Oops, HBO has done it again. Well, HBO Nordic in this case. The newest episode of Game of Thrones season 6, “The Door,” has leaked and unfortunately is already all over the internet.
Rather than spend the next ten hours chasing down spoilers, we’re going to open up this chat as a Spoiler Quarantine for “The Door.” People who have watched the episode early can chat about it in this post, and ONLY this one. Comments in other posts will be deleted, so keep your chat contained here. We ask that you do not post any links to any downloads/torrent sources. Comments of that nature will be deleted.
So here it is, your early spoiler chat, radioactive nuclear-hot Spoiler Quarantine for “The Door.” Have at it!
*Note: Our usual Open Chat will be up later this afternoon at the regular time with the standard rules for those who have avoided spoilers and skipped pirating the episode.*
HODOR!!
HOLD THE DOOR!
RIP you magnificant giant!
You held the door!
What a remarkable episode. The ending completely blew my mind. The episode is jampacked and for me this Seasons episodes get better and better. Whenever I watch one I think its the best of the season, just until the next one arrives and its better than the one before. And we are just done with half the season.
HOLD THE DOOR!
And they are seriously going to kill of all the wolves?
Someone give me a hug…. I’m crying like a little boy..
I posted my question in other thread it was deleted. Again I am posting for the first time here but have been lurking for some time now.
Is there a treatment for grayscale in the books?
The Door is officially the saddest episode, even beats Red Wedding, in my book. Absolutely devastating……
The last scene was a nail in my heart !!!!!!!!!!!
Night’s King!
Bran sneaks out to watch a horror flick….
… Yes, and maybe a Hodor flick, too?
RIP Summer
Northern Giant 🙁
RIP Hodor. You held the door 🙁
He held it guys…
The sweat giant did it… He held the door….
I’m still crying.
I know at least one person on Westeros.org actually guessed the “hold the door” thing several years ago. Congratulations to them.
Though as we near the endgame, more and more “fan theories” are going to be proven accurate (and many more disproved). One also sees that in the reactions to the origin of the White Walkers.
Arya’s face at the Ned scenes 🙁
Also, an asskicking for the waif is overdue. I can’t wait for Arya to overcome her.
Also, it’s interesting that only Nymeria and Ghost remain. Hopefully they don’t axe Nymeria this season. Is it true that her wolf army is making an appearance this season?
This episode was straight up insane
OH MY GOSH HOLD THE DOOR? I JUST CAN’T
Sean C.,
Kudos to them.
Ohh god, many will be angry at the WW origin. It was such a big thing that created dozens of theories. Some will be without a doubt disapointed.
weeeeat,
No such reports, only fan speculations.
Jinx47,
Remember what Stannis once told Shireen in the show? I think it was even last season. He got all the men to Dragonstone that promised a cure, but noone could help. I think thats the exact thing we know from the books as well. At least I cant remember something else.
Amazing episode. Definitely top 5. I cried so much during the last scene… Poor Wyllis. RIP 3ER and Summer. Kingsmoot was great, I loved Euron. And Jon with the cloak OH MY he looked just like Ned. Also Littlefinger seemed genuinely sorry for what happened to Sansa, but I’m glad she didn’t forgive him. Great acting by Sophie Turner. I give this episode a perfect 10. How could they top this episode is beyond me.
Rest in piece, you marvalous giant, the fandom shall never be the same..
A moment of silence, for Hodor please.
Rhaenys Stark,
Aeron’s speech was absolutly amazing!!
Rhaenys Stark,
Also, we have 5 more to go!!! Just imagine episode 9 or 10, if this one was so damn good.
Anyone got the names of actors from the troupe? I wonder how they are called.
Thank you. I wonder if they are going to change it in the show. Otherwise there was no point to have it as the only Denny moment this episode and spent so much precious time on it.
I also read somewhere that the whole season details as description has been leaked.
Well fans had 20 years to think things through. I’m glad this theory was correct… I always found it fascinating.
NO. MORE. DEAD. WOLVES.
#RIPSummer
I was screaming when Summer died ?
And Hodor ?
Kingsmoot was too rushed imo, but i understand, they have to make space for Bran. Euron don’t look too threatening up to this point. Will this be the last time we see them?
Daenarys, you just played the cruelest version of friendzone ?
What did you guys think about the Kingsmoot? I actually liked it. Honestly, the whole thing bored me somewhat in the books, but I love seeing psycho Euron on screen. Kudos to Yara and Theon for stealing the entire fleet and getting the hell out of dodge.
alwayswinter,
devastated ?
Jinx47,
Well Shireen was cured somehow.
Most likely they simply tried so many things, they don’t really know witch treatment actually cured her.
Ian glenn also gave some hints he may be in S7…So we may see him again.
impuregold,
I know right? Summer, oh why, to save the CGI budget for the dragons and the white walkers is my guess?
What a wonderful wonderful episode. That ending was just spectacular. Every scene was brilliantly done by Jack Bender.
And Hodor, we are gonna miss him
Lady_Vicious1984,
Loved it!
Theon was so sweet praising his sister. Aeron’s speech while crowning Euron was amazing!
Lionthing,
Might want to go on the /r/asoiaf subreddit for the summary
The wolves are dying too fast. There must be something behind it.
That’s pretty much it. When you have many thousands of people speculating on the future of the story, give them years in which to do it, and an internet to share their ideas over, it’s inevitable that at least somebody will figure most of the story details out, given sufficient information from the source material. There are only so many ways a story can develop, after all, and nothing new under the sun.
Sean C.,
Just curious. I was never really that into theories.
Anyone guessed the WW origins?
As Night King was made of Dragon glass, does it mean that he is immune to it now?
#SaveTheDirewolves #SaveTheStarks
RIP Summer and Hodor. Lighting a candle for Ghost and Nymeria. Hodor’s story is so tragic.
This was the best episode of the season so far. Arya’s scene outside was so hilarious. I called it when I said Sansa will be making clothes for her and Jon this season. Bran will have some major character development next (the guilt he must feel is insane and he’s giving me serious Frodo vibes). Jon has completed his transformation into “Season 1 Ned Stark in the crypts of Winterfell”.
Also, thank you Davos for telling Sansa what’s up.
I love Yara and Meera so much! MEERA IS OP IN THIS EPISODE!!!!!
Anyone else truly cried?
I’m not joking, I really shed some tears..
I thought the biggest reveal even more so than the walkers’ origin was the little moment when Meera stabbed to death one of WWs with what appeared to be an ordinary spear. Did I get that reveal right?
Jinx47,
Oops, what I forgot. I think Stannis also said, they were just able to stop it spreading? But not curing.
Jinx47,
It was a spear the Children used, without a doubt it had Dragonglass.
The death animation was just like when Jon killed one in hardhome and when Sam killed his in S3.
Mihnea,
I literally had goosebumps watching some of the end scenes. Yeah I did shed some tears in the end
I legit sobbed.
I’m so mad about Summer. Save the direwolves!!!
The WW origin story makes sense if you look at the First Men and Andal Invasions. It’s GoT’s version of Age of Ultron.
I can’t wait to watch this in HD
From the Dany Jorah scene, to the end with Summer and Hodor,
I am a mess of emotions
Seriously, I cried like a baby at the end (something not even Neds Death or the Red Wedding did to me)
Jinx47,
No. I guess the spear-head was dragonglass. Sam gave them a bunch of dragonglass if you, if you remember.
Anyone going to talk about the theater scene?
It was hilarious! And sad….
Jinx47,
R+L=J&M possible reveal ? :d
Jinx47,
It was a dragonglass spear.
Oh thank you, it was hard to see on the WEBRIP version. Another reason to stay late night to rewatch everything.
Jinx47,
It was a spear which had a dragon glass at its end
Can someone explain me all the Sansa-Jon things?
Sansa says to LF, Jon is her brother and she doesn’t trust him… he answers that she needs an army to be loyal only to her.
Later she said lies to Jon, and tries to get an army loyal to her like LF told her to do?
Also the look everyone gave to her when she said she is real Stark and people will support her and Jon is as Stark as Ramsay is Bolton.
Then she was like, i am so happy i lied and i am getting an army but then she gave a direwolf coat to Jon while smiling. Sansa confused me!
The last scene was amazing! So sad for Hodor.
Jinx47,
Atish Vaze,
How could you not cry….
I still need to truly grasp the end, where Bran is half in the present, half in the past, while warging…
Its complex shit.. but intriguing as hell.
Jinx47,
No there is no cure even in the books. People have been cured (like shireen), but so many different things were tried on them that no one knows what exactly cured them
Mihnea,
Yes. Summer’s whimpers got to me bad and Hodor’s fate was so sad. His entire life was a tragedy because he was meant to be a sacrificial lamb. Seeing baby Hodor and old Hodor struggling was heart-wrenching. I even cried for that last child of the forest.
Jinx47,
I truly forgot such shitty quality still exists…..
Mihnea,
Apart from the spectacular last scene, I also cried when Sansa talked about what Ramsay did to her and when Jorah finally confessed his love to Dany. Amazing scenes and perfect acting by everyone involved, especially Sansa and Jorah. Can’t wait to see the preview for next week.
shinmenmusashi,
Wouldn’t Meera’s canon book appearance debunk this theory?
Atish Vaze,
didnt sam kill one with dragon glass
Flayed Potatoes,
Summer’s cries hitted me hard. Leaf’d death just made me sadder
And Hodor just made me cry out loud…
Mihnea,
As a Shakespeare fan I loved it. D&D should write an episode in verse lmao.
i wanted more of that. the theatre company is a very interesting and impressive collection of actors. And this season we are having way too much grotesque male nudity. That shot of penis with warts was disturbing even on my WBERIP version.
Rhaenys Stark,
It was still preaty fresh so Sansa’s scene didn’t made me burst into crying but it definetly started there!
God I love Ian Glenn, May he return to us soon.
It was more a culmination of the entire episode rather then Hodor alone.
Hodor was just the final straw….
Jinx47,
Didn’t Sam give them dragonglass
Here I am crying about Summer dying more than Hodor. RIP Summer 🙁
Hey Sansa, soooo Bran’s wolf just died….just kinda wondering where you got all that fur for Jon’s new cloak?!?!
HelloThere,
Yes. I prefer books and was really skeptical of this theory, but D&D already showed us they can make massive changes from the books. So in the show this theory may still be true.
Jinx47,
Wait until you see it in HD..
Well there was complaints we didn’t get enough male nudity…. I just doubt this is the kind of nudity the ladies wanted. LOL
Something about that scene between Jorah and Dany just made me feel like Jorah isn’t coming back into the story ever…
It felt like the end (and i felt like Dany knew it, which is what made me feel emotional)
I wish I could say I stopped myself BUT I COULDN’T, and I’ll watch again at air time, and twice after that. Holy shit.
I wouldn’t be surprised if we lose Nymeria and Ghost this season. Who will be the last direwolf standing?
I’m so upset. #SaveTheDirewolves
Yrs indeed, I forgot about that.
So Sansa is back to being a bitch to Jon after only one episode?
-Reminds him he is a bastard and actually uses his name and status in a sentance in a comparison to Ramsey… WhatTheFu*k?
-Lies to him
– Tries to make it up to him by making him a cloak with the smallest Stark sigil possible and giving herself a frikn bat symbol sized Stark symbol on her chest.
He is visibly offended by both of her slights.
Unship Jon and that bi*ch please.
HelloThere,
Ian, did say in a interview he is curious to see how Jorah’s story progresses.
He might be back later on.. Perhaps not this season…who know..
Jinx47,
Only children can be saved, but not exactly treated. All grown ups are dead in some years… it’s strange how fast it’s advancing on Jorah.
Anyway, this was an AMAZING episode!!! Well, an amazing ending. Until the Bran scenes it was alright. That’s the perfect word to describe it: alright. I liked the scenes with Sansa, nothing special. I kind of disliked what happened with Arya… she’s supposed to be no one, so why was she laughing and getting angry at that play?? Her Stark persona should be a long way beneath the surface…. if she reacted so easy to that the Faceless Man would know.
The Moot… it started poorly, it was disappointing just like the arguments Yara and Euron used, but I liked Alfie Allen’s acting A LOT!!!
Now Bran, WOW!!!! They started so fast explaining one of the great mysteries of the story: the origin of the White Walkers. It was one of the most popular theories out there… but with Hodor??? Bran being responsible, a lot fewer people believed that (also because in the books we didn’t know that young Walder was a normal boy). The ending was so touching… GOT hasn’t moved me like this in seasons.
PS: WTF happened with Summer?? They’re really killing all the direwolves?? Why? They don’t want to spend the CGI budget on anything else than dragons??? I’m almost sure nothing like this happens in the books, they’ve shrank their importance from the start and now they’re just getting rid of them. It’s the only thing I kind of disliked about this episode. Poor Hodor 🙁
So the Night King was the first white walker created….
alwayswinter,
I’m pretty sure they have supplies at the Wall (fur, leather, etc.). I’m shocked she made everything so fast lol. She’d destroy everyone on Project Runway.
Hoyti Von Totiy,
I thought he was clearly happy when he got the armor, just his usual gloomy self who doesn’t really know how to react.
Things I felt during this episode
– Fuck yeah Sansa!
– YAAAS YARA!
– don’t know if I completely hate or kinda like Euron
– Shit that’s how the white walkers came to be
– awwww Jorah & yas dany don’t let him leave
– Poor Arya (no one) having to watch that play
– oooooo Varys just got shut down
– Bran you absolute idiot.
– That one small moment when tormund smiles at Brienne <3 SHIP
– oh shit the walkers are here, WAKE UP BRAN
– noooooo SUMMER </3
– My heart is being ripped into a million pieces. Hodor you sweet giant. You had to live your whole life being taunted for being a half-wit. But you weren't a half-wit. You were sweet, and loyal, and innocent, and strong. And you held the door <3
Connor,
Nah… I doubt it.
He is just a face to the WW, we need this in a TV show.
The enemies need to have a face, he embodies this.
Hoyti Von Totiy,
What’s it like being a founding member of the He Man Woman Hater’s Club?
“Her Stark emblem was bigger than his!” Fuck me bloody if that’s what you’re on about. What are you, eight years old?
Mihnea,
The idea that the Children created them has been a common speculation over the years.
Those intricate embroideries and leatherwork!!!! She must have had half of Asian child labour from Apple plants assisting out. 🙂
Sean C.,
Good to know, thanks!
Seeing all this COTF and WW lore coming to pass, I just want to know more. Though probably we will need to wait for the books for that.
Was that man the COTF turned into a WW the Night King?
Why do you guys think Sansa lied to Jon?
Also.
I am chellanging everyone to convince me that the story will end with a pact or truce with the WW.
There will be a final battle and without a doubt Dany will also be there with the dragons.
Man… I don’t want Sansa to forgive LF or anything but the knights of the Vale sure would’ve come in handy at this point.
Mihnea,
I did cry for hodor , but didn’t even get a little sad on dany/jorah scene because of her terrible acting.
Rhaenys Stark,
About LF? That’s her personal fight and struggle, she didn’t want Jon’s help with this.
It was something she herself needed to do.
I’m a bit annoyed at Sansa. All Littlefinger had to do is say one sentence and she now starts lying to Jon. That Tully plan won’t work imo. She’ll come crawling back to LF and he’ll use her again and manipulate her against Jon. I hope it backfires and LF gets served, but I don’t think he’s done playing the Starks.
She was way out of her league in the strategy meeting and Davos saw that. Jon planning the campaign was a nice reference to how he planned Stannis’ campaign in ADWD. He knows Northern houses. I get what her intention was with the Jon/Ramsay comparison, but it’s one of those things that sounds good in your head, but terrible when spoken lol.
Jon = KITN CONFIRMED IMO
Flayed Potatoes,
Haha yes I was just looking to add a bit of levity to the situation, what with all the direwolves now dying all of the time 🙁
My mind just wandered to an eventual Bran/Jon/Sansa reunion where Bran looks at Jon like “that motherf***er’s wearing my wolf!”
Anyway, an amazing, heartbreaking ep imo. 5 down, 5 to go!!
I don’t know about that.
The final scene was so powerful, it had the ring of truth; GRRM truth.
And if it wasn’t cribbed from Cogman’s talks with GRRM about his ultimate plans, then Cogman has made a massive contribution to the series. Because I bought that entirely ; hook, line and sinker.
Ser Arian the lazy,
I thought it was briliant!
To each his own I guess.
U guys are reeeeaaaccchiing hard with anti-sansa comments, lol.
I was also very intrigued by the “passive agressive” conversation between Varys and the Red Priestess. So much said and yet unsaid. I need to rewatch that scene.
Did she indicate that she is working with Mel? What did she communicate to Varys when she touched his hand?
What was the meaning of all of it?
HelloThere,
Agreed.
Mihnea,
That’s what I thought too. Love Jon-Sansa dynamic.
Connor,
It doesn’t really work with the story of the Night’s King who was a brother of the Watch, a human…. I mean in his time the wall was already built. It’s obvious what we saw tonight takes place a long time before the story of the Night’s King. I’m not sure they’ll explain it in the show… they don’t need to, but in the books it’s probably just a position that’s passed down from a White Walker to another…
Brienne’s comments about Jon were pretty hilarious and on point. Class episode, but pretty traumatising 🙁 I wish they’d just leave the fricking direwolves alone! It’s gonna be some trek to get back to the wall safe with no wolf and no giant!
alwayswinter,
Poor Bran.
I am 100% sure he makes it past the Wall and it will allow the WW to come through….since he’s been marked and all.
It’s tough being a Stark fan lmao.
Jinx47,
She wanted to scare him no doubt.
Am I the only one feeling like the show has done a bad job explaining Children of the Forest? And now they are all dead. (?)
I’m going to guess that Benjen will be saving Bran and Meera. Or maybe it’s Coldhands (don’t think so).
Flayed Potatoes,
Benjen to the rescue…?
Jern Sner,
Ok leaving the last bit behind, she lied to him and compared Ned/Jon to Roose/Ramsey in a single sentance. After all Ramsey did to her?
Really?
Rhaenys Stark,
Brienne’s statement pretty clearly indicated that we’re meant to think it’s trust issues. Why exactly, I’m not sure, but there you are. And she may not want to get into that she turned down the Arryn army, which they kind of need.
The point of that statement was not to compare character.
the last episode I cried at was The Red Wedding, now bam here comes the season 6 emotions train…Jon/Sansa last week, Hodor this week
I’ll be so dehydrated by the end of the season
Well now I know to have a box of Kleenex handy when I watch tonight ?
I have a feeling that we will get Benjen next week, to save Bran and Meera from some wights.
impuregold,
Nah. Not all the lore needs explaining.
They fought ”men” and were loosing, so they created the WW.
So where did Jon & Co actually go? They all left Castle Black at the end but where are they heading?
Hoyti Von Totiy,
The situation is the same though.
Both are bastards, there’s nothing wrong in that.
I think LF’s half-brother comment got to her. He’s manipulating her. I remember Sophie saying there will be some sibling rivalry.
(Deep sigh)
I don’t know anymore; it just seems like they’re rushing WAY too fast to the end. You bring in Max von Sydow to play Bloodraven…and you kill him off after three episodes without even going into his backstory or explaining any kind of importance to the larger plot outside of being a deus ex machina for Bran?! George has hinted for years that the White Walkers are more interesting and complicated than the mindless force of destruction they appear to be…and the show just makes them into mindless zombies created by the Children of the Forest as a WMD to be used against the Andals. Call me Linda if you wish, but these are HUGE opportunities missed in the name of rushing to finish. Hopefully, George will get the chance to finish his story on his terms in the books because the ending we are getting here feels so reductive compared to what could be. Maybe this story works if I just judge it as a single work of TV as opposed to the knowledge that I have from the books, but I find it harder and harder to do so.
Oh god i was so sad for hodor.Honestly has there ever been a more tragic character than hodor?I understand his purpose but that was heartbreaking I felt even worse than during the red wedding cause he was completely inocent and pure and had a terrible ending
Hounded,
To gather the houses of the North.
No, the weird stuff is that LF talked to her against Jon, and she followed his advice. On the top she started lying to Jon. Brienne asked her why she lied and she didn’t even answer. Then she gave him a coat.
It’s not personal…she wants Jon to fight a war for her, but she makes clear that people will get behind her and she wants the army to be loyal to her.
She hides information from the people who are going to be on the battlefield.
Hounded,
I think they are going to meet with the houses Jon mentioned.
Connor,
Without any news of the actor coming to the GOT set?? Not happening. Maybe Coldhands… I never really gave him that much importance, but the visual of a huge elk might be something D&D would want to put in the show. They don’t have Hodor to carry him, how can Meera do it alone?
Ser Arian the lazy,
Her acting wasn’t terrible, especially in that scene. I think Emilia’s great when she portrays a vulnerable, not-so-smug young woman. Her ‘regal’ scenes are sometimes off, but definitely not terrible.
RBloodworth,
If you think the WW’s origin is different in the books, you are fooling yourself.
The story is turning into a fantasy story, with a bit of politics in it, both books and show.
Fantastic episode, gutted that Summer died …
I didnt watch the episode yet, but i read it on a reddit post earlier. I only read the parts with Bran though.
I am pissed about Summer dying though, i am NOT ready to see Summer die tonight 🙁
The first recruit North house, which one is the closest?
Game of Thrones Wiki is in chaos once again due to the fools at HBO Nordic.
I can’t “ignore” the spoilers when I’m one of the guys who has to actively remove them – moderators here must know the feeling. God damn it.
Sean C.,
But was there some double meaning in that sentence? On the one hand, she is saying that there is no reason for people to prefer Ramsey over Jon as they are both bastards, on the other emphasising that they are both bastards after all.
RBloodworth,
Yeah keep waiting,i’m sure when he’s done with all the novels he’s written on his Not a Blog about Hugo puppies or whatever else irrelevant shit that no one cares about he’s eventually going to finish the books .
Connor,
I agree. She can’t carry him by herself and the episode showed baby Benjen again. Benjen is coming!
Rhaenys Stark,
She doesn’t want Jon to know she met with LF, that’s for sure. You’d think she’d see past what LF did and just just hate-use him for his 45k army, though.
I agree it has something to do with LF’s last words about Jon. But I am sure it is not the interpretation of some people in this thread. And I am pretty confident she finds out about LF’s role in her father’s death this season.
Vlad,
They created the perfect situation to bring him back, by showing him in the flashbacks.
I think he’ll be back.
Mihnea,
Well, the origin is obviously this… but them being simply a mindless destruction force??? We’ll see, I doubt it. You said earlier that it will end up in a huge battle… well, that sounds cliched as hell :)). No, I don’t think we’re getting a truce, but it’s possible they simply put them back to sleep. Why did the White Walkers stop killing for 8000 years? what brought them back? it’s obviously not the Children of the Forrest again.
Lionthing,
Go to kickass…you can find episode there like I did
R.I.P.Hoddor.,
This, Jon is risking his life after her pushing, and now she is withholding crucial information from him, that there is a Vale army ready to help them if they wanted.
The North irritated me this episode.
It’s heartbreaking. Prepare yourself!
Connor,
hope so some one did tell a character who was forgotten will come back
Meera is a boss!!! I wish there were more Meera fans in this word!
Vlad,
Yup, cliched. But once you throw away this notion that Martin is some kind of Jesus, who destroys tropes, it makes perfect sense. You don’t like it, just because you think he’ll throw a catch in the last minute…it won’t happen. You are lying to yourself.
Mindless? Did you saw the NK and the other WW, they are clearly not mindless.
The horde of wights they control is.
Mihnea,
Benjen – the magic horse rider with the fireball in the trailer
I refuse to believe otherwise.
Flayed Potatoes,
I think that if we’re going to get a CH like character, this is the time. Meera and Bran need help without Wylis, may he Hold The Door In Peace.
Flayed Potatoes,
It’s gotta be him! Next week better show us!!!
I was wondering about this. Fire did not seem to bother the WWs in this episode either, so should we assume that it’s only dragonfire that will prove deadly for them?
Mihnea,
Flayed Potatoes,
Whats wrong with the origin story?
Flayed Potatoes,
It is simply wrong to believe anything else.. 🙂
I definitely am, after this episode!!
Apart from the ending scene, this episode was a let down imo. Kingsmoot was butchered. Dany’s story is just fanservice at this point. The new Red Priestess is just cheesy. Littlefinger & Sansa stuff was meh, Castle Black stuff was cool I suppose, but when is it not?
All complaints aside:
That ending was at Hardhome levels of intensity. Like, holy shit. Fast paced, intense, exciting, heartbreaking… WHY DID THEY HAVE TO KILL SUMMER?? That whimpering broke my heart. And poor, poor Wyllis 🙁 He gave his life, his honor, his sanity for one purpose… he held the door ’til the very end 🙁
ghost of winterfell,
For the WW? Yes. Only dragonglass can kill them, that’s what we know.
But I think Dragonflames will work on them.
Well, couldn’t she hints and foreshadowing at having Jon legitimised which I suspect is coming.
ghost of winterfell,
I agree. Just wait till they get to those Northern houses and they’ll barely have soldiers to spare because they are: poor, rekt after the Red Wedding, rekt after taking their homes back from the Ironborn (as the show told us). She’s in for a rude awakening. 🙁
FFS!!! I come here to check if there is any interesting news on GoT day and I see this. HBO really have to do more to prevent leaks. I know they say they are trying, but they have to try more.
Thank you to the mods for creating this thread, so people who have seen the episode can talk without ruining the other threads. I haven’t seen the episode yet, and won’t until it airs as 1) I don’t have time to watch it in full, and 2) I’d rather watch it the intended way; it is hardly worth the bother of watching a pirated version a few hours before the episode actually airs anyway.
I’ll stay away from the site until I have seen the episode, because I don’t want to be spoiled in any thread. Hopefully no one else is spoiled (unless they want to be), and at least this thread warns people (I haven’t read any comments so I don’t know if people have been spoiled or not).
I hope this doesn’t happen again, but I bet it will.
All in all this is easly in my top 5!
S6, so far is my favourite!! Just amazing all over.
Anyone else kind of irritated by Euron’s portrayal this episode? It wasn’t necessarily bad, but it wasn’t good either. It was just sort of bland. Shame, too, because his introduction in episode 2 was so promising.
Hoyti Von Totiy,
God, are you that dense? She’s saying that Ramsey is NO BETTER than Jon, because they are BOTH bastards of their lord fathers, NOT SAYING IT AS A BAD THING, JUST A FACT OF BLOOD AND BIOLOGY. Ramsey has no better claim on anything than Jon, Ramsey just got a piece of paper signed by a false boy king that says he’s legitimized, but we know what defense paper shields give, and what the people of the north think of the people trying to rule them from the south.
It must be exhausting being you, being so righteously pissed off at the wrong things all of the time.
ghost of winterfell,
Because dragonfire was originally used to forge the first and original valyrian steel and is somewhat magical. “Normal” fire isnt.
I think the end of the dire wolves marks will mark the beginning of the final war.It sort of marks the end of their childhood.
Austen,
He was great. Loved the scene were hi is drowned.
I will never understand the hype of the kingsmoot and never will….
The whole Kingsmoot felt straight out of Chris Nolan’s “Dark Knight” in its composition and execution down to the music. Cinematically it was a departure. Don’t people agree?
Definitely top 5 for me, perhaps even top 3 after rewatch.
HelloThere,
It’s among the only 4 good-ish things in AFFC.
I loved that he wasn’t a complete mad man, with blue lips and so on. He was Ironborn,
Jinx47,
The Umbers are the closest but they’ve already sided with the Boltons so I guess they’ll avoid them. Perhaps the Hornwoods? Then they might split up – some of the will go to Bear Island for the Mormonts and some of them to White Harbour for the the Manderlys
Jinx47,
The drowning scene was, to me, one of the best stand-alone scene in the show.
Jern Sner,
Hoyti is a troll. Leave him be.
Ok so the priestess scene makes me believe that the whole prophecy thing relies strongly on religious propaganda (especially her saying she’ll send the priests to do PR work essentially lol). Both GURM and D&D have shown some healthy religious skepticism, so I hope this remains the same going forward. Many characters will fulfill a role in the war with the WW. Some will provide soldiers, some knowledge, some combat experience, some heavy fire related artillery lol. Also, her obsession with fire and purification is creepy….she’s creepier than Mel lmao.
Flayed Potatoes,
Yup, the way it looks to me now, she will have to go back to LF for the Vale army, and it’s LF once again who holds all the cards. I do hope there is some final twist in this tale that we can’t see now 🙁
Mihnea,
I actually love AFFC (on rereads, 1st read is a slog), but I hated the kingsmoot… went on.. and on… and on… and yes it was cool in the end (with the dragon horn), but it was never even on my radar for scenes i wished to see on the show.
Hornwoods was prominently featured on the map shot. So possibly there. But I agree they are most likely splitting up for the next three episodes.
Flayed Potatoes,
I think she’ll be the one to convince Dany off the real war to come with the WW’s.
