Executive producers David Benioff and D.B. Weiss appeared on Late Night with Seth Meyers this week, mostly answering questions we’ve all heard dozens of times. But there was one interesting tidbit- the showrunners explain why the queen of England declined to claim the Iron Throne during her well-publicized visit to the set in Northern Ireland last summer.
“Apparently the Queen of England is not allowed to sit on a foreign throne,” says Benioff. “This is an esoteric rule we didn’t know about until that moment.”
“That’s the thing about the queen, she’s a stickler,” jokes Meyers.
More news and light spoilers below the cut:
The secret’s out- there’s a familiar face returning to Game of Thrones, one many viewers thought they’d never see again.
Tom Wlaschiha‘s return to the show for the fifth season was revealed last summer when the news turned up on his German agency website. He was never sighted during filming, however, and nothing was official until a couple weeks ago when him name was included as a cast member on the HBO schedule listing for Game of Thrones.
The actor finally acknowledges his return, speaking with TVGuide.com.
“That’s really tricky. I thought, ‘Maybe I will be back, but not with my face,'” he says. “I was totally surprised. I’d always hoped to be back at some point, but with Game of Thrones you can never be sure. […] I think at some point in the season, [Jaqen and Arya] will meet.”
George R.R. Martin addresses the issues of the show’s endgame versus his own, in the same TVGuide.com article.
I think their endgame will be the same in broad strokes, but it will be very different in an enormous amount of detail,” he says. “We’ve discussed the ultimate ending of the book and the fate of many of the major characters. But as you know, there are many, many secondary characters, tertiary characters. I haven’t sat down with David and Dan and done a list of the top 150 characters and what’s going to happen to them in [the] books, so in some cases, the fates are going to be quite different.
And in other casting news:
Last year, it was reported by unconfirmed sources that Welsh actress Gwyneth Keyworth would be playing the role of Clea in season 5. According to the casting breakdown we saw, Clea is a pretty young courtesan with nimble wit who shares a scene with Tyrion Lannister this season.
Keyworth’s agency CV has been updated to include her role on Game of Thrones in a Mark Mylod-directed episode, and so we can now consider this casting officially confirmed.
The actress has appeared on British programs such as Misfits, Case Histories, and The Great Outdoors.
Luka Nieto,
Makes sense to me!
I’m not surprised that there are rules regarding where monarchs sit. Once upon a time, this was the gesture that signified conquest. Obviously it does not mean that anymore: but the rule probably was put into place centuries ago.
I wanna see Volantis in the opening credits *w*
I have a dream that someday David Benioff will do an interview about Game of Thrones and he won’t tell that story about GRRM asking him who Jon Snow’s mother is.
Pretty fun interview stuff https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=40vc4EeBDHk
JamesL,
I have a dream that he one day won’t be asked that. Not his fault.
Do D&D ever do interviews or attend events solo?
I liked the anecdote about thronesitting rules for the monarchy.
Might I politely request that Americans stop saying “Queen of England”? Ticks the Scots off, and we have to share a nation with them, for the time being.
Definitely.. There’s enough to build from, there’s the bridge.. and.. uh.. what else aren’t they skipping in the show?
.. Perhaps a statue of an elephant and tiger? Would make sense in signifying the free cities:
– Braavos: The Titan
– Slavecities: The Harpy
– Vaes Dothrak: The Horses
– Volantis: A giant flame, or Elephant/Tigers
I’m glad the Queen didn’t sit on the Iron Throne ~ for sure it would have snagged her pretty coat. Anyway, on to my favorite topic ~ the return of Tom Wlaschiha. I hope he keeps the same reddish/silver wig but wears less armour ~ a lot less armour. I’ve watched so many of his German interviews/movies, I can actually understand some German now.
Ich liebe dich Tom!
JamesL,
This
Request denied. We won the war, so we don’t have to do what you want.
Fall_of_Byzantium,
lol what would you prefer we called her??
Indeed. We can then talk about President Obama of the District of Columbia.
@ThroneDrone
“Elizabeth the Second, by the Grace of God of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and of Her other Realms and Territories Queen, Head of the Commonwealth, Defender of the Faith” might do if you want to be really formal.
Or just the Queen of the UK?
Ser Oromis Locke,
Volantis will probably have the bridge, since they’re making a big set piece out of it in the show.
Fred,
It’ll be there, I’m willing to put money on it.
Rafael,
What’s wonderfully awkward about that is Jerome/Bronn and Lena/Cersei used to date, gossip mags claim they don’t talk, hence his immediately shutting down when they ask him about Cersei.
Elizabeth II, Queen of Canada
Don’t you mean Queen Elizabeth, the autistic old bird we pay taxes to and in return we get a load of fat, American tourists over-crowding the streets of Lahndahn?
Can’t sit a fictional throne, even if it’s a realm in another universe!
An interesting detail.
Fall_of_Byzantium,
I’d have thought a Scot would prefer to not have to acknowledge a Saxe-Coberg and Gotha monarch. Isn’t there a Stuart somewhere around to whom you’d prefer to genuflect?
As for the screening for Larchmont Charter, I’m in LA but it’s too far with traffic. Please ask about how many locations they can visit in the opening credits before it goes too long. I’ve always wondered if it was structured to include locations that one show will “visit” during the episode, or whether its to do with the characters (Houses) that are active in the episode.
Interesting dilemma… I would hope that porcelain thrones are excluded from this prohibition!
OT: In case you always wanted to see an Indian version of GoT (kinda) you’re apparently a lucky dog.
Luka Nieto,
I know I wasn’t really blaming him I was just pointing out that it’s almost comical how often we hear him tell that story.
We do it for your benefit: we know that you guys still secretly swear allegiance to the Stuarts.
(And, strictly speaking, you share a country with them: you represent different nationalities! In fact, you have at least two different nationalities in Scotland: it’s not like the Lowlanders and Highlanders always were united in brotherly love, or even in cultural background!)
