Game of Thrones cast members are arriving in Los Angeles for tonight’s SAG Awards ceremony, and Sophie Turner has offered up a few season 6 tidbits at a pre-awards party.
Last night at Entertainment Weekly‘s SAG Awards party, the actress spoke with the magazine about what’s to come on Game of Thrones this year.
Turner says this will be the “biggest season yet” with “so many shocks, it’s massive.”
As for her character, “I mean this season is a really, really big one for Sansa,” the actress teases. “It’s probably her best season yet. It’s her really coming into her own. She, this season, really commands the respect that she deserves and she grabs hold of it and she runs with it and it’s really good.”
According to Turner, viewers will “finally getting that storyline that you’ve been craving for the past five seasons.” She says, “It was amazing because the past five seasons, it feels like it’s been building up and up to that.[…] You can only suffer so much before she finally gets her, the respect that she deserves.”
Several of the show’s stars partied at the EW affair along with Turner. Pictured at the event:
Alfie Allen, Maisie Williams and Hannah Murray
Alfie Allen and Carice van Houten
Maisie Williams touching up her makeup:
Sophie Turner with her hand in the cookie- no, candy, jar
Maisie and Sophie also hit the red (okay, black) carpet to show off their outfits:
Tune in to the 22nd Annual SAG Awards tonight, which is aired live on TNT and TBS, starting at 8 P.M. EST/5 P.M. PST. Good luck to the cast of Game of Thrones as they compete for Outstanding Performance by an Ensemble in a Drama Series, and to Peter Dinklage who is up for Outstanding Performance by a Male Actor in a Drama Series!
Great. Just don’t die this season.
Hodor!
Ravyn,
As long she doesn’t cut the head of someone she’s probably safe
Go, Sansa, go
Good Luck for Team Thrones at the SAG Awards <3
I'm Rooting for you guys.
She’ll obviously survive the jump from the wall, then. I wonder if Theon will. Maybe he’ll have a few broken ribs, or something. Then what? Where do they hide?
I am dying to know if Tyrion will try to locate his ‘wife’, with Varys’ help.
Tyrion and Sansa may be the great love story of series, second perhaps, only to Deny and Drogo.
Right. These lines are almost standard now! Hopefully things do get interesting in a positive way. 🙂
Good Luck to GoT and all cast, crew, writers, producers and directors!!! GoT deserves Best Ensemble Cast in a Drama Series!! Finally!!???
Didn’t she say the same thing last year and her character ended up getting raped and doing nothing for a season?
OMG the hype is real! For us living outside of US, does anyone know any live streaming links for the ceremony?
Turner says this will be the “biggest season yet” with “so many shocks, it’s massive.”
I hope it’s not just shock for the sake of delivering shock value. There has to be well thought out motivations and proper foreshadowing. If not then the season will seem like a parody of itself as it tries and fails to create YouTube reactions.
I have faith that this season will be good but I hope they don’t pander to creating “moments” rather than telling a story.
5 seasons? That could rule out anything to do with Roose & Ramsay (unless Sophie just means something relating purely to Sansa’s arc).
Would think that most fans would be hoping for the Boltons big time comeuppance and at Sansa’s doing would be very sweet.
“When redheaded people are above a certain social grade their hair is auburn” 🙂
Alex Stroup,
She does her best to hype up the character’s story each year, since that’s just PR 101 for any show. But the bulk of her talk about Sansa being a player, manipulating Littlefinger, etc. in the leadup to Season 5 was very early on, before she got the scripts, when she, like everybody else, was working off the direction that Season 4 set up. Once she got the scripts she pivoted to mainly talking about it being a tough year for the character (followed by, once the season was over, the customary pivot to “okay, but next year will be different”).
Next year may indeed be different, of course.
Love Sophie’s dress for the event; her best look for an event in a while.
Ser Not Appearing in this Series,
She’s probably saying the we will finally learn who Jon’s mother is
I’m Looking forward, I really liked her story arc in season 5. I really interested in where her character goes from here.
That’s not in context of what she says though which is about her own storyline.
And really who cares who Jon’s mother is? ( retires 50 paces and bunkers down… )
I Do :p
It’d be hilarious if GRRM has just been diddling with us and it turns out to be of no significance at all 😀 ( a very slim prospect, I know)
No offense, but in the pic of Alfie and Carice, whatever the hell Carice is wearing, it looks like a damn fluffy bathrobe. Sophie looks chic as usual, but I love Maisie’s outfit.
I just sincerely hope Sansa’s story arc this year really delivers. If only GRRM could liven up her character in the books… I far prefer show-Sansa over book-Sansa.
Gah… when will they release the trailer? I was hoping today, since they released the season 5 trailer this time last year…
Sansa will be installed in Winterfell as the Queen in the North after the battle of the bastards! It is known!!
Looks like she just got out of bed…hmm: ” I’ll be in my bunk “
Rhaenys Stark, only the red carpet
http://www.nj.com/entertainment/index.ssf/2016/01/sag_awards_2016_when_channel_time_nominees.html
Isn’t GoT nominated for Stunt Ensemble as well?
A trailer would be good about now
Fienix,
I guess when you’re naked on TV a lot, you just wanna cover up in real life?
Red Viper of Dorne,
And Rickon and the Umbers are going to be okay with that?
That’s what I thought too. I hope her official clothes are under the bathrobe and this was some picture behind the scenes or something like that.
OMG, you’re right, it does look like a bathrobe!
Puts on fire retardant suit: I also agree with you about preferring show-Sansa over book-Sansa. I found that getting inside Sansa’s head made me like her less than her TV incarnation.
Good stuff.
A lot of people were mad at season 4 and 5 for building up Sansa’s agency and making it seem like she’ll finally become a true player in the game- only to fail collossaly and enter yet another psychopath’s horror story.
The way I’ve always seen it is that season 5 was Sansa being really bold and yet again being used as a piece (by Littlefinger, of course) and letting herself be manipulated. Which causes her to, yet again, become the powerless victim she was since season 1. Now throughout the season, she manages to manipulate Theon into joining her cause- again thinking she failed after he spills it to Ramsay, but actually being successful (as the Myranda thing proves at the very end).
It’s fair to say that now that she’s finally shaken off all the people that try to use her (Littlefinger, Cersei, the Tyrells, Lysa and so on) and reconnects with her past (Theon, and eventually some Northern Lords)- here is when she is bold enough to enter the game again, and I doubt she’ll fail the second time. She has all the tools she needs, and she’s smart enough and (tragically) experienced enough to use them to her own gain.
Ser Not Appearing in this Series,
…and when they’re ‘ginger’, they get to dig the latrines.
Ser Not Appearing in this Series,
I think the Mockingbird is about to go the way of the dodo.
Just a reminder.
COVER YOUR FILMING SPOILERS!!!
That would be…satisfying, but I think Littlefinger is Teflon.
REVENGE!
Is there any chance, due to the event tonight, that we might get something? At least an anouncement date for the trailer???
Tywin of the Hill,
🙂
“The Queen of the North” maybe? Or something similar? I’m down with that. In terms of the fandom, Sansa has always had her knights. #TeamSansa
The North Remembers♥
This is soooooo exciting
People saying I hope this season is good?
Umm are there any doubts ? Too funny man!!!!!
http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/news-photo/name-cards-are-displayed-during-rehearsals-at-the-22nd-news-photo/507417172
http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/news-photo/name-cards-are-displayed-during-rehearsals-at-the-22nd-news-photo/507417216
I just found these pics on getty…. i am ready for many beautiful people today!
That is correct my friend 🙂 An Award we haven’t lost yet lol don’t want to jinx it XD
Ser Not Appearing in this Series,
I feel like the moment she’s referring to is at least one Stark kid reunion. That’s at least how I interpret it.
As long as it’s not SanSan….
I think that it’s revenge, obviously. What main emotion did people have after S1, besides ‘Dragons ?!’? ‘Avenge Sean Bean,’ of course.
to be Honest there are quite a few people doubting it will be, of course I’m not one of them. but still, season 5 was a mixed bag, some hated it, some loved it, some didn’t like it as much as previous seasons but liked it regardless, and some people who thought it wasn’t very good, but a bad season of game of thrones is better then about 90 % of what comes on television. lol I’ve seen them all XD
Rygritte,
Yes! I think Sophie almost let “revenge” slip!
Matthew The Dragon knight,
Yeah I know
I just don’t get it :p
Jokes
I loved season 5
Number two overall 🙂
That’s what’s so great about the books and the show, you never feel like you’re being railroaded toward a single inevitable outcome. There are so many possibilities 🙂
I was about to comment something similar, the interviews she did not long before the season aired last year was what had me getting nervous for her character in S5, she wasn’t as unenthusiastic as she usually was. And the interview that EW published after it was revealed that they were going to be married (it was done a few weeks before the S5) she said she was broken-hearted etc, which is when I knew that it wasn’t going to be Sansa manipulating Ramsay.
So I’m glad to see that it at the very least won’t be as bad as last season for her.
I agree… I am not always a fan of her color choices but this was dead on. Beautiful ensemble!!
Jentario
That idea of Sansa returning to her roots could be a key theme this year, with Dany and other characters also.
Matthew The Dragon knight, I think part of the disappointment associated with S5 is everyone was really looking forward to the storylines in S6 and some thought those plots were cut. I never doubted.
