House of the Dragon stars arrive in Cáceres; Arryk & Erryk, Aemond and more Targaryens cast; Do we finally have our Aegon?

Alicent Hightower's previously seen carriage in Cáceres, Spain
Alicent Hightower’s carriage, previously seen in England, is now in Cáceres, Spain

Filming for House of the Dragon has continued uninterrupted in Spain for weeks now, although much of the main cast has flown there only these last few days. In fact, it seems like the entire Targaryen court will be present… including several newcomers! The sons of King Viserys make their debut, as well as new Kingsguard members. Who’s playing Aemond? What about Ser Arryk and Erryk Cargyll, twin members of the Kingsguard? Is one of the new mystery cast members the elusive Aegon?

Calahorra Castle in Granada was the site for the first royal congregation, which suggests that —just like Trujillo Castle in Game of Thrones— this Renaissance stronghold won’t be a castle on its own right but part of King’s Landing, whether it’s the city walls or the Red Keep’s. As we reported, Matt Smith‘s Daemon Targaryen was involved, and Los Siete Reinos confirmed Rhaenyra Targaryen and Alicent Hightower were also present. According to Spanish newspaper Ideal, dragons were also likely involved — and they weren’t there just to look pretty, as explosions and flares were seen.

The new (or rather, old) design for King's Landing Gold Cloaks, in Cáceres
The new (or rather, old) City Watch, which became known as Gold Cloaks in this time, in Cáceres

Production then moved on to Cáceres. Despite the medieval look of the city’s old town, it still required many days of preparations to turn it into King’s Landing, which we already commented on. Finally, on October 11, actual shooting began in earnest. Though it was a more closely guarded set than when Euron marched through the same streets, some detailes have surfaced, especially now that much of the main cast has arrived.

As Cáceres native Javi Borrega showed us, Fabien Frankel, who plays Criston Cole, was seen practicing a fight with twin actors Elliot and Luke Tittensor, which likely means they’re playing fellow Kingsguard and twin brothers Arryk and Erryk Cargyll.

Actors Ewan Mitchell, best known for The Last Kingdom, and Tom Glynn-Carney were also seen around them. In fact, it looks like we have our Aemond One-Eye! As you can see below, the second son of King Viserys Targaryen and Queen Alicent Hightower was photographed with his Targaryen platinum hair and an eye patch. Technically, this could be a slight if understandable deviation from the source material, in which he places a saphhire in place of his lost eye (though I guess they could to that sometimes still; but it’d be unnecesarily expensive if they were to do the VFX for every shot.)

Aemond Targaryen Caceres

Since Mitchell appears to be playing the one-eyed Targaryen prince, Glynn-Carney is likely playing one of his brothers. He might be Dareon or even Aegon, a key figure in the drama (though not at first) whose casting has eluded us thus far.

This week, according to Hoy, the stars of House of the Dragon have been seen in Cáceres, for these last days of filming: Rhys Ifans, Hand of the King Otto Hightower; Milly Alcock, the young Rhaenyra Targaryen; and Matt Smith, the rogue prince Daemon Targaryen. Showrunners Ryan Condal and Miguel Sapochnik were also present.

Photo by: Hoy / Jorge Rey / María Arias
Rhys Ifans, Milly Alcock, Matt Smith, Ewan Mitchell, Tom Glynn-Carney. Photos: HOY

With all the royal court in King’s Landing’s streets, whatever’s going on is sure to be something of import. We’ll keep you up to date if we learn about any of it!

78 Comments

  1. Wow, Ewan Mitchell and Tom Glynn-Carney are just SO perfect, my goodness!! I would even say that Aemond looks just like a young Daemon, which is quite fitting lol. My only problem is…. Olivia Cooke is no more than 5 years older than them so… how is that gonna work? I’m sure make up will greatly help but I am still conflicted about the casting, ngl, no shade against Olivia, she is absolutely wonderful and will deliver an amazing performance I’m sure.

    I have to say, I’m so incredibly happy to see my beloved greens come to life! I know they are supposed to be “the baddies” and such but I cannot help myself, hopefully the show will bring out the family dynamics of the Targaryen-Hightower team.

    Now we just need to meet the most likeable greens yet: Helaena and Daeron, I think these two characters will make people root even more so for the greens, hopefully they’ll expand their roles quite a bit.

    I honestly feel like the greens are like the Lannisters (ruthless, calculating, rich, powerful and ambitious) if the Lannisters hadn’t been too focused on murdering each other lol, I’m very excited to see them act as a family, if they get it right, which I’m sure they will, we could have a very strong case for the greens and maybe fandom support.

    This are some of the points that I would love them to explore through the series. there are MILD SPOILERS:

    OTTO

    We could see Otto’s fear of Daemon Targaryen, fully knowing what could happen to his family if Rhaenyra became queen, some could argue that Otto and Daemon had as much to do with the Dance as Alicent and Rhaenyra. Also, show him being competent as a hand, he was quite good at it and it will be really nice to see his bond with his daughter Alicent, we don’t know that nuch about their relationship but it would be nice to see them being close and supportive of one another

    ALICENT

    Alicent’s sadness over being married to an elder man that you don’t love, going through the pain and trauma to bring a boy into the world just for that boy to be set aside in favour of Rhaenyra. And now that we know that Rhaenyra and Alicent will start as friends / companions at first, making their bond even stronger, we could see their relationship rotting away and the pain that comes with it.
    Alicent was an extremely succesfull queen consort ala Margeary, doing public work and parties, jousts, showing that her entire focus is on being a succesful queen, doing EVERYTHING right in her role: from giving birth to several sons, to being beloved by the people to being incredibly politically savvy.
    Talking about political savviness, Alicent is a highly competent politician, she is much much better than Cersei in that regard, not only she possibly commits regicide and succesfully organises a coup but she is also brilliant at forming alliances with several other houses and that’s key, Cersei was good at grabbing power but didn’t know how to use it, Alicent did.
    I know it’s a very common trope to make female antagonists likeable but she adores her children and would do everything to protect them, she smuggles a very injured Aegon away to safety and stays in KL knowing that she could easily die, but stays to be a distraction to safe her son.
    I also think is key to show indicate that Alicent only staged a coup after many many years of triying to put her son on the throne through more “honorable” means, heck, she even proposed Rhaenyra marrying Aegon, the coup -and probably poisoning the King- only happened because it was the only thing she could do to put her son where he rightfully belonged according to the law, there is no doubt that Alicent is ambitious and power hungry but she also wants what she thinks her children deserve.
    Alicent also goes through unbearable amounts of pain and trauma, mind you that she was at the same room where the Blood and cheese incident happened, she saw everything unfold, she also sees her son being gravely injured and in such pain he almost becomes like a drug addict with the milk of the puppy, she looses everything and everyone she loves, at the end, she is completely alone with only her painful memories and regrets to accompany her