That Night’s King guy is ruthless fkhead isn’t he.. And what could it mean that Bran now has his mark? WTF
WTF, why another direwolf had to die?! This episode was so mesmerazing! I think it was comparable to the red wedding plot twist. I felt sorry for Hodor and his written long time ago destiny. Can’t wait to see how Bran is figuring out how to become proper three-eyed raven. And I am a bit angry of the death the former one- does it mean that there won’t be any hint of Tower of Joy plot in this season? I’m so confused after this episode!
Austen,
I don’t find Euron very threatening tbh. And the fact that his ships were stolen so easily doesn’t help his case lmao. I’m curious how he’ll build 1000 ships so quickly 😛
How would she learn that?
tkk,
That if Bran gets somehow south of the wall, they can probably pass the wall as well..
Criterion,
I won’t stop watching the show. It’s still my favorite show on television, but that doesn’t mean that I don’t see flaws in it and express my opinion about them.
HelloThere,
Now…this is a strange thing… LOL. Won’t hear people who liked AFFC say the KM was bad…
I agree with you though, I disliked it a bit, way to long for first.
And then came the convienient plot device for Dany…
Mihnea,
I actually don’t believe that GRRM plans on undermining every trope :). Nope. Well, people who just skim the story don’t see this, but he does kind of turn upside down all the fantasy tropes…. but if you go even deeper, he does actually follow all the fantasy tropes :))…. because well, they work.
When it comes to White Walkers, I don’t think he’ll keep to them. Why? Well, because all his work is paralleled with Lord of the Rings. He thinks about this constantly and actually keeps bringing it up in interviews. Even in LOTR there are consequences even after the last huge battle: the destruction and retaking of the Shire. He’s not going to give a simpler story thank Tolkine well…. because he simply won’t do it :), even if maybe it seems contrived. That’s the way he thinks.
As for the White Walkers, I’m not saying that they are mindless, of course they’re not, this is not the Zombie apocalypse :). No, but their actions and their destruction of everything living is mindless. There’s no negotiation, no compromise, no mercy, no nothing…. and I don’t think the fact that they were created by the Children of the Forrest is sufficient to give them the complexity GRRM would desire for them. I hope I made myself clear… I’m not viewing GRRM as a perfect writer, far from it
I wonder if we’ll see more of BLoodraven in flasbacks (we know we are getting more, right?)
Flayed Potatoes,
I think it was a figure of speech, not that he truly wanted 1000 ships.
Vlad,
And I simple think you hope to much.
HelloThere,
Most likely Bran will see them alone.
Based on the leaks one of the returning characters does it?
RawJah,
Yeah maybe and the NK even did some weird crap to the ground which made it crack/break? I suppose that’s going to happen to the Wall aswell.
I agree. Aeron’s speech was sooo good. I think that drowning thing happens in the books right? The Ironborn drown their children and if they die they are not worthy or something like that.
Sean C.,
What if the chain of events goes like this –
Sansa has refused Littlefinger’s help but he will ignore this and still bring the Vale army to help in the battle for the North and help secure the Stark victory. Littlefinger is counting on this putting him back in Sansa’s good books and making her grateful for his help. However in the meantime Sansa has discovered what Littlefinger did and has him executed for it. So she would end up accepting his help and then killing him once she’s done needing him. A very Littlefinger move.
Rhaenys Stark,
No, they just carry Euron on their backs, like he is a rock-star.
Well I just saw “The Door”…
Will definitely watch it again tonight on TV when it airs to support the channel and the show.
Don’t read the rest as it’s about the new episode and sorry if don’t know if this site allows spoiler tags–
SPOILERS BELOW:
I’m just going to say that it feels good to end the episode not on a cliffhanger, but on a rather sad scene as well as a scene that answers a question we’ve been wondering for a long time… I’ll have a different view looking at Hodor and hearing his quote from now on whenever I’ll re-watch the series from Season 1… And we somehow know that Bran’s ability as a Warg and Greenseer that he can somehow affect the past too, which is amazing. It’s the kind of tragedy I’ve been looking for in a long time, especially seeing it happen to someone as innocent as the sweet giant… I’ll need to watch it again later.
Mihnea,
I was sobbing so much my mother had to calm me down 🙁 Hodor’s story is so so tragic 🙁
Sorry, I don’t comment as much, I’m mostly a lurker of this website but this episode is compelling me to comment. It was amazingly heartbreaking 🙁
Please people stop talking about spoilers for future episodes, that you know of because of the reddit-leaks (or whatever is the source).
Hounded,
That, again, would require her to learn what he did, which there’s no real prospect of since she’s going to be spending the season riding around the North, where nobody knows about it.
Labs,
Welcome to the Wall! Hope you’ll become a active member of the community, from now on!
My wife asked me, why I was sobbing and I could only say Hodor…
Rhaenys Stark,
I don’t know if it’s done to everyone… no, it’s done to the priests. That was the part that seemed off to me. Drown him and than keep him there to see if he comes back. They made it seem magical… (they seem to take the more magical route with everything). Even the priests after being drowned are brought back, you know mouth to mouth breathing? :)) I mean, WTF? was Euron basing his entire plan on that priest not keeping him 5 seconds too long under water???
Alexandre Laframboise,
I think he cant really change the past all the time. It was only, that he could influence Wyllis, because he warged into Hodor in the real time and that made him hear Meera as well somehow.. I mean, sure, he did change something in the past, but that was a veeeeeeeery special situation.. He was more the vehicle that made Wyllis be able to hear Meera.. I think..
HelloThere,
I don’t think that they will show any backstory to Bloodraven since its not going to affect the events bound to happen in the future
Vlad,
If he dies, he isn’t worth it, that’s it.
Sean C.,
Perhaps theres a Northern Lord who is very well informed. I feel like Wyman Manderly would be someone that knows alot of stuff.
Atish Vaze,
That is simple backstory and worldbuilding, to add a bit of flavour.
The books have ample time to do that, the show doesn’t.
We can’t waste time on background characters past.
Can I just say something.
I did not cry during the Red Wedding. I did not cry when Ned Stark died or when any of the Direwolves died. I have never cried in a Game of Thrones episode.
But I cried in this one.
Mihnea,
And Euron would agree to that?? If he doesn’t come back than he’s better off dead?? Well done than in making the ironborn even simpler than in the books. Didn’t think that was possible 😛
And if he dies than what?? Who’s king? :)) Yara already ran with all the fleet (great preparation from Euron’s part on that as well)
I think Bran has already affected the past. One of that instance is Hodor. We will come to know if he has done something else too
How did Meera’s voice go through Bran and into Wyllis?
That part didn’t make sense tbh
Vlad,
To prove how strong he is, it’s probally done to all the new kings.
Ok, let’s stop.
We won’t agree, on this. We clearly view stories in general, very different, not only this one.
I hope Jorah’s aunt at Bear Island makes an appearance in armor. That would be awesome. I’m surprised the Knights of the Vale are at Mote Caleyn since Ramsay actually drove the invaders out of there. I’m guessing like in the books Jon will gather those various small houses and groups in the North to join his ranks like what happened during the pink wax letter shenanigans.
Am I the only one who didn’t like Sansa trusting LF’s remarks about uncle BlackFish? Does she know for a fact that anything is happening at River Run? Seemed like some of the old ignorant Sansa emerging. I don’t know if we’re getting a Sansa who is acting with a false sense of superiority and is going to fail hard soon or one who is going to end up all LF style with the secret bs plots.
Still waiting for the Tyrell army to hit Kings Landing and deal with the Sparrow. I’m guessing Brienne is off to be captured on the way to River Run by a certain pissed off zombie.
ghost of winterfell,
I hope so too. The way I see it is that LF will come out of this looking like a hero for helping Jon and I wouldn’t be surprised if he gets Sansa to agree to marry him. The only thing that would throw a wrench in his plans is the Northern houses supporting Jon as heir/lord/KITN over Sansa, and her agreeing to it without letting sibling rivalry get in the way. I think LF expects to be warden and Lord of Winterfell via marriage to Sansa, so that would ruin his plans.
Can you imagine what will happen if Bran rides in with the R+L=J reveal and LF is there to find out? LF is the scariest and most dangerous character imo.
Hounded,
Why would some Northern lord know the intimate details of what went down in King’s Landing in season 1?
Vlad,
Not ”all” the fleet.
The ”best ships”.
Yes, I think this has a big implication moving forward. I wonder what else he’s done?????
I would’ve loved to have one of the CoTF coming along with Bran and Meera, they just look so beautiful!
By the way, the stones around the tree of the three-eyed-raven are aligned the same as the horse heads the WW’s placed in season 3
http://3g28wn33sno63ljjq514qr87.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/HorseCorpses.jpg|
Loved Jorah and Dany! I’m afraid we might not see Jorah again this season.
Kind of dissapointed with Arya but I’m sure it all pays off
The Greyjoy part was bad. The new Greyjoy leader just had his entire fleet stolen, and people still want him as their leader? The scene felt rushed to me, although I did like the drowning ritual.
This is the same guy who thinks he’s the storm and the drowned god. He seems very ambitious lol 😛
Guys, Sansa didn’t compare Jon to Ramsey in regards to their likeness. She compared them in regards to house loyalty. She was saying that houses have rallied around a bastard (Ramsey) so it isn’t far fetched for Stark loyal houses to rally around Jon.
TFT,
”the best ships”
Not the entire iron fleet.
Thank you! This cannot be stated often enough. 😀
TormundsBeard,
Agreed.
Flayed Potatoes,
Yeah, but I still think he didn’t truly mean 1000 ships..
RonSleet,
Ramsay drove the Ironborn out of Moat Cailin and they were probably replaced with Bolton soldiers. LF could just claim he’s allied with the Boltons to get his army garrisoned there.
Surprised by the Hodor scenario. Sad about Summer and hope that Hodor survives. Not sure how I feel about this one. Shame that Bran didn’t go back to TOJ, if he had it might have saved the Night’s King and his horde from overtaking the Children and the cave. Ooh, what happens now!
Atish Vaze,
Yes it’s a closed loop thing.He can’t change the past in a way that things in the present will change cause it has already happened.He has already done it.But in this case it was bloodraven who brings him there cause he needed hodor to become hodor.It was meant to happen.
Holdor will reanimate and be a killing zombie for the WW.
Flayed Potatoes,
Most likely. He rode ahead, to meet Sansa.
I kinda feel a bit, a tinny bit, sorry for him…he didn’t know.
Kingsmoot was ok, but I don’t know what will happen next. The Iron Islands plot is much better than Dorne in the show I think.
But I don’t think that Iran will be the next big villain in the show. I think the biggest role he can get is Cersei’ right hand, or maybe even Dany’s ally if he kills Yara.
There is nothing magical about him and that was his biggest advantage over Ramsay, Tywin, LF and other villains. I don’t like this decision . But we will see. I’m afraid that he will get Doran’s treatment.
Meco,
Please no….
Daegon,
I felt the same… It’s a pain to bear for how he’s the most innocent character ever introduced so far, whose fate was laid from the start…
mau,
I doubt it. The casting call mentioned that it was quite a big role.
That can’t end with 2 scenes. He will most likely attack the Reach/Oldtown.
Mihnea,
I will definitely become more active now because this season has just been amazing!
Flayed Potatoes,
Yup Jon will be KitN and LF won’t like that one bit. I also want Sansa to outwit him somehow and not fall for his provocations.
TormundsBeard,
I think some people take issue with this because Jon is very sensitive about his bastard status and it’s one of the reasons he was hesitant to go and fight the Boltons last episode. He doesn’t think houses will support him because of his bastard status, whereas Ramsay was at least legitimized and the Boltons were placed in Winterfell by the Crown. It’s like rubbing salt into the wound, I guess.
I’m sure Sansa means well and I get why she made the comparison, but it’s one of those things that sounds better in your head than when you say them out loud if that makes sense. She also has no military experience and hasn’t dealt with Northern houses, so she’s being a bit idealistic. We’ll have to see if her outlook changes when she deals with them directly.
Labs,
Glad to see you are enjoying it!!
Yeah, I don’t think he can do it at will, but he can mess things up accidentally for sure. It’s unfortunate though since that does mean that he has to be careful when experiencing past events through visions.
What’s the runtime for this, is it the full episode?
Daughter of Winter,
53 minutes…..weirdly because the official runtime is 57 and I doubt the credits are 3 minutes.
I can clearly see it now.
Dany gets the Dothraki, now the Iron fleet.
And last
Benjen involved I think. Whether it is a BenHands/ ColdJen is the real mystery.
It might be the CotF took him prisoner at the behest of Bloodraven, knowing he would be needed to get Bran back. That’s the best explanation for a living Benjen.
It’s not a bad explanation for a dead one, too.
Steel_Wind,
Yeah. I think he’ll be back just because, now will be the best time. He was mentioned last season at the assassination and we got him now, in the flashbacks.
Jinx47,
Yeah what was that about?
I thought that was one of the Spears that the children of the forest were using?
OMG JACK BENDER!!! This guy should direct every episode from now on. I almost had a heart attack. Summer…. Hodor…. 3ER…. Second best episode of the whole series. Almost a Hardhome.
Mihnea,
Alright, must’ve remembered that wrong
I agree, I had high hopes for this man ever since he was announced. 🙂
If the plot need that, they will know.
OMG!!! I saw this thread and couldn’t resist going to look. In tears right now 🙁
I’ll come back when I’ve got a grip…..
Wow! Just wow!!!! I don’t seem to have much lucid thought past that. Amazing!! Heartbreaking, dramatic……..bfhhrtjvdrjmkjgfxefnvgrhkllbds…..bleh!!
mau,
I doubt it will even come out, at this point in the story.
I get the impression he wants to go after Yara and Theon. And if they survive, he can’t.
mau,
Also any opinions on the other scenes Mau? I’m just curious..
Yes, but you could see how other people and Jon looked at her when she said she is the real Stark.Awkward, I don’t know.. she was acting weird.
Lionthing,
Sansa badasses over Littlefinger, and rejects his Knights help. Sends Brienne to Riverrun where her Great Uncle, the Blackfish, has rallied a small force of Tullys. Sansa, Jon, Davos, Brienne, Meli etc all leave together to find support in the North. Sansa makes Jon a cloak like Neds, Hype.
Ayra gets her ass beat again, then gets a mission, she watches a play as actors play out a slightly bent version of her Father’s death, and then kills the lead actress, completing her mission.
Bran has a vision of the Children of the Forest creating the Night’s King, and the whites, which they did to fight the first men, which ended up being a mistake.
King’s Moot. Euron arrives, admits his crime, and rallies the Ironborn. Yara and Theon flee having lost the King’s Moot, stealing the best ships. Euron commands his men to build new ones, so he can go and meet Dany. Hype.
Dany accepts Jorah’s service again, but he reveals his greyscale, says he’ll end his life before it consumes him, tells her he loves her, and then tries to leave, she commands him to do whatever he can to find a cure.
In Meereen, Tyrion and Varys meet the high priestess of Rhallor, and she knows quite a lot about Varys’ past, and she goes out to increase their popularity in the city.
Bran sneaks into a vision, to go back to the scene where the nights king was created, instead he finds it to be Winter, and the army of whites standing there staring at nothing, eventually the Night’s King spots him, grabs him, and Bran’s vision ends, he feels immense pain, and it is revealed that the Night’s King touching him allows him to enter the tree, and that he will be coming for them. The Three-eyed-Raven tells him its time for Bran to become him, and that he isnt ready, and takes him into a vision to show him whatever he can he the time left.
The big Finale. The Night King arrives at the tree, with his whites, and tries to enter, with Bran still in a vision, the Children try to fend them off as best they can, but are overwhelmed, eventually, Meera’s voice appears inside Brans’ vision, like a voice from the heavens “wake up bran, we need hodor, warg into hodor”. The three-eyed-ravens tells him to follow the command. By this point, in the real world, Hodor is pulling bran on his sledge down a passage to safety, the children do their best to stop the oncoming onslaught of whites. Summer stays to fend them off, diving in and sacrificing herself for their safety (RIP Summer :'( ) – next, still running down the tunnel, Leaf, the Child of the Forest, sacrifices herself with an explosion to kill off the rest.
Finally, the the end of the Tunnel, Meera and Hodor, along with Bran who has still not woken up have reached a door. Back to the vision, Bran sees Willis, following the command he Wargs through Willis, to Hodor, of course, the same person. Bran sees Hodor doing everything he can to “Hold the door” whilst meera escapes.
In the vision, Willis falls down, fitting, and repeating the words “Hold the Door”.. and continues to do so, losing his mind, whilst Hodor in real life, Holds the door, and sadly, and dramatically, slowly ripped apart by whites, sacrificing his life for Bran/Meera, and you finally find out why he says Hodor, because all along he was destined to die, holding the door.
Best episode ever!
I saw some of the scenes, i didnt see the kingsmoot part, Arya part, Dany part, Jon part with Sansa and co planning on what to do, only the Bran scenes, which i wished i saved for tonight to watch in HD. Shame on me!!
Not read all the comments yet but choose to watch this over the stream rather than be spoiled. People at Westeros.org are going to freak as there are a lot of Winds of Winter spoilers in there.
Giving it a second watch now but it was gripping TV, non-stop just doesn’t let up and I am agreeing with D&D that this is the best season so far.
mau,
If that is where he truly goes, I think Dany will be the one to kill him.
Will see though, the casting notice sounded to big, in my opinion, to just kill him now.
Mihnea,
Robert’ s death came out last season, and that was S1 material as well.
Vlad,
Dont fool yourself and dont call george martin in your defence . Martin is been pretty clear in his statements ( just see wiki) to compare the children oggi the forest to the sidhe also known as the aesi , the mythical elves oggi gaelic world who controlled the good forces of the nature , and their counterpart Are the fomorians also known as the jotun o jotunar , the ice supernatural demigods responsible for the long night and the climate change with the long winter in the ragnarok . The ragnarok ends with a great final clash between the gods heroes and humans on one side and the jotunar on the other ; the world is nearly destroyed , many gods and heroes sacrifice themselves for the victory , there are Earthquakes that submerge a lot of known lands ( explanation for the horn of winter waking the giants from the earth ) . The survivors to the havoc remake the world again , a New world . U wanted a truce a pact with the others ?? Coz They have Noble motives? The ones being til today , busy killing hundreds of thousands of human people Beyond the wall ???.
I totally agree. Thanks for understanding what I meant. Wasnt sure if what i wrote made sense 😀
Mihnea,
I didn’t say that he will die for sure. But if he is going to Meereen he will either be killed or became Dany’s ally, and both are disappointing IMO.
mau,
Touche…
I did not read the article, nor the comments.
Honestly, I cannot understand why anyone would want to deliberately deprive oneself of the joy to watch the episode without knowing. Really guys, it will air in a few hours. Don’t do this to yourselves.
Having said that, I am out of here.
mau,
Ally, I doubt. Especially if Yara and Theon get there first.
Sou,
Well, I did watch the episode without knowing….
littlefinger just activate sansa’s bitch mode….he manipulate her and no she manipulate jon by keeping crusial information and when brienne ask why she lied the scene goes withj sansa giving him a gift…her jon=ramsay speech and her “i am a stark” and the smirk at the end… was weird it make sense but is terrible to hear and to say….jon will obviously trust her but what will happen when he will learn that she deal with littlefinger…behind his back?…..
Mihnea,
I don’t believe anything he says lmao. He’s the cockroach of Westeros to me.
ghost of winterfell,
Jon is morphing into Ned 2.0 in front of our eyes. I hope he doesn’t develop the same…um…. decision-making skills lol.
LF has like 10 contingency plans in case something goes wrong. It seems like it will be difficult for Sansa to outwit him. I hope she finds a way.
Mihnea,
I often don’t write anything abut the scenes I like. 😀
And I think that Kingsmoot was good scene, but Euorn is not someone who seems like an amazing character in the show. He is good, but too ordinary.
I think this episode was really good, and this season was very good. My favorite season was S4, and E4 and E5 were the weakest episodes of that season, and here they are very strong.
I can only imagine how good E6-10 will be.
And I really liked their explanation for Blackfish and Riverrun. It is the best option they had, since they decided to delay that storyline. It will feel natural to the story.
The worst option was to pretend that he has held that castle since S3.
The ending made me cry, like i never cry during a show ever. The music playing when Hodor was holding the door being held back by the wights and then it ending with Wyllis becoming Hodor, saying “hold the door” into “Hodor” and it ending with no music made me cry :'(
RIP Summer and Hodor 🙁
UNCLE BENJEN TO THE RESCUE!!
It would be so awesome to see if its actually Benjen who saves Meera and Bran, it would ease the pain after what happened at the cave….
ghost of winterfell,
Perhaps Sansa won’t have to go to LF, but LF will bring the army regardless, showing her that he “truly” cares, winning favour with the Starks again.
***
I don’t get the hate for Sansa. She may have lied to protect either LF, Jon or both. It is too soon to judge her.
Sou,
I live in Europe and the episode will be airing too late for us here. This was the perfect time.
mau,
Good to see you liked the episode overal.
I agree, the episodes are very strong, much stronger then usual!
Also agree on the BF, it made sense and even made him look even more badass!
Antares,
Agreed.
The episode overall was great (RIP Hodor and Summer – Season 6 is definetely no “Time for Wolves” 🙁 ), but there are still some plotholes or at least open questions that bother me:
– So, the Vale army is “encamped” at Moat Cailin right now. Does this mean the knights of the Vale laid siege to Moat Cailin, which was never taken from the southern side before?! In this case Ramsey would know that they are trying to invade the North, so he will be prepared. And how did Littlefinger manage to get through Moat Cailin unseen? From Runestone to Mole’s Town through enemy territory in only 1 episode, that must be a new record!
– I get that Sansa is mad at LF and does not want to be dependent on him anymore, but turning down his offer to help her out with the Vale army is just stupid. She herself has noone to fight for her and Jon only “has” 2.000 wildlings, who btw never agreed to fight for him or the Stark cause. So she turns down LF’s offer to invade the North with a large, fresh, unscathed army, but immediately after that sends Brienne to get the Blackfish and his remaining Tully forces (probably just a few hundred men), who are busy with holding Riverrun against the Freys and Lannisters? And LF is supposed to tell the Vale knights “Sorry lads, Sansa does not want our help, let’s go home”? Also, why did she lie to Jon about her meeting with LF? Jon has never met him before and probably never heard anything about him, so why keep their meeting secret?
– In their strategy meeting Jon and Sansa mention that the largest Northern forces are the Umbers, Karstarks and Manderlys. Sansa says “Fuck the Umbers, they gave Rickon to Ramsay”, but where did she get that information from? She did not know his whereabouts and Ramsay only wrote that he has Rickon, but not that it was the Smalljon who handed him over. Then she wants to ask the Karstarks for help instead, the only Northern house which has a good reason to support the Boltons… and noone even considers talking to the Manderlys, who are the only “big” house, who have not declared for Ramsey yet? But fine, go rally all the small houses instead 😀
– The scenes with Bran and Bloodraven were confusing and felt a bit rushed. So, the Children of the Forest “made” the White Walkers? And now they are helping Bran and Bloodraven, who are fighting against them? ö.Ö The NK touching Bran in a vision enabled him to locate and enter the cave in the present? Bloodraven – knowing that they are running out of time and that Bran has to leave though he is “not ready” – uses his last opportunity to show Bran something significant for another Winterfell backyard visit?!? And what exactly happened with Hodor? Did Bran warg him while still being in a vision of the past, so that he accidently warged the Past-/Vision-Hodor, too, creating some kind of time paradoxon? Young Wyllis would never have become Hodor if Present-Hodor would not have to “hold the door”… and if Bran was still warging Hodor when he died, isn’t his mind lost now?
There is also one thing that really annoys me this season: They are (re-)introducing so many great characters only to kill them off in the first or second scene in which they appear, with little or no dialogue or significant actions done before … basically only bringing them back for a good, shocking death scene to keep the body count up: Doran, Trystane, Areo, Roose, Balon, Osha, Khal Moro, Hodor (though his death at least had some significance)… you could put Summer and Shaggydog on the list as well. I guess Rickon and the Blackfish are next :/ I hope they keep the Hound around for a while once he is back.
mau,
Yup, watching the episode on a sunday evening is much better then at 8 AM on monday morning before going to work..
lord of blogfell,
I hate in the story that Sansa is manipulating Jon, but I like that she is not just a good and honorable person.
I thought she would find out about Ned from Brienne (who could know this from Cat), but I was wrong.
YouHoldTheDoor,
The way I understood that scene is that while Bran is at Winterfell, he can still hear Meera as he is kind of the bridge between the past and the present. When BloodRaven tells him to warg into Wylis, he does. Young Wylis in proxy, can hear Meera since Bran warged into him. As Meera is telling Hodor to hold the door in the present, that is what Wylis hears from the present and says in the past. That is how hold the door became Hodor. If Bran did not warg into Wylis in the past, he would have never became Hodor and it would have ruined the timeline. I’m sorry if my explanation isn’t great!
Bran will definitely feel a lot of remorse for what he did to Hodor 🙁
Mihnea,
Did you watch it yourself? Is it abrupt?
Mihnea,
I would like every episode to leak 10 hours earlier. 😀
That was the saddest death yet…I can’t believe how heartbreaking the death was.
And common!!!!! Stop killing the dire wolves already.
Also, who is leaking these episode? I only watched it because I’m in Europe and If I wanted to watch Monday after work as I usually do, I would have to go through another Monday trying not to catch any spoilers (and I work in social media, so can’t avoid it)
Daughter of Winter,
Not really, the episode flows quite nicely.
The intro is there and about 5 seconds of credits.
mau,
Me too, me too.
Curse us for living in this barbaric and uncivilized place that is called Europe!!!
😛
Jonida,
HBO Nordic, screwed thing and released the episode earlier..
So HBO leaked it…
I think thats how its going to play out. LF is probalby saving the day in the big battle, and dont really like that:/
Mihnea,
I know many of you guys hate them but Elio and Linda recently uploaded a video speculating that the CotF was responsible for creating the WW and lost control of them somehow. And I’ve seen it round and about Westeros.org too so yes, there are a lot of book readers who believed this.
Mihnea,
ugh, me too.
Jonida,
HBO Nordic accidentally aired it.
taim,
I don’t like it……but that is why I like it…
Does this make sense to you?
Episode running times for this show always include the opening and closing credits, and are rounded up a minute if the show goes even one second over the preceding minute.
Just for clarification.
Same here! I only watched the Sansa/Jon scenes and the Bran scenes and I regret it a little bit 🙁
Mihnea,
Esti roman ? :))
How did Sansa find out that the Umbers gave Rickon away?
Did they send the Umbers a raven and they were like “no thanks”????
Geone,
Da. 🙂
? I dont like it because it would kind of lessen The starks win over Ramsey if LF comes to the rescue. Sansa just could have taken LFs offer, because they obviously dont have enough men for the battle.
No LF is kind of the saviour if he comes in without the agreement of Sansa.
The wights were crawling on the damn ceiling of the cave! Spider-Wights, lmao.
We need more explanation on how the Children of the forest created the White Walkers, the man they turned into a white walker in that vision was the guy who is now playing the Night King. Also, how can they raise the dead? We need more to go with here!!
ps. the way Bloodraven died was kind of sad to me, when he turns into that black smoke (?) in the vision was pretty cool. The magic in this episode was insane! when the Night King cracked the ice like that was fucking awesome!!
As a book-reader myself, i always had this hunch that the COTF were involved in creating the WW.
Flayed Potatoes,
It’s probally common knowledge by now.
They clearly know the Umbers joined the Boltons,.
Areo has been just an extra in the show. Doran and Trystan were not brought back in E1 to be killed off. They appeared in E10 of the last season, you can’t compare them with Osha.
Osha, yes, just brought back to be killed off. But that is better than to be forgotten.
Khal Moro wasn’t brought back, he was introduced this season and appeared in 3 episodes, just like Kraznys in S3, so nothing is rushed there.
Roose’s death was foreshadowed since S5 and he wasn’t brought back, he has appeared in every season since S2. His death openedthe season, just like Joffrey’s in S4, nothing unusual there.
Jonida,
HBO Nordic accidentally put a streaming leak some 12 – 13 hours ago today.
taim,
I said. I like it…because I feel a bit uncomfortable with the idea.
And asks if that makes sense. 🙂
I didn’t mean to be rude or anything!
Hopefully Jorah’s departure isn’t Gendry 2.0
Shadow Shifter,
Because that was a good theory and it makes sense, even if that isn’t shocking.
Mihnea,
Banuiam :))
Geone,
Ian Glenn kinda confirmed in a interview he will be back.
But I think he will come with Sansa’s agreement.
Geone,
Numele ma da de gol! 🙂
Mihnea,
Oh, that’s good. I also think that we will see Gendry again when Arya comes back to Westeros.
As book reader as well, I had no idea. I read about the theory literally hours before the leak on Reddit and I was sold. When I actually saw the episode, I was completely mindblown.