Ser Not Appearing in this Series,
I think she meant since Sansa has been silently taking the base for 5 seasons, and we have all been waiting for her to finally snap, and stick a corkscrew in someone.
Lyanna_Targaryen, Good guess, but at this point, I’d say that’s second to seeing Sansa royally fuck somebody up.
Maggie, Those chairs look incredibly uncomfortable.
“For the night is dark and full of uncomfortable dress clothes! Fetch my bathrobe at once!” 😀 Love it.
And good to hear from Sophie. Sansa better kick some Bolton butt this season. I think she would do well as the hardened badass Queen of the North.
Dwm,
I hope she doesn’t “snap” I hope she coldly calculates the demise of a house or three.
Boltons will f*cking die!!!!!
Lonely Cat,
Haha that’s right
r-hard,
Sophie darling you did everything except helping me getting through this 85 days easier! And the trailer won’t be anything different, just making the wait harder than it is still we need it so bad.
REVENGE IS COMING!!!
… And someone reminding me of “if you think this has a happy ending you haven’t been paying attention” in 3…2…1
Grailking,
Yes, I suppose “snaps” was the wrong wording. I meant more along the lines of finally taking control, rather than being pushed around.
Looks like this season all the Sansa fans are going to be happy!
Angela,
I hope that Ramsay survives season 6 somehow and he’ll escape from the North to going to the Riverlands for some Frey helping. But they’re destroyed already as well. And Ramsay escaping from there too and meanwhile he just run into Nymeria’s pack who will eating him…very slowly.
Maisie is such an itty bitty powerhouse and yaaaay Sansa, kick some butt with style! Sorry, I just have a slight motherly thing toward the Stark girls.
Wait a sec….did not Sansa already get a really, really big one last season, courtesy of Ramsay?
Arthur,
I keep telling myself this you know, that this season we (who passionately loves her) will be rewarded for our patience over this past years and all of that childish hatred towards her.
Fingers crossed for another brilliant season.
As a ginger, I can assure you we’re much too good for that. You know nothin’. 😉
Also, Lord Davos, definitely agree with you regarding a common theme of “returning to one’s roots. I think the trials and tribulations of past seasons – training, per se – is going to finally come to fruition for the main characters (Jon, Dany, Tyrion, Arya, Sansa, Bran). They’ll use their successes and failures to finally help them move towards what they’ve been seeking since season 1!
Chimeny,
2 more weeks I’d say
Sansa’s arc SHOULD be dramatically different – because she was shoe-horned into the Jayne Poole arc last season and went backwards (although I think the choice was the right one). The transition will be that much more awkward – she’s got a big rebound to get done!
We all know she’s going to rock this season! She will find Rickon, summon the Northern Lords to Jon and be Queen Elizabeth with a pack of Direwolves at her heels (including Nymeria warged by Arya). That is my hope. Shhh… it’s not too much. Too much is for her to also be wearing the sexiest Goth armour (a la Final Fantasy Lightning) and be riding a Unicorn, with the Hound, Davos and Jaime at her side.
….and then, because it’s GoT she will die on us. Arghh….
Tywin of the Hill,
Hmmm… Monty Python, Firefly and Jon Snow’s mother provocation…
Is that you Jay? You sound like my brother….
Turncloak,
I agree – It seemed that some of the events in S5 were just wedged in for “another big moment” and didn’t really fit with the ongoing story. Hopefully, the writers learned from some of the complaints last season on that front.
Rygar,
Not thinking Ramsay has a really, really big one. If he did, he wouldn’t be so angry.
ladywolfsbane,
I do hope she learned at least something from Cersei and wears some armor
Kit and Rose smooching in LA… for those who care lol
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-3424527/Game-Thrones-stars-Kit-Harrington-Rose-Leslie-share-kiss.html
plop_plop,
Awwwww now I’m dreaming of their cute ginger babies 😛
I love how the Daily Fail always makes it sound like they’re announcing something huge, when those 2 have been on and off for years. 😀 Rose is looking good! She’s always been incredibly thin, but she doesn’t look quite as breakable as she did for awhile there. Love boho skirts – wish I could wear them!
Rygritte,
Agreed, terrible seats and seating arrangement for an awards show as SAG. Looks almost like one for a local county awards show at some Ramada Inn banquet hall.
plop_plop,
Yea! TV’s perfect couple back together, need to come up with a name for them.
tyjon,
“Eleanorsby” maybe? Using their middle names… the first names would only work as “Krose” lol
tyjon,
I believe the same commonly used amongst those who follow the couple is “Leslington”.
She’s not going to die. She is going to kill.
tyjon,
My thoughts, too. Looks like a typical cheap conference setting. At least the table covers look a little better.
That seriously lowers the probability of that mega-spoiler scene being real, where Sansa supposedly
I don’t think she can command respect while still married to Ramsay (or equivalently, while Ramsay continues to exist).
That’s great news. And I really hope those people who thought Sansa went backwards last season would realize that she did not lose her internal strength and does not resemble Jeyne Poole in any way (except being married to Ramsay). I had a really nasty comment war on Youtube about that with someone called Captain Canada.
Game of Thrones won the stunt ensemble award. Mad Max won it for the movies.
Pigeon,
I always felt bad for Rose in the beginning when he wouldn’t even stand next to her in cast photos.
http://cdn2-b.examiner.com/sites/default/files/styles/image_content_width/hash/6c/8c/6c8c6f960c7c917c89f9fdbc37c46610.jpg?itok=NGHTk_Jl
And then after they broke up the first time, a reporter asked her on the red carpet what kind of women Kit likes.
crimethink,
Maybe it was a vision scene.
Lord Parramandas,
I disagree. She fell completely back into the role of damsel in distress. The few moments of independent agency she showed (e.g. taunting Ramsay about his bastardy) evaporated almost instantly in the face of Ramsay’s next dirty deed. After her Prince Charming failed to show up and save her in the last episode, she immediately gave up and headed back to her cell to continue being Ramsay’s punching bag.
The writers are going to have to do a ton of work undoing last season’s arc for her to credibly become a strong character. The sad thing is that she was well on her way to being a player in the game at the end of Season 4. I know the writers said they put her into Jeyne’s place because they had nothing else for Sansa to do and didn’t want to lose Sophie Turner, but I think if they had let her take a year off it would have been better than what they did in S5. It’s a good thing for Bran Stark that Isaac Hempstead Wright isn’t an actor in demand, otherwise he probably would have been brutalized by somebody last season too.
Michel says next season will be bigger and better. What they normally say.
crimethink,
She later escaped her cell by herself and lit the candle by herself, so she hardly just crumbled.
FreeParking,
I’d like to see at least one actor promise the season will be smaller and lower-quality than the previous one, just for laughs.
Michiel Huisman very nervous answering whether he fears “to die” next season at the red carpet.
Sophie killing it on the SAG carpet: https://www.instagram.com/p/BBLpTnTJCki/
plop_plop,
Rose turned up on last week’s Downton Abbey to reprise her role. Totally took me aback remembering that show was where I first saw her.
Well, don’t know if it’ll be that, but this comment pairs up well with Liam Cunningham’s “Sansa will be on a hell of an arc this year” comments from last year. Looking forward to it…And there will be, I presume, some sort of Stark reunion this season, some permutation of Sansa-Jon-Rickon, plus maybe a “telepathic” assist from Bran…not necessarily in that order.
I couldn’t disagree more. Jeyne is completely different and you have to be a mastermind to manipulate Ramsay. He is one of the most cunning characters on TV (save for LF, Varys and probably Tyrion). And she was on her way to escape. She stole that corkscrew while Ramsay was mentally tormenting her. She managed to penetrate Theon’s Reek personality and she learned that Bran and Rickon are still alive, which may prove to be integral information. Taunting Ramsay about his bastard status planted the seed of doubt in him which may cause him to turn against his father next season, thus weakening the Boltons.
The producers have planned this storyline since season 2 so moving her to WF was not some quick decision. They’ve stated that Sansa did not lose any of her internal strength last season which means that Ramsay did not break her and if you have failed to notice that… well I advise you to rewatch the series. Taking a year off would be a terrible decision in my opinion.
The dress looks lovely, not digging the hair though.
Sean C.,
They should just draw words out of a bowl. “Next season is crunchy.”
She looks Beautiful 🙂
Carice van Houten to the italian press: “You will see her in her element this season. Winter brings out the best of her”. I don’t think the reporter got a word of what she said!
You’re basing that on what?
In truth, we have no idea where Sansa was going after calling for help didn’t work, because the show didn’t think it important to communicate that. So she could have been trying to sneak back to her room, or…something.
😀 oh God yes!!!
for some reason that put a smile on my face XD
Congrats to @gameofthrones on the win for Outstanding Action Performance by a Stunt Ensemble in a Series! #SAGAwards ?
wait wait wait ? it won ? I don’t understand. The awards didn’t start yet did it ?
I meant that escaping her room was a sign of her strength (or at least the sign that she wasn’t broken). I know that she possibly tried to return to her room unnoticed because that would have probably been her best chance. At that time, she couldn’t escape through the main gate because several bolton soldiers returned from battle.
I’m fine for Sansa to have a great season, so long as it isn’t at the expense of Dany and Arya’s storylines – again.