Fall_of_Byzantium,
No. People don’t popularly call her the “Queen of the United Kingdom” or a long list of titles. She’s the Queen of England.
Besides, I’m American, and I find all royalty and aristocratic titles distasteful anyhow.
Sue the Fury,
In that case, call her Queen of the Scots as well….
It is the United Kingdom, not England. So my point remains- let’s call President Obama the President of the District of Columbia.
Irrespective of whether or not you find titles distasteful, at lease use the correct one as matter of respect.
I just can’t resist…
Only Americans ? What about the rest of the world not living in the land of the free?
@Greatjon of Slumber, “winning the war” is no justification for being impolite, what’s next? “you-would-be-speaking-German-if-it-weren’t-for-us” jokes? Come on man…
@Suethefury, that’s a “tad” harsh, don’t you think? Speaking of cultural conflicts, I find taste being distasteful…
Ugh I wish the queen had sat on the iron throne then maybe we could have found some archaic law that gave us a reason to ditch her and her parasitic family once and for all.
I’m worried that we might not get it…. The title sequence can only hold six locations. Three are permanent (King’s Landing, Winterfell, The Wall), two are now going to be planted for the entire season (Meereen, Braavos), leaving one slot, which will likely be taken up by Dorne for nearly the whole season.
Speaking as a Scot, you can keep her.
Fred,
Whats with the fetish of seeing places in the opening title? I usually go grab a mountain dew or go take a piss when the opening theme is playing.
Busmans,
They could extend the opening intro by 10 seconds, or whatever it takes to include another location 🙂
Balerion The Cat,
Exactly, Ramin would have to rework the theme song, which would be cool in and of itself!
Stark Fan,
This is one of only two shows that I actually watch the opening credits carefully, because I enjoy the artistry and the music. The other is Black Sails.
Off-topic, but isn’t it weird we haven’t had character posters yet? Every season has had them, except this one.
The only tertiary character I wouldn’t want to die is Mace Tyrell. On the show he’s just a nice old guy not knowing what’s going on. It’d be sad if he died in a cruel GoT way. Perhaps bookMace will die and showMace will be spared.
Wait, are we talking about Americans or people living in countries promoting freedom? You lost me somewhere… 😉
Yes, a sad, cruel death no doubt would turn dozens and dozens of viewers off of the show for good!
Stark Fan,
Same for me. I might watch them once a season, but I usually just skip ahead (if I can), or do something else for a minute. They’re not why I watch the show, and I couldn’t care less if they showed them, or a blank screen with names for a minute.
I like the idea that the Queen didn’t realise this was the set for a fictional show and just thought that Northern Ireland have become a bit rebellious recently.
“Goodness me they have a nasty throne and everything”.
HBO Schedule has been updated:
S5E6: “Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken”. 54 minutes.
Interesting (but probably random) note: all three directors (Slovis: 53 + 58; Mylod: 60 + 51; Podeswa: 57 + 54) so far have a total amount of exactly 110 minutes of footage.
Stark Fan,
Because they’re amazing (award winning) opening titles and its fun to spot the different places. Lots of people worked very hard on them and a lot of thought has gone into them. Some people appreciate that.
I was actually going to go with some Basil Fawlty humor. “Whatever you do, don’t mention the war.” 🙂
In Germany we usually call her the British Queen – I guess that’s a bit better than just English Queen even though it still leaves out Northern Ireland. I guess there is such a thing as tradition when it comes to the use of titles in the media – not saying that it’s right or respectful.
As for the question of what to call QEII – I guess you should call people either what they call themselves or at least some part of that. Elizabeth II might do, maybe? I just think it’s disrespectful – taste or no, political opinion or no – to call someone something that they are not called/call themselves.
Calling her the Queen of England is a bit like if the British media consistently called Obama “leader of the American Democrats”, always foregoing the title President, never even mentioning that he might be something else but a party leader, simply because they disagree with the particular American brand of state order.
Which brings me to a (real, honest!) question to those who abhor titles as reminders of a past feudal system: can you actually root for anyone on Game of Thrones? I mean, most of the main characters are aristocrats. Dany is a queen, Ned a lord, Tyrion spends most of the series enjoying feudal privilege etc. Is that something you have to make yourself forget to enjoy the show? Or do you exclusively root for non-aristocrats?
I am a fervent supporter of democracy, but I acknowledge history and therefore accept the reminders of the feudal system (such as aristocratic titles, which usually don’t indicate any real power these days anyway) as reminders of my cultural heritage, seeing it as a stepping stone to the better system we live in now.
That opening sequence won an award, if I remember correctly, for how ingenious it is. I love watching it for the “artistry” (as someone else said above).
But I wouldn’t call it a fetish. It’s simply appreciation, and I feel excited if I spot a difference/something new.
My secret hope is that for Season 7, or perhaps just for the *final* episode, we get an extended opening sequence that brings back all of the locations ever seen in the credits.
Right now, the most number of appearances is obviously a four-way tie between King’s Landing, Winterfell, The Wall, and “wherever Dany is,” but the real stats would be:
1. King’s Landing/Winterfell/The Wall – 40
4. Harrenhal – 15 (I am surprised at this stat, and I would expect Dragonstone, Meereen and Braavos will all surpass it in due course)
5. Dragonstone – 12
6. Meereen – 10
7. Pyke – 9
8. Dreadfort/Vaes Dothrak/Qarth – 7
11. Riverrun/Yunkai – 6
13. Braavos – 5
14. The Eyrie/Astapor – 4
16. Moat Cailin/The Twins – 3
18. Pentos – 1
Well to be fair, tourists whether they be American or from another nation do bring money into the British economy – and they aren’t all fat. For the avoidance of doubt, I am not one of those people who think the royal family should not be criticised (though only if they merit criticism).
