The Night’s Cast Episode 14: Going Beyond the Wall, with special guest Robert from In Deep Geek!

CAption

The last time we see all three dragons alive and well…sigh.

After a bonus episode analyzing the Season 8 trailer, we’re back! This time on The Night’s Cast, the official podcast of Watchers on the Wall, we’re discussing the sixth episode of Season 7, “Beyond The Wall,” and all the things that come along with it — much-debated weight hunt and all.

Join Petra, Samantha and special guest Robert from In Deep Geek as we break down the penultimate episode of Season 7!

*Please note: This episode was recorded prior to the release of the Season 8 trailer*

The Night’s Cast is available on iTunes and SoundCloud, and you can follow us on Twitter as well. Happy listening!

21 responses

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    1. Been with Watchers on Wall since beginning and before but first time listening to podcast of any kind on here.

      Wow, I picked a bad one! Not in terms of the analysis or people on it but for the episode itself. All three of you just killed this one. I didn’t realize how bad it was until I listened to the analysis. I’m looking forward to going into archives to see some ones y’all actually enjoyed.

      For the record…Wight Hunt was a brutal storyline. However I really enjoyed the different character conversations it brought. Sounds like most of you were not huge fans of the dialogue though (jokes about Gendry and Melisandre for example) but it was a nice reprieve.

      Nice job overall! Really impressed with detailed knowledge.

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    2. OT, but I bought the latest issue of Entertainment Weekly today, and there’s even more GOT goodness than I expected. Highly recommended!

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    3. Guess I’m in the minority, but I really enjoyed this episode. Loved the Jon/Jorah and Jon/Beric conversations and I love anytime we get some Night King and WW action. The music when the dragons swooped in and destroyed the wights is one of my favorites as well. So yeah, I liked this episode!

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    4. Jack Bauer 24,

      I really enjoyed it too! I remember I was completely immersed for most of the episode and on edge for the last 20 minutes or so. It has some of my favorite dialogue from the season as well, like Dany and Tyrion talking on the fireplace at Dragonstone, Dany and Jon on the boat after the death of Viserion, Sandor and Tormund, Jon and Jorah, etc. I also really liked Dany’s growth on this episode, by risking everything to save The Suicide Squad and commiting to her role as a “hero” by offering her help to The North.

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    5. Chilli,

      Me too! I remember prior to going online to check how people felt toward the episode I thought “I guess people will be upset because of the way the travel was handled in this episode” and I was surprised to see a general dislike towards most of the things that happened in it.

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    6. Jack Bauer 24,

      I am with you I really enjoyed it.

      I really liked the Tyrion and Dany comversations in this episode and was surprised to hear the dislike for it on the pod.

      I also don’t think Arya and Sansa were plotting together and putting on a show for LF. That makes no sense to me. What info did they get by doing that? Why did they feel the need to? All the info needed to execute LF Sansa had – Lysa murder – or Bran had. What was missing was Sansa deciding to make a move which seems clear she decides to make in 707 after hearing about LFs little game.

      Also, the logistics yea they prob don’t make sense but the payoff more than worked for me. That is a choice story tellers make all the time. Sacrifice logical consistency for drama and tension.

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    7. The majority says that the whole episode is badly written or that it makes no sense. That’s just not true. The only illogical aspect is the time traveling (Raven from Eastwatch to Dragonstone, Daenerys from Dragonstone to Eastwatch), but that didnt bother me that much. It’s obvious that many of the fan base, especially book readers are overly critical since season 5. They are just waiting for the opportunity to criticize anything and throw shit on the writers and the show. There may be two scenes that I dislike in this episode but the rest is fine for me.

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    8. Jack Bauer 24,

      For me?

      ➖ Major drawback was that the banter among the Snow Patrol wasn’t natural, in the sense that conspicuously missing during any of the interactions between Beric, Thoros, Gendry, Sandor and Jon was any mention of what they all had in common: relationships with and shared experiences with Arya Stark. Each one of those men had spent significant time with, and had been impressed by Arya. Each one had been abruptly separated from her without knowing what happened to her. Between Gendry (NW caravan leaving KL in S1e10 through BwoB selling him to Mel in mid-S3); Beric & Thoros (intercepting Hot Pie, Arya & Gendry in the beginning of S3 through Arya running away in mid-S3), and Sandor (“kick all you want Wolf Girl” in mid-S3 through being left grievously wounded at bottom of cliff at the end of S4e10), the Wight Hunters could have reconstructed Arya’s whereabouts and adventures for a continuous period of over three years.

      One would expect Jon to want to know every detail about the favorite sister he hadn’t seen since S1e2 when he looked in her eyes, told her “I’m going to miss you” and held her tight when she jumped into his arms. Likewise, one would expect Gendry, Sandor, Thoros and Beric to have mutual curiosity about what happened to their leader’s sister, and at least casually ask Jon about her fate in passing. Arya was their common bond.

      Conversations about their experiences with her and her well-being would be the obvious topic of conversation(s) when these characters met each other and teamed up to go wight hunting. (Not, as in S7e5 when Gendry/”Clovis” first met Jon, the three minutes Gendry saw Ned in Tobho Mott’s shop. Nor would Jon simply remark to Sandor in the Eastwatch cells that he’d seen Sandor in WF, when Jon had to know Sandor had been Arya’s captor-turned-caretaker until Brienne tried to take custody of Arya, and that Sandor was presumed dead.)

