Entertainment Weekly has a big casting scoop for us today! EW reports that Freddie Stroma has joined the cast of Game of Thrones as Dickon Tarly, the younger brother of Samwell Tarly.
Recently, Stroma has starred in the television series UnREAL, but may be best known to worldwide audiences as the obnoxious Cormac McLaggen in the Harry Potter film series. Stroma also appeared in Pitch Perfect as Luke, showing off his accent and his abs.
Back in May, we received the casting list for season 6 which indicated we’d be seeing Dickon next season. It described him as “athletic, a good hunter,” and “not particularly bright.” Dickon is, as he was in the ASOIAF novels, the favored child of Samwell’s stern father Randyll.
Well, readers, what do you think of this casting? I think he’s a great choice, based on the roles I’ve seen him in!
Lol I just commented on this in another post.
Good choice!
He’s no Dickon Manwoody but it will do :p So we will meet Sam’s family. Let’s see who’s playing Randyll next!
I’m going to guess this is probably a smallish role? Whatever transpires between the Tarly family will be mostly Sam and Randyl.
Tormund’s Woman,
We also got a casting call for a ”Mother” and a ”Sister”, I guess also Sam’s familly.
For some reason, I’m equally exited for them aswell. 🙂
Another Potter actor joins the cast!
Who Next?
David Thewlis would be a fantastic Aeron.
methinks the Dickon jokes are about to get a lot more raunchy with that handsome fuck in the role
I also replied to this on the other thread. Lesson learned: Never try to out-scoop a scooper.
For me this is a bit larger picture deal. Obviously Sam/Gilly will go to the Tarly homestead….I have to think that Oldtown would be next on their cross country jaunt. Seems logical to me……..one step at a time. 😉
I knew who he was as soon as I saw the picture on you tweet, it’s great to see more potter actors join the show. Great casting, I think he will do great, as big or small as his part may be. His interactions with Sam will probably be either heartbreaking or hilarious (or both).
GRRM had to be snickering like a ten year old when he wrote that name.
I have a strong feeling that Dickon will try to seduce Gilly just to bully Sam.
He was amusing in the Harry Potter films; that’s the extent of my familiarity with him.
Ravyn,
If there ends up being an attack on Oldtown or whatever, he may end up doing some fighting.
Aahaha I forgot Dickon was a lunkhead. I like this even better now.
Nice news!
I always knew Dickon would not be played that actor cast last month, Sam Colman I think it was. I’m still guessing he will be Pate the pigboy. Perhaps young Hodor in flashbacks or one of the green recruits from the casting leaks…
This last week has certainly brought a tonne of production news!!
Thanks for all the great work, Sue and the sharp-eyed/ obsessed fans who sent in reports!
Hmm actually, if you look at the facial features, there’s enough of a similarity that he and Sam Tarly could pass for TV-brothers.
Gravemaster,
I have a funny scene in mind,
Dickon makes fun of Gilly about looking bad.
They then proceed to give her a bath, gods know she’s earned it.
When she returns they are all stunned how preaty she is. Wont be a problem here as Hannah is very preaty.
Just my two cents.
Wait? Where’s the Hodor?
Am…am I the first one?
If so, Hodor!
If not, then I’m calling Gilly falling for Dickon if she meets him.
Sean C.,
Yeah, he was hilarious. This will probably be a similar role, to be honest. A dumb yet good-natured hunk of a man. At least I hope Dickon is good-natured… Randyll will be enough of a bully for Sam.
So the show can’t have 2 characters called Osha and Asha, but they can have Rickon and Dickon?
Gravemaster,
Not that we really know anything about Dickon (even in the books I don’t think Sam really talks about him), but I personally think him being a bully would be the least-interesting way to portray the character. Sam already has a bullying dad, who will presumably be the main focus. Not that I expect Dickon to get much focus, but I think it would be more interesting if he tried to be on good terms with Sam despite his dad’s obvious bias.
The Tattered Prince,
Consonants are pronounced more distinctly than vowels. Vowels such as “o” and “a”, in English in particular, are too similar in some instances. Some of us can barely spot the difference sometimes. That said, it was a bit unnecessary.
The Tattered Prince,
R and D are not really that easy to mitake, for one another, unlike A and O.
Sean C.,
I’d like that too. A good-natured kid, maybe even naïve as to what happened with Sam’s exile. That’d be great.
Poor Sam. Ian McShane for a hateful dad, and this guy for an insufferable younger brother. And all he’s got is love and White Walker debris under his fingernails.
Kinda like “Mr. Awesome” from Chuck (the spy spoof TV show)? When I first saw him and saw that his nickname was “Mr. Awesome” I was totally expecting him to be a douchebag of a character. I was pleasantly surprised when Mr. Awesome turned out to actually be awesome.
Luka Nieto,
Agreed, would like if Dickon is somewhat nice too Sam. He can do some jokes tough, wouldn’t be brothers otherwise. 🙂
Now Sam and Ron can sulk together about being overshadowed by best friends and brothers.
This casting is perfect. Freddie looks younger than Sam, but muscular. And I think their eyes looks similar, good for playing brothers.
The Tattered Prince,
I think they just didn’t like Asha as a name for some reason and say that as an excuse.
And IMO Yara is a better name.,
Well hellooooooooooooooooooooo Dickon!
mau,
Yeah wouldn’t suprise me.
I don’t agree with you about Asha tough, While I don’t find it an extremly good name, it doesn’t bother me. Same with Yara..
Anyway, in my opinion, complaining about names, is really petty tough.
People who insisted Sam Coleman for the role are probably feeling pretty stupid right now.
So I’m tryin to think how dickon would be important enough to be cast . I’m thinking that he dies somehow making Sam the heir
Cumsprite,
That’s why they yell that this is a ”misscast”, it’s preaty easy to spot them.
Shane snow,
The heir again I should say
Moonlight,
They totally look alike!! I saw his face and though: oh wow, they found an actual actor who looks just like John, only slim.