As for killing off characters prematurely
But there is less than a month before we find out in any case. Thanks to Sue the Fury for finding out this information for us.
Abhorring aristocratic titles is not the same thing as abhorring a person. You can root for a person, especially in a fictional story. I don’t root for any particular person to win the Throne though.
As it happens, I think the feudal system in Westeros is crap and it’s no surprise they keep tearing each other and themselves apart. Personally I don’t think there will be an Iron Throne left by the end.
One of the things I loved about ADWD was Tyrion realizing just how much privilege he had had before as a result of his aristocratic life. He was pitying himself for years due to his father (which is understandable) but Penny and everything else helped him realize the world was full of much worse things for people without money and power, especially dwarfs.
The opening credits if they feature Volantis should have a big sign saying “Whores Welcome”.
That would lay that particular issue to rest 😉
Well, it is commonly said that the Ulstermen are more British than is the Queen. (She is, after all, mostly German, anyway! :D)
There are fans who use this selectively to disparage characters. Daenerys in particular seems to get this: she cannot really be on the side of “the people” because she still championing a feudal system, and feudalism is just as bad as slavery (even if it wasn’t). However, “democracy” is essentially an unknown concept here. Moreover, people forget their history lessons if they think that places go immediately from aristocracy -> democracy. It has always been baby steps: expanding the power from just the monarch to all aristocrats, then expanding power to all land-owners, then expanding it commoners. Parliaments and congresses are important intermediate steps: but those usually begin semi-democratic at best (rich white men get to vote), and then it expands from there.
Here is another way to put it. Ned Stark is supposedly a paragon of honor and justice. However, he will not consider supporting a superior candidate for the throne, or propping up a child-king that can be controlled for a greater good: the throne must go to the completely ill-suited Stannis because that is “right.” The gods would not have put Stannis in that position if he was fit to rule: and if the gods had meant for commoners to rule, then they would have had the commoners born to noble families. It’s really simple, right? (And, yes, it is classic cognitive dissonance: Ned has to see where primogeniture took them with Aerys, and yet he cannot disown this basic moral “truth.”)
At any rate, people who get hung up on this are (as always) missing the point. These are not Tolkienesque stories about Right and Wrong. They are modern stories about what people do when put into “impossible” situations where it seems like every choice is the wrong one in some way. It’s not about rooting for Daeny or Jon or anyone else: it’s about wondering what they will do in a bunch of “Kobayashi Maru” like personal tests.
So the Queen of England can only use toilets within the country? That is a very strange custom
They make us millions of £, yes they don’t have paid jobs or anything but they do actually make much, much more than they receive from us.
Why’s is so distasteful? What I find truly distasteful is American exceptionalism and the sort.
Why, cheat of course! What else?
Martin not writing for S6
http://www.accesshollywood.com/george-rr-martin-on-game-of-thrones-s5-and-the-winds-of-winter_video_2706537
The Spanish GoT page posted a video with cast interviews, some new behind the scenes footage inluding a small dialogue between Ellaria and Doran at 03:12 in which she says: “Your brother was murdered and you sit here in the Water Gardens, staring at the sky and doing nothing!”
I’m so glad we’ll see more of Ellaria, Indira Varma is a great actress!
Video here: https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=816400455081262
H. Stark,
Noooo 🙁
I would love to have copies of those interviews that aren’t dubbed over.
Also, it kind of looked like Jorah was on the ground being stabbed in the pit… though that easily could have been someone else
asdf,
There’s a new s5 pic up on the HBO website. Here’s a postimg of it. http://postimg.org/image/69pmvpurb/full/
If I saw correctly, it’s also a shot that just includes Daario’s knives and shot from his back. Also, it’s shooting in the direction of the epic greenscreen on the arena walls. And there’s another screen on top that looks like a dragon wing but is quite likely just there blocking hindering light.
H. Stark,
Unsurprising, seeing as TWOW is clearly nowhere near done. Frankly, if he was writing an episode, the thing I would take from it would be that he’s given up on getting it out before the sixth season.
Sean C.,
It takes him a month to write an episode too, so if that month’s put towards TWOW, all the better.
I love Gwyneth Keyworth. She was great in Misfits and Case Histories. 🙂
Well, it’s probably true if you use the other side of the Bell Curve! 😀
Greatjon of Slumber,
The Eyrie has been unfairly absent from Season 4 openings.
Never mind…… 🙂
Gwyneth Keyworth was hilarious in Misfits, so the description for her scene with Tyrion sounds great.
Oh, it’s totally crap, just like it was crap in the real world. I’m just saying that it was the pecursor to what we have now and I kind of embrace that as it reminds me of my own privileged life, even though I’m comparatively poor.
The people holding titles in the Western World these days are basically entertainment, symbols at most, part of our heritage and identity, but not our life choices. I kind of like that.
As for Tyrion realizing his privilege: Do you think any of that will be retained in the show? I have a feeling that they will leave it out. I don’t remember it ever being big on social commentary, or mucking it up when trying (see: Talisa).
Luka Nieto,
That seems pretty implausible to me: none of the protagonists are pondering whether the monarchy is a good (or bad) thing in itself. They all take it for granted. Even when the Starks and Greyjoys rebel against the Iron Throne, it is to set up their own kings, not to do away with monarchy. Even secondary characters like Varys who come from outside the aristocratic system do no speak of ending monarchy: instead, their “liberal” agenda is to redefine “qualified” for the monarchy based on temperment, training, etc., rather than based strictly on primogeniture.
But at this point, the people of Westeros (nevermind the lead characters driving the story!) are no closer to working out Quantum Mechanics than they are to working out Egalitarianism.
Balerion The Cat,
Even though I can understand spanish I wish we got those interviews without the dubbing, those look quite interesting, specially the ones with the new cast members who have not been interviewed yet. Oh and the scene with Doran and Ellaria looks great.