      Plus, those four of Jon’s fellow wight hunters all knew Arya was desperate to be reunited with her family but was prevented from doing so while the war was raging (and her captors/guardians were prioritizing their own agendas). Arya/Arry confided in Gendry that Yoren was supposed to take her home to WF, and later, after Arya, Gendry and Hot Pie escaped Harrenhal, they were headed for the (presumed) safety of the Tully home in Riverrun; she ran from the BwoB when they reneged on or delayed their promise to take her to Riverrun when they decided to hunt down some Lannister soldiers instead; despite the Lannisters “holding sway” over where they were traveling Sandor first tried to reunite her with her mother and Robb at the Twins, and then with her Aunt Lysa at the Vale. (He also knew how attached Arya was to the sword her brother gave her: she was willing to march right into the inn with five soldiers inside when she saw Polliver with Needle.)

      I know that I and other commenters have griped about this omission before, and that the prevailing explanation is that the showrunners wanted to save the characters’ reconnections with Arya until S8. Still, when every one of the wight hunters except Jorah and Tormund had personal relationships with Arya Stark, it was contrary to human nature for none of them to ask her brother – who was now KitN after retaking the Stark family home – what had happened to Arya.

      As long as the episode was going to feature banter on the way to searching for the zombies, at least a few minutes could’ve been devoted to questions the hunters would presumably ask and answers they’d want to know about someone or something they had in common. Instead, their conversations included Gendry’s incessant complaints about Beric and Thoros selling him to Melisandre; and exchanges between Sandor and Tormund about Brienne, “dick” and “c*ck.”

      ➕ Highlight of episode was the absurdist comedy of the freezing cold wight hunters marooned on the island in the middle of the frozen lake, when a bored Sandor decides to throw rocks at the horde of zombies encircling them.

      ➕ Jon offering Longclaw to Jorah, and Jorah declining it, was a nice, classy touch.

      ➕ Beric and Jon comparing resurrection notes and trying to figure out why they’d been singled out was pretty good.

      – End Redundant Semi-Whinge –

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    9. Ten Bears,

      And why is the winterfell plot illogical? It was well written in my opinion. I think that the majority totally misunderstood the Winterfell storyline!

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    10. The Light King,

      What do you think was the storyline?

      In my opinion a big reason why people did not like the storyline is that they just don’t like the idea of Sansa and Arya fighting while being played by LF. For whatever reason, the story did not do the legwork for certain folks of having them understand why they would be fighting.

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    11. Hey all! I Usually looove these rewatches recaps even with the negative criticism but i think this episode was hardcore. I wanted to stop several times after the xxxtimes of «  meh » or « i dont know what rubs me the wrong way ». I feel like you could have just jumped it? Or maybe have someone who liked it a bit more too? Its obviously more than fair than you say whatever you like on your podcast but this was a bit too extreme in my opinion and made the episode not too enjoyable. I hope the next one is more positive. Thanks !

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    12. House Monty:
      The Light King,

      What do you think was the storyline?

      In my opinion a big reason why people did not like the storyline is that they just don’t like the idea of Sansa and Arya fighting while being played by LF. For whatever reason, the story did not do the legwork for certain folks of having them understand why they would be fighting.

      Agreed. The Winterfell storyline, as planned by the writers, is pretty straightforward: two sisters, who hadn’t gotten along to begin with and have gone through completely different experiences, were finally reunited. Naturally, they had a clash of personalities and were suspicious of each other’s motivations. They resolved it only in the final episode of the season after Littlefinger’s blunder in episode 7, which finally clued Sansa in, and some off-screen help from Bran.

      Seeing as how many people managed to fail to comprehend that plot line, thinking that the sisters were playing LF all throughout the season, I would say that the writers ultimately failed to convey the story and overcome audience’s dislike of the idea of those two fan favorites fighting each other. I think maybe the conflict was portrayed in a rather illogical and childish way to be believable, considering how mature both Sansa and Arya have become throughout the series.

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    13. The Light King,

      House Monty,

      Alya,

      I agree too. Also don’t really understand the complaints about it. Thought it was well written as well. What people also seem to forget is that Arya went to Winterfell because of Jon not Sansa.

      Alya: I think maybe the conflict was portrayed in a rather illogical and childish way to be believable, considering how mature both Sansa and Arya have become throughout the series.

      I don’t think it was illogical the way they behaved because ‘old habits die hard’. Childish? Yes!

      Last year my grandmother died and after the wake my mother and her siblings stood by her body saying goodbye some more. And the oldest two sisters who never gotten along well got into a really big fight standing there over their mothers dead body. Like seriously?! You’re doing this now?

      So no matter how old people are or what they have been through they can still act like little children. Old habits die hard.

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    14. I love this episode of the podcast! Such a lovely analysis adressing many of the problems (I had) with the seventh series, I really appreciate that. You can be a fan of a something and also see its flaws.

      I like that you touched upon the priority of plot over characterisation. This season there were indeed far too many several occasions where I had the impression that it was the need to get from point A to point C informed the actions and storylines instead of the characters or situations themselves. With regard to the discussion about Tyrion I therefore agree completely when Petra (?) when she says “I think they are building up to something I just do not think in will feel earned when it happens”.

      I had similar feelings about the wighthunt, and about the Sansa, Arya, Petyr storyline. Both felt manufactured to me, they did not at all follow organically from the story and even worse demanded that several characters be severely dumbed down. This weakens the pay off.

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    15. Second episode of the podcast that I’ve listen too. While at times I thought it was a little negative, though I agreed with most of it. The thing I found the most baffling is no one pointing out that both the wights and white walkers can’t cross water but they suddenly have a scuba team complete with chain to haul a dragon carcass out of the water to re-animate. In the next episode they even make a point to Euron that they can’t cross water and he says I’m checking out to the Iron Islands, which actually seems like a plausible plan.

      Nick Hartley Does not Sow!

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