Aww, Pedro and Sophie (and Sarah Paulson) on the red carpet: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CaAZ9vCVIAQckXc.jpg
Just saw Gwendoline Christie! She is stunning and oh my god SO tall.
They already announced it?
Jack Bauer 24,
I think that award is not televised?
that’s what I’m saying, why not wait for the awards…..
I would have jumped for joy to have them announce that 🙁
According to this article, they announce the stunt awards on the red carpet pre-show rather during the show: http://www.sanluisobispo.com/entertainment/celebrities/article57483803.html
And in which season did that happen? I think Arya and Sansa are on the same level of importance, at least on the show. And judging solely from reports of season 6, I would say Sansa’s story is more significant this season.
who else besides me are watching the Sag awards on television ?
Is it on TNT?
Matthew The Dragon knight,
Because they know that the audience doesn’t care about stuntmen (unfortunately).
Mad Max won the movie award, of course (Kris Tapley at Variety remarked that had it gone to any other movie, he would expect a considerable portion of the telecast would have to be dedicated to justifying that choice).
Sansa’s story could have been told in 7 episodes last season easily. There were other storylines that needed explaining or better development but they didn’t have time because they don’t divide the timing right.
I’m fine with it being significant so long as they remember that Arya and Dany are significant as well and their stories need to be told too. And I am saying this as someone who doesn’t give a crap about the Dany storyline.
I so hope Sophie Turner isn’t over-hyping Sansa’s role this year. I hope this year is awesome for her and she sticks it to Ramsay Bolton. She can’t have her own agency whilst still married to that psycho. #TeamSansa!
YES 🙂 that’s the channel i’m watching on 😀
Why was it important to communicate a minor detail like that?
Er, how did Sansa’s storyline detract from either Daeny’s or Arya’s? Sansa’s beefed-up story detracted from Theon’s, obviously: but Theon’s not as important a character as Sansa is, at least on the show, and very probably in the books. At any rate, they had to shoehorn Sansa into the Crows/Dragons story somehow.
AryaArya,
The only appearance that she made that wasn’t necessary to the plot they had chosen to tell was in episode 4 (and that was pretty clearly exposition they wanted to include for other reasons). If anything, the whole Winterfell plot suffered because it virtually dropped out of the final three episodes (where it has about six minutes total); Theon, especially, suffered as a result of that.
I don’t see how Sansa’s screentime negatively affected Arya or Dany last season, anyway. If anybody negatively affected Dany’s screentime in her story it was Tyrion, and with Arya they seemed to be struggling to even fill out her story, based on what they did with the time allotted (which I found weird; there was easily more that could have been mined out of those chapters that would have been more compelling than what was put onscreen).
Wimsey,
I never said that it necessarily was important, only that the show didn’t think it was, and thus we don’t know it. Arguably, seeing as the proponents of this story argue that it shows Sansa developing and making her own decisions, it would be rather nice to know what she was going to do next now that the escape plan delivered to her by others had failed, since either choice (go back or try to escape herself) would have rather different implications for where she was, mentally, at that point.
Wow, that’s a burn! :/
Such a stunning young lady
Gwendoline Christie: “Watching actors of the caliber of Michelle Fairley, Ian McShane and David Bradley interact on set is a personal masterclass for me. This season is the most powerful for all of the characters”.
Yes I agree with Tyrion taking over Dany’s storyline and them messing up Arya’s even with the time allotted but we are talking about Sansa in this thread and so I didn’t put them in.
Don’t even get me started on Cersei (an even less important character) hogging up the screen time.
My issue is really more with placement. Since season 4 their editing and pacing has been a series of bad choices.
But how they handled Sansa’s storyline last season (a little bit in each episode) is how they should be handling the main characters storylines every season.
You can’t leave a main character out for two eps in a row in a 10 ep season. You lose momentum on that storyline and you lose your drawing power for future episodes.
Maisie Williams just made it into the SAG awards noms with 6 episodes for the second year in a row. I’m sorry, but for the actress playing Arya Stark one of the main protagonists in this show, that is verging on disrespectful of the producers to have reduced her to a sideline.
In fact on another board I was reading that she now has the same ep count as Jorah. Perhaps Wimsey could start talking about a Big 7.
Hannah Murray:
https://twitter.com/AwardShowNews/status/693582868652650496/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw
Very yellow.
Pablo,
Where was this?
Gwen said that at SAG ?
Pablo,
Wait, WHAT?
AryaArya,
Episode count is not a very good means of measuring character importance, past a certain point. Jorah is an important supporting character who spends the season with, variously, Tyrion and Dany, two of the leads. Obviously his episode count is high. That’s also why the Ensemble nominees tonight include a bunch of random Night Watch people who were little more than extras but appeared in lots of scenes with Jon and/or Sam, but is missing people like Natalie Dormer and Kerry Ingram.
Arya’s carrying her own storyline, largely unconnected to everything else. If anything, it’s a sign of her importance that she’s the only Stark sibling whose AFFC/ADWD story was actually adapted. Sansa got Jeyne’d and Bran dropped offscreen entirely.
FreeParking,
RAI News (Italy). Nikolaj was interviewed also but he didn’t say anything about season 6.
Thanks!
I know, I know. It’s just two years of frustration with them sidelining Arya for the Hound show and then whatever the hell last year was.
I just hope they find a way to balance the storylines this season. For all characters.
r-hard,
Can’t decide which way I would prefer for Ramsay to die — being torn apart by Wun Wun, eaten by Nymeria and her pack, or stabbed by Sansa with the giant needle necklace.
Why does Sansa ‘deserve respect’? For suffering? Is Sophie saying that Sansa ‘commands the respect that she deserves’ because she is a Stark and hence deserves respect or something?
I am guessing that the show is going to overcompensate and go overboard propping up Sansa this season after the ranting last year over her rape. She will probably go charging into the battlefield with the Northern lords and be Queen in the North and all that.
Can Someone say Still undefeated for Outstanding Action Performance by a Stunt Ensemble in a Comedy or Drama Series 😉
Okay on to SAG dresses.
Like: Sophie’s, Maisie’s and Gwendonline’s. Yay to Gwendoline finally not wearing a designer sheet!
Dislike: Emilia Clarke – bad fit in the bodice.
Have we seen any other ladies?
plop_plop,
Aw that just made my day.
SerNoName,
deserve respect for being a human being (same like everyone else) – not to be brutalized on whim.
SerNoName,
I always figured that a person had to do something to earn respect, not just demand it, but hey.
And just like that, the season took 10 steps backwards.
Pablo,
WHAT? Is this a joke?
plop_plop,
Krose before hoes as they say. Sorry couldn’t resist.
Lonely Cat,
I’d like the ”Nymeria and her pack way” because that would be ironic for Ramsay who hunted for his victims with dogs.
what’s so funny about it ?
Yeah some1 better confirm or denye this already.
Lord Parramandas,
Well i hope that you’re at least having fun talking and debating about all of this because i’m telling you my friend it won’t work, it’s as simple as that and that’s why you don’t see me doing it. You and me and others like us we have a very different mindset in compare to them when it comes to sansa and specially those subjects related to the show.
Gwen confirming MF is back will be a misquote, and YET ANOTHER of the million red Stoneheart red herrings, just you watch … the fates know know pity on her account, trust me.
Plus, no way Gwen would be so stupid as to confirm that. She probably innocently said words to the effect of: “watching actors like Michelle (i.e: generally across the seasons) and McShane/Bradley this year has been a masterclass for me” and someone’s made a judicious edit to bait the LSH truthers again. Not accusing teh person who made the op who may have heard it 2nd hand, but long story short …. they do it mercilessly every year …at any/every opportunity … and with increasing believability/ingenuity.
I mean, come on. No way Gwen would practically confirm the storyline of her latter season episodes any more than saying “interacting with Stephen Dillane was a masterclass for me!” prior to season 5 last year.
I.E: Another hoax, or your money back.
Pablo,
Link? I am not believing it until I see proof or someone I trust confirms it.
Freeparking, do you seriously think that, after being trained with the rest of the cast in keeping mum on spoiling plot points for years, Gwen has just confirmed a long dead character’s return to the biggest TV show in the world at a massive public form like the SAG?
The internet would have probably gone nuts already
Forget about it being true; you’ll set yourself up to be burned. 100% hoax, or canny misquote.
I am taking the girl at her word this season. Of course, every season the whole cast talks about it being a “big” season for their character. I have to believe it this time. Have to. Five seasons of Sansa being a pawn, a victim, is more than enough. Just when it feels like the powers that be are letting Sansa assert some power over her own destiny, it turns to piss. She hasn’t had much luck and I want to see her own this shit…as in, she is the lead in her story. Just please, get her the hell away from LF and Ramsey.
So…is this the season where they actually mean it when they say things like “the biggest” “the best” “amazing” “bigger”, etc?
Damien,
No, I don’t. Hence my I want to see proof post.
Damien,
I watched all the interviews and I am pretty sure she meant Michelle Fairley in seasons 1-3, not season 6.
Hannah Murray is such a stunner.
Pablo,
Downton Abbey wins for ensemble.
Red Viper of Dorne,
it is known, but you forgot a baby stark/bolton that is coming.
Revenge for the Starks!
