuming the WW retreat or melt after experiencing global warming and Sam’s unrelenting bookish bravado):
      Unsullied: a sympathetic tolerance
      Dothraki: a forced tolerance

      I’m simply recognizing that both integration factors depend on Dany’s influence. If she or her dragons are not around, I don’t see a stable situation at all.

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    42. Hodors Bastard: If she or her dragons are not around, I don’t see a stable situation at all.

      Like in Meereen, I am afraid.
      That is the principal weakness of an autocracy : once the autocrat is not around, the whole structure tends to crumble.

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    43. Markus Stark,

      They always do that, if they are about to put up a new one. I don’t know why they do that, probably to make it easier for the new trailer to come up in the search. They deleted the long walk teaser a few days before the first trailer released, that’s how people knew it was coming.

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    44. Hodors Bastard,

      Yeah, they created 50 episodes using the books. And 10 episodes last year were really inspired by the books.

      The majority of Arya’s storyline was inspired by her chapters from ADWD and that one chapter from TWOW.

      Sansa’s and Jon’s storyline was inspired by the storyline Davos and Stannis had in ADWD. I’m sure that Ramsay and Jon will battle each other in the books as well, because there is set-up for that, but obviously GRRM didn’t give much details to D&D (except Sansa and LF arriving to save the day, because that’s the last chance to make Sansa relevant to the main plot in the books, and it really feels like a resolution to the battle GRRM likes to write).

      Everything in Cersei’s storyline was a show-original, except maybe the fact that she will become the queen.

      Tyrion’s storyline was a version of Dany’s and Selmy’s storyline from ADWD.

      Jaime had a version of his storyline from AFFC. Brienne has a show-original story for seasons now.

      Theon and Yara’s storyline was inspired by the Victarion’s.

      And so on…

      The point is, I don’t think D&D got that many informations from GRRM, because he doesn’t know what to do to with the majority of the story. If he had real details the book would out by now.

      And from the leaks of S7 it is clear that there are some plot points that are taken from the future books, but majority of the season is show-original.

      And I don’t think that’s a bad thing, since I always liked D&D’s style more.

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    45. mau: And I don’t think that’s a bad thing, since I always liked D&D’s style more.

      That’s fairly obvious and D&D have indeed owned their exciting adaptation. But like I’ve mentioned before, “inspired by” and “authored motivations” make for very different stories. I bet we’re gonna be surprised by the divergence.

      A few biased and unhinged things to note:
      – Sansa may have nothing to do with the northern battle. After the hopeless Stannis battle and sabotage in the snow, the blizzards will clear and LF will make a deal with the Blackfish/Royce to lead the Vale against the weary Bolton/Frey army, probably exacerbated by a rebellious uprising from within WF as well. Sansa may actually get lost in the mix and not make it north, instead her ‘coerced’ diversion may involve the Crannogmen or current Riverlands persons of interest. 😉

      – The dinner party hosted by malevolent LSH/BwB with Jaime/Brienne (and possibly BF) will redirect the Riverlands storyline considerably and may effect any details listed above (and possibly Arya’s tale).

      – The Victarion plotline has nothing to do with the Asha/Theon plotline. V lost 50% of his ships via storms and pirating on the way over, has a horn that will prove useless or cause more chaos and will get himself roasted by an angry, untethered Viserion (V on V!), like his egotistical counterpart, Quentyn. Whatever is left of those ironborn ships and Unsullied (after the Meereen battle) will be decimated by another 50% on the way back. The Summer Sea ain’t kind to navies carrying seasick armies. Who is rooting for Victarion? Almost no one. Heck, I think the ‘silent’ Dusky Woman will be his undoing. 🙂

      – Dany is airborne when she gets to Westeros, without a huge contingent of indigenous support

      – Davos? Heck, he may be the one who witnesses Hardhome with Tormund! Or finds Rickon…

      – The YG/Varys/Illyrio factor will complicate things, especially after Dorne/Doran hears about the Quentyn nonsense. I would be happy with the Blackfyre/Golden Company twist.