    AEGON

    -Aegon´s relationship with his eldest sister, the envyhe feels towards her and the rejection he feels for his father, think about it, in Westeros (minus Dorne) every single lord’s eldest son is gonna inherit their father’s title, castles and fortune whereas Aegon is the only exception to that rule, he must be plagued with insecurities, why would his father set him aside? isn’t he enough? Why doesn’t his father love him?
    – His relationship with Rhaenyra is one of the things I am most excited about, I assume they were both incredibly jealous of each other, Aegon feeling left out and Rhaenyra constantly worrying that one day her father would disinherit her and name her brother the heir, that resentment, jealousy and weariness towards each other would be really nice and heartbreaking to see, at the end of the day, they are the official leaders of each side.
    – Alicent and Aegon’s bond, Aegon doesn’t do anything his mother doesn’t want him to do, he truly is a mommy’s boy though and through, but it also makes sense, his father rejects him and his mother is fighting as much as she can to put her son on the throne, as ANY woman would do during those times, Alicent is ambitious and power hungry but she also wants what she thinks her children deserve.
    – Indicate his hesitance to becoming king, recouncing to it at first because he still loves and respects his sister.

    AEMOND

    – Aemond being awful, I don’t think they can redeem him that much, maybe with a certain witch, but honestly? let him be a monster, from an audience perspective it will be wildly entertaining, reminding them of Joffrey, however, there is one huge difference, joff was a coward fool, if there is something Aemond has as much as cruelty is courage and efficience.

    HELAENA

    – Helaena being complex, wouldn’t it be nice if she actually was the smartest and more sound of the children? Whilst everyone is focusing on that stupid iron chair, let her be the voice of the common folk, a woman who deeply cares about what truly matters: the people, Helaena is BELOVED by the commonfolk, show why! Maybe at the end of the series we will all be like “Yup, should have been Helaena all the way”.
    – Please, explore Helaena’s descent into madness properly, for the love of god, Don’t go like “yeah, she craaaazy”, explore her grief and trauma over what’s happening, Helaena looses everything for the actions of others, maybe she recovers from the blood and cheese trauma and what she is on the edge of happiness, she finds out of what happened in bitterbridge.

    DAERON

    – Daeron is kind, gentle, competent, effective and a true badass, I love him a lot and I’m sure people will cry with his stupid dead behind a tent

    JAEHAERYS, JAEHAERA AND MAELOR

    I mean, they are very very yound children, the most important one is Jaehaera because she’ll be queen at the end, at least for a little while, she is extremely traumatised after the blood and cheese incident, Jaehaerys is brutally dead and poor little Maelor is… yeah… I always find it surprising that people always mention blood and cheese but they never mention bitterbridge, you have an angry mob brutally ripping apart a toddler and then Lady Caswell (the lady of the castle) literally hangs herself after seeing her entire lands being reduced to ashes.

    THE GREENS

    Ormund Hightower, Sam Tarly, Johanna Westerling, Corlys Velaryon at the very end, And the best of them Sir Criston Cole, the man of the broken heart, just cool amazing characters all around. No, not you Urwin Peake, no one likes you.
  2. I might be wrong as it’s sometime since I read Fire & Blood now but isn’t Aegon in this story quite young like teenage?

  3. Jon Snowed,

    I think they’re playing with the timeline somewhat, especially as regards the ages, plus it seems there’s going to be two “parallel” storylines: what happened in the past (twenty or ten years ago) and what happens “now”, right up to the break out of the war. Aegon the Elder (Aegon II) is – in the books – about ten years younger than Rheanyra, a few years older than Rhaenyra’s three eldest sons. The show might play with the timeline/ages.

    Don’t expect everything to be just like the books or you’ll be disappointed. 😀

    It’s not malice from the showrunners, often it’s practical things like actors – especially child/teenage actors – growing up/ageing between shooting seasons, if you’re expecting a 2-3 year or more run.

    Maybe the “older” women in HotD are being played by unfeasibly young actors. The industry still seems to think female actors have to be “young and pretty”, disappear from view until they’re old and merited enough to be in the “Olenna Tyrrel”-category, after which they can be venerated. Male actors find work during the “dissappear” years – slight wrinkles just add character, donchaknow. (But apparently not on a female face..?)

    Anyway, I expect the timeline and ages to be different from the books. It won’t bother me if the story is well told and internally consistent enough.

  4. So based on set leaks it seems that S1 will cover at least 3 timelines. I hope they know what they are doing.

  5. OberonYronwood,

    Thanks for your long piece, explaining “Green love”. Very interesting reading.

    I’m kind of “Black” leaning, though they weren’t very good either. Rot at the top with Rhaenyra and Daemon.

    Reading Fire and Blood, I thought Otto Hightower was a kind of a Tywin-figure. Less ruthless, but very capable, very keen to advance his family – he wasn’t the Lord of Hightower, a brother or an uncle, something like that.

    But while Hand to the Old King (Jaeharys I), he took good care to insert his nubile young daughter Alicent as a nurse and companion to the Old King. Ingratiating his family (via his nubile daughter) with the ruling Targaryen family. He was ultimately successful – Viserys married Alicent and she produced several sons – Viserys’s first wife had only produced one daughter, Rheanyra.

    Alicent was used as a political pawn from a very young age. Reading to the Old King (Jaeharys I), currying favour, seeking advancement… the ultimate advancement.

    Fans like to compare Alicent with Cersei. Dad Hand of the King, able to make King marry the Hand’s daughter, make her Queen… and his grandson King.