Shane snow,
My guess..He takes Garlan’s role, in fighting the Ironborn.
dee,
My opinion exactly!! How can people say he doesn’t resamble Sam..?
Cumsprite,
It was stupid idea.
And I think that Dickon will be a dick.
Shane snow,
he can’t become heir again though – he gave up any chance of that when he joined the brothers of the Night’s Watch. If Dickon dies (and then Randyll, eventually), the title and lands go to some uncle or cousin of theirs.
He really does look like he could be Sam’s brother. Nice.
Regarding the Asha/Osha versus Rickon/Dickon, in addition to what others have pointed out about consonants, I’m guessing (of course I could be wrong) Dickon will be pronounced with a long “i,” whereas Rickon was not.
I have always chuckled over the Asha/Yara thing, though. I get the reasoning, although I, too, think the audience could have kept it straight, but what makes me chuckle is Yara, at least to me, sounds a lot like Arya.
mau,
He’s got a good name then. 😛
Good selection, he could pass for Sam’s meat head sibling.
Now cast Mrs. Tarly, Nina should cast this actress, just becuase it would be fun:)
Mihnea,
He will have 2-3 scenes at most.
I think he’ll be more for comic relief, along the lines of the handsome but dense prince in Shrek.
Never did understand that, but ah well. After all….Robb and Robert. Jorah and Jeor. Tywin and Tyrion. Jon and Jon Arryn. Rickon and Rickard. Stark and Karstark. And on and on and on. Weird excuse to change a name, at any rate.
Nymeria Warrior Queen,
Hmm, I never tought about saying Dickon, with a long ”i”. Damn english is complicated.
My autocorrect turns dickon to suckin
Considering they’re willing to announce who is playing Dickon, but are keeping Ian McShane’s role secret, is it safe to say McShane is not playing Randyll Tarly? I’m definitely starting to lean towards McShane as Septon Maribald now.
Great visual casting. He definitely looks like Sam (a hotter, buffer version of Sam, but yeah). I’m tickled that Cormac McLaggen is joining the GOT ranks, along with Tonks, Argus Filch, Aragog, Mrs. Granger, Aberforth Dumbledore, Amycus Carrow, and Madame Maxime. I’ll always remember that hilarious scene with Cormac lasciviously sucking food off his fingers to attempt to entice Hermione.
Sam can’t inherit as a NW brother: “I shall hold no lands” and all that.
…I do agree that something’s likely to happen to Cormac…er, Dickon. GRRM loves killing off the handsome, flashy, young golden boy types in favour of their less resplendent siblings. Ned outlives Brandon. Doran outlives Oberyn. Robb’s brothers outlive him. Joffrey’s siblings outlive him. Loras isn’t dead yet, but I’m betting Willas will outlive him. And so on.
Pigeon,
Arya/Yara, Bran/Bronn, Arys/Varys, Pork and Beans
M,
Imagine the same scene, only him making fun of the fact that Sam can’t eat it.
What a newsy week. Awesome.
I dont recall Frances de la Tour in GoT ! ^^
tyjon,
LoL
*
“It’s leviOsa, not levioSAW”
*puts away the Hermione hat*
M,
Wait, where is Madame Maxine in GoT?
I am glad to see you chose an avatar!! Looks good and I wish that everyone would choose them. Bland grey and white no name avatars are boring. It is so easy to do! YAY!!!
JCDavis,
Don’t stop, I’m taking notes here 🙂
M,
I kno but I figure it would end up something along the lines of like what stannis offered Jon but it will happen far later in the story
JCDavis,
Well, I’m a “show purist”, so I must have one half of D&D on my avatar. 😉
Shane snow</a
M,
I also dont think nights watch will be around for much longer
I think the rest of the Tarly family should follow soon enough
LOL. Is Book Dickon a dick? I can’t recall. (I mean, this is GRRM’s work, “handsome and athletic heir” is usually shorthand for “utter douchebag,” so probably.) It doesn’t mean they wouldn’t change TV Dickon’s characterization.
It’s more interesting to me if TV Dickon is a goodnatured jock type who’s not terribly bright, as opposed to some dumb, nasty jock who lords it over and looks down on Sam. Knowing GRRM, though, I’m guessing the latter is more likely than the former.
The thing about GRRM to me is that he’s so predictable in some ways. He doesn’t care about alpha male types at all; he’s completely uninterested in their stories, unless they suffer some sort of devastating loss which strips them of alpha status forever. He takes great delight in introducing arrogant, good-looking, flashy young things and disfiguring or massacring them. What does interest him are characters who for one reason or another are outcasts, overlooked, dismissed or even abused, either by dint of their birth, sex, appearance, illness or disability, or for some other reason. The line about GRRM’s–sorry, “Tyrion’s”–soft spot for “cripples, bastards and broken things” is a good one, because GRRM has very little interest in characters who don’t fit into one of those three categories.
mau,
Tghere is no such thing as a ”show purist”, most of the fighting in the fandom, is between book readers- those who liked AFFC/ADWD and those who where letdown by them(This is me, I didn’t hate those books, but I was very dissapointed.)
“Dickon” is a real man´s name …
Mihnea,
Sorry, the right term is a show apologist. 😀
That guy cut his hair short around filming time. I think he’s young Hodor. Looks so much like him now.
Ian Whyte doubled for her, for height. 🙂
(And of course Frances de la Tour played the face/acting/closeup scenes.)
Now my delicate feelings are all hurt and stuff. 🙁
(No, not really. I like my SN to be like the cheese…it stands alone.)
dee,
Sam’s sister would come before any cadet male lines, at least in theory.
How do you choose an avatar?
I can’t figure it out. I must be dense as a castle wall.
This actor is perfect. Exactly how I imagined Dickon!!
The. Worst.
You forget Bronn and Bran. Sometimes it seems the show thinks women are interchargeable. No. They are interchargeable.