      Nothing against D&D, but I believe a very different ebook awaits us.

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    46. lucy,

      While I am glad to have Rory McCann back for the end, a contrived redemption story – the kind we’ve seen a million times before – was not ‘original nor is it feather in Cogman’s (or the show’s ) hat.

      Have we been reading the same books or watching the same show? That’s the center of his character arc, and in both books and show it’s been crystal-clear from the first time he was protective of Sansa (which carried over into his protection of Arya).

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    47. dragonbringer:

      Why it doesn’t negate the fact that wall still stands as a Border for Westeros and guarding its as one of the most important duty.

      But the Wall was constructed expressly to defend Westeros from the Others, and per the conversation between Jon and Ygritte way-back-when, the Free Folk just got stuck on the wrong side of it. It originally wasn’t a border between distinct nations, cultures, or warring tribes; it was a border against a supernatural force, and the people on the other side of it have only been “enemies” because the physical barrier prevented them from fully participating in the agriculture and commerce of lands where they could travel freely in older times. In essence, the Wall created the Free Folk, and more importantly, the enmity between them and the “Kneelers,” by physically separating them from the rest of Westeros and denying them the resources far more readily available south of the Wall.

      There really is no great present-day equivalent, but I think of the Wall as, roughly, the separation between West and East Germany during the Cold War. Same people, same culture, same language… and over a certain period of time, different methods of governance and access to goods resulted in a division that was based far more on economics and resentment than on culture.

      Except for the Thenns, of course. They’re just fuckers.

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    48. mau:

      Wolfish,
      Sandor in the books won’t go with BwB to fight the WW. That won’t happen. LSH is the leader of BWB and she doesn’t care for the WW. And I’m sure that the climax of S7 is also show-original.

      LMAOOO!!!

      At myself, that is. Because I had a really, really long day yesterday, and I… momentarily forgot about LSH.

      And I didn’t even have anything to drink!

      /ducks rotten fruit

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    49. Wolfish: Except for the Thenns, of course. They’re just fuckers.

      Best. Conclusion. Ever.

      The demonstration was impeccable too but damn, that conclusion… 😉

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    50. Wolfish,

      Ummm…I’m going by Show!-only portents. I cannot comment on Book!Sandor. Reading over the dialog and rewatching scenes, including those with Melisandre, BwoB, Ray and Hot Pie, Sandor is either a decoy or more likely – the Warrior of Light Melisandre was talking about.

      (*Ducks head in anticipation of barrage of virtual spitballs and tomaties*)

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    51. Pigeon,

      I love Rachel W. too! I haven’t seen her in her Oscar-winning role yet (the plot summary of “The Constant Gardener” sounded too depressing for my tastes…I know, that’s a poor excuse..)

      However, I’ve loved her ever since I saw her in Neil LaBute’s 2003 movie “The Shape of Things.” She was wickedly good as an art student who gets involved with Paul Rudd’s dweeb character. That same year (2003), she was fabulous in “Confidence”, a movie about grifters.
      Come to think of it, she’s always been excellent. I should really take my own advice not to be a genre snob and check out “The Constant Gardener.” She must’ve done something right to win an Academy Award.

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    52. Geralt of Rivia: I do think white walkers will have to be defeated but the question is if entirely or not? Previously in the war agaisn them First Men and CotF won, yet they’ve survived it.

      It may play out differently in the books, but the way the show depicted the creation of the Others/WWs by the CotF suggests that the dragonglass shard in the heart could be the key to their unmaking as well. If someone were able to get close enough to the Night’s King to yank it out (perhaps by wearing Valyrian steel armor), then we may reasonably guess that the entire “hivemind” of the wights will collapse simultaneously. Whether the other WWs operate independently of the NK is another question, but perhaps they can all simply be “unplugged” for good.