    Alicent is what Cersei could’ve been if she was a bit… no, a lot more savvy, aware of the political situation… a lot smarter.

    Otto is Poundshop Tywin but Alicent is so far above Cersei it’ll be interesting to see.

  6. mau:
    So based on set leaks it seems that S1 will cover at least 3 timelines. I hope they know what they are doing.

    What’s the third timeline?

    I’m thinking “old stuff” bleeding into “middle stuff”. Then “now” stuff that brings us to the brink of war.

  7. OberonYronwood,

    I’d like to thank you as well for your post! 🙂

    I also think is key to show indicate that Alicent only staged a coup after many many years of triying to put her son on the throne through more “honorable” means, heck, she even proposed Rhaenyra marrying Aegon, the coup -and probably poisoning the King- only happened because it was the only thing she could do to put her son where he rightfully belonged according to the law, there is no doubt that Alicent is ambitious and power hungry but she also wants what she thinks her children deserve.

    The thing for me is, Alicent isn’t the one who makes the law in this society — that’s the current ruling monarch and Viserys decided to go against a decision made by another power only about ten years earlier. Alicent knew this going in.

    On that note, it’s not as if Viserys promised Alicent that their sons would be heir to the throne or indicated any such thing — both she and her father knew King Viserys had made Rhaenyra his heir for the whole realm to see (which was Otto’s own idea in the first place because he didn’t want Daemon inheriting the crown). As a result, I don’t think Alicent was owed a son as heir apparent to the crown simply because she failed to change the king’s mind about changing his will during his lifetime — a will that was now the law under his reign and one she knew about going into this marriage: that it’s her step-daughter who Viserys named as heir, not their sons. As such, I wouldn’t say Alicent was justified in what she did or in her role kicking off the Dance of the Dragons to arrange power for her bloodline. I do think she had options (ie. accepting Rhaenyra as queen, not starting a war for power). Her kids could still been royalty and lived a life in Dragonstone, King’s Landing, or in other places of the world — just not as rulers with power transferred to the Hightower-Targaryen bloodline.

  8. OberonYronwood,

    I’m a bit dissapointed that in your long write-up about the Greens, you only devoted two lines to Deareon the Daring the best of the Greens.

    He wasn’t an entitled lazy brat like Aegon or an entitled, greedy, stupid psychopath like Aemond.

    Daereon, though the youngest, had some nous. He used his small dragon to the best advantage. He had learned about warfare and strategy and tactics and put it to use.

    Daemon’s and Aemond’s dragonfight above the God’s Eye must’ve looked very spectacular, scary, even glorious… But how much did it achieve, apart from giving the ultimate stroke to the egoes of two second-born Targaryen Princes?

    The war became so horrible because it was in the hands of the most bigoted, vengeanceful, petty, stupid people on both sides. If anybody tried to talk any sense, they would be trown into the dungeons. Way to win a war, ha ha ha.

  9. talvikorppi,

    1. Timeline with younger Rhaenyra and Alicent
    2. Timeline with older Rhaenyra and Alicent but their children played by younger actors
    3. Timeline with older Rhaenyra and Alicent and their children played by adult actors

    We saw younger and older version of Aemond on set.

  10. talvikorppi,

    Sometimes British female TV reporters/newsreaders/presenters get sidelined when they aren’t twenty-somethings anymore while that doesn’t happen with their male counterparts; people will deny that it’s because of age though.

    I wasn’t aware of the dramatisation of GoT from the very start (learned of it circa 2013) but when I did some back reading I found out that there had been some people who thought Michelle Fairley wasn’t glamorous enough to play Caitlin (sp?). Mind you I’ve read comments to the effect that Matt Smith wasn’t ‘hot’ enough to play the character he is depicting. ONE reason I haven’t read ‘Fire and Blood’ is so that I go into watching the series without any expectations/possible disappointment if an event or minor character is left out (condensation in adaptation is bound to occur in books as long and involved as Mr M’s I feel).

  11. Addendum to previous post: even though I’m an old trout I’m not against having attractive male actors on TV shows – providing they have the acting chops and aren’t just beautiful talking statues.

  12. Dame of Mercia,

    I’m a middle-aged trout 😀 and I’m totally not against having attractive male actors. I’m salivating at the prospect of seeing Graham McTavish onscreen! ;-D

    I’m just curious what female and male viewers see as attractive, and how their (supposed) preferences influence casting decisions. Or what some showbiz executives (mostly male) imagine to be the eye-candy female viewers would want… (It’s simpler for their ideas of a male viewer: young and pretty actresses).

    As a middle-aged trout, I can appeciate young male beauty, such as Robb, Jon, Loras (Richard Madden, Kit Harington, Finn Jones), but it doesn’t excite me – they’re boys – then I drwl over middle-aged male beauty (Nikolaij Coster-Waldau as Jaime!), and find older men like Davos or the Blackfish (Liam Cunningham and Clive Russell) quite sexy.

    Why is it that showbiz executives (rightly?) think that female viewers are OK with male actors of all ages, but think male viewers want to have young and pretty female actors… then skip over to the “crone” department a la Olenna Tyrell?

    (Yes, I know Lena Heady was in her late thirties/early forties when she portrayed Cersei, but she looks younger. Fun fact, Nikolaij Coster Waldau, Jaime, Cersei’s twin, is a few years older than Lena Heady.)

    Given the showbiz’s ideas about age re. male/female actors, there might be even more timeline/age confusion in HotD.

  13. mau:

    1. Timeline with younger Rhaenyra and Alicent
    2. Timeline with older Rhaenyra and Alicent but their children played by younger actors
    3. Timeline with older Rhaenyra and Alicent and their children played by adult actors

    We saw younger and older version of Aemond on set.

    OK, I get you.

    So some stuff before any of the kids were born or Alicent’s kids were small kids.

    Then some stuff when Rhaenyra’s first three kids are quite young, Alicent’s kids a bit older (Aemond’s eye incident?)

    The “now” of the timeline, when Alicent’s kids are “grown up” and Rhaenyra’s first three are teenagers. Aegon the younger (Aegon III) nine or ten – a kid.

    Plus some could be aged up, and the show could play fast and loose with the timeline/ages. We’ll have to wait and see.