Jinx47,
No real treatment for greyscale
mau,
Hopefully.. But I don’t know, the ”villian” saving our ”heroes” does sound like something GOT would do..
This is was seriously my favoriote episode out of all season. The last 10 minutes were the best thing I have ever seen on televesion. I still have goosebumps, 5 minutes later
Mihnea,
Daaa, al meu e George, pot sa ma ascund bine :)) L-am articulat un pic aici 🙂
Stannis,
But the hodor story was a bit M.night shyamlan like from Signs
Fancy word for a sellsword,
Jonida,
fuck sake wtf did Brans direwolf and hodor have to die
Flayed Potatoes,
Probably lol
Aparently they declared for ramsay so I guess the rickon stuff was included in that declaration
Geone,
I feel like a potential cure for Greyscale is something that the Red God followers might know about. Tyrion and Varys met with the High Priestess in this episode. I can imagine all of this becoming connected by the end of the season. I can imagine Jorah disappearing for a few episodes though before popping up again near the end of the season.
Geone,
Yup, S7 is my bet for him.
Anyone still hoped that Summer will get through all those Wights in the end ? I’m still gutted that another direwolf died. Hopefully this is just for budget reasons and in the books the direwolves will not bite the dust.
Wasn’t Shireen cured from greyscale ? So a cure is around surely, but given the fact that Shireen was treated by alot of doctors and so on, noone could tell which cure was successful.
Geone,
I think they just decided, they are to expensive and require to much work into it, and they give to little in return to the over-arching story.
But Yeah I was gutted, his screams were really painful to hear!
Antares,
maybe but she lied to the only man she can fully trust right in her life,he will fight for her and maybe die for her knowing that she lied to him, i can see now the sansa from the books…what she said at the briefing are words f full of dagger in the back “jon is a snow and will always will be even if he is written in the paper as a stark” she was also a bitch to davos by saying that that “northeners are loyal and don’t trust outsider” targetting davos jon gave her “ookaaay that was weird look” and finally she lied to jon when it wasn’t necessary jon is completly in the trust in her so she make a mistake
Some thoughts about the Arya scenes..
Isnt it interesting, that Arya has to kill a Cersei, like in her List. Of course its not THE Cersei. But i think this makes it almost like a prophecy. I think its a test from Jaqen to see if she can stick to her task, especially in those special circumstances. Oh and did Arya know that Sansa had to marry Tyrion? Now she learned that as well.
Geone,
Exactly!
Is anyone wondering why the WW are no longer working with the COTF but fighting them and willing to kill them?
Yeah, well, me too. Only I wasn’t being serious about it and was spitballing dumbass ideas with other fans.
Hodor meaning “Hold the door” is uncomfortably close to the racist “What has six legs and says Ho De Do?” joke.
Iain Glen actually gave a huge interview and a small part was published two days ago.
http://webogi.com/t9rwzT
At the bottom it says that it’s just a small part of the whole thing, which will be published in June. Basically that’s a normal thing and we know from other actors, that the interviews are always divided into small parts before we get the whole thing. Based on this, there will still be some Jorah action later this season.
Ser Pounce,
The COTF most likely lost control of them.
I think will get more backstory closer to the ending, S7 seams a good bet.
I believe that Arya ironically will spare the actress that plays Cersei, but she will kill the real Cersei in the not so distant future. Also i think that is the moment when she will decide to leave the FM and the Waif will be chasing her, and Arya will kill her too. She will always be a Stark, and will never forget what her family went through.
Flayed Potatoes,
Maybe some henchman of the Umbers got wind of the treason, but couldn’t act against his liege lord. So, out of shame, he went to CB and took the black and shared his information.
That was hard to watch … the last part. I cried like a baby. I was surprisingly sad about the 3ER (Max Von Sydow’s fault) … then Summer broke my heart (Why do they have to kill all the direwolves … and listened Summer, awful) … but, then … the Hodor part … the combination of present and past … young Hodor… I cried so much.
The Kingsmoot was so amazing … I didn’t expect Euron to tell everyone he paid the Iron price… That was so badass … Masterful scene. I loved it.
Sansa/Littlefinger was interesting … I knew it was Littlefinger who suggested to look for the Blackfish… OMG, I have a feeling Arya will make an appearance in Winterfell this season. Please!!!!, only Nymeria’s pack of wolves could compensate the loss of both Summer and Shaggydog.
I think it’s because they realized that they were more powerful and wanted to become independent from the COTF. When the COTF tried to stop them, they viewed their creator as an enemy. It’s kind of like the WW saying to the COTF that there are “no strings attached” to them anymore.
Antares,
Or it’s common knowledge in the North by know… Seems the better explenation..
Did the Children of the Forest intend to have the White Walkers raise the dead? Or did they do it unknowingly? Hmmm, I want more about that. That one scene wasn’t enough on how the White Walkers can do what they do.
Ser Pounce,
One good reason might be that the WW still have some human conscience in them and they are pissed that the COTF sacrificed them and making them these creatures. I don’t think they are too happy to live their lifes as a WW. Also GRRM stated on numerous occasions that the WW aren’t just mindless killing machines, hopefully this will be explored more in the future episodes and in the books too.
Labs,
Loved that scene in the Avengers.
These United States’s presidents yo…Bush did 9/11 and Obama did leak Game of Thrones episodes.
RBloodworth,
I understand how you feel, but no one has sung just yet. There are 2 more seasons to go. Look, they were created by CofT, but that was thousands of years ago, and from man. So, what have they been doing for thousands of years? clearly, they are organized and at least a little thoughtful (not in the Hallmark way). They have not been out to destruct for all this time, so they must be content somewhere doing something. And for some reason they have been called back to deal with something. So, they MUST be more interesting than just being WMDs, regardless of how they came to be.
And, now it seems there are no more CofT, so man and anti-man will still have to come to terms somehow. Battle? sure. absolutely. But, also, there is still room for something more. I could be wishful thinking. That happens.
Speaking of battle, after the emotional turmoil of the episode, I do not see many people mentioning yet that we once again got a very clear shot of how they deal with fire. Thus, we got a pretty good idea of the physical power struggle to come.
The WW can walk right through the fire and put it out. The wights cannot. But, once the WW put out the fire, the wights are a go. This is interesting in terms of how Danny’s fire thing and the dragons will play into the wars to come.
also, the fuckety fuck fuck time travel paradox. I’m not going in on that. I refuse to get sucked into it again. nope. This explains so much. Why GRRM was watching LOST with such interest, why he said “i do not want to shit the bed like LOST,” why Bender directed. Just gonna leave that there and walk away.
The acting and emotion of this episode was bar none. each scene was gorgeous.
The tin foil will be grade A starting tonight. tehe.
Antares,
I think that it is more likely that Sansa knew from Theon that Rickon went to the Umbers and when she read the letter she assumed that the Umbers delivered Rickon to Ramsay. It’s a big stretch too …
Another theory might be that the GNC it is in effect and Sansa knows about it.
Connor,
COTF probably didn’t realize what they created until it was too late, kind of like how nuclear weapons were created without knowing what would be the real consequences on our world.
Mihnea,
I know right? I loved it too! I don’t know if you watched the new Captain America movie but it’s really good! Especially the fighting sequence!
Labs,
Haven’t got to it unfortunatly but it is on my list!!
Nice to hear it’s good!
Izatty,
That was some usual fire, the Dragons breathe dragonfire, from which Dragonglass is made, which when used against the WW is deadly. The magic from the dragons can hurt the WW (the fire breathen by them).
Geone,
That seems to be the reason she was given the assignment in the first place. It’s the ultimate test to show if she truly has left behind Arya Stark and is “no one”.
RawJah,
i think this kill was ordered by cersei, like how qyburn and mountain are told to go kill everyone who talks shit about her. when arya figures that out, she will be out of there. no way she kills for cersei.
Sean C.,
Bran will find out I think. Somehow.
Izatty,
Nope, she will kill Cersei.
Mihnea,
Believe me you are not alone…wow, I’m still reeling. Can’t wait to see it again tonight on HBONOW. It swept me away. Kingsmoot a bit hurried, but still good and overall it was just so amazing. Everytime I think I have a favorite episode another comes along and kicks me. Poor Hodor and Summer….someone here mentioned the wolves are getting slaughtered…I hope it’s not an omen. We are down to Nymeria and Ghost…scary.
Amazing, sad, blown away, just a few things that sum up how I feel right now.
Geone,
I think it will be
[Spoiler] why did the bloodraven say that ‘now its time for you to become me’ and take Bran back to winterfell to make Hodor (gulp, gulp, sob], Hodor?
Can someone please explain the connotations of this? Is Bran the Three-eyed Raven? Is Bran going to become coldhands? Cause you know, the mark on his hands and all??
And WTF BRAN!
[\Spoiler]
” A girl has decided.” Am I the only one thinking that Arya doesn’t want to kill a decent woman and will make a run for it?
Aside from all the craziness happening in westeros, all things seem to be leading to the second siege of Meereen. where Euron arrives and helps fight against the Masters. That would be epic.
*****STILL WAITING TO SEE DROGON******
Mihnea,
Yikes. 😐
And despite that, Sansa didn’t feel any regret for rejecting the Arryn army. Oh boy….we’re in for a crazy ride…
TheRealwolf,
It’s a good possibility.
A dark thought crossed my mind … Bear with me.
So, in the show, it is clearly stated that Bran can change the past to some degree. Let’s say that maybe the guilt he will feel for Hodor will make him stay away from interacting with what already happened (like BR said in the trailers “The past is already written. The ink is dry. We watch, we listen and we remember). But this is too much of a risk for the show/books, what if his life is threatened again or something like that … I guess the only way to be sure that the past won’t be altered is killing Bran off. I fear this could happen at some point in the future … Hopefully i’m wrong.
Flayed Potatoes,
Got your tickets? 🙂
Guys.. I’m not ok. RIP Hodor.
I’m not watching yet but did Euron have the dragon horn?
Mihnea,
Yep, i think that Jaime might be the valonqar in the Maggy’s prophecy …
Geone,
Well, that would be end-game material, I think the season he is safe.
He still needs to tell Jon about the TOJ!
Jinx47,
There are strong hints in the books that fire can cure greyscale although nothing yet has been proved.
JamesL,
No.
Plus, Sansa is like the stupidest girl or is she cleverest? She wants Jon to fight for her, but reminds him that he is a bastard.I hate her,Forget about what happened to her in the past, I just plain don’t like her that she actually led LF to manipulate her, knowing full well all his manipulations and how he uses people. Plus she’s trying to play Jon? Seriously? I mean come on, give the man a break
Read the recap and think that it was like a “driveby” warging, it was an accident?
RawJah,
I think killing the actress is a test from the Faceless Men to see if she truly is No One.
I wouldn’t be surprised if Arya ends up killing the real Cersei too. Forshadowing!
Lyanna_Targaryen,
Something like this is my guess.
Or he did it on purpose, knowing he’ll need Hodor to be just like this and hold the door….This is the sadder option..
Mihnea,
I hopped on the Northern train in season 1. I’m not leaving it. #FreeTheStarks #SaveTheDirewolves
I meant after that, after this season, if he makes it in the endgame … I’m not so sure, but alas, i was 80 % sure that Rickon will be the one to inherit Winterfell, and after what happened in this season, that theory is close to breaking point.
Geone,
How should Theon know? Yes, they escaped him, this he knows, but not where they went.
Bran is giving me some serious Frodo vibes and I wonder if his fate will be the same as his.
Hodor Held the door, but I can’t hold my tears… And Summer!!
Flayed Potatoes,
LOL!
Can we make a #HeHeldtheDoor in memory of our hero?
Mihnea,
He couldn’t know … because he just recently discovered his greensight and so on, when Hodor was a kid, Bran wasn’t even born …
Flayed Potatoes,
Going by the next two episodes descriptions, it seems that Arya will
We might get Nymeria and her wolfpack this season, and a reunion between Arya and Nymeria! I am excited to see if that happens, it will be a happy moment for Arya. 😀
Geone,
My original speculation too, but it’s really getting destroyed right now LOL.
Mihnea,
I think bloodraven is the one who did it on purpose.He took bran there cause he knew it was time for hodor to become hodor,cause it was always meant to happen.
I don’t really think she acted as horribly as most of you are saying she did. Sure, she lied to Jon about LF, the Blackfish and the Vale armies. That is bad and will have repercussions later on, I’m sure of it.
But, well, when she compared him to Ramsay…she was right. Within the Show’s own context, a Bastard who killed his father is ruling the North. Yes, he was made a Bolton, but I really doubt the Lords and Ladies care about that…he’ll always be Roose’s bastard. Jon is also a bastard, that’s pretty clear, but when Sansa was comparing both of them, she was doing it because of the way Northeners believe in power. As soon as Jon shows his strength, many Northern Houses will follow him, the same as many other Houses are following Ramsay, just because of the sheer fear he inspires.
This is, of course, something that happens on the Show. Kinslaying doesn’t seem much of a problem (the way Euron talks about killing Yara and Theon), the same with bastards. Sansa mentions herself as the Stark because she is, indeed, a Stark. They already have the Stark name on her, they shouldn’t worry about Jon being a bastard.
Besides, even Brienne calls on Sansa on her lying to Jon, and it’s clear she feels bad about it, just look at her face (by the way, Sophie’s acting this season is superb). She’s got used to lies, that’s all. She realizes it on that very moment. It’s what happens when your “protector” is LF, and your husband Ramsay. You lie to survive.
But she still makes him the new Stark clothers, as close as the ones Ned wore, and she still acted very nicely to him on that scene. Jon also didn’t seem too hurt about the whole “bastard” stuff. I think some of you are looking the wrong way about her scenes last episode.
Geone,
Yeah, but he was there in the vision… Agh, time-travel really messes my mind.
Jenny,
Yup, this is what I’m going with as well.
BTW, has been watcher for a while, didn’t think I’m capable of commenting with my limited knowledge. Has to comment today
RIP Hodor. RIP Summer 🙁
Oh man, this episode is going to gut me. Summer 🙁 Hodor 🙁
I haven’t watched it yet because I don’t want HBO’s lawyers coming after me, but I’m so glad I read the spoilers because if I had to watch the events with Bran and Co unprepared I’d be bigger mess than I am now.
I did see a screencap of Tormund’s look to Brienne as they leave CB…comedy gold! I ship them, man, I ship ’em hard.
What’s the screen time breakdown? Sounds like the Starks get the bulk of the time, yeah? Leaving, what, 20 minutes for Dany, Tyrion, and the Kingsmoot?
#JusticeForHodor
Also, was Kinvara calling Varys out? “As long as we serve the same queen, you have nothing to worry about.” *Varys looking super worried*
Maybe Varys is behind the Harpys?
And, also, doesn’t it suddenly seem like the political GoT is a completely different story then the mythical, fantasy GoT?
Interesting theory. I’m not sure, if Cersei really gives a shit about what people in Braavos think of her. But could be, nontheless. REally interesting thought.
You guys really hate confident women don’t you? First Daenerys now Sansa. I see you.
TheRealwolf,
Welcome to the Wall! Don’t be shy, we are, mostly a very nice and polite community!
But, don’t you think the CofT fire is somewhat magical too? I mean that was a very purposeful scene- exactly about fire. IDK, seemed like they were trying to show something more than just what appears on the surface.
But wasn’t Hodor already a bit slow ? Maybe in the end he would become Hodor no matter what Bran did, they just rushed it a bit.
Connor,
I agree 100%
I hope Nymeria doesn’t die lol.
Can someone please help a girl out? I’m so confused!
Who warged into Hodor to get him to move and start helping Meera and COTF. I thought it was Bran until I seen that Bran was still in the vision. I thought that for Bran to warg into Hodor that was where his mind had to be – surely he can’t have his mind in two places at once???
Also what made Hodor have his vision of hold the door? Was Bran warging into Hodor in the vision who then connected to Hodor in the present? Or was Bran not a part of it at all? OR did Bran just make Hodor have a vision?
I loved the ep but I didn’t have feels at the end because of how confusing I found it
Izatty,
I think it’s a normal evolution.
We start, with a preaty much normal world, that resambles our own but slowly, piece by piece we are being given, more and more fantasy elements!
Slowly the politics seem so pointless, so petty and meaningless in face of the real threat, the real enemy.
My question is, how would we react, if these horrors were all true?
In my opinion this is the main theme, not politics and backstabbing.
How would normal people, react if everything would be true?
Geone,
Or Hodor always needed to be Hodor, so he can hold the door and Bran surviving…so he can make him Hodor….
Time-travel is crazy..
Mihnea,
Thanks. She straight up told Qyburn, i his lab, use the little birds all over the lands to ferret out anyone who is talking shit about the Lannisters, even beyond KL. Mummers was a major way of disseminating information/propaganda.
On a second thought … it will be too easy for Dany to just ride her dragons over the WW and bathe them in dragonfire and that’s the end of it … The WW surely must have a weapon against Dragons too … Maybe they will be capable of warging them ?
BunBunStark,
Yeah pretty much.The Kingsmoot is reasonably long,Dany has a short scene and the Tyrion stuff is like seven minutes I think.Mostly North,Arya and Bran.
Geone,
She has to get there. There is no other way to stop them.
That doesn’t mean it will be easy or it will have a happy ending. I think all her dragons will die and perhaps even she will die in the final fight.
Theon didn’t know that Rickon went to the Umbers. He had no idea where they went.
BunBunStark,
Bran gets the bulk of the time then Sansa & Jon then Arya then the Greyjoys then Tyrion and then Jorah.
Mihnea,
interesting point. How would we react if there was a threat that could destroy all humanity and the world needed to come together to stop it? hmmmm….don’t think any political machinations have stopped. In fact, they seem to have gotten worse rather than better. Don’t think most average people have stopped to think about “winter.”
mau,
Yes, I know, not all of them were missing for a season or longer, but my point is that they all contributed little to nothing to the story since their first season 6 appearance.
– Doran apparantly had no “Fire & Blood masterplan” or no plan at all in the show and really was the weak man/leader that others saw in him, which makes his character somehow pointless. He did not even had good dialogue scenes, which is very disappointing, especially for the book readers.
– Trystane was placed on a ship with Myrcella’s body last season, heading straight towards an already paranoid Cercei… that seemed like a great build-up for some Mad Queen revenge plot against Dorne and ended up as the most stupid death scene the show has ever done.
– Show-Areo was a background character, yes, but his only purpose was to protect Doran. And he went down by being stabbed in the back and not even trying to fight back. If he had died after a short fight scene with the Martell guards while trying to defend Doran from Ellaria, it would have been a fitting end for him. Goddamn, he never even used his axe in the series 😀
– There was indeed a build-up for Ramsay killing Roose, but I would have preferred if they had kept him around for another 2-3 episodes. It would have been interesting to see his reaction to Smalljon handing over Rickon and him trying to rally the other houses against Jon and the wildlings while keeping Ramsey under control. We never really got to see Roose’s strategic skills or his distrust against Ramsey. The show made him way more naive than he is in the books. He should seen have his own death coming from a mile away 😀
– Balon’s death was long overdue and was okay for me
– Osha… yes, it made sense to kill her off quickly since she was no longer needed, but she only had one dialogue scene this season. A “farewell” scene with Rickon or some small “Ghost in Winterfell” plot would have been nice, but yes, it was okay.
– Introducing a whole bunch of new Dothraki characters only to barbeque them all after 2-3 scenes was a bit strange. At least one of the khals/warriors should have survived to lead Dany’s new Dothraki army into battle. I really liked Khal Moro after his appearance in episode 6×01 and thought he would end up supporting Dany, but he became a total asshole in the 6×04 scene.
– Shaggydog was killed off-screen, Summer only had one short scene this season…
– Now Hodor is gone, too 🙁 They are really trying to get rid off all the minor characters as quickly as they can. I guess there won’t be many supporting characters making it to the final season.
Ingelheim,
I love your theory about how she lied because she is so used to it by now. And I totally agree on S. Turner’s acting. 🙂
Sean C.,
Yep … maybe the GNC is in effect.
Also, can we brush off the theory that the Others and the Starks are related ?
Dammit, Sansa is being a selfish, manipulative liar. Is she just using Jon to get what she wants and then she will screw him over?
TheHeartTree,
there is a lot to unpack in that bit. I think Bran did have his mind in two places at once, and he can because of his powers. But for Hodor this was a mind melter.
Oh my god.
That ending was really sad an unexpected. Bran , your hubris is through the fucking roof! Look what you’ve done! I’m guessing he’ll hate himself for this, big time.
How in hell will Bran and Meera survive this… 🙁
That flaming mace dude from the trailer probably plays a part. Benjen? Coldhands?
The funniest part was when everyone left and only Edd remained with like ten guys so he was like I guess I’m Lord Comander lol.And I know most people think he is pretty much tost,but who knows guys he might make it.I have faith haha
Izatty,
I mean, they seem petty to us, not the characters. Compared to the WW and the threat of the end of world, the Tyrrel/Lannister conflict seems so…pointless, so meaningless, they fight one another, and in the end even if they ”win”, they help only the WW.
It’s also sad/depressing to see this, everyone is fighting among themselves, weakening themselves, ignorant that death is slowly coming for all of them.
Summer’s death KILLED me – whyyyy did he have to die?! It’s not real, it’s not real, it’s not real…I’m gonna have to keep telling myself this all day…
As far as Kinvara is concerned – I like that she mentioned Daenerys being the one that is “promised”, much as Melisandre said to Davos about Jon. I wonder if she and the other Red Priests/Priestesses know about Melisandre’s new mission of believing in and supporting Jon as TPWWP, versus Daenerys, and how that divide will affect everything to come.
Bran’s storyline has really wowed me this season – he wasn’t one of my favorite characters in previous seasons, but seeing just how important and powerful he truly is has totally gotten my attention. I’m surprised that Bloodraven died, but I figured we’d be losing him in some sense soon, since he said that Bran wouldn’t be stuck in the cave forever. Meera is a badass, thank the gods for her. With Bran being marked now, though…it’s definitely going to be a race against time for he and Meera. Uncle Benjen, where areee youuu?…
Arya’s story is starting to grip me finally…I think we see where it’s heading though. When she mentioned that the actress seemed like a decent person, and had some slight reservations when talking with Jaqen…a girl won’t get a third chance, so I’m excited to see Arya take on the Waif and head back to Westeros.
All in all, I loved this episode, even though the ending has made a mess of my soul for the day. I’m glad the WW finally made an appearance, and that we learned their origins, even if that did seem a bit…rushed somewhat.
Jenny,
Jon-”don’t knock it down, while I’m gone”
It’s going to fall, you just know it!
Mihnea,
i meant, in real life, we act petty too, especially politically, and are very well versed in denial. Just like the people of the realm.
I accidentally saw it on reddit last night-the details, not the actual show-and I’m just so sad about Hodor. His whole life was changed because of his future death. Because no one is allowed to warg into another person-and even worse-to warg into a person in the past while his future self is dying. But BR had to make him do it because it had already been done. If Hodor had been Wylis, he would have been a warrior and joined Ned in the rebellion or left Winterfell. He wouldn’t have been the one tasked with carrying Bran North of the Wall to BR in the first place…and sacrificing himself so Bran could live *sob*
He’s a hero and I hope Bran never forgets the damage his powers can do.
Jorah…now as soon as I read this I thought about something. I’ve been rewatching again. Did anyone realize Quaithe only spoke to Jorah in season 2 and then disappeared? And her second and last sighting she was painting protective magic on a guy traveling close to the Doom of Valyria where Jorah got his greyscale?
Wouldn’t it be cool if she shows up and saves his arm and then gives him some info that will help Dany? I say yes. This is my new dream for Jorah because I don’t want him to disappear.
Also BENJEN next episode. Seriously they need horses and Meera needs help. Benjen is coming. BTW I’m pretty sure Benjen knows a little something about Lyanna…and his family crypts…just saying.
Still watching tonight, even though it’s going to break my heart. Hodor needs more than a last call RIP. He needs a memorial statue. *sniffle*
Wylis wasn’t slow, that is why they showed Wylis in the flashback in episode 2, to show that Hodor wasn’t slow, that something happened to him that changed him completely. I personally don’t think it was rushed, as they set it up with the episode 2 flashback, that there was more to Hodor’s story. The ending finally shows us what really happened to Hodor, how he came to be and that Bran was ultimately the one that made him this way. It was truly heartbreaking.
OK having read all the comments and having watched the episode my head is buzzing for end game thoughts:
1) I agree Bran going through the wall with the Nights King mark may bring it down like it did the cave; this sounds like a perfect episode 10 moment.
2) I think we will see Coldhands save Bran and Meera rather than Benjen.
3) Sansa is still a bit of an idiot at times, but I generally like her story, it will be interesting how she gets the Knights of the Vale to fight later, I’m guessing she realises it’s the only option.
4) Euron bringing his fleet to Dany is clearly aligned with the books, I’m assuming she will kill him after arriving in Westeros.
5) The White Walker origin I am convinced is coming straight from GRRM. The Hodor stuff I would assume is also from GRRM but it may not be.
6) Dany I am becoming more convinced has to die, this story cannot end with dragons or white walkers still roaming around. I would suggest Jon is the ultimate protagonist and brings balance some how.
7) We know Bran will still have visions so most likely he tells Jon about his parents i.e. R+L=J and this is coming in the next few episodes once they find a weirwood to rest at. Isn’t there one near the wall?
8) I think Tyrion is making some mistakes in Meereen even if they are for the right reasons, I think both his recent decisions will come to bite him and the Sons of Harpy/Slavers will rise up only for Dany to run in and ruin the city before setting off for Westeros. I agree she may pull a Stannis and stop persuing the Iron throne in order to meet the white walkers.
Izatty,
I got that wrong, sorry!
Yeah you are right, here.
Jenny,
Seeing Edd with so few Night’s Watchmen got me SO nervous! They have so few people and resources…I don’t see them holding down Castle Black when the WW show up…they’ll probably just sweep right on thru with the cold and take Edd and the rest with them.
OMG, that is something I missed! This is definitely foreshadowing the Wall falling. I think this will be the ending scene of episode 10. That will be freaking awesome!
Kill the boy and let the man be born still hasn’t happened. Jon came back from the dead to be manipulated by some vengeful, selfish chick who contributed to her family’s tragedy in the first place. In the original draft of ASOIAF Martin had Sansa betray her family and die for it. Perhaps it’s what will happen in the show.
Wow! Just wow! Hodor! Hodor! Never again will we read those comments the same way again.
Labs,
As horribly bad as I felt for Hodor, I also felt terrible for Bran when he realized that he “made” Hodor the way he is. I wonder how that guilt will play out as Bran comes to grips with what has happened…”The past is already written, the ink is dry”…made sense before, but this ending demonstrated it to the fullest.
Mihnea,
Yeah I know it’s going to fall.GRRM put it there for it to fall otherwise there is no conflict lol.For the longest time I thought it was going to fall at the end of this season,but now I’m changing my mind.I feel like it’s too soon.Maybe sometime next season.And I know this why most people think Edd is toast,but who knows he might survive us yet.I will continue to live in denial till it happens haha
The only thing that comes to my mind after watching this episode is the LOTR-scene in which Aragorn kicks the orc´s helmet…
…or listening to Simon & Garfunkel´s original Sounds of Silence…
…or watching Rust & Bone on repeat…
Actually, I can think about a lot of things, but they´re all pretty sad…
Just to give my 2 cents about Sansa in this Episode:
She really confused me. NOt only lies she about how she knows about the Blackfish holding Riverrun, but she sneaks off on her own to meet LF. But last EP she and Jon wanted to go everywhere together.
Then she trusts the info LF gave her, after she kinda humiliated him and seems to not think things through. IF the Blackfish holds Riverrun, how could he have an Army that is able or willing to help the Starks in the North? Since he’s holding RR that will be most likely under siege. Because I dont think the Freys went home, when he won RR back.
When Davos kinda shuts her off, she looked kinda pissed, because how dare he tells her something about northern houses. Impulsively she starts then talking about the Blackfish and Riverrun and lies about how she knows about it. Maybe because someone could say: Uhm, the source isnt trustworthy enough.
What I kinda got from these scenes was: She desperately wants to play the game of thrones, but just isnt made for it. Like every other Stark before her. Ned, Robb, and also Jon.
TheHeartTree,
Bran was “warged” into a green vision when Meera started shouting at him to wake up. He didn’t wake up. Meets starts screaming to him (which we can see that he hears in his Winterfell vision) to warg into Hodor to save her, 3Er & Leaf in the Weir cave from the WW and the wights who’ve breached it. He was looking at YOUNG Hodor in the vision, maybe he got confused as to transferring his consciousness in the plane of existence where his mind was (in past Winterfell) vs where his physical body was (the Weir cave), jumped into young Hodor but IMMEDIATELY jumped out, nevertheless causing the connection and short circuiting poor Wylis’/Hodor’s noggin. Even Wylis’ posturing and movements of his extremities indicate significant brain injury and trauma (med student here).