Most irrelevant comment thread ever. Thanks, random grumpy Scot!
Well, I guess you can get hung up on all kinds of things, it depends on what you bring to the story as a reader, and you always bring some form of preconceptions, like glasses through which you read any given story. If your glasses are of the social commentary variety, you can totally read the story through that.
The same goes for rooting – if you need your novels to give you a character to root for because identifying with someone is your way of reading, then ASoIaF/Game of Thrones will give you that, too (it’s like that for me). It doesn’t matter what the story is supposed to do, if we can even define that. So I would disagree with you that people who root characters or focus on their positions in Westeros/Essos society are “missing the point”.
However, I would agree with you, that the question of Right or Wrong is probably not the strongest/most overt point the books/series are making. It’s more about increments and shades of grey and how the human condition plays into that.
Looks like that episode 2 summary was real after all. Kit Harington hinted that the election is actually from episode 3 (many of us thought it would be in episode 2). There’s not even a mention of the election in Maggie’s summary so how could she possibly guess that if she was trolling?
asdf,
I caught that Sansa pretty explicitly refers to herself as the “key to the North”.
Afeastfordances,
Cami, our great Spanish source from back in October, translated that Sophie quote over on AFOIAF fully. Sophie says:
So even juicier than you’d thought…
Cami’s working on translating all of the interviews in that video btw, so I’ll transmit that info over here when its ready.
Sue the Fury
I find your lack of courtesy, manners and pig-ignorance distasteful too.
If you wish to display your lack of respect to another culture so blatantly, don’t veil it behind how oh-so democratic your ideals are.
Wimsey,
Although a monarchy in Westeros will probably linger, I agree with Sue that the “iron throne” itself will be destroyed, much like the golden harpy in Meereen in S5ep1. It represents the wrong thing in Westeros. Alternatively, the “7-kingdom monarchy” may be replaced by an oligarchy sitting in comfy chairs, for better or worse. 🙂 Regardless of what happens in KL, the real story will end with the Starks returning to Winterfell. Full circle.
Also, nice dragon shot at about 45 seconds have we seen it before? (This is where everyone tells me, Lulu’s Mum how come you can notice detail from a split second of action but don’t remember when they showed a bloody great big dragon apparently taking a bath/doing a Loch Ness monster impression and I go “oh of course embarrassed myself on the internet again!”)
No, just no. This is just as disrespectful as calling her Queen of England to the other 15 sovereign states the she is queen of. Yet we always have to hear Queen of England, Queen of the UK or Brittish Queen. How about her other equally legitimate titles of Queen of Australia, Queen of Canada, Queen of New Zealand, Queen of Jamaica, Queen of Barbados, Queen of the Bahamas, Queen of Grenada, Queen of Papua New Guinea, Queen of Solomon Islands, Queen of Tuvalu, Queen of Saint Lucia, Queen of Saint Vincent and the Grenadines, Queen of Belize, Queen of Antigua and Barbuda, and Queen of Saint Kitts and Nevis? Can we get some of them thrown in even occasionally.
Alright here’s a link to the AFOIAF post where Cami fully translates the above-linked Canal+ interview.
http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/126770-season-5-casting-news-and-speculation-v14-show-spoilers-book-spoilers-past-op/?p=6854254
Lulu’s Mum,
Can’t stab through that armor. Doesn’t look like he is aiming for gaps or his head either.
Greenjones,
Or more directly:
‘Emilia Clarke: “This season we are going to see a lot of new things, a lot of more shocking moments, there is going to be a lot more kind of those big red wedding style moments this season.”
Carice Van Houten: “It looked good for us at the end of season four, we have captured Mance Rayder, we saved Jon Snow, now we are stronger, more possitive to take action, we have an army so we can go south and take the throne.”
Jessica Henwick: “My character is Nymeria Sand, she is the middle daughter, well she is the second one of the sand snakes but if we talk about our trio I am the middle one. I myself am the middle child in my family so I have been able to use my own experience to understand some thing of her character.”
Rosabell Laurenti: “I play the role of the youngest one, in the show I am Oberyn and Ellaria’s daughter.”
Iain Glen: “I am worried because she doesn’t have my advice.”
Nathalie Emmanuel: “Personally, I think she has become a very good friend for Daenerys. Her Queen has a lot of worries but I also think she worries for her and is very supportive. I think both support each other.”
Iain Glen: “He goes into a very very dynamic and difficult journey on his own. is also a very physicall season for him too, with a lot of fighting like all those sequences we did in Spain, we really loved filming there, we filmed some fantastic sequences there.”
Sophie Turner: “She is the eldest Stark now, she is the key to the north and she has to be there to reunite with her younger brothers. I mean, if they are still alive. She just have to stay alive for them.”
Kit Harington: “We leave Jon Snow at the end of last season defending the Wall, against all odds. He thought he was looking death in the face and he survived. He certanly didn’t expect to be around this seson, he didn’t expect to be back at Castle black. We find him trying to negociate with Stannis and his army and he has to play politician really, with Stannis.”
Alex Sidding: “I play Doran Martell who is the heir of the family that rules Dorne. On a simple way he is my bodyguard but.. I spend a lot of time alone and he is the only person there with me.”
Deobia Oparei: “I play Areo Hotah, he is this fearsome warrior, captain who looks after the prince but he is also, if you like, the chief police of House Martell of Dorne.”
Alfie Allen: “In this season if you like, Theon is not as alone as in previous seasons. I guess you may kind of see the hint towars Stockholm Syndrome, that is something we always had a feeling was there but in this season there are definitely some messed up kind of tender moments between Theon and Ramsay.”
“I think is sort of a theme of season five how a lot of characters take paths that they have never taken before. We are going to see characters meeting that didn’t have any dialogue with each other before.”