  14. OberonYronwood,

    ”I have to say, I’m so incredibly happy to see my beloved greens come to life!”

    Good to see your true colors shining through. 💚.
    I was going to post a Team Green Musical Interlude. In deference to those who’ve expressed their dislike for references to music videos, I’m going to post it later tonight in the Comments sections under the previous article, “House of the Dragon Filming in Spain…”, preface it with a warning ⚠️, and cover it with spoiler coding.

  15. OberonYronwood,

    ”And now that we know that Rhaenyra and Alicent will start as friends / companions at first, making their bond even stronger, we could see their relationship rotting away and the pain that comes with it.”

    I’m glad you said this. While I’m not familiar with the source material, I surmised from the teaser trailer and some of the set photos that Young Rhaenyra and Young Alicent will start out as friends. I am hoping HotD will avoid the Mean Girls/stink eye trope. (For me, the Sansa vs. Dany and Arya vs. Dany xenophobic spitefest constituted a missed opportunity to show Sansa ingratiating herself to the Dragon Queen, and Arya bonding with a dragon riding Targ warrior who came to the rescue of Jon & the Snow Patrol at the Frozen Lake. But I digress…)

    The deterioration of the Rhaeneyra & Alicent friendship, and the ensuing cycle of retribution and retaliation, can be dramatically effective if they’re the result of outside forces and intermeddlers pushing them to assert their respective “claims” to the throne.

    (Along those lines… what’s the deal with Otto? I thought it was his idea for the king to designate Rhaenyra as his heir. Why would Otto then try to press Alicent to claim the throne for her sons?
    I’m not liking Otto already…)

  16. Ten Bears: The deterioration of the Rhaeneyra & Alicent friendship, and the ensuing cycle of retribution and retaliation, can be dramatically effective if they’re the result of outside forces and intermeddlers pushing them to assert their respective “claims” to the throne.

    Well, Rhaenyra and Alicent do start off on good terms in the source material.

    However, I’d say the trouble starts with them and what they want/feel their owed, which is in conflict, with neither relenting or giving in. By the time Alicent marries Viserys, Rhaenyra has already been solidified as Viserys’s heir. But when Alicent has a son with Viserys, she wants her son to be Viserys’s heir, not Rhaenyra, and Alicent is unsuccessful in getting Viserys to change his mind. This is ultimately what divides them — Rhaenyra is named as Viserys’s rightful heir and is being educated to rule — thus, Rhaenyra has the expectation of taking up the crown upon Viserys’s death. However, Alicent wants Viserys to change his mind and unname Rhaenyra as heir so he can make her son his heir instead of Rhaenyra.

    As for Otto…

    Yes, it was his idea. Otto wanted Viserys to defy the Great Precedent (finalized by Jaehaerys in 101) because under the Great Precedent, Viserys’s brother Daemon would be heir and Otto hated Daemon. As a result, Otto urges Viserys to make Rhaenyra his heir in defiances of the Great Precent. Viserys is still hopeful he and his then-wife Aemma can have a son. However, when Daemon mocks the deaths of Viserys’s wife and newborn son (who die as a result of complications from childbirth), Viserys disinherits Daemon to make Rhaenyra his heir.

    So Otto gets what he wants until…

    His daughter Alicent marries Viserys and has sons with him. Now the Great Precent looks great to Otto because with Alicent having sons by Viserys, Otto’s own blood would sit on the Iron Throne (as they’d inherit before Daemon). This would grant power and prestige to Otto’s family via Otto’s grandsons. That’s when Otto changes his tune and goes against Rhaenyra’s claim that he once pushed for.

  17. I wonder if they’re messing with us about Aegon and Aemond since this makes little sense to cast actors that old to play the roles. They could easily have put an eye patch on the actor playing young Daemon to troll fans.

    Tom Glynn-Carney would have been great as Aegon 5 years ago. Casting some recent drama school graduate would be the way to go to find someone like Kit or Richard.

    Olivia might be able to look older, but that would be far easier to do if they cast actors who looked early 20s. And Tom really doesn’t based on close-up selfies. He looks older than Olivia in real life.

  18. To add to my previous post, Tom Glynn-Carney is 26 and only a year younger than Olivia Cooke (Alicent Hightower) and Fabien Frankle (Ser Criston Cole) and three years younger than Emma D’arcy (Rhaenyra).

    Ewan Mitchell is between 25-28, so he’s either slightly younger than the actors playing Alicent, Criston and Aegon or older than them.

    I can’t understand how this makes sense unless there are very significant story changes and extensive makeup used on all of the actors.

  19. I think the hightower age is a little overblown. Cooke is 27. At most she has to play is 15 years older. A good makeup team can achieve that. And honestly people who take care of themselves don’t look that much different from late twenties to early forties save for a few wrinkles and some gray hair.

  20. A bit off topic, I’ve seen adverts for season 2 of this British show C.O.B.R.A. which I haven’t seen (or season 1 for that matter). The reason I’m mentioning it is that it features Richard Dormer (Beric). It looks like season 1 featured Ellie Kendrick (Meera) but I’m not sure if she’s in the second season. https://youtu.be/Tv2NfJ0pE28 I only watched the first season of ‘Once Upon a Time’ but from the trailer Robert Carlyle is in it too.

    The board has gone quiet again but I hope it perks up again when and if the next set of leaked (or given out openly) photographs appear.

  21. Regarding the show with Richard Dormer, I’ve just read that nothing has been shown of season 2 other than the first three episodes. I don’t think there were THAT many episodes anyway. Whether they will be shown later I don’t know. Apparently the reason the other episodes weren’t aired (not yet anyway) was to do with the British MP (Member of Parliament), David Amess, was murdered on 15th October and there was a plot point in one episode which while not exactly the same bore some similarities (purely coincidentally).

    Bad things happen in the real world and not just in Westeros.

  22. A bit off topic too: I have not watched Season 1 or
    Season of “Ted Lasso” (on Apple TV) but my sister has and she says it is delightful. I’m mentioning it because she recommended this high thread count scene featuring Hannah Waddingham (Septa Unella) as Rebecca:
    ⚠️ Spoiler Alert!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8k-bSEhEDo

    I like how the scene started..