Jinx47,
There’s no complete treatment, there’s some things to do to slow the spread but not known 100% treatment, some people get lucky like Princess Shireen and get it stopped.
But The books are from a POV approach so there might be one in Ashaai by the shadow or somewhere that out of the knowledge of our POVs
Mihnea,
Thank you for your warm welcome! ?
I can already see Ramsay killing Ghost first thing during the battle. #RIPSummer #WhereAreYouNymeria
I’m cool with what happened in this episode (though I don’t care for being able to affect the past. That has always been a cheap mechanism for me unless it’s established early in a story). How things happened however left me wanting. The King’s Moot in particular was just silly and rushed. The ending had great visuals though, as usual. But “Hardhome” remains the only time that this show has done much for me when it goes full fantastical action. And yes, the more fantastical aspects of the series feels like a completely different show than what is still the more grounded/political stuff. It’s been a bumpy transition. This is an inspired mess of a show at this point, but it’s perpetually watchable and always great to talk about.
Ingelheim,
I think she makes them to make sure he won’t think against her. I’m just not liking her somehow ( probably my instinct) I really hope, I really really do that she doesn’t end up betraying Jon. 🙁
I will go Jojen mode now and predict the future :
There will be alot of threads on westeros.org trying to explain what happened with Bran and Hodor.
I don’t understand why everyone’s jumping on the Sansa will manipulate and eventually double cross Jon once she gets what she wants band wagon?? She wants her home and her family back – the family of which Jon is very much a part of, if she wanted power or to rule she could have very easily taken LF up on his offer of the Vale army and told Jon to go jump. She could have not told anyone about the Tully army at all and sent Brienne on a mission to gain their support secretly – yes she lied about where she obtained the info but I don’t think she did it for nefarious reasons. The way I understood the admittedly awkward Ramsay vs Jon speech she gave was that Ramsay holds the north when he’s essentially a Snow so it’s not a great leap to believe the north will follow Jon – especially since she carries the Stark name and she declares him as the rightful ruler.
So we’re halfway through the season and we’ve had one scene with Rhaegal/Viserion and no Drogon. What’s the point of doubling their size if you can’t afford to put them on screen?
Icekhione,
You can go with Hoyti and have your own He Man Woman Haters Club. BYE.
TheRealwolf,
Same here! I don’t comment at all as I mostly lurk but this episode emotionally wrecked me 🙁
Does anyone think that Benjen will save Bran and Meera and then Meera will lead Bran to where her father resides ? (the Neck)
Icekhione,
I don’t think that’s right. I think Sansa is being very protective of herself. She trusts Jon, but not 100%. She cannot possibly come out of what she went through 100% sane. She is worried about being no.2, the woman. This has never worked out for her. So, now, she is looking out for herself first and revenge second. She is not out to get Jon though. But she is being careful.
Geone,
You truly are a greenseer!!
Jonsnowed,
Yes, there’s a weirwood near the Wall where Jon said his vows. There are probably others in the North as well.
Geone,
More likely, Howland Reed will go North.
Wonderful farewell for our dear Hodor. Oof. Will really Kristian. And Max.
I don’t quite know what’s up with the offing of the direwolves this season, but it’s making it seem like an afterthought which annoys me. CGI is expensive. Well, shell out then. Summer deserved a better fight.
Also deflated about the creation of the White Walkers, I thought t would be a bit more fantastical than that. Not sorry to see the CotF go, but some very good scenes in the cave.
Meera spearing that Walker! Fantastic. Jorah and Dany – beautiful, my dear Iain Glen again proving why they keep him around. 😉 He will be back. I’m pretty much expecting a Victarion cure at this point.
Brienne calling our Sansa’s lie – good on ya girl! I get Sansa’s anger. But the realization and begging for the army that will happen later on is inevitable, there goes that little moment of gratification for her.
The back story of the FM – nice. I will miss Jaqen so damn much when Arya inevitably leaves. Ok, I’ll miss Tom Wlaschiha more. 🙂
Pretty decent episode. I haven’t cried for a long time – I did with this one.
Euron was completely unconvincing. Not the script. I’m sorry but the actor was totally lacking and that made a believable scene rather lame. He has no edge, no dark side and was miscast imo.
Lady_Vicious1984,
Oh yeah the watch is done.The White Walkers are gonna run through them.I just hope Edd gets a horse and runs south,but let’s be honest he’ll probably die.
Jinx47,
Shireen was cured, so I think so…
I know, same here! I feel absolutely terrible for Bran because he finally knows that he made Hodor the way he is and he knew that if he didn’t, they would essentially die. It’s so sad 🙁
I can’t wait to see how it will affect Bran going forward and if he will have more visions of the past.
That’s exactly how I saw it too.
Halfman,
I thought he was great.
But, to be honest I did want a more ”normal” Euron instead of the crazy guy with eye-patches and blue lips…
But if you wanted the guy from the books, I get it why you are dissapointed.
I also have a question … When Bran decided to enter the Weirwood link and stumbled upon the NK, Bloodraven was sleeping ? Or was he in the vision too ? It felt like BR was already in that vision trying to see what WW are doing or something like that, when Bran touched that branch it took him where BR already was … i saw it like this, i really thought at some point that BR was warging the NK, because he touched Bran the same way BR touched him in the first vision when he said “enough, time to go back”. Well that was shattered when the NK slayed BR, when i saw all of them around 3ER i thought “Shit, they might be connected with him!” :))))
Labs,
I was like, summerrrr runn!!! And Hodor my God!!! I usually re watch, but couldn’t do! I can’t see Hodor getting ripped off. He is a hero, about whom no songs will be written 🙁
Geone,
I think Bran, got a bit bored and wanted to see more of the WW, but instead he got were the NK was.
Or the NK made him appear there…
I hated hearing Summer dying. So sad 🙁 Ghost and Nymeria better live until the end!!!!
Meera should have yelled at Summer more than she did, maybe Summer would have followed them, I wanted Summer to live so bad 🙁
TheRealWolf,
We will remember him.
WHUUUUTT? how DARE you? lol. I have to completely disagree. All I thought the whole time is the scene is cheesy as fuck, thank god for Pilou for saving it. He is incredibly gifted and fun to watch. IDK, Borgen fan though.
I also like the parallel between Arya’s story and Bran’s, they are both in training to learn new abilities, but both will be forced to end their training early and continue on their own.
Halfman,
Well, u just hope you are right!!! I would love it. I just don’t want Jon to be betrayed once more. 🙁 may be I’m protective of him 🙂
Pigeon,
I think the WW being created by CotF is perfectly analogous to all of the trinkets and machines of war that we humans build in an effort to keep ourselves safe. It only works when the machines of war stay in our control; but they never do as, history has taught us.
Geone,
Loved that line ”am I ready?”, ”No”.
He just comes off like another basic, power hungry arse-hat, which this show hardly needs more of. There doesn’t seem to be anything unique about him at all. I blame the writing more than anything. We’ve seen him for two scenes and in both he’s just randomly come in and given speeches.
I just rewatched the episode. Does anyone else think Jon has a funny look on his face as he watches Sansa talk about Northern loyalties and that she will rally them as the Stark. It’s as if he starts wondering at that moment, what is she thinking. I only felt this on re watch. Am I reading too much?
And no, despite some hints about possible rivalry in this episode, Sansa will never betray Jon. That’s not happening, imo.
I never cried throughout the show like I cried at the end of this episode.
John Johnston,
That’s what I like at him.
As I said, if you wanted book Euron, I understand why you are disapointed, I don’t share them but I do understand.
To me he is quiet a nice character, from the 2 scenes we got.
Absolutely amazing episode. The ending was terrifying and gut-wrenching. RIP Summer, Hodor. Finding out how the White Walkers were created…wow. It really does feel like we are heading full steam towards the end, which is exciting and sad. As far as Sansa goes, to me, it’s obvious that she wants absolutely nothing to do with Littlefinger, and if she mentions that the Vale has offered their men, they will have no choice but to accept their offer because they need the men. It was so nice to see Jon finally riding out of Castle Black.
This season is my favorite so far, hands down.
I’m going to wait until it airs tonight to watch it. Three questions if you will…
How was it overall, was Bran’s vision epic, and how was Euron?
Mihnea,
But maybe i missed that bit, ready for what ? To take his place ?
ghost of winterfell,
After being betrayed and stabbed by his own men he probally finds the notion of ”loyalty” a lot more cynical then Sansa.
Wow! The best episode so far. And the fact there was no boring King’s Landing or Ramsay scenes made it ever so better.
It was nice to give Dany an emotional scene like that for once. The “I command yourself to cure yourself” -line was a bit cheesy but I like how it was left out in the open whether he can find a cure or not. I hope this is the last we see of Jorah so his destiny is left in the open. Or that he returns as a stoneman because his love for her kept him following her still.
The Bran scenes were amazing. We were treated with 2 mysteries being exposed – the birth of the white walkers and Hodor’s past. I really enjoyed Hodor’s backstory. It was really bittersweet and it also established that the outcomes of Bran’s past meddling can be seen in the present. That kills the fan theories where Bran saves Ned etc.
Mereen was another awesome scene. Not only was it cool to reveal Varys’ past to show viewers, it was also a pleasure to see Varys uncertain of himself. The North scenes were solid plot building but I feel like this part of the story is losing a bit steam since we know exactly where this is heading to. The Ironborn scenes were well made, though my least favourite part. Theon being all confident so soon was a bit forced imo. The best part was to see Yara sail to meet the dragon queen.
Jack Bauer 24,
It’s in my top 5.
Bran was amazing.
If you want book Euron you might be disapointed, he is much more grounded and ”normal”
I agree with that. And I think that the …. not ‘normalcy’, but straightforwardness of it was maybe why I felt a little bummed? Anticipating too much, I think. Not everything is fireworks. 🙂
Theon is looking better. I love Pilou, and the drowning scene was excellent, as was the ‘Dude, where’re my ships?’ moment of realization. Lol. And the whole ‘Well, YEAH I killed Balon, silly!’
I just had a thought that someone may have already posted. But I think we may have just seen the end of summer, and the beginning of winter.
ICE WOLVES?
Mihnea,
Yes we do! I never cried for anything or anyone on screen. Hodor, is my sweet gaint hero 🙁
Labs,
Yep exactly – there was nothing that could be done to change that fact, and it’s just a reality that Bran is going to have to come to grips with. Bloodraven gave Bran an emphatic “No” when he asked if he thought he was ready to take over…I’m sure that means that more possible mistakes will be on the way as far as Bran trying to exercise some self-control with his visions. Now that Bran is “marked” by the Night King, it’s going to be a race against time for he and Meera…I just wish they had a direwolf and sweet giant to help them along 🙁
Well, it depends who you ask. Both were great for me. Bran’s story was more emotionally powerful for the reasons that were already discussed.
Mihnea,
Hmm, could be. Sansa should have been the same too though.
Still, I am a but curious about his expression at that time.
TheRealWolf,
I know right? When Summer decided to attack, I was like NOOOO and hearing him die broke me! There is only two direwolves left and it makes me so sad. I love the direwolves so much 🙁 I will rewatch when it airs here and I know for sure that I will cry as much as I did the first time. Hodor’s story is so tragic, he really did hold the door 🙁
I only ended up watching the Sansa/Jon scenes and the Bran scenes (Yes, I am biased towards the Starks :P)
Jack Bauer 24,
Bran was amazing, I have never felt this emotional after an episode ended. Euron was strictly ok.
Can someone tell me whether old Rickard Stark was played by Sean Bean??? The quality I have seen it in was questionable at best and he wasn’t there for long but he looked hell of a lot like Sean Bean.
And the ending tore me to pieces, why, oh, why? I cried like a baby… Such an emotional, brilliant episode. I really feel like we could be getting the best season up to date. Also, are we going to see the rest of the ToJ scene now that Bran has left the cave? I most certainly hope so – maybe they are keeping it for the finale or episode 9?
Jenny,
I agree – Edd is pretty much the only one left in the Night’s Watch that I care about. If he doesn’t make it though, I know he’ll at least go down with a fight if he’s able to. The way Jon told him to not let the Castle fall down though, as he was leaving…bit of foreshadowing maybe?
ghost of winterfell,
He’s thinking what I’m thinking: “You sweet summer child.”
Getting betrayed by his NW brothers has a lot to do with it, I think.
MakeThemBurn,
King’s Landing has become boring and Bran’s storyline is the most exciting. What a crazy world.
I kind of love how Bran has breezed back in in season 6 all like “Yo what’up I got the best storyline now” And everyone else is like “Shiiiiiiiiiii”
incredibly amazing to watch, both emotionally and visually. Euron seems to be getting mixed reviews, albeit erring on the side of great. i loved him. but, have a soft spot for the actor. Overall A, Vision Epic, Euron very good.
Hounded,
It’s mostly the WW making everything seem so small in comparasion.
Definitely NOT.
Overall it is one of the best episodes ever and in my opinion, the best of the season so far. Euron was great, but quite different from the books (so if you expect blue lips and sheer madness you will be disappointed). Bran’s scenes were amazing and heart-wrenching.
I also think it is possible she so far remains in doubt about Jon’s willingness to fight – after mutiny resurrection and all, that is. So just in case he backs off?
Hope it’s only that, and some unwillingness to speak of Littlefinger.
Jinx47,
Even in potato quality, I still am certain that wasn’t Bean!
It’s interesting that my friend & I had a discussion about this episode last night and nailed almost every scene exactly as it played out. D&D are getting extremely predictable. In any event, the execution is key and I thought most of the scenes worked really well.
The Kingsmoot was… eh. Parts of it worked well but the switching of who people were backing seemed comical… too easy. It makes sense in the book since Euron is likely using magic to turn people to his side. I also thought I’d be more impressed by Euron but he just comes off as the typical villain on VIKINGS.
Now, the big scene at the end… I’m sure it will play really well with show-only types and people who super love action movies, but it all felt a bit rushed to me. HOWEVER, the final moments were very emotional. And that’s what matters most… that the show makes us care about these people.
6.05 is an episode that could have been given more time to get to and through, but D&D are apparently rushing to the end because… reasons.
Izatty,
Yeah I thought Pilou was great. It was more the writing – they didn’t build it up enough – they pretty much just raced to the conclusion that Euron is King now and he wants an alliance with Dany. They’re really racing through the stuff in the subplots like the Iron Islands and Dorne while King’s Landing seems to be stalling (I thought Cersei’s trial would have happened within the first few episodes but we’re still waiting)
Pigeon,
Hahahaha I actually liked Euron – he’s the kind of crazy where he could be telling you what a great and beautiful person you are and you believe him, even as he’s cutting your eyes out of your skull.
Mihnea,
I prefer character development over quick speeches. Then again, the Iron Islands stuff I’ve never found that interesting. And the rushed nature of the King’s Moot didn’t help sway me.
Lady_Vicious1984,
I liked it too. No need to portray Euron a la Ramsay to know he’s crazy and evil. The actor nailed.
Becca,
I don’t think anyone is saying that, more that she is still messing things up and isn’t yet mature enough.
I don’t see the problem some of you are having with Sansa. Oh she lied to Jon, yes, she did and I agree. Jon doesn’t know LF, what would he do with that info etc. And the Starks are known to be trusting and honorable……that’s why they have suffered so much. Being honest and trusting. She has been around a lot of lying and vicious terrible people. I’m glad she is using what she learnt. Keep her cards close to her chest. And she didn’t have any animosity towards Jon, she was ok sending Brienne away as well as making him that fabulous Ned-like coat.
John Johnston,
I didn’t thought it was rushed.
Thought Theon showed great progress and evolution. Euron doesn’t need to show any, he was just introduced as a enemy/foil/villain to the main character.
Sansa: “the North remembers”
Episode 7 description (correct me if I’m wrong): “The North is reminded.
Hinting at the close future?
Just realised this was the first episode in a while without Ramsay. And he was not missed.
LOL!
I hope Screen Junkies re-evaluate their position on Bran’s storyline this season. They always call him boring in their season recap videos lol. Us Bran fans are getting a major return on investment <3. I am so curious to see what Bran's state of mind is after this. I wish HBO was Netflix and we'd get all the episodes at once lol.
Btw, it was such a delightful surprise to see Ned's dad in the flashback. He's just what I imagined from that one scene.
Jinx47,
Don’t worry, he’ll make it up to us when he apears next weak..
alwayswinter,
Am i the only 1 wondering where Ghost was when Jon and Co. left Castle Black
Regarding the Kingsmoot I thought the show did it very well to be fair, not sure how much more people were expecting or felt was needed?
Flayed Potatoes,
Yup.
He was stoic, strong, and the way Ned said ”yes father” showed a lot about their relation, there is no refusing papa Stark.
Dessmr,
Yep I agree – it’s nice to see someone crazy that
Dessmr,
I agree. I’m interested in the Ironborn now, which I couldn’t necessarily say before (books and show)…
Jonsnowed,
And the drowning was, to me, one of the best stand alone scenes in the entire show.
I really truly believe that Kings Landing will pay off in a huge, huge way by end of season.
yes, there is a bit of a rush. but, it’s time to move forward and I do not resent it.
Lady_Vicious1984,
Yeah I mean forshadowing that it is actually going to fall.It was so sad it reminded me when he told grenn to hold the gate,even though this time there is nothing they can do.It has to fall
Bran has got to be in the next episode, he already sat out one episode, which was episode 4. I think next episode is when we get Uncle Benjen and he will talk with Bran and tell him what he was doing after all that time in the far North.
GeekFurious,
Oh, get of your high horse..
Jonsnowed,
Oh I didn’t mean here exactly, but on a lot of the other boards I’m definitely seeing a lot of betrayal talk, I just figured here would be a safe place to vent.
Connor,
Bran-”what were you up to for 5 seasons uncle?”
Benjen-”stuff…things…”
So i have dornish red on Bran being the one who woke the white walkers from their slumber.
Labs,
#heheldthedoor should be a hash tag that should trend in his memory. Summer is a stark, and straightforwardly loyal( that magnificent beast). I’m loyal to starks too, but I am a little bit least loyal to Sansa. Hope she doesn’t do anything stupid like trusting LF and betraying/insulting Jon. I just love Jon too much. A bit brooding hero, but I love him
Rhaenys Stark,
Littlefinger totally played Sansa though. He told her Jon is only a “half-brother” (made her not tell Jon the whole story) and that Blackfish has retaken his place. What if that last part is not even true and he wants her to cross through Moat Cailin…
Rhaenys Stark,
Littlefinger seemed genuinly sorry? You’re just as naïve as Sansa! 😀
Was that Sean Bean playing Rickard Stark in that flashback scene at Winterfell? It looked so much like him! Just a quick glimpse in bad quality so hard to tell.
Amazing episode. Goosebumps & tears.
Know what I’m really excited for?
Next episode preview….
Jenny,
Yep I agree…there’s absolutely nothing they can do at all, except for get as far away from the actual Wall as quickly as possible, which just won’t happen for those at Castle Black. I can only imagine the horror of standing on the top of the Wall, looking down at the Night King and his army as they approach and then stop, possibly thinking the Wall is protecting you…then hearing/feeling the Wall beginning to collapse. I imagine that collapse would be felt throughout the entire North and would be one MASSIVE “Oh, fook me” moment once everyone realizes what’s happening. Regardless of whether or not people still don’t believe the WW are back…I’m sure they’d be terrified to hear the Wall falling, and wtf could be causing it to happen. And it’ll probably happen just in time for there to be a Stark back in Winterfell…
Sansa lies to Jon?
Ser Arian the lazy,
Now I think you’re trolling. Clarke isn’t the best actor in the series, but her emotions were very genuine in the scene with Jorah. Some of her best acting to date.
Jack Bauer 24,
Not with ill meaning.
Mihnea,
Haha me too. After I watched the episode, I told myself “Well, at least I still have a new 30-second preview to watch tonight”.
Joachim,
Good point, I was watching Tormund eyeing up Brienne but yeah, don’t recall seeing Ghost there.
So wait, Sansa turned Ghost into a new cloak for Jon?!….seems dark, even for the new badass Sansa but i’m not ruling it out!! 🙂
#I’llSeeYourFreyPiesAndRaiseYouAGhostCloak
RawJah,
Well I think you’re wrong. Because unlike Robb ,Ned and Jon she doesn’t put all her cards on the table. She is sending Brienne to RR, no marching there with her entire contingent. Also she got LF on the defensive. And also revealing her info to Jon, was revealing it to Davos, Tormund etc. People she have no idea who they are. She grew up under liars and manipulates, why wouldn’t she learn and use some things from them. And believe it or not, she doesn’t know Jon all that well either. Its not like a Arya Jon dynamic
I think the other thing this episode established that Bran does not need a wierewood tree to see any visions now.
But she totally trusts LF’s Info about Riverrun. Without knowing if its true, how many men he could possible give away (which makes no sense in a siege). And so on.
Jinx47,
I agree. I need cheering up now. I’ll be sad for a bit
Mihnea,
Ahahah me too!
Lady_Vicious1984,
The ”inside the episode” is also good.
Sou,
I knew I would regret it. I watched it anyway, some parts at least. I regret it.
But at least I’ll get to enjoy it again tonight on TV, the full of it, with relatives alongside this time~
Thanks!
alwayswinter,
I guess he just went ahead.Tbh if he doesn’t serve a plot point they are not going to spend money to just show him walking.At this point I’m already praying that he doesn’t get killed in the battle cause we really don’t have a good track record for direwolves #prayforghost
Livewire67,
Thank you so much for your post! I’ve been reading all the comments trying to piece everything together.
I’m kind of glad that I read this thread beforehand. I would’ve been inconsolable if I hadn’t.
I’m very sad about Summer and Hodor :(:(:(:( And most of all no TOJ with the 3ER, I hope Bran is able to look on his own.
I def. want to see this scene between Sansa/ Littlefinger and Sansa/Jon, everyone seems to be interrupting it in a different way.
Also, are we still going to ”hodor” in the comments?
Mihnea,
that’s not true…. The dragons glass is their kryptonite, like a small cut or stabbing and they explode into pieces. But pretty sure you can kill them using other tools too. The problem is their bodies are probably taking incredible damage before they die and also their body is probably a lot more stronger than human body. So normal tools would be too inefficient in a fight…. so with dragonglass all you will need is a smalll cut/stabb and he is dead.
About fire….. They aren’t immune to fire…. they just bended it so they could pass. They didn’t went through flames or something.
That being said, I’m afraid that this pretty much confirms that it will be very hard for dragons to kills walkers. I don’t know how exactly their powers work and how powerful they are, but it’s possible that only soldiers can kill them. Though the dragons will come in handy when it comes to destroying the wights hordes.
Not sure if I can look the same at that word after today. But the “North has to remember.”
Izatty,
Funny that you would mention Lost, because I’m starting to get flashbacks to both that show and the two Matrix sequels. In both cases, fans spent years speculating on the various tantalizing philosophical and narrative possibilities that could arise at each story’s conclusion, only to be eventually let down by cliched, effects-heavy endings drenched in religious symbolism that ignored the interesting ideas that were proposed earlier. I really, REALLY hope that this story isn’t all going to end with a noisy White Walkers vs. Dragons battle where all of the survivors live happily ever after, but I have a funny feeling that’s where this is all heading.
With all that being said, though, the acting in tonight’s episode was pretty first-rate. In particular, if this is indeed the last time that we’ll see Kristian Nairn as Hodor, I want to give that guy a standing ovation. Contrary to popular belief, that was NOT an easy role to play, and it could have easily turned into an ugly stereotype. Not only did he manage to avoid doing that, but he took what was a small tertiary role and turned it into an iconic character (not that this really means anything, but Hodor has inspired just as many- if not more- t-shirts and posters as any other character on this show) with real pathos and shading- all while only saying one line, no less. Bravo, sir.
Jinx47,
I think we should go with: ”He held the door”.
RIP Summer
You’re absolutely right. This should be trending on Twitter in his honour. #heheldthedoor
All the direwolves are Starks in nature, loyal and honourable. Jon is my favourite Stark (he is still a Stark if you subscribe to the R+L=J) so I completely understand you! I love Sansa a lot, she’s my #2 but if she betrays/insults Jon and sides with Littlefinger, I’m done with her. However, I have faith that she won’t betray Jon.
You know, seeing Bran’s storyline unfolding the way it is makes me so happy because I used to love his scenes since season 1 even though most people thought he was boring. He always intrigued me since he was the closest to the magical aspect of the show. I’m happy that everyone likes his storyline, especially after today’s episode!
I’m sorry, I keep on writing and writing 😛
Hoyti Von Totiy,
Sansa is that character that is doomed to always be a victim because she is not capable of making the right decisions at the right times, and not trusting the right people. She is not a victim because she is surrounded by the wrong people, but she is unable to filter all the bullshit and trust her family above all else.
Sansa just wants Jon to fight for her so she can claim WF for herself. Irony being Jon doesn’t give a shit, he might have dreamed of being heir to WF but he is not Tyrion or Ramsay to fight over castles and titles. Jon has bigger problems with WW marching on the wall, after rickon dies he is going to have to fight an even bigger battle. Sansa can have her precious WF she can be all alone.
On the other hand Theon has shown more character development, right to rule is deserved not by blood or being the first born but by ability. Theon and Arya are the true sister brother team despite being apart all their lives and now they have support and love each other. Sansa is not capable of such devotion or understanding towards her family.
The real Stark super team is Jon, Arya, and Bran. Bran is going to help Jon with WW info and warging, Arya is the warrrior with the wolf pack and Jon is the leader. I don’t give a shit about Sansa, if after everything that has happened she still hasn’t learned then she is never going to change. Besides the targ, baratheon, lannisters self destructed because they couldn’t stick together Sansa is just proving that if she can’t be a team player then she is going to doom her family.
Jenny,
#prayforghost indeed!!
Seriously people, we’re down to less direwolves than dragons!
Even if all 6 are destined not to make it to the end, I really hope we get a couple of big scenes for Ghost or (pretty please D&D) Nymeria before we lose them.
Labs,
Don’t worry. Feel free to express your opinion and don’t be shy!
Mihnea,
I strongly doubt after today that we will ever see hodor in the comments again
Lady_Vicious1984,
I can’t wait for the episode 6 preview as well as the inside the episode. I can’t wait for the interviews especially from Kristian Nair and Isaac Hempstead Wright.
Was Ghost with Jon when he left CB? If not I hope he’s hiding someplace D&D can’t find him.
Mihnea,
Ah, true – thanks for reminding me that I have more goodness to watch tonight, Mihnea 🙂
Well that was quite sad… Bran basically ruined that kid’s entire life and then he died protecting Bran. Although, I am a bit confused about what exactly happened… not really in a bad way. Did he warg young Hodor in the vision? Was his condition caused by being sort of permanently warged by Bran from that point on, even though Bran was not yet born? Or was it because old Hodor died while being warged through his past self? I get what happened at face value, but when trying to explain it, I get very confused.
@Jinx47,
@Mihnea,
I don’t think I’ve teared up after a show, but Hodor…
Can’t imagine a sadder life..
Doesn’t this mean that Bran can’t actually change the past that we have already witnessed? But elements of the past (that we’ve already see play out (like Hodor), might have been partially created by Bran. So he won’t be actually able to change the world that we live in now, but we might learn that he had more effect on it than we previously thougth.
Hodor.
Emerson Hex,
so maybe.. coldhands?
Connor,
If Bran isn’t in episode 6, we riot!
RawJah,
She is not totally trusting it. She is sending Brienne to find out. She can’t just automatically assume he’s lying when she is trying to assemble an army. It wouldn’t be logical. She clearly is not siding with LF or she would have totally been in on having him in the fold with the Vale army immediately. All she did was held back info from Jon and not just Jon, everyone in that meeting room.
Labs,
Me too – I’m really interested to see what they all have to say/add to the whole thing!
wasnt there an article with the actor who plays young ned? He said he is in epsidoe 6 and 10, so therefore at least Bran has to be in those episodes to see young ned.
Mihnea,
It was my first ever “Hodor”!!
I always seem to arrive here too late, despite visiting the site several times a day! Glad I got the last “living” Hodor, or something to that effect……errr, someone hold the door, i’ll see myself out.
Connor,
YEA I KNOW WTF WHY SUMMER I THEY ALREADY FUCKING KILLED SHAGGYDOG THIS SEASON. WHY DO THEY HATE THE NORTH THEY DO THE WORST CRAP TO THEM.
Can any 1 explain to me the last scene how did bran connect with past hodor if he cannot alter the past . How did that young hodor started saying hold the door if that girl was saying hold the door just then..and why did hodor not get up to take bran outside until bran connected to him
alwayswinter,
I see what you did there!
Lord Stoneheart,
Bran warged young Hodor in the vision, it affected grown Hodor. Because grown Hodor died with Meera’s words the last thing he hears ringing in his ear it became a permanent state for young Hodor. That’s how I understood it.