Anon,
Sansa is his second wife. It’s Tysha he most wants to be with.
Thank god…
These are the type of comments I always write. My opinion, supported by arguments and facts. Anything else feels incomplete to me. And I have every right to voice my opinion, don’t I?
So she didn’t say/imply MF was in season6 then, Pablo?
Well, blow me down …
Wish you’d said that in the first place, though …
One thing I think I’ll enjoy this season – it should bring Sansa and Arya closer together. Arya
. Conversely, it seems that Sansa will
, which so far has been Arya’s specialty.
My ideal end for the girls would have them sitting together doing a Legolas and Gimli about who killed whom among their enemies (‘Joffrey’, ‘Walder Frey and all the other Freys, too’, ‘Littlefinger’) , so anything that brings them closer to understanding each other is fine in my books.
I’m scared everytime some of the actors say things as “big”, “shock” or stuff like that. It doesn’t always end well.
As for Sophie and regarding her past declarations… I don’t expect anything for this season at all. Probably be summoned to Jon’s plot this time and to add horror and shock,
.
Her character is the plot driver to the rest, and when it’s not, they make it happen. If they wanted to progress her plot/development as a player, maybe she should had been cut entirely like Bran last season. Or if they wanted the character around for a while, a couple of scenes at the Eerie hinting
would have been enough.
Yes! Though I enjoyed their chemistry onscreen, Arya was reduce to snarky one liners and they cut her trauma and sadness…
It would be traumatic. And become an argument at the “I left the Hound die” part XD
As you know, I personally detest the idea of SanSan and find it vomit-inducing and absolutely atrocious. That said, setting personal views aside, I think you’ll agree that show Sansa is much less connected to the Hound than the book one is. Hence… no chance. 😀
Yaga,
Thank god.
Those ”theories” make me want too barf.
The tree man…
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jan/31/bangladesh-tree-man-abul-banjadar-surgery?CMP=fb_gu
OH SHUT UP!!!! I seriously can’t trust anything the actors have to say.
She said the same last year and look what happened. I bet they’re going to rape or sideline her again.
The writers clearly can’t write female character and I hope this show fails miserably.
Might as well kill her off already.
plop_plop,
Shopping and kissing, Rose and Kit are adorable! I hope they stay together.
AryaArya,
I also liked those dresses: 1. Sophie’s; 2. Maisie’s; 3. Gwendoline’s. I think Carice’s would be very nice without the jacket which was so like a lab coat, as someone has very well put it.
dothrakian raven,
Da fuck,man this world sure is stranger than i thought it was .
PhilyG,
I also hope you leave this site and never post again but hey we can’t get all that we want in life .
She never said that last time and she definitely wasn’t sidelined. She had more screentime than in any previous season, especially 1-3. And I don’t understand what would a hate-watcher like yourself follow a fansite.
No chance at all in the show, but you know… The shipping power is endless and twisted XD. Anyway, I think they’re gonna do
this season. She’s like an intercheable doll.
Well, technically having screen time doesn’t mean being meaningful. Look at Brienne or any dornish character or Myrcella last season. Or Daenerys and her “where are my dragonzzzz” XD
Really, really s…l…o…w…l…y and painfully please! 😀
Ok so most people think it’s probably just incorrect but if by any (likely very slim) chance the quote from Gwendoline Christie is about the three actors working together, rather than doing things separately, or even a misunderstanding of what she said by whoever reported it,
Lulus Mum,
The character most fans (myself included) believe will be embodied by Ian McShane has never met that lady, I am sure of it, but has to interact with Brienne. I think Gwendoline refered to great actors she had shared/ would share scenes with.
Shy Lady Dragon,
Afternoon Your Shyness *waves* 😀 Thanks for that. I knew it was probably unlikely but thought I’d mention it as
PhilyG,
When was Sansa raped? If you are referring to the scene in Ramsays bedroom with Theon present, well, the only thing that would have made THAT scene MORE romantic would have been having Brian Adams sing “Heaven” in the background. Or maybe Michael Bolton singing “Can I Touch You There”? Yes, yes you can.
I too hope this show fails. So that I can start jamming again to 80s and 90s sexy saxophone rock every Sunday night with my old band mates. Its been far too long. Bring me a Higher Love. Woah O.
Rygar,
It was acceptable in the 1180s
PhilyG,
I will never understand you people. This site’s opinions and rules are very well known.
Why someone would loose their time to post something like this is beyond me.
SlayerNina,
Your paranoia over her is beyond ridiculous.
For someone who complains so much over how they don’t write women right, you are quick too treat her as an object now that she was raped.
Like women who where raped cannot live their life anymore or that now they are worthless after being abused….
Rygritte,
Sexy sax? Because that shit should never, ever, be considered “acceptable” by any means.
I know, but some sing it like a Calvin Harris song.
Lord Parramandas,
Of course you have every right to discuss your opinions, you totally misunderstood me my friend maybe you should read my reply to you again.
I never meant to insult you and in fact i’m shocked that you felt insulted but nonetheless i’m so so sorry for that, it was never my intention.
Lulus Mum,
Hi Mum how is everything? I hope great, wanted to say that i just saw your response to me in PGA thread few days ago, you know about my exams and that you’re incredibly kind and i’m so grateful for it. Have fun love you.
Rygritte,
I can’t believe you did.
Shy Lady Dragon,
Hey Shy Lady how’s everything? Hope you’re doing fine surviving the long wait till April, i just saw your reply to me about my exams few days ego in that PGA post, well thank you sooooo much for your kindness and believe me it means a lot to me.
Lord Parramandas,
Agreed. If the audience is rooting for the ‘badasses’ (e.g. Dany, Arya) to emerge triumphant, they might just be in for a nasty surprise. Sansa has a different approach to ‘the game’ than Arya, but that doesn’t mean it’s necessarily bound to be less successful. While Arya tends to dive headlong into dangerous situations (e.g. if the Hound hadn’t restrained her, i.e. knocked her out with an axe, at the Red Wedding, she may have met her untimely end), Sansa’s sojourn in King’s Landing, and with LF/the Boltons, has taught her the value of being more circumspect, gathering info/intel, biding her time, and playing ‘the long game.’
What’s more, in the interim, Sansa has also become far more adept at playing ‘the lying game’ than Arya, for all her Faceless Men training. (Remember, Maester Aemon’s wonderful retort to Alliser Thorne’s sarcastic query, ‘You always know when a man is telling a lie. How did you acquire this magical power?’ Maester Aemon: ‘I grew up in King’s Landing.’ The same can be said for Sansa.)
As Tyrion remarks, not without a certain awe, ‘Lady Stark, you may survive us yet.’ She has armored herself in courtesy. For all her auburn Tully looks, she is a Queen of Winter. She is ice, and ice preserves. I’m not so sure of Arya, or Dany.
SerNoName,
It is possible, you know, for a person to hit ‘rock-bottom,’ and to nevertheless emerge, having learned a few bitter, important lessons along the way (we can probably include Jon in this…) GRRM reworks a lot of archetypes from Star Wars, as well as Dune, and ‘the sleeper must awaken’…This doesn’t necessarily exclude Sansa; it’s just taking her longer to open her eyes:
LF: ‘There is no justice in the world. Not unless we make it.’
There is no respect. Not unless we demand it.
There is no freedom. Not unless we take it.
Sansa is a less flashy character than Dany, and lacks the convenient ‘Deus ex machina’ of a dragon to rescue her from her metaphorical ‘Daznak’s pit.’ As a consequence of her ‘passive participant’ (in)actions, she lost Lady, so Sansa’s transformation since then has had to be a purely internal, uphill battle, which I find more interesting to watch.
Sansa (not only Bran) is the chained, winged wolf. She will take flight– without a dragon– whether her detractors like it or not.
I would argue that the fact that the show’s telling of the story included Sansa and created a storyline for her instead of omitting her (as the Crows/Dragon’s story essentially does) is a sign that Sansa (or at least Show!Sansa) is going to be important in the end. If we had just the books on which to go, then it would be very debatable whether Sansa is going to be important in the end. After all, there is a reason why so many of us had dismissed her as little more than a prolonged 3rd part PoV!
Sansa underwent major character evolution last year. Based on just the books, I had concluded that Sansa was never going to be an important character in the series: she showed zero evolution through the first three stories, and just when she showed signs of starting to evolve, GRRM dropped her out of the fourth story.
One thing that GRRM does (and the show replicates) is dynamic development through cathartic situations. Well, Sansa’s gotten that in spades now, at least on the show. And in the show (unlike in the books), it has not just burned away the old character: we’ve seen new sides to her emerging from the ashes. In some ways, I am most curious to see where she is going: M,B&W have made the character trajectories of the other major characters pretty plain as we get towards the final act: but owing to the very late onset of Sansa beginning to evolve, her trajectory is much less obvious than theirs, at least to me.
(I also think it very possible that Book!Sansa will never be anything more than a glorified 3rd party PoV: the dimensions that Show!Sansa has taken might never be seen on page.)
The dragons are not Deus Ex Machina. The Drogon gun was hung early in the season and fired at the end. That is what good storytellers do with their plots: set up the pieces, and then make them all click at the culmination of a story. Daeny’s bond with Drogon is part of Daeny’s character: and the time and effort she devoted to Drogon throughout the series (book and show) is having payoff.