      I would really like it if the NK would turn back into a human and live just long enough (before expiring of a traumatic chest wound and extreme old age) to explain who he is – perhaps an ancestral Stark?

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    53. Marlana: The dothraki can live in the open places in Dorne.

      Yeah, that seems to be the obvious place to ‘isolate’ them since south of the Red Mountains does resemble the Dothraki Sea (or is it more like the Red Waste?). But will integration be that easy? I doubt they’ll get into it on the show (possibly because the Dothraki may be decimated in the coming conflicts) but I don’t have a good feeling about it.

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    54. The Dothraki are the cannon fodder of Dany’s army, as the Wildings are in Jon’s army. Troops without metal armor will not long survive pitched battles against armored fighters (or rampaging wights). Jorah had a conversation with a Dothraki about this very point in Season One, and then went on to demonstrate it by wearing armor to protect himself amongst that horde.

      My own personal speculation on the end of the story has the human survivors of the Ragnarok on Westeros emerging from the rubble to find all magic gone from the world: no dragons, no wildfire, no wights, no White Walkers, no Wall, and no giants remain. (A giant must be a magical creature, because a human frame, scaled up to giant size, would simply collapse from its own weight). The survivors find the seasons themselves now come in regular order of fixed and short length. (I don’t know whether the Children of the Forest are inherently magical, although they seem to use magic extensively. I can’t see them becoming the only non-human sentient creatures to survive, though.)

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    55. Wolfish,

      Oh. 😉

      I sort of agree.

      Dragonglass dagger plunged in to his heart might have a more meaningful significance for the future arc. Someone would have to either kill him this way or unmake him. We don’t even know if dragon fire can harm him or other WW’s. I would say WW’s are committed to their King, what would be interesting to see, if they have powers as he has to reanimate corpsesn and by being a necromancer. So many questions about him.

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    56. Hodors Bastard,

      But my question is them being tolerated by who ??
      If you say people of westeros then don’t you think its very rich of them to allow these people to fight for them and then the war is over turn hostile towards them..
      I simply believe even without dany post war the experience of fighting together will make them more bonded ..
      Like you say if dothraki is decimated in number after war ..I I imagine the same for westeros people and army because of the countless wars even before the great war..

      Let’s say war is over and huge losses were suffered on the side of humanity ..don’t you think those events would change both westeros and dothraki view about each other..don’t you think they will be more alike and understanding of each other after fighting the war on the same side ..

      The dothraki lived in the Great grass sea where they relied on riding and slaving the cities but in westeros they can adopt to the place and make life for themselves…I don’t understand why you keep viewing them as robots who are programmed for only raping and pillaging .

      Its again comes to give them a chance and believe that people may change after the condition …for some reason you are not giving the dothraki this chance ..I guess we will see who gets it right when the show finished

      I have to ask what you think of Wildlings and how their integration will go with westeros ..because they are similar to dothraki in some ways and outsiders to westeros. ..

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    57. dragonbringer: The dothraki lived in the Great grass sea where they relied on riding and slaving the cities but in westeros they can adopt to the place and make life for themselves

      Please don’t get me wrong, db, I actually appreciate the stance you are taking for the Dothraki. It is rather insightful and optimistic. Perhaps I am somewhat stuck with the depiction of the Dothraki that I have read thus far. I saw the trailer for S7, with the Dothraki sacking and hacking, and for some reason I have taken a contrarian perspective to it all, which obviously extends from my ‘possibly errant‘ opinion that the Dothraki would not fare well during the sea trip. I honestly believe that Dany, meaning well and all, has uprooted these nomadic, aggressive people and has escorted them to their ultimate doom (‘cannon fodder‘ as Tensor the Mage expressed above).

      I think my thoughts regarding the Dothraki integration are similar to the northerners’ default handling of the wildlings, but that distrust extends over hundreds or thousands of years. Westeros does not know the Dothraki…but maybe that will be to their favor when all is said and done.