In the casting call they said Dickon will be a brute but in the books he is a good guy…. he helped Briene …
You mean “show-apologist.” There’s no such thing as a show purist, only book purists. ?
Hottest guy ever in Game of Thrones!
Hoyti Von Totiy,
Not a mean brute, they never specified, they just said he is not very smart.
M,
It really would be nice that if an attractive young male would not be horrible person for once. There was “who would you marry” thread in Westeros recently and I just noticed how many beautiful and likable women there are in asoif compared to men. Dim but likable jock would be nice character for Dickon.
But I think book Dickon is still a child. When the series started Sam was 15 and now it has been 3 years at most, probably less. And Randyll bullied Sam for years before Dickon was born. So book Dickon is probably 11 at most. So this dynamic will be unique for the show even if GRRM originally wanted Sam and Dickon be reunited after the 5 year gap and have this dynamic it is pretty unlikely to happen.
The show was great with the dysfunctional Lannister family dynamic (which now I miss) before so I think they will handle the Tarly’s great even if we do not see them much. So I am looking forward to this. Hopefully the Greyjoy family dealings will be handled well too, I think they have done a good job so far and it is only the lack of screen time for them that has been a problem. But now they might not have time to develop the characters and the plot well enough and have to modify it from the books too so they might suffer similar to Dorne (but nowhere near as badly in any case). But they could do good job with them too.
THAT is what bothers me.
Why put in a typical stereotype of a “fat”-weak/smart brother and a “thin/strong” dumb brother …?
GOT is better than that.
The Osha/Asha thing is so stupid because they are both barely even on the show so who would confuse them?
Sue the Fury,
Wow. The resemblance is uncanny. He’s definitely playing young Hodor!
Sue, any info on Mark Gatiss returning?
Well, YOU may be snickering like a ten-year-old, but no need to project that onto the author. FYI, Dickon was an extremely common nickname for Richard in the Middle Ages/Renaissance. There were no Ricks or Richies in Shakespeare’s day, but plenty of Dicks and Dickons (the latter more likely used as a diminutive for a child).
And the word definitely did NOT yet have the phallic connotation that it did today. According to the Penis Chart (yes, there is one, it’s a timeline) from ‘Green’s Dictionary of Slang,’ the earliest known citation of the word ‘dick’ used as a euphemism for the male member is from 1836! Common slang terms from circa 1500 like pin, cod, spindle, iron, fiddle, pillock are no longer in common use to signify the penis, though pizzle is still sometimes used in reference to livestock.
Sadly predictable which regular commenters on here went straight for the dick jokes. Grow up, laddies.
Good casting. Will be nice to explore Sam’s family dynamics. I’ve noticed that often casting announcements come right before filming for that individual. So if younger Tarly should be filming soon, perhaps news of who is playing his dad should come soon.
Hoyti Von Totiy,
What? Dickon doesn’t appear in the books, does he?
Sue the Fury,
You’re RIGHT. I forgot about that.
Prediction: Gilly is gitty after meeting Dickon and asks Sam’s sister to doll her up to try and get his attention. She then has a sad/awkward convo with Sam about how her baby doesn’t really look like a Sam but could pass for a Dickon. And our poor Sam is crushed
Sue the Fury,
Thanks for the update… and yes he does!
McMannis,
Whew, that was a close call! The site will crash if each article doesn’t get a hodor within the 1st 50 comments, it is known
Gendry. Podrick. Trystane, so far as we know. Loras.
OMG! I want one, GoT Pinball Machine Coming
Firannion,
+1 I found your comment fascinating
Making the 8,
That wouldn’t make any sense for multiple reasons: firstly, because Gilly has been rather aggressive about asserting her interest in Sam; and second, everybody knows that Gilly came to Horn Hill with Sam from the Wall, and her child this could not possibly have been fathered by Dickon.
tyjon,
I wasn’t sure if it was a video game, nope it’s a real pinball machine that’s awesome. I’m much more hyped for this than the cheap but overpriced bb8 toy
Like a daikon radish? Doesn’t sound right to me, and definitely not the way the name was pronounced back when it was a common diminutive for Richard.
In some ways, I would agree. But in other ways, isn’t their father supposed to have taken a much more direct hand in raising Dickon? If so, then he should be much more hard-edged than Sam, and much more the son that Randyll wanted.
Still, it might be better if Dickon is some intermediate between Sam and Randyll that can serve as a bridge, rather than Dickon being Dudley Dursley (to continue the Harry Potter theme). Of course, given that we don’t know what the heck the Tarly’s do in Winter, this is a big “might”!
Oh, and Gary Oldman should play R’hllor when he appears. 😀 (Actually, I am surprised that more Harry Potter alum have not appeared in Thrones: but, then, perhaps many of them are shying away from more fantasy projects for obvious reasons.)
Just another Essos cock merchant,
Almost $200 for 5″ bb8, that will break down sooner than later, I’ll pass.
Real GoT Pinball machine for your GoT recreation cave, need a GoT pool table with GoT billiard light and then a GoT chess set and GoT dartboard.
*passes over some warm cookies* That always helps, right? 😉
A long “i” like daikon, yes, but not with the second syllable being pronounced like “con.” In addition to already stating I could be wrong, I’d be surprised if they were overly concerned about how the name was pronounced hundreds of years ago.
btw – Of course everyone is entitled to their opinion, but imo, there’s nothing wrong with some dick-jokes. When reading or hearing Shakespeare, do you find yourself wishing you could go back in time and tell him to grow up?
*sniffle, sniffle*
Yes, thank you, I feel better, now. 🙂
tyjon,
BTW ozzys the man, that’s where u got that pic from right
I’m not sure where Dickon being nice comes from…
I personally always pictured him as a jarhead type…
Sam was the disappointment… Dickon is his father’s golden boy.
Sam was more like his mother… Dickon should be more like Randyll.