I don’t think Sophie was exaggerating or lying this time because it seems very likely that she will be the one to call the banners, with the help of Jon and Davos, and then rally the Northern Lords and convince them to fight for Jon and the Stark cause in Snowbowl. It’s also possible that Davos is with her in those scenes since he went to White Harbor in the books and we had the casting call for the character that likely matches Wyman Manderly. Sansa, Davos, and the Northern Lords could maybe meet in White Harbor or someplace that isn’t Winterfell while Jon is in the Gift with Tormund and the wildlings strategizing for the battle. It will also be interesting to see Sophie showcase her range because I don’t think she’s had a lot of standout moments besides her testimony to the Lords of the Vale and a few other scenes. So I’m quite excited for her arc in S6.
Lulus Mum,
Interesting idea, but I still think that those two characters have never had any chance to meet. Good afternoon to you, too! *waving*
Daughter of Winter,
Hi, sweet Winter child! I’m so glad if my words made a little difference! I remember how much I used to shiver before exams, no matter how well prepared I was and I wish every student were braver.
April is still too far, but my boss seemed determined to help me, so I got so much work that I don’t have time to get bored or frustrated. Being an GOT addicted I still spend time every day on this site, because… you know!
This:
and this:
TV and movie audiences tend to get restless when a character is playing the long game, because it’s not actiony enough. But if the actors are good enough to convey their internal processes on their faces (case in point: Alexander Siddig), that can end up being much more powerful drama than the stabby/burny/explody bits. While not thrilled with Sansa’s Season 5 detour into yet-more-victimization, I am holding out hope that she has learned her lessons well enough to gain gradual control over many situations in the North by playing her cards close to her chest. It would be lovely if it turns out that her twitting Ramsay about a competing heir turns out to be a calculated move to destabilize House Bolton rather than just a fleeting fit of adolescent rebelliousness.
Shy Lady Dragon,
Haha I’m so glad that your boss is on good terms with you, good luck with all the works. Your words my lady are sweeter than honey, always filling me with joy and i’m so grateful that i can interact with someone as sweet as you here, seriously it means a lot since you know i’m pretty much alone in my life.
Also i must say that despite what my user name might suggest i’m not a girl, daughter of winter refers to sansa who is my top favorite.
Simon,
Oh yeah, in the book. I was referring to the show.
Wimsey,
The narrative devices are clear. However, the dragons are far more than an extension of her character; they are also intimidating weapons of mass destruction that enable Dany to bully her way out of intractable situations. The ‘deus-ex-machina’ point I was making was about internal vs. external rescue/growth. I find the quiet, though electric, subtext of Sansa having to negotiate her way through the ‘minefield’ of dinner with the Boltons (which required the subtlety and intelligence of acting talents like McElhatton and Turner, who are actually capable of a range of shifting expressions to go with the dialogue) more engaging than the blunt instrument of Targaryean pyrotechnics (which required a green dummy and Clarke, scantily dressed, and staring off into the distance, as usual).
It’s interesting how GRRM (along with D&D, following his lead) relentlessly punishes Sansa for her every indiscretion, yet coddles Dany with plot armor. And now, when things couldn’t get any worse, and she just flew away from her responsibility– Enter Tyrion (complete with spymaster-in-tow)– another deus ex machina
— to rule the roost, and sort out the mess she left behind:
‘…they must be trained as well, or they will lay my kingdom waste. For all her Targaryen blood, Dany had not the least idea of how to train a dragon.’
Daughter of Winter,
Thanks for your beautiful words, good ser! What a wonderful thing this community is, don’t you think? There are always interesting things to discuss with nice people.
My boss is, indeed, a good person, but I was joking when I said that he meant to help. It just happens that this time is hectic at the institute and, as a result, I got more work to do than I used to a month ago. I’m pretty sure my boss has never heard of GOT and, in the slim possibility that he has, he would never dream that one of his serious and mature employees spends so much time worrying about a mere show which, above all, it’s a fantasy!
So, you admire Sansa so much, that you chose your user name after her! It’s only natural, I think. I hope she’ll have more luck in season 6. I suppose people would believe my favourite is Dany. I just happen to be fascinated by dragons. Actually I’m a Stark supporter and my favourite characters are Tyrion, Brienne and Jaime.
If that is indeed the case, it would be a typical Littlefinger move, wouldn’t it?! (causing chaos to erupt within the status quo, by playing off the parties against each other, targeting their weak spots in a seemingly offhand manner, and watching for an opening). The uncharacteristic expression of smug menace that came over Sansa’s face during the dinner with the Boltons, when she correctly identified Ramsay’s vulnerability, namely his prickly unease at the announcement of his stepmother’s pregnancy, makes me think she’s learned her Littlefinger lessons; it was a calculated move!
Daughter of Winter,
Hello Wintery one *waves* 😀 I’m fine thanks, hope you are too, especially now the dreaded exams are over! When do you get the results? I’m doing some work at home so popping over to this site every couple of hours for a break as the report I’m checking is pretty hard going.
Currently entertaining myself imagining Ramsay and Littlefinger getting everything they so richly reserve and it would be very cathartic for our girl to have at least some involvement. It’s not going to happen but I like to pretend Sansa will suddenly snap and out-Ramsay Ramsay, going completely psycho on him. His gurgled drowning in his own blood final words will be “wow lady, that was over the top!” in horrified awe at what she’s done to him. Oh dear, watching this programme has turned me into a homicidal maniac! 😉
Shy Lady Dragon,
Whaaaaaat? I thought GoT was a documentary! 😉
I would love to see a scene which mimicked Ned Stark’s arrest for treason in Season 1, but this time with Littlefinger with the knife to his throat and Sansa in the Cersei role.
Shy Lady Dragon,
WotW is great indeed, it’s actually like my second family and it’s greatest strength might be the fact that you’ll see nice open minded people so much more than annoying ones here and this is so important for me specially when i look at other ASOIAF/GOT websites.
Haha of course i realized that you were joking about your boss and am glad to hear that he’s a good man, again good luck with all the extra works.
Yep i love her immeasurably and despite this fact you rarely see me going into discussions and debates over her and her storyline and that’s simply because I’ve had enough of all this ignorance and misunderstandings towards her (specially among those who seemingly supports her) so i choose silence most of the time anyway. (not that i’m saying that i understand better than others oh god not at all, it’s just my opinion shy lady)
And of course i’m totally team stark, Jon and arya are my second and third favorites. and Tyrion well everyone loves him, you know what they say, there are two kinds of people in this would those who love tyrion and those who don’t watch game of thrones so there is that my lady.
Ps: Who is not fascinated with dragons?
Lulus Mum,
Hey Mum it’s 01:12 am where i live and i can’t sleep haha but it’s totally usual for me, anyway the results are already in and thank the lord they were way better than i expected myself so there is that.
Tell me that you’re making cookies, something tells me that your cookies are excellent i might travel this thousands of miles distance between us just to try them out. (sorry for feeling a bit too comfortable with you)
And don’t worry mum, after 5 seasons this show turned us all into homicidal maniacs i guess so fingers crossed for a gruesome death coming that bastard’s way.
Sounds like she will really come into her own as a figure whom the North rallies around
Not sure this will be the case in the book, I expect she is a figure who the Riverlands Lords rally around and she is based in Harrenhall but could go either way
I really dislike this notion (not a personal ‘attack’ on you, Summer Child, because A LOT of people say this same thing); that LF ‘taught’ her how to manipulate (or taught her anything for that matter). Perhaps you can make that argument in the books, but in the show, LF didn’t teach Sansa anything. She had already learned how to ‘manipulate’ people as far back as Season 2 when she saved Dontos life by telling Joffrey it was ‘bad luck’ to kill someone on his name day. She attempted to deceive LF in S3 by playing the, ‘I’d feel awful if something happened to you,’ role when she wanted to stay and marry Loras instead of going with him. She already figured out that LF killed Joffrey, before he confessed, and she played the Vale Lords on her own…without the prompting of LF or any of his machinations. Also, correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t recall a time–in any season–where LF tells her to find people’s weaknesses and play on them as she did by calling Ramsay a bastard and driving a potential wedge between him and his father/stepmother/future brother. Matter of fact, the only thing I can think that LF verbally ‘taught’ her was that, ‘money buys a man’s silence for a time; a bolt through the heart buys it forever,” (a lesson that hasn’t come into play yet), and that there’s, “no justice in this world. Not unless we make it,” (another lesson that hasn’t come into play yet).
Now, I’m not trying to say that LF’s role in her life isn’t important, because it is. And if she gets to killing people next season because she remembers that there is no justice in this world unless she makes it…then yes, we can say he ‘taught’ her something. But until then, I don’t think that notion can be applied to Show Sansa.
An earlier commentator mentioned that they prefered show Sansa to book Sansa, and I concur. For all of the talk about the show not giving her ‘agency’, I’m constantly surprised at the seeming dismissal of the fact that Sansa developed mentally and emotionally…on her own…without anyone’s ‘lessons’. Show Sansa doesn’t have to be taught how to world works by LF, she already knows/knew. The only thing left for her to do is own those lessons and put them into practice.