Deobia Oparei: “This season we are getting into this multicultural land. I think that’s something great we contribute to Game of Thrones.”
Emilia Clarke: “Yes you are going to see Dragons, there is going to be a lot of Dragons this season.”’
Lulu’s Mum,
Additionally … that scene looks like its definitely during the pit fighters battle part. And we know Jorah is in the circle surrounded by the Harpys with Dany and Daario and etc so it seems like he would survive it even if he is stabbed
Greenjones,
The Sansa stuff is definitely interesting.
Messed up tender moments between Reek and Ramsay?
One of Roose Bolton’s leeches,
On a side note when did Roose get leeches, do we see a mine-are-more-magical-than-yours leech off with Mel? ;O)
Is there any natural or social law that inevitable requires step-by-step transition from mediaeval (i. e. pre-absolute) type of feudalism to democracy? What would be then the next step in political evolution in Westeros? Shall victorious Daenerys ‘break the wheel’ of feudal lords and constitute an absolute monarchy first, broaden the Small council into a parliament after that, call the first democratic elections, and abdicate after initial session of the parliament at the end?
Btw, was the American Revolution in the 1770s premature and hence intolerable? Did American revolutionists violate any evolutionary law? Why the Revolution took place after all? (Plz, don’t bring up the fairy tale about taxation issue.) Why did just 13 colonies resist the Crown, why not colonies in present-day Canada? What were/are benefits of the Revolution? In what way did Canada, where a revolution or a war for independence did not occur, come off worse?
“… if you’re not into the whole brevity thing”
Stannis would’ve had her fuckin’ head had she sat down. Smart move, Lizzie.
It’s great to finally have some dialogue from Dorne.
Afeastfordances,
Hm, might be the case. She wouldn’t mention it if it wasn’t in some form in the script.
Luka Nieto,
Salty Dornishman,
I’m not saying the whole lot should be said at once. Just mix it up a little. Have her refered to as the Queen of Belize maybe. Or you know, just Queen Elizabeth II, without any country listed. At this point I’d even accept Queen of the UK etc. to at least acknowledge the rest of us as existing. Genuine question – have there ever been other Queen Elizabeth IIs in history for another nation, a different person to the current Queen of… lets go with Papua New Guinea?
Afeastfordances,
There might be a mention in passing but considering Martin said he wrote about Osha in book 6, he’ll probably make his appearance in next season.
Hodor’s Bastard,
You know for years I had an ending all figured out really about how the series actually finishes. Then ADwD came and it all got messed up. Had no idea how it will all end, until last year when someone put in my head the ending where all is covered with snow, massive wipe out of Westeros population, apocalyptic proportions, no IT, not an actual system to rule the land (be it democracy, oligarchy, monarchy), and Jon Snow walks alone through the Wall gate walking alone North. No one alive for as long as the eye could see. Him and Ghost. Pretty grim. I wish I hadn’t thought of it now LOL
Yes. The probability of small steps is always much greater than the probability of large steps. This is simply because small steps can be accomplished by single events, whereas large steps almost always require multiple events.
Good question. Obviously, the concept of “democracy” is almost non-existent, so that would be out. However, expanded rights for the commoners would be possible: which would largely mean more control over their possessions. What someone like Daeny would do with the mercantile class would be the interesting question: given her experiences out east, she might distrust them as much as the other aristocrats do, albeit for completely different reasons.
How does “premature” necessitate “intolerable”? And, at any rate, it was hardly premature. It was just an expansion of the democratic systems that existed. Moreover, although the “taxation without representation” was a sham, the “taxation” part was not: a desire to not pay additional taxes was a big incentive for the revolution! (Contrary to popular belief, Americans were not hankering for representation in Parliament: they were content running themselves in a proto-democratic fashion.)
The “proto-democratic” part is important because the US was still a proto-democracy: in many states, only men with certain levels of property were allowed to vote. In other words, it was a system in which only the equivalent of the lesser nobility and upwards (who own all the land in Westeros) were able to vote. Eventually, all white men were enfranchised. And, as is well-known, it was some time before women and non-whites were enfranchised.
So, this was very much a gradual, step-by-step process: the US did not go from feudal to democratic overnight: the colonies themselves began far, far advanced from feudalism, and they transition to far short of truly democratic after the Revolution.
Sp.TV,
If that’s true…
Oh, and in 5×06, “Jon hears dark tidings” sounds like he’ll receive the “dead things in the water” letter, or something similar.
Other things are quite suggestive as well.
I can’t believe you didn’t mention Queen of the Andals
Sp.TV,
Yeah, if true….ep5 is going to be quite interesting!
Hodor’s Bastard,
It also solidifies a few other storylines: the wedding in Winterfell (Ramsay and fArya/Sansa/whoever); Margaery gets imprisoned in 5×06; and Stannis comes into trouble on his way south, which we see in the trailer, as the Baratheon camp is up in flames, but I don’t quite get what’s supposed to be happening yet.
Tormund’s Woman,
Not bad. Definitely an option. Maybe the CotF will rule again? Maybe Jon and Ghost will wander south and meet up with LS and Nymeria and they will finally reconcile. (I’m welling up already)
Luka Nieto,
Lol. That’s only because I was restricting myself to sovereign states and not ethnic groups which is a different list. Also Angles is the correct spelling. 😉
I still think Ep 8 could be A Ghost in Winterfell. Esp if wedding preparations are Ep 6. It would make for a great climax to Theons B-story. the main stories of Jon Danny Cersei etc can then take up last two episodes
Luka Nieto,
Tormund’s Woman,
I agree that most of westeros will be in ruins. I was reading a theory that the last survivors will get pushed back all the way to storms end where they make their final stand. That or the God’s Eye because its filled with weirwoods and just sounds epic. Kingslanding will definitely be completely destroyed.
