[Updated!] New photos from the Game of Thrones Season 6 Finale “The Winds of Winter”

Isaac Hempstead Wright as Bran Stark. Credit: Helen Sloan/HBO
Isaac Hempstead Wright as Bran Stark. Credit: Helen Sloan/HBO

HBO has released the final pre-viewing photos of the season, focusing on the season 6 finale of Game of Thrones. The tenth episode, which is titled “The Winds of Winter,” promises exciting action in King’s Landing with the trial of Cersei and Loras, in the North with the Starks in the aftermath of the battle, in the Riverlands with Jaime and the Freys, and across the sea with Daenerys and her growing empire. We’ll be checking in with Bran one more time this season, and yes- winter has finally come.

Episode synopsis: “Season Finale. Cersei faces her trial.”

Update 6/23: We’ve added several more photos to the post!

Photos below the cut!

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Emilia Clarke as Daenerys Targaryen and Peter Dinklage as Tyrion Lannister. Credit: Helen Sloan/HBO

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Liam Cunningham as Davos Seaworth. Credit: Helen Sloan/HBO
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Finn Jones as Loras Tyrell and Jonathan Pryce as The High Sparrow. Credit: Helen Sloan/HBO

 Nikolaj Coster-Waldau as Jaime Lannister and David Bradley as Walder Frey. Credit: Helen Sloan/HBO
Nikolaj Coster-Waldau as Jaime Lannister and David Bradley as Walder Frey. Credit: Helen Sloan/HBO

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Jerome Flynn as Bronn and Nikolaj Coster-Waldau as Jaime Lannister. Credit: Helen Sloan/HBO
HBO.com has posted this image as well:

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More photos are expected at a later point, hopefully tomorrow, so we’ll keep this post updated as they come in!

Update: here are several more photos from the episode, courtesy of Farfarawaysite!

First we have a couple Bran shots very similar to the ones released yesterday and in advance of the season.

1

2

Then we stop in at the Twins with Jaime and Bronn, and Walder himself. The guests don’t look thrilled to be there.

5

6 (1)

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From the trial of Loras Tyrell. Loras is center with the High Sparrow, and Lancel is close by in this first photo.

10

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Tyrion just before or after his photo above with Daenerys

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From Empire Online:

ep10

Sue the Fury
Susan Miller, Editor in Chief of WatchersOnTheWall.com

1,007 Comments

  1. Could Jamie and the Lannister army be headed north after epp 10? Can’t see the lannisters being very happy with the new stark/vale alliance

  2. Either walder frey is getting killed this episode or maybe jaime lannister…i hope it’s the former one

  3. Probably get new photos tomorrow. Guarantee that none of them will show anything that isn’t already in the preview.

    WHAT ARE YOU HIDING FROM US HBO?????

  4. Sou:
    Florian,

    Ha ha, I take it you do not worry for old Walder. Who, in my view, will soon become the late Walder Frey. For good.

    The North Remembers 😉

  5. I also have a feeling that something will happen to Dany. Maybe Daryo will try to kill her. She has tears in her eyes in the promo and she is shaking her head in disbelief while Tyrion is comforting her.

  6. Molestown bastard,

    Hm, no time I think. I mean, no time to react to that, plus I don’t think he would do it without consulting with Cersei and I don’t think she would send him off to the North now with her trial coming up.

  7. On topic. Looking forward to Bran. Hopefully we see TOJ and extremely excited about Jaime and WF

    House Adder,

    You left and found the house burning 🙂

  8. Inga,

    No. He still has rags on him, if he is in Winterfell Sansa would make him nice suit. He is close to Wall from one or other side.

  9. I wonder if the wall falls and if the mother of dragons set sail in the final scene to head west!

  10. Hahaha look at Bran chillin’ .
    Can’t believe that this great season is almost over 🙁

  11. Any chance for Arya to drop by the Frey party?

    What was the point of Riverrun this season btw? I’ve read the books but can’t remember it having a bigger purpose there either.

  12. Inga,

    I definitely think he’s going to…let’s be safe and say disappoint her. I’ve been expecting it for a while-and this would be a good time.

    Also- Run Jaime! Don’t eat or drink and do not talk to Walder Frey. Or…maybe do and realize that this idiot’s greatest crowning achievement that he can’t stop bragging about is slaughtering people who come to his parties. Kill him. Head north.

  13. Why is everyone expecting something will go down at The Twins? Is this based on more than a desire for Walder Frey to die?

    Because I don’t think he will. Nor Jaime for that matter.

  14. Alen:
    Inga,

    No. He still has rags on him, if he is in Winterfell Sansa would make him nice suit. He is close to Wall from one or other side.

    Yeah. He’s gotta be on the north side of the Wall still – in that photo.

    Perhaps he’ll reach Castle Black in this episode, but if so, we’ve seen no hint of it yet. At the least, his scene(s) will start with him still north of the Wall.

  15. Mihnea,

    Bran storyline is the best one this year… R+L=J is coming, I can feel it in my bones…
    Children playing with wildfire…cccc

  16. monka,

    There was snow in the scene where Sansa was meeting Littlefinger (they must have had had a snowfall in the night)… But probably it’s just my wishful thinking. The heart-tree of the Winterfell godswood doesn’t seem to have fir trees nearby.

  17. So glad Cersei finally has a new costume. She’s been wearing the same navy blue outfit the entire season. Previously she had lots of mourning gowns in black but this season she literally wore the same one in every scene. Maybe, post giving birth it was the only comfortable one to wear.
    Another off topic thing I noticed. In episode 608 the costume credits in the opening credits were given to Michelle Clapton who was replaced this season with April Ferry (who has been credited in the openings of all other episodes) But I was wondering why was her name brought back and replaced Ferry’s for the opening of 608. Michelle Clapton is now credited in the closing credits as series costume designer for her past work and the costumes still used by the show created by her, So it was odd that this happened. Maybe it was a goof up by the post production team. anyone have insight?

  18. Dutch Maester,

    This. This.

    I don’t think it will be anything then a cool conversation.

    Might be wrong, sure. Won’t mind it either. But I just don’t see it.

  19. Inga,

    She’s probably just telling Daario that they can’t be together anymore and that he should stay in Meereen. She’s in the game now and a sellsword isn’t a fit consort for a queen.

  20. House Adder:
    lyanna_targaryen,
    Marriage proposal, duh

    Look, I got to give it to old Walder. He has like a dozen daughters that he needs to marry off, hopefully by passing on the dowry or whatever they have in GOT world.
    It has been a nightmare for dads until something like 60 years ago, so poor old Walder does all he can to lure eligible bachelors… ?

  21. Game of Thrones where nominated for two TCA awards

    OUTSTANDING ACHIEVEMENT IN DRAMA

    “The Americans,” FX – (2015 Winner in Category)

    “Better Call Saul,” AMC

    “Game of Thrones,” HBO

    “The Leftovers,” HBO

    “Mr. Robot,” USA

    “UnREAL,” Lifetime

    PROGRAM OF THE YEAR

    “The Americans,” FX

    “Fargo,” FX

    “Game of Thrones,” HBO

    “Making a Murderer,” Netflix

    “Mr. Robot,” USA

    “The People v. O.J. Simpson: American Crime Story,” FX

    “UnREAL,” Lifetime

    A lot of good competition, we have some God like shows. Mr Robot, the leftovers, and the people vs oj.

  22. Hoping to see Ned Patrick Harris, aka Doogie Stark, at the Tower of Joy…can’t wait to see the actress chosen to portray the infamous Leanna.

    Can’t believe I’m rooting for Cersei and her evil entourage. Of course, who knew I would ever forgive Theon and that Jaime would become one of my favorites. I still hate her but I hate the High Sparrow just a teensy bit more.

    I’m super excited to see what happens with Walder Frey. So glad there have been no leaks and spoilers regarding this story arc and wonder if they are going to have an exciting twist that will blow us away.

    Hardhome was like a drive by shooting…totally unexpected. What do they have in store for us Sunday?

    I’m so sad this is it for the year, but I’m looking forward to an exciting finale!

  23. So no Arya in the finale right? That’s a first. Maisie isn’t credited in the cast for episode 10 on IMDb. I guess we’ll have to wait until next season to know what happens to her.

  24. I want House Frey,every man,woman and child, going the Way of the Dodo before his eyes and before his death! The RAT COOK curse falling full power on him and joining the disappeared Boltons,Umbers and Karstarks 🙂

  25. lyanna_targaryen,

    Whether they think LSH is in or not?

    😉

    Speculation for the ep: Loras’s trial is first, he pleads guilty and gets the living life as a penitent punishment Marg mentioned, hence the hair do. He’s freee to go back to Highgarden = win. I don’t think this is really a spoiler but I’ll hide it just in case

    Then it’s Cersei’s turn. A group of her enemies are conveniently in one place which allegedly has wildfire stored under/near it. If she can somehow make sure Tommen isn’t in there at the relevant moment, it’s all going to go horribly wrong in glow-in-the-dark green. They’ve mentioned wildfire and her burning stuff so many times this series I will be very surprised if that’s not rather heavy handed foreshadowing.

    No firm ideas on anything else. Don’t know much about how the magic in the show works but

    if Bran reaches the Wall and has the Night’s King’s mark, will it effect the magic that keeps the WW north of it? Maybe he wants go south but can’t for that reason. Oh yeah and we’re due more of the ToJ vision aren’t we?
  26. Dutch Maester:
    Why is everyone expecting something will go down at The Twins? Is this based on more than a desire for Walder Frey to die?

    Because I don’t think he will. Nor Jaime for that matter.

    But then why would Jaime ride all the way to the Twins instead of heading back to Kings Landing?

  27. Florian:
    I’m so worried about Jaime and Walder scene. ?

    Don’t worry. I did initially but on reflection I think this could illustrate a positive twist. Walder Frey is loathsome. Even those he’s allied with know that. Jaime had contempt for the way the Freys were handling the siege of RR.
    Cat knew he was a slime ball too when she tried to negotiate with him. He’s going down I think. How Jaime emerges I haven’t a clue but there is so much potential with Jaime, I think he’s safe.

  28. Should be a good last episode to season 6, hope they can wrap everything up with a neat bow on top XD

  29. This is my most anticipated episode of all time tbh…

    And I really glad the season is ending…. GOT is fun, but the fandom can get exhausting, and Im kinda throned out right now

  30. Hawk: At least it seems like both Jamie and Bronn leave The Twins unscathed.

    Looks like they are heading to the Twins.

  31. Sou:
    Hawk,

    How can you tell?

    No clue, but I don’t think they’d show them travelling back to The Twins. With all of the plot happenings, they’ll probably condense it. They’ve done it before with a few travel scenes. The viewer might be left to logically assume they packed up after Riverrun and headed back to The Twins.

  32. I am expecting good scenes between dany and tyrion and others in meereen.

    And also for cersei..

    I believe two things may happen this episode ..

    1) bran will be seeing TOJ and we will switch straight back to jon in the crypts..

    2) varys will be in dorne and will give a speech about coming of daenerys stormborn and why she is the best ( since that speech about YG in books mostly fits with dany anyways )..and we cut straight to dany and tyrion set sailing

  33. Dutch Maester,
    Won’t go into book stuff-just show…
    Remember Bran’s story of the Rat Cook at the Nightfort before Sam and Gilly ran into them?
    It was not for murder that the gods cursed him, nor for serving the Andal king his son in a pie. A man has a right to vengeance. But he slew a guest beneath his roof, and that the gods cannot forgive.
    Guest rite is a big deal and Walder specifically fed Robb and Cat bread and salt as soon as they arrived for the wedding. This means they can take off their swords and relax because they’re among friends. A person who violates this is right up there with king and kinslayer.

    Plus the Freys are nasty bits of work that no one wants for allies. And Walder and his sons mentioned the Red Wedding every time they were on screen this season. I think it’s a clue. 🙂

  34. Alen,

    Edmure. Thoros. Beric. Benjen.

    Perhaps he, like the ones above, has a part to play and they wish to re-introduce him now?

    I might be wrong, of course. But…why would Jaime kill Walder? Why would Walder kill Jaime? I can’t find a plausible answer to those questions and no, Arya’s not arriving at The Twins this season.

  35. Im beyond excited that Bran is up on a horse!! Tho I think the special saddle Tyrion made for him might be a bit small now…

    Oh I so want Frey to die; hopefully at the hands of Arya!

  36. monka,

    That’s such a small amount of snow and whorefrost, easily could happen in a matter of hours. Winter is coming afterall

  37. Hawk,
    Ah that’s good. I love spoilers because I want to be mentally prepared for bad things happening to my faves. If you were as massive Jaime and/or Bronn fan I wouldn’t want you to be lulled into a false sense of security. Unless you like horrible surprises of course, in which case I can exclusively reveal that nothing bad ever happens again and everyone lives happily ever after, honestly! 😉

  38. OH shit Cersei is wearing BLACK. She’s going full Aerys.

    I wonder what her escape plan is?

    GET HYPE!

  39. Bran!! Yay!! I can’t wait to find out if he makes it south of the Wall or if Benjen tells him since he’s marked he can’t go through without severe consequences. But then if that were the case why would he have escorted him all the way there? I do think that’s the weirwood where Jon & Sam said their NW vows. I’m so excited for Bran’s and Jon’s stories in the season finale. And Arya. 🙂

    I’m so sad that this is the last Wednesday of the year where we’ll get pre-viewing photos. 🙁 It’s going to be a long wait for next season.

  40. Anya,

    They often leave out pics of some characters, Arya is most likely in it. I’m sure everyone will get an appearance no matter how small.

    Except Gendry.

    Waiting to see if

    Lady SH shows up…this is really the only time it could happen. Brotherhood going North with the Hound in tow, the Hound as Lady SH right hand…would be epic.
  41. Oh man … it’s been such a great season, I’m not ready for it to end. Now we’ll spend the next couple of weeks reading all the post-mortem articles and reviews, season and episode rankings etc. … and then the GoT buzz will slowly wind down … EXCEPT for us lunatics, who will be jumping right into season 7 production at the end of July!!

    Our season 6 watch ends, and our season 7 watch begins!!

  42. Lulus Mum:
    Hawk,
    Ah that’s good. I love spoilers because I want to be mentally prepared for bad things happening to my faves. If you were as massive Jaime and/or Bronn fan I wouldn’t want you to be lulled into a false sense of security. Unless you like horrible surprises of course, in which case I can exclusively reveal that nothing bad ever happens again and everyone lives happily ever after, honestly!

    I love spoilers, too! It gets me so hyped for an episode. I still get emotional when the episode airs, but I love being able to look at all of the subtle things, the way scenes are shot, and the locations while not freaking out. XD

  43. lyanna_targaryen:
    I NEED TO KNOW WHAT JAIME AND WALDER ARE TALKING ABOUT.

    Maybe Walder’ll congratulate Jaime on punching his son??
    I think it’ll be basically Walder Fey talking, drinking lot and mocking his new wive and Jaime has to listen to it, and Jaime’ll be with his thoughts in Kingslanding.
    Or Walder’ll explian the stupid hats, who all Freys are wearing.

  44. I don’t know if I can handle an other off season…… 🙁

    Also Bran looks relaxed as hell.

  45. Mawk: Waiting to see if

    Lady SH shows up…this is really the only time it could happen. Brotherhood going North with the Hound in tow, the Hound as Lady SH right hand…would be epic.

    People have been saying exactly this for the last 3 seasons. “This is the last chance for LSH!” “They have to do it this episode!”

    Then it doesn’t happen.

    It’s time to finally face it –

    Beric is alive, meaning LSH is not!
  46. EW just posted that 3 more photos that were earlier announced,wont be coming after all 🙁 Too spoilery,maybe ? Anyways,I am sure more info will be posted before the weekend.

    I can’t believe it’s finale already…Oh man!

  47. monka:
    Inga,

    there was no snow in winterfell last episode (except jon of course)

    You’re right about that but in the preview for the season finale, there is snow as the white raven approaches WF and when Sansa & Littlefinger are in the Godswood. While I don’t think Bran is in WF in the above pic, there is definitely fresh snow in Winterfell in 6×10. I’m sure WF is going to look gorgeous covered in snow; that muddy mess of the last few episodes was not aesthetically pleasing.

  48. Speaking of costumes is that even black dany wears ..iam not sure it looks something like dark blue..
    Three days after I still can’t get past that comment…lol..

    Regardless of the color the dress looks good on her ..

    Another thing iam so glad and will be relieved is that they can’t bring mad king again in dany’s story..for once tyrion as said everything about mad king and secondly cersei will take care of this issue in KL
    They have milked this mad king enough so lets move on.

  49. Violencersei:
    Or Walder’ll explian the stupid hats, who all Freys are wearing.

    Actually I would like to find out the rationale behind those hats, now that I think of it.

  50. Lulus Mum,

    In the promo, we saw Tommen all dressed up for the trial, Cersei can request that her son not be present while she is being judged. I think the High Sparrow will allow that, either because (i) The king being present while his mother is getting judged may affect the judgment of the seven septons. (ii) Given the nature of Cersei’s crimes (infidelity, regicide etc), not allowing her son to be present will be a kindness, whether that son is a king or a peasant.

  51. Rich Stark:
    EW just posted that 3 more photos that were earlier announced,wont be coming after all Too spoilery,maybe ? Anyways,I am sure more info will be posted before the weekend.

    I can’t believe it’s finale already…Oh man!

    Someone should do us a solid and release them!

  52. Sou,

    They aren’t part of armor – even the female Freys were wearing those in Red Wedding. Probably as a uniform to help the Freys to distinguish their kin from the guests when they organize dinnertime massacres.

  53. HelloThere,

    I’m with ya. This show is my favorite thing and I adore it (it has its flaws yet it’s still pretty good) but sometimes there’s just so much fucking negativity relating people expecting fan theories to happen and also book purists saying D&D have ruined everything and people with impossible expectations about the show. This site is one of he few where one can have a respectful conversation about difference of opinions about the show and not just spat out things like “Fuck Daenerys” “The show is shit now” and so forth.

    About the photos; that shot of Cersei is MARVELOUS.

  54. I have a feeling that

    Arya will serve up them Frey pies….hopefully Bronn and Jaime (especially Bronn) won’t eat them and die. That would suck, but I highly doubt that Jaime will die, I just hope Bronn doesnt because hes awesome lol.
  55. aabe:
    Lulus Mum,

    In the promo, we saw Tommen all dressed up for the trial, Cersei can request that her son not be present while she is being judged. I think the High Sparrow will allow that, either because (i) The king being present while his mother is getting judged may affect the judgment of the seven septons. (ii) Given the nature of Cersei’s crimes (infidelity, regicide etc), not allowing her son to be present will be a kindness, whether that son is a king or a peasant.

    Sure, but it would take a kind person to do kindness…

  56. Cersei is a villain I love to hate. Lena just makes that character enjoyable to watch. I cannot wait to see what happens! Looks like a lot of stuff is goin’ down!

  57. Frokkie,

    Definitely. Personally, I would love someone to just come upon him in the finale. Maybe he went back to the Inn where Hot Pie works and is making swords and horseshoes in the back or something.
    Or maybe he rowed to Oldtown.
    Our team really needs a good blacksmith who can work with-if not create-Valyrian steel. 🙂 Plus Arya is coming back to Westeros. It’s time for the only person whose story hasn’t been addressed to show up.
    Or I’ll have to wait for Season 7…

  58. Not that it means anything but last time I looked at IMDB this episode had basically everyone listed in the cast except for Sam, Gilly, and Pod…and of course Gendry.

  59. Cersei’s costume looks so much similar to what tywin used to wear..
    And that shot of her is wonderful

  60. I’m rooting for Arya to show up in the riverlands, kill a Frey or two and Jamie recognizes her, then escorts her to Winterfell.

  61. I am prepared to be pissed off if Jaime

    is the one responsible for House Frey’s extermination. Yeah, he knows they are incompetent but Cersei would be pissed because the Frey’s are in the collective Lannister back pocket. Making Cersei mad is the last thing Jaime wants. This is just a kill that I want at the hands of a Stark and who better than Arya. Her first duty upon returning to Westeros is killing Walder. I am kind of thinking we could get a Brienne/Pod cliffhanger like the books, only its Frey soldiers that have them, no LHS and it’s the BwB, with Sandor in tow, that come to the rescue. They are heading north, so is B/P, so it would be cool to see them join up since really, Sandor/Brienne’s mission was identical in Season 4.
  62. BunBunStark,
    I think it was lightly snowing behind Sansa when she was saying her fond goodbyes to Ramsay? Just tried to check on Youtube but the picture’s too dark to tell ?

  63. dragonbringer,

    I know, right? Since Miguel Sapochnik directed it I expect a really big episode from what we’ve seen him do and also some sweet, sweet cinematography

  64. I’m very curious what Dany and Tyrion are talking about. They seem dejected. From the trailer, Tyrion says, “You’re in the great game now, and the great game is terrifying.” What could happen so quickly after the triumphs of the last episode? Theory:

    Euron caught up to Yara in Meereen, and killed her and took back the 100 ships. Now Dany must decide whether to agree to the marriage alliance with him.
  65. Mihnea:
    What are the chance we have a QITN or a KITN?

    I’ll give 40/60 for Queen.