Side note: her words sound promising. There’s hope, my God, there’s hope!!! But I’m going to tame my expectations only for the sake of not ending up with a broken heart. I had high hopes for S5 and let me tell you, I’m still bitter as fuck about how her storyline developed. But alas, what’s done is done. It’s show canon now. Let me focus on the future….
So, what odds are we giving her that she kills Ramsay? 50/50? More/less? And if she does end up killing Ramsay, should we take that as the fulfillment of her prophesy (i.e. “Slay a savage giant in a castle made of snow”), or no?
RosanaZugey,
Well, book Sansa is more of an idiot… She needs those lessons.
In the show, I see LF as more of a transformative agent. Show Sansa, I think, needs to be released from her own inhibitions against using her innate skills. (After all, politics is so dirty and dishonourable. Daddy wouldn’t approve, no more than he would approve of Arya killing her way through her life, even though that is a very valuable skill as well, given the world.) Littlefinger releases these inhibitions. You can see that as an important, if tacit, lesson as well.
RosanaZugey,
LF to Sansa S4E5- first of his name.
Know your strengths, use them wisely one man can be worth 10,000.
Sansa knows manipulations, but LF does teach her things in what he says and what he doesn’t say, like at the inn before Brienne came to them, and Sansa assumed LF was getting remarried from his proposal was accepted; a more pointed reply from someone more skilled may have led to: and who’s the lucky Mrs.Baleish type question.
RosanaZugey,
Very sensible observations. Totally agree!
Given that last year Turner boasted of how in Season 5 Sansa would ‘learn to play the game’ and ‘take control’, and then Sansa spent the entire season trapped in Winterfell being repeatedly abused and rape, I would take this with a handful of salt.
Honestly, anything where one of the actors says ‘This is the best season yet! And my character is in a very interesting place this year!’ is just show-promoting guff not worthy of any real analysis.
They had done a great disservice to her character since the beginning. Like cutting all her scenes with Dontos to “ey, I’m gonna save you while you are silent”. Or the empathy she shows to the Hound making her being scared. Or making her being nice to Tyrion because he’s Tyrion. Or making her cry when in the book it’s plainly stated how she doesn’t cry at all. Show!Sansa was an inanimated object since the first episode and pushed in the background of someone else’s plot.
And yes, she’s screwed now because the only asset she really can use was her virginity (reading “she can be the wife of”), and the show has destroyed that too. Or it’s any doubt about Jon or LF will use her rape to give an empowering speech to the northern lords to rally to Winterfell?
RosanaZugey,
Interesting.
I seem to be seeing Sansa completely differently. Sansa in the books (and the show) is continually being used. That’s not to say she’s not learning tiny aspects about how to survive along the way, but it doesn’t change the fact that she’s been bounced from one “abuse” scenario to another (and I’d argue that doing whatever she can to please her captor doesn’t signify that she’s “learning” in any meaningful sense – she’s surviving, that’s all). Littlefinger is a manipulator who is grooming her both psychologically and sexually, in the process robbing her of her identity in order to build her up again to suit his own purpose. Will that purpose end up being mutually beneficial? Well… yeahhhh… to an extent. But what is the cost? (because this story has always been about cost) I strongly believe that whatever “power” Sansa acquires will largely be due to Littlefinger’s machinations. And her moment, her TRUE moment in the story will be when the other shoe drops and she finally sees him for what he is, and what he’s done to her, and to her family (even while building her up in the process). Because to what extent does power matter when it’s been handed to you by the person who ruined everyone and everything you love in the first place? That’s the interesting moral dilemma I think GRRM is setting Sansa up for.
Maybe that’s why I didn’t have such a huge problem with what they did to Sansa in Season 5. It was a version of what Littlefinger is doing to her in the books, just on speed. Perhaps D&D recognized that Sansa isn’t “safe” in the Vale in the books, thought the ways in which she’s being groomed there are too subtle to come across well on TV (fitting, since most don’t seem to pick up on it from what I’ve read online) and went with the WAY more overt scenario which shows that Sansa is out of her depth, still. We’ll see how it all ties together next season I guess!
For the spoiler pics, in the show the “Slay a savage giant” is more about
Plot armor is the pure definition of Dany, Jon, Arya and Tyrion. In some parts of the show (specially last season), is up to eleven. And they were also given some habilities noone knew they had, like summoning pet dragons with the power of love, kickass the Night King, magic changing faces and a counseil of a foreign country hoping you could rule them (and free sex) XD.
I’m on the “they killed Barristan so Tyrion could clean Dany’s mess alone” wagon too
I think the Deux ex Machina vibe comes more from the show’s point of view than the books. In the books, the dragon was already there killing people and Dany has to take action to pet him. In the show, it’s totally a DeM: she was already to die (after being saved by Jorah), close her eyes and boom! the dragon comes killing quite specifically her enemies XD
You know, for however much people like you sperg about stuff like this, I can’t really bring myself to care about anything of it. Maybe treat it as a caution that you’re exaggerating about this supposed damage to the character.
You really have a low opinion of her, lol, if you’re reducing her to her hymen. Was virginity Margaery’s only asset, too? No. Why should it be for Sansa?
Daughter of Winter,
I second that. She is very sweet! When I was new here Lady D was one who engaged and has made me feel welcome 🙂
SlayerNina,
I see what you’re trying to say, but that’s not a deus ex machina. Drogon, and his rocky relationship with Dany, was previously established. It didn’t just come out of nowhere.
Drogon appeared in S05E02 and the purpose of that scene was that he still cares for her. So is it really that weird for him to appear when she needed help?
Of course, I know it is almost impossible to reason with you.
Nice theory, but it’s still a dragon, not a dog. And it doesn’t attack Meereen or Dany’s friends, only Sons of the Arpy
Most of the characters are reduced or given character traits that are the opposite of their counterparts. And not just for the show’s sake, sometimes just because, since there’s no repercussion in the plot or the character itself. Why?
And Margaery was accused of treason and the main support of that was she was not a virgin. In the show, she consummed with Tommen on season 5, so the accusation of treason is based on her brother’s sexuality (and she lying). It’s not reducing, but who is or not virgin (and by extension, who is the father of their children) is important to the theme of the characters and the plot. Being the “Virgin” (thus, disposable bride) was one, if not the most important to Sansa. That’s why she’s being married/promised to married every season, that’s why they are trying to manipulate/save her. Plus, Margaery has the Tyrell support, a crown and Tommen. Sansa has nothing but Littlefinger. As long as he can marry her.
SlayerNina,
Wrong yet again.
Watch the scene again. Drogon clearly burns couple of unsullied.
ygriTTE,
Hello to you too good ser/lady, i’m so sorry but who are you talking about exactly? Lulus Mum?
I’ve checked ADWD. Drogon did not attack anyone in Daznak’s Pit until some fool attacked him. So you are wrong in this case. The only difference is that book Drogon came to feast on the corpses and show Drogon came to help Daenerys. Yes, he is not a dog but even more intelligent creature.
No ‘attack’ taken; it’s fun to discuss different perspectives! By ‘learning her lessons,’ I didn’t mean to imply that it had been someone’s intention to teach her. Littlefinger doesn’t see her as his apprentice; he wants to use her for his own purposes. In the process of gaining her trust, he just gets carried away, bragging about how clever he’s been, and amusing himself, watching her mind slowly tick over his nebulous ‘revelations.’
So, you see, just as she let him ‘into her castle,’ he’s unwittingly allowing her more than a glimpse into his (e.g. Lysa and the Moondoor), hence the lesson. Curiously, psychopaths not infrequently get an urge to ‘confide’ their half-truths to an audience, and who better to unload on than someone as powerless as Sansa, who is therefore perceived as unlikely to pose a threat (this over-confidence may yet prove his undoing…). I think he gets an extra perverse thrill sketching his schemes to someone who is essentially a victim of those schemes (the same way he explicitly warned Ned not to trust him, knowing full well he would inevitably double-cross him). Basically, he ‘rescued’ her from being put to death for a crime in which he’d implicated her as the primary suspect (with his characteristic cheer, he made her position quite clear to her on the boat out of KL)!
Someone mentioned that the two of them would make a great ‘power couple’; however, that would imply a marriage of equals, and LF definitely doesn’t consider her an equal partner, nor does he care for her. If you are in any doubt, just consider how he ‘secured’ her with the Boltons of all people, ‘so far from here, even Cersei Lannister can’t get her hands on you,’ then scurried to Cersei to report on her whereabouts!
So, he’s not really her mentor– although he’s led her to believe he is. Nevertheless, he’s one of several people who have introduced her to the world behind the mask, or rather a world of masks, hidden motivations, and shifting allegiances. This is the quintessential lesson every Stark needs to learn:
‘Look around you, we’re all liars here and every one of us is better than you.’
‘Always keep your foes confused. If they are never certain who you are or what you want, they cannot know what you are like to do next. Sometimes the best way to baffle them is to make moves that have no purpose, or even seem to work against you…I’d risk everything to get what I want.’
‘And what do you want?’
‘Everything.’
‘When you know what a man wants, you know who he is, and how to move him.’ (a neat summary of the lesson, although I’m not sure this particular line was in the show)
‘Better to gamble on the man you know than the strangers you don’t…. you think you know me?’
‘I know what you want.’
‘Do you?’