Sp.TV,
Ok, so…
405. Aemon gives Jon his speech, Slynt is executed. Mel has more visions about Jon, maybe gives him the daggers in the dark warning. Big Wall episode. Cersei meets with the High Sparrow, maybe comes to her agreement to let them arm? Maybe sells Loras out. Tyrion and Jorah at the Sorrows (ghosts, though? Not sure what that will be).
406. Margaery learns about Loras’ arrest? Or something grimmer? Jon gets news of Hardhome. Wedding at Winterfell is pretty self-explanatory. Doran speaking his word is… interesting. Are they going really fast with this, and he’ll reveal his whole master plan now? Or will this just be him shutting down Ellaria and the Snakes’ scheming for the time being?
407. Dany agrees to marry Hizdahr to calm down the Harpy. Brienne meets this old woman character they’ve written. Stannis gets stuck in the snow? Learns that the Boltons have him surrounded? Arya faced with her destiny… Maybe that’s where she formally decides to become a Faceless Man? Not sure.
Crabber’s Son,
And in what possible sense are stonemen ghost from the past…? Really, do tell. Unless I’m missing something here… I just don’t see it.
asdf,
Sp.TV,
“Jon swings his sword.”
“Winterfell prepares for a wedding.” (written by B-Cog!)
“Stannis comes into trouble on his way south.”
CAAAAAAN’T WAAAAIIIIIIT!!!!!
These episodes are going to be so awesome!
5×05: “Edd, fetch me a block!”
5×06: fArya plot & wedding
5×07: Death March
Sooo gooood stuuuuuff!
Messy Justin Massey,
It sounds great.Jon swings his sword.
Luka Nieto,
Still, I believe we’ll get him stucking in the snow, we had a report over on the ASOIAF forum by somebody whose friends were extras for Stannis scenes, and she described exhausting marching through fake snow, make-up to make characters look starving, aso.
Messy Justin Massey,
I hadn’t heard about that. Yeah, I’m sure we’ll get the march in the snowstorm. I just wanted to bring up the camp in flames. I can’t find a context for it, yet I’m 99% sure it’s Stannis’s camp.
Will be interesting to see the first episode written by Dave Hill (E4) and this also confirms that Cogman will be writing one of the final 3 episodes which is his latest-season slot to date. Makes sense since Martin sat this season out that Cogman would get the episode they may have wanted Martin to write.
King Tommen,
Hadn’t thought about that! That’s so cool! 🙂
Probably 5×08, right? 5×09 and 5×10 sound like exclusive D&D material.
Arya doesnt seem to be getting mentioned much in the synopsis’. Im hoping she has more to do this season than they are making it look like
Luka Nieto,
Are we even sure that’s a Baratheon camp? I don’t recall seeing anything that marks it as such. I mean, it’s the best guess we have, since Stannis is the only character who seems to be hanging in tents, but that’s all we have to go off of.
Also, there’s definitely ice involved. In the trailer shot of Stannis and Mel and Davos in the tent, you can see the silhouette of where snow has piled up on the tent’s roof.
Luka Nieto,
Luka Nieto,
Of course, I don’t know if she speaks the truth, but she doesn’t strike me as a user who’s lying (I could search for a link, but it’s in one of the 14 volumes of the infamous “Casting, News and Speculation” threads, that have most of the time ~200 pages).
I’m also sure, it’s his camp (I mean: tents, snow, … Whose else could it be?!), and have absolutely no clue about the “Why?” and “How?” and so on.
Afeastfordances,
We’ve got another shot of Melisandre in the Baratheon camp, and it looks very similar to the one in flames. Then again… it’s a camp. I can only tell they’re not Lannisters, because their tents are all red. But, as you said, it’s mostly by process of elimination.
Luka Nieto,
They are ghosts because they used to be men but now they have nothing left of their humanity they are just ghosts of their former selves. Gone completely mad from the greyscale. But I think the show is going to change the sorrows at least in location.
King Tommen,
They’ll want to keep some stuff secret.
I’ve thought for a while that a version of the Battle of Ice would happen this season. As you said, Stannis has to do something between his death march in 5×07 and the finale, right? Stannis winning the Battle of Ice wouldn’t be a big spoiler either; it’s not the Battle for Winterfell, nothing that decisive. It’s Stannis killing a whole bunch of Freys (maybe Boltons in the show.)
Luka Nieto,
My thought is that it will be opposite in a way:
Luka Nieto,
If I had to guess, E8 sounds like something they’d give Cogman since he wrote the WW stuff from last season.
Wimsey,
That makes way more sense.
That conjecture (NOT a theory or even a hypothesis!) is forgetting something important: story. Before you can guess at the ending, you have to address a couple of huge questions:
1) Why are the White Walkers doing what they do? What are they even doing?
2) What is up with R’hllor? What is it’s endgame?
The ending won’t have anything to do with battles or last stands, even if those happen towards the end. The ending will center around the main characters coming to terms with whatever the answers to these questions are and/or what those answers mean. The lead characters probably will not agree amongst each other, and they probably will have big trepidations themselves. Simply being willing to accept the facts might be a huge part of the issue.
(Our best model for this might be Babylon 5, where the climax to the Vorlons vs. Shadows war led to some interesting dilemmas for the lead characters.)
Ghosts of the past could just be like all the ruined civilizations that he passes on his river trip
Luka Nieto,
Ah, I agree that she’ll ask, or she’ll ask the related “how could you have?” questions. However, will she understand the answer(s)? (That comes up in the books, too.) Indeed, what Reek thinks happened and what Theon knows happened might be two different things at this point, too.
They certainly have a bit of room with which to work here: there are many scenarios that could naturally fall out of this. (Indeed, will Theon even admit to recognizing Sansa? After all, Reek never knew her. Of course, a big part of the Reek vs. Theon fight might stem from this rather than from Abel’s washerwomen.)
asdf,
That seems more likely to me, yes. So certainly the Sorrows. But not a specific reference to the stonemen, I don’t think so.