    If Jon and Sansa reconcile I imagine that he would defer to her if she wants it.

    People have been discussing Bran coming to WF heart tree this episode in order to witness ToJ. In that case, I’d think Sansa would defer to his claim! I’m rather hoping that Jon – Bran – Sansa reunite and Jon’s true birthright is known before any one is declared heir to WF.

    Anyway are we still doing King / Queen vs Lord / Lady? I was under the impression that Robb’s secessionist movement died with him.

  66. Run Jaime run, only 2 things can possibly come from this:

    1: Red Wedding 2

    2: You have to marry one of his daughters

  67. Mawk,

    I know, I’m talking about the fact that Arya is the only main character who’s not listed in the cast for next episode, not about the pics. I really think they won’t show her until next season, why would the whole cast be credited except for Maisie then? It makes sense though, she said herself that Arya wouldn’t appear much this season.

  68. aabe,
    Mmm could well be, I like your thinking. If she, or whoever does it on her behalf, gets rather over excited with the…er…dosage, Tommen’ll need to take an urgent holiday a long way away. Oh Tommen I just remembered I left my car keys in Casterly Rock, could you pop over and get them for me? That sort of thing 😀

  69. Okay so

    We are confirmed to see:
    North – J/S, S/LF, J/D/M, (hopeful for another Jon scene. Yes. I am selfish)
    Bran and Co
    King Landing
    Dany and Co, talking then sailing off
    The Twins

    I don’t think we will see:
    Arya 🙁
    Hound and BWOB
    Dorne
    Euron
    Sam and Co
    Edit: I used to think the wall will fall, but that will be next season

    So, the stories we have confirmed will be meaty. Yay!

    (spoiler free speculation so do not confirm or repudiate anything using spoiler knowledge) thank you lol

  70. Alan the Tall,

    Yes in Miguel we trust..

    Sword of the Morning,

    Its just pre match jitters and nervousness that daenerys will be feeling with regards to finally moving towards to wesreros..the one thing she wanted her whole life ..that’s going to give anyone some fear..
    And to be frank we need that kind of a scene with dany

  71. House Adder:
    Mihnea,
    KITN, that is the way for Sansa to outplay LF, and winter has come, they need Winter king.

    Hmm… I think Littlefinger wouldn’t mind at all if Sansa was no longer heir to WF. He can still marry her and it’s less complicated. And he’d still have influence over the North vis-a-vis Jon and Sansa’s relationship.

    Bran’s the real wild card though. Maybe he’ll say “I’m not Bran Stark anymore – I am the one who sees with a thousand eyes, and… two” 🙂

  72. Violencersei: Maybe Walder’ll congratulate Jaime on punching his son?

    Maybe, Walder doesn’t strike me as being a kind-hearted dad, he’ll probably joke about how he only hit his son with a stick whereas Jaime used a metal hand…

  73. While everyone is fearing for Jamie ..

    I have a feeling that brienne is going to die

  74. Will we find out what happened to Lord Karstark?

    I am dying to know what Jon will do with Melly and Davos.

    YES BRAN!!!!!!

  75. I have absolutely no idea on what to expect for the Riverlands. Will Arya show up? Will there be a massacre at the Twins (and who will kill who?), and will Brienne and the Hound play a role in the upcoming episode?

    So many questions… What do you guys think?

  76. Moqorro:
    Vyse,

    I have more respect for trolling than that! Hope, I didn’t annoy too much.

    Not at all, was just betting on what the video would be. 🙂

  77. Cersei’s costume is glorious

    Can’t wait to see her wrath in full force… Shes been bottling it up all season….

  78. So we finaly saw Sam and Gilly in only two episodes this season.
    I really loved the familly reunion scene.

  79. Mihnea,

    “Kings are a rare sight in the North.” Robert snorted. “More likely they were hiding under the snow. Snow, Ned!”

    Corn,” the bird said, and, “King,” and, “Snow, Jon Snow, Jon Snow.” That was queer, the bird had never said his full name before, as best Jon could recall.

  80. Dee Stark,

    I more or less agree, but I do think that we will see Arya arriving to Westeros or something. The reverse scene of when she arrived to Braavos.

  81. House Adder,

    So, regardless of Arya’s FM skill level, when she says, “Arya of House Stark” doesn’t that mean she’s not going to be “no one”?

    EDIT Not defending the IMDB list just curious about Arya’s willingness to use a face going forward.

    Also, any thoughts on the lack of (casting spoiler)

    the Merrett Frey type role? Was it just cut or reduced from 3 eps to one? Also, the Manderly spec’d role hasn’t appeared either 🙁
  82. Is The Inn at the Crossroads near the Twins? Maybe Hot Pie and an old friend of his might be in the Frey Kitchens.

  83. I just realized …

    This is the last episode in the history of GOT where plot armor exists…
    The end game starts next season

  84. House Adder,
    Cool,* thanks. Wasn’t my dodgy eyes then! 😀

    On a side note, every time I see KITN I immediately think Kit N, has he changed his surname to Narington or something? Mind you, when I see Deepwood Motte I automatically assume it’s Depeche Mode. Every. Single. Time. The last record I heard of their’s was about 20 years ago so it’s not like their name crosses my mind on a regular basis.

    * literally 😉

  85. OMG I want a wildfire scene in Kings Landing and then SNOW STARTS FALLING! Bam, Cersei, all your revenge is pointless in the end.

    Btw, speaking of snow falling, I’ve thought this over and over, but I wonder if Mel will actually claim in the Davos/Jon scene that she got TPTWP wrong BUT she was right in burning Shireen to save TPTWP’s army. Shireen still had king’s blood – and Jon’s army still beat the weather.

    And then the second the battle ended, even in the scene in the courtyard taking away Rickon’s battle, the snow started to fall. And by the time we see the preview scenes, it’s clear snow and Winter is there.

    Gonna go ahead and say our Melly did actually save Jon’s army, but made an oopsie with whose army she was saving.

  86. I’m sticking to my theory that Brienne and Pod will meet up with the Brotherhood and the Hound on their way North.

    And that Jorah will show up at the Citadel at the same moment as Sam…

    I really feel like we could see almost everyone this episode (even Dorne if Varys goes there).

    For me the wildest cards this finale will be Arya and Euron !

  87. Sword of the Morning:
    I’m very curious what Dany and Tyrion are talking about. They seem dejected. From the trailer, Tyrion says, “You’re in the great game now, and the great game is terrifying.” What could happen so quickly after the triumphs of the last episode? Theory:

    I was wondering the same thing. Dany looks worried in that scene even though they just beat the Masters/Harpies.

  88. dragonbringer,

    Yeah, we need to see Dany go through some emotions; it’s the thing she’s been expecting to do her whole life and to be scared will show that she’s not just a ruthless, cold-hearted conqueror. That’s the reason I loved her scene with Yara, Dany showed excitement and and got to relate to someone; and she wasn’t just on conqueror mode.

  89. How much time has passed between episodes 9 and 10 for it to be snowing heavily now?

  90. Sou,

    arya arriving in bravos was a season premiere thing,
    s o if anything she will be getting on a ship to westeros

  91. I wonder if Melisandre is going to be executed by Davos…

    I hope not. Her character is interesting, and I think there’s much more stuff for her to do.

  92. House Adder,

    It’s possible but I think she would take the face off at some point like she did with Meryn Trant, she wouldn’t wear it the whole time.

  93. Motherofmadness:
    So glad Cersei finally has a new costume. She’s been wearing the same navy blue outfit the entire season. Previously she had lots of mourning gowns in black but this season she literally wore the same one in every scene. Maybe, post giving birth it was the only comfortable one to wear.
    Another off topic thing I noticed. In episode 608 the costume credits in the opening credits were given to Michelle Clapton who was replaced this season with April Ferry (who has been credited in the openings of all other episodes) But I was wondering why was her name brought back and replaced Ferry’s for the opening of 608. Michelle Clapton is now credited in the closing credits as series costume designer for her past work and the costumes still used by the show created by her, So it was odd that this happened. Maybe it was a goof up by the post production team. anyone have insight?

    They submitted the finale for costumes and it already shows why. Cersei and Tommens new costumes look great.

  94. Mihnea,

    Tyrion Pimpslap,

    Adding these to the collection:

    “They say the king gives justice and protects the weak.” She started to climb off the rock, awkwardly, but the ice had made it slippery and her foot went out from under her. Jon caught her before she could fall, and helped her safely down. The woman knelt on the icy ground. “M’lord, I beg you—”

    “Lord Stannis is marching to a slaughter. So he cannot help me, and would not even if he could.” Alys knelt before him, clutching the black cloak. “You are my only hope, Lord Snow. In your father’s name, I beg you. Protect me.”

  95. I think things are going to go badly for old Walder. Why? Maybe Jaime is just sick of the hole lot. Maybe a desire for some justice for Catelyn Stark. However my vote is…

    Jaime promised Bronn a big castle…and a Lannister always pays his debts.

  96. If all is tied up nicely this could be the best season finale to date. Cersei is going to lose it, and I can’t wait to see how it unfolds. As for Arya reaching the Twins, everything we’ve predicted with regards to her storyline turned out to be completely the opposite. So I will go with a simple shot of her on a ship back to Westeros, however non-climactic and dull that is.

    LF and Sansa scenes are amongst my favourites, but if he asks for her hand in marriage, bahhh!!

    Bran and whatever he’ll be doing/uncovering will be up there for me this episode. I need my NK fix!

    Cannot believe we are almost at the end of the road.

  97. “When the snows fall and the white winds blow, the lone wolf dies but the pack survives.”

    Winter is Coming.

    Arya is headed to Westeros. Bran is headed south. Jon and Sansa are in Winterfell.

  98. Arkash,

    I’m sticking to my theory that Brienne and Pod will meet up with the Brotherhood and the Hound on their way North.

    The Twins is on the way north…

  99. Can’t believe in 4 days GoT will be gone until next year. With it being a shortened Season 7 it could be even longer until the premiere. Maybe they’ll premiere later than April.

  100. Dee Stark:
    I don’t think we will see:
    Arya
    Hound and BWOB
    Dorne
    Euron
    Sam and Co
    Edit: I used to think the wall will fall, but that will be next season

    I actually think we’ll see all of those lol. Here’s how I could see it breaking out time-wise, bearing in mind a 69 minute total.

    North – J/S, S/LF, J/D/M – 12 mins (including Brienne in this – just guessing)
    Bran and Co – 9 mins
    King Landing – 15 mins
    Dany and Co, talking then sailing off – 8 mins
    The Twins – 6 mins
    Arya – 6 mins
    Hound and BWOB – maybe not included, maybe mixed with Arya
    Dorne – 3 mins
    Euron – 3 mins
    Sam and Co – 6 mins

  101. I think Arya will be arriving next season. The

    “Wall falls down”

    moment might be one hell of a season opener

  102. I have a question? Perhaps someone can answer. Is there any reason to believe that Bran can’t have children? Does waist down disfunction mean you can’t have sex/ make babies I ask because I honestly don’t know and Sansa seemed to completely dismiss Bran as potential heir when talking about rickon last episode. Please do not take offense I’m just asking.

  103. Also agree with those of you predicting Jon will be KotN. He’ll be legitimised this episode, and Sansa will support his claim. I can’t see it going any other way given the revelation we hope to be getting this episode.

  104. Shaz:
    If all is tied up nicely this could be the best season finale to date. Cersei is going to lose it, and I can’t wait to see how it unfolds. As for Arya reaching the Twins, everything we’ve predicted with regards to her storyline turned out to be completely the opposite. So I will go with a simple shot of her on a ship back to Westeros, however non-climactic and dull that is.

    LF and Sansa scenes are amongst my favourites, but if he asks for her hand in marriage, bahhh!!

    Bran and whatever he’ll be doing/uncovering will be up there for me this episode. I need my NK fix!

    Cannot believe we are almost at the end of the road.

    Season 4 finale had Arya on a ship, I don’t think they’ll do it again. She already booked passage, so its been established already.

  105. Dee Stark,

    Sam will be in the finale, he has a scene with a maester i think, about the valyrian steel sword he stole and find out why it kills White Walkers. And Arya has to be in the finale, no way she can miss out on it.

  106. Nadia,

    In my mind, I always think of Shireen’s sacrifice as a way to pay for Jon’s life. Completely unintended on Mel’s part but it follows that only death can pay for life. I gather that Mel prayed for R’llhor to help Azor Ahai only Stannis was not AA. Granted, this doesn’t prove Jon is but just a thought.

  107. Some people were speculating that the three trumpet blasts Davos heard while looking at Shireen’s pyre was from the Wall, and indicates White-Walkers. Could it be, instead, the Vale troops on their way to Winterfell. I don’t know if trumpets from the Wall can be heard that far south.

  108. Connor:
    I think we will get Dorne in the season finale.

    Same. For it to only be in the premiere would be strange.

  109. I think KL could have upwards of 20 minutes with the trial(s), the little birds stuff, and any other pre/post trial scenes.

  110. Shaz:
    Also agree with those of you predicting Jon will be KotN. He’ll be legitimised this episode, and Sansa will support his claim. I can’t see it going any other way given the revelation we hope to be getting this episode.

    But if there is that revelation (I assume you mean RLJ) how would that make Jon King in the North – he’s not even Ned’s son in that case? Doesn’t it make him King of Westeros instead?

    In which case Sansa would still be Lady of Winterfell. Maybe Sansa will kneel to Jon as the True King of Westeros. Making her the first to pledge to the new dragons… 🙂

  111. The Dothraki and Unsullied begin an all out battle in Mereen. They are unable to keep peace among the different cultures. Daario tells Dany that he and his men, The Second Sons, must leave the city. Tyrion strategizes a solution.

    Brienne and Pod have been captured by the late Walder Frey unbeknownst to Jaime. Jaime arrives to discuss the details of their arrangement for Riverrun. Jaime demands the prisoners released (if they haven’t already been killed). This is enough for Jaime to want to kill Walder.

    Petyr Baelish divulges incomplete information to Sansa regarding his plans for the Vale. He likely fails to mention what he intends for Winterfell. Sansa begins to realize that the real concern they should be addressing (winter coming) isn’t an agenda item for littlefinger. One is about to betray the other.

    Varys meets Olenna in Dorne to discuss with the Sandsnakes the possible options for ousting our enemies (the Lannisters). Varys presents a compelling case for Danaerys. I can’t imagine the Sandsnakes being convinced. Yet they agree to be the landing point for Dany’s Dothraki hordes.

    Cersai awaits her trial. Blows the Sept of Baelor to smithereens. Inside were the High Sparrow, Lancel and Loras. Tommen trapped inside on one of the highest floors of the building or back at the Red Keep elects to either jump to safety or commit suicide because of his inner turmoil. Margaery will have some role in this. My guess is suicide.

    Qyburn’s little birds

    kill Kevan Lannister and Grand Maester Pycelle. Good riddance to that old creep.

    Bran has the vision of the Tower of Joy which is the least difficult of all predictions to make. Yes, Lyanna gives birth to Jon before dying in labor. Meanwhile, in Winterfell Jon has growing concerns of Westeros’ ability to defeat the whitewalkers. Cue, intense convo with Sansa or Davos or Melisandre.

    The Hound kills Beric Dondarrion for good, but not before Lady Stoneheart gets a shout out (appearance?). And lastly I’m hoping *Arya kills Thoros of Myr or whatever other Brotherhood members she must to help the Hound survive. At that point they’ll call it even. A girl is home. Cut season.

  112. Violencersei: Maybe Walder’ll congratulate Jaime on punching his son??
    I think it’ll be basically Walder Fey talking, drinking lot and mocking his new wive and Jaime has to listen to it, and Jaime’ll be with his thoughts in Kingslanding.
    Or Walder’ll explian the stupid hats, who all Freys are wearing.

    In the preview Walden is toasting to the Frey and Lannisters uniting. A marriage? Maybe the high sparrow convinced Tommen the dweeb to marry off his uncle to keep him out of the capital and away from Cersei? Walder looked very happy and I imagine a marriage into the Lannister family would do that.

  113. Mihnea,

    KitN and you know why I said it. Otherwise how would Jon’s story progress? Sansa’s highest point this season was to kill Ramsay and exact her revenge, being more proactive along the way. It was more of her war than Jon’s. Much like White Walkers is more of his story than hers.

    But Jon would basically stall, dude went from Night’s Watch, pushed by his sister going to war and then what sitting in the corner? He knows about White Walkers more than anyone and they need to be prepared, Sansa doesn’t know about them much like Northerners. Sansa is about to take down LF and her being Queen would only cement his victory. Jon being KitN with her support would make for interesting dynamics and screw with his plans.

    But tbh wouldn’t be surprised if we’ll end up with Queen in the North will all the thing women taking charge theme going on. It would fit but Jon being KitN with Sansa’s blessing would screw LF big time.

  114. Laura,

    interesting if you are right

    I would love to see Arya, but I feel like if we do it will be getting on a ship or something

  115. Nadia:
    “When the snows fall and the white winds blow, the lone wolf dies but the pack survives.”

    Winter is Coming.

    Arya is headed to Westeros. Bran is headed south. Jon and Sansa are in Winterfell.

    Nice.

  116. Mihnea,

    King-no doubt in my mind… King of the Free Folk, King of Winter, King in the North
    Secret bonus-king’s blood. 😉

    Nadia,

    Yes!! Love this.

  117. Will they touch on Rickon’s burial do you think? It’s a bit tinfoil but [ spoiler ] I wonder if something could be found in the crypt that reveals R+L=J though I think that’s more likely to be shown via Bran having a flashback. [ / spoiler]

  118. If Tommen dies who takes the crown? Is there any precedent for the mother of the dead king to act as regent — or queen?

    Will there just be a power vacuum and chaos?

    I fell like Cersei needs to take power somehow but I don’t know how that would happen… full Lannister takeover ( minus Kevan who will most certainly die)???

  119. Anya:
    House Adder,

    It’s possible but I think she would take the face off at some point like she did with Meryn Trant, she wouldn’t wear it the whole time.

    If she’s in a room full of people and it’s a covert poisoning of only select individuals it would be a wise choice not to reveal herself the killer and certainly not as Arya Stark. She could have a one second reveal after leaving the castle or filmed in a way that the viewer knows it’s her without seeing Arya’s face (hands mixing a poison and then putting it in something)

  120. Dame of Mercia,

    it might be more of showing Jon in the crypt and then cutting to bran… very vague but clear connection for the die hard over analyzing person like me.

  121. Dee Stark,

    We saw her on a ship going to Braavos in season 4 finale. Not that there’s a rule about repetition or anything 🙂 But I hope-with all this fast travel-she’ll already be in there. Using her skills.

  122. Dee Stark:
    Connor,

    its pretty big I wasn’t expecting to see him and now I know what he will be doing

    all good.

    I don’t think that’s actually confirmed though. I think it would be odd if we only had those 2 episodes of Sam this season. He should be in the finale.

  123. What if Jaime is simply at the twins to get a letter about what happens in KL? I mean it’s kind of compressing time to a ridiculous degree but maybe it could work if the KL scenes wrap up by halfway through, and Jaime getting the letter about what Cersei has done happens as a late scene…?

  124. Fellow watchers, please fill me up with theories … On how little finger the creep Bailish will die.. If that is ever possible. Or atleast his downfall. Pleaseeeee

  125. People, COVER YOUR SPOILERS.

    I know it feels like every other person has read the leaks now, but please stop discussing it like it’s all common knowledge and also not a big deal when you reveal something as fact for people. It’s super rude and thoughtless.

  126. Dee Stark,

    Queen of positivity indeed!

    Clob,

    Who can recognize Arya’s real face at this point? 1) Brienne 2) Sandor 3) BwoB

    But none of the Freys. Jaime prob not. Edmure no. She’s essentially already in disguise.

  127. RG,

    I hooopppppeee

    Khaleesi,

    Unfortunately, I feel like we wont be getting LFs demise this Sunday. I was so so so so hoping that – its GOT , we wont be cheering for two episodes in a row Hahaha

  128. Sou,

    And “the wolves will come again.” Finally!

    tiny direwolf,

    I don’t know who could take the crown if/when Tommen dies but it will not matter. KL will be thrown into complete chaos once Cersei starts playing with matches. And it will be a nice precursor to Dany’s return to Westeros.

  129. Dee Stark,

    Or the other way around. Bran/TOJ and then Jon takes Rickon’s body to WF crypts and kind of glances at Lyanna’s?

    I think it was so telling that they’ve 1) had LF/Sansa reference the story down in the crypt and 2) had Jon mention taking Rickon to the crypts.

    I AM HYPE

  130. Tycho Nestoris,

    Jaime absolutely would recognize Arya?! He saw her quite a decent amount and the Stark girls have been part of his consciousness for quite a while.

  131. One who waits:
    Is The Inn at the Crossroads near the Twins? Maybe Hot Pie and an old friend of his might be in the Frey Kitchens.

    Yes. It’s on the Kingsroad between KL and WF. It’s literally on the crossroads and has a road to the Twins.

  132. Regarding Jaime headed north. Yes, Northeast from Riverrun to the Twins – ie the pic is PRIOR to the celebration with the Freys. I can’t see Jaime headed further north from there given that he’s completely dedicated to returning to Cersei from comments earlier this season AND Cersei’s current predicament of NOT having the Mountain for a Trial by Combat. Cersei’s in no position to be ordering Jaime to go anywhere.