You’re right, there was no explicit instruction. However, LF did reiterate the concept of knowing what someone wants (see above), as a means towards anticipating their moves, and to predict how various parties would potentially relate to one another, a thought process previously alien to Sansa. When she tuned into the tension over the Bolton family pecking order, it not only gave her a handle on what Ramsay wants (to be recognized as Roose’s heir, and ultimately to dominate his father), but also on what moves Roose (he brooks no challenge to his authority, and obviously enjoys needling Ramsay with the legitimacy issue). Voila! Needle Ramsay about being a bastard; Ramsay needles Roose; and Roose needles Ramsay…Watch this space! I also think Sansa must’ve understood the painful dynamics of bastard vs. trueborn, in light of her own family history (witnessing the rivalries of Cat vs. Jon; Rob vs. Jon; and Jon’s distress), and applied this experience to her current situation.
Exactly! That’s where her arc is leading. It will be interesting to see how she reacts.
Well put. The story makes clear that ‘opening ones eyes’ always comes at a cost (Ned, Bran, Jaime, Arya, Theon, Dany, Jon, etc). I’m also intrigued to see what price Tyrion, everyone’s favorite slippery customer, will pay.
This doesn’t happen – it’s usually simply the delusions of people who interpret characters vastly differently than DnD that make them make these claims. Understandable, since these people often had spent a lot of time adhering to their version. But no less delusional. The essence of each main character, their narrative and basic conflict, remains the same.
I’ll grant you that at times, character evolution is sped up (as in the case of Stannis) or delayed (as in the case of Jaime). This is due to runtime and/or budget concerns – the necessity to create arcs for every important character every season.
Sansa is not her virginity, though, which is my point. I think that moving past it, past this apparent roadblock of the only thing people like you valued her for, should liberate her as a character – she’s free to move on with her plot now that she’s beyond that.
Your major fallacy here is the assumption that the entirety of Sansa’s story regards her virginity. It doesn’t. There’s more to it than that. Revenge. Reconnecting with family. Possibly coming to an understanding with her sister. Or possibly choosing to betray them once again, this time much more consciously than in the first season.
which is a hell of a lot more than what Ned, Robb, & Catelyn did.
I think D&D said that Dany was simply accepting her fate in that moment, but I like to think she was thinking about her babies/summoning Drogon.
That makes me sad & why I hope Sansa
Jon: [looks down] I’m sorry.
Sansa: You have nothing to be sorry….
Jon: I should’ve…. [emo tear]
Sansa: Then you would be dead, too. [cries & collapses in his arms]
Littlefinger: [flashes back to Brandon & Catelyn & turns green with envy]
already double-crossed him
In the books, that was the Hound.
Summer Child,
Oh please you are comparing a scenes of dinner and dragon flight ..seriously
Why don’t you go back where the series actually starts …abused and molested throughout the childhood.,used as pawn in other people games ., .,sold into a forced marriage and raped several times by her husband while at the embraces the culture in a way that ensures her survival ..
Or rape and abuse survival only counts when you are in season 5 or name stark behind it ..
How about you focus on the conversation of dany and daario about she is the only one with no choice or the conversation between tyrion and hizdar and dany during the fight ….or tyrion and dany conversation..
Instead of comparing dragon flight why can’t you take these scenes to compare when talking about a dinner scene ..
And talking about flying away and leaving the mess to clean up by someone else. ….you assume that …there is no reason to believe tyrion to succeed while dany failed ….eventually she will be the one cleaning up the messs with fire at the end of season ….wait and watch it …
Its not like characters don’t have luck or plot gifts …the so called virginty of sansa should be taken long ago…but she still has. ..so stop comparing to other characters with far more significant roles and compare them to characters on their level not above them …
SlayerNina,
If you read the books drogon appears the exact moment when she rejects meereen and its culture and removes the floppy ears …
Exactly how ghost appears when Jon is wondering whether he should accept stannis offer and take the name stark or be snow ..ghost appearing made him choose is decision …
It’s all about metaphorical in the books too ..
Angela,
Ha ha yes I am looking forward to the reaction on people’s faces to wun-wun. I reckon there will be alot of surprised faces this season from wun-wun to the white walkers and hopefully dragons as nearly everyone in westeros is clueless to all of the above and when they see them there will be some shocked faces, especially little finger. Also I wonder how varys hasn’t got wind of the white walkers yet, I thought he had spies everywhere
LOL, it’s really on point.
Daughter of Winter,
It’s really refreshing to see someone like you on the internet, I have seen alot of your comments and you are a considerate person and you are always the bigger person when arguments are close to arising which you quickly defuse
SlayerNina,
Making sansa cry on the show isn’t a bad thing, it is a TV show it adds drama and emotion. Her liking tyrion or showing a positive approach to tyrion is not forced he stuck up for her and he is a witty interesting guy who shows he has a heart, it doesn’t mean the writers are making her sideline on other characters stories. Most of this series is based on the Starks so she has a big part to play and with a huge list of main characters and storylines I’m sure it’s difficult to keep each one on the forefront developing, she is gradually being made into the character she’s meant to be and maybe this season we will see her story unfold and make more sense. Your comments come across like blind rage with little detail ,try calm down with the sansa hate , I know we are entitled to our opinions but you just breath negativity.
I disagree with that. Cutting things as Tysha, Sansa’s compassion or Arya’s desire to reunite with her family is a huge departure and change of motivations. Tyrion main conflict was not to kill his family, Arya’s and Sansa are not revenge, for example.
It doesn’t. But if you cut the scheeming about her being
there’s nothing else than her virginity and the possibility to marry her to someone. The Lannisters could reclame the North via Tyrion (even with the regicide thing) and the northern lords won’t follow her if there’s a male heir avalaible (at this moment, Bran and Rickon and they could even prefer bastard!Jon over a girl raised in KL and married to a Lannister, plus Robb’s legicimaty decret).
Irishton,
She’s my fave of the books and I’m a strong defender of her character. That’s why I hate show!Sansa. The tears are only part of the “damsel in distress vibe” who completely destroys the “courtesy is a lady’s armor” theme and Tyrion being nicer it’s the way to manipulate the audience to root for Tyrion and make him the flawless Hero everyone should stand for.
It’s like when Stannis was given extra scenes this season showing him as the loving father and Shireen the adorable daughter and then suddenly burns her to make the impossible: the audience being happy than the Boltons (repeat, the Boltons) won.
Sorry, my mistake
I hope they didn’t say that. Daenerys could be sometimes everything a ruler should’t be, but she doesn’t give up never
Irishton,
Thanks my friend it’s very nice of you to say that, i’ll participate in debates and discussions whenever i feel that i can actually add something useful to them and not just for the sake of commenting, also there are always a considerable chunk of other comments that i simply have to ignore for various reasons specially those related to sansa, almost every time i read a discussion about her i end up painfully annoyed (it probably sounds crazy i know). So yeah the fact that you rarely see me writing comments isn’t because of me being afraid of participating in them.
Thanks again for your kind words ser/lady, have a good day (or night).
Daughter of Winter,
I think you are right not to take part in heated arguments because in the end there’s nothing more than being annoyed. I really like commenting and talking to people, but when the discussion begins to look like a quarrel I prefer to just read it to find out various opinions and the way people bring proofs to support them.
There are always people to have friendly chats with and that’s important imo.
Shy Lady Dragon,
Hey you, how’s all the work dear?
Well yeah after all this time being a reader of this place i know that what or whom comments i should or shouldn’t read (yours are among those that i never miss my lady). But that is not to say that i don’t enjoy different opinions, in fact various mindsets is one of the top reasons that makes WotW such an amazing website.
And i’m all in for fun friendly chats with you, Lulus Mum and other amazing people of this place.
Well, that’s your reading, and you’re entitled to it (mine is that the essence of Arya’s and Sansa’s *is* revenge, for example). But by the same token, you can’t argue that the show misinterpreted things when they interpret and develop things in a way that doesn’t agree with your reading. DnD are informed, we aren’t.
It’s like StanFans saying that DnD misinterpreted Stannis. Well, if they were told from start that Stannis’ story ends with him burning Shireen, I can understand how that coloured their reading and influenced their representation of him!
Robb didn’t legitimise Jon on the show, did he? That said, that’s not the key point: that is, you’ve pre-set up in your mind the Northern Lords – whom we haven’t met for years on the show – to be sexist. Meanwhile, it’s possible that, due to the recent upheavals, they’ll become somewhat more malleable, and will be willing to go for any Stark. But then, obviously, you’ll be crying mischaracterisation, won’t you?
Ok with that. But informed doesn’t mean the same path for the same ending, as Martin said. Or it will be the same if Dany becomes Queen of Westeros by killing Tommen with her dragon or becoming Queen if LF kills Tommen? Both endings are with Dany as a Queen. In the first she could be seen as ruthless killer, the second one she could be totally the savior. It matters.
Stanfans complaints are about how his motivations in show and books is a) Become King and b) Left the throne to his beloved daughter and heir. Killing him and specially Shireen killed by him is a misinterpretation, with canon of the books and the show.
I forgot there’s no Robb’s letter, my fault. But in the other issue, is safe to assume that the Northern lords will be sexist in some way or another, mostly because what they did in the show with Sansa and Dorne. The northern lords didn’t give the throne to her (in their point of view, Arya, Rickon and Bran are dead, so she’s the only Stark survivor and by extension, the only one who has “direct” claim). If they needed a puppet to raise the banners, why she doesn’t was made such puppet?