I’m not sure he would need to be a stereotypical bully going out of his way to be mean to Sam, but he should certainly be someone Randyll Tarly could take pride in. I don’t think being sympathetic or nice to Sam would be the type of thing that impresses Lord Tarly.
Hover your mouse over your avatar and choose make a better profile. I think you have to sign on to Gravatars….or Word Press, but from there, there are tons of choices. But it also allows you to choose from one of your own “my pictures” file.
So I’m guessing he gonna be a dimwit and a jerk. He will probably come of jofferyish mixed with robin. And we haven’t had a hint of any of that according to Sam
Regarding the Rickon vs Dickon thing, they could go with different pronunciations. The show pronounces “Rickon” as “Rih-KAHN,” so maybe they could pronounce “Dickon” as “Dick-en.” Or something like that.
Loving all the casting/filming location news this week. The Greyjoys and Tarlys will be fun in S6. Thanks, Sue and WoTW staff!
That sounds like a subplot for CW’s Reign, not GoT. After the hell she’s been through, I don’t think Gilly will be impressed at all, even if Dickon is civil.
Isn’t it obvious? Because of GRRM. Which category does he fit into? Definitely not the latter.
I don’t see the sibling resemblance that some are seeing – he doesn’t have John Bradley’s pug nose at all. But based on his turn as Cormac McLaggen, it seems like a decent fit. We know that he can do a smug dumb jock, presuming that’s as far as they go with fleshing out the character.
But I agree that it would be more interesting if Randyll’s other son has his own way of manifesting the strain of having such an overbearing martinet for a father. Obsessive/compulsive perfectionist, perhaps? Anorexic/bulimic? Just because Randyll has always favored Dickon and vigorous physical activity comes naturally to him doesn’t mean that pleasing such a parent is easy. Lots of athletes have eating disorders.
I know this out of the topic but I gotta ask… No Euron or Ironborn sightings today?
Sean C.,
Sorry I should have added an lol as I was not at all serious. I was just implying after meeting Dickon it would be more shit heaped on Sam if Gilly renamed her baby after her new crush.
Darquemode,
Dickon in the books is like 11 years old, tops. He’s clearly meant to be somebody with a martial inclination, but I don’t think that precludes him having some affection for his brother. And sure, Randyll would have probably done his best to set a poor example on that score, but Sam’s mother and sister would also be influences.
No, because Shakespeare’s ribald humor is sly, funny and not at all infantile. It doesn’t sound like seven-year-olds gleefully spouting the bad word that they just learned this week and discovered shocks the grownups. I see a big distinction – like the difference between Monty Python (whom I love) and Benny Hill (whom I detest). For me, sexual humor is a whole lot more effective when it’s either a little oblique or completely absurd, and not just waved in your face to be ‘dirty’. But that’s just me, I guess.
Sean C.,
It wouldn’t surprise me if, at least in private, Dickon was decent to Sam. Unless he’s a mini-me version of his father, I’d think it would only be natural to have some type sympathy for how Sam was treated. Moreover, I would guess Sam always treated Dickon decently…just because Sam’s decent that way.
Yeah, there was no way that the other kid was playing Dickon. This fits how he was described.
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Sean C.,
True enough I guess…
Another big player in his attitude would be the knight he is a squire for… I forget who that was.
I don’t see Dickon becoming a major player in the books or TV series. If he does only have a handful of scenes, is there time to flesh out a dynamic character? Even if there is enough time to do so, is there any gain from doing so? I personally think that the character is only there (on the TV series) to show a contrast to Sam. I don’t see the benefit of showing Dickon as an understanding brother personally.
Shrug…
Firannion,
I disagree. I think some of Shakespeare’s jokes are absolutely infantile, and they’re meant to be…especially if you take the atmosphere of the performances at the time into consideration, an atmosphere much more like a concert these days, where people from all walks of life attended, and the audience did not necessarily sit there quietly observing.
I swear to God if they waste too much time on the Tarlys’ soap opera….
There was already too much Sam & Gilly boring cheesefest in season 5. Would the story suffer without Sam’s family drama/travelogue? Can’t see how it would. Also isn’t Dickon like 13 in ADWD? It’d make him about 18 in the show. That guy doesn’t look that young.
Darquemode,
I don’t mean that Dickon needs to be a bully or a dick-on to Sam..
I just expect him to be more like Randyll Tarly than Melessa Florent. I don’t see sympathy playing a big part in the role if that is the direction they go.
Firannion,
To be fair, you quoted info from something called a ‘Penis Chart’.
Done!!
Why should we see a young Hodor? Young Robert Baratheon is more likely, with young Ned and Jon Arryn.
Sean C.,
true, I forgot about the sisters …
Darquemode,
I wouldn’t put it past D&D to extend Dickon’s role. They have a habbit of doing that. That is creating show-only characters, giving minor characters from books more screentime than necessary, all the while cutting out important characters or screwing up/cutting short the storylines of those already on board.
phantomstrife,
How do you know wich storyline is important? Did you had a talk with GRRM?
WOOF!!!
I mean, uh, Woah! Yay!
Let’s hope D&D have heard Kit asking for more male nudity on the show, now they have the perfect candidate for a full frontal 😀
I mean D&D seem to think Dickon Tarly is more important than Lady Stoneheart, Victarion, Val, Arianne Martell, Coldhands, fAegon Targaryen, Jon Connington, Harold Hardyng, Strong Belwas…
He’s important as the brother of one of the main established characters, Sam. He’s not a back from the dead to do nothing or a new characters with a whole new storyline that keeps the viewers away from the main established characters, like the examples you give 😉
Darquemode,
Now that you’ve mentioned the Florents, will Sam’s mother be concerned about her cousin and Shireen’s death?
Probably not, I guess.
Moka,
Yes. And I don’t think they’l do a flashback with Hodor.
phantomstrife,
Then he is…
The Tattered Prince,
The Florents are a minor detail, especially one marying Randyll, I don’t see why they should add that.