  133. QueenofThrones: But if there is that revelation (I assume you mean RLJ) how would that make Jon King in the North – he’s not even Ned’s son in that case?Doesn’t it make him King of Westeros instead?

    In which case Sansa would still be Lady of Winterfell.Maybe Sansa will kneel to Jon as the True King of Westeros.Making her the first to pledge to the new dragons…

    But guys, how will this revelation be known to Jon? I mean it will be Bran who finds out. And I don’t think Bran will cross the Wall and arrive to Winterfell so soon.

  134. BunBunStark: You’re right about that but in the preview for the season finale, there is snow as the white raven approaches WF and when Sansa & Littlefinger are in the Godswood. While I don’t think Bran is in WF in the above pic, there is definitely fresh snow in Winterfell in 6×10. I’m sure WF is going to look gorgeous covered in snow; that muddy mess of the last few episodes was not aesthetically pleasing.

    Could Bran be greenseeing via the WinterFell tree?

    BunBunStark,

  135. Nice stills, but nothing new we haven’t already seen from the trailer.

    I’d like to check 3 names off my list. Joffrey, Check. Ramsey, Check. Cersi–would love to see her finished and killed off. By Arya, that would be so welcome and sweet. Probably will not happen, of course.

    Check!

  136. Dee Stark,

    No not this week, but I just want to hear theories.. On how he will go at the end. I want to be As satisfied as I’m with Ramsey’s death.. When it finally happens. I’m done with his pedophile, slimey, creepy,smug smile. He killed Ned ( still sobbing), tried to woo cat basically on his remains.. And really ? He loves Sansa because she looks like her mother??? Yikes!! Most of my friends like him.. But I want him dead.. I wish bran finds out in a vision and sends and r-mail to Sansa

  137. monka,

    But there isn’t much snow on the ground in this picture. So who knows? We’ll have to wait until Sunday. 🙂

  138. monka:
    Inga,

    there was no snow in winterfell last episode (except jon of course)

    Yes, there was. When Sansa “released the hounds” on Ramsay, it was snowing.

  139. Friend of Fire,

    Does waist down disfunction mean you can’t have sex/ make babies I ask because I honestly don’t know and Sansa seemed to completely dismiss Bran as potential heir when talking about rickon last episode. Please do not take offense I’m just asking.

    No offense taken, its a good question. Depends on the amount of damage done to the spine, and where it is. It is possible he can. But I dunno, that fall was pretty bad….Nowadays there are things that can be done…..but back then, luck of the draw.

    here’s an article about the subject for those who are interested
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rachelle-friedman/misconceptions-about-paralysis_b_4644588.html

  140. Friend of Fire:
    I have a question? Perhaps someone can answer. Is there any reason to believe that Bran can’t have children? Does waist down disfunction mean you can’t have sex/ make babies I ask because I honestly don’t know and Sansa seemed to completely dismiss Bran as potential heir when talking about rickon last episode. Please do not take offense I’m just asking.

    There are paraplegics who can still father children. Whether that’s the case with Bran, I’ve no idea. In the world of GOT its natural they would assume he couldn’t though.

  141. Dee Stark,

    I AM BECOME HYPE THE DESTROYER OF WORLDS

    Also did you listen to the soundtrack?? Winter Has Come – same music as when we see the white raven flying and then the mix of the Stark theme and the GOT opening theme DYINGGGGG

  142. Dee Stark:
    Laura,

    interesting if you are right

    I would love to see Arya, but I feel like if we do it will be getting on a ship or something

    I feel like the next time we see Arya will be in Westeros, probably in the Riverlands. I just can’t figure out if she will meet back up with The Hound/BWB, show up at The Twins or a third option.

  143. What if Walder Frey is the one to tell Jaimie about Cersei?

    Whether she is found guilty, or not guilty, or burns down the city as many are predicting, it’s likely that the trial should have happened by the time Jaimie reaches the Twins.

    Imagine how angry Jaimie would be if he learns Cersei successfully did what he ruined his reputation to stop.

  144. Nadia,

    Oh no maybe I should skip reading this thread. 🙁 I hate when people do that I am reading from the bottom up thank you for the warning!

  145. Friend of Fire,

    I wonder if she thinks that Bran is dead if only Rickon was found.

    But she didn’t actually dismiss Bran did she? She was just talking about Rickon and saying that Rickon is way more a threat as a trueborn son than she or Jon were.

  146. Sou: But guys, how will this revelation be known to Jon? I mean it will be Bran who finds out. And I don’t think Bran will cross the Wall and arrive to Winterfell so soon.

    Therein lies the $64 million question. While the audience may learn Jon’s parentage, what significance can it have if a) there is no proof and b) only a tiny handful of people learn of it.

    GRRM and the show runners have us all stumped there!

  147. Sou,

    Maybe the whole Winterfell Crypt theory will be confirmed? That there is something down there hidden in plain sight that will tell Jon the truth?? Could be possible since he’ll probably go down there once Rickon is buried.

  148. Nadia,

    I have been waiting till after the finale to listen! I’m so excited for it!!! It sounds like it will be amazing! OMG!

  149. ash:
    Anya,

    I wonder if the face she uses will be Lady Crane.

    Or Black Walder or Lothar Frey. I’d love to have her sitting next to Walder during the whole feast and then just slice him to bits. Don’t know quite how she’d pull it off but it would be awesome 🙂

  150. I am SO HYPED to see Bran again–finally. I hope some truth is revealed…..something huge must happen, besides what we’ve all been speculating about.

  151. I’m sorry I’m super delayed on this, but Winds of Winter sounds like the Greyjoy and Dany theme?? That’s not at all what I thought it was going to be!

    Omg is Dany going to Westeros GET MORE HYPE

  152. QueenofKnowingNothing:
    Sou,

    Maybe the whole Winterfell Crypt theory will be confirmed? That there is something down there hidden in plain sight that will tell Jon the truth?? Could be possible since he’ll probably go down there once Rickon is buried.

    I loved that line about burying Rickon in the crypt “next to my father.” Well, next to your father’s harp, yes. 😛

  153. Sou,

    Haha! Your’s is a tremendous reason!!! Theories… Any idea? I’m just wondering if obsession for Cat is his raise to power.. Obsession with Sansa might be his downfall??!

  154. Nadia:
    I’m sorry I’m super delayed on this, but Winds of Winter sounds like the Greyjoy and Dany theme?? That’s not at all what I thought it was going to be!

    Omg is Dany going to Westeros GET MORE HYPE

    Could mean Euron has Dragonbinder after all.

  155. Laura,

    Don’t think harp is there or it would prove anything or Jon is suddenly drop sword and become a melancholic singer. But I think some people will be dissapointed with TOJ and all that.

  156. Dany feels too powerful right now, and you should never feel that way on Game Of Thrones. The “Mad Dog” has fallen, and now the Crow’s Eye will rise.

  157. tiny direwolf,

    She is wearing the ring of her dead firstborn son and her daughter necklace all season 6, and in episode 10, she will wear Tommen’s crown.

  158. House Adder,

    As much as I like the sound of Sansa Stark Queen in the North, LF would won and I don’t want that slimey fucker to win. He wants Sansa torule the North and him to be her husband or have power over them. This Ned’s home and he basically throw him to lions. Sansa need to take him down and screw with him and his plans.
    I think Jon and Sansa will have convo, then we’ll get LF and Sansa. After that Northerners will gather and Sansa supports Jon. Northerners will declare and Jon will gather North against Walkers which he wanted in the first place.

  159. Khaleesi,

    Sansa will stab him with Valyrian steel dagger he always wears on his hip. the dagger that started the war in Westeros.

  160. ash,

    actually that wasn’t a good article, sorry should have read it There is more info online if you are interested

  161. Here are some crazy theories…

    I was thinking about the LSH character (that people continue to hope shows up in the show)…since in the show many book characters have been omitted and/or the actions done by other characters…well…

    What if the LSH part is played by the Blackfish? He died, and his body could have been thrown in the river like Catlyn…to float down until the BwB find the body, and Beric gives up his spark to bring the Blackfish back. He then becomes the bane of all things Frey.

    Regarding Jaime and Walder….

    What if the Frey’s have Edmure killed behind Jaime’s back? Would that not put Jaime in a position to maybe act on killing Walder? He could then give either Riverrun or the Twins to Bron…cause they made a point of having Bron complain about not getting his castle etc. and a Lanister always pays his debts etc…

  162. Adhyan Taneja,

    I still have no idea why or how this would happen based on the situation they are in. I think both Jamie and Walder are fine, unless Arya climbs into Walder’s bedroom and kills him.

  163. Flayed Potatoes:
    Will we find out what happened to Lord Karstark?

    I am dying to know what Jon will do with Melly and Davos.

    YES BRAN!!!!!!

    Lord Karstark led Ramsay’s cavalry into battle. Since the cavalry on both sides was wiped out, I think it’s safe to say that Karstark, like the SmallJon, is dead. IF Karstark somehow survived, he’d be Jon’s prisoner.

    Melisandre did have Shireen burned, that’s true. But Stannis and Selyse gave her permission to do it. And Stannis stopped Selyse when she tried to save the girl (even though it was still too late). I think Jon will get the full story from Mel, and when he does, he’ll make Davos see she’s not entirely to blame for Shireen’s death. I do think he’ll banish her from the North, despite Davos’s desire to have Mel executed. Jon still needs a man like Davos. And he’ll try to convince him to look ahead, to the wars to come, not to the past.

  164. LF won’t die.
    I don’t believe this for 1 second.

    But he will certainly have a aweful day!!

    ”His joy will turn to ashes in his mouth”

    He’ll think he won but then……. Something.

  165. House Adder,

    House Adder:
    Khaleesi,

    I don’t want him to raise any more.. He smiles like smug hero… But he betrayed Ned and he can’t have his daughter because he was infatuated with his wife…

    Sansa will stab him with Valyrian steel dagger he always wears on his hip. the dagger that started the war in Westeros.

  166. I just don’t see anything happening to the Frey’s while Jamie Lannister, Bronn and their army are there. Now maybe once the army leaves then the Brotherhood can attack people traveling back to the Twins from Riverrun. But the brotherhood can’t do a damn thing to the people in the castle of Riverrun. Jamie has no cause to kill all the Frey’s even if they kill Edmure. I guess Arya could come back and sneak into Riverrun and kill Walder. But that isn’t the Comeuppance I want. I want the total destruction of the Frey’s gone. Killing one or two is not enough.

  167. Question – the Glovers weren’t at BotB were they?? Please gimme Tim McInnerny for another scene.

    I thought that scene made it clear that he didn’t particularly have any love for the Boltons, but that the Starks and their foolishness and selfishness had gotten his people killed. Still, there was a strange honor in the way he talked about the whole thing, and he was totally right about Robb Stark, and I would be so so so thrilled if he came back to pledge to the Starks again. Not because they demanded it, like Sansa demanded it, because now they’ve earned it.

  168. Mihnea,

    No, because it’s speculation. It’s not confirmed in the book either. It is 100% speculation. There are many other things that do need to be covered from the books though, like people discussing

    Qyburn, Pycelle and Kevan and the little birds which keeps coming up.
  169. I NEED to know the following:

    What the hell is Jaime even doing at the Twins? Makes little sense as he was desperate to get back to Cersei unless Brienne/Edmure/BF have pricked his conscience..

    Who is that walking out of the great Sept in the trailer shot, is it Loras?

    Cannot wait for the Wall to fall on Sunday ?

  170. ash,

    ash:
    Anya,

    I wonder if the face she uses will be Lady Crane.

    You can’t just use any face. The body and face have to be prepared by the Faceless Men, as we saw last season and this season. And, as Jaqen said in last year’s finale, it must be done right. Otherwise, there are consequences, like Arya being blinded. There is a way to use a “face” correctly. We haven’t seen any evidence that Arya could do that yet.

  171. So given, that I received permission from our Lady herself.

    Will we see TOJ?

    If so, how much will we see?

    Will it be clear cut or a bit of a tease?

    And what will the reveal be?? I wonder..

  172. Apollo: What the hell is Jaime even doing at the Twins? Makes little sense as he was desperate to get back to Cersei unless Brienne/Edmure/BF have pricked his conscience..

    Yes.

  173. Sou: But guys, how will this revelation be known to Jon? I mean it will be Bran who finds out. And I don’t think Bran will cross the Wall and arrive to Winterfell so soon.

    I think it’s only going to be known to Jon if the Winterfell heart tree is where Bran has the ToJ vision. Which would be awesome. I don’t see how it wouldn’t be possible for Bran to get there given he’s been offscreen for two episodes and apparently has a horse now. It only took Brienne two episodes to get from The Wall to Riverrun which is much farther.

    Anyway my point really was that if Jon finds out RL=J he’s not going to be King in the NORTH – in fact his claim to Winterfell arguably gets worse since it would be through Lyanna rather than Ned.

    Honestly I’m more interested in who will be awarded the Dreadfort. Maybe the Wildlings? Or what about Last Hearth? Would be ironic. Those Umber assholes killed Rickon as surely as Ramsey did, all because they hate the Wildlings…

  174. kit_hepburn,

    Yup, they did.
    Well I also think he was exagerating in that moment with Edmure, too make him surrender the castle.

    And hell Cersei herself said she will be fine. He can’t know all the plans flew out the window.

  175. Mihnea,

    We have our answer 🙂
    We will see young Ned and Lyanna in her bed of blood. Maybe even see the baby and hear Promise me Ned.

  176. QueenofThrones,

    Tormund Giantsbane will be proclaimed the Lord of the Last Hearth, he is Giantsbane and he killed SmallJon Umber whose sigil was the Giant.

  177. Apollo:

    What the hell is Jaime even doing at the Twins? Makes little sense as he was desperate to get back to Cersei unless Brienne/Edmure/BF have pricked his conscience..

    Or perhaps Jaime Lannister’s words don’t match Jaime Lannister’s actions…because that’s how he rolls.

  178. Do we still expect this to be the episode Kit was refering to when he said they did a whole episode which was Jon Snow’s whole story?

  179. Mihnea,

    C-Section hype!

    I think they will reveal half of the theory because they only worked at introducing the mother this season.

  180. Joey,

    I kind of think that was episode 9, which is really unfortunate because it wasn’t really at all Jon Snow’s story.

  181. Apollo,

    No. Second part is pure speculation. One I don’t think will happen

    Soooo……
    Dee Stark,

    Rejoice Dee. You haven’t been spoiled!!!!!! Well a bit…. Could have been worse… right?

  182. House Adder:
    QueenofThrones,
    Tormund Giantsbane will be proclaimed the Lord of the Last Hearth, he is Giantsbane and he killed SmallJon Umber whose sigil was the Giant.

    Love it. I hope this happens!

    Who gets Dreadfort then? I guess they could just raze it to the ground and split up his lands amongst the surrounding lords.

  183. QueenofThrones,

    Does King in the North really have to based on inherited claims though?

    We’re not talking about Warden of the North, which in theory has to be a trueborn Stark. Can’t the North declare anyone King or Queen in the North? It only matters who they bend a knee to.

  184. Flayed Potatoes,

    Tormund and Davos “Maybe our mistake was following kings Jon Snow is no King”

    Lyanna Stark repeating to Jon”House Mormont knows no King but the King in the North whose name is Stark” etc

  185. If i recall there is a Weirwood tree just north of Castle Black, is that where we assume Bran is, and where he has his “final”vision of the year. 😉 Hopefully just prior to crossing the wall and meeting up with, and checking in with Castle Black. Would be great for all of them to see Benjin. Plus if Pink Floyeds album does come crashing down we need to see some of those guys prior.

    Though i would love if Bran made it to Winterfell this episode and checked in with the tree prior… but I doubt we will be getting that reunion this year.

  186. Tycho Nestoris,

    The casting call for the “Hapless Sly Son” that people thought might be Merrett Frey turned out to be a casting call for the recast version of Lothar Frey, a role which was filled by Daniel Tuite. Though the casting call specified that he would be in three episodes, it looks like he’ll actually be in four, because he’s been in three so far and will be in the finale as well (I don’t actually recall seeing him in “No One”, but he was credited for that episode, in addition to appearing in “Blood of My Blood” and “The Broken Man”).

    As for “Fletcher”/Wyman Manderly, he and “Boyce”/Lord Cerwyn will appear in the finale.
  187. Great pics. Bran looks like he’s posing for Playgirl. I hope he has a good chunk of action this episode, I was surprised how caught up I was in the greenseeing, Three Eyed Raven thing. I’m hoping TOJ is finally resolved, with the ANSWER given this year, so that next year they can start showing what that will mean to Jon.

    Other than that, I can’t bring myself to even venture a theory as to what might happen – I’m hoping for a twist, a POSITIVE twist, but I can’t imagine what that might be. This whole season has left me in a state of mumbling awe; I’ll be in the middle of concentrating on something else and blurt out to myself something like “…But why didn’t the Blackfish go to Sansa? He should’ve gone to Sansa.” or “Ramsay’s gotta die this episode.” *Yay for that one* or “Davos, don’t mess with Mel, she brought Jon back, I’ve forgiven her.” Strange how this whole Game of Thrones world has captivated me, especially this season. I’ll almost be ready for a rest.

    BUT … if Arya doesn’t show up to visit Old Walder this episode, I wouldn’t mind seeing her swing by the Inn at the Crossroads next year to check on Hot Pie, even just for a bit. She ought to have a few minutes of peace with an old friend before she starts murdering people in Westeros again.

    That’s all I’m saying for now, sigh.

  188. Mihnea:
    So given, that I received permission from our Lady herself.

    Will we see TOJ? Yes

    If so, how much will we see? Not as much as we want to

    Will it be clear cut or a bit of a tease? Something in middle

    And what will the reveal be?? I wonder.. Still haven’t been able to use spoiler tags effectively haha-but it looks like an algebra problem. 🙂

  189. Nadia,

    Lyanna Mormont’s letter indicates that KITN is a hereditary title: “House Mormont knows no King but the King in the North whose name is STARK”.

    Jon Targaryen doesn’t qualify, as he’s not a Stark.

    Anyway Jon being declared King of Westeros with Sansa Stark as his vassal Lady of Winterfell (Or Bran as Lord) wouldn’t change much practically. Everyone would still be following Jon.

  190. HunterMac87:
    If i recall there is a Weirwood tree just north of Castle Black, is that where we assume Bran is, and where he has his “final”vision of the year.?Hopefully just prior to crossing the wall and meeting up with, and checking in with Castle Black. Would be great for all of them to see Benjin. Plus if Pink Floyeds album does come crashing down we need to see some of those guys prior.

    Though i would love if Bran made it to Winterfell this episode and checked in with the tree prior… but I doubt we will be getting that reunion this year.

    Yes, it’s highly likely Brans next exchange will be at the WW grove a few miles north of the Wall. Which means it’s equally likely he’ll pass through the Wall with Benjen and Meera too, given the proximities involved. Brans final scene will be more than simple downloads/flashbacks.

  191. QueenofThrones,

    Is he legitimate Targaryen? Only this way he has better claim than Daeny. From what we know TOJ could or could not be clear cut answered.

    I don’t think Jon will find out this season either way. Before that he’ll probably be crown as KitN. I think it’s not so much about title but it gives him ad Sansa power to unite the North to fight the real enemy. Also others will notice him and give his word greater thought. Daeny will probably unite South.

    Jon could be decalred King of Westeros at the end but not before. Even with this Daeny wouldn’t step asie after everything she achieved.

  192. Dutch Maester:
    Why is everyone expecting something will go down at The Twins? Is this based on more than a desire for Walder Frey to die?

    Because I don’t think he will. Nor Jaime for that matter.

    The Rat Cook story is one of the biggest “guns hung” (to please Wimsey) there is in the entire series. There will be Frey comeuppance, and it will be of epic proportions. (I don’t think Jaime will die or enact the Stark’s revenge.)

  193. Nadia,

    It was so long ago though. If Jaime rec’g Arya what would he do? That’d be an interesting decision to see play out imo.

  194. Nadia,

    Perhaps, but we are teed up for the 2nd part of the ToJ and so many events from the past would be perfectly juxtaposed with the actions the characters are taking in present time. I can’t help but fantasize that we will see all the key moments of Robert’s Rebellion leading up to Ned’s promise in the end.

  195. Dee Stark,

    I think we will see Sam, because his story needs more than the abrupt ending with Heartsbane. Also I think there were some filming news about

    Sam talking to a maester at Oldtown

    , as well as S6 soundtrack has a track named Maester. So I think we will see Oldtown, at least interior if not the hightower.

    There were also leaks about

    Arya returning to riverlands – some even said a wolf pack was involved.

    I don’t know how reliable these are, but if the leaks are false, then BwB will certainly make an appearance in Jaime’s storyline. People keep telling there is no setup or opportunity for Red Wedding 2.0, and yes we have not heard of any weddings at Twins, but I’m 100% sure that Freys and the Lannisters aren’t the only people who are going to be in the Riverlands story of finale. Something must happen.

  196. Tycho Nestoris:
    Dee Stark,

    Queen of positivity indeed!