Sp.TV,
Excellent! Thank you!
“Kill the Boy”: The title had already implied that this would be a major episode for Jon and the Wall storyline, but this summary would seem to confirm Janos’s execution will take place in this episode, as many suspected. Some imminent forshadowing for Melisandre as well. As for “Tyrion sees the ghosts of the past” … well, I’m afraid I don’t know exactly what it means. Episode 5 would seem to be right placement within the season for the Sorrows, and while “ghosts from the past” isn’t a particularly apt description of the Stone Men, the writers of these episode summaries frequently use fairly loose descriptions whenever they want to conceal something (I’ll always remember Sam’s encounter with the White Walker in 3×08 being denoted as “Sam and Gilly meet an older gentleman”). But who knows – maybe it’s dragons or the ruins that he and Jorah pass through on their trip down the river (we saw some of those in the concept art)
“Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken”: Sounds like Margaery may be arrested in this episode, which makes sense to me as I’ve long suspected that Cersei will be arrested in Episode 7. Having Margaery be arrested in Episode 6 would give her just enough time to savor her victory before her own imprisonment. Elsewhere, Jon will hear about Hardhome in this episode, and Ramsay’s wedding will either be in this episode or the next one. As for “Doran Martell speaks his word” – I doubt that we’ll be hearing his “Fire and Blood” speech this early. It’s possible, but I think it’s something else (maybe him throwing the Sand Snakes in prison after their skirmish with Jaime and Bronn).
“The Gift”: Pretty clear that this is when Dany will agree to marry Hizdahr. Coupled with the title of the episode, “Arya is faced with her destiny” sounds like it could denote her first assassination assignment and her first face-change (also – “faced” with her destiny. Ha!). It sounds Brienne might meet the old woman from the casting leaks in this episode, although the context remains a mystery. As for Stannis, trouble on the way south could mean any number of things. Yara? A Bolton scouting party? Inclement weather? Nothing is ever easy with that guy.
Also, assuming that the writers listed for these episodes are correct …
Jared,
GRRM wrote episode 9 in S2.
mau,
Ah, you’re right. I edited my previous post to reflect that. Thanks for the reminder!
Luka Nieto,
They combined many different battles in one in the fourth season(S4E9).
I expect to see the same with Stannis and Boltons.
mau,
If that’s true, then I wouldn’t expect it to happen this season, because that would be getting ahead of the books (and, honestly, the whole story) by quite a bit.
Crabber’s Son,
asdf,
Very poetic.
The casting call leak says specifically that the old woman is a “serving woman who helps Brienne on her journey” which suggests she works in an inn or something similar. This would match up with the trailer shots we have of Brienne and Pod booking it on horseback away from an Inn. I would suspect this an extended part of the chase from the Vale knights from the previous episode (or perhaps some new group looking to capture Brienne). In any case, it’s a solid guess that McCusker works in this inn and helps Brienne and Pod escape somehow.
So whatever happens in E7 with Brienne, I don’t think this old woman is a part of it as her appearance will be long past by that time.
Luka Nieto,
I am hoping to see that battle this season. It is natural climax.
It is a great mistake on GRRM’s part for moving that to the sixth book.
Hodor’s Bastard,
The insight will be seeing CGI ruins and their current inhabitants. This is a visual medium and that’s not the sort of exposition that’s remotely necessary.
I’m still confused about the geography of the whole thing. Are they just… making up a new river or something, and placing the Sorrows there? Or maybe they sail up the Volaena, the final tributary of the Rhoyne… for some reason?
mau,
Yeah. I believe ADWD is great, but it’d be much better with… you know, an ending. Any ending. Any climax.
Luka Nieto,
The sorrows will take place in the ruins of valyria this seems like the only option considering there is no reason they would be back on the river again. The ruins of valyria have been mentioned in season 2 when Quaith was painting the man to pass through the smoking sea. She said he needed protection, im guessing for the show canon its protection from greyscale.
mau,
I read that it was GRRM’s editor that made him move the battles to the next book for some reason or other.
Jared,
I really, really hope Cogman wrote the Hardhome episode!
Crabber’s Son,
That’s a possibility, I guess. The concept art showed ruins in a river, though.
We’ll see.
Luka Nieto,
I believe the Sorrows will be sad remnant of the past darkness in Essos, possibly even Doom related.
Maybe they’ll make it so the river gives you hallucinations and the “ghost of his past” means that tyrion will see some form of tywin and shae
Crabber’s Son,
There’s an interview somewhere and GRRM says that they were forced to move the battles to the next book because the book would’ve been too big for the coverslip or something like that
Hodor’s Bastard,
I mean… I don’t need to suspend my disbelief. That’s not an issue. If they change the map, they’re just switching a fictional map for another, so I don’t see the problem. I still think it’s a bit weird if that’s what they’re doing.
Crabber’s Son,
Reasons were wrong, whatever they thought.
Why? That change makes everything easier
mau,
According to the HBO viewers guide the only way they can make it by water is through the smoking sea lol. It just seems to make the most sense why introduce a location we are never going to see or hear about again versus actually have them see the ruins of the greatest civilization in Game of Thrones history. It will make more sense to the fans. They will just make the smoking sea slightly more river like.
Non-book reader here, but Tyrion seeing ruins of the past: it would be great if those were ruins of Valyria he passes, and then he sees Drogon flying overhead. It would be an incredibly WTF moment for him. Dorothy, you are not in Kansas anymore.
Crabber’s Son,
Yes, old valyria plus dragon would be great… I agree…
There is a noticeably lack of Sansa in the descriptions
ace,
And many other characters. The synopses always choose only a few characters.