The Tattered Prince,
Interesting… I had not considered that.
Randyll is a military man so he the topic of Stannis defeat (his actions maybe less so) could come up I guess, but I doubt it will be a main issue in that arc. Hmmm…
D&D are also in a much better position than any of us are to determine what characters are and are not important.
Don’t get me wrong, of the characters you mentioned, I really liked Val, the Griffs, and Coldhands, and it would have been great if they had seen a reason to work them in. They didn’t. That tells me they don’t have an impact in terms of where the story is headed, or the impact they may have could easily be taken up by another character.
Nymeria Warrior Queen,
Don’t bother, he would rather live in his cynical world. Where D&D luagh maleficaly, each time they cut a story, then admit that those stories are simply going nowhere. Perfect example for this is Quentin.
Nymeria Warrior Queen,
If you think they give a shit about canon at this point…Them cutting out certain characters or killing off those who are still very much alive in the books is not indicative of how important they are or aren’t canon-wise. They’ve strayed too far from the books.
Since I’m not a mind-reader, I try not to presume what they do or don’t think. I just know they know a helluvalot more about the overall story than any of us do, so are in a better position to determine what is and isn’t important.
Moka,
You think LSH is doing nothing? Or is it about them being averse to the notion of bringing dead characters back to life? In such case, we can expect Jon to join LSH’s club soon enough.
phantomstrife,
It’s because you people, that I can’t wait for TWOW, to see you all shut up. And rage when Stannis dies, when Selmy gets killed my a random yunkish guy, or Harry rapes Sansa.
You are right on the point that they are diverging, but it’s the road they take that is differant, the destination will be the same as the books. Stannis and Selmy are perfect examples for this.
*roflmao*
phantomstrife,
Yes, I think she is pointless, she will not kill Jaime, or Brienne, She will not get revange on the Frey’s because she has a 15-man band.
If a character is important without a doubt to the entired storyline, then sooner or later, we will get him. Just like we get Euron now.
It wouldn’t hurt you to use “in my opinion” after some of your remarks. Humor is humor and is totally relative. I found some of Shakespeare’s humor to be totally infantile and I have just about read or seen in some fashion most of them. And it is my opinion that the humor can totally be seen as projecting to a younger market.
JCDavis,
Oh how much better the world would be, if people would just say ”in my opinion”.
Nymeria Warrior Queen,
Right, like didn’t Martin even express his wish that some of the characters omitted had made it to the show? He’s even made sure to remind everyone of book!Stannis being alive recently or some other characters that the show has killed off. Goes to show that what’s important in the books isn’t necessarily so on the show.
phantomstrife,
Well Stannis is alive in the books at the end of ADWD and early TWOW thats clear, but he will die eventually. GRRM saying anything otherwise would be him spoiling his own work, you don’t do that.
outdoorcats,
I’m leaning towards McShane as Aeron. I could see him as a religious fanatic.
I never had the feeling that Dickon was unkind to his elder brother in the novels. Of course it could be because I only read the books to satisfy my curiosity after I watched season 2 and I did it really fast that I missed many details. Could somebody quote an example or two to refresh my memory. If it is too much then is alright. If not then thanks so much 😀
Josla,
There is none, Dickon is around 12-13 in the books
phantomstrife,
GRRM is hardly the best person to judge which characters are important for the story. He was upset that Quotho was killed in season 1 and that role (if it is of any importance) can be played by any newly introduced Dothraki character.
Furthermore, the books and the show are different and changes don’t matter at all as long as both tell good story (which both do mostly).
Well, LSH appeared only 2 times in the course of 3000 pages and achieved absolutely nothing. So yes, she’s quite useless, for now.
And concerning Jon, his storyline is not over. When Cat dies, her storyline is over and the purpose of her death is that her children are left alone and have now to avenge their family and take back Winterfell. When Jon dies, his storyline is not over and nothing of his storyline can be taken by someone else : his parentage, the Watch, the White Walker attack, Azor Ahai, Mel, Davos… Jon is not LSH.
Regarding the Asha/Yara name change, I think it probably came down to the fact that both Osha and Asha would have been sharing scenes with Theon specifically around the same time in series 2.
In one episode Theon’s talking to Osha, in the next he’s having an argument with Asha. It probably just didn’t sit right.
Whereas Rickon and Dickon are unlikely to ever be mentioned in the same breath or share scenes with any particular character.
Dickon may only feature in a couple of episodes and then never be heard of again, whereas Osha and Asha/Yara featured prominently in both seasons 2 and 3, and again this coming season it would seem.
References to Osha and Asha from one scene to another throughout a season or more probably wasn’t worth any confusion/oddness when they could simply change one of the names.
phantomstrife,
As the author, I’d guess Martin would like to see every one of his characters make it onto the show. So what if
You’ve seem to be one of those people who wants to wring their hands about this or that character not appearing, or being killed, or not being killed. Ok. You still don’t know as much as D&D do about what is or isn’t important in terms of where the story is heading. Neither do I.
Damn, it looks like the spoiler coding still isn’t working.
Dragonslayer,
Or characters like Quentin, Penny….I could go on and on. It is expected that the books have more characters, and more side-stories. But a TV show can’t afford this luxury, they need to tell the story of the MAIN characters. like: Jon, Arya, Bran, Tyrion, Dany, Sansa.(you might add Jaime too). These are the characters the story is about. Not Val, Stannis, Selmy, Stonehearth, Coldhands…etc.
Yes they are interesting characters (most of them), but their contribution to the MAIN story is little, or if neccessery can be done by an already establish character.
I can see it now. Sam’s brother will enter the stage by pulling a shirtless Ramsay sans blood and gore, then Gilly will jump his bones, Sam will walk in on their tryst and the soap opera will be in full swing. Alternatively Dickon will (try to) rape Gilly. D&D like their cheap thrills and shocks.
phantomstrife,
Thank you! I just moved you from book-purist list, to the troll list.