    Clob,

    Who can recognize Arya’s real face at this point? 1) Brienne 2) Sandor 3) BwoB

    But none of the Freys. Jaime prob not. Edmure no. She’s essentially already in disguise.

    It’s not a case of recognition as much as it is remaining anonymous. If she’s seen doing something, killing someone with another face she just escapes and removes the face. If she’s seen as herself she can be identified as ‘that girl’ and tried regardless of who she is. It’s pretty much the whole deal with the FM, anonymous assassinations.

  197. Arkash: I’m sticking to my theory that Brienne and Pod will meet up with the Brotherhood and the Hound on their way North.

    Oh… good theory! I’ve been wondering about Brienne’s story moving forward. Since she has a Valyrian steel sword, it is logical that her end game will be fighting the WWs. While the ruling class plays their games of power, who is king/queen/warden/whatever, the BWB, Hound, perhaps Brienne and a bunch of stragglers will form their own separate group whose goal will be to fight the final battle. Somehow, if Sam with his sword could join them…… perhaps if Jorah goes to Oldtown, meets Sam and gets that sword? 🙂

  198. Clob,

    She can only use faces of people who have died right? and faces that are at the house of black and white? So in other words not anyone from westeros that we’ve already seen?

  199. Apollo,

    I think it’s Lancel. Loras has the same haircut but different clothes in the promo. The guy in promo has some chains on his shoulder (like the sparrows do). Loras has no chains.

  200. aabe,

    Yeah Sam has to finish his mission and find something important on defeating the white walkers. And then he goes straight back to the wall or winterfell I imagine.

    and somehow Randyll figures into this.

  201. Jack Bauer 24: Season 4 finale had Arya on a ship, I don’t think they’ll do it again. She already booked passage, so its been established already.

    Yes, and her last words were, I’m going home. I’m hoping that we won’t see her journey or even recognize her when we do see her in Westeros. Until she takes off her face.

  202. Geralt of Rivia:
    QueenofThrones,

    Is he legitimate Targaryen? Only this way he has better claim than Daeny. From what we know TOJ could or could not be clear cut answered.

    I don’t think Jon will find out this season either way. Before that he’ll probably be crown as KitN. I think it’s not so much about title but it gives him ad Sansa power to unite the North to fight the real enemy. Also others will notice him and give his word greater thought. Daeny will probably unite South.

    Jon could be decalred King of Westeros at the end but not before. Even with this Daeny wouldn’t step asie after everything she achieved.

    I don’t think we know he would have a better claim than Dany, his father was the crowned Prince or the heir, but never King. Danys father was king. But I suppose it could come down to patriarchy over primogeniture. On the other hand, it could come down to dragons and armies.

    Though in truth I don’t expect to see either of them on the iron throne.

    How long is the finale? Isn’t it over an hour?

  203. MakeThemBurn:
    Any chance for Arya to drop by the Frey party?

    What was the point of Riverrun this season btw? I’ve read the books but can’t remember it having a bigger purpose there either.

    In the show the main point of adapting the Riverrrun siege seems to have been to get Jamie out of King’s Landing for…reasons (episode 10 plot reasons.)

  204. Clob,

    If Arya takes revenge on the Freys, I think she will want it known that it was her who did it, as a warning to let people know what happens when they break the guest right (or mess with Northerners). Her goodbye to Jaqen suggests she is back on full-Stark mode. Once her operation at Twins is successful, she will not care who is after her. And she can protect herself. In fact, most the Riverlands are already with the Tullys and BwB. No one loves the Freys – not even the Lannisters. And unlike Boltons, Freys do not scare their vassals. People are just going to call is gods’ justice if Freys are massacred. If the Lannisters are caught up in it (Jaime, Bronn and their army), then Cersei will do something, but Cersei is also on Arya’s list. Arya is more likely to do something to provoke/hurt Cersei. (I still think Jaime is the valonqar, though).

  205. Ginevra: Yes, and her last words were, I’m going home.I’m hoping that we won’t see her journey or even recognize her when we do see her in Westeros.Until she takes off her face.

    At the Twins?

    I’m assuming that Arya may have taken a Face from the Hall of Faces (you know, the one that may have been where she deposited the Waif’s face?)

  206. Geralt of Rivia: Jon could be decalred King of Westeros at the end but not before.

    I see this a lot and I can’t quite understand the reasoning. Why would the whole of Westeros declare Jon as the King? Do you think he will set out to conquer the rest of Westeros?

    If you are referring to Jon being a possible Targaryen, weren’t the Targaryens booted out in a rebellion quite a while ago? By people who included Ned Stark?
  207. Looking forward to the Stark banners flying at Winterfell once again on the opening credits… I just hope they burned all the bodies ?

  208. Dutch Maester:
    Why is everyone expecting something will go down at The Twins? Is this based on more than a desire for Walder Frey to die?

    Because I don’t think he will. Nor Jaime for that matter.

    We have no way of knowing, really.

    But I incline to think something will happen because their pattern with season finales of late is to stick to scenes that move story arcs along. “Character note” scenes seem to be saved for earlier episodes in seasons.

    With as much plot development ground as they have to cover in the finale, it seems odd that they would drag Jaime all the way up to the Twins unless they had a reason for it. If it’s just for his character development, it seems strange to go there. What more could they do with him in this regard that the Siege of Riverrun didn’t accomplish already?

  209. House Adder,

    Sorry, I meant more like, if she’s Arya Stark, she’s not going to pretend to be someone else. I am not saying that she can’t physically use a face, just that she’d be opposed to it now that she knows her true identity.

  210. AerynsunX:
    ash,

    You can’t just use any face. The body and face have to be prepared by the Faceless Men, as we saw last season and this season. And, as Jaqen said in last year’s finale, it must be done right. Otherwise, there are consequences, like Arya being blinded. There is a way to use a “face” correctly. We haven’t seen any evidence that Arya could do that yet.

    Other than her drinking from the well with Jaqen to remove the blindness when he says, “if a girl is truly no one then she has nothing to worry about,” and in her last scene when he tells her she finally is no one. Yeah, he may have told her she’s not ready between those two scenes and she did refute the statement and claim her true identity. Her blinding scene on the show I think was confusing on purpose to make it really mystically strange for the viewers. In the books the Kindly Man blinds her with a potion, it wasn’t caused by wearing a face. After her blindness is cured she does begin to use faces from the hall.
    I guess what I’m saying here is that I don’t believe GRRM is writing all of this training arc for Arya just to have her completely abandon it, go home and be a normal little girl. I don’t see D&D doing that either. I fully expect to see her use faces even while not being part of the FM and we’ll have to accept that she did fully learn how to do it.

  211. Kay,

    The thing is that Jon might be viewed as the best candidate after the war. Due to his deeds in the war. This what I was aiming for and question whether as solo King or as King and Queen.

    Theme of his arc his duty vs love. He never wanted to be LC but Sam pushed him and others choose him. KitN could be similiar, King of Westeros too. It’s not about what he wants but what he feels is his duty. Of course depends on if Daeny is alive. She could push him to rule with her or others will. Depends if she is alive.

    Either way we got a lot of foreshadowing for him to be a King. Especially in the books, last episode Tormund and Davos talked about Jon not being a King. Which means he’ll likely be one in finale or even later on. He’s King Crow to Wildlings after all.

  212. Demon Monkey,

    My understanding is that the Targaryen succession line is as follows: Aerys>Rhaegar>Aegon>Jon if true born. Dany is not in direct succession, not if Jon is proven as true born. If Prince Charles becomes King then William follows and if something happens to him, George takes over and even the little princess would come before William’s brother, Prince Harry. Viserys thought himself king only because he was certain Rhaegar’s children were dead not because he was next in line after Rhaegar.

  213. Athelstane: We have no way of knowing, really.

    But I incline to think something will happen because their pattern with season finales of late is to stick to scenes that move story arcs along. “Character note” scenes seem to be saved for earlier episodes in seasons.

    With as much plot development ground as they have to cover in the finale, it seems odd that they would drag Jaime all the way up to the Twins unless they had a reason for it. If it’s just for his character development, it seems strange to go there. What more could they do with him in this regard that the Siege of Riverrun didn’t accomplish already?

    I am now beginning to think maybe Walder doesnt die. Maybe he and Jaime’ll plot something huge and nasty (no idea what) moving the Freys to be the next big villain for early next season.

    With Boltons extinct, Essos out of the picture and their villains (SoH & Masters & Waif etc) gone – as well as KL villains likely dead or less relevant next season – maybe the show is going to need sone more from the “pure nasty” end of the spectrum just for all the stories to stand.

    Of course NK may take Joffrey/Ramsay’s place as chief villain – but these little baddies are needed too.

    Jaime joining him will mirror Tywin’s early alliance & together thwyre gonna seek to blunt the Starks before thwy grow too strong.

    But like some villains like the masters for example…maybe the threat to the North wont be very successful for long

    (Though what i wish for is entirely different….Frey Pie and Lannister Sauce – Walder as Nymerias’ lunch & Jaime out of a tower or something…)

  214. George: In the show the main point of adapting the Riverrrun siege seems to have been to get Jamie out of King’s Landing for…reasons (episode 10 plot reasons.)

    Unquestionably partly that – but also as “character note” scenes for Jaime. They have to do something with him, he’s a key major character.

    Riverrun really is mostly about Jaime, at least as it is on the show.

  215. Athelstane,

    Assuming Frey dies this season, Jaime will prob stick around the riverlands next season?

    As a book reader I guess I now know how everyone else feels, I never thought it would be this hard to predict plot lines.

  216. Athelstane,

    I think the purpose for his trip to the Riverlands was to get him out KL. To keep him away during the trial. He won’t be able to protect Cersei. He is also save there in case Cersei does go mad and starts a huge firework.

  217. Tycho Nestoris,

    She will use the no one skill- face swap- to infiltrate the Twins, and she will infiltrate the Twins because she as Arya Stark wants revenge for her brother and mother.

  218. aabe,

    My opinion, but I just don’t see it going down that way. She’s decided that she’s Arya, not No One and does not want to spend her life murdering ‘good people’ because they’re paid to do it. I don’t believe however that she won’t use what she’s learned to get justice for her family by killing the ‘bad people.’ Perhaps she only uses a face one more time ever to go after Walder, but there’s not one single character that wants him dead more than she does and like Sansa with Ramsay, she deserves the kill. She’s the only family that was right there when it happened – watched them kill Grey Wind, watched them parade Robb Wind around on a horse.

    As I wrote just above, book Arya is using faces after her blindness and appears to be much closer to becoming a FM. Whether that version has her leave the order completely or becomes one and goes back is still a question. The path it’s taking appears to be one that will enable her to do her deeds FM-style.
  219. QueenofThrones,

    Targaryen or Snow, Jon is a Stark. As much Stark as Robb, Sansa, Bran, Arya and Rickon. The only difference is that they get their half from Ned and he gets his half from Lyanna if theory is true. What is in a name? That which we call a rose by any other name would smell as sweet . . .

  220. Geralt of Rivia,
    But what do the rest of Westeros, say the Martells, Tarlys, Tyrells, Greyjoys, Lannisters, know about Jon’s abilities in wars?* Why would they care about him or want him to be King of WESTEROS? His entire life and story have been confined to the North. He was LC and couldn’t appease all factions and got stabbed. Davos, Tormund, and northerners support him and he is an idea candidate to take charge in the North due to his honorableness. But Westeros? I find that talk of his “legitimacy”, “harp-in-the-crypt” (:D) etc. all rely on how he might be the “true” Targaryen heir. But the Targs were dethroned, their King and Heir killed. I am amazed that suddenly the Westerosi will want to embrace a “true”, male Targ as a gift from the gods. Now…. if Jon wants to, and marches south with his northern army, then yes, right of conqueror, why not? Just like Robert Baratheon. Or Aegon Targaryen!
    * He was just very badly defeated in the latest battle we saw, and would have died if not for Sansa, LF, and the Vale army.

  221. I can’t wait….I have a feeling this is going to be an excellent finale and in some ways even better than episode 9.

  222. Inga,
    At 1:00 you can see a similar curve in the trunk, and the evergreens look like the same ones. I think Bran is *just* north of Castle Black. You’ll have to watch it on Youtube, sorry -_-.

  223. Danny: My understanding is that the Targaryen succession line is as follows: Aerys>Rhaegar>Aegon>Jon if true born. Dany is not in direct succession, not if Jon is proven as true born

    But Jon is not true born even if R+L=J. He would be a Targaryen bastard, rather than a Stark one. Rhaegar was already married to someone else (Elia) at that point.

    He could be legitimized theoretically of course, but….

  224. I really hope that Arya doesn’t already turn up in the Riverlands.

    Regarding the question of why Daenerys could be so devasted (speculation based on the books upcoming):

    Maybe Theon takes the role of Quentyn and rather unsuccessfully tries to control a dragon? This could seriously jeopardise the new alliance.
  225. Jon doesn’t have a claim to being the King of Westeros.

    You gain the throne through inheritance or conquering it in Westerosi history. The Targs were overthrown. That’s it. The Targs no longer have claim to the Iron Throne.

    Dany will conquer for the throne. Jon, legitimized or not, is not going to be King of Westeros unless he decides to try and conquer the Iron Throne.

  226. Athelstane,

    However Targaryans practised polygamy in the past, so the fact that Rheagar was married to Elia would not have precluded him marrying Lyanna also. Not saying he did, but he might have.

  227. Arkash,

    My guess, Sam bonds with Jorah over the fact that he is Jeor’s son and he tells Sam that Dany is planning to come to Westeros with her dragons, which Sam will realize is good for fight against WWs.

    With Brienne and Pod, Jaime and Bronn and Brotherhood all in riverlands area, it seems likely there will be some convergence here. Since Brienne and Pod just interacted with Jaime and Bronn, I think a Brienne/Hound meetup/confrontation is most likely. Given how they demonstrated that BwoB uses hanging as execution, Brienne could get strung up by them, leaving us thinking she is a goner,

    similar to the books (perhaps Arya saves her later?)

    . But I could also see Walder Frey’s men capturing her and bringing her to the Twins,

    then the Freys stringing up her and Pod, leaving us on the same type cliffhanger as the books or Jaime and Bronn rescuing them then kicking some Frey ass

    .

  228. I think ending the season with Jon crowned as KITN will be too anti-climatic and uncharacteristic of GOT. There bound to be a twist or a cliff-hanger ending for all storylines this season. IMO, and for the next season:
    Kings Landing story will be wrapped
    Dorne/Tyrell storyline will be set up
    Deny/Greyjoy story will take a new turn
    Riverland’s story will be closed
    North’s story will end on a twist cliff-hanger
    Bran will contribute to North’s storyline and will continue his greenseeing with no resolution
    Few filler scenes with Brienne and Sam
    And the last scene will be Arya’s new storyline with a twist tied in with one of the sideline stories introduced this season.

    One of the major character’s who has not been predicted to die will find his demise in this episode too.

    No wall falling this season, IMO.

    And I hope none of this is accurate in the end:)

  229. Violencersei,

    This is really much ado about nothing.

    If Britain leaves, Northern Ireland still exists as a region, it’s not like it goes away. And Britain cannot afford any hit to their economy in that event, including the cash cow that is Game of Thrones. They will 10000000% make it work.

  230. Does anyone know for sure if Fletcher is actually showing up or if he got cut somehow? I’m dying to know. Do spoiler tag it though if anyone has any idea.

  231. Jack Bauer 24: This could be really bad.

    By the time any of the leave arrangements take effect, if that even happens, HBO’s GOT will have season 8 already aired.

  232. The finale might be incredible but don’t put your hopes up for so many things. It’s okay to theorize but my advice is don’t think that those theories will happen. 90% of theories for GoT were bashed and rejected by the show. I say just don’t let the HYPE and expectations consume you.

  233. I haven’t read the comments so apologies if I’m the 100th person to make this speculation, but I wonder if Jaime will decide to turncloak it and kill Walder Frey.

    In the books, Jaime turns on Cersei. It’s possibly only a matter of time before it happens in the show too. Maybe a combination of hearing about whatever fuckery she does in KL and seeing how much Walder Frey is just the absolute worst will push him over the edge?

    Could just be wishful thinking!

  234. Kay,

    All of those factions wil get a lot of people killed. They will look up to someone who was doing good things against Walkers. I don’t think it has so much to do with his surname but rather his actions in the war. At the end of the day maybe Daeny wil llive and ask him to rule with her but if not people will look up to someone with potential and there is Jon.

    People at the end of the war of dawn will be exhausted to fight and no need to conquer anything. Imagine how much of a chaos white walkers will bring and how many thousands people will die, what millions maybe.

    Robert took iron throne by the right of conquest but he build it upon his Targ heritage which is ironic. He hated them but through their blood he justified his claim.

    Yes, Jon got beaten because of his emotions. Let’s hope he learns.

    Athelstane,

    Polygamy was practicided by Targaryens before and Rhaegar was honorable or well honorable person wouldn’t cheat on his wife but he would want Jon to be legitimate. Not dishonor Lyanna. Besides the point is Jon lived his whole life as a bastard and ironic is that he most likely is legitimate and he doesn’t even know about it. One passage in the books say that bastards are not allowed to hurt princes or something like that. It was when Jon wanted to sparring with Joffrey and Joffrey turned out to be bastard. Guess who might be prince.

  235. Alan the Tall:
    The finale might be incredible but don’t put your hopes up for so many things. It’s okay to theorize but my advice is don’t think that those theories will happen. 90% of theories for GoT were bashed and rejected by the show. I say just don’t let the HYPE and expectations consume you.

    A not so good sign for expectations for this finale is the fact that this episode was not submitted for neither directing or writing categories at this year’s EMMYs. While it got in for some techs. I am suddenly not feeling very positive.

  236. We have a synopsis for next weeks episode on our tv in Australia. Does anyone want me to post it?

  237. Inga,

    In the promo we can hear Daario say (and I’m pretty sure that it’s him), “Are you scared? You should be.”

  238. Ginevra: The Rat Cook story is one of the biggest “guns hung” (to please Wimsey)

    Yes, I remember Bran telling this. Such an eerie story, cant decide if I want it to happen or not. Dead Freys, YES but THAT way? Iffy. Where is Wimsey lately? Kind of been looking for him to get his take on Ep9. Haven’t seen him but haven’t checked all the threads, either. Hey, Wimsey, you ok? Taking a break?

  239. Rose:
    We have a synopsis for next weeks episode on our tv in Australia. Does anyone want me to post it?

    Pls, do.

  240. I’ll be honest, if D&D go the

    “entire swath of enemies burned alive in a locked room” route in King’s Landing

    , I’ll be disappointed. I know they’ve foreshadowed it heavily, but THEY JUST DID A SCENE LIKE THAT WITH DANY EARLIER THIS SEASON! I’m sorry, but it’s damn lazy writing to basically do the same scene twice with different characters, not to mention the fact that it wasn’t even original the first time it was done: Quentin Tarantino beat D&D to the punch 7 years ago with Inglourious Basterds (which I’m sure was inspired by something else before it as well).

  241. What is important to the story is not that Jon is a Targaryen ( Dany is Targ too ) but he’s TPTWP the one who will defeat the White Walkers, Jon will never sit on the iron throne at the end. That’s not his story, that’s Dany’s. IMO.

  242. Jinx47,

    We need to close storylines. ending has to be Daeny and her army leaving for Westeros. That being said Jon being crowned KitN makes sense, Sansa Queen too. Depends on what they’ll went for.

  243. Jinx47,

    Perhaps not that much will happen except for Cersei’s trial and some Northern twist and it will all be setup for Season 7. Yeah, the fact that it wasn’t nominated sucks but Hardhome wasn’t nominated and it was the most exciting episode of Season 5; it can still be great but it won’t top The Battle of the Bastards.

  244. Alan the Tall:
    Jinx47,

    Perhaps not that much will happen except for Cersei’s trial and some Northern twist and it will all be setup for Season 7. Yeah, the fact that it wasn’t nominated sucks but Hardhome wasn’t nominated and it was the most exciting episode of Season 5; it can still be great but it won’t top The Battle of the Bastards.

    Well at least all awards pundits are predicting Kit Harrington’s first EMMY nomination this year.

  245. Jinx47,

    Aaaaaaand, I don’t know if other people think the same way but I thought Kissed By Fire was one of the strongest episodes of Season 3 and of the entire show but it wasn’t submitted for the Emmy’s neither for writing nor for directing.

  246. Miss Stark:
    Does anyone know for sure if Fletcher is actually showing up or if he got cut somehow? I’m dying to know. Do spoiler tag it though if anyone has any idea.

    In the finale ?
  247. Jack Bauer 24,

    Still building ships? I mean, a thousand ships aren’t built in a month… But in the end who can tell? Time in this show makes absolutely no sense 😛

  248. I was worried about Jaime; Walder Frey is always very jealous of the richer houses. But I can see he has a plate of food and drink, so guest right should keep him safe. Whew!

  249. Alan the Tall,

    I absolutely agree. Specifically Jaime and Brienne bath scene (though the whole episode was great). It is still one of my favorite scenes from the series.

  250. I think I know the fate of Lord Karstark. I noticed him standing next to Sansa, while Jon was punching Ramsay. Was he Littlefinger’s friend in the North? Anyway, that’s interesting.