I could not possibly AGREE with you more. Today, I am showing signs of LOST PTSD. There is still so much garbage surrounding the “divisive” LOST ending that even after all these years it is hard to have a reasonable critical conversation about it without getting jumped on. Today, I feel that De Ja Vu.
and yes, the emotional impact, the acting and the character arcs were very well executed and very impactful. But, LOST used to do this too to keep a certain portion of the fandom hoping and connected.
Mihnea,
As in the 1000 years BR lived in that cave.
Okay, I haven’t seen it but just read the comments here.
Based on what we already know, I think that what Sam finds out at the Citadel about destroying the White Walkers might be very valuable later on.
Also, weren’t the most recent White Walkers created by the Night’s King from Craster’s babies? And why only Craster’s babies? Didn’t Craster have Stark blood? Maybe this will also be significant somehow. There’s still a lot of mystery surrounding this part of the story.
And what’s up with the direwolves? How come they are so easy to kill?
Whatever, the Starks and Targaryens seem to be the most significant people in the books and the show.
Dessmr,
Yeah, this.
Mihnea,
Only the Daenyrys/Jorah ‘I got AIDS, dont touch me, even though I love you, even though I am 90 and you’re 21’ scene.
Izatty,
Yeah, I was a HUGE LOST fan who felt very let down by the ending. Please let’s not have Game of Thrones end up being all a dream had by Bran, with the ending being a return to his happy family, all together and all alive (because he changed the future). That would be so vomit-inducing I can’t even let myself think about it.
I swear to the old gods that before I die I will write an epic fantasy book with a great payoff and total twist at the end that nobody saw coming.
I mean I thought the ending was interesting but clearly not content with ruining the Dornish storyline they seem hellbent on ruining the ironborn stuff. Where’s crow’s eye? And logistics aren’t a strong point in this season. Littlefinger literally can get anywhere by himself in a jiffy.
Mirthula</stro
That was scathing and off base I think. You have no idea what she has in mind. She has seen what blind trust has done to people. I don't see Sansa siding with anyone except Brienne. And what exactly did she do to Jon? Keep some information from him? He doesn't know who LF is, LF is cunning and she is clearly planning something for him. And for u to say Arya is team this or that. How do u know? You have no idea what she will return to do
Also liked the parallel with Hodor, holding the door and Grenn in season 4, holding the gate. Both died loyally serving a larger cause (and serving Starks), most likely knowing they were going to die.
i’ll be waiting…
Marko,
Right there being crowned. 😛
Mihnea,
I truly cried. And I keep watching the end because apparently I love to cry.
Labs,
Oh!you should write, I would want to read anything about Starks!!! Bran, yes I liked him all along! Particularly in books. Jon is my first favourite too. If you are a Harry Potter fan, I don’t remember where but it is said somewhere ” the best leaders are the ones those who doesn’t seek it, but be a leader anyway when the responsibility is thrust upon them” I just love Jon
Now I am seriously curious how they’re going to handle the Hodor reveal in the different dubbed versions. It’ll be hella stupid in german for sure 😀
Izatty,
I really don’t like this idea, that there must be a big, shocking twist, that no one saw coming……
Well it’s just my opinion, but I think if they build the story around the final being a battle, so far they did quite well, in my opinion, I don’t see the problem in it…
I don’t think there will be a ”happy ever after” ending, in my speculation I believe Dany and her dragons will die and many others perhaps, like Jon and so on..
I couldn’t agree more. Nobody, BUT NOBODY, has even contemplated that Sansa is protecting Jon. She knows LF by now. If he is working her to part ways with Jon, calling him ONLY her “half brother,” then perhaps Sansa sees that LF wants HER as queen of the north so that HE can marry her and take advantage. Maybe it’s not Jon she is fucking with, but LF. If LF believes Sansa is in on his machinations, then she can control him better. She cannot control his gamesmanship if Davos and Turmonde and everyone else takes the information she has and runs with it in ways she KNOWS will not end well. No one is really listening to her in the planning sessions. She actually knows a lot more about the ppl involved in this particular battle then anyone else at the table. Wow. just wow on ditching Sansa so fast. Yes, she is likely out for revenge. But someone who is out for vengence for herself and her family is not about to turn coat on the only family that is actually by her side.
Sansa SAW her father die BECAUSE OF HIS HONOR. she knows Jon is the same. She is taking control to protect him.
Boy, am I the only one who truly despises that cheap zombie movie crap?
I never understood the exalted praise of those zombie avalanche scenes in Hardhome, but this was even worse – c’mon guys, this is not Dawn of the Dead, this is Game of Thrones.
Yes, the White Walkers revive the dead, but do the wights have to move and act B-horror-movie-wise? Crawling on the ceiling like a horde of goblins from LotR? Really?
I love GoT, I really, really do; and I liked this episode, as I liked Hardhome. But for me this zombie nonsense with its cheap thrills takes away so much of the atmosphere and the full potential surrounding the White Walker storyline.
*Sigh*
Shana,
Yes i think it means exactly that it’s a closed loop.But tbh after what happened I don’t think Bran will try to influence anything more.He must be feeling so guilty.
because for a show that was supposedly rooted in the realities of war, its is pretty shallow to have a good v evil battle at the end. Same goes for a story that identifies itself as the subverter of tropes, especially in fantasy.
That said, I am not convinced it will all end on the battle field.
Green Chili,
Well, it’s only going to get bigger and bigger the more we approach the ending…
Jinx47,
It was a dragonglass spear. Every weapon the Children use is made out of it, as is in their culture.
I have a suspicion that Ghost may go next episode. There was an article about the wolf who plays Ghost and it said that Ghost was having some kind of a big moment in ep6 if I remember it correctly. Who else red it? What do you remember?
Izatty,
That’s why I like this direction…
It’s a normal world, with, mostly, normal people, and this terror and monsters, the WW, happen to actually be real..
I think people forget that at core, this is still a fantasy story, and in the end the fantasy elements will outshine the real world politics…etc.
I never said the ending will be a battle, but I fully think, and honestly expect, there to at least be a huge battle, I would feel robbed if there weren’t none..
Just my opinion..
Jinx47,
Not sure about that one, she cuts a white walker down with an ordinary sword a few seconds earlier to that, and that one didn’t shatter
Who cares?
Labs,
Plus it’s 1:40 Am here in India and I can’t make myself to get a wink.. I am just scrolling down and reading everything. And how can you not write ???
Jinx47,
Stanis managed to stop shireens greyscale in the books, but no there is no known cure.
yes, yes of course. huge battle. no way around it. but, just – hopefully- not that the battle is the resolution. Someone scarifies, WW are defeated, only some live, the end.
mau,
I called it just this Saturday. Odd that no one really considered this possibility, it’s so obvious and good. And the Battle of Six armies was a couple of armies short at the time.
Now I wonder how Brienne and Blackfish will get past Moat Cailin. My guess is Littlefinger will have taken it and let them through. The Riverrun army is definitely going to be the grand deus ex machina of the Battle of Winterfell. And I have a feeling the Knights of the Vale will be right beside them. I wonder how Sansa will react to Littlefinger’s return. He’ll probably win her the battle, but will that be enough? And will she understand along the way that her rivalry with Jon was another of his manipulations? Maybe Littlefinger will still meet his end in the finale, as expected.
Zod,
a wight I believe, not a WW.
Well, that was an episode, wasn’t it?
Wow. To witness the creation of the White Walkers as a weapon for the Children in the war against the First Men was pretty amazing. And then… wow. What a massacre! Summer, the Three-eyed raven, Leaf and, of all people, Hodor! We didn’t really know Leaf and the raven that much, so it was as affecting as it should, but I hoped to see more of Summer before his end. That said, Hodor’s end was suitably epic and tragic. It’s funny that we get Hodor’s origin story and his death exactly in the same moment.
The thing that surprised me in the kingsmoot is Euron admitting having killed Balon. D&D are obviously doing a thing with overt kinslaying this season, and I hope it pays off. I’m guessing it will, at least with Ramsay and (after three seasons) Walder Frey. I wasn’t surprised about the lack of a dragonhorn… In fact, I was quite glad! What he proposed was much better: an alliance. He supplies the ironborn’s large fleet, Dany supplies the dragons, they get married to seal the pact and together they conquer the Seven Kingdoms. The dragonhorn is superfluous. It was great to see Yara and Theon stand up during the kingsmoot and later escape with Yara’s men and the Iron Fleet’s best men. I didn’t expect them to adapt the “old way” of the ironborn baptism, with the proper drowning. I swear I could see Aeron wish he wasn’t “reborn”, which does make sense.
“Where are my niece and nephew? Let’s go murder them.” ugh.
The way Brienne’s storyline is going, I hope, I HOPE, they introduce LS. Brienne going back to the Riverlands? Book readers know what happens to Brienne at the Trident… Who knows though 🙂
I was the first one to say that the Hodor – hold the door theory was utterly simple and silly in my opinion, but watching it play out, it really messed me up more than any other death on the show.
Watching young Hodor on the ground, screaming hold the door repeatedly, actually made me tear up, and I never, cry when I watch anything. That was some tough cookie dough.
Bran pretty much destroyed Hodor’s life and brain, controlled his actions, used him as a mode of transportation, and “killed” him in the end so that he and Meera could escape.
Hodor lived most of his life knowing how he would die, while being used. I understand that Bran didn’t really know what he was doing, and you could tell how upset he was when he looked at Hodor flopping around in the ground. Still – the trophy for the worst death on AGOT goes to Hodor!
what if jorah comes back net season having found the horn in his quest for a cure t greyscale?
Luka Nieto,
Agreed with everything.
Was glad there was no dragon horn, always thought it was silly and just a plot device.
Theon was great, good to see him getting more confident! And I for one liked Euron…
Aeron’s speech was amazing, just pure awesomeness. One of the best stand-alone scenes in the show, in my opinion.
Izatty,
Will he also find LSH and Quentyn?
It seems a bit strange to complain about cheap zombie movie crap being part of the story when the show’s very first scenes featured them.
And Hardhome was amazing.
Mihnea,
Yeah there were bunch of people on the forums and youtube who guessed that children of the forest created ww to fight the humans but they could not contro them/ they got out of their control so they set to destroy them later instead.
Amazing episode !
With Hodor’s death, Bran need a new transportation device. I can’t see just him and Merra traveling alone for long.
Coldhand ? Benjen ? Someone else ?
If I am a Harry Potter fan? I’m like the biggest Potterhead ever! This quote is probably one of my favourite quotes and it really describes Jon’s journey. He never wanted to be a leader but he was put in the position.
he isn’t going a quest for lost story lines. lol. just seems like his journey may take him – if he goes on one- to where such a horn might be.
I don’t understand the Boltons strategy for the upcoming battle if I was them I’d form some raiding groups to bleed the wildlings and cut off Jon and Sansa from going to rally the other houses the Umbers are in a specially good position to do this. It makes no sense for the Umbers to retreat from Last Hearth to winterfell and giving Jon all the room to move around. The plot demands it I guess.
Jinx47,
Stannis’s daughter Shireen had it when she was young and someone managed to stop it from spreading, I guess that means there is some sort of cure yes.
Great episode, but why are they killing all the wolves?! 🙁
Beer Island,
I haven’t seen the episode yet but I always wondered why Sansa sent Brienne away. After everything that’s happened to her you’d think she’d be sticking by her side 24/7!!! Especially since it sounds like she doesn’t trust Jon 100%… that might’ve not been the best choice?! Who knows?!
Would love to see Benjen come back. If nothing else, it would be amazing to see what he’s been doing for the past 6 seasons.
Izatty,
Just kidding. 🙂
I truly have no idea how Jorah’s story will go on… Will we see him again this season?
Ian Glenn, did drop some hints he may return in S7…so there is that.
I read some of the first comments, everyone’s like “OMG LF has turned Sansa against Jon, she’s lying to him and it’s gonna get worst §§§”
Can’t people just realize that Sansa, while willing to retake the North, basically turned down the army of the Vale? Of course she lied to Jon, she couldn’t tell him she had refused the help of the Vale (for strictly personal reasons) when they needed it the most…
jppoirier24,
It’s Benjen, I mean, c’mon. I highly doubt they will add Coldhands to the show now lol.
his ships? Those weren’t his ships. Those were yaras ships and they were taken before euron became king….
I haven’t seen it, but read all the spoilers – will hold off a few more hours for better quality! Sounds exciting and very tragic. 🙁 Plus direwolf death – oh no! I wonder if Summer’s death means that Bran will finally die too? Also, what is Meera’s fate? Also, with both Summer and Hodor dead, will Bran start warging Meera now?
i had a thought and I wonder if anyone else on here would agree:
The way that Ned was portrayed in the play made it seem like he wanted the iron throne for himself. Obviously without the proper lineage he wouldn’t be able to hold a strong claim to it. But it gave me the feeling that in addition to other reveals/future eventual reveals that the show is heading on a path that Jon will lay claim to the iron throne.
They’ve already shown us the likelihood that Jon is a descendant of Rhaegar, they’ve hinted this episode that he’s likely going to be legitimized as a true Stark, and we know that they are amassing a large army to fight a Great War. He’s said back in season 5 in the Hardhome episode that the only way they will be able to stop the WW is together, and if all signs point to Daeny making her way to Westeros, turmoil on the iron throne, and the reveal that Jon is a Stark/Targaryen, it could be that this is the likely future for Jon
No idea if this was posted here yet but GRRM basically gave it away in 2013
https://ventrellaquest.com/tag/what-hodor-really-means/
Post from 2014 but the conversation took place in 2013.
JonSnuSnu,
This!! And then she tries to make it up to them by telling them of the Blackfish and the Tully’s.
Can I copy the comment, for the other threads, when they all start yelling she betrayed him? LOL.
Kay,
She’s a hero, bless her soul.
I hope Meera makes it to the very end, also, does anyone think that she and Bran will have a “thing” going on?
Atish Vaze,
Usually what creates something has the power to destroy it….
jppoirier24,
From that pre-season pic of Bran we know he finds a horse someplace..
The North Remembers,
But she does trust Jon she trusts him to keep her safe she said as much.She just doesn’t want to tell him about littlefinger and there could be so many reasons for that
Mihnea,
I came close
Labs,
I’m a potter head too!!! It’s been a long time since I have read those books. So I don’t remember exactly where it was quoted. So we are team #Jon then 🙂 I just wish Ghost doesn’t die though. Crossing fingers
“having way too much grotesque male nudity”
We don’t have enough male nudity. *Duuh*.
Don’t care about Wyllis. Don’t see what the “big deal” is about that half-Giant thing. I’ve seen way sadder scenes. Anyways wow, about Bran and White Walker thing. I cried with Daenerys and Jorah. And that poor canine. Most links for viewing the episode have the stupid, damn credit card and payment information required.
he did some weird crap to the ground that didn’t do shit. He can’t do anything to the wall. Though I see him/them breaking the gates.
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
What was the point of the Direwolves?????????????????
Damn you Martin!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Mihnea,
And Bran’s Night’s King mark will be the cause. Yikes. Could it happen this season? At the pace things are moving…
TheKingWhoCares,
And how did Littlefinger manage to get through Moat Cailin unseen?
The same way Brienne and Pod did … they just went around it … just think if all the armies before that had thought of that … 🙂
dan,
Ummm probably that thing he did with earth is to make sure the whights enter the cave. The last time I saw them trying to enter the cave, they were all smashed to pieces. So, just my thoughts
jentario,
EP10 is my guess.
RawJah,
Can someone please explain to me the whole bran being in the past and present whilst warging at the same time?
And also was that the nights king whp the children stabbed with thr dragon glass?
Darkrobin,
Well he did say the army didn’t pass.
I don’t think it’s that hard for a few people to pass it.
Geone,
So then are the parallels:
Dany/Jon
Arya/Bran
Sansa/Tyrion?
PLEASE say Benjen is back to save Bran!
So the children made the white walkers to fight against the first men
Benjen & Tonic,
Next episode! Have faith.
He could cut off his arm ….
Shireen could not cut off her head.
Jenny,
Oh, I haven’t seen the ep. yet, I’m just going off of what the earlier comments said. I can’t wait to watch it tonight, I want to see how everything goes down!
Atish Vaze,
Stunning debut from Jack Bender! Absolutely stunning!
Jinx47,
Its that dragon glass stuff I think
I do not know if this is right, but: 3ER took Bran into the Winterfell vision because he had to, whatever happened, happened. Bran was in the vision, where I think 3ER kept him on purpose. He heard Meera, because as we know, he can interact with visions. He worged into Hodor in the present, leaving himself in the vision in the past. Once he warged into Hodor, young Hodor in the vision could see him. Bran was able to control his mind in two different places. Hodor on the other hand had a meltdown. He experienced his own death while a boy. This means that the person being warged into and the person warging SHARE the visions of each other. One knows what the other knows. So, Bran forced Hodor to experience his own death, while still young, and forced him to experience two different periods of time. But this had to happen because present Hodor is already Hodor. So, ontological paradox.
this could be all fucking wrong. IDK.
I have wayyy to much tin foil after this episode.
Azor Ahai,
Yes.
Hold The Door,
I didn’t watched LOST, so I was pleasently suprised by him. Stunning directing.
I take back almost everything I said about Jack Bender. This was a great episode.
But yeah, it’s funny that HE HAD TO GO BACK!
George actually hinted at the “Hold the Door” thing in an interview years ago…
The Children actually having created the Walkers is a theory that’s been out there for a while too, apparently correct, since I’m assuming D&D got that from George…
Fantastic episode BTW, the second for me this season that makes it as a Top Ten for the series as a whole…
Hoyti Von Totiy,
According to the history and lore clips about greyscale there’s also the risk of greyscale appearing on another body part after you cut it.
Well I guess that ‘Summer’ really is dead
Mihnea,
I agree with you. I just remember Robb going around some pass (Golden Tooth?) where a Lannister army awaited because (allegedly) Grey Wind showed him and his army around. “Goat” tracks have been used to bypass strongholds … think Thermopylae … the Persians died to a man on frontal attacks but were show a way around the pass and the rest was history … I believe that even a small force could take Moat Cailin from the north. So the entire army did not have to go that way, just a few hundred at most …
So is Hodor gonna come back as a zombie type now or what?
Mihnea,
BTW, I’m envious that you’ve seen the episode … as it is on in 4 hours here … I’m holding out for HD …
Yup I am shipping it for sure lol
Yeah but then I wonder abt all theses prophecies if just dragon glass itself is enough to defeat Nights King
Darkrobin,
When you watch the episode.. please take 1 minute to appreciate HD.. Please.
Only when you don’t have it, do you truly see how much you loved it..
Sarevok,
not that bad… Halt die Tür! Hold the door. Hodor= Haditü 😀 😀
Jack Bender pretty much directed all of Lost’s best episodes, with the exception of the pilot, so I wasn’t surprised this was very well directed…
Lady_Vicious1984,
I believe Wimsey has hypothesised that R’hllor was the voice that spoke back to the magician who cut Varys as a child (or that the magician was a priest of R’hllor)… that would possibly explain the interactions … and given how much Varys hates magic as a result …
Shana:
Doesn’t this mean that Bran can’t actually change the past that we have already witnessed? But elements of the past (that we’ve already see play out (like Hodor), might have been partially created by Bran. So he won’t be actually able to change the world that we live in now, but we might learn that he had more effect on it than we previously thougth.
Hodor.
This was my thought, as well. When Bran called out to Bed at the TOJ and Ned heard him, that’s when I started to believe that Bran may have influenced history. Not that he’s changing things now, but that the changes already existed in the story well before book 1/season 1.
impuregold,
Yup. Saves on the budget!
Mihnea,
I hope you’re right, fingers crossed for that mystery man on the horse from the trailer?
Sansa said “Jon is as much Ned’s son as Ramsay is Roose’s to remind everybody that they still follow Ramsay even though he’s not a legitimate heir. They could also follow Jon. But in any case, if they want to follow someone, who has a Stark name, Sansa has it for sure. She also told them about the army of Tullys, so I don’t think she’s getting an army just for herself, otherwise she wouldn’t have told them. However, I don’t think she fully trusts Jon to take her seriously, that’s why she lied about how she found out. Littlefinger is shady as hell, this time he isn’t lying though, he declared war on the Boltons as well. There’s a great possibility that he’ll try to double-cross them as soon as the battle is over, but they need him right now.
Mihnea,
Thank you!!! I will 🙂
BTW, always enjoy your comments … you are very knowledgeable … I may not always agree on some of the details … but I always respect them … and you are almost always right on the important things …
Benjen & Tonic,
Yeah I think it’s him.
LOL, I always wonder about that. No wonder that Spanish translator went onto those YoutTube spoiler rants… the stress. now it all makes sense.
Darkrobin,
Thank you!
Yeah we might not agree on some things but that doesn’t mean we can’t have nice conversations and discuss the show we love!
The North Remembers,
I don’t think its not she don’t trust Jon. Sending Brienne away shows she trust him, in his intentions. I just feel she realizes people don’t need certain information, and certainly not at the wrong time. She said to Brienne, Jon is not Tormund, or Davos or Mel. I feel she is cooking up something, which will come full circle as her tutorledge under LF. That’s how I interpreted. Doesn’t mean she has become some power hungry evil biach some people are saying she is.
Jinx47,
Just put the english words and put the translation in “()”…. No idea how these are called in english..
That’s what most romanian translators do in this kind of situations and puns.
Man. All I can think right now is what it must be like to be GRRM.
Literally spend decades creating this story, and finally get to the point where you get to share the big reveals with the world…
Only to sit and watch someone else do it for you. Ouch. Must be heartbreaking.
Mihnea,
Yo, did you not see Sue call you out specifically, to stay the hell out of this thread? You’re spouting spoilers everywhere. While I appreciate your enthusiasm, can you please find some chill and do as our nice mods are asking?
Atish Vaze,
No it’s probably the reason why dragonclass kills them. It made them, it kills them.
The whole Kingsmoot thing was quite well done, I thought.
They’ve done a very good job writing the Ironborn scenes this season; better than in past seasons, I think.
I am going to spend likely the next hour reading all of your comments but I am still stunned. My husband and I were just sitting on our couch with tears streaming down our faces, completely mired in shock and disbelief. Virtual hugs to everyone.
RIP No one, because that play just ensured Arya Stark will never go away
RIP Summer 🙁 🙁
RIP Hodor 🙁 🙁 (ugh it just breaks my heart knowing that he knew his whole life how he was going to die. )
I don’t get the whole “OMG! Sansa is being an ass to Jon!”
Of course she turned down Littlefinger. How was she supposed to trust him after what happened with Rmsay? She has one option otherwise and that is to unite as many Houses of the North as possible with the Tullys.
As for her bastard comment, it was a bit blunt, but true.
Certainly better than the horror which has befallen Dorne.
Geone,
Arya is one of the three candidates I have for the
– not my first choice – that would be
but that may not be the shows takes the plot as there’s been no mention of that prophecy …
This episode shattered my heart like obsidian shatters a WW. Hodor!!?? Scarred for life!!
@mihnea I cried a River!! The thought of it is heart-ripping. Sweet sweet Wylis/hodor and the horrors. The fact that a silent reader me, came our to vent today after 5 seasons and 5 episodes speaks volumes about how much it affected me. I felt the need to share and reach out. It was too much to take all the suffering silently.
All those who thinks Bran affects the past i think it’s the other way round. Its either destined or (and this one is a giant) OR.
THIS IS A RETELLING OF THE EVENTS. As in the mess has already happened and the world is ending and for some reason they(the starks) get a shot at redoing it all over… Go back in time & undo all their mistakes. So maybe this is the redemption mankind needed. “A second chance and there won’t be a third.” I am just rambling & quoting GOT to justify my GOT theories. Oh! I’ll never be the same again.
Chriss,
That must suck. I guess he can fall back on things happened a different way in the books. I know a lot of people who thinks the show should strictly follow the books and for the most part I agree, but sending Sansa north and taking Fake Arya story is a better plot IMO. And I feel a lot of people will agree when Martin finishes some of these. I’m kinda certain he had a strong feeling the shows would catch up and past the books. Which is a shame because he had plenty of time to finish them from GOT till now.
I was thinking though – for the most part, Hodor has always seemed cheerful and playful, with the exception of some breakdowns with storms or threats (like a lot of people would!) So that makes me feel a little better.
I’m confused…isn’t this a spoiler chat thread?
Hold the door :'(
Really pleased with the change of pace these last two episodes. However, Little Finger getting from the Vale to Mole’s Town in an episode seems to be on the very edge of how much time travelling they can allow.
We’ll probably see Brienne and Podrick in Riverrun next episode then….
Hope Arya hears more news from Westeros. It’s nice to see her kept a bit in touch with the other story lines.
I was really pleased we didn’t see any of Ramsay for an episode. Need a break from that stuff.
Also, the way Jorah backed away from Dany as though to prevent her from getting too close….dawww.
It’s curious, I don’t know how they are going to pull that off the dub actors in my country. “Detén la puerta” doesn’t sound anything like Hodor.
I did not understand the ending!!
I mean what did they imply by connecting the Hodor of the past with the present?
Is there an infinite time loop? Is the three eyed raven actually Bran of the future, and the events continue to happen again and again?
how do they translate “Hodor” now?
Nymeria better be back now…if the reason for lack of direwolf action was cost of visuals…now they should show Nymeria since second last alive.
Summer’s death isnt as hard to take as his siblings…cos the others were due to merciless treacherous & oppressive cowards (Cersei, Joffrey/ Freys / Umber) – but Summer voluntarily dies a hero saving his beloved master! Much better way to go.
Also, now that they tried so hard to make Hodor’s fall so heroic…I hope they capitalise and give us plenty of that storyline (Bran & WW) till the end! Meaning Bran’s being one of the heroes of the world should show frm now on!!
Hounded,
I think they need a lot of set up for the trial “scene” itself … and if what I’m guessing/people are predicting is true … then the denouncement of the “trial” may start a rapid end game for Cersei that they want to develop over the end of this season and Season 7 and …
I have a hard time believing the LF and Sansa will be the end of Jon so I’m not really worried about her playing games she can have WF probably going to be wrecked by the Walkers soon anyways.
I could easily see Jorah passing on his greyscale — deliberately — to Euron so as to ensure he would never marry Daenerys.
Whether Jorah comes back to GoT or not — and for how long — I think it is likely that he will remain a part of ASoIaF for many years. Indeed, longer than any other actor on the series.
While it is possible that Roy Dotrice will be able to narrate The Winds of Winter, Iain Glen is clearly at the top of the list to be the narrator for the audio book version of The Winds of Winter and A Dream of Spring in the event that Dotrice cannot do them.
If you have had an opportunity to hear Glen’s reading of GRRM’s recent ASoIaF short stories, that will leave you with few doubts that he is the right man for the job. His voice for Jorah is completely in character; Glen’s other voices are equally as powerful and persuasive. He is a brilliant voice actor.
Even though I kinda spoiled myself before watching I still found this an outstanding… By far one of the best yet.
Poor Hodor! And Summer! It’ll be interesting to see how Brans feelings of guilt/remorse develop. And also how the hell they’re gonna get away from those wights (even with “Benjens” help).
The only (and I mean only) issue I had with the episode was Euron. I really wasn’t at all impressed with him, which I think is down to extremely poor writing in that scene particularly. Badly written scripts in other scenes is easier to forgive with characters/actors we’re familiar with (and whom we identify with), but with Euron the poor quality is laid bare. Just as it was with Dorne. I’m probably the only one here who thinks this, but hey.
Other than that, I’d say a fantastic 11/10! 🙂
George,
I think the Ironborn scenes were always good. The actors were always great.
This is a problem. And it’s a book problem too, I’d guess. If GRRM is going to introduce a time loop, it’s even more escalation than introducing resurrection.
It’s effectively introducing the idea that even if all is going terrible, don’t worry! Because the last chapter can be Bran managing to reset time! Woohoo! I seriously hope that’s not how things are going to go.
I don’t think we will see Jorah again this season.
Sansa rejected Littlefinger’s help because she knows he cannot be trusted. He gave her to the family who killed her own and knew Ramsey “cuts” people. Seasons ago she told Littlefinger she knew what he wanted: Power.
There’s no chance he won’t kill the Starks for their power eventually. She’s learned well.
The bastard comparison was to point out that people follow a bastard lord of Winterfell whom they hate. Following Jon should be easier to swallow as he’s a Stark.
She also says it because (as Littlefinger pointed out) everyone sees him as half brother. Even if it was said as a double entendre.
She loves her brother. All she cares about now is the safety of her family, getting her home back and maybe a lil vengeance.
Ugly sobbing over the last scene. Poor freaking Hodor.
Luka Nieto,
The dragonhorn is superfluous.
Perhaps, in the books, that was a device to create dramatic tension .. will the horn work? Could it take a dragon/dragons from Dany? Etc.? In ADWD and that continues until the begining of TWOW … so for over 5 years 🙂 And given the compressed timeline on the show that is superfluous?