No more comments from me. Have a good night!
Did I not end that comment with “But that’s just me, I guess”? Did I also really need, in your opinion, to insert “in my opinion” into a single-paragraph comment? Would that not have been a little redundant?
Very well, if it makes you happy: That comment in its entirety was my opinion – though I suspect that many Shakespeare fans would agree with me that even his bawdier routines aimed at the groundlings rise above the level of baby-talk punning on the word ‘dick.’ And IN MY OPINION, based on my personal experience of growing up around boys (three brothers, and most of my childhood friends, since I was a tomboy), hearing adult males use that term seems a bit cringeworthy, because it’s typically the first euphemism for their junk that little boys learn once they’ve given up ‘wee-wee’ and ‘pee-pee.’ TO MY EARS ‘dick’ still sounds like baby-talk. With all the colorful alternatives available (a whole rainbow of Yiddish terms, for example), I do wonder why grownups still cling to that one.
You know, watchersonthewall.com is a website for those who like the show. Since all your posts are hateful comments about D&D or the show, maybe you should go to westeros.org. There you’ll find people of your kind 😉
Oh ok. That makes sense qhy I don’t remember then. Being the favorite of his dad doesn’t make you an instant dick. Hopefuly the showrunners don’t go for the conventional and make him more sympathetic
Pigeon,
Um, yeah. That’s the ‘official’ word for it, you know? The one used by doctors and scientists and stuff.
Firannion,
“I kiss the Wall’s hole, not your lips at all.”
Even little kids laugh at that one.
But don’t let me stop you from enjoying your seemingly lofty perch, and the rest of us will have fun making and/or laughing at what you deem infantile dick jokes.
Moka,
This site was preaty good, but it slowly turns into another hate-fest, mostly because of all the book-readers (those who hate the show) started pouring in, I suspect because of the spoilers the team here posts (Good job guys btw!) they want to know where the story in the books go.(the irony!).
It’s truly sad that we scream and yell, about this. After all it’s just entertaining, (both books and show) we should be able to disscuss even if we dissagree, with politness at least.
For those of you who say “D&D already know how the saga’s going to end.”
“As you know, I don’t outline my novels. I find that if I know exactly where a book is going, I lose all interest in writing it.”- GRRM
“It’s a great twist. It’s easy to do things that are shocking or unexpected, but they have to grow out of characters… And with the various three, four characters involved… it all makes sense… And it’s nothing they can do in the show, because the show has already—on this particular character—made a couple decisions that will preclude it, where in my case I have not made those decisions.”- GRRM
Schwing!
Tywin of the Hill,
“We have talked to George extensively about where he’s going with the books, and will continue to do so.”
He may not do a formal outline the way some writers do, but he obviously has an idea where he’s going. That doesn’t mean some of the things can’t change over time, but they still have a clearer idea than we do, given none of us have sat down with Martin and discussed the books.
outdoorcats,
Or Marwyn.
“In my opinion” is overrated because this text is coming from me, it’s obviously my opinion. Same if you heard it come from my mouth.
Or at least that what I always think when I read or hear anybody’s comments, then I choose to agree, disagree, or ignore
Although I am familiar with the scientific name for the vast majority of our human bits and pieces, I am not a penile scholar such as yourself, and cannot refer to a phallic encyclopedia for reference. As much as I appreciate higher learning, I can still just appreciate a dick joke now and again, juvenile as they may be.
Nymeria Warrior Queen,
This!!..I’ve heard on many occasions where Mr Martin says he knows the ending its just getting the characters in the story there that he’s working on
Soooooo this Dickon casting is really bringing out the worst in people
Agreed! Martin knows the finale and “in my opinion” he has become rather bored with writing how he will get the story there. Which is why he takes many years in between books as opposed to when the idea was fresh and new to him and he was cranking books out earlier in the series
Ok, now I’m sitting here laughing at the thought of a dick-shaped…oops, pardon me, a penis-shaped…book.
While that is technically true, when reading someone’s words, many times one can come off as an insufferable know-it-all who really has zero respect that others may not agree with their “opinion”. Adding the “in my opinion” validates that it is just an opinion. It doesn’t make it fact or any more true than any other persons opinion. Rather than as gospel or fact. It is a quirky thing about the internet and reading rather than watching someone’s body language or hearing the tone and inflection of their voice.
I’m happy they at least keep the family of established characters in – I mean, as opposed to seeing some Hightowers we haven’t been connected to before, they’ve set up Samwell Tarly’s past before, and family drama is often the core of most stories. Good to see them rounding out the Tarlys.
* would have broken the like button over this post *
I don’t think so. People are going to be caustic or ugly for any reason they can if that is what they are in to. Mostly the conversation around here is perfectly civil. Today seems to be one of those days that can spiral easily. Especially when discussing the differences between book and show. My two centavos!
There were three boys needed for the scene I believe, not two boys and an adult.
IIRC the “Big for his age boy” was also described as being clever, not something you’d ever call Robert.
My guess young Hodor (they probably won’t call him Walder) is shown to be clever but then is injured in a fight with either Ned or Brandon.
The reason for the scene will be whatever lesson Bran takes from the knowledge that his Dad or Uncle is responsible for how Hodor is.
Is it just me, or does this ‘Dickon’ really look like he could be a little brother of ‘Sam’s’? Great casting! It will be nice to see them interact. I’m really interested in how Sam is perceived by his family as a whole. He’s been through so much, and has really grown in his self confidence and bravery because of it.
I’m sorry, I just have to do it…
Ugh, can you stop saying this over and over again? I think I speak for most of the people criticizing the show on here that if the things that are criticized happen exactly the same way in the book, they’ll be bad as well. I/They/We’ll criticize GRRM for it as well. That’s the main difference between this place and ‘purist sites’: GRRM isn’t sacred here, but D&D aren’t as well. Both make mistakes. And if a D&D mistake turns out to be a GRRM mistake, it’ll be GRRM’s fault and I/they/we’ll go on and criticize GRRM for it.