    Rebecca: “I have something I need to tell you.”
    Ted: “Oh. Deja vu.”
    Rebecca: “I’m a f*cking bitch.”
  23. Dame of Mercia:
    A bit off topic, I’ve seen adverts for season 2 of this British show C.O.B.R.A.which I haven’t seen (or season 1 for that matter).The reason I’m mentioning it is that it features Richard Dormer (Beric).It looks like season 1 featured Ellie Kendrick (Meera) but I’m not sure if she’s in the second season.https://youtu.be/Tv2NfJ0pE28I only watched the first season of ‘Once Upon a Time’ but from the trailer Robert Carlyle is in it too.

    The board has gone quiet again but I hope it perksup again when and if the next set of leaked (or given out openly) photographs appear.

    I’m all in if Ellie Kendrick is featured! One of my biggest disappointments was D&D’s decision to ship her back home. The 3ER and D&D decided her role was done. She did get to live though! Bran basically said “Thank you for your service…goodbye.” She served her purpose. Bran wasn’t Bran anymore and couldn’t even give her a hug. I don’t think Bran should have disappeared. D&D decided it would be like invasion of the body snatchers, and Bran was no longer really Bran. His body was taken over by the 3ER. This is also very sad. I think he could have still been Bran and had the powers of the 3ER at the same time. Meera didn’t get through to him. That was disappointing. Max von Sydo didn’t seem like a robot.

    The children of the forest were pretty much all blown up, so none of them were left to thank Meera either. I think D&D tried to limit the number of characters during the final season and sent Meera home. I would have loved to see her help poor Theon guard Bran.

    I also noticed not much was going on here at WotW. I’ve still been checking back most days to see if anything is happening. I do appreciate the depth of knowledge many of the people here display, once the posts really take off.

  24. Tron79,

    You’re forgetting that while Sydow’s 3ER most likely took years to complete his training and became the 3ER more gradually, Bran became the 3ER in a couple of hours. Receiving the knowledge of the universe all at once would be enough to overload anyone’s brain and change their personality.

  25. Young Dragon:
    Tron79,

    You’re forgetting that while Sydow’s 3ER most likely took years to complete his training and became the 3ER more gradually, Bran became the 3ER in a couple of hours. Receiving the knowledge of the universe all at once would be enough to overload anyone’s brain and change their personality.

    Good point. Perhaps Bran’s brain is still in shock and eventually part of Bran’s personality may return.

  26. On the subject of GOT actors doing other stuff, has anyone seen The Vault? It’s Liam Cunningham’s new film; a heist movie where they rob the central bank in Madrid. It’s a fairly mediocre effort, Liam is a wonderful actor but it’s almost as if he’s playing Davos when I watch it.

    On another note Kit and Richard Madden are in the new Marvel movie – Eternals which releases later this week here in Europe. Unfortunately it’s received the lowest critic ratings of any MCU movie so far so seems it’s not very good:-(

  27. Jon Snowed: On another note Kit and Richard Madden are in the new Marvel movie – Eternals which releases later this week here in Europe. Unfortunately it’s received the lowest critic ratings of any MCU movie so far so seems it’s not very good:-(

    IMO, there are way too many superhero movies being made now. The market is oversaturated. I think the supply is way higher than the demand.

  28. Tron79,

    Hopefully Bran’s people skills will dramatically improve since he’s king now, otherwise he won’t make for a very good one.

  29. Tron79,

    I don’t think they really knew what to do with him. I could be misremembering, but I think they slightly regretted that decision. It might have been in an Isaac interview. In the context of the ending, I can see why they would regret it, someone like him as King? It just opened them up to so many problems/questions that nobody can answer. I really don’t get the whole Bran thing, I think it is the book plot with the most development left. We are still relatively early in Bran’s story, so it was very difficult for D+D.

    RE: HOTD, is it me or have they been filming for eons? GOT didn’t take this long did it?

  30. Jenny,

    It seemed to me to be key to the story about the Others in the books. I suppose he was key in the show, but using Bran as bait didn’t seem like what GRRM would have had in mind. Unfortunately we may never know. Even if TWOW comes out someday, Bran’s story may not develop as much as we would like in the next book. But I would hope it would since it’s the winds of winter, we should be spending some time in the snow beyond the wall. But there are so many other characters to deal with, it’s hard to say.

  31. Apologies if this gets posted twice, it was marked as spam when I edited it

    Tron79,

    I’m not sure about anything related to Bran, they had to come up with a reason for the NK to kill him, which seemed pretty flimsy to me. Unless GRRM introduces a similar character, that will obviously be different in the books. This is where I feel for D+D, they had an almost impossible task. It’s unfortunate that they had to get him on the throne as per GRRM’s ending, that was a lot of leg work for them. Plus it’s the more supernatural/mystical side which is pretty dense in the books. They had to streamline that too. I like the idea of the 3ER being a wrong un, someone for Bran to overcome, he’s currently drinking Jojen juice isn’t he? My memory is a bit hazy, I need to reread soon. There is some dodgy stuff going on in that cave, i’m really interested in it, but unfortunately i’m starting to think that Winds will never come out :/ that has put me off rereading

  32. Jenny:
    Apologies if this gets posted twice, it was marked as spam when I edited it

    Tron79,

    I’m not sure about anything related to Bran, they had to come up with a reason for the NK to kill him, which seemed pretty flimsy to me. Unless GRRM introduces a similar character, that will obviously be different in the books. This is where I feel for D+D, they had an almost impossible task. It’s unfortunate that they had to get him on the throne as per GRRM’s ending, that was a lot of leg work for them. Plus it’s the more supernatural/mystical side which is pretty dense in the books. They had to streamline that too. I like the idea of the 3ER being a wrong un, someone for Bran to overcome, he’s currently drinking Jojen juice isn’t he? My memory is a bit hazy, I need to reread soon. There is some dodgy stuff going on in that cave, i’m really interested in it, but unfortunately i’m starting to think that Winds will never come out :/ that has put me off rereading

    Yeah,

    Bran is still in the cave/tree. But I was just rereading a wiki summary, because it’s fading my memory too. He was having some amazing visions. It already had much more depth than what the show used. The children of the forest fed him the paste to help him develop his abilities. You’re right though that D&D were in a tough situation to get Bran to the end as King especially if they didn’t choose to delve into the supernatural and magical (more fantasy) side of the story. I doubt they understood all of the prophesies either. I feel more discouraged lately about the book coming out. I just re-read the Wiki at https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/A_Dance_with_Dragons-Chapter_34
    just to refresh my memory some.
  33. Tron79,

    They had to come up with a solid reason for him to be King as well, a person who we don’t really know anymore. I can guarantee that Bran won’t be voted King at the Great Council because he has a good story. I can only imagine how hard they wracked their brains to come up with *something*. It’s a shame that the climax of the whole thing left me with so many questions, but i’m not even sure that GRRM knows the answers at this point in time. People joke about the Bran is evil theories but it’s all so vague, with the information that we have its entirely plausible. It’s not true obviously lol, but it’s an option.