Kay,
That would actually be a cool idea. That does not quite happen in the books: but that is absolutely no reason not to do what you suggest.
ace,
Sometimes they add a sentence or two to the descriptions as the season airs once some stuff they want to hide comes to light.
Ooooo… avoiding all the Queen of England stuff… you guys have made me think of something…
Kay,
I would love to see this as well.
Luka Nieto,
It’s possible that they could sail up the Volaena. That river does exist in the show’s universe, assuming HBO’s viewer guide is consistent with the map that the writers are operating from (and I don’t see why it wouldn’t be). http://viewers-guide.hbo.com/game-of-thrones/season-4/episode-10/map/location/68/volantis-free-city
The one thing I do not believe that the show will do is move the location of Volantis itself – that’s just an unnecessary complication. I also doubt that Tyrion and Jorah will just sail back up the Rhoyne proper – whatever route they take has to get them at least marginally closer to Mereeen. At a certain point, they’ll be captured by Malko’s band of slavers who will ferry them the rest of the way.
I will be very curious to see how they answer the geographical question with respect to the Sorrows, but as long as we get at least a cursory explanation, I’ll be satisfied. To be honest, I’m just happy that the Sorrows sequence made it into the show at all. It was one of my absolute favorite parts of ADWD – ominous, rich, atmospheric and ultimately thrilling. When the Griffs were removed from Tyrion’s storyline, I expected that the Sorrows would be an unfortunate casualty of that decision. I’m very glad to see that Benioff and Weiss found a way to justify its inclusion.
Ramsey grooms Reek to pretend to be Theon and give his bride away.
Jon & Stannis receive wedding invitations.
Sansa, wearing that bloody cloak with the oversized hood flapping behind her, will come upon Theon striding in the opposite direction in Winterfell. When they find themselves face-to-face, their eyes will meet. Sansa will put a hand on her dagger necklace. “Theon Turncloak. Theon Kinslayer,” she’ll say. “I’m not. I never killed Bran and Rickon. They got away. There are 3 swords missing from the crypts. Go see for yourself.” Sansa then goes to the crypts to investigate and contemplates her next move before she weds Ramsey and he Reeks her. In an interview, Sophie says if she could ask GRRM one thing it would be “How do you come up with all of this creepy, scary, sexy stuff? Everyone wants to know what’s going through your head, George.” In another interview, I believe she said she only read her parts of the scripts.
(Smothered snickering)
But that makes sense; I knew it had to be some tradition or law we didn’t know about.
Arya’s Nose,
I’ve been a fan of the site, and a reader of these comments for ages. I’ve heard actual GOT related topics that I almost pushed the button on the comment box to debate. But no… I tend to avoid comment box “blah, freaking blah…” You’re comment though, chapped my ass.
Why don’t you stop and think how much more intolerable you’re Islands’ lives would have been without us “fat Americans” over the last 100 years…
Brits dismissing Americans, and Americans dismissing the British, should check their shit at the door. We make each other better- We should get over ourselves.
I can’t believe how naive People are here its like reading posts from people that haven’t read the books LMAO!
Rygritte,
In productions like this, actors are only given their parts of the script. Why would you give Kit Harrington scripts from Kings Landing scenes?
Wimsey,
I seem to recall interviews indicating that GoT’s main cast get full scripts and everyone else only gets their own stuff. I could be wrong though as I can’t remember any specific instance where this was said.
Arya’s Nose,
You aren’t talking about the same England that’s handed the keys to the kingdom to a bunch of immigrants, are you? Are there any Englishmen left there?
Oh that’s right, they’re all emigrating here to become citizens.
How dare people who haven’t read the books post comments on a website who’s primary focus is the TV show ….
Wow…as I see the urban legend about the average American’s stupidity is actually true!
Wimsey
The step-by-step argument could be a convenient argument of any ruling class. It could be an excuse for maintaining privileges of elites, an excuse to maintain elites’ formal powers at their present level. Is it because of the argument why Founding Fathers of the US didn’t abolish the slavery, is it because of the argument why they remained slavers? An abolition of slavery in the aftermath of the American Revolution would be a step ‘too much’, kind of a revolutionary ‘overtaking’? Were slaves in the US not prepared to take next step in the social/political evolution, or slavers and politicians were the ones who had blocked ‘the inevitable route’ of the evolution? Oh, maybe it was ‘just’ the economy based on/dependent upon forced work of slaves that ‘prevented’ next step in the evolution? As Malcom X put it – You can’t have capitalism without racism.
Back to Westeros and Essos. If step-by-step approach is the only possible and reasonable, why then you support the idea that Daenerys should push forward her revolutionary methods in Slaver’s Bay? If revolutionary social transforming in the cities of Slaver’s Bay is possible ‘n acceptable for you, why then you think anti-feudal revolution in Westeros would be in vain, and premature? Is the Daenerys’s war on slavery an act of revolution, or just progressive ‘n evolutionary step towards feudalism? Do you think Westeros-like medieval (agrarian) feudalism is more progressive social formation than the one that shape mercantile, urbane, proto-capitalistic societies in the city-states of Slayer’s Bay?
Btw, if Daenerys ‘breaks the wheel’ of feudal lords ‘n begin to rule Westeros, do you think she would allow Freemen, who don’t kneel for anyone, to inhibit the land south of the Wall?
Rygritte,
OK. Or that. that’d be cool. 😉
Can we please let the irrelevant British monarchy continue its rotting process into the trash bin of history?
At best they are symbol of few centuries of colonialism, slavery, invasion and occupation, famine and war. Let these criminals rot.
Of the Night,
I recall something about the main cast getting full scripts, too. That idea would be supported by several comments by some cast members in recent interviews wherein they stated they only read their scenes and not the rest of the script, because they didn’t want to know what happened to any other characters/didn’t want to be spoiled. I swear Ian Beattie was one of them who said he wanted to see it when he watched the show, just like everyone else (I’m paraphrasing, of course).