Seriously? You did not just say that! I can’t stop laughing…
I’m starting a petition here for the part of Sam’s mother, if she hasn’t been cast yet.
It would be a shout out to the show runner’s and be fun to watch her on the series.
If Sam is 23-25 the actress would be the right age considering the medieval world.
Drumroll………………..I submit to Nina Gold the actor “Amanda Peet” for the role of mother
I second that! The should be a “like” button for comments…
It was meant to be infantile, or at least “lower class”: Shakespeare deliberately added coarse humor that only the lower classes sitting in the bad seats understood.
That cannot be emphasized enough! In the end, the Story for the whole series is going to reflect how those 5 or 6 characters have evolved from Book I/Season I to Book VII/Season VIII. Taking too much time away from these characters often is adding sawdust to the flour rather than icing to the cake.
Actually, Robert seems to have been fairly clever: he was a good tactician after all, and being clever can help with that a great deal. But as for Hodor being “injured,” whence comes this notion? There is no reason to think he was ever any other way.
Cumsprite,
Get me off your list cumsprite!!!!!! U got it wrong m8 give me 20!!!!
Not necessarily: not all conjecture is opinion, after all. It clearly is your conjecture, but (strictly speaking) an opinion should have some formal premises and then factual justifications using those premises to support the argument.
An equally likely conjecture is that GRRM gets hung up on tiny details and loses sight of the end-goal. The Meereeneese Knot seems to be one such example: supposedly it took him forever to work out how to get people down there. My thought is that GRRM needs to work more with an editor: as the TV series shows, the Meereeneese Knot really should not have required too much work, and any editor worth his/her salt would have been able to give him a few suggestions that would have greatly reduced the number of pages and probably greatly reduced the number of years necessary to get the book out.
Now, I wouldn’t call this an “opinion”: but it is a possible explanation that predicts some of what we’ve seen and read.
Tis…best…comment…ever!
Sure he’ll be fine. Dick doesn’t get me that excited…the character I mean!
Shane snow,
How would that matter? Sam is part of the NW, he can’t be the heir to a house, because (technically) he is not even part of a house anymore.
I’ve just realized: I was envisioning Harry the Heir as Cormac McLaggen as (with longer hair) when I read the Alayne Chapter. Stroma did a great job of capturing a smug, sleazy and self-entitled “scummy guy” in that short role. (For a smart girl, Hermione had pretty awful taste in men: but, then, a lot of smart girls I know had pretty horrible taste in men, something of which I took full advantage of in my youth! :D)
Sue the Fury,
Who was Aragog in GOT sue?
Do you really find it necessary to try and correct someone on the conventional use of the word “opinion?” I mean, obviously you do, but if you’re going to go that far, I’d suggest you take some time to sit down and write letters to the publishers of all the dictionaries who, according to your “strictly speaking” definition, have incorrectly defined the term.
PenileScholar,
Does the cock merchant consult you?
Another generic white male character with no plot relevance (he doesn’t even appear in the flesh in the books) gets the gig while such dynamic characters like Arianne get shafted.
PenileScholar,
Huzzah!!!
Moles town bastard,
Julian Glover (Pycelle)
Moles town bastard,
Pycelle
If we’s now seeing characters who are only mentioned in the story, where’s the casting call for Howland Reed? If there’s to be a ToJ flashback, shouldn’t he be there? Or Oswell Whent, Gerold Hightower? Can one hope for Rhaegar at some point?
I’d pay to see one on the shelf in the background at the Citadel library.
I’d pay to see this in the background on the grounds of the Citadel!
Please don’t! That would be a massive cock-up!!!
I agree, he certainly looks as though they could be related. Welcome! We aren’t all crazy here, but it helps.
Only when he can’t find the said chart!
Completely OT:
I want to take a moment to thank many of you for making me laugh so much, particularly today. I’m a bit out-of-commission with a bad knee, and it’s driving me nuts. The laughs are really helping me maintain what little sanity I have.
Drinks, or I suppose I should call them cocktails, are on me!!!
Cheers!
rhyordan,
Oh yes, because Arianne (and Dorne in general) has been so relevant in the books so far.
Get in a boat and row, kid.
But I thought that Arianne WAS getting shafted by a generic white male character in the book? And that just didn’t end well.
Nymeria Warrior Queen,
Only when he can’t find the said chart!
May I just say this site has some really great…um… members?!?
Could you possibly provide a…
Wait for it…
Wait…
For…
It…
Link?
Robb Snow,
Way more relevant than a character who hasn’t even appeared in canon. Do you actually believe Dickon Tarly will have any role to play in the last two books?
phantomstrife,
You don’t like shock and you are a fan of GRRM?
*groans as she grabs a rum and coke* Sorry to read that you are laid up *toasts* Get well thy knee!! Pigeon is really on top of her game today!! Aces!! It made the work day go much faster….less than 15 left until out of here for three!!
Cheers!
rhyordan,
We know that Arianne won’t.
This stuff just writes itself. Have a great weekend my boat mate! That doesn’t sound right…..nuts!! 😉
rhyordan,
And Dickon won’t play any role, he will be just a little more than an extra in Sam’s story.
Arianne on the other hand had a stupid plan for Myrcella (done by Ellaria), and he has shown her tits (done by SS).
So that’s it.
heh, no, it was more tongue-in-cheek to chide the poster on the arbitrary assertion with no factual basis! That written, that is the definition in my dictionary, although it does separate out the colloquial usage as “coll: any view held for any reason.”