  251. I don’t think this is a spoiler for the Unsullied so I won’t cover it. In the books Tywin has a sister who is married to a Frey. They haven’t brought the aunt into the show thus far and it’s a bit late in the game to introduce her now but it’s just possible (slim chance I know) that Jaime is at the Twins to visit his aunt.

  252. All I want in 06-10 is to see The Hound eat every fucking chicken in The Twins.

    And Benjen score a couple more Coldhands Kills. That’d be cool too.

  253. Geralt of Rivia:
    Jinx47,

    We need to close storylines. ending has to be Daeny and her army leaving for Westeros. That being said Jon being crowned KitN makes sense, Sansa Queen too. Depends on what they’ll went for.

    But, why would Jon be crowned as KiTN? Sansa is the next in line since Bran is nowhere to be found. I’m also anticipating the ending with Dany finally sailing for Westeros! I hope to see Arya in this episode, too.

  254. Arya hasn’t crossed anyone off her list this season. Walder Frey is getting it. Hoping LF get it from Sansa too. She finally gets tired of him send ravens with dick pics. I think there will be some combination of him blabbing to her and revealing some of his atrocities to a third party, maybe Jon, maybe Bran through the weirwood tree. Kingslanding may be a cluster, everyone could die for all I know. I wouldn’t care either. The Lannisters certainly seem to be leaving the Twins. Maybe they have Jaime betray them or something. Which would just add to wtf would they do that and have people freaking out about the plot. I’ll stick with Arya being there. What I’m looking for overall is the characters whose arc seem to be at an end in context of the bigger plot and with the knowledge there are only 13 episodes after this season. Tommen, Margaery, Sparrow, Mountain, LF, Walder Frey, maybe Melisandre…..doubt it. Only thing I expect is a lot of dead characters.

  255. Geralt of Rivia:
    Kay,

    Polygamy was practicided by Targaryens before and Rhaegar was honorable or well honorable person wouldn’t cheat on his wife but he would want Jon to be legitimate. Not dishonor Lyanna. Besides the point is Jon lived his whole life as a bastard and ironic is that he most likely is legitimate and he doesn’t even know about it. One passage in the books say that bastards are not allowed to hurt princes or something like that. It was when Jon wanted to sparring with Joffrey and Joffrey turned out to be bastard. Guess who might be prince.

    As far as I know, polygamy is no longer accepted in Westeros. I’m not familiar with the timeline of Robert’s rebellion. Did Rhaegar’s wife die before him? Is it possible he married Lyanna after he was widowed? That’s the only way I can see that marriage (if it ever occurred) being legit.

  256. HelloThere:
    Cersei’s costume is glorious

    Can’t wait to see her wrath in full force… Shes been bottling it up all season….

    Her hair looks really good, too. Finally.

  257. Danny,
    I agree. He’s a Stark through and through. As Ned told him, “You may not have my name but you have my blood.”

  258. Dame of Mercia:
    Will they touch on Rickon’s burial do you think?

    Dee Stark:
    Dame of Mercia,

    it might be more of showing Jon in the crypt and then cutting to bran… very vague but clear connection for the die hard over analyzing person like me.

    I would love it if after Bran’s vision, it cuts to Jon in the crypts paying his respects to Ned and Rickon, and the camera not-so-subtly frames him with the statue of Aunt Lyanna behind him. Or he lights the candle the way Sansa did in S5. And then music swells as the audience knows something while Jon Snow still knows nothing.

  259. Arya hasn’t crossed anyone off her list this season. Walder Frey is getting it. Hoping LF get it from Sansa too. She finally gets tired of him send ravens with dick pics. I think there will be some combination of him blabbing to her and revealing some of his atrocities to a third party, maybe Jon, maybe Bran through the weirwood tree. Kingslanding may be a cluster, everyone could die for all I know. I wouldn’t care either. The Lannisters certainly seem to be leaving the Twins. Maybe they have Jaime betray them or something. Which would just add to wtf would they do that and have people freaking out about the plot. I’ll stick with Arya being there. What I’m looking for overall is the characters whose arc seem to be at an end in context of the bigger plot and with the knowledge there are only 13 episodes after this season. Tommen, Margaery, Sparrow, Mountain, LF, Walder Frey, maybe Melisandre…..doubt it. Only thing I expect is a lot of dead characters.
    Inga,

    I didn’t notice that. When she asks where he is or when Jon is beating him to death?

  260. Jaime at the Twins: could his next move be to march North instead of back to King’s Landing again? His pitstop at the Twins could mean both the celebration of the retake of Riverrun and to cross the river on their way North.

    After all, the Starks taking back Winterfell is no different than the Blackfish retaking Riverrun in the eyes of the Lannisters/Iron Throne. This set up another Stark/Lannister conflict with a future Siege of Winterfell at the beginning of Season 7.

    HOWEVER, things will change very sudden when the Walkers break through the Wall…

  261. Danny,

    You’re talking about being a Stark in spirit, right? I thought you only got to be termed a Stark by birth or marriage. …that is, that you took your father’s name. I can’t recall anyone saying Robb, or Bran, or Arya was a Tully.

  262. Nadia,

    If Jon is proclaimed King in The North next episode, they will rebel against the crown again. The Northerners want their independence from the Seven Kingdoms. I believe Jon will want more to remain King in the North than become King of Westeros. Danny should accept their independence as a reward for their efforts during the war against the White Walkers.
    The only way I see Jon becoming King of Westeros is if he marries Danny. But Danny and Jon marrying and ruling together is too cheesy for GOT. I prefer the former.

  263. Lord Shephand,

    After all, the Starks taking back Winterfell is no different than the Blackfish retaking Riverrun in the eyes of the Lannisters/Iron Throne. This set up another Stark/Lannister conflict with a future Siege of Winterfell at the beginning of Season 7.

    HOWEVER, things will change very sudden when the Walkers break through the Wall…

    I don’t think the Lannisters would ever go that far North, especially not with winter arriving…and, they’ve got a lot of political problems themselves. Anyway, like you said, when the Walkers come, nobody will be thinking about castles!

  264. Brian,

    I know, right? Ugh. Jon might need her again in future too damnit. Anyways I have a feeling this finale will leave me wanting so much more with not much sense of closure.

  265. Inga:
    I think I know the fate of Lord Karstark. I noticed him standing next to Sansa, while Jon was punching Ramsay. Was he Littlefinger’s friend in the North? Anyway, that’s interesting.

    That’s not Karstark, that’s Littlefinger.

  266. jinx47: That’s not Karstark, that’s Littlefinger.

    It’s not Littlefinger at all, it’s some guy with a red beard and hair (looks like he’s holding a bow and arrow) and it’s not Karstark either. You see him specifically when Jon is punching Ramsay inside Winterfell.

  267. Whatever you think of the outcome at Winterfell. It doesn’t change the fact that Sansa is a fugitive of the state. She’s still wanted back in KL for the murder of the King. LF has two options. He marries Sansa and sides with the North, or he kills Sansa and seals his future with the South. I believe, that he has plotted with Walder Frey to kill Sansa(if she rejects his proposal). Walder Frey is going to meet with Jaime to tell him of their continued routing of the Starks. Jaime either gets angry with Walder for not keeping the Lannisters in the loop, or he finds out that Cersei knew of the plot and kept it from him. The back of the head you see walking through the archway in the trailer is Jorah Mormont coming back to take command of Dany’s invasion army she is taking to Westeros. She no longer needs an interpreter and leaves Missy, Grey Worm, and Daario to defend Mereen. Daario is not happy with this decision.

  268. Valaquen,

    Nice clarification cause I think they were discussing two different shots and that archer (red beard) is def not Karstark.

  269. Lord Of Lite,

    The one walking through the archway might as well be Theon because of the way he’s walking but it could be Jorah too. I hope it’s Jorah.

  270. newbietothegame:
    Athelstane,

    I think the purpose for his trip to the Riverlands was to get him out KL. To keep him away during the trial. He won’t be able to protect Cersei. He is also save there in case Cersei does go mad and starts a huge firework.

    Oh, definitely that, no question. They needed Cersei isolated. Jaime had to be sent out on another expedition.

    But Jaime remains an A list character, so they have to do something with him. The Riverrun sequence from the books was grabbed and made into some more character moments for Jaime. Because the show needs those, too. And honestly, Jaime has been a more interesting character when he’s been separated from Cersei anyway.

  271. My predictions:

    This would make a fine finale:

    Tyrion getting a 3 some with Dany and Yara and finally finishing his honeycomb and jackass joke.

    Jon getting named King of the North, killing LF, and Sansa named Lady of Dreadfort.

    Cersei going mad, Franken Gregor killing tons of people, all of kings landing up in smoke, Cersei killed by Kevan.

    Jamie going rogue, killing the Freys then himself after hearing of Cersei demise.

    Arya stowing away on Dany ship wearing the face of a crew member.

    Bran finally seeing the end of the tower scene.

    The wall crumbling down and white walkers riding giant ice spiders….black screen!

    Then boom final view after black screen 10secs….The Hound eating a bucket of KFC

  272. Nadia:
    Violencersei,

    This is really much ado about nothing.

    If Britain leaves, Northern Ireland still exists as a region, it’s not like it goes away. And Britain cannot afford any hit to their economy in that event, including the cash cow that is Game of Thrones. They will 10000000% make it work.

    Yeah, this looks like FP trying to drum up clickbait, honestly (and they’ve been consistently anti-Brexit to boot).

    Look, they’re already about to start shooting season 7. Any funding from the EU for S.7 is already in hand or in the pipeline, so that leaves only Season 8 in any question. And it will take at least two years to navigate a British exit from the EU. It’s not like the vote happens tomorrow, and then on Friday Britain is no longer in the EU.

    And HBO is going to find a way to get the last season of its big cash cow in the can. They’re not going to let anything get in the way of that. And plenty of places will be happy to find a way to kick in funding or subsidies if it actually becomes necessary.

  273. Halfman: Therein lies the $64 million question. While the audience may learn Jon’s parentage, what significance can it have if a) there is no proof and b) only a tiny handful of people learn of it.

    GRRM and the show runners have us all stumped there!

    Bran will eventually make it to Jon and be by his side for the Great War, though I’m not convinced that will happen this season. Until then, Bran may be able to whisper to Jon the same way he whispered to Young Ned. And that might be this season.

  274. All this speculation has me on edge!
    What is the theory behind the caught unawares expression LF gives amidst the snowy forest background in the trailer? Correct me if I’m wrong but that scene hasn’t come to fruition yet, right? Will it follow his scene in the Godswood with Sansa? Could it be Brienne about to take him down after Sansa orders him to, this is the optimist in me speaking obvs.

    I love that Sansa is by a Weirwood tree btw. Could Bran try communicate with her?

    Ugh this is killing mehh!

  275. Flayed Potatoes:
    Mihnea,

    C-Section hype!

    I think they will reveal half of the theory because they only worked at introducing the mother this season.

    Thank goodness we’ll be able to finally see it is a wrinkle in the linen and not a slash. And we’ll end the twins theory. And hopefully the pregnant Sansa theory. Although, like her mother, that theory may never die.

  276. Ultimate jamie redemption this episode? What if Arya infiltrates frey’s and murders walder and then all the freys go to kill her and jaime swore an oath to catelyn to protect her daughters and get them home so he tells his soldiers to kill all the freys thus becoming an oathkeeper while breaking guest right classic jamie duality. Its one of a few scenarios which would neatly tie up all the stories this season. Other option involves brotherhood without banners because they still need to be involved somehow, and it would be great to have the hound save arya or vice versa.

  277. Flayed Potatoes,

    It’s really an absurd theory, and the idea the Ramsay would know about it even if she were is also silly, I think his conversations with Roose earlier this season make it quite clear he believes he didn’t impregnate Sansa.

    Plus, even though the show’s relationship with logic has become pretty tenuous at times, the idea that a child would survive the jump from the ramparts of Winterfell is crazy.

    People don’t understand the kind of physical pain and damage that rape can cause, so they made way too much out of her “I can still feel what he did to me” line.

    Feeling pregnant and having physical pain from possible tears, bruising, etc… aren’t remotely similar.

    It was clear she meant to impress upon LF how badly she had been abused. It would have been a seriously strange way to say she was pregnant.

  278. George: At the Twins?

    I’m assuming that Arya may have taken a Face from the Hall of Faces (you know, the one that may have been where she deposited the Waif’s face?)

    Yes, I believe she’ll show up at the Twins. She could be elsewhere, but that would seem the most poignant given her list, and it would set the tone for things to come with Arya.

  279. Geralt of Rivia,

    Despite what it looks deep down dany does not want to rule and remember she keeps thinking if only rhaegar’s son was alive he could have ruled and I could step down and let him rule..

    After their learning arc’s in AdWD they must end up as jahaerys the conciliator and good queen allysane ….jon on the throne but dany have a say in the when its comes to important things.

  280. News article spoiler and contract-signing spoilers ahead:

    When Sophie played “Two Truths and a Lie,” she said:

    1. Ramsay dies.
    2. Lady Stoneheart returns.
    3. Arya checks three people off her list.

    We know 1 is true and 2 is false unless D&D have lost their heads, but how will 3 be true? I believe Walder is likely to die but Cersei is certain to not, which means the Mountain is likely to not. Even if we count the Waif, how will this be three? Do we even trust Sophie?

  281. Halfman,

    The question of proof is the biggest one to me. I don’t know why anyone would believe this. Dany certainly wouldn’t without massive amounts of proof, and obviously other factions such as the Lannisters (as well as anyone who doesn’t recognize Targaryen legitimacy) definitely wouldn’t care even if there were proof.

  282. Ginevra:
    News article spoiler and contract-signing spoilers ahead:

    When Sophie played “Two Truths and a Lie,” she said:

    Seems like she was either mistaken, or full of carp.

  283. Jack Bauer 24,

    I find it exceedingly hard to believe that either she or Maisie would actually reveal two major plot points.

    I always assumed some or all of it was untrue.

  284. Markus Stark,

    Right, or people are assuming like 3 weeks have passed since she left Winterfell, not like the months and months it would likely be.

    Or that Sansa hasn’t done absolutely everything to guarantee she’s not pregnant.

    Very weird speculation.

  285. Markus Stark:
    Flayed Potatoes,

    It’s really an absurd theory, and the idea the Ramsay would know about it even if she were is also silly, I think his conversations with Roose earlier this season make it quite clear he believes he didn’t impregnate Sansa.

    Plus, even though the show’s relationship with logic has become pretty tenuous at times, the idea that a child would survive the jump from the ramparts of Winterfell is crazy.

    People don’t understand the kind of physical pain and damage that rape can cause, so they made way too much out of her “I can still feel what he did to me” line.

    Feeling pregnant and having physical pain from possible tears, bruising, etc… aren’t remotely similar.

    It was clear she meant to impress upon LF how badly she had been abused. It would have been a seriously strange way to say she was pregnant.

    http://m.hitfix.com/the-dartboard/game-of-thrones-please-stop-with-the-sansa-is-pregnant-theory-it-misses-the-whole-point

    HitFix says please stop with the Sansa pregnant theory. It “misses the whole point.”

  286. Miss Stark:
    Ginevra,

    Manderley!

    Yes, but that isn’t enough. That’s not even close to what the Rat Cook suffered for killing only one person protected by guest rights – and Lord Frey slaughtered hundreds, at least.

  287. It’s going to be really hard for GoT to top last season’s finale, or create the same “Is Jon Snow really dead?” hype for the off-season.

    So I’m trying to keep my expectations in check. Aside from burning down Kings Landing or the Wall falling, I’m not sure what “big event” could happen that would be that cataclysmic? (Question mark)

    While KL burning is a possibility, I don’t see the wall falling yet. There hasn’t been enough to set that up, plus once the Walkers cross, all the other story lines almost become moot overnight.

    My guess is the wall stands through next season (though is tested throughout), and falls in the S7 finale. S8 then becomes all about the battle to survive.

  288. Thronetender: Where is Wimsey lately? Kind of been looking for him to get his take on Ep9. Haven’t seen him but haven’t checked all the threads, either. Hey, Wimsey, you ok? Taking a break?

    He was around this morning in some threads, particularly the Sophie interview thread, but I think another one or two.

  289. crabber’s son,

    Is he though ..deep down he wants the recognition and accepted ..hence the reason he keeps getting this dream about becoming lord of winterfell

  290. Grayven Reyne:
    I was worried about Jaime; Walder Frey is always very jealous of the richer houses.But I can see he has a plate of food and drink, so guest right should keep him safe.Whew!

    That’s worked so well in the past.

  291. Inga:
    Is Ban in the godswood of Winterfell? Can anyone tell?

    No he’ll be near a Weir Tree north of the Wall, possibly the one he touched and had that vision through when on the way to the 3ER

    Can imagine he can still hook into the Weirnet and have visions by touching the faces etc, which hopefully is how we get rest of ToJ…

  292. Mihnea:
    LF won’t die.
    I don’t believe this for 1 second.

    But he will certainly have a aweful day!!

    ”His joy will turn to ashes in his mouth”

    He’ll think he won but then……. Something.

    My theory/wish goes something like this

    LF: I thought you knew what I wanted
    SANSA: I do… you want my hand in marriage
    LF: Yes
    SANSA: I agree, I promised my hand in marriage and I will give it
    LF: **Looks at her like a pervert**
    Robin Arryn and Royce emerge
    SANSA: Which is why I have agreed to marry Robin when he comes of age
    LF: Umm, wut?
    Robin: Yes, Sansa and I have discussed it and while I can’t make you fly Uncle Peter…
    Brienne appears, unsheathes Oathkeeper
    LF gets what’s coming to him

    He serves literally no purpose in the story going forward.

  293. Grayven Reyne:
    I was worried about Jaime; Walder Frey is always very jealous of the richer houses.But I can see he has a plate of food and drink, so guest right should keep him safe.Whew!

    Nar Jaimie is fine, Walder Frey basically fawns over the Lannisters and want the approval of their like given his nagging insecurities over the esteem in which his House is held

  294. One who waits:
    Is The Inn at the Crossroads near the Twins? Maybe Hot Pie and an old friend of his might be in the Frey Kitchens.

    Did Ben Hawkey film this off season?

  295. Laura,
    (continuing your story)
    LF: But wait! before you kill me there’s something you should know.
    Sansa: Here he goes again
    LF: Back when I was a poor orphan your mother pitied but could never love, I ran into a few Children of the Forest….
    Brienne: Can I kill him now?
    LF: And they told me exactly how to make Valyrian steel with blood magic and what really happened to cause the Doom of V–wait!
    *kills him before he can talk about things he shouldn’t know again*
    🙂

  296. I don’t understand why people think Jon will be KitN. Sansa is now lady of WF and possibly QitN. I’m not saying this because I think she deserves it more or because she would be a better ruler but purely based on succession rights: the trueborn daughter is ahead of the bastard son. And yes, if Bran shows up, she will have to back down.

    Furthermore she has LF’s army to back her claim if she (and LF) presses the issue. The northern army seems to be a bit tattered right now. I loathe the idea of Sansa owing LF her victory though I do believe Sansa will eventually kill the scumbag and keep the army somehow. However, that would be for next season as it is too good to be true that LF will bite the dust one episode after Ramsay.

    As to the ToJ, I have a gut feeling that reveal will be for next season. Btw, if R+J were not married, Jon would still be a bastard and Dany would be the legitimate heir to the iron throne, not Jon. However, I presume R+J eloped and got married; it was not an abduction/rape as everybody has been told.

  297. Mrs. Podrick Payne:
    I don’t understand why people think Jon will be KitN. Sansa is now lady of WF and possibly QitN. I’m not saying this because I think she deserves it more or because she would be a better ruler but purely based on succession rights: the trueborn daughter is ahead of the bastard son. And yes, if Bran shows up, she will have to back down.

    Furthermore she has LF’s army to back her claim if she (and LF) presses the issue. The northern army seems to be a bit tattered right now. I loathe the idea of Sansa owing LF her victory though I do believe Sansa will eventually kill the scumbag and keep the army somehow. However, that would be for next season as it is too good to be true that LF will bite the dust one episode after Ramsay.

    As to the ToJ, I have a gut feeling that reveal will be for next season. Btw, if R+J were not married, Jon would still be a bastard and Dany would be the legitimate heir to the iron throne, not Jon. However, I presume R+J eloped and got married; it was not an abduction/rape as everybody has been told.

    I think young Ned is confirmed for the finale.

  298. I’m hoping that Arya and Jaime meet, if only to hear Arya exclaim, “You’re Jaime Lannister, the Queen’s twin brother!”

  299. From all the season (not episode) trailers and previews, we’ve not seen the scene of Littlefinger in the winter godswood and of the Freys celebrating, which we’ve discussed at length. But we also have yet to hear Sansa’s line: “It’s all I think about. What’s taken from me.” We also didn’t get, “the past is already written; the ink is already dry,” but we may never get that line or Sansa’s. And that’s it, I think. This list has really dwindled in the past two weeks. They’re keeping the last episode pretty hush-hush.

  300. Ginevra,

    I’ve been wondering if she says that to Jon or LF. The former would be so powerful as a reason why she was so tunnel vision – I just want them to have a real conversation.