  34. Jenny:
    Tron79,

    They had to come up with a solid reason for him to be King as well, a person who we don’t really know anymore. I can guarantee that Bran won’t be voted King at the Great Council because he has a good story. I can only imagine how hard they wracked their brains to come up with *something*. It’s a shame that the climax of the whole thing left me with so many questions, but i’m not even sure that GRRM knows the answers at this point in time. People joke about the Bran is evil theories but it’s all so vague, with the information that we have its entirely plausible. It’s not true obviously lol, but it’s an option.

    from the books, Bran doesn’t feel evil to me at all (at least not yet. His story is just getting started). I was drawn to the story of the Children of the Forest and their little society in the cave/tree. None of it felt evil to me. They seemed to be nurturing Bran and helping him develop his powers. Bran even gave them cute names since he couldn’t pronounce their real names. Perhaps that will all change and it’s just luring us in, but it’s possible GRRM didn’t know where it all was headed yet. I think from the visions in his sleep in Bran’s last chapter, GRRM must have had an idea of some of it. I think the visions were from the past though. I don’t want to harp too much on D&D’s decisions for season 8. I don’t blame them. They did the best they could with very little info, especially in Bran’s case. They used Sam’s speech as their vehicle to get Bran to the end. When I heard Sam’s speech the first time, it seemed forced to me. I could tell right away it was a plot vehicle (When Sam’s in the war room and says, “That’s what death is, isn’t it? Forgetting. Being forgotten…” etc…). I wonder if GRRM really wanted to show was that you don’t have to be a King or Queen to be important. You could be physically challenged like Bran, but with the help of a close group of friends, you are capable of doing incredible things and influencing change in the world. I hope one day we will get to read what GRRM had in mind. I guess I’m still a little hopeful for TWOW, but beyond hopeless for ADOS. It will be good that the prequel comes out. For me, I still love GOT. I’m looking over to my right at some of my memorabilia right now. But it is becoming more and more of a distant memory. Those stories in the books hopefully will never be forgotten (quoting Sam’s speech). But they do fade over time if GRRM isn’t able to continue them. With the prequel coming out, it will at least get some energy back into the ASOIAF world. It may not help GRRM finish any time sooner, but it may help bring the stories back to life some for me.
  35. Tron79,

    Yeah, the Bran is evil theory only works for the show because of his demeanour and the amount of gaps in the story. I am suspicious of the 3 Eyed Raven in the books though. He will either help Bran, or Bran will defeat him in some way. Bran’s hero’s journey is quite unconventional, but if he is going to be King, it will have to follow similar beats.

    The thought of the books never coming out does make me feel sad too, so much investment and it might never end. I keep seeing GRRM attached to new projects and my heart falls every time. I keep telling myself that I enjoyed the time I spent with it and that wont be erased if he never finishes. Still a huge bummer though, I really want to read about Bran, and I want to see if he goes into the whole Prince that was promised prophecy. There are a few things that the show couldn’t possibly resolve that I am curious about. Is FAegon a waste of time!? I might never know!

  36. Jenny:
    Tron79,

    Yeah, the Bran is evil theory only works for the show because of his demeanour and the amount of gaps in the story. I am suspicious of the 3 Eyed Raven in the books though. He will either help Bran, or Bran will defeat him in some way. Bran’s hero’s journey is quite unconventional, but if he is going to be King, it will have to follow similar beats.

    The thought of the books never coming out does make me feel sad too, so much investment and it might never end. I keep seeing GRRM attached to new projects and my heart falls every time. I keep telling myself that I enjoyed the time I spent with it and that wont be erased if he never finishes. Still a huge bummer though, I really want to read about Bran, and I want to see if he goes into the whole Prince that was promised prophecy. There are a few things that the show couldn’t possibly resolve that I am curious about. Is FAegon a waste of time!? I might never know!

    Originally I think GRRM was trying to do a trilogy like LOTR, so it probably turned into more books than he ever imagined. One of the problems is that he throws away alot of what he writes and does it all over again.

  37. Jenny,

    If my chronology is correct, Book #5, “A Dance with Dragons,” was published on July 12, 2011.
    That’s over ten years ago. Even the most optimistic reader must have serious doubts that “The Winds of Winter” will ever be released, let alone “A Dream of Spring.”

  38. Ten Bears,

    That’s why I refuse to read the Kingkiller Chronicles, the first 2 books are very highly rated but the second book came out in 2011, Patrick Rothfuss is slow, but I think he will release The Doors of Stone before GRRM finishes Winds. I just don’t want to invest in an unfinished series again. That’s the beauty of Sanderson, the man is a machine, I read a 1000 page book and felt fine about it, he will finish that series. I started reading The Gentleman Bastard Series (it’s awesome) and the 4th book is due out this year thankfully. GRRM has taught me to be careful though

  39. talvikorppi,

    I see some hope here. I follow Succession and if I had a crown for every fan comment on Gerri “She’s kinda hot!” being the typical, it all depends on presentation. And Gerri is neither young nor slim and certainly no crone, either, so it can be done. And it should be done.

  40. While we wait for more news about HotD, I just read that Rory McCann will play the lead role in a new show about a detective D.C.I Daley (from the book by Denzil Meyrick)

    I’m extremely excited to see him in a starring role like this one, and I also usually like detective shows, so this could be lots of fun. It looks like it hasn’t started production yet, but this should be awesome.