Chriss,
It is his own fault tbh. He originally had a solid three book structure for ASOIAF:
1 – WOFK (War of Five Kings)
2 – Dany’s Arrival
3 – Walker invasion
A simple three act structure that would have been a great fantasy series. However somewhere along he began to write more and more and suddenly book one split into three. That’s fair enough, he couldn’t fit it all into one book.
He then said he was going to do a five year time skip which would bring all characters into a place where he could put them in their endgame. He then had to remove that due to narrative reasons (nothing happening for five years with Stannis or in King’s Landing after Tywin’s death would be pretty stupid) so again a fair enough reason.
Then he releases a book with no Tyrion, Dany or Jon, the three characters most readers were greatly invested in. I am not saying AFFC is bad, there are some good chapters, but overall it felt bloated with not much happening until the end of the book (Brienne and Stoneheart, Cersei and High Sparrow, Jamie and Riverrun). This angered some fans but Martin promised that ADWD would be out a year after AFFC.
Fast forward to 2011, George releases ADWD, a book that was better than AFFC but still suffered from some issues – mainly being too much bloat and certain characters not really being needed (couldn’t those Jamie or Cersei chapters have gone into AFFC). Again more fans begin to feel angry, and tbh I can’t blame them. It didn’t help that the two battles that book needed to at least feel complete were moved out.
At the same time HBO releases GOT, and it becomes a smash hit. Now fast forward another five years, D&D are nearing an endgame, in the process revealing many secrets from GRRM’s series. This IMO is George’s fault. It stems back to his failure to contain his story. He describes himself as a gardener – well in a garden sometimes the weeds and dead plants need to be cleared out and planted with new seeds, otherwise the garden becomes a mess. That is what has happened with ASOIAF – instead of finishing certain stories and then starting new ones, George has added more to his already messy garden.The result – the show is spoiling all his secrets and he has no one else to blame but himself. I have no sympathy for him because of that. He has had nearly 20 years to finish this saga, and he hasn’t. That’s on him, not D&D, Bryan Cogman or anyone else. He himself has realised that (see his new years post) but its to little to late for me.
By the way I should point out this is not directed in particular at you. Your comment just spurred me to get some things off my chest ala GRRM, D&D and the book v show debate (which I think is bloody childish but that ain’t important now).
Chriss,
I don’t think so. I think that Bran will be afraid to mess with time again after he created Hodor.
I kinda agree.
I liked all the Iron Islands stuff, but Euron’s speech was kinda underwhelming…could have been a lot more epic…and u can tell the actor could have given more…but was like they were tryna give Euron this carefree feeling rather than badass…Yara’s and Theon’s speeches were brill!
Fuck you Game of Thrones.
That is all.
Wintefell will not be Sansa’s. It seems more likely that it will be Bran’s.
I had thought Bran would not make it south of the Wall and would ultimately be killed and live out his second life in Drogon.
While that may still be the arc for Brandon Stark in the novels, I think in the TV series it will be otherwise. Bran is going to make it back to south of the wall. And Brandon Stark IS The Stark. He is the King of Winter, come what may.
Louis,
And that’s a good ass point. Because she clearly knows about the WW. John said it in the scene talking about the other houses. I feel she is playing LF and just keeping Jon out of the loop. Big wtf moment coming. I just rewatched the episode and she said to LF “if you didn’t know, your a fool, and if you did know you’re my enemy”. Then u can see she asks him, “what you think he did to me?” He histates then starts talking. Then she says, maybe you did know about him afterall or something to that effect. She has clearly ascertain that LF knew about Ramsey.
Flayed Potatoes,
I agree. People kept complaining about Bran and his storyline … maybe not realizing how important he would be to the endgame
So tonights episode is one of the most emotional of all time?
Jack,
I understand your point of view. Hell, I’d say your opinion is probably in the majority – at least around here. And if not, it’s certainly a very common point of view.
I disagree. Maybe it’s because I came to the books late. After Book five had been published, and just after season three finished.
I ended up loving the later books. I ended up loving book 4 in particular, and being especially fond of Dorne and f’Aegon. I understand that people were led to believe the story would evolve in a particular way, and I understand that GRRM has clearly developed the story on a way he didn’t initially intend, but I love how vast and detailed the world is. I love that it’s more than just a story now, it’s a whole world.
See, I could read a novel of just the goings on of the people of Westeros. I just really love that kind of stuff. So, you know, I’m just really happy with how things are developing in the books. My only fear is how long it’s going to take him to finish the books.
Jack Bauer 24,
No. I don’t think so. I never cared for Hodor.
Izatty,
Well I still don’t know, but we pronounce Hodor the same way “Jodor” but that’s the thing how do you make “”Detén la puerta” to Jodor.
ShakaZulu,
Good thinking. They are always complaining about the wolf budget. I think they are trimming the fat
Many commenters are taking a dark view of Sansa not telling Jon about the source of the Riverrun information, but I interpreted it as Sansa wanting to avoid bringing Littlefinger into the situation in any form. She makes it very clear in her scene with him that she wants nothing to do with him, so no need to give anyone any ideas about him as a potential ally or resource.
For my fellow Jonsa belivers out there this is an obvious way to make sparks fly between Jon and Sansa, call it rivalry, call it wanting to protect the other because thats all they have left, whatever. This is a move in the part of the directors to explore deeper in to their relationship and how they trully view one another with respect to prior to them leaving Winterfel.
Remember Jon’s relationship with Ygrett and how it developed, I see a parallel here.
Chriss,
No it’s a closed time loop everything that can be changed has already happened hence the hodor thing and bloodraven taking him there.Everything that we see in present time won’t change
I thought it was a really good episode by the end but the Kingsmoot left me pretty cold. In the books kin slaying is like the number one no-no for the Iron Islander’s and here’s Euron (with two eyes, why?) just up and admitting he murdered his brother. Also no Victarion or for that matter Aeron who seems to have been replaced by a character who fills the role but isn’t (as far as I can tell) a Greyjoy. I get that stuff gets cut for translation but this was less of a cut and more of a butchering.
Still though by the end I was back on board, the rest of the scenes were all pretty amazing and there’s no denying that ending was powerful stuff.
Chriss,
That’s OK. I came to the books after season 3 as well. We have differing opinions on them. Nothing wrong with that. Now I do hope that TWOW proves me wrong and George can tie everything up. I hope for a great TV finale as well, that way we get two great things from this world, instead of one mediocre tv ending and a book ending that never comes
I will say however had George maybe released some of these extra chapters of other characters such as YG, Dorne or the Iron Islands in another book after the end of the main series, I may have been a bit more forgiving to those parts.
Anyway this is a nice chat, very respectful. Why can’t more people in this fandom be like this.
Chriss,
What this scene show us is that whatever Bran can change in the past, it has already happen : “The ink is dry”.
This is a time paradox. Bran did change at least one thing from the past, but nothing that changed will be something new to us.
I am …that episode…. that was CRAZY…
LF is alive now because Sansa has allowed him to be…how long she allows that remains to be seen ..and she is in no way double crossing Jon.. she isnt being 100% truthful with him, but we dont know that he has been total honest with her either
A Girl became Ayra Stark in this episode, you could see the disgust and the hate filling her watching that play..The Waif called it… Lady Ayra Stark will never be no one.
The WW vision was CREEPY as hell!
Jorah will be back..Dany has commanded it and it will be so..loved seeing her lead her new Army out of Vaes Dothrak
LOVED LOVED Mereen scene…the best this season of that plot line..I hope Kinarva isnt a one off character because I loved her!
and finally…
Leaf, Summer and Hodor all went out like a Boss….those last 2 minutes were HEART wrenching..Kristen(sp??) earned 6 seasons of paychecks for that scene..he KILLED me
Do you guys remember this article from last August about a Season 6 White Walker sequence which will “Blow up the Internet”
http://watchersonthewall.com/internet-breaking-white-walker-scene-and-incredible-vfx-gag-in-season-6-probably
BRING ON COLDHANDS. I wish they would stop killing the Direwolves. That’s the only issue I have with Season 6. Fine kill off Hodor in a heroic way, that’s fine and I wouldn’t want anything less for the fella, but STOP KILLING THE STARKS (the direwolves are Starks if anyone tries to argue). I still think that the director can fuck himself. First GoT episode that he has directed and he has done that to us. I bet he kills a dragon in the next episode
For me, that’s what made it so compelling, not a major character and kind of crazy plot wise, yet probably one of the most cruel fates in this story and in the end with one of the biggest impacts.
Seriously. It’s pissing me off. I have to look at each poster’s name before I read their comment because of whoever this Jinx person is who keeps referencing the leaks. >:( Knock it off!!
I’ve finished watching the episode and I’ve read some of the comments here too.
To get this out of the way, I’ve given up on Dorne and now I’ve given up on Iron Islands storyline too. It’s obvious now that the only reason they’re even in the show is because they’re going to need them for the giant battles at the end for the “war to come”. So they’re cutting them down to the absolute minimum because their storylines are not the main storylines that “attract audience”. But we’re going to need them at the end once everything is done to know who is siding with whom and who will be getting what land, etc.
Having said that, I really enjoyed this episode, I shed a tear, I actually did for Hodor and I don’t cry often. But I can’t say I haven’t seen the “hold the door” theory a few years back on ASOIAF Forums. Even though the original post was a joke.
Anyway the most intriguing aspect about the episode is perhaps the introduction of the timeline continuum issue at the end of the episode. I cannot fathom how this paradox can be solved now. Because if Bran was is and was, than what is and what was what this whole time? Do you catch my drift?
So Bran is from the future? And he’s from the past? He’s Bran the Builder, Azor Ahai, Rhalor, Bloodraven, and he’s Rhaegar? Does he reset the past or send his conciousness back into someone else every time to try to end the inevitable end? So once he built the wall to prevent the others, than he reset time and sent Azor Ahai, then he reset time and sent the dragons? Is he the saviour who is stuck continuously in a loop and sending his conciousness into others and into the past and every time tying to kill the others before they kill everyone?
Just food for thought. This is poisonous tinfoil made food, watch out haha
I cannot wait for Alt Shift Xs explanation for this episode. Ohh boy.
impuregold,
My thoughts exactly. Who is left, Ghost and Nimeria? I don’t like how insignificant TV has made them.
My Prediction:
Arya’s final test to become one of The Faceless will be to kill her Direwolf (Nymeria) – thoroughly to sever all the ties from her family and thus prove that she really is “No One”.
But regardless of all she has gone through to strive to become one of their Order – and given the doubt expressed about her being able to become one of The Faceless due to her heritage and class status – she *will NOT do it*.
At the crucial moment, she will realize and declair that she actually is *Someone*. And she will walk away with the skills she has learned to join in the final battle against the WhiteWalkers.
I have not read anyone else put forth this prediction.
That’s simply how I would plot it.
Your mileage may vary.
Atish Vaze,
obviously as we all seem, no.
I watched the episode without subtitles so maybe I didn’t understand well what happened, I hope someone could explain it to me.
A mark was all was needed to bypass the anti WW magic? It can’t be, otherwise they wuold have marked Waymar Royce in the prologue instead of killing him.
Jinx47,
It was great, but I don’t think that tonights episode is one of the most emotional of all time.
RW was more emotional for me, Sansa’s rape, Ned’s death,…
lalla,
The Nights King marked Bran, Waymar Royce was killed by White Walkers who would not have the same powers
@POL1T1CS,
I was thinking he tried to warg young Hodor while he was in the past, causing the loop or paradox or w/e you want to call it. I need to watch it again. What happened might be very plain to some people, but its hard for me to wrap my head around.
…and the CotF… whhhhut the fhhhuuuuck?
lalla,
A mark in vision.
I decided to wait till official airing, but my ‘perseverance’ lasted hardly two hours.
Here are some comments:
Bran Stark – disobeying elders and messing up everything in Westeros in all timelines
There were several moments where I laughed out loud (the Braavosi play, Tormund/Brienne, Lord Commander Edd). The Bran scenes were heart-wrenching.
Kingsmoot was good, but Euron’s entry was not as epic as I expected. I’m glad that Asha and Theon escaped.
It seems LF has infected Sansa’s mind by planting worries about Jon. Like many others who commented here, I thought that her highlighting of Jon’s bastard status and her own trueborn status as a sick consequence of LF’s words with her. I was like ‘and now we have pre-GoT Sansa back!’.
But I do not blame Sansa for lying to Jon, or even denying the Vale’s help. From her point of view, LF could double-cross her any moment, and she was angry at LF, and she does not really know how bad the situation of Northern houses are, so she denied the Vale’s army. As for lying to Jon, what could she tell him? If she says ‘Littlefinger told me when he came to offer me an army which I rejected’, she will face criticism from everyone. Davos will say that LF can’t be trusted, so the news about Brynden may not even be true. Jon(who does not know LF or King’s Landing politics) will say that Sansa should have accepted the Vale’s help. By saying that Ramsay received a raven, Sansa avoided these arguments and she was able to motivate the men around her, by giving them a false sense of hope. In a way, it is similar to the way Sam got men to support Jon’s candidature to Lord Commander in the books. He lied to both parties to get both their support. Now Brienne will go tell Blackfish that the North is rallying against Boltons, so Blackfish and remaining Riverland houses will support Sansa. The Northerners will rally to battle thinking that they have Blackfish’s support, and Blackfish will rally to battle thinking his has the North’s support. In the end (if everything goes as hoped) Sansa will get the support of both the North and Riverlands. But this is GoT, and rarely do things go as planned. Let’s wait and see.
Why Meera killed the white walker with the lance ? A second before the children of the forest try to kill with a same weapon and i it doesn’t happen anything… maybe R+L= J+M?? Or the lance was made of dragonglass ?
I dont’ understand how they bypassed the anti WW CotF magic. Can’t be just the mark, otherwise they would have used it already on someone to pass through the Wall.
lalla,
Well bran is no ordinary person and they did touch him in a vision so there must be some kind of magic involved at least i think so
RBloodworth,
Agree. If White Walkers are in the West then what’s in the East? Like the hell is the Five Forts of Yi Ti guarding from?
Perhaps some shit went haywire with the White Walker magic? or Perhaps the Children of the Forest came from the East running away to West due to the White Walkers they created there. (‘w’) so much lore to look forward to
Where are the usual suspects commenting on the penis?
Jinx47,
Stannis got Shireen’s cured somehow. There is only a bit of detail about it in the books. Something along the lines of they got all kinds of people from all over the world to come help her, but they didn’t say what actually worked in the end. Iirc.
Holy shit! I never had cried watching GoT (actually, there were few moments in my life when I really cried) because being a book reader I knew most things that happened. But man… these last two episodes made me shed some tears. First the Stark reunion and now Hodor’s last stand… I couldn’t help it.
The ending was so fucking crazy, I never thought that would happen so fast. And now Bran will be broken because his irresponsibility has cost the lives of Summer, Hodor, Three-Eyed Raven, Children of the Forest… the real first line of defense against the White Walkers (the magic) is gone.
Now I really hope that the hooded figure from the trailer is Benjen, otherwise they are screwed. Besides, all the focus on little Benjen in the flashbacks has to pay off in some way.
Sean C.,
I’m starting to think much like how Bran is going to shape the past that it is fan theories that give screenwriters ideas.
SD,
THIS exactly..she wants nothing to do with him and does not trust him. Why tell Jon about an army that could as easily be against them as for them anyway?
lewi,
there was a dragonglass attached to the lance sam gave it to them when they met at the wall
I took it as young Hodor seeing his own death (via Bran, who is with both young and older Hodor), and being permanently affected by that and the warging.
dan,
Dragon fire is not the same as regular fire. If dragonglass can kill WW I would think so can dragon flames.
Jinx47,
OMG, yes.
When it was revealed that the COTF created the WW, I thought that would be the thing I took the most from this episode. Then that ending happened and I that’s how I know that this is the saddest episode of GOT yet lol. And even though we now know how the WW were created, we still don’t know what their motive is. I mean yeah, it obviously involves wiping out mankind, but is that just it? And Bran’s out of the cave, so maybe he really will be the one to tell Jon about his parentage. And he’s marked like Harry Potter so that’ll cause problems down the line haha. Yara and Theon (I’m so happy that they’re together BTW) are gonna try to be get to Dany and beat Euros to the punch. This was yet another amazing GOT episode with several big revelations, and an ending so sad it literally brought me to tears.
“Some say even today, he still holding the door…”
He needs to be talked about in legends for his bravery and being the most loyal… 🙁
Anyone notice that Summer looked nothing like he did previously? He’s practically white.
I’m seriously worried about Meera, like she was like ten meters ahead and carrying Bran like how far could she get. It was like: RUN, MEERA, RUN.
So what happens with Hodor, is there any chance he gets back as a walker since no one is burning his body?
AND THE WOLVEEEES. I can’t. Pray for Nymeria.
Not sure if it has been mentioned previously, but Hodor isn’t being controlled by Bran as he holds the door. I would argue that it’s Wyllis doing that act and Bran basically links the boy to that moment in the future and the trauma of essentially being killed turns Wyllis into Hodor.
By the way, I’m kinda glad I was totally wrong about why Sansa sends Brienne south. The version of events that actually transpires involves more of Sansa doing politics, which I enjoyed.
He always looked creamy white with brown patches on the top.
Mihnea,
Well, I doubt that statement. The (new) actor that plays the Night’s King, is the one being sacrificed (one of the First Men) by the Children. So I think it’s pretty much safe to say he has lived. for 10 000 years. Despite what gehrgehrmehrtnn said.
“Hold the door” I cried
Valaquen,
So that means Bran can effectively change the past or something? D:
Sansa learnt a lot by spending so much time in KL and with LF. I am sure we have only seen a tip of the iceberg today.
I suppose. Just looks so different from when he was with Bran on his bed in Season 1.
http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/gameofthrones/images/8/85/Summer.png/revision/latest?cb=20150404163201
lewi,
It was dragonglass, I think, like when Sam did it.
Yeah. That was a dog. By season two they used actual wolves. It’s a bit weird to notice this now, five years too late.
Also, the fur in dogs and wolves completely changes colors when growing up.
Edgar,
Meera is OP! She’ll get him to safety! In Meera I trust!
Wait, but if the Childen created WW, why are WW attacking them? I think I really have to read the books.
So now Jorah’s been commanded to find a cure for greyscale. At some point, does he, or perhaps one of Varys’s connections, investigate the case of Shireen Baratheon? At some point, there has to be some accounting for Mel’s having burned the little princess. It would be interesting, given Varys’s existing suspicion over Mel, if somehow those two arcs intersected.
We know more about the White Walkers in the show. So that won’t help you.
No, it always happened (Bran turning Hodor into Hodor isn’t changing history or anything, since he already grew up with Hodor in that state). Bran was just fulfilling his role in history.
I did not cry while watching the episode, but the grief is slowly settling in right now. 🙁
Mihnea,
HoDoor
Intervene in the past, sure. But change it? I don’t think so. That always happened to Hodor, obviously, so Bran only fulfilled his role in this timeline, just out of order.
I’ve only seen these comments and not the episode. Honestly, if this is how this story is going then I’m really starting to consider bailing on the whole thing. Maybe it’s an extreme, over sensitive view, but I feel this story, at least as a show, is made hopelessly irredeemable by the struggles and deaths of the good. It is dark and depressing. Who cares who “wins” at the end when everyone has lost nearly everything that mattered? There is no winning. Every good person or guardian is dying. I don’t need stories that depress me no end for my entertainment too. And apparently they’ve added an always illogical time paradox too? Hollywood never learns. Effect before cause? Loops? Parallel timelines? What is this? The Game of Matrix? Whatever. Kill off the good people, kill off the wolves, let the evil ones become so evil that their eventual death (if they die) isn’t even satisfying due to the damage they’ve already done to our heroes. I don’t know. I guess dark, depressing fantasy isn’t for me.
Geone,
The human they executed and turned into a walker might have been that bastard Stark?
Mihnea,
A final battle of good and evil is too obvious for G.R.R. Martin – and he’s never given us anything really obvious. Besides, that kind of ending is exactly what Martin criticises in his inspiration – Tokien. Now, if the show goes in that direction, so be it, but it’s definitely not a Martin-style ending.
Fantastic episode! I’m always a slut for wibbly wobbly, timey wimey time travelling stuff. I never thought GoT could be this heartbreaking! I hope Hodor forgot what it feels like being ripped apart/eaten alive after the seizure/warging was over. His death scene was more shocking and moving than the red wedding! And it was beautiful! Way to go Jack Bender, he directed some really great Alias episodes, so I’m not surprised that this one turned out so well.
Bring on Benjen!
Is Jorah going to go to Oldtown to find a cure and meet Sam?
Beer Island,
so trusting a stange bodyguard she met 4 days ago is more trustworthy than the brother she know for 14 years? please….
Agree. Suspect D&D are exhausted and want to be done with GoT, in part because of the belief that every episode has to be bigger and more difficult to render. If they had been content to tell the story a little more simply ( and a little more economically ), they could go on for quite some time while still enchanting the audience and gratifying HBO.
Actually, I seem to recall vague spoilers last year about filming done for a “pack of wolves” both in this site and on WIC.
oh, it just occurred to me that the name of the episode is related to Hodor
Alexandre Laframboise,
Hodor hasn’t loyally decide to hold the door. He has been forced to hold it by Bran.
Richard E Grant played Robert and Kevin Eldon played Ned, two great English comedic actors, Richard E Grant was in Withnail & I. Not sure for the others
That’s what happens when I rewatch season 1 prior to Season 6. 😉 I didn’t think any wolf would lighten up that much!
Mihnea,
Worst thing about it is all the joking everyone did about him for years and now we know bran essentially mentally broke him so he could fulfill this purpose of dying to save them. Awful. It made me cry so bad. On another note, it shows the reason why people shouldn’t warg into people.
Some people are greatly misinterpreting the ending scene, while forgetting what Bloodraven spelled out for us: ‘The past is already written, The ink is dry’. Bran cannot change it. He cannot alter it in a way that it changes the future. Hodor didn’t suddenly become Hodor in that cave because Bran fried young Wylis’ brain. He had been Hodor since his childhood because of Bran, and Bran grew up with that Hodor.
What we’re witnessing here is predestination paradox, otherwise known as causality loop. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Causal_loop
It basically spells out that it’s impossible to change the past.
Jinx47,
There was a cure. The disease was stopped in Shireen… The damage was done, but not progressing…
Edgar,
Yeah, I don’t see how Meera (and Bran) could possibly get away. Those wights were on the verge of breaking through while they were still in visual range. Of course, they will get away, otherwise we’ve been watching a really pointless tangent for six seasons (well, five seasons).
As far as the debate around Sansa’s state of mind, clearly she’s being established as having trust issues, but at this juncture I don’t think she’s consciously manipulating Jon and co. or anything like that. When Brienne asked her why she didn’t say who gave her the information, I thought from her reaction she looked discomfited, like she didn’t really know. Her advice in the planning session was all sensible enough. Where this is going, I guess we’ll see.
Connor,
Nah I’m pretty sure the nights King will let Bran and Meera escape past the wall, and then the mark on bran will somehow let the white walkers through. An appearance from Benjen would be cool though
Jaemi,
Kevin Eldon has been in pretty much every british comedy series of the last 20 years.
Cersei is played by Essie Davies. She is Australian. She is fantastic in my opinion. Ms. Fisher’s Mysteries!
I think we will have to see what happens between Sansa and Littlefinger. Perhaps she does not want to explain to Jon in vivid detail what exactly happened between Littlefinger, her and Ramsay. I could understand that. I hope she tries to bypass Littlefinger and approach the Lords of the Vale directly. She is right not to trust Littlefinger, but she will be in a compromised position if she has to go back to Littlefinger and ask for his help against Ramsay.
But I still think it is wrong to lie to Jon, they need to be able to trust each other.
I dont think the bastard talk from Sansa would really be an issue for Jon, he has gotten over the fact that he is bastard a while ago.
But I disagree on her input during that meeting. She did not really offer anything of sound value. Davos was making more sense than her. Sansa has been the South for a while and she was learning Southern politics. The North is different, and that is why Sansa was out of her depth.
I also liked the way Jon approached the meeting. He held back and listened to what everyone had to say, and then he decided what they should do.
She was wrong about the Karstarks, obviously, but the general stuff about the Stark name was correct (I’m really not sure why everybody was looking at her weird when she pointed out that she is a legitimate Stark; shouldn’t that be obvious? That’s why Ramsay wanted to marry her).
Rhae Rhae,
Well done, keep them to yourself. This is about guessing, not actually disproving things because of spoilers gtfo
you are still counting down to episode 5, lol…. just beutiful
Martin has already introduced time loops/time magic. In ADwD, Tyrion and his companions sailing down the Rhoyne river pass beneath the same bridge twice. A rather eerie chapter.
Probably is. Then again, he has no one but himself to blame.
When she gave Jon he coat, he smiled and was happy. She is trying to legitimize him. And, everyone sees how delicate he is right now – see Brienne’s comment. I do not think Sansa wants to expose Jon to LF machinations. And, I do not think she will be in a bad position if she has to ask LF for help. He will be grateful she is letting him off the hook. I do, however, think she wants to be the hero of the battle, to gain more respect for her opinions. Maybe that is why she is holding back the vale army information.
I’m afraid he will not make it, because he is the 999. Lord Commander now and I always thought with a Great War to come that when the White Walkers invade and(no matter if they win or lose) the Night’s Watch will no longer be needed, they will end with Commander 1000. But then again, GRRM might just stop short of the big number to avoid that jubilee.
So many fans are expecting dragons flying around and killing WWs with dragon fire, while humans kill wights by ordinary fire. What a glorious battle that would be. Dany’s dragon, dragons awakened from the walls of Dragonstone, dragons from Ashai… That expectation will be defeated.
The return of the WWs was catalyzed by the red comet, which activated some aspect of Westeros that awakens obsidian.
Mihnea,
I did but I thought the children still controlled them. They created a mosnter theu couldn´t control.
Jinx47,
I’m thinking (or hoping ??) Nymeria is coming back with a pack of dire wolves to help fight the white walkers so save the budget??
Sean C.,
While the show could have clarified that bit, a reasonable and likely answer to that question is that the Bolton messenger who delivered the letter told Sansa and Jon that lord Umber had turned Rickon over.
jennyofoldstones,
Payoffs and twists do not good literature make.
A lot of people, making a lot of excuses, for Sansa Bolton in this thread.
Once more, those closest to Jon will end up betraying him.
I’m on Jon’s side
TheKingWhoCares,
I agree 100% with everything said here, especially the part about the warging & how it is unclear and doesn’t make sense. Like, when Hodor’s eyes turn white, who is warging him? It can’t be Bran as he is watching Young Hodor having a fit in the yard. And what made young Hodor’s eyes turn white ? Who was warging HIM?? Are we being told the Bran has more than one concience that he can warg several people simultaneously ?
Marlana,
Only, a lot of viewers are finding these episodes to be some of the series’ best…
Jack Bauer 24,
Really solid episode. The last part of Bran’s storyline is hard to watch and awesome at the same time, like Hardhome but it really hurts … The episode is so emotional and at the end I was crying like a baby … Other episodes I want to cry but this one I couldn’t hold the tears, punch after punch … I like Euron, he is definitely a different Euron from the books, but I liked the actor. The Kingsmoot also had a lot of changes … but I really liked it … We’ll see what you think. Not everyone liked Euron … but I think everyone agrees it was a good episode.
In the books, the Night King is a Stark. Is it possible the man the CotF used in the show is also a Stark, and the reason why the experiment went wrong was because it happened to be a Stark with powers (as Rickon, Jon, Bran have in the book, and also others in their ancestry)? The actor doesn’t look much like a Stark, but then again that was 1000 years ago so we can quite reasonably expect then-Starks don’t look like current-Starks.
PS: Ok, actually my theory doesn’t need the guy to be a Stark, just someone with magical powers (like Jojen, say). What do you think?
Sean C.,
Sansa is correct about the Stark name, I imagine (as was Ramsay). And Sansa, in that scene, made the point that the North is different, while Davos made the point that politics evwerywhere is basically the same. So you may need to watch that scene again.
Boudica,
I agree with you. I think she’s going to have a rude awakening when she gets to the Northern families to ask for their help. This will give Littlefinger a huge advantage.
I liked Jon in the meeting too.
@POL1T1CS,
I haven’t watched the episode, but I’m here anyway, cuz spoilers are good! Anyhow, re Bran as past-future-whatever, if so, that’s the one tinfoil theory I always subscribed to (for the books) and here it is!!!!
idk how GRRM/D&D will solve the paradox, but it was always built in, thanks to Bran’s ability to basically time travel.
Frankenstein.
The spiralled architecture around the weirwood trees in both of Bran’s White Walker visions looks extremely similar to the way the WWs displayed the bodies of wights in S1 and S3. Especially when Mance says “always the artists”… I wonder if there’s a connection there.
HBONordic. they did it to themselves.
Flayed Potatoes,
OMG i know right
What if when bran sees what’s in the tower of joy and he sees the baby with Ned and howland reed ask what will you name him bran says out loud Jon. And that’s how he gets the name Jon. Haha it’s like doctor who.
Blown away. Crushed.
Jon’s (inevitable – Hero’s Journey – resurrection) had nothing on this.
Personally had a rough week (broke up with someone very important to me last Monday)…in tears at the Jorah/Dany stuff. But then! Absolutely spun out at the info crammed into this ep.
So, if The Children Of The Forest created The White Walkers to Police Mankind’s destructive nature (creating a literal Force Of Nature they cannot control) and protect themselves, are we looking at a fundamentally elemental battle for Westeros where man’s actions can merely direct any outcome?
Bran is the key now, obviously. Plus this episode has confirmed that the narrative is operating in a linear causality (the timeline is immutable – his actions have already determined events). Very interesting considering the ‘Bran driving Aerys II mad’ theory.
Also, some quality Ironborn content at last.
Mihnea,
It has always being about the ilussion of power and politics in a magical world, a this people had broken to fight their game of thrones. It didn´t turn, the game of thrones has been the farse since the beginning, the song of ice and fire is the truth.
I see a lot of people are worried that the WW are going to catch up with Bran and Meera and kill them, but I don’t think that’s the case. Bran was marked by the Night’s King and that allowed him to enter the cave. I think Bran will be allowed to go past the Wall and this will allow the WW to invade Westeros. Meera is the only one who can transport him there, since he can’t walk.
The Night’s King is basically Ultron and the CotF are Tony Stark (lol). Their creation turned on them and they lost control.
Can someone PLEASE tell me where GHOST IS?! The last we saw of him was for like a second in the first minute of episode 3. Jon didn’t have any scenes with Ghost at all, which is odd, considering that they were INSEPARABLE before he died. So where is he, and why isn’t he leaving with Jon?!
The whole time paradox thing now opens up other possibilities. Like Bloodraven and also Bran orchestrating many events that happened. I’m now 90% sure it was BR who sent that female direwolf south of The Wall. It’s possible he or Bran made Aerys II go mad. It’s interesting that in the novels, Mormont’s raven, which seems to be warged by Bloodraven, keeps referring to Jon as King.
great episode, loved dany and jorah, and the last scene was mind-blowing
Also, yes.
Enough with the Direwolves already.
My fantasies of Ramsey being torn apart by the Superpack are now one fainter.
*that Bastard.
(actually, how about we have Brienne behead him at Sansa’s command once the Starks reclaim Winterfell?)
RhaenyraTargaryen,
He’s leaving with Jon, but the show has sidelined the direwolves for CGI reasons 🙁
Flayed Potatoes,
Or Skynet/Terminators.
Showmakers don’t like horns. No dragon horn for Euron and no horn of winter for the night’s king.
Flayed Potatoes,
People in the ASOAIF are too sexist, that´s it, Sansa won´t asked them to fight for the honor of her family, her pride, gold or soath, Sansa is in the same position as them; poor, orphan, tired and angry, She will ask them to fight for freedom, family and their land.
Icekhione,
Correct I think! Brilliant theorising 🙂
The Dragon Demands,
Sympathy!
Icekhione,
I think Bran was who blacked Ned´s mind at the ToJ.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxI8aPISq8I
If three eyed raven dies, when does he say his line: ‘we watch we listen and we remeber’ from the teaser in december? He never said it
R.I.P.Hoddor.,
You ever consider that she is simply taking the lessons of Littlefinger and manipulating him now and now the other way around ;)?
Jinx47,
Nothing specific. It was said that when Shireen Baratheon was cured, there were so many different methods used it would be impossible to narrow it down to a few, let alone one.
It does exist. We just don’t know what it is.
sam,
That doesn’t change the fact that the families they are going to suffered great loses from The War of The Five Kings. Whatever her pitch is, it has to be very convincing to secure even the small number of soldiers they have. They will fight (otherwise, what’s the point of the story), but it will be a difficult battle and the numbers won’t be enough.
I wouldn’t at all be surprised if at the end of all our protagonists’ struggles, hurt, grief and losses on all sides…that Petyr Baelish sneaks onto the Iron Throne to claim it.
Sansa should have had Brienne kill him. Not in a tired rape/revenge trope way, just because the Starks are about Honour. Ramsey forcibly took Sansa’s. Thus, he dies.
Baelish is alive for a (narrative) reason.
The ONE thing that pisses me off this episode is, Summers death. WHY D&D, why must you do this? :'(
#PrayForGhost
#PrayForNymeria
Ok, finally read all these comments – phew. There is so much going on in these episodes, it’s unreal. I might have to watch this one twice more tonight to take it all in but I don’t know if my heart can take it. Normally, we do outdoorsy stuff or small day trips on Sunday and I am so glad we didn’t today. I have lots of thoughts.
STARKS
1) Pigeon, I actually thought Summer was Ghost at first, which made no sense, so you’re not crazy.
2) So this “big set piece” that’s been talked about – originally in Season 4, then in Season 5, now for sure this season – we haven’t seen it yet right? There’s no way they would have had the Night’s King attack on the cave in Season 4. I know the spec was that it could be Nymeria and her pack. But if they are killing off single direwolves left and right because they’re so hard/expensive to do, how could we expect them to do hundreds of direwolves? I want it to be her pack, but that’s just seeming less and less likely.
3) You Jon stans are so weird. It bears repeating every week. Sansa is not trying to stab him in the back or front or anywhere else. She is just out of her depth.
4) Someone up there asked about Bran and Meera getting together. In the books, he is quite taken with her but I doubt anyone is pausing the action from here on our to make some sort of Bran and Meera’s Infinite Playlist side romance.
5) I didn’t think it would ever happen but with the death of Hodor, Benjen or Coldhands seems downright inevitable. Benioff said in one of the “Inside the Episodes” that the theme of this season is rebirth so Benjen makes the most sense to me.
6) I wish D&D had done a few little teaser scenes of the CotF before season 4. Kind of how they had a few White Walker/Night’s King scenes prior to Hardhome to establish these guys. The CotF are so vital to the history of Westeros and they didn’t really get their proper due and were kind of throwaway characters.
7) Oh Arya, you won’t get a third chance. Can’t wait for you to make a break for it and head home. Can’t wait for The Waif to get it on your way out of town. I am wondering what this will mean for the future of the Faceless Men in the show. Will they just be done or is there more in store down the line – will they seek revenge on Arya?
OTHERS
1) So, is Jorah going to lead some sort of a stone men army against the Night’s King’s army? Come in to help Dany and Jon save the world? Greyscale is obviously important to the story, otherwise it wouldn’t have been introduced last season. And as a certain someone says, they’ve hung the stone men gun on the wall and now they have to… you know how the rest goes.
2) Yass Queen Yara. Also, Alfie Allen is just great. One of the best actors on the show, week in and week out. Kudos sir.
2) Hmm, not too much happened outside of the Stark world this week (totally ok with that)
Please, please please, if you were one of those who read whatever the spoilers are for the remaining episodes, please don’t use them to inform your speculation or confirm/deny other’s spec. That would be a bummer.
If next weeks episode is leaked, I’m going to put my fist through the wall!
O.M.F.G
Mindblown.
Jinx47,
dragon glass!!! not ordinary one. Sam did the same
Jinx47,
stannis’ kid got cured, so i guess there’s a cure
Just finished watching it, easily the strongest episode of the season and that’s saying something after last week. The ending was one of the best scene they’ve ever done.I’m not ashamed to admit that this is the first time I’ve cried watching Game of Thrones….
Looks like I have a new top 5…
alwayswinter,
I DIED
Hurt my heart so much. This spoke to me on a spiritual level.
Yeah a lot of people last year were thinking that LF was going to show up after the battle of winterfel and come down on both Bolton and Stannis army and act as clean up pretty much killing two birds with one stone. Those people were half right, he will be doing that this year though cutting Bolton retreat and forcing Ramsey to a meeting which he will not survive.
I think I know how Ramsey will die now and unfortunately for most, I do think it will be by a Stark blade.
In Bran’s first vision with the 3ER, he looks north to the curtain of energy at the top of Westeros, then to beyond the curtain. Whatever is beyond the curtain is why Bran has to live, because winter is coming. The construct beyond the energy curtain fuels enables the WWs to do what they do.
Except, his dig on Jon, he’s pitting brother against sister, why else lie to him about the Raven. Hope Brenne’s calling out Sansa for it has results.
Without debating that point, if Bran is alive, and can access a tree, he can go back in time and still talk to Bloodraven. He can see Bloodraven and, presumably, Bloodraven can see him and they can speak to one another. The training, as such, need not be over.
Though to be fair, I think it will be in this TV series.
Sean C.,
The only thing I can think of, is that Caitlyn knew that Littlefinger betrayed Ned, and maybe she told Blackfish about Littlefinger. OTOH Tyrion also knew about his dagger being used and Littlefinger framing him for the attempt on Brna’s life. He could have told Sansa. And remember, Sansa was right there st King’s Landing. At some point she had to learn that her father was betrayed by Littlefinger and Janos Slynt. ( I was so pleased when John beheaded him!)
I think and I’ve been saying for a long time, if the Starks are to survive they can’t have their wolves, it ties them to the world of magic; as Leaf said there is no room for magic in the realm of men.
Jesus! I just watched it, i can’t stop fucking crying
RawJah,
One of them cured her thats why she was still alive without it spreading futher.
Antares,
People just want to Jon go mary sue, because that´s the story we had been told the last centuries, so when women do it is mary sueish but in males is natural and realistic. But what happens when men who are actual heroes get tired of the
Mihnea,
She is Azor Ahai, that is her sole, main and ultimate porpuse in the story. To die so humans can have a change againts the white walkers. That is why she is a mother.
No, Sansa never heard about that from Brienne, nor in King’s Landing. If she did, she would act on it; there was no reason to trust him as she apparently did in Season 5, or to not have Brienne just kill him in this episode, if she did know.
I did not really notice, I’ll have to watch it again.
Jon did look really happy. That is why it will be bad or heartbreaking if he finds out she is lying to him. I dont think Jon will be legitimized or that she is trying to legitimize him. I think she might have given him the cloak because she felt guilty about lying to him.
As a side note there was so much happening in this episode it is difficult to remember the small things, but it was amusing to see Jon stumble like a typical man when she asked him what he thought about her dress.
I dont really think Jon is delicate right now, he has always had a brooding persona. Brienne herself isn’t exactly smiles and sunshine, either.
Right before he was stabbed he was also very demoralized after seeing the Nights King raising the dead.
Jon is not an unreasonable type, if she explained to him all that Littlefinger has done, and how he has brought her to the Boltons, then I am pretty sure he would trust her judgement on Littlefinger.
I can’t see why Jon wouldn’t respect her opinions.
But it is not surprising that Sansa would have trust issues. I do think she is right about not trusting Littlefinger. I guess we’ll see how this goes. But in general when you tend to lie to the people closest to you it tends to backfire at some point.
lord of blogfell,
Its not that simple. She met her before that and she was in her mothers charge and her persistence have to count for something. In any case like I said, its more than trust issues and more of don’t bring Jon into it until he needs to know. Right now, he doesn’t need to know what she is planning for LF and she may need the army eventually.
its not Jon that’s a problem for her, its the other people she doesn’t know. I really do not think Sansa means ANY harm to Jon. Remember, you and I know him better than she does at the moment.
Theon didnt know where Rickon and Bran went, all he knows is that HE didnt kill them, that they got away with help from Osha and Hodor
we are just going to have to assume that off screen they found out about Rickon the same way they know Umbers and Karstarks have joined Ramsay…not important to know how, just that they do ..
Soooo was this the first time the Night’s King’s name was actually mentioned on the show?
Re the Jon and Sansa knowing about Rickon and the Umbers.
Maybe when Sam and Bran crossed paths he told (off screen) Sam he sent Rickon to Last Hearth. And then in turn, Sam told Jon when he returned to CB. Sam did tell Jon about seeing Bran, iirc (or maybe it was alluded to happening off screen too), so it stands to reason Bran would want Jon to know the two of them were alive and well.
I’m sure the topic of Bran and Rickon being alive came up in Jon and Sansa’s off screen chat, so if Jon knew where they where, he would most likely tell Sansa.
So then when they learn Ramsey has Rickon, it wouldn’t be to far of a stretch for them to realize the Umbers turned sides.
Either way, its a possible logical explination.
Mihnea,
You are not the only one, my brother. You’re not the only one.
Is everybody kidding theirselves when they say they’re happy with kings moot!!!! What happened to dragonbinder horn??? That woulve been so sick on camera!!! Masssive let down for me
It’s ok for you Americans I’m still up at 2am just to watch in HD and I still don’t understand
The author has been quoted as saying that there is no magic, only science that we don’t know yet.
is it just me that got pumped seeing dany wearing black? (or a very dark brown?
Spiral could be related to the medieval non-linear concept of time.
I’ve never been so upset watching GoT. That final scene made me cry for the first time ever. A big shout out to both Hodors, Kristian Nairn and Sam Coleman, for being so fantastic.
Shireen Baratheon had been “healed” or at least the spreading had been stopped. By some exotic sorcery or some such, I believe it was said. So it seems there would be hope. Jorah is already in the right parts of the known world
Jinx47,
James,
Teaser trailers often have character narrations that don’t happen in the actual season. I remember way back in season 2 there was a “Cold Winds are Rising” Stannis teaser, a line he doesn’t say during the season itself.
I cried for Hodor…
And when I was able to put myself together, I thought: Who’s going to save Bran and Meera now? Cause the wights are right behind them…
Well, I think it’s time to introduce Coldhands! Who else could save them? I can’t imagine anybody else… They also need to escape quickly and I think a great elk could help in this… 😉
And I know it’s not Benjen in the books, but it would be great if Coldhands was Benjen Stark in the series! Another great comeback! Bran saw the young Ben in his visions and then exactly the old dead Benjen Stark helps him reunite with Jon and Sansa… Wouldn’t it be great? 😀
JFC game of thrones!!!!
This episode was so damn sad.
But also, apparently it was just too nice to have two Starks together and happy together? Immediately we have to get Sansa lying to Jon and LF trying to turn Sansa against him?
And let’s remember that Sophie said that Sansa won’t be agreeing with Davos and Jon. And she’ll obviously be leaving Jon at some point of the Vale is coming to save the day. I can just see the show have a rift between them and them not actually end up on the same side.
Lut,
Me too. I am so sad, we lost osha, hodor and Summer this season. Just crazy!
Had to hold out ALL DAY long to watch this.. Im saying this was the hardest moment for me than any other… this was just too difficult.. I just can’t even talk. My head is just not able to even think about all the craziness that took place in one show.. that was hands down the MOST epic show I have ever seen.
I thought the reason they were looking funny at her was because what she was saying now was different from what she said last week. That people will fight for Jon if he asks. I might be wrong though.
Quaithe will heal him.
If this show has Sansa trying to manipulate Jon I will lose it. I don’t THINK it’ll happen but if Sansa chooses LF over Jon I’m not sure how I’ll ever like her again 🙁
Quit killing off all the direwolves, you heartless sh*ts!
I cried for Hodor like I haven’t cried for anyone – except Cat – on this show. Bran’s storyline this season is very enjoyable.
@Nadia Hmm to go look for Sophie’s interview…I’m kinda sad because I guess I naively expected sunshine after last week. Now, I still think there’ll be on the same side, but I guess it won’t be smooth and games will be played.
I can’t believe we’re down to two wolves. Not ok.
Jinx47,
Stannis Baratheons daughter had it and he was able to stop it. He alluded to it last season, think it may have been the episode he ended up “sacrificing” her. I have to think they put that scene in for a reason.
shinmenmusashi,
They’re not the same age on the show to be twins.
The LF stuff trying to force a wedge between Sansa and Jon is making me nervous about how things play out later. The Vale fighting in the bastard bowl has 2 possibilities
1) Jon sends Sansa to go get them – but then why he hell would he start a battle when they’re so disadvantaged without knowing he’ll have backups
2) Sansa leaves him in a disagreement and he doesn’t know she’s coming back, and she/the vale surprises him
DIE LF DIE OPEN YOUR EYES SANSA
Can someone please answer??
Now that the night’s king has his mark on bran .. will he be able to know where bran is (i.e. will he able to locate/track bran wherever he goes) ??
Also I’m assuming all the children of the forest in that cave died .. are there any more children of the forest left or the ones in that cave were the last ???
They said on inside the episode that Sansa doesn’t fully trust the people she’s with now and that LF still has some hold on her. It’s good story telling IMO hopefully she wakes up because this will backfire on her.
lol didn’t notice this before as I loaded the page with my small laptop very quickly
Tend not to say anything too spoilerish anyway
Mind = Blown in a pretty big way
Next for Bran and co, I have a suspicion that chain flame man is Benjen who will help Meera and Bran get back
So much heartbreaks over Summer, Bloodraven, Leaf and “Hold the Door” Hodor, can’t believe my “scramble his brain” suspicion was correct
Ratings are going to skyrocket from here
Sansa and Jon is fascinating, a bit of a juggling act as they are merging to primary characters, eg Sansa’s leadership arc in the Vale/RL with Jons leadership arc in the North
Have seen people slag off Sansa, but she has learned from Marge (how she relates to Jon) and she is learning from LF a darker side which she is keeping hidden…
I find Game of Thrones shitty fantasy like Warcraft, basically an affront to Tolkien.
Anyway, Ironborn are so cool.
I suspect he’ll be able to “hack into Bran” personally,
Eg Bran can still learn things from touching Weir Trees ala on his way to the Cave
But if he learns about “what’s in that Tower” then the NK gets new information about Jon, so they’ve really set up a Jon/Night’s King arc
Also, previews for Dany the Fire + Blood conqueror which may prove controversial over time as it strips away any benevolence, in a sense I suspect she will be the counterpart to the Night Kings, the opposing force but kinda the same
Mihnea,
I remember reading one theory a while ago that said the Children of the Forest created the White Walkers to defend against the First Men, but at some point they turned against the Children. I don’t believe a reason was given as to when or why they turned against the Children, but perhaps the White Walkers are angry at having been turned into what they are.
Damn, there are just too many effing comments to go through right now. I watched this thread grow all day while I stayed patient to watch. I’ll catch up in the recap thread instead. For now I’m going to simply and unexpectantly just comment on the Daenerys, Jorah, Daario scene… I fully assume the anti-Dany crew didn’t care for it. I on the other hand though that was some of the best work Emilia has done. She looked and sounded different to me also… older… tired or wiser? Darker? I don’t know yet as I’ve only watched once so far. Maybe on my 7th or 8th viewing I’ll have a better thought.
impuregold,
Seems like the ghost will also die in the battle of the bastards ? maybe nymeria survives
I can’t deal with the dire wolves dying left and right this season. It’s devastating. They hold such a great significance. And if the past is any indication, once a Stark’s direwolf dies tragedy soon follows. I am not sure the direction they are taking now. Not sure how she and Bran can get away from an army of White Walkers with no help. I agree with the post made earlier: NO MORE DEAD DIREWOLVES!!!!!!!
Hodor. You “held the door”. Go in peace you gentle giant. You laid your life down for Bran, now you can go in peace. ??Most heart wrenching scene.
Jinx47,
Sheeren was cured. So there is a cure.
Jinx47,
Sheeren was cured. So there is a cure.
Remember Shireen had grayscale and survived!!
I am just heartbroken about Hodor and Summer!!!
Damn they get you, and it isn’t even real life.
Really feeling sick and can’t stop crying?. Hodor and Summer, did not see that coming at all???
Mihnea,
Hug buddy. I cried too
This is all definitely playing out in a very Shakespearean way. Ramsay’s words still come to mind in situations like these “If you think this has a happy ending, you haven’t been paying attention.”
Also, how is Bran, and any other person that knows Hodor, going to feel when they see him as a Wight?
Louis,
I don’t mind her not trusting the others yet (Like Mel) but not trusting Jon??
Thank you Hodor.
I’ve never full out cried during an episode, tonight was a first.
Please don’t let him come back as a wight.
One of Ramsays 20 good men,
?
Jinx47,
Yes. Shereen was afflicted with it. Side note. Burning at the stake is not part of grey scale treatment.
R.I.P.Hoddor.,
She was t putting Jon down. She was simply pointing out that Jon’s bastard status doesn’t really matter. Ramsay is just as much a bastard as Jon and houses have sworn to him. Yes he was l legitimized, but Jon has a true Stark behind him. Sansa will be the Stark Lady and Jon her sword and strength.
Mihnea,
Jesus Christ, I will cried for at least ten minutes when Summer died.
Ghosts Lunch,
Thanks Ghosts Lunch .. your reply makes sense .. now that I think about it, just being able to know bran’s location wont be of much use to the night’s king .. lol
Will any of the direwolves survive or are they all destined to die? And if that’s the case, does that mean that the Starks are all meant to die? Perhaps Arya and Jon are the only Starks that will survive. Because she is “no one” and Jon is a Targeryan?
Jinx47,
Not really a cure but for some they were able to stop the process but only in children. Like Shireen
Vlad,
The other dire wolf deaths in the show have matched the books. Time will tell with Summer. Nymeria gets time in the books that hasn’t happened in the show though.
So, I finally watched it… Thanks D&D for that emotional trauma. I’m still bawling. Poor Summer! Poor Hodor!!! ? #HeHeldtheDoor
Jinx47,
haha i agree. it needs to be stopped. why summer wouldn’t have stayed with bran is beyond me though
Edgar,
Think about the faceless men in the episode. They were slaves and revolted against their masters and all that jazz.
Seems to be a common theme. The WW were probably initially slaves of the COTF and then broke free from their control. The COTF taught the First Men how to kill them because otherwise…it was game over man. The WW were a nuke gone bad.
Jinx47,
There is a treatment; Stannis finds it for Shireen after searching all over the world…it left her scarred but alive. My guess is it has something to do with the red god…perhaps this was Mel’s entrance to her house…kind of a Rasputin thing.
Meera should cut Bran’s tainted hand off. And Jorah should cut his hand to stop grayscale spreading. It’s not even his sword hand.
I’m not as down on Season 5 as some people, but…
I am going to say that Season 6 is already better, more satisfying, even after five episodes. And that’s even before BastardBowl.
The stakes feel a lot higher, and they’ve really nailed some big character scenes.
What with new developments in the Bran/WW story, I don’t think Bolt-On is too unlikely at all. The show must have skipped it like they skipped the Mance/Abel arc for production convenience.
TheKingWhoCares,
I think I understand why Sansa lied to Jon about Littlefinger. First, it was pretty clear that Littlefinger is her enemy now. She just made him her enemy. She refused his troops, and his offer to help. She berated him in front of Brienne. You could even say she threatened his life. Then she threw him out.
I thought she was very brave to actually go to Molestown and confront him to his face. He presumed a lot by sending her that letter. I guess he really did think he still had the power to manipulate her, but instead, she did not trust him. Smart girl. At least she didn’t make the same mistake her father and mother made.
So should she now tell her brother who is trying to assemble an army, “Oh, by the way, I just made an enemy and refused thousands of troops?” My second point is that the true fact is we don’t know what Littlefinger would do, but we do know he is his own number one priority.
The fact that he is at Moat Cailin which we knew to be under Bolton control raises a lot of questions. Does Ramsay still believe Littlefinger is on his side? Do the Lannisters still think Littlefinger is on their side? Do the Tyrells still think Littlefinger is an ally? He spreads himself pretty thin.
He could have told a trusting Sansa that he would fight for her. Then at the last minute turn on her to get Winterfell, and killl Jon in the process. With Rickon & Jon dead, if Littlefinger had Sansa he could control the North. Or so he believes.
Sansa just threw a wrench in his plans and she knows enough about him to get him killed. He is not her ally and not to be trusted. I think she’s in great danger because she knows too much. if he can’t win her support so he can get his hands on Winterfell she is not useful to him.
And the nasty way he said “your ‘half’ brother” lets me believe he has no respect for Jon at all. he sounded like he was mocking Jon. Which would not be smart. I think Sansa felt bad about lying to Jon. She really does care about him.
I agree there was a plothole when she said Rickon was turned over to Ramsay by the Umbers. Theon told her her brothers were alive, but even Theon didn’t know where they went. he had no idea Brann & Rickon split up and Rickon waswith Osha. In fact did Sansa even now who Osha was?
Or maybe because she’s a woman. It’s a pretty patriarchal warrior society in the North.
Still, I think having Sansa, a fully legitimate Stark daughter at Jon’s side can only help him.
Just wanted to add that in my opinion the solution is for Sansa to turn Lord Royce against Littlefinger and get Robbyn to take away the soldiers and give them to Sansa. The whole point of that scene with Littlefinger Robbyn and Royce leads me to believe that could happen. We know Royce is no friend of Littlefinger and while Robbyn seems to like Littlefinger right now, he may not mind seeing him fly through the Moon Door.
what? no! no! where? noooooo
Jinx47,
Shireen had grayscaole on her face and was cured (its progress was stopped). Stannis’ maester searched east and found a cure iirc.
Jinx47,
He did but they lost it all at Hardhome
Roz’s Ghost,
The smart play for Littlefinger is to still take the field against the Boltons; this is what he sold Robyn and the Vale nobles on; there are limits even to his ability to turn his manipulation on a dime.
Anyway, Littlefinger has much better prospects at working with Jon and Sansa than he does with Ramsay, who really cannot be controlled or trusted. But he will likely wait to time his assistance in a manner that benefits himself the most…he may send messages to Ramsay that he’s coming to his assistance, fool him into believing he’s still on his side…and then play the role of the Stanleys at the Battle of Bosworth Field (1485).
I’m still holding hope that the umbers are loyal and biding their time to betray Ramsey
lewi,
The Child stabbed at the armor, Meera hit his unprotected throat.
Now that the Whitewalker threat has become all-too real, and they might breach the wall any time (I think Jon’s humorous comment/farewell to Edd is a foreshadowing), don’t you think it’s time we are rid of scum like Littlefinger who play their little games? I hate LF as a character and I want him to die, but more than that, LF’s greedy gnawing at the North at the worst possible time is a bit too much to suffer.
Yeah, people looking funny at her has nothing to do with her mistrust of Jon. It must be noted that Sansa was first married to a Lannister and then to a Bolton – she is not exactly someone the North would love follow.
CC,
I wondered the same thing
now that we know the children of the forest created the WW ; does that mean there is no Great Other (the God who vs Rollo’r)
Jinx47,
Seriously, I cried my eyes out all while screaming at the TV. Im sleeping with my husky tonight like every night but, tonight my heart is broken why do they keep killing the wolves damn them… And, Hodor… I’m so upset if they kill off Ghost or his remaing sister I done with this show… I know its not real but, still… If they are going to kill them off then why even put them in the storyline, WTF!!
Izatty,
This is a great explanation. Thanks!
Zikas,
I don’t think so. The Children had to be praying to someone when they were casting that spell, unless if they are just that magical. So far all magic has come from some sort of source though.
Rei,
Hmm, anyone else get a sinking feeling that his self-sacrifice for Dany (that’s clearly how he wants to go out) will happen right before the remainder of this interview?
What i take from this episode is…..Bran has to die or sacrifice himself for sake of everything and keep the normal timeline.
@POL1T1CS,
The conflict of Ice and Fire is cyclical over millenia. The CotF do things which do not resolve threats to humans and planet and the WWs do things which threaten existence of humans and try to terraform Planetos to Ice. Then the Wheel turns and some things are reset to a slightly different starting point.
Meanwhile the humans are there living their soap operas on top of the time cycle/warp. In a way like Groundhog’s Day. Occasionally a player may be brought back to life if someone asks for it, like a video game reset. In fact, this story may yet prove to be a video game. All the human activity is merely foreground, while the real struggle is in the background and mostly unknown to us.
Mihnea,
I can’t remember if it was said in the show, but in the book greyscale is always fatal to adults, but children sometimes survive, although they remain disfigured (but non-contagious).
RawJah,
Sorry you two, Shireen had the mild children’s form of greyscale that can be cured. No cure for the fatal kind Jorah has
lewi,
The Child was also using dragonglass but hit armor, which stopped the thrust. Meera struck the walker in the neck/head (no armor), which killed it.
Roz’s Ghost,
Sansa is not smart or brave. She shouldn’t have lied to her brother. Also, Ramsey dont trust anyone. Little Finger is sneaky and in most cases come out on top. Anyway, I just want to know whats going to happen to Bran. Bran mess up bad and alot of people died because of his stupid mistake.
Dan,
Richard E Grand and Essie Davis are two of the actors in the troupe
Jaemi,
Essie Davis was another one. First Australian on the show as far as I am aware
Hoyti Von Totiy,
It’s interesting to see that you took that as Sansa being a bitch when I viewed her actions as a someone who is trying to protect herself and the rest of her family through what she knows and unfortunately she picked a lot up from people like Cersei and Balish. I am also of the opinion that she is being purposefully cruel, but rather was reminding people that she is just as much, if not more a Stark, despite the fact that she is a woman. I also think her giving Jon the cloak, and saying “I based it off of what father used to wear” was really smart. She associated herself closer to Jon thru their relationship to Ned Stark, by not only verbally recognizing it, but by giving Jon something symbolic that she made herself. Anyways I love to see how Sansa’s character will develop thru the rest of the season.
Hellos fellow Watchers.
I didn’t see the leaked version of tonight’s episode. I waited till 9pm, tuned in and even watched the rerun.
There are a shitload of posts here so I’m just going to point out what stood out for me:
* Arya is my favorite character; hands down. BUT her storyline is going too slow. Also, she needs to kill the Waif like yesterday.
* I know Tyrion is supposed to be super smart but I think eeeeeeeevery thing he’s doing will come to bite him in his little drunk ass. That red priestess seemed cray – cray (aren’t they all?)
* The Greyjoys. Keep it up. Don’t Dorne them.
* Not going into the Sansa plot. People are way too sensitive about her BUT I will say; don’t lie to your brother. Bad move Honey.
* Meera needs to be right up there with Arya and Daenerys. She’s a kick ass woman like the best of them.
* Kudos to the Director and Writer. This is big screen level here people. The ending was superb. That being said? When the show ends regardless of the outcome, Hodor should be the most important character. I’ll even throw a hashtag and say he’s the #GOAT of #GoT. He was never dumb, he knew how he was going to die and he still went with the flow.
DOWN POINTS: Summer. The producers are clearly pro-dragons. By now I don’t want Nymeria to appear… who am I kidding. Yes I do, specially know that Brienne is going to the Riverlands. And it wouldn’t hurt if Gendry was thrown into the mix (I know, I know, wishful thinking)
And finally QUESTION:
Was the actor who got stabbed the same one who plays the Night King? If so; who was that guy? Some random schmuck who was walking around the woods or are we going again with the Stark / Brother of the Night’s Watch theory?
Thanks to anyone who replies back. If not? Thanks Watchers on the Wall for letting me vent.
I’ma gonna cry for Hodor now…
There’s been a lot of heartbreaking scenes in the books and on the show. I haven’t been affected like this since the first time I read Ned’s death scene so many years ago.
Dom,
I don’t remember Shaggydog dying in the books. In fact, in one of Ghost’s “dreams” he is on an island eating a beast with a single horn I believe.
Amazing episode.
As far as some predictions moving forward, we know that the show is having to mesh some stories from the books together to save time and money and introduction of new characters, so here’s what I see happening (apologies if someone made these predictions earlier):
-Yara and Theon take on Victarion’s quest to get Daenerys, except now it’s a race. They need to get there first. And they don’t want her, they want to warn her and join her before their uncle can get there, so they can beat him. It’s their only logical and best option.
-Jorah will likely receive the other part of Victarion’s plot, in that he will meet a red priest who burns his arm to cure him because he “has a part to play in the wars to come.” It’s already been set up that the red priests support Dany, so it’s likely that they’ve seen Jorah in the flames helping her.
-Jon and Sansa and co. will try to rally the North. They zoomed in on the opposing house in the episode for a reason, they’re going to head west toward Deepwood Motte (the Glovers) and Bear Island (the Mormonts) and etc., making a giant circle of the North, raising troops, hoping to meet Brienne with the Tully army in the Neck and Moat Cailin and working their way up. Brienne will hit some snags though because…
-After Margaery is rescued, Cersie will send Jaime to Riverrun to take it back. Brienne may be able to talk her way out of the situations with Jaime and convince the army to abandon the castle and set North, but I doubt this happens. There’s a popular book theory about the men who pledged to take the black after Riverrun fell actually going to castle black to fight for Jon. Brienne may make this plan with them, so they are spared and lead the meat of the army to fight for Jon and Sansa. Jaime may realize what is happening but will let it happen for Brienne.
-Bran and Meera will be overtaken by wights. All will seem lost before someone saves the day. Who? There are two options I can’t decide on. The first is the character from the books, Coldhands, a wight who retained autonomy. He’s thought be some to be the true Night’s King, but it’s hard to say why he can keep his autonomy. More on that momentarily. Or, second choice, warm everyone’s heart again with Benjen Stark saving the day. However, I hope Bran’s growth from the visions and Summer’s death and Hodor’s death leads to the conclusion I reached: the White Walkers want him. They’re pursuing him, and they’ve marked him. If he crosses back under the wall, that may speed up their bring-it-down schedule.
-Finally, about Coldhands. What if his autonomy was returned by the three-eyed raven? What if he discovered a way to make him almost like he was through the trees? That’s a nice power to have, and he would be saving Bran if Coldhands is his rescuer. More importantly, it would also explain why the Walkers want Bran so bad. If Bran can learn that power, he can decimate their army. Bran being a greenseer may give him the necessary abilities to beat the White Walkers.
Sorry for the length and overflow of info. I just had to get it all out. Enjoy.
Patty,
Why does everyone keep implying that the direwolf dying is some sort of doom for its corresponding Stark? Sansa’s was the first to die and she’s still going strong… She’s arguably endured more than anyone and made it through.
He is the same guy/person/King: They stabbed a man (with dragonglass and created the Night’s King, a golem, a Frankenstein monster, to use in their battle (the stuntman who plays the Night’s King also played his human form, by the way). The actor’s name is Vladimir Furdik.
Jen@HouseStark,
Cool, thank’s for the reply.
Do you know if we will get to know who he was as a human? Someone of importance?
You are welcome! From Wikia:
The Night’s King lived during the Age of Heroes, not long after the Wall was complete. He was a fearless warrior, who was named the thirteenth Lord Commander of the Night’s Watch. Later he fell in love with a woman “with skin as white as the moon and eyes like blue stars”, he chased her and loved her though “her skin was cold as ice,” and when he gave his seed to her he gave his soul as well. He brought her back to the Nightfort and after the unholy union, he declared himself king and her his queen, and ruled the Nightfort as his own castle for thirteen years.
During the dark years of his reign, horrific atrocities were committed, of which tales are still told in the North. It was not until Brandon the Breaker, the King in the North, and Joramun, the King-Beyond-the-Wall, joined forces that the Night’s King was brought down and the Night’s Watch freed. After his fall, when it was discovered that he had been sacrificing to the White Walkers (possibly in similar way to Craster), all records of him were destroyed and his very name was forbidden.[1]
Pretty much, I was thinking Home was one my favourite episodes and then they keep getting better
Ah thanks for explaining, I just thought that was a general White Walker
Can understand why they had to go for a stunt man (same one as who fought Jon at Hardhome I think), could kind of tell by the way he swung the sword at BR
George hates war. A lot of his writing describes the horrors and futility of war. Aswell as the whole Good vs Evil trope.
when are we going to find out that meera is jon snow’s twin sister born in the toj both ned and meera’s fathers were there ned took the boy and sorry can not remember his name took the girl
I cried like a baby! Starting with Summer, and then Hodor! The direwolves are falling down fast. I hope Ghost and Nymeria will be there until the end. BTW, where was Ghost? Did Jon leave him in CB?
Was that guy being killed/turned into a WW on the Winterfell Weir Tree?
Face kind of looks the same?
Vlad,
Well, the actor we saw being transformed into a white walker is the one credited for the Night’s King, so that one is definitely the Night’s King being created. The story of a Lord Commander of the Night’s Watch being the forst Night’s Kings was a story told by Ygritte, if I remember correctly, so it’s not necessarily a true story. What makes sense to me is that the Children made the White Walkers to have a common enemy with the First Men and make a peace, then leave the North to them while they hanged out in the South. What they didn’t count on was the next invasion, the Andals, who came and slaughtered them, and therefore, leaving only a handfull of Children who fled beyond the Wall.
Ser Pounce,
I wouldn’t assume they ever helped/worked with the COTF.
Yeah but she stops being a Stark (in books IMO) and a benign Lady, eg she becomes quite dark
She does develop a warging ability with Hounds though, similar to Arya with Cats as well as Nymeria
As for Bran though, in a sense he died when he fell from the Tower so I do expect he’ll die right towards the end
That said I expect everyone effectively will die by about the end so…
999thLC,
I reckon it is Benjen in the show, though they will invoke Coldhands with the flaming mace thing
GH,
My thoughts on Lady … I’ve read that originally GWWM had a different arc planned for Sansa and that he changed the arc … the death of Lady make more sense in that arc … when he changed the arc, my guess is that he kept the death and it came to symbolize her initial belief in the Lannister’s and her inadvertant “betrayal” of Ned
So Bran had to be in the vision at WF at the exact same time the WW attacked the cave so he could warg into Hodor at the exact same moment he needed him … otherwise why would they be in trance mode when the WW were almost at the cave
And it appeared that Wylis could see Bran at the moment he warged into Hodor
3ER exit had echoes of Obi-Wan Kenobi’s exit to me
So Hodor is dead right?
Bran’s visions are some sort of time travel? He travels back in time and HODOR is affected? Remember Ned could hear Bran when he shouted ‘Father’ in one of the episodes?
The Red priests are not good people to take help from… She will expect dragons to burn a lot of people in return.
Oh, this was so emotionally devastating on several levels. I honestly don’t know how I feel right now. I always assumed that Hodor was somehow affected by Benjen Stark and that’s why he took the black. It seemed fitting for the series’s grounding in some aspect of reality but this was astonishingly devastating. Oh my goodness, I’m crying and the wine isn’t helping at all. The rest of the episode was really quite good but nothing feels significant in comparison. All hail Sansa, however, Queen in the North. https://goo.gl/AALKls
Looks like the 3 eyed raven is none other than Bran Stark from the future. He comes back to the past to try and correct this particular event by showing young Bran what happened if he fucked up the warging! It also leaves open the possibility of Bran trying to undo everything that has happened by rewriting subtle events in the past and set a new path for the future. This would mean that GoT is actually where Bran’s mistakes lead to the birth of the white walkers and Winter Coming which he tries to go back and change the course of history right.
Bran the rebuilder.doing it all.over again. And again. And I love it! My first post ever so be gentle. We all know nothing.
Mie,
Never mind, I found out it is Wayne Foskett who is Rickard Stark 🙂 Great casting! Looks a lot like Sean.
RhaeLin,
Wayne Foskett, I thought it was Sean, but they look quite a lot alike 🙂
DoorHeld,
Yes. I was more incensed over Summer dying rather than HODOR.
Hodor… just Hodor 🙁
Mie,
Bran the broken builder. Jon the last hero , dany and her many names.azor azoha .prince thats promised Jon or now arya could be any one.even her headless daddy.all gonna have god like status.
Akash Singh, yeah kinda seems like sansa got a little sexual tension going with jon
RBloodworth,
Ok…Lindaaaa
GH,
GH,
Well yes, her direwolf was the first to die and she has had one of the most difficult trajectories. She has been surrounded by people she cannot trust and has had some really horrendous things happen to her. Its just difficult to see these wolves continue to sacrifice themselves. It can’t be without any symbolism/purpose because they are the representation of the Starks. Just trying to understand.
I’m in favour of the Ice and Fire being in one person (Jon Snow as Stark/Targaryan) or possibly two (Meera) if Lyanna had twins! Dany’s future is looking a bit ‘mad king’ like to me. If she listens to the Red Priestess ‘Burn them All’ strategy she could be a very destructive force. She is pure fire.
Flayed Potatoes,
Bran’s guilt will help him make the next third eyed raven, me thinks. These kind of solitary personalities accept these positions mostly because they have deep dark secrets to hide.
And going by the Bran Stark theories that are going about since yesterday, our present Bran has more than just Hodor’s death to feel guilty about. One very interesting theory tells about Nan mixing up the various Bran’s in the Stark lineage and calling them as one. With Bran’s newfound “retrocausality” time travel ability he could well become all of those past and future Bran’s in the Stark lineage and affect the history of Westeros in a way unimaginable. 😀
Amazing episode and I love that the story of Hodor’s origin comes directly from Martin himself.
It’s hard for me to believe that this is the way Summer is killed in the books. I always felt that Summer would be a major piece to the end of Bran’s storyline.
This was by far the saddest and most heartaching episode in my opinion. The fact that hodor was there for bran since the start made it more painful. The red wedding and jon’s death didn’t measure up to the emotion I felt when hodor was left behind he was so innocent and didn’t do anything to deserve this gruesome death the fact also that he was partly being controlled by bran made it more unacceptable.
Jinx47,
Yes, or so it seems. Victarion (Euron’s brother) has greyscale on one arm like Jorah, and he meets a Red Priest named Moqorro on his way to Essos who tries to cure it by burning the arm just enough to kill the greyscale but not the arm entirely. However, it’s the last thing that happens in the books (in Victarion’s part of the story) so we don’t know if it really worked or not.
Just thought of a theory but what if given Bran’s new abilities he’s the reason for the mad king going mad And for people like Melisandre hearing voices from the flames. All to set about this chain of events. Damn you’re welcome
Battu,
I hope the time travel element isn’t very prominent in the story, as it would undermine the impact of past events, especially if you have the power to change them. I am confused enough as it is about Hodor lmao.
I can see him ending up like The Three Eyed Raven out of guilt. There’s also the fact that we don’t know how the NK’s mark will affect him.
Jack,
100% he had a lot of time to finish the saga. And maybe he should have waited till he finished book 5 to have HBO make the show, then take the 6 years to finish it. Now his books will be compared to the shows version, the ending atleast, instead of the other way around.
Battu,
Oh my god. So he might go all the way back to Bran the Builder? That’s an amazing theory. I love it.
So Hodor is still gone-was hoping it was all a dream…what an episode!
Izatty,
Yes, one can’t say he wasn’t able to drive to the dark side as Kasper Juul. Also, he was a very convincing full blown sociopath/psychopath in 1864.
I don’t get why people expected Euron to act any other way in Kingsmoot, either. When I read the novel, I remember thinking about how it was essentially a Corporate Takeover. Euron may have looked outlandish in the book, but he didn’t act outlandishly, as far as I remember. This kind of psychological sublety of GRRM’s writing and this series was what draw me in, initially.
I do expect Euron to go into full blown psychotic seizure later on. Nina Gold knows her stuff. If Pilou was casted as Euron, they expect him to do stuff exactly like this. As with Max von Sydow recast as Three Eyed Raven – that one look in vision, before he went black dust, was everything. Even with the general high standard of acting in the series, that was classic, very Bergmanian, indeed.
TheHeartTree,
I thought Bran warged into Hodor (The 3ER told him to do so didn’t he?) as Meera’s voice intruded in the flashback creating a feedback of sorts, frying poor young hodors brain.
Maybe because 3ER had already seen it happen?
Talvivaara,
Yeah some good points
One thing I noticed was Pilu has done the trippy nut thing on the rope bridge seamlessly, but as soon as he got up after the Coronation a deep sense of malice
And it’s no small role either, eg the main antagonist to Dany for the next phase it seems
But Max Von Sydow, I thought it seemed odd when seeing the pics with his lack of long hair and zombie Tree appearance etc, but this episode, and when looking back, you can really get a sense of how he added deep depth to Brans journey I might not have felt with the original actor
Obviously BR chose this event firstly because it is “Home” that Bran loved so endearingly in E2, this is when Direwolf Summer is being killed etc, eg the Winds of Winter is sweeping in it is Rickard saying goodbye to Ned ala BR to Bran, it’s the last time Rickard and Ned saw eachother I think so Rickard is attempting to give Ned a loving message etc before they part,
and you have to see how BR is doing the same with Bran, eg in the very final moments of life when he is face-to-face with the Night’s King in a sense his final act is a gesture of warmth to his protege, the last vestiges of Summer before the grim winter sets in
This was all quite touching and Max Von Sydow really conveyed that in the facial expressions (rather than words) before his image dissolved into the wisp thing, it was really a quite fantastic scene given a lot of power by the actors involved
I loved how throughout the entire thing, while he is teaching and lecturing Bran to keep him under control and to be responsible but he never showed anger, never blamed Bran or put him down as such
Beer Island,
Take all the.time u need.martin is king makes Tolkien look like Dr Seuss. Blood ravens plan looks clear to me. Kill off all the starks. Trick bran to fight on wrong side.3er laughing tree at lyanna stark who puts on the armor. Wins tourney.and rhaegar.3er drove the king “mad” with voices to burn it all.bran being pushed and a 3 eyed raven watching it all .the dragon has 3,heads .a blackfyre targ a true targ and I’m gonna say it….
Ice fyre targ. This world is so off tilt children screwing around .nobody really dies . its all a game and we know nothing.
Should have been obvious. I say in hind site .cof broke the arm of dorne almost sundered the north.and finally forges light bringer on 3rd try plunging in the heart of a stark.there is no good or bad only evil or hero’s .
B raven is a half targ he fought in blackfyre rebellion. With the true targs became hand I think and just left with some men and joined the watch.then made lord Commander and left that office too. Not for starks. But rid world of them.to a targ fan he may be good. Not I I’m stark all the way .braven has info we don’t. And to him nights king may seem evil. But I think they start coming cause blood raven is killing starks.blood of my blood .all answers right in front of us
Jinx47,
There is no known treatment, though Stannis did bring in healers from all over the world, the most learned maesters from the citadel etc to help Shireen. They tried potions and tonics but what damage was done could not be undone. They were able to stop the progress and help her keep her sanity by stopping it from spreading.
The left side of her face is scarred by Greyscale, which she caught as an infant. Normally considered a death sentence, Stannis refused to give up on her and called in every healer he could find from both sides of the Narrow Sea to try to cure her, and through the combination of their efforts they managed to succeed, though the left side of her face was left permanently scarred– Shireen Baratheon Wikipidia
Jinx47,
Well , in the books , didnt a Red Priest halfway heal Victarians hand when it was severely infected . I know he didnt have greyscale but …
jennyofoldstones,
Should have been obvious. I say in hind site .cof broke the arm of dorne almost sundered the north.and finally forges light bringer on 3rd try plunging in the heart of a stark.there is no good or bad ,, evil or hero’s .just a,2faced god who don’t give a damn.
One of Ramsays 20 good men,
It is fall in show most of deaths are from falls. leaf ,summer,balon, traitors at wall had a short fall
Dylanstargaryian,
Where has benjen been in oldstones Ben has been jen .
jennyofoldstones,
Maybe he already has.maybe history repeat .I’m thinking bran the rebuilder
Cof are called children for a reason.being childish about there fate there times up and it screwed the world askew .half’s and 3s everywhere. Middle ground to be had ?maybe jon
Bitter sweet .war of roses. Red targ, blue stark.the north was supposed to remember. Bran does I hope. Building all that we know . maybe a tweak here and there
Not according to the words he put in Leafs mouth:
There is no room for magic in the world of men, the giants will go, the mammoths, COF…….the Direwolves will out last us all, but they eventually will go. paraphrased.
Bitter sweet .war of roses. Red targ, blue stark.the north was supposed to remember. Bran does I hope. Building all that we know . maybe a tweak here and there children missed up the world they so loved.damn kids never an adult thought .bitter sweet.nothing left to rule.
Just watched the episode. I don’t usually comment on the episodes anywhere but with this one I have to. I was so blown away. The whole episode was great, but the very end scene… I was so sad while at the same time excited to learn the answer for this long time mystery. A weird combination of feelings.
Overall a great episode, the visuals, the character moments, the new reveals of the overall story. I’ve not liked the episodes of the latest seasons as much as the earlier ones. But this one was nearly perfect IMO, with the exception of LF and his jetpack. I could not at all care about Sansa in that scene because I was just taken out of the show by how ridiculously quickly he got there.
HelloThere,
Ditto. The kingsmoot was an ok scene in the books, but a bit boring. It didn’t improve on screen. How some commenters think it was rushed is beyond me – I was waiting for it to be over. But I guess it all has to do with how much you like the Ironborn and their story. I honestly don’t care all that much about them, so there is that.
Love it .so much to absorb though.it is known that we no nothing. All ago for whatever. Dany had to go back to go forward. The planet is off its tilt.kids playing and breaking and sundered freaking forging light bringer or Lucifer.is anything left for us to chew on .shit seems backward.I know.
The wall comes down breaking westoroes again. But done right the huge north is broke into the sea .northeroes. Putting planet back on track.
Davos said it fuck the gods now where is that stallion who fucks the world?.
Jinx47,
Stannis found a cure for his daughter, remember?
Mihnea,
No, she had a mild case as an infant, and its generally not fatal in children
Atish Vaze,
I was thinking about that too. I suppose dragon glass won’t kill him. Maybe Valyrian steel will or better yet dragon flame.
No cure only thing is death which seems hard to get in this song.could cof have done that too.they sound alot like many faced god .wierwood trees worshipped by children .lots of trees with faces .I believe those kids created it all as a way to battle humans.everything I’ve seen shows no sign of a true god. Just people fuckin power playing each other to no end..or ww are the anti apocalypse.
TheWhiteSnowWolf,
I’m hoping Jorah ends up in the Citadel and meets up with Sam who might have read a book about curing greyscale. If he had told Tyrion about his greyscale he might have known something about Shireen’s case and possibly point him in the right direction or even Varys might have known which maesters were called in by Stannis. I hope he makes it.
Poor Hodor!! So sad 🙁
It reminded me of Harry Potter when Snape tells Dumbledore that he raised Harry for slaughter. All the things Wylis could’ve done with his life like any normal, albeit large, human being but instead he had to become Hodor. I have hope still that since we didn’t actually see him dead, that maybe he was rescued somehow and possibly Wylis again.
Jinx47,
I’m a grown man and couldn’t help it .another first for show for me.by far the best of series. Every scene they gave us clues an foreshadowing at its best.hodor was not even close to my favorite.but gotta love that heart.hope to see him again standing with ww and the north men together to fight the fire queen.fire god or whoever,does not sound like something I’d follow.blood raven killing starks pissed him off.glad those silly children saved bran the rebuider and a ice targ.
Nights king vs dawns queen. 3 heads of the dragon.3 different targ lines black fyre targ true targ and I hope the new icefyre blood line.
Flayed Potatoes,
I also liked how Ser Davos put Sansa into her place,and if the Tullys have a large army im going to win the lottery tommorow.Lol
Jon’s Mom,
Jon’s Mom,
Jon’s Mom,
Citadel has been feeding half truths face less man are there and only change what they don’t want anyone to know.
Greyjoy bridge infrastructure,
Yes don’t think they be much more than a sesame Street army by now. Black fish maybe .
fall right now winter is coming next year .more ww next year. Ficking pissed about the poor job the nights watch men have been doing.think why would all the scum of westeoroes sent to do a job being the nights watchmen for the nights king.because it is a sacrifice to him.they watched the wrong side.
The north is gonna have to remember.there.pact with children may be void.and the.wall can.come down cause ice isn’t gonna stop ice people.kinda polar of fire for targs.
Sofiab,
Lil pinky is a blank to me. Maybe a faceless man maybe glamour. Maybe bran has changed other things we’ve yet to see.
bran the un builder of the wall.once he sees what the blood ravens been doing. Brans the key. almost godlike in books. Once he truly knows what’s up that wall is coming down horn to blow down wall is hidden north of wall why?seems on the wrong side to keep away from the ones who would need it .if they wanted it down it would be. Nights king can blow the horn or maybe bran. Warging into those island of wierwood trees .maybe. Nights king after blood raven or just getting. Ready to face evil dragon queen. Who with the force she has would destroy the 7kingdoms.Jon the middle man for both sides. There will.be a bargain for the good of the world all that wall is.a.perfect wedge. To break. The northernmost point to crash into the ocean .forming a truly cold place for those ww we don’t really know nothing about.except that they let Sam live and benjen been north awhile.night king is looking like an ally to starks . wonder why his Family has forgot it all .blood raven.Jinx47,
In season 4, Sam gives them some dragonglass arrow and spear heads. She probably used one of them.
Bran and Meera are saved by Coldhands (or Benjen or the Flaming Mace Guy {the fire he jumps through seems similar to the one at the entrance of The Cave}). They reach the Wall but since Bran is marked the magical powers of the Wall may not stop the WW. It is just as the protection of the Cave fails.
Sansa and Jon separate and try to recruit as many houses as they can. Sansa is not so successful but Ned 2.0 is and that scene in the trailer during the Battle of The Bastards when Tormund sees Jon(probably) with an army behind him changes the course of the battle. One of the two flayed and burned men on Bolton X’s is Rickon (#SAVE_THE_STARKS)
-What Sansa meant that if the Karstarks and The Umbers can pledge loyalty to a Bastard then why wont the other houses of North rise for a Bastard and 2 Starks.
Dylanstargaryian,
Maybe we will find out Baelish had a twin all this time and no one ever knew. 😀
I got to work this morning had a thought. Princess was promised to the nights king. Bargain was made .blood raven somehow found out.and has been trying to keep it from happening. Killing off those starks that have to keep the deal.oh yeah and those spirals off bodies in first episode sure looks like a sign .hey where is my princess? Again in the last show saw same spiral “sure could pass for danys sigil.another reason Ned didn’t want Robert to kill her he knew she was promised to the nights king.and as long as she is across sea .he may believe he isn’t responsible any more.
Gotta be close.
sofiab,
That would explain a lot.hey Read my last post please and feed back
Maybe not princess but Prince’s plural as he was owed 3 princes from house targ.why else would rhygaer drop everything. And want to be a warrior. To protect his kids.Jon’s stare down last.year has a lil more meaning now.Ned’s promise is even more so lyanna doesn’t want her twins to become what everyone fears.please read
The episode doesn’t really reveal a lot about the white walkers. For example it doesn’t reveal their motivations, endgame, where they got what looks like night watch armour, and the significance of the night king and why he in particular leads the white walkers and where he got his powers of white walker conversion and reanimation.
mathos,
Yes I’ve been speculative .but I’ve not seen any thing close and it fits so nice.I’m pretty certain nights king is a stark and they made a bargain princes or princess we’re promised to him check out those spirals that is pretty darn close to dany sigil.
Dylanstargaryian
May 24, 2016 at 9:01 am
Dylanstargaryian:
I got to work this morning had a thought. Princess was promised to the nights king. Bargain was made .blood raven somehow found out.and has been trying to keep it from happening. Killing off those starks that have to keep the deal.oh yeah and those spirals off bodies in first episode sure looks like a sign .hey where is my princess? Again in the last show saw same spiral “sure could pass for danys sigil.another reason Ned didn’t want Robert to kill her he knew she was promised to the nights king.and as long as she is across sea .he may believe he isn’t responsible any more.
What about the ‘other theory’ that Jon is acually the son of Lyanna and Rhaegar?
Peachesforever, maybe maybe
Might be Ned’s promise to let Jon go in dany place.why benjen Was gone so long trying to renegotiate.and maybe he did send three princes as promised. Meera Jon and benjen r all of royal blood to me.but thoughs spirals sure looks like it was the targs to pay there. Price.
Kinda believed 3 princess were promised. All targ blood blood raven stopped it .
I have been reading these songs since 2000 .only now wrote post. But I thought I’d seen all the theory’s. Not this one. It was like being slapped in the face. Seem likely all my evidence supports it. Blood raven was hand of the king Left with I forget how many men to join nights watch got elected lord commander and just left again.
Why only direwolf die everytime??.
Poor summer ?and poor shaggydog?. Please stop killing direwolf.
He needed to save his targs . start killing the ones who made the pact.starks fall real rapidly being. Pulled apart.just like that one of the oldest houses almost detroyed.the north remembers what winter is coming.all fits so nicely.
Nights king may be invincible he was forged with dragonglass .may need to be unforged. Or just maybe the wall will break off and take.half.the north with it. I think that the world needs a northroes. To put.planet back on axis.
The. Wolves r just as proud a creature as a stark. Willing to die for what they love.plus there not extinct yet.
QUESTION:
Other than the 5 Stark Direwolves and their dead Momma. Is there any record of any other ALIVE direwolf both in the books and the tv show?
R.I.P.Hoddor.,
At last.! someone sees what I see….. Sansa is Cersei mark 2 …..Jon beware!
Ghost would make six. Dire wolves are alive north of the wall in the books.
Mihnea,
Peace is the only way to win a war it is known. I love a good challenge.
Mihnea,
A little late but you asked: the theater scene reminded me of just how strong the writing is for GOT. The reference is quite clearly to the play within a play in Hamlet. The goal is to provide a character with a very clear perspective on a thing with a different point of view. Arya also got a clear sense that there are stories about what happened at Kings Landing that are not flattering to her family. The dividing line is this: Arya is a child of the North of Westeros hiding out (let’s be honest) in Braavosi. And what is very clear is that the Braavosi don’t think much of their financial clients in Westeros. Raises the question of what is a girl to do when she realizes that she has been studying in the depths of the bowels of a people who may be her enemies.
Mihnea,
You won’t miss him for long… white walker hodor, scary thought!