  301. Ginevra:
    From all the season (not episode) trailers and previews, we’ve not seen the scene of Littlefinger in the winter godswood and of the Freys celebrating, which we’ve discussed at length.But we also have yet to hear Sansa’s line:“It’s all I think about. What’s taken from me.”We also didn’t get, “the past is already written; the ink is already dry,” but we may never get that line or Sansa’s.And that’s it, I think.This list has really dwindled in the past two weeks.They’re keeping the last episode pretty hush-hush.

    I’m pretty sure the 3 eyed Raven said the “ink is already dry” line to Bran in the episode where he was trying to call out for young adult Ned. (And where it seemed like Ned heard him and Hodor definitely did later so I think the 3ER was wrong about that one).

  302. Mrs. Podrick Payne,

    The whole point of the TeamStark 2016 Tour of The North was to show that they will not rally around Sansa and using the Vale army to back her claim would be an even bigger mistake as the houses that were just on different sides will most likely unite to defeat what is essentially an invading force.
    Jon will have won loyalty of a lot of people after BoB and him being a “bastard” cant be held against him as the previous leader of the north was also a bastard except for a piece of paper signed by a boy king they arent really loyal to anyway

    Jons arc is going to require that he has power, he will need it to fight the Nights King/WW…to get that power at this point he will have to become King in the North

  303. Mrs. Podrick Payne,

    There are a few reasons why I think he will be king and why Sansa could be okay with it. (this is assuming her Vale secret was just a moment of desperation and mistrust that gets cleared up after chat with Jon)

    1. Succession rights are kind of out the window at this point. The world is a mess after the wars, so many houses have lost the majority of their fighting men, winter isn’t just coming-it’s coming with a horde of ice zombies. People aren’t into standing on ceremony-Glover said as much to Sansa when she reminded him about the duty of bannermen.

    2. The wildlings follow Jon and now the North, on both sides of that last battle, saw him fight to the last man in the muck right beside them. Saw him put other lives ahead of his own-ala Ned and his Stark predecessors. That counts for a lot among this particular group of people.

    3. Sansa has been a hostage since season 1. Why? Because she was thought to be “the key to the North”. And then the last Stark. All of her suffering came from people using her as a pawn to rule and/or gain control of Winterfell. It would make sense to me if that affected her in a negative way. If Jon were king-she wouldn’t be as valuable a target. Now that she’s home again that might appeal to her.

    4. It’s exactly what LF wants. He’d be the stepfather of the Lord of the Vale and the husband/consort of the Lady of Winterfell-Harrenhal is his and the Tullys are gone-so the Riverlands are easy pickings. Sansa is the physical representation of Cat-who he held up as a symbol for years as he worked for what he wanted. All that would be left is KL and the Reach…although you really think he’d know about Dany and the dragons at this point. Still-Dany would have to work with him-because he would basically be in control of a huge portion of Westeros. Do we really want to give him that kind of power? I say no. 🙂

    Bonus 5 for Bran. Bran being the 3 eyed raven kind of sounds like a full time job. I’m not sure he can do the day to day business at just Winterfell with all that going on in his head. I mean, maybe, but it seems less likely.

    When you know about the WWs, you want a leader to bring you through the Long Night. Jon is that leader. Even if he doesn’t want to be. #kingjon2016 🙂
    Someone make bumper stickers haha!

  304. Ginevra,

    We didn’t get “They have no idea what’s going to happen” from Bran either.

    We actually did get “The past is already written, the ink is dry” from Bloodraven in “Oathbreaker”. What we didn’t get from him was “We watch, we listen, and we remember”. While that line was probably cut from the scene in “Oathbreaker”, Bran’s line about people having no idea what’s coming seems rather important.

    It may also indicate that aside from the ToJ, we may get another Bran vision, perhaps of the future, pertaining to what will happen when the Winter comes.

  305. Laura,

    Littlefinger will likely live as long, or nearly as long, as Varys. They are the puppet-masters, the competing narrative representatives of ice and fire. They balance each other out.

  306. Jack Bauer 24,

    I disagree with much of the article, especially all the parts about Sansa’s rape undermining her agency, and how the show supposedly focused too much on Theon. Utter nonsense in my view, but I don’t want to reopen that can of worms ; there is enough hostility and controversy in the comments regarding Sansa as it is.

    But the title of the article is correct, theories about Sansa being pregnant do indeed miss the point.

  307. I’m interested to hear the Sansa speech, as well as the little birds get stabby. By the way, rewatching the episode. There was a good amount of Jon’s army that was intact when the Bolton’s surrounded them and the Vale army arrived, plus remember, Glover and Manderly didn’t join the battle. Don’t remember if they said Hornwood took part. There could still Be a formidable force still left in the north.

  308. lyanna_targaryen:
    I NEED TO KNOW WHAT JAIME AND WALDER ARE TALKING ABOUT.

    The return of Winterfell to Stark control.

    Speaking of the fall of the Bolton’s…I wonder what will happen to the Dreadfort? Who gets it?

  309. Sou,

    Maybe Bran will communicate it through the the weir wood tree t Sansa who was also at a tree? He can talk to people through the tree right?

  310. RG,

    Ok, you made good points in 1-3. However, I can’t possibly imagine the show runners marrying Sansa off AGAIN to the monster who orchestrated the whole mess that killed her family after being married twice to monsters that murdered her family. Especially after last’s year’s uproar. I also think her story arc is about her gaining independence, as you mentioned in point 3, she is done being anyone’s pawn. So no, I don’t think she will marry LF. She might promise him that but beat him at his own game before the wedding, keeping the Vale army for herself.

  311. Of course Sansa won’t marry Littlefinger now, people.

    She’ll marry Walder Frey first, and THEN she’ll marry Petyr, thus marrying into all the major families that have wronged her family.

    That was her avatar path: Lannister (fire), Bolton (earth), Frey (water), and then Baelish (air).

  312. Geralt of Rivia: At the end of the day maybe Daeny wil llive and ask him to rule with her

    Awww…….. I like how you graciously admit that Daenerys MAY live! 😀 Maybe Jon will live at the end of the day? 😉 And ask her to rule with him? Also, I get it. You are basing Jon as King of Westeros not on R+L=J and such mathematical formulae, (which should be irrelevant, right?) but on Jon saving the realm in the war against the WWS. Okay. Obviously the dragons are irrelevant!

  313. Markus Stark:
    Ginevra,

    We didn’t get “They have no idea what’s going to happen” from Bran either.

    We actually did get “The past is already written, the ink is dry” from Bloodraven in “Oathbreaker”. What we didn’t get from him was “We watch, we listen, and we remember”. While that line was probably cut from the scene in “Oathbreaker”, Bran’s line about people having no idea what’s coming seems rather important.

    It may also indicate that aside from the ToJ, we may get another Bran vision, perhaps of the future, pertaining to what will happen when the Winter comes.

    Maybe that’s how we’ll see the NK for the last time this season then? Since it is too early for the Wall to come down, maybe Bran sees the NK and company make it there in a vision? I would be pretty disappointed if we didn’t see NK in the finale. Will they have enough time for two Bran visions though?

  314. Flayed Potatoes:
    Ginevra,

    Unless Arya adds

    then it’s trolling lol

    It’s quite likely that is exactly what she meant.

    The reason she only includes Walder Frey to her list is because she doesn’t know the names of the other people who had a part in RW. But she actually would have all of them on her list. So her 3 kills will be 3 Freys, that’s it (Frey Pies!! )
  315. ThisGirlHasNoName:
    It’s going to be really hard for GoT to top last season’s finale, or create the same “Is Jon Snow really dead?” hype for the off-season.

    So I’m trying to keep my expectations in check. Aside from burning down Kings Landing or the Wall falling, I’m not sure what “big event” could happen that would be that cataclysmic? (Question mark)

    While KL burning is a possibility, I don’t see the wall falling yet. There hasn’t been enough to set that up, plus once the Walkers cross, all the other story lines almost become moot overnight.

    My guess is the wall stands through next season (though is tested throughout), and falls in the S7 finale. S8 then becomes all about the battle to survive.

    Hopefully not as many cliffhangers though. Off season is too long lol. I really think final scene will be Dany and company finally leaving Essos.

    I really want to see Yara and Theon react to seeing dragons for the first time.

  316. Markus Stark,

    That line from Bran “they have no idea what’s going to happen” was from the teaser promo way back in dec, it was not actually from the S6 trailer, so that line may have been added on as a voice over for dramatic effect, and not part of any scene. Bran’s vision in ep 10 will be ToJ related, I don’t really see how that line will fit in. Unless he has a separate vision of WWs causing destruction or something.

  317. Ron: The return of Winterfell to Stark control.

    Speaking of the fall of the Bolton’s…I wonder what will happen to the Dreadfort? Who gets it?

    Ser Tormund of House Giantsbane and his Lady Brienne 😉

  318. ghost of winterfell,

    I hope we do get a separate vision, as I want to see the White Walkers again. I mean we were promised more WW action this year, but we actually haven’t seen that much of them. We only saw them in “The Door”.

    Another thing I’m wondering about, is the scene that was cut from Season 4, and then from Season 5, that we were supposed to get this year.

    I don’t know if anyone remembers the details, but some VFX guy came out after “Hardhome” aired, and said in an interview that the script for Season 4 originally included an extremely VFX heavy WW sequence, that was cut because it was too costly and complex. Then they moved it into Season 5, but it got the ax once again. He later said that this time around (meaning in Season 6) the scene would definitely be included and would be internet-breaking.

    I can’t imagine it’s the cave battle, since that couldn’t have ever been planned for Seasons 4 or 5.

  319. Jack Bauer 24,

    Who knows ! The finale is going to be jam-packed no matter what. I just hope it won’t feel rushed.

    But if possible, I hope we do get two Bran scenes, I’ve really missed his story these last few weeks, and I want more from Benjen as well.

    I would also love to see the Night’s King again, and honestly I feel like it’s necessary in a way.

    We were told there would be a lot more WW action this year, but we only saw them in “The Door”, and then had the wights in “Blood of my Blood”.

    A man is not satisfied with only two episodes featuring WW/wights. A show owes a man three.

  320. Mrs. Podrick Payne: I don’t understand why people think Jon will be KitN. Sansa is now lady of WF and possibly QitN.

    This is just a gut feeling I have based on Jon and Sansa’s interactions this season, and I may be completely wrong come Sunday evening. I think Sansa will expect that being a trueborn daughter, her claim will come before Jon’s. But I think the people who fought with Jon, the Northerners, will declare him KitN. Sansa will go along with this, but in her heart she will be disappointed. This will push her more towards LF, who may offer her his hand.

  321. Mihnea,

    My guess about how it goes down (I’ll stick this under spoiler tags, even though it’s speculation).

    Early on in the episode, Jon and Sansa have their conversation about trust, and we will get an explanation from Sansa about why she didn’t tell Jon about Littlefinger and the Knights of the Vale (it may not satisfy everyone, but it should cut down the raging debate somewhat). The two will “reconcile” and promise to be more open and honest with one another, presenting a united front against their many enemies.

    Shortly before or shortly after that, Littlefinger confronts Sansa in the Godswood. He wants Sansa to be either Queen or Warden of the North. He either suggests that she marry his puppet Robin or he proposes marriage to her himself. Effectively, this would unite the North and the Vale into one political entity that can rival the Iron Throne. Despite his earlier assertions that he wanted to make amends for selling her to Ramsay, he’ll basically imply that she owes him for his role in helping reclaim Winterfell for the Starks. In doing so, he’ll make it clear – not directly, but overtly – that Jon is an unwanted complication and a threat. He already tried to drive a wedge between them in “The Door” with his assertion that Jon was only Sansa’s “half-brother” and she needed her own power base.

    Sansa knows exactly what Littlefinger’s game is, but also feels like her position is compromised. She goes through an internal struggle about what to do.

    Meanwhile, the Northern Lords gather at Winterfell to reconcile with the reinstated Starks (and for those who refused to support them to apologize). A debate will ensue as to who should lead the North – Sansa, the trueborn daughter of Ned Stark who married both a Lannister and a Bolton, or Jon, the supposed bastard who’s also a war hero (despite Jon’s tactical errors during the Battle of the Bastards, I expect the most of the North will respect his bravery and view him as the hero who led the fight to defeat the Boltons. I doubt that the fiercely provincial Northmen will be keen to celebrate an outsider like Littlefinger as their avenging angel).

    During the debate, Sansa will unexpectedly throw her support to Jon, making the case that his military experience and knowledge of the greater threat massing beyond the Wall makes him a more suitable leader in the wars to come, despite her trueborn claim (also, it’s a powerful display of her trust in him). This also effectively undercuts Littlefinger’s plans. Her words help tip the scales, and Jon is declared King in the North. Jon is shocked and doesn’t necessarily want the title, but he agrees to accept it, effectively becoming Jon Stark (somewhat ironically, since I believe his true parentage will be revealed to the audience before this). Littlefinger is furious, but seeing Jon, Sansa, and what remains of the North united, he decides not to challenge them … for now. So the stage is set for the Northern political conflict in Season 7.

  322. AlexG:
    I want House Frey,every man,woman and child, going the Way of the Dodo before his eyes and before his death! The RAT COOK curse falling full power on him and joining the disappeared Boltons,Umbers and Karstarks ?

    Nevermind, he’ll find anothers.

  323. Jack Bauer 24,

    I must have heard the soundtracks hundred times in my sleep ..

    I went into the night thinking maybe they can end with winter has come or light of the seven..

    But when you hear the winds of winter after 2.10 mark its surely happens when end credits rolling ..
    And that 2.10 minutes has dany’s and greyjoyes theme mixed and near the end of the 2.10 mark we get dany on drogon theme..

    So I expect we will be seeing dothraki and unsullied mount the ships and yara and tyrion and theon too and then dany will start the March by getting on drogon with rhaegal and viserion on the tail .

    I can’t wait for the visuals ..if last episode is anything to go by it would be awesome..

  324. Jack Bauer 24,

    I must have heard the soundtracks hundred times during my sleep ..

    I went into the night thinking maybe they can end with winter has come or light of the seven..

    But when you hear the winds of winter after 2.10 mark its surely happens when end credits rolling ..
    So dany sailing to westeros is end scene for sure ..

    And that 2.10 minutes has dany’s and greyjoyes theme mixed and near the end of the 2.10 mark we get dany on drogon theme..

    So I expect we will be seeing dothraki and unsullied mount the ships and yara and tyrion and theon too and then dany will start the March by getting on drogon with rhaegal and viserion on the tail .

    I can’t wait for the visuals ..if last episode is anything to go by it would be awesome..

  325. You guys, they had Jon questioning Mel about just what kind of God it is she serves that brought him back to life only to possibly be killed again and then next week we see that Jon will learn from Davos about the burning alive of a little girl and she’ll say that’s what the LoL wanted so you know that Jon will not want to have anything to do with her or the LoL. What happens if/when he turns his back on this God and thus his destiny??

  326. Kay,

    That would be the final nail in Sansa’s coffin for me. I used to be so insanely hyped to see her inevitable take down of LF at some point, but I now have such an issue with her character that I have to say I’ve stopped rooting for her. There is nothing likeable about her to me, and even if I sympathize with her plight, I’m far too dismayed with the direction they’ve taken with her to really enjoy her scenes in any way.

    They have had her 1) declaring that Rickon is a lost cause without even appearing saddened by that fact (despite previously using his captivity as an argument to convince Jon to fight), 2) sending Jon to the slaughter for an unknown reason (I have already heard people’s myriad excuses for this, and none of them make any sense to me so I’ll kindly ask any who would reiterate them to abstain from doing so), 3) smiling smugly as if she is a great victor when the Vale arrived, despite the fact that thousands have just been butchered, and Littlefinger riding in before everyone (including Jon) was killed is purely a matter of luck that she should get no credit for , 4) ignoring Rickon’s death, and 5) sadistically smirking at Ramsay’s fate despite the fact she has just lost her baby brother.

    If they make her overtly power hungry as well, and disappointed that she isn’t viewed as a great savior and leader, I’ll have to completely write her off as a character I simply cannot care about anymore.

  327. Markus Stark,

    The scene they were speaking of was showing Mel’s true age, most probably. They were waiting for the right time to show this. The vfx guy did not say that it was going to be a WW heavy sequence, if I am not mistaken. All he said was that there was some vfx gag which they were very excited to do, which they knew was going to happen since working on S4.

    Regarding the finale, the only WW action that is likely is Bran seeing them in a vision, imo.

  328. Kay: This is just a gut feeling I have based on Jon and Sansa’s interactions this season, and I may be completely wrong come Sunday evening. I think Sansa will expect that being a trueborn daughter, her claim will come before Jon’s. But I think the people who fought with Jon, the Northerners, will declare him KitN. Sansa will go along with this, but in her heart she will be disappointed. This will push her more towards LF, who may offer her his hand.

    Or maybe Sansa supports Jon as KitN because she sees this as the best way to thwart LF. I feel this season will end with Sansa somehow getting the upper hand against LF.

  329. Demon Monkey,

    I think Danni will step aside, eventually. Remember she can’t have children. It’ll be up to John to continue to grow their almost extinguished house.

  330. I’m worried that the wall will come down or the walkers will breach it in this episode. They better burn the piles of bodies outside winterfell pronto!!

  331. Markus Stark,

    If u want others to stop arguing for Sansa then I suggest you stop bitching about how terrible and irredeemable she seems to you.

    Just a thought.

  332. Kay,

    To be fair to Sansa, and i’m not feeling particularly charitable to her so this is unusual for me, but she hasn’t shown necessarily that she wants power for HERSELF in terms of political power.

    I think she’s wanted revenge and to take Winterfell back from Ramsay. But I don’t think she’s ever expected that it would be HERS.

    From the beginning she did say she wanted Jon with her. He was pretty front and center in the recruitment efforts. She’s talked about him being Ned’s son, even as a bastard, a few times. And she acknowledged that as a girl, she doesn’t have a great claim.

    I don’t know if her ultimate goal has been power. And according to Sophie, Jon letting her handle Ramsay without being asked kind of went a long way for her. I don’t think she’s angling and she’s really pragmatic now – I don’t think she thinks she can rule alone as a woman.

  333. Ygritte,

    I’m of the belief that the LoL is just a greenseer that has reached out to the priests and priestesses whether he dismisses Mel or not doesn’t change his destiny

  334. Alen:
    Violencersei,

    They talking about his son Merret and his ass being stamped by q Brotherhood.

    The White Fawn, leader of the outlaws, branded him with her brand. Who is they and why are they talking about it?

  335. Markus Stark: If they make her overtly power hungry as well,

    Nadia: but she hasn’t shown necessarily that she wants power for HERSELF in terms of political power.

    Replying to both of these points, because I don’t see Sansa so far as power-hungry, or wanting power for the sake of wanting power. But she’s been a pawn too long, she has suffered at the hands of people who held power over her (and who she didn’t expect at the beginning to be cruel to her), so she may want some power to be able to be “independent”, so to say. In the beginning of S1, she didn’t imagine Joffrey to be horrible to her. When she consented to the Bolton marriage, she didn’t expect Ramsay to be a sadist. She may finally realize that by having some power of her own, she no longer has to be at the whimsey of anyone else.
    And… as I said before, I may be totally wrong. Just wanted to explain WHY I think she may want some power.

  336. aprildismay:
    Cersei wearing black. Does this mean Tommen will die? One can hope.

    Considering Tommen is the only character who hasn’t tortured a kitten to death, I find it a bit sad how everyone seems to hate him. Just goes to show how much people despise weakness.

  337. Sam,

    Because LF would win, Walkers will come. Sansa knows precisely nothing about them and neither does Northerners. Jon and Tormund saw them and they know. This is now the most important thing. If spoilers are true, Northerners value bravery on the field more. Actually Sansa supporting Jon would make sense in a way that she would finally put trust in him as someone who knows walkers and what is coming to them. also screw LF plans.

  338. Mrs. Podrick Payne,

    Doesn’t Sansa have the big secret against LF? Namely, that he killed Lysa Arryn. Or did her “testimony” in S4 take that off the table? Also, I’m assuming only Cersei and Varys know that LF was the one who turned over Ned. If Sansa ever found that out…though I’m amazed she was at KL so long afterwards and no one mentioned it to her (esp. Varies who has no love for LF).

  339. Geralt of Rivia,

    Polygamy was practicided by Targaryens before

    It’s been 250 years since the Targaryens practiced polygamy. It was Aegon I’s son, Maegor who died in 42 AC. We are past 300 AC.

  340. Kay,

    Jon already died so probably not gonna die again. This is why I mentioned Daeny if she lives or not. She could easily go in the blaze of glory or not. I hope not but you never know. If she lives, she holds all the triumphs and can ask Jon to rule with her. If not some Grand Council will decide which leads me to LC voting, KitN maybe.

  341. Ravyn,

    Lysa also mentioned before she died that she killed her husband and accused Lannisters at LF’s instructions, and LF admitted that he and queen of thorns killed Joffrey. Plus LF lied to the Vale about where he was taking Sansa. She knows all of this–but still doesn’t know about the gold cloaks and Ned betrayal-or convincing Cat that Tyrion tried to kill Bran so she’d take him hostage which started a war. She also doesn’t know he’s the reason she was forced to marry Tyrion and stay in KL because he didn’t want her marrying Loras, going to Highgarden and ruining his plans.