  41. Tron79,

    I don’t know that series, Tron but I remember that Scots writer, Quintin Jardine, said that he thought the Hound might make a suitable DCI Skinner if the Skinner books were ever dramatised. I sometimes find that if I read a library book I like which is fictional that I occasionally fan cast a story and GoT alumni sometimes creep in there.

  42. Tron79,

    I can easily imagine him smoking a corn-cob pipe and solving crimes, a la Sherlock Holmes, only this time with a more ornery attitude.

    “Sir, how did you know he was the murderer?”

    “Experience”

  43. On this Thanksgiving here in the USA, I want to say thank you to everyone at WotW for being there over the years, and I’m hoping people stick around to talk about tHotD once there’s more to talk about. There’s been a pretty long lull with no posts, and it’s getting me worried. I know it gets frustrating hearing the same thing from GRRM over and over about being very busy in other projects. This community is really important. Some continue to be isolated because of COVID. I just talked with someone who had a bad reaction to her first shot and couldn’t take another one. She’s still living totally isolated. Life wasn’t easy for her before COVID, and now her fears are much worse. It helps to have communities like this one. It’s really comforting each day to come to WotW and read the latest from Adrianacandle, Ten Bears, Wolfish, Jenny, Mr. Derp, talvikorppi, Young Dragon, and so many others. I would list all of you here, because I really do appreciate all of your comments. I miss seeing Kevin here. I just thought about Kevin.
    I think the holidays aren’t always filled with light for people who struggle. Often it’s a stressful time and something to get through. The people here at WotW really are a community.

    I think people are just hibernating under the ice of no news waiting for the first episode of HotD to reach the screen. In the meantime, here is a post from WoTW from Thanksgiving on 2015 with cool items to purchase from back then. I love the Christmas is Coming art by TomBerryArtist/deviantart

    https://watchersonthewall.com/holiday-gift-guide-for-the-game-of-thrones-fan-on-your-shopping-list-part-i/

  44. Jenny:
    Tron79,
    Yeah, the Bran is evil theory only works for the show because of his demeanour and the amount of gaps in the story. I am suspicious of the 3 Eyed Raven in the books though. He will either help Bran, or Bran will defeat him in some way. Bran’s hero’s journey is quite unconventional, but if he is going to be King, it will have to follow similar beats.

    The thought of the books never coming out does make me feel sad too, so much investment and it might never end. I keep seeing GRRM attached to new projects and my heart falls every time. I keep telling myself that I enjoyed the time I spent with it and that wont be erased if he never finishes. Still a huge bummer though, I really want to read about Bran, and I want to see if he goes into the whole Prince that was promised prophecy. There are a few things that the show couldn’t possibly resolve that I am curious about. Is FAegon a waste of time!? I might never know!

    It doesn’t even work for the show! One thing that was made abundantly obvious on the show: there isn’t “good” or “evil”, there are just different sides that all see themselves as just and honorable.

    As for the final books, I suspect that the incredibly negative reception to the series end was a very sore blow to GRRM. It was bad enough that the world saw it before he could let them read it: but that the world saw it and then collectively vomited really had to sting. And, let’s face it: the last two books were pretty awful.

    So, given that we haven’t gotten a good GoT book since Bill Clinton was president, and given that we know that GRRM has been writing a ton of it without a clear thought about the big “whys” (e.g., why do the White Walkers want to do away with memory? Why do the followers of R’hllor have so much invested in the White Walkers? Why does R’hllor even care about this stuff? etc., etc.), and given that any resolutions upon which GRRM might stumble will almost certainly be tacked on poorly, well, maybe it would be best if we never do see it!

  45. I just saw a 47th comment..Does that mean WotW is working again???
    It’s been stuck on 46 for quite some time…

  46. Mr Derp,

    The first season that he didn’t work on. I don’t know what went on behind the scenes, but he left for a reason and I don’t believe that it was because he wanted to focus on Winds. He was disagreeing with things before that. But he wanted 10 or even 13 seasons, he clearly had a very different plan for the show and it might be no deeper than that, he seems to be on good terms with David and Dan

  47. I always felt that GRRM not being involved in S5 had more to do with the fact that they were cutting a lot of fat from AFFC and ADWD, they clearly streamlined some arcs and made a few creative changes. But realistically they didn’t have a choice due to the scale and pace of those books. I thought he might have come back for S6 but I did feel his influence there much more than the final two seasons.

  48. Wimsey,

    Except the ending wasn’t negatively received. The finale was the most watched episode in HBO history, the season 8 Blu Ray topped the sales charts, season 8 dominated at the Emmys, and GOT continues to be high in demand two years after it ended.

  49. Tron79,

    Testing…
    My Comments (including replies to you) have been diverted to Moderation Purgatory for the last several weeks, and then vaporized by the Lord of Light. Let’s see if this goes through…

  50. Young Dragon,

    It’s difficult to quantify, it wasn’t particularly well received critically, and 10 of its 12 Emmys were in the technical and creative categories, natural for such a huge scale production. It missed on out Writing and Direction, it didn’t deserve the writing Emmy but I was surprised about Direction. I firmly believe that Succession should have won Outstanding Drama but it won the next year and probably will win again for Season 3.

    I also think that general audiences liked it just fine based on DVD sales figures. The episode viewing figures don’t mean much because nobody was going miss the ending after all those years. People who bailed on the show came back to see how it ended. I don’t know many GOT fans in my personal life, my uncle and cousin hated it, my physio hated it, not really enough for me to base anything on. That’s why I never say ‘everyone I know hated it’ it’s anecdotal.

    So the brand is perfectly in tact, I believe that even those that hated Season 8 will check out House of the Dragon. People who claim that it has disappeared from the public consciousness are simply wrong

  51. Jenny,

    Receiving an Emmy nomination is an achievement. It doesn’t matter if they didn’t win. I disagree about the writing. They certainly deserved to win. The Iron Throne was an incredible episode with many big character moments. They deserved to win for Dany’s victory speech alone.

    Of course people would have missed the ending if they weren’t liking the season. That’s just how casual viewers are. They won’t force themselves to watch something they don’t enjoy.

    I suspect the House of the Dragon premiere will bring in high viewership numbers thanks largely to GOT. After that, the show will fail or succeed on its own.