And about Dorne, there’s any hint about male-female equality in the sucession there. There’s any word about equality in this realm, Trystane replaced Arianne as heir + minor details as changing the dornish court of mixed with all male lords or being Oberyn’s father the one who brought Elia and Oberyn to KL instead or their mother (the ruler)… And it’s Dorne, the “progressive” one. Why do you think they’re gonna do WF equalitarian now? And more, after all the scenes showed involving the Stark children being raised as lords or ladies?
It’s not, though, and that’s exactly my point. Bookreader StanFans only know him at the end of AFFC ADWD; DnD probably knew that TWOW events would impact him so that he would burn Shireen, for years.
Similarly, you are implicitly assuming that the things that concern other characters at the end of the books at your disposal are what will concern these characters in the books to come. Thus ignoring their future evolution.
I don’t understand you here. What did the Northern lords do with Sansa in the show so far? They haven’t appeared for two seasons.
Considering she also said the same in the previous season, I’m going to take it as a spoiler of Sansa getting tortured as well as raped
Not that I’d like that, but last season was hyped as some sort of “Sansa in a revenge trip” and didn’t exactly end that way
No, in the show, Stannis started out wanting the throne for himself and his legacy, but his motivations changed. Melisandre convinced him of the true threat in the North and that Stannis was the messiah sent to save the world from the White Walkers. That became his new purpose and is apparent when Melisandre tells him “Only you can lead the living against the dead,” and when Stannis informs Sam to continue reading about the White Walkers to gauge their weaknesses.
So her pregnancy is confirmed?
She never said that last time. Yes, the season was hyped because of the way how season 4 ended but I don’t remember anything about Sansa being “badass”. If she said she would be stronger character, that could just mean bigger presence or demanding more acting abilities and both was the case of last season.
Have some faith. Do you really think the writers are that stupid?
The principal argument against Stannis killing Shireen in the books is that
.
To me, the northern lords were erased only to left Sansa alone. It’s odd that in WF there’s any glimpse of other lords, but the Mormont girls sent a letter to Jon saying they don’t recognize Stannis as King.
Yeah, I’ve read that several times. It never stops being stupid, though. He can move. In GOT the book, Catelyn moves to King’s Landing and then halfway back to Winterfell in what – three chapters? I forgot. Point is, book Stannis moving Wall-Winterfell-Wall over *two books* is not out of question.
How ‘erased’? They simply weren’t present. Were Jaime in the Riverlands, Balon’s death, the Kingsmoot or Bran’s training ‘erased’ as well just because the show is only getting to these plot points now?
I think it would be far more questionable if they had been present, including for the abuse, and did nothing (while professing loyalty to the Starks). Which, incidentally, is what happens in the books.
Funny you asked that question. I sort off remember a casting call for a newborn, dark hair, towards the end of filming. First I thought for the indoor TOJ filming, but that had already taken place during the summer. Hmmmm, would that not be a twist, Sansa being pregnant?
And my inside is screaming NOOOOO at that thought.
Newbietothegame,
From the bottom of my heart I hope the dark-haired baby is born in the TOJ scene, but I’m so afraid you may be right. It’s only natural to show the baby when it’s found and taken by his uncle (trying to be vague here), but if this scene was already done when this baby was cast 🙁
Shy Lady Dragon,
Let’s hope this is not the case and they just needed additional scenes for the TOJ bit.
Newbietothegame,
Shy Lady Dragon,
The casting call was for a brown eyed baby, Sansa’s child by Ramsey would not be likely to be brown eyed.
WHEWWW.
ghost of winterfell,
So glad you reminded me this, thank you! TOJ it is!
Newbietothegame,
Nooooooooooooooooooooo just no, stop it right there please
Daughter of Winter,
I know, but the fear was short lived because they were looking for a brown eyed baby. Forgot about the brown eyes.
Newbietothegame,
Well there is that too i guess.
Ned (light eyes) + Catelyn (light eyes) = Arya and Bran (dark eyes)
Pigeon,
Yeah. I think one of the few reasons to specify eye colour is because the child plays a child version of some established adult character. I remember them specifying green eyes for young Ned as well.
Lord Parramandas,
Well, yes, I do think the writers are that stupid 😛
Daughter of Winter,
I totally understand where you are coming from and its sir, also you are very welcome. Also I only get to have a good day or night not both… Ha ha just joking, have a good one and look forward to seeing your comments on this awesome website.
SlayerNina,
I’m sorry I’m really tired and had to read part of your comment a few times in disbelief, but did you really write that aryas motivation is NOT revenge?
Pigeon,
I forgot about Michelle Fairley’s grey eyes.
I’d very much like to watch the first pilot, I don’t think it could be that bed as they say in the podcast. And I’d like to see Jennifer Ehle as Catelyn, I can’t imagine her playing that part.
Is one of them. The other, meet with Jon and return to WF. I’m just saying that is not her 1º idea, at least, until the Red Wedding. And even with the FM, she still miss her home. Compare this:
“Needle was Robb and Bran and Rickon, her mother and her father, even Sansa. Needle was Winterfell’s grey walls, and the laughter of its people. Needle was the summer snows, Old Nan’s stories, the heart tree with its red leaves and scary face, the warm earthy smell of the glass gardens, the sound of the north wind rattling the shutters of her room. Needle was Jon Snow’s smile. He used to mess my hair and call me “little sister,” she remembered, and suddenly there were tears in her eyes.”
To this:
“Arya’s gotten very good at letting go, she’s been forced to let go of everything that means anything to her in this world. And she does a great job getting rid of that costume and getting rid of her money and getting rid of the coin, but Needle was a very, very special gift. She sees herself as an instrument of revenge in many ways in this world and that sword is the way she’s going to exact that revenge on the people who wronged her family. It’s the instrument of that revenge. Letting go of Needle would really be letting go of Arya Stark, and the fact that she can’t let go of Needle makes it clear to us that she’s not at all ready to be no one”.
It’s a huge difference
Then you are on the wrong fansite.
Shy Lady Dragon,
I really don’t think they’ll pull that card with Sansa though, although it’s not impossible. I mean, give her a break.
I still don’t see how she and Theon can have escaped that jump unscathed, but hey it’s fiction. 😛
The original pilot would be amazing to see! Such a negative critical response to it, you really wonder how it could have been that bad. But I suppose it’s fortunate that it was badly received, as we have the actors now that fit so well. 🙂
Theon and Jeyne survived the jump pretty much unschated in the books. She broke a few ribs but only because Theon landed on her.
Snow.
As a kid that grew up in northern Canada with a propensity for rock climbing and jumping from heights into snowbanks, I can tell you that at that distance, the mound of snow at the bottom wouldn’t do jack shit aside from maybe preventing outright death. Lol. And if it was a significant pile, you’d have a fair time of it trying to extricate yourself from a snow coffin. My theory is that, having grown up at Winterfell, Theon and Sansa were taught to always carry Swiss army snowshoes with flame thrower and parachute attachments.
Pigeon,
LOL, maybe it was a HUGE snow drift at that side of the castle wall and they only had to jump a couple of feet and then slide down?
Yawn, we need a trailer to get the hype going again.
Pigeon,
LOL! I can imagine them, although I had to google “Swiss army snowshoes”. This scene made me give another meaning to “I can see only snow”, i.e. snow that thick to present no danger to them.
I suppose Wun Wun could run run and grab them in mid-air? 😀
Fienix,
You can’t be serious? Show Sansa is a terrible character. Book Sansa while she does have her flaws is easily a deeply superior and more complex character than the one presented on the show. Book Sansa is actually learning and applying the skills she has learnt from Littlefinger when trying to manipulate and win allies around her. All Show Sansa does is say speeches about her ‘being brave” and do nothing to better her situation or use any of the skills that Littlefinger MAY have told her about except for season 4 – that scene with her getting Baelish out of trouble though it sacrificed his character’s methodical thought process it did show Sansa as an interesting character…until season 5
Book Sansa never manipulated anyone. TV Sansa actually managed to conclude that LF had a role in poisoning Joffrey without him telling it. And the scene with the Vale lords was better than all her book scenes combined.
According to the writers, Sansa hasn’t lost her internal strength in WF. And you have to be a mastermind to manipulate a person like (TV) Ramsay.
Alex Stroup,
Sansa has been a Turnip. They have had her do implausable things. Suffer, Whimper,Cringe, and go back for more.They dress her up like Cruella DeVille for one shot and then turn her (Get it? ) back to quivering jello.She’s no Stark. I think Sophie’s blowing smoke for the show. Remember the build-up for The Fearsome Sand Farts, er Snakes. I’ll watch but somewhat disconnectedly, waiting for the next load of unbelievable pap they try to shovel out weakly (No “sp”) Bah!
Lord Parramandas,
Have you seen the web vid where this Russian guy jumps off an apartment bldg into a snow drift and walks away?
Drogon,
Are you sure you came to the right site?
Why on earth would Sansa do the thing your original comment suggested? That would be entirely out of character for her. More likely she’d suspect what was happening and be royally pissed off.
Best comment on here.
SK,
She’s a human, but not a being.
Stalin was both human and being. Did Stalin deserve respect?