    He really has been busy the last few years.

  342. Mrs. Podrick Payne,

    Power resides where men believe it resides.

    At this point, with all the chaos that abounds, I’m not certain that people will be overly concerned about strictly applying the rules of succession. At this point, what Lords are left in the North that have supported the Starks – three? The rest sided with the Boltons or didn’t enter the fray. Who gets to decide?

  343. Markus Stark,

    It seems to me that they want to have it both ways … they want Sansa to be a “boss ass bitch” to use Sophie’s words, and yet still a respectful highborn lady who has good motivations but sometimes has understandable trust issues. Whether that is intentional, bad writing, or due to other factors, I don’t know and I doubt we will have any resolution. It could just end up being a lovefest at WF and everyone will kiss and make up with no further explanation required.

  344. Markus Stark,

    Another thing I’m wondering about, is the scene that was cut from Season 4, and then from Season 5, that we were supposed to get this year.

    I thought that was the Mel reveal.

  345. Sigh…season finale already ?!
    I’m going to miss you Jon Snow!

    This is my favorite season so far!
    So excited ( and bummed ) for the finale!!??

  346. Markus Stark:

    I agree with most of this but its a bit harsh to criticize Sansa for finding pleasure at the sight of her tormentor being killed. How is it any different from Jon deriving his pleasure by punching Ramsay’s face to oblivion ? Deanerys smiling smugly while burning all the Khals-even though none had directly hurt her-was truly inexplicable by comparison.

  347. RG,

    Yeah, I hope these plot threads figure into their future relationship, whatever that is. It really shouldn’t just be dropped. I mean…she really has to find out at some point that LF essentially killed her father.

  348. BranTheBlessed:
    Markus Stark:

    I agree with most of this but its a bit harsh to criticize Sansa for finding pleasure at the sight of her tormentor being killed. How is it any different from Jon deriving his pleasure by punching Ramsay’s face to oblivion ?Deanerys smiling smugly while burning all the Khals-even though none had directly hurt her-was truly inexplicable by comparison.

    ^ THIS!!!!! (Where is that pesky ‘like’ button when a girl needs one? )

  349. Demon Monkey,

    What the hell is the matter with you ?
    I didn’t ask anyone to stop defending Sansa. If someone wants to defend her, fine, go ahead. But I personally don’t like the direction they’ve taken with her, and I have every right to say so. It’s not “bitching”. You don’t agree with my opinion ? Fine, then disagree with me respectfully or ignore me.

    You can’t dictate the terms of how or when people get to share their views. I’ll express my opinion if I want to. If that’s inconvenient for you, tough shit. Deal with it.

  350. Re Sansa: I don’t know why people expect her to be sweet, honorable Lady Stark. Hiding the truth, manipulating people to her benefit doesn’t bother her as that expert conning of Vale elders showed us.

    She’s always been the least ‘Stark’ of all Ned’s children. While the Starks are established to uphold honor and family and be ready to die for those values, Sansa has- from the beginning- paid more importance to her own interests, her own survival-sometimes at the expense of family and honor.

    Its not mere coincidence that Lady was the first direwolf to die and it was a product of Sansa betraying her family ( Arya ) and the truth for the benefit of her future husband. It is also no coincidence that Ghost and Nymeria have outlived their kin, as Jon and Arya were established in the very first chapters to resemble Ned the most.

    If Sansa does become Lady of Winterfell, I for one will be very disappointed.

  351. During the victory meal of the Lannisters and Freys , if some of the Freys died and Jaime doesn’t , Jaime will be blamed. He has his army with him so they can’t do anything. It will isolate the Freys. They cant rely on the Northern house for back up and the Lannister umbrella they’ve risen under is no good to them now.
    I cannot see Sansa accepting a marraige whether in name only. She knows what can happen and she won’t have a choice if her husband ” wants” her .
    After this series, 14 episodes left , that’s a lot of drama to be condensed in . Both Bran and Benjen have been touched by the WW. If Bran being touched made the magic at the children of the forest redundant, it must be the same at the wall.
    Houses will unite under a leader they think will be the best , bastard or not if winter is coming .

  352. Darkrobin,

    Yeah, they definitely want it both ways, and the problem is, in my opinion, that both of those aspects of her characterization failed, making the result pretty poor.

    I don’t think Jon will have any problem with what Sansa did. Hell, he’ll probably praise her for it. At most he’ll say something like “You were right, but I wish you would have trusted me with the information”.

    The writers clearly didn’t intend for her to have done anything wrong, they think they wrote a perfectly cohesive story about Sansa being smart and strategic. I really don’t think she is meant to have wronged Jon. Which is a big part of the problem : it’s a completely valid interpretation of what we saw that she did wrong Jon, and for no reason whatsoever. In fact, defending her actions requires quite a few illogical and contrived assumptions.

  353. BranTheBlessed,

    Jon did not have any satisfied little smirk as he looked upon the bloodied face of Ramsay on the ground before walking away. He punched the shit out of him because revenge rage, had blood lust from the savage war being fought coursing through his veins. Jon would never get personal satisfaction out of watching vicious dogs rip someone’s face off. Hell, he didn’t even enjoy hanging the men who murdered him! I agree with Kit’s assessment in that the viewer at the end should be like, ok Jon that’s enough, cause we don’t like seeing our hero turning into a monster or whatever.

    When Ramsay tells Sansa he’s now part of her she proves this is somewhat true by having a moment where she’s morbidly satisfied with her method of retribution as she walks away, imitating Ramsay himself. And no it’s not her fault, she’s had her last bit of innocence destroyed by a lunatic. I’m not saying that Sansa shouldn’t have put mad dog Ramsay down in the same method he used to kill others, I’m just saying that he’s made her a colder more callous person whereas old Sansa would have turned away at that kind of spectacle.

  354. ygritte

    Yeah, I agree that the encounter with Ramsay has possibly left a lasting impression on Sansa. The smirk though is more of a directing thing, I think. Its pretty common on this show, the satisfied smirking reaction of a female actress. The expression of contorted anger works for Jon but for female characters, it wouldn’t look very good on TV. The alternative would have been to make Sansa exhibit no emotion at all, that’s mostly reserved for Arya.

  355. BranTheBlessed,

    “I agree with most of this but its a bit harsh to criticize Sansa for finding pleasure at the sight of her tormentor being killed. How is it any different from Jon deriving his pleasure by punching Ramsay’s face to oblivion ? Daenerys smiling smugly while burning all the Khals-even though none had directly hurt her-was truly inexplicable by comparison”.

    You’re right, the Khals hadn’t done anything to her Dany, but it’s already been established that Dany sometimes smiles smugly while murdering people who didn’t harm her.
    I mean let’s remember than when she got her Unsullied army, she had all the masters of Astapor slaughtered. They hadn’t done anything to her. Yeah, Kraznys was talking shit, but that’s it. In the books, I think she even orders her men to kill every person above the age of 12 who is wearing a tokar. That’s pretty brutal.

    She crucifies 163 masters, indiscriminately, and later shows little to no remorse when she learns Hizdahr’s father had in fact spoken out against crucifying the children she was seeking justice for.

    She feeds a potentially innocent master to her dragons. She’s violent, and she has a touch of that Targaryen madness in her, and yes she enjoys some of this brutality.
    So while her smiling smugly as she burned the Khals didn’t endear me to her, it was basically within character for her, given what has been established about Dany in the books and the show.

    Ramsay’s fate is a different story, but I won’t get into too many of the details because it would be quite lengthy and I already know that literally nobody will agree with me.
    Everyone loved Ramsay’s death. I did not, and I’m pretty sure that I must be within a minority of 0,000001% (or less) of the viewers.
    Suffice it to say I obviously have no sympathy for Ramsay, and did find Jon pummeling him to be satisfying, but I don’t like the writers’ decision to have Sansa feed him to his dogs. That’s the Bolton thing to do, and I would have preferred that Jon and Sansa deal with him the Stark way.

    The main problem to me though is her smile as she’s walking off. Obviously I can understand her satisfaction at Ramsay’s demise, but she just looks so calm, serene, and happy. It feels wrong, tonally speaking, given that Rickon has just died, that she would smile about anything.

    One thing that I like that GRRM has always emphasized in his writing is that vengeance doesn’t always taste as sweet as we think it will, and it certainly doesn’t repair the damage that has already been done. Sansa looks as though all is now right with the world, but to me, the sense of loss and the grief should have outweighed any pleasure she could derive from Ramsay’s death.

    At the end of the day, I don’t like the show’s celebration of blood lust and vengeance (which they have a habit of doing), as opposed to showing the viewers that no matter how bloody Ramsay’s death was, no matter how fitting or how deserved it was, it will not and cannot make up for all the harm he has already caused, and all the pain the Jon and Sansa will live with forever as a result of Ramsay’s crimes.
    Even if she already knew Rickon would likely die, she has just seen his lifeless body. The despair and sadness at the fact that she has lost yet another family member at the hands of a Bolton should be the main emotion she is feeling. Instead, it looks like her savage murder of Ramsay has really put her mind at peace.
    I prefer stories where vengeance is a misguided quest to fill the hole in your heart – a quest that inevitably fails when you realize you will never get back what you lost.

    I have many other reasons why I personally didn’t like that scene (or the fact that Jon appears to have been involved in arranging it), such as the fact that Sansa has probably never seen such a horrific and gruesome thing, and yet she has no problem watching someone being eaten alive. Even if it is deserved for Ramsay, it’s a horrific and disgusting thing to see. You would think she would find the sight disturbing, but no, she seems very calm and content. There is just something off about her unflinching sadism.

    Not to mention the fact that her revenge seems to only be for the abuse she endured. His murder of Rickon doesn’t seem to factor into the equation, it doesn’t even seem to be on her mind at all. The writers said Jon let Sansa finish Ramsay off, because she was his victim. But the truth is, if it’s vengeance for Rickon, Jon has every right to it as well. This indicates that Sansa’s revenge is for herself, rather than for herself AND Rickon.

    As for your point about Jon, he is in a fit of rage over Rickon’s murder, hence why he is pummeling Ramsay. He isn’t enjoying Ramsay’s suffering in the same calculated and sadistic way that Sansa is when she kills him. But this is a minor point.

    The more important point is that even Kit Harington said that if Jon were to continue beating Ramsay, it would be going too far. Jon would be a hero becoming a monster. Now that’s just Harington’s opinion, and it’s debatable obviously, but I do think that is a correct interpretation of how the Starks are meant to behave and be perceived. They are meant to be driven by justice, not senseless brutality, even when horrible things have been done to them.

    Like I said, I have several other reasons as well, but I’ll stop here, because this is really getting way too long, and probably very tedious to read, and like I said, nobody will agree with me.

    This is just how I felt about it.

  356. ygritte,

    I love everything you’ve just written. You nailed it, and expressed my thoughts far more succinctly than I ever could.

    This is also why I have trouble believing Jon would be OK with, let alone help set up, Sansa’s “execution by dog” of Ramsay. But the evidence in the episode seems to suggest he did.

    What do you think ?

  357. White Raven? Mad Queen? #HYPE

    Plus I hope Jaime kills Walder Frey: we are close to the end now, I want him to be more than Cersei’s lover.

  358. Markus Stark
    ygritte:

    Fair points. The smirk is more of a directing thing, I think. Its pretty common on this show, the satisfied smirking reaction of a female actress. The expression of contorted anger works for Jon but for female characters, it wouldn’t look very good on TV. The alternative would have been to make Sansa exhibit no emotion at all, that’s mostly reserved for Arya.

    Re: The Stark way of death penalty, it is a honorable way of dying. Perhaps Ramsay-for the monstrosity and inhuman nature of his crimes-does not deserve that clean death? Besides only the Lord of Winterfell can pass the judgement and carry out the deed ( I think? ) so Ramsay would need be kept alive until a Lord of Winterfell was chosen.

    At the end of the day, D&D choose the route that’ll look best on TV. And the sight of Ramsay meeting his end by the same hounds that he used to slaughter innocent lives gives a satisfaction to most of the viewers.

  359. Woohoo Season Finale!!! Gonna be epic…predictions…
    (although i have been wrong about pretty much everything this season)
    Can see Cersei torching the Faith Militant, SU and HS
    Varys to have somehow allied with Dorne (remember them) and the SS’s end up taking out KL and GMP – paving the way for Dany and her New Alliance (Iron Islands, Dorne, Second Sons, Unsullied and Dothraki) to set sail for Westeros.
    JL, BotB, BoT, Pod, Hound, BwoB’s, Freys are all kind of in the same area and can see some of these characters clashing.
    ToJ has to happen and then hopefully Bran can communicate to JS through the Weirwood trees and tells him R+L=J
    Arya, Sam, Gilly – would just love to see them

  360. dragonbringer,

    Daeny wants to rule and show makes it clear. She wants power and she wants what is hers. Unlike books where she thinks about Rhaegar’s son. They make her power hungry. But don’t think it would work between them and that this is the ending George thought of. It’s an option. I would like to see Jon far away from ironhrone and who knwos if that throne still exists at the end.

  361. Halfman: I see Jaime has no pie on his plate but Walder does!

    LOL, yup!! Unfortunately, Bronn at some point is standing over Walder Frey’s plate…what if he sits down and chows down on that tantalizing piece of pie that is there for the taking? Dun, dun, dun!

  362. I think we have to expect a big twist at the ToJ, same kind of the Hodor twist.
    Now I have to prepare myself to the finale :p

  363. RG:
    Ravyn,

    Lysa also mentioned before she died that she killed her husband and accused Lannisters at LF’s instructions, and LF admitted that he and queen of thorns killed Joffrey. Plus LF lied to the Vale about where he was taking Sansa. She knows all of this–but still doesn’t know about the gold cloaks and Ned betrayal-or convincing Cat that Tyrion tried to kill Bran so she’d take him hostage which started a war. She also doesn’t know he’s the reason she was forced to marry Tyrion and stay in KL because he didn’t want her marrying Loras, going to Highgarden and ruining his plans.

    He really has been busy the last few years.

    I don’t think Sansa was present when Lysa blurted out how she killed Jon Arryn and set the Starks against the Lannisters, on LF’s behest. Sansa heard this, in the books but not on the show, iirc. So other than killing Lysa, the only incriminating act done by LF which she has knowledge of is Joffrey’s death.

  364. Holy crap people still arguing about Sansa?? Amazing….ever since I came here last year, I’ve always wondered how come people get so sensitive over her?

    The new pictures seem to indicate Frey pies?? We were supposed to get a fat northern lord who unexpectedly switches alliances and has one important scene. Manderlys confirmed at the Twins?

  365. My prediction for season 7…Battle for Winterfell 3.0.
    Sansa falls for Jon, Arya shows up and attempts to steal him away; meanwhile the WW march ever onward, but Sansa, Jon and Arya are oblivious as the Dance of She Wolves continues, yet Jon has his eye on a particular shade of Red, stay tuned next April for “As Winterfell Turns”.

  366. This is speculation; and I’m not sure this qualifies as spoiler, but I’m covering, just the same.

    I know I’m in the minority, but I’m not so sure about one theory:

    Jon’s parentage…

    I used to think the Rhaegar + Lyanna = Jon theory was on the nose. Now, I’m not so sure. GRRM likes to toss out red herrings and distractions, (not so sure about D&D), it just feels as if that theory is just, I dunno, too easy.

    I know there are reasons/thoughts contrary to this alternative theory:

    but I’m kinda leanin’ toward Robert Baratheon + Lyanna = Jon. The timing is off, but do we have proof/surety that the ‘Bed of Blood’ was due to immediate childbirth complications? Could it have been just plain ol’ murder? Are there other potential fathers out there?

    I just think maybe we could be getting led down a path and there might be surprise. .. kinda hope so, kinda don’t.

  367. LL of Darkwater,

    Robert and Lyanna never spend a night. Lyanna knew he would never be faithful to her and Robert said she was the only thing he ever wanted.

    George said it many tims that he’s not gonna backtrack from what he planned ad he carefully put hints. Show alluded to only one theory so unless two babies were born. It’s right on the money.

  368. Ginevra,

    Ginevra:
    From all the season (not episode) trailers and previews, we’ve not seen the scene of Littlefinger in the winter godswood and of the Freys celebrating, which we’ve discussed at length.But we also have yet to hear Sansa’s line:“It’s all I think about. What’s taken from me.”We also didn’t get, “the past is already written; the ink is already dry,” but we may never get that line or Sansa’s.And that’s it, I think.This list has really dwindled in the past two weeks.They’re keeping the last episode pretty hush-hush.

    The “past is already written” was said. The Three Eyed Raven line that hasn’t been said yet is “We Watch, We Listen, and we remember.” We also don’t have Bran’s ” They don’t know what is going to happen”

  369. Geralt of Rivia,

    Yeah… I’m thinking that, mostly thinking that… and I don’t think that’s in line with other stuff.

    But I also don’t think that story line would be specifically backtracking (the ink is dry from the hand of GRRM) just…. something nagging about the way Baratheon spoke of her. And something feels as if it’s creeping up behind as a surprise.

    I’m most likely waaaaay off, probably, yeah, I’m sure I’m wrong.

    Still…. nah.

  370. Anon: Some people were speculating that the three trumpet blasts Davos heard while looking at Shireen’s pyre was from the Wall,

    The wall is several days ride from Winterfell. The horn blasts were from the Bolton alliance lining itself up for a days worth of carnage and fun.

  371. Markus Stark,

    You are not alone, I felt the same way. The expression and sentiment was wrong, and her entire arc went on a downhill curve when she threw Rickon under the bus. The Starks in many ways symbolized an actual happy family that truly cared about one another through out the series. The lone wolf dies, but the pack survives. But here is a clear and deliberate break from that – it is more than her being pragmatic, it was cold – normal people fight for their loved ones until all hope is lost. I think I read or it was in one of the producers videos that Sansa isn’t a pure Stark anymore, which puzzled me – especially as I thought Sansa would be instrumental in uniting her family as she learned that Arya, Bran, Rickon and Jon were alive. Perhaps this is what they meant – her connections to her family are not as strong anymore, too much time, distance and pain. She may sill care about them, but just not enough anymore – and that is sad.

  372. LL of Darkwater,

    What Red Herrings has GRRM ever given us? Most of the putative examples are things that fans blew way out of proportion from narrative details of the sort that book authors have to include in an attempt to capture things with words. These have been labeled “Mount Molehills”: that is, mountains built from molehills by fans!

    GRRM’s fans are not alone in this. Tolkien fans and Rowling fans certainly did the same: the latter is particularly instructive, as many of the wildly incorrect conjectures from hardcore fans about how there series were based on small narrative details that were, in the end, just small narrative details, whereas the correct conjectures from normal readers were based on the well-hung guns of the series. One thing that has largely distinguished GRRM from most other fantasy writers is that even the plot twists are set up in advance: when something happens, then you can look back and go, “oh, that is what X and Y meant a chapter or two ago!”

    But as for Robert and Lyanna, no, they would not have been together. And this just gets to the basic psychology of men like Robert. A wife would have been completely different from any other woman to him: a wife is supposed to be virtuous and chaste, and thus should be a virgin at marriage, even with regards to him. He would not have pressed himself on her because he would have projected this onto her.

  373. viki: The expression and sentiment was wrong, and her entire arc went on a downhill curve when she threw Rickon under the bus.

    Sansa did not throw Rickon under the bus. What that shows is that Sansa really has few delusions left: and she also has no illusions about Ramsay acting at all “honorably.” Now, I would not call Jon a deluded individual: but he is a heroic one, and he has a “saving people” thing. As we’ve seen, he will go to great lengths to save someone, and even if he knows that the odds are against it, at his core, he won’t accept that he cannot until he’s seen it’s too late. However, one effect of Sansa’s time with Ramsay is that she now sees it as “too late.”

    But this gets back to the issue of Sansa’s displeasure that they were not asking her about how Ramsay thinks. The mistake that everyone makes with Ramsay is that they assume that he’ll act like a good ex-bastard trying his hardest to fit in with the nobility. If anything, then he should be extra-chivalrous. In the end, even Roose made that mistake. The concept of a psychopath is only slightly closer to being within their grasps than the concepts of quantum mechanics are. Sansa gets this. Jon, who is the bastard working extra hard to be as honorable as possible, does not. (Indeed, Jon’s experiences would make him lean the other way from Sansa: he has found that there is “honor” in people who are not supposed to have it, even if the morals are slightly different from his own.)

  374. I read this recently in another forum and thought it was one of the better explanations of Jon’s parentage, if R+L=J. This was originally posted buy TMZ on Westeros.org. pretty much sums it up eloquently

    Posted March 17, 2012

    To be perfectly honest, I’ve always thought that R+L=J will end up being a deconstruction of the standard “hero turns out to be the king’s/prince’s long-lost son and heir” trope, not a fulfillment of that trope. Every time we see this trope in traditional fantasy, the hero’s “true” identity as a son of royalty ends up supplanting his “previous” identity; he uses his newfound royal lineage to seize the throne and bring peace to the realm, and he always embodies the characteristics of his royal parent, not his non-royal parent. Being the son of the royal family always ends up conveying tangible advantages to him—-we find out that his physical features, war prowess, and intellectual capabilities are incredibly similar to, and therefore derive from, those of the ruling family. Learning who his “true” father is always ends up being a positive, productive thing, not just for him, but for those around him—-the hero explicitly wants to be known as the ruler’s son, and the people of the realm look at each other and think “of course, this hero makes perfect sense as the ruler’s son”.