  52. this is a bit off topic. on the other hand, what could be off topic in a sleeping thread?

    this guy here once applied for the part of Jon Snow, without success. instead, he had to wave with a sausage and become dog food. you remember these days? when you think of Ramsay’s face, would you have seen any Jon Snow in it? me: never.

    until now…

  53. The site seems to be dormant at present but on the offchance this message shows up Happy Christmas/New Year or whatever season’s greetings you celebrate – to members of the community.

  54. Young Dragon,

    Is any of that true or relevant? The finale’s ratings definitely are irrelevant: people couldn’t hate it until they watched it. (And the reality is that it was disliked pretty intensely; I still think that it was badly misunderstood, but the “Scouring of the Shire” plotline made a popular / well-received ending almost impossible.) You are definitely incorrect about Emmy’s: it was 2020 (not 2019) when the final season would have been nominated, and GoT didn’t get any prominent Emmys that year. I don’t think that it was even on the list of nominees for Best Series.) The high DVD sales would have reflected pre-orders before the finale aired.

    One of the most damning things was the very low binge-watching viewership during the COVID lockdowns. Obviously, GoT had limited ability to generate new audience. However, this is the kind of series that is easy to rewatch over and over if people like it. (HBO discovered that prior to season 8: they got great binge-watching “catchup” viewing in the weeks and even months leading up to the new seasons; they got nothing close to those numbers while people were exchanging sourdough recipes and singing Irish sea-shanties.)

    The brutal reality is that if GRRM ever finishes the 6th book, then it’s not going to be a big event outside of the fandom. At most, it will be an almost joke headline buried at the bottom of CNN’s webpage.

  55. Young Dragon,

    Whoops: it turns out that the final season was Emmy eligible in 2019, not 2020, and it did get a couple of major Emmys. I was not just surprised to learn this, but also surprised that I didn’t hear about any backlash against the nominations the way that happens when bad movies get Best Picture nominations. However,I also see that there was a bit and I missed that, too! I clearly stopped paying any attention in 2019. (I did get a lot done in 2019: that probably is why; and, let’s face it: I don’t always catch the backlash against bad Best Pic noms!)

    I am curious to see whether the new series gets any major viewership. I’ll be surprised if it does, not simply because of the final season, but because prequels have a well-earned reputation of being bad in general. (I’m not sure if I’ll watch it: I suspect that it will be all plot and no story, and history books do that much better than fantasy can.)

  56. 🎼 🎵🎶 “I’m dreaming of a Wight Christmas… ” 🎶🎼
    🤶🏻🧟‍♀️🧟‍♂️🧟🌲🏰🌲🧟‍♂️🧟‍♀️🧟‍♂️🎅

    (+ S8e3-inspired pictograph):
    🌬 🏰📚🩸🧟‍♀️ 🗡👸🏻 🔪💀 ❄️ 🧊

  57. 🎼 🎵🎶 “I’m dreaming of a Wight Christmas… ” 🎶🎼
    🤶🏻🧟‍♀️🧟‍♂️🧟🌲🏰🌲🧟‍♂️🧟‍♀️🧟‍♂️🎅

    (+ S8e3-inspired pictograph):
    🌬 🏰📚🩸🧟‍♀️ 🗡👸🏻 🔪💀 ❄️ 🧊

  58. death by chickenfire,

    Thanks for that! I’ve heard some of his songs in Welsh before, but not English.

    Any role I’d seen Iwan in prior to Game of Thrones was so completely different to Ramsay – I’m actually glad, as I don’t keep that as my sole impression of him.

    Happy New Year to all, miss the threads but my posts never get approved, so I’m assuming others may be in the same position as well.

  59. For some reason my comment wishing folks Merry Xmas/happy new year is still awaiting approval from about a week ago. Too late for xmas now but will try again to wish everyone all the best for 2022.

  60. Yay! I see some new comments!
    Sue, Petra, and others, I hope you decide to keep WotW running in 2022!!!
    HotD is probably coming in April……

  61. Tron79,

    Hey, Tron!
    Since comments and replies have been imprisoned in Moderation Purgatory or vaporized over the past two months, I re-posted two replies to you as comments under the YouTube video you posted ~ October, 2020.

  62. Ten Bears:
    Tron79,

    Hey, Tron!
    Since comments and replies have been imprisoned in Moderation Purgatory or vaporized over the past two months, I re-posted two replies to you as comments under the YouTube video you posted ~ October, 2020.

    Hi Ten Bears!! I just read your comment. Let’s hope WotW keeps working!!
    I had to remember which YouTube video you were talking about! It’s been awhile!
    Anyway, I found this article about Maisie and the Multiversus
    https://movieweb.com/maisie-williams-multiversus/

    .. here is an excerpt from the article
    “Try using Bugs Bunny & Arya Stark! This platform fighter lets you play out your fantasy matchups in a fun co-op or head-to-head fight for supremacy.”

  63. Looking at Tron’s post above I’m having a job getting my head round Arya Stark fighting Bugs Bunny.

    I came to post a link to an interview with the actor who formerly played Lord Bolton Senior and has more recently been in ‘The Wheel of Time’ https://youtu.be/CZNpeG4HOyg

  64. Odd that there hasn’t been any mention of the new HBO 2022 trailer which features House of the Dragon – unless this site is officially defunct. Which is a pity because it was always my favorite GoT site.

  65. LOL, did Dinklage just get a bunch of dwarves fired from Snow White because he was offended? lol, what a turd.

    “representation is important”

    “having Dwarves in a movie is offensive”

    which is it Peter?

  66. Dame of Mercia,

    Thank you! I’ve always thought he was a great actor. 🙂
    Not sure what is happening with this site, but hope everyone is OK and looking forward to this year’s shenanigans.

  67. is WotW still alive? or just waiting under the ice… I still check back to see if anything is happening here, and I was excited to see a couple of posts today worked!
    It looks like HotD is still finishing filming, so my guess it will drop late 2022.
    I know not everyone enjoys hearing tidbits from GRRM, but I liked his positive reaction to the first episode he saw.

  68. Tron79,
    Tried to post a link to an article re: GRRM’s reaction to rough cuts of HotD, but they’ve been in moderation for a month or so. Hoping this gets through.

Comments are closed.

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