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    58. mau,

      You seriously believe that, my expectation is Season 6 will be roughly 60-70% from Winds with some adaption (note I discount dialogue and very minor one one scenes).

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    59. Having now read all the comments I see where Mau is coming from and agree with him/her more.

      As for Jorah, he’s a bit of a inbetween character for me, I don’t dislike him but I wouldn’t be overly upset if he were to die. In fact I would imagine he is a character that could easilly be killed off as I doubt he’s important for the end game or the landscape after the great war however the guy has like ten lives and always seems to come back.

      In terms of the books do we feel D&D have given him some of Jon Connington’s arc which is important for the end game perhaps?

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    60. Firannion,

      I’ve thought this exact same thing about the dragonglass dagger and the identity of White Walker I, which leads me to a disturbing conclusion about the hivemind of GoT fans… 😉

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    61. dragonbringer:
      Hodors Bastard,

      I have to ask what you think of Wildlings and how their integration will go with westeros ..because they are similar to dothraki in some ways and outsiders to westeros. ..

      Wildings are basically almost gone.

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    62. Ten Bears:
      Pigeon,

      I love Rachel W. too!I haven’t seen her in her Oscar-winning role yet (the plot summary of “The Constant Gardener” sounded too depressing for my tastes…I know, that’s a poor excuse..)

      However, I’ve loved her ever since I saw her in Neil LaBute’s 2003 movie “The Shape of Things.”She was wickedly good as an art student who gets involved with Paul Rudd’s dweeb character.That same year (2003), she was fabulous in “Confidence”, a movie about grifters.Come to think of it, she’s always been excellent. I should really take my own advice not to be a genre snob and check out “The Constant Gardener.” She must’ve done something right to win an Academy Award.

      I admit the first movie I saw her in was The Mummy, and I thought she was just the most beautiful girl ever…I’m straight, but I can certainly appreciate beautiful women! 😊 Love that movie.

      The Constant Gardener is a wonderful movie, but quite heartbreaking. Ralph Fiennes is pretty good at being in those kinds of movies! That ending though. It’s wonderfully acted by all, she deserved those awards!

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    63. Pigeon,

      Like you and Ten Bears, I find Rachel Weisz exceptionally beautiful in a memorable (not cookie-cutter) way, and have always loved her work. The earliest films I remember seeing her in are Enemy at the Gates and About a Boy (one of my all-time faves, with our girl Natalia Tena before she was Nymphadora Tonks and Wildling Osha). I did love The Constant Gardener, which I saw in the theater, but don’t know if I could bear to watch it again. As you wrote, “That ending, though”…

      It’s stayed with me all these years.

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    64. Wolfish,

      Osha in “About a Boy” was great in a small part. So was little Nicholas Hoult as the Boy; hard to believe he’d grow up to be Nux in Mad Max: Fury Road…. “Witness me, Bloodbag!”
      Back to Rachel Weisz… I remembered that restaurant scene when Hugh Grant essentially admits to her he’s a total fraud. So nice to see that come full circle via his public self-humiliation towards the end.

      PS. You all have got me scared to watch The Constant Gardener with comments like, “the end though.” I don’t like heartbreaking endings. I still haven’t gotten over Zefferelli’s “Romeo & Juliet”, and I saw that over thirty years ago. (I seriously crushed on Olivia Hussey as Juliet; one of the reasons I wanted her daughter India Eisley to play a similarly star-crossed lover Lyanna Stark: that and the fact that India Eisley looks like Maisie W in similar pictures in fur hoods.)

      Enough early morning pre-coffee disgression.

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    65. Ten Bears,

      I also loved Zeffirelli’s Romeo and Juliet, which I also saw (gulp) more than 30 years ago.

      As for The Constant Gardener… Do watch it. It is a beautiful film, as others have commented, and well worth seeing.

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