    But with Jon, all of this is twisted on its head. Jon comes across to everyone that meets him as the embodiment of what it means to be a Stark, not what it means to be a Targ. Jon values the characteristics of House Stark, not House Targaryen. All of the advantages that have allowed him to succeed and grow have come from House Stark, not House Targaryen. Learning that his biological father was Rhaegar Targaryen won’t be a beneficial thing for him—-it will be devastating, because Jon isn’t going to think Rhaegar was superior to Ned, or that House Targaryen is better than House Stark, in any conceivable way.

    And I think the whole point is that, perception-wise, there really isn’t loads of objective evidence that would convince a large number of people that Jon is Rhaegar’s kid (and thus, has some claim to the Iron Throne). Identity, both as a personal construct and as a socially-created construct, has been a major theme of these books.

    Aegon is probably not Rhaegar’s son, but he’s been carefully crafted to appear as such; Jon probably is Rhaegar’s son, but everything about him—-his looks, his demeanor, etc.—are going to convince everyone that he can’t possibly be Rhaegar’s son. If nobody in Westeros has put forth R+L=J yet of their own volition, I don’t see how the word of a crannogman lord and a servant, and without all of the little hints that readers have but which are intrinsically unavailable to the very people that would need to be convinced—the conversation between Ned and the 3 Kingsguard, for example—will have anyone going “of course, this guy who looks like the reincarnation of Ned Stark must logically be the trueborn son of Rhaegar Targaryen!” And this could very well be one of the major points of R+L=J: the idea that perhaps your biological father isn’t the driving force behind your identity. That perhaps this “reveal”, which would be a crucial turning point in a traditional fantasy, won’t actually end up being a driving force, plot-wise, in ASOIAF.

    Jon isn’t going to learn about R+L=J and decide to start calling himself Jon Targaryen, burn people alive, ride on the back of a fire-breathing dragon to roast his enemies, or move into the Red Keep. He’s not going to proclaim himself Rhaegar’s trueborn son and the rightful heir to the Iron Throne.

    I think he’s going to ask Howland Reed to keep his mouth shut and never speak of it again, because Targ blood doesn’t actually give Jon anything he wants—it can only take from him what matters most to him.

    Therein lies the deconstruction: being the long-lost son of royalty ends up being the worst possible thing for Jon, something that injures him emotionally, something that provides no actual benefits to him but which can only destroy the advantages being Ned’s son grants him.

    There are a huge number of reasons for GRRM to have included R+L=J that have nothing to do with Jon gaining the Iron Throne. R+L=J can mean that Jon already fulfilled the AA prophecy in the circumstances of his birth: he was born at the end of a long summer (the 300-year reign of House Targaryen, who originated in Valyria (the Lands of the Long Summer), the builders/destroyers of Summerhall, etc.), while a star bled (Ser Arthur Dayne), out of smoke and salt (the colors of House Stark), etc. If Jon is Rhaegar’s biological son, then whatever prophecy made the Targs believe AA would come from them can be fulfilled via Jon–just with a twist, as Jon descends from the Targs but is not actually a Targ. Jon serves as a deconstruction of the Targs’ endless propaganda about their capabilities, as Jon succeeds because of Stark capabilities, not Targ capabilities. Furthermore, if Rhaegar married Lyanna before a weirwood, then what might matter is the weirwood part—Ned and Catelyn married in a sept, not a godswood, so from the POV of the Old Gods, Jon might actually be the only “legitimate” son of the House of Stark, and thus, the first in line for the throne of the King in the North.

    Everybody in these books loses the part of themselves that they most value—Cersei loses her beauty, Jaime loses his sword arm, Bran loses his ability to climb, Sansa loses her world of chivalry, etc., etc. Jon’s POV makes it clear that the thing he loves most isn’t the Watch, or his honor, or anything like that—-it’s being a son of Eddard Stark and a brother to Bran/Robb/Arya/Rickon/Sansa. R+L=J steals that away from him. But perhaps the point isn’t about learning who his father was (because, in a very real sense, Jon already “knows” who his true father was—Ned). Perhaps the point that’s going to drive Jon’s story arc is learning about his mother, and the point is that Rhaegar wasn’t nearly as important, then or now, as he thought he was.

  375. Flayed Potatoes:
    Mihnea,

    Tyrion Pimpslap,

    Adding these to the collection:

    “They say the king gives justice and protects the weak.” She started to climb off the rock, awkwardly, but the ice had made it slippery and her foot went out from under her. Jon caught her before she could fall, and helped her safely down. The woman knelt on the icy ground. “M’lord, I beg you—”

    “Lord Stannis is marching to a slaughter. So he cannot help me, and would not even if he could.” Alys knelt before him, clutching the black cloak. “You are my only hope, Lord Snow. In your father’s name, I beg you. Protect me.”

    Man, I wish we had seen Alys this season. Her and Wylla Manderly would have been a great addition to Lyanna Mormont.

  376. LL of Darkwater,

    If it’s Robert+Lyanna, it doesn’t make sense why Rhaegar’s most trusted men (and best fighter Arthur Dayne) would be guarding Lyanna (and possibly her baby) at the TOJ.

  377. George,

    I feel like that last one was only recorded for that one teaser, just like Ramsay was recorded saying “Winterfell is mine, come and see!” just for that teaser with the banner. “We watch, we listen, we remember” is probably a deleted scene.

  378. Darkrobin:
    Sam,

    His wife was killed by the Mountain in the sack of KL after Rhaegar died.

    Thanks for clarifying this. Then, I don’t see any way for Jon to be legitimate if R+L=J is true. He’ll simply be Rhaegar’s bastard as polygamy is no longer accepted in Westeros.

  379. RG,

    These are the many reasons why LF has to die at the hands of Sansa. Please, GRRM, D&D, make this happen! 🙂

  380. LadyStark:
    Sigh…season finale already !
    I’m going to miss you Jon Snow!

    Ugh. Me, too. I can’t deal. Haha! Super excited for the finale but I’ll be sad when it ends.

  381. Ramsay is dead, which means there’s a chance Euron will take over as the new main human villain. If that’s what they planned going forward, they might be doing what they did with Ramsay back in season 3 when Joffrey was still the main human villain. They introduced him slowly with only a few scenes, then elaborate din him a great deal in the next season. If this is what happens with Euron, they he Will be set up as a big threat in the finale, just like Ramsay was in s3e10. That can happen in two ways I think. Either he does something horrific with great impact, or he is revealed to have a dangerous plan or weapon. Personally, We’ll get a scene with Euron and Aeron (who’s there mainly for Euron to have someone to interact with, other than representing the Iron born religion, looking awesome and making great speaches). Euron will reveal that he burned the Mereenese fleet, and that he has the dragon horn. Meaning that his scenes this season were merely an inteoduction to him.

  382. Markus Stark: The main problem to me though is her smile as she’s walking off. Obviously I can understand her satisfaction at Ramsay’s demise, but she just looks so calm, serene, and happy. It feels wrong, tonally speaking, given that Rickon has just died, that she would smile about anything.

    I think her smile may have come from the build up of all the shit she has been through, to the point where she has finally taken revenge on ONE of her abusers. And I would also like to add that (hopefully) you have never had to endure what Sansa has been implied to have endured (since we didn’t see ANYTHING past the wedding night thank God), so you don’t really know how you would feel if you finally got revenge, and obviously this is a TV show so its going to happen by Hounds and be super gruesome/dramatic.

    Not trying to change how you feel, just my two cents. 🙂

  383. viki,

    Wow. This is very well written. Thank you. I also thought that Jon would be devastated when he learned Lord Eddard wasn’t his father.

  384. Markus Stark,

    You know, that’s something I haven’t really thought about but yeah, who let the dogs out? How did Sansa suddenly turn into a dog whisperer? Those beasts kind of had perfect timing didn’t they? Just another little detail they leave off screen for us to ponder. I don’t think it would ever be Jon’s idea but I guess if she asked him to do it he wouldn’t refuse her.

  385. no one: Considering Tommen is the only character who hasn’t tortured a kitten to death, I find it a bit sad how everyone seems to hate him. Just goes to show how much people despise weakness.

    I actually like Tommen, mostly because Tyrion loves him. (I love Tyrion. 🙂 ) Also, he’s a sweet, innocent boy. I can’t help but feel for him.

  386. Yeah they even throw a “send their regards” in to get us even more stressed.

    Florian:
    I’m so worried about Jaime and Walder scene.

  387. I have a synopsis on episode 10 on my TV Guide APP

    Tyrion counsels Daenerys on the upcoming campaign; Jon and Sansa discuss their future; trials begin in King’s Landing.
  388. Dee Stark,

    Wow, thanks! The sibs perhaps will discuss how they will rule the north together. (nope, I don’t buy that crap that they’d have a sibling rivalry) 🙂

  389. How do we know the Frey celebration is at the Twins? I assumed Walder Frey had traveled to Riverrun to gloat over his prize.

  390. Dee Stark,

    I am so ready for this.

    Everything is falling into place for the end game…
    and its kinda sad…

    I miss all the characters that we lost to get us here,

  391. Sam,

    Yeah, he’s just an innocent kid. I don’t get the hate for him, yet I guess people are just frustrated that he’s been such an ineffective king. I will be sad at his death.

  392. MakeThemBurn,

    Well, in the books

    someone in the Riverlands told Jaime that Tyrion is NOT his brother or something to that effect (which has led to the Tyrion being Aerys’ son theory) and he receives the note from Brienne to go see her, which he starts out to do. Brienne and Pod have been captured by LSH who is about to hang Pod when Brienne speaks a word to stop her. I believe the word is “kingslayer”. So those could be important things in the books but have not happened on the show.
  393. Wimsey: Sansa did not throw Rickon under the bus.What that shows is that Sansa really has few delusions left: and she also has no illusions about Ramsay acting at all “honorably.”Now, I would not call Jon a deluded individual: but he is a heroic one, and he has a “saving people” thing.As we’ve seen, he will go to great lengths to save someone, and even if he knows that the odds are against it, at his core, he won’t accept that he cannot until he’s seen it’s too late.However, one effect of Sansa’s time with Ramsay is that she now sees it as “too late.”

    But this gets back to the issue of Sansa’s displeasure that they were not asking her about how Ramsay thinks.The mistake that everyone makes with Ramsay is that they assume that he’ll act like a good ex-bastard trying his hardest to fit in with the nobility.If anything, then he should be extra-chivalrous.In the end, even Roose made that mistake.The concept of a psychopath is only slightly closer to being within their grasps than the concepts of quantum mechanics are.Sansa gets this.Jon, who is the bastard working extra hard to be as honorable as possible, does not.(Indeed, Jon’s experiences would make him lean the other way from Sansa: he has found that there is “honor” in people who are not supposed to have it, even if the morals are slightly different from his own.)

    Does anyone think that the Blackfish threw Edmure under the bus and that he is therefore less honorable / his arc is shit? I haven’t seen that.

  394. How should we call Tommen after his death, no spoiler just my opinion.

    Tommen the wise
    Tommen the kind
    Tommen the just

    Come with your own titles!

  395. Blanche Holstein,

    In the pictures, you see Bronn and Jaime riding a horse in armor. If they are hanging around Riverrun, it would not make sense for them to ride out. Also, in the promo for next episode, you can see the Twins from a distance right before the celebration. Could be just some editing, but Walder does not really seem like the kind of man that will travel from the Twins since he distrusts almost everybody, even his family.

  396. viki,

    She doesn’t care about Rickon? Come on man. He was dead already like she said. Trying to save him was committing suicide like Ramsey did. The starks find it hard to put logic over emotions……lead to all their demise really. Ramsey could and would never let Rickon live. He is a true Stark. He is the rightful heir to the north with Bran lost in the wild. Ramsey knows that. Jon had no chance of saving him. When something is a fact, the sooner one accepts that the better they are for it.

    People are trying to paint her as throwing her family under the bus for status. I just feel she has become calculating, and starts to accept things for what they are.

  397. Wimsey:
    LL of Darkwater,

    What Red Herrings has GRRM ever given us?Most of the putative examples are things that fans blew way out of proportion from narrative details of the sort that book authors have to include in an attempt to capture things with words.These have been labeled “Mount Molehills”: that is, mountains built from molehills by fans!

    GRRM’s fans are not alone in this.Tolkien fans and Rowling fans certainly did the same: the latter is particularly instructive, as many of the wildly incorrect conjectures from hardcore fans about how there series were based on small narrative details that were, in the end, just small narrative details, whereas the correct conjectures from normal readers were based on the well-hung guns of the series.One thing that has largely distinguished GRRM from most other fantasy writers is that even the plot twists are set up in advance: when something happens, then you can look back and go, “oh, that is what X and Y meant a chapter or two ago!”

    But as for Robert and Lyanna, no, they would not have been together.And this just gets to the basic psychology of men like Robert.A wife would have been completely different from any other woman to him: a wife is supposed to be virtuous and chaste, and thus should be a virgin at marriage, even with regards to him.He would not have pressed himself on her because he would have projected this onto her.

    It’s not a clue, but I’ve always thought making Ned seem to be the protagonist was somewhat of a red herring. I don’t think a red herring has to be a clue. Just anything that throws a reader off the scent. Something misleading. In that case he has done it plenty of times.

  398. ygritte:
    Markus Stark,

    You know, that’s something I haven’t really thought about but yeah, who let the dogs out? How did Sansa suddenly turn into a dog whisperer? Those beasts kind of had perfect timing didn’t they? Just another little detail they leave off screen for us to ponder. I don’t think it would ever be Jon’s idea but I guess if she asked him to do it he wouldn’t refuse her.

    I don’t think Jon necessarily needed to be involved in Sansa’s plan. He was going to handle Rickon’s burial at that time. All she had to do was go to the kennel master, whoever he was and say “I am Sansa Stark of Winterfell and I want to feed your dogs”, I don’t think he would have been able to refuse, even if he wanted to 🙂 >

  399. Frokkie:
    Gendry time you started to row back to shore mate!

    He’s probably still searching for the end of the world, mentioned by Arya. He lacks a decent education, you know.

  400. Mihnea,

    I say Tommen the Blessed, like Baelor Targaryen the Blessed (a kind, overly zealous king when it comes to the Faith of the Seven much like Tommen)

  401. ygritte,

    Unfortunately, his death seems inevitable. He’ll have to be dead for Tyrion to be okay for Dany to take the Iron Throne (I think). He loves that boy (as well as Myrcella). If Dany and co. will arrive in Dorne, I wonder how he’d react to the news that Ellaria and the SS killed his beloved niece.

  402. Dee Stark:
    Sam,

    I really hope they don’t separate. Please Sam. Tell me they wont.

    I actually don’t mind if they do. All my hype for Jonsa has gone. But it won’t happen. They will probably work out their differences and hopefully next season, their interactions will be less stressful. I expect more Stark re-unions in the coming season.

  403. Wimsey,

    Red herring probably the wrong phrase… I was kinda loosely referring to instances when one really feels as if a character is safe or is really going to die, and the opposite happens. Sudden (and sometimes horrifying) Plot Twists probably a better phrase. Mount Moehills… yep, I get that/those. .. the last few episodes being prime examples.

    I just sort of kind of read Robert Baratheon a bit differently.

    And it was just a thought. Not particularly tinfoil, just a little hiccup of a trace of a wondering.

  404. Mihnea:
    How should we call Tommen after his death, no spoiler just my opinion.

    Tommen the wise
    Tommen the kind
    Tommen the just

    Come with your own titles!

    In British history in Saxon times there was an “Aethelred the Unready”. He was not a boy king though. Tommen is a nice kid basically but not worldly-wise so perhaps “Tommen the Unready” might suit.

  405. Sam:
    ygritte,

    Unfortunately, his death seems inevitable. He’ll have to be dead for Tyrion to be okay for Dany to take the Iron Throne (I think). He loves that boy (as well as Myrcella). If Dany and co. will arrive in Dorne, I wonder how he’d react to the news that Ellaria and the SS killed his beloved niece.

    I also wonder how Ellaria and Co. would react to Tyrion. After all, Oberyn died defending Tyrion in the trial by combat. Would they blame him? They have not really been very rational in apportioning blame for Oberyn’s death. Some tension in their camp?

  406. ghost of winterfell,

    Imagine the after dinner mess that poor kennel master has to clean up, eek. Then again guy’s used to it by now so eh. In Iwan’s exit interview when asked if the dog really got close to him in that scene and he’s like no way, they only would be dealt with by the trainer, they were vicious guard dogs and when they were walked through the set the actors couldn’t make any sudden movement, look them in the eye, etc. I just found that kind of funny because I had read a couple comments by probably lovers of that breed about how they were probably sweet dogs haha.

  407. ygritte,

    The dogs know Sansa, too. Ramsay wouldn’t have have them set to attack her on sight, only on command. And she wasn’t a nice half-dead rare steak like Ramsay was at that point. No big shock that they’d ignore her.

  408. ghost of winterfell: I actually don’t mind if they do. All my hype for Jonsa has gone. But it won’t happen. They will probably work out their differences and hopefully next season, their interactions will be less stressful. I expect more Stark re-unions in the coming season.

    I have a feeling they will work out their differences. (*feeling hopeful) But yes, I got stressed whenever they fought so no more of that, please. Or, at least less of that. I expect Jon and Bran to meet next season. And Jon and Arya. That’s gonna be a cryfest for me.

  409. ygritte:
    Markus Stark,

    You know, that’s something I haven’t really thought about but yeah, who let the dogs out? How did Sansa suddenly turn into a dog whisperer? Those beasts kind of had perfect timing didn’t they? Just another little detail they leave off screen for us to ponder. I don’t think it would ever be Jon’s idea but I guess if she asked him to do it he wouldn’t refuse her.

    Probably the Kennel master? While Ramsay is unconscious she got Ramsay’s Kennel Master to open them.. and cause Ramsay was a little Sh *t and ordered him to starve the dogs he loves..he obliged.

  410. Darkrobin:
    Markus Stark,
    It seems to me that they want to have it both ways … they want Sansa to be a “boss ass bitch” to use Sophie’s words, and yet still a respectful highborn lady who has good motivations but sometimes has understandable trust issues.Whether that is intentional, bad writing, or due to other factors, I don’t know and I doubt we will have any resolution.It could just end up being a lovefest at WF and everyone will kiss and make up with no further explanation required.

    Do you dislike characters that are complex and have many conflicting emotions/motivations? Why shouldn’t she both be a badass and also have trust issues and also generally be good? Why should Sansa have to be either an uncomplicated badass OR a frightened little girl? Why not both?

    See also: Jaime Lannister. Dany Targaryen. Tyrion Lannister. Arya Stark.

    If you want simple characterizations and no character development maybe you should consider watching a different show…

  411. Sam,

    Not that I buy into the whole Robert Father thing. .. but if Rhaegar (and Dayne) didn’t actually realize it was someone else’s baby.

    Just musings. Clouds that fluff through my addled brain in the wee hours before sleep takes over. Which it rarely does, seeing as how until Episode 10 of Season 6 airs, I shall be ruled by insomnia.

  412. QueenofThrones: Do you dislike characters that are complex and have many conflicting emotions/motivations?Why shouldn’t she both be a badass and also have trust issues and also generally be good?Why should Sansa have to be either an uncomplicated badass OR a frightened little girl?Why not both?

    See also: Jaime Lannister.Dany Targaryen.Tyrion Lannister.Arya Stark.

    If you want simple characterizations and no character development maybe you should consider watching a different show…

    THIS!!!

  413. Sam,

    Jon and Arya meeting better be intense ! I am looking forward to all reunions, but mainly Jon and Arya. The show so far has not really hinted at their special relationship, maybe they will once they meet. Sansa and Arya reuniting should also be interesting. Especially if they are accompanied by a scarred gentleman who has a soft spot for both 🙂 .

  414. I am really looking forward to this week. There are two huge question marks whose answers will largely be book spoilers, which I suspect we’ve only had a handful of so far this season. The two questions are who will die when King’s Landing burns, and what the hell is going to go down in the Riverlands. Both have so many possible permutations of characters and dangling TV and book plots that it is really hard to guess. The other storylines seem more straightforward – consolidation in the North, Dany’s launch, Bran’s vision, Sam arriving in Old Town, etc. Of course I’d love a twist in any of these, but am not expecting it.

  415. Sam,

    I really hope they don’t team up with Ellaria and SS. Can’t stand them. But since Tyrion isn’t in communication with anyone from KL he probably won’t know unless they decide to tell him or Varys comes back with the news of Myrcella right? And if they do, I don’t see how Tyrion deals with making an alliance with such people. Something else I was just thinking is about Varys getting so unnerved by the red priestess associating herself with Dany, just what did he think was responsible for her mystical dragons? And surely he heard the “whispers” of Dany’s progression through Essos with the blood magic ritual as well. Wouldn’t he and Jorah have a line of communication or am I remembering