Here you go, Arianne and the SS masquerading as Rhonda Weiss and the Rhondettes. It’s just as dynamic, shows better character development, is just as irrelevant to the overall plot of SoI&F, and and much (much!) more funny……
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qn-cbsg7Dq8
Jeb,
Thanks
rhyordan,
The unptenth “TomBombadilly” type of comment.
Moles town bastard,
‘Twas everyone’s favourite slimey pervert Pycelle: Julian Glover CBE.
Edit: Jeb beat me to it…I miss the edit button!
Josla,
There really isn’t much info on Dickon in the books, Sam doesn’t mention much other than he was the younger, favorite son. We know he is around 11-13 in the books, a squire, and
I get the impression that he is more like Poddrick Payne – a young boy, eager to be a man and learn the ways of fighting and war, and all those things that typical boys of that age (in that age) wanted to be. Sam was the opposite, liked to read, sing and dance with his mother and sisters. There is also the impression that since Randyll blames Sam’s weaknesses on his time spent with his mother and sister, he had all but removed the boy from their influence and Sam’s, so I highly doubt a strong bond exists there.
Stuffy auld pedant I may be, but you can’t deny that I made you prick up your ears.
::rimshot::
As a believer in the scientific method, I must demur. I have honestly not earned such a title with any sort of track record of replicable controlled experiments. I can lay claim to a fairly long lifetime of purely anecdotal observations, but those by themselves do not qualify me for your kind and generous description.
I am only a humble former English major/Linguistics minor and current writer/editor with a tendency to care too much about such trivialities as the nuances of semantics. I lead a monastic existence in a dusty garret with no friends save Google, as my neverending pompous pontifications on the subject of word choice have driven them all away. However, Google has served me well in this instance: It took me less than five minutes to locate said encyclopedia. But I can save you those five minutes by posting the link here:
http://timeglider.com/timeline/194b572e19fd461b
I suspect that some WotW readers will find some of this archaic genital nomenclature at least nominally amusing, and perhaps even potentially therapeutic for such mundane complaints as inflammation of the knees. It therefore strikes me as selfish not to share this treasure trove of arcane information.
You’re welcome.
I feel it’s pretty much 99% that Ian Mcshane is Randyl Tarly
Sir! You have won my affections. Thank you for this gift – indeed, my own background consists of a double major in Classics and Biology, which not only explains my penchant for unsavoury humour in part, but also the scads of free time with which to spend on The Great Interwebs.
You are too humble by half – your existence sounds idyllic. Dusty garrets are far superior to dusty garters.
JCDavis,
You as well! I’ll try not to take on too much water in my travels, else it becomes a pissing contest.
Ravyn,
Since the series is not following the books exactly, you don’t really know that. Also, do you know what’s happening in the future books? If so, please divulge.
Alas, I fear that I have been less than perfectly clear as to the delicate nature of my empirical research regarding the abovementioned topic. ‘Madam’ will do.
Madam! You have still won my affections, as we have both succeeded in avoiding a Y chromosome.
Pigeon,
And stealthy little buggers they are, too. Thank the Old Gods and the New that we have retained the capacity to ask for directions when needed.
🙂 I love you people! Lmao!
I wonder if we’ll get to see Heartsbane…
Congrats! As for the character, I guess the name says everything, he is a “Dick-On” Tarly…
Here for the dick jokes! And I totally agree….that Monty Python video plus the quips from everyone are making my day. Life is short and I’ll take laughs any way I can, thank you very much. Especially about a show that actually has “cock merchant” as a great line, even if it isn’t Emmy-nominated like “bad pussy.”
If so, I hope that Gilly is shown as resisting / being uninterested. If they’re going to show Dickon as a twat, it will also be cool to show him being taken down a peg or two, and I don’t see Gilly as a ‘damsel in distress’ character really.
Will there be fat pink mast sighting???
Nymeria Warrior Queen,
Sorry you’ve been unwell, yer ‘Ighness and wish you better. I’ve been out of sorts myself – more with cold and very bad hay fever – the last fortnight and hence have been spending far too much time on the internet. I’m not educated to Firry’s lofty heights but I’m reasonably educated. You probably know that Dickon did used to be quite a common name (or maybe a short version of Richard) in times past in the UK at least. There was a Dickon in the children’s book “The Secret Garden” from the early 20th century. Slightly off-topic I was quite disappointed to learn that one line in the music hall song “Glad I’m a Gladiator” was “We need dickies* that never need starching” and not “we need knickers** that never need starching”.
* as in ‘dicky-dirt’ rhyming slang for ‘shirt’
** British synonym for panties.
I’ll give Shakespeare a pass on any of his not so good jokes because when he was good he was (in my opinion) very, very good.
Pigeon,
Thank you! And truth be told, I don’t think one could read/watch this series without going crazy, lol.
Wildfire’s Kiss,
I’d think so. Now we know how important Valyrian steel swords are, and we’re getting Randyll Tarly, so it would seem strange, at least to me, if we didn’t see Heartsbane.
Firannion,
Ah, the things one can find on the internet! Thank you. 🙂
Thanks to all for the kind words regarding the knee.
This one goes out to Dame:
Now, we just need to find out who is playing Sam’s parents.
Dickon could be mean to Sam in front of their Dad. It is part of trying to show that he still wants to be separate from Sam. He is made the heir and has to play that role. In private, it could be completely different. They could show Dickon struggling with that dynamic. He doesn’t want to treat Sam badly but he has to show that he is not “soft”.
We don’t know much about their relationship, from the books, besides the favoritism.
The scenes could be completely different. I could be incorrect.
As I posted on another thread, I think it would be interesting if Randyll doesn’t believe Sam’s stories about the White Walkers, but Dickon does and seeks him out later to tell him so, out of Dad’s hearing. Then maybe Dickon, wanting to be a hero, takes Heartsbane and heads for the Wall?
Maybe. There is a possibility that Dickon might believe his brother. I want Dickon to not just be a mini carbon copy of Randyll. Complications are better TV. Dickon chooses to save the realm over his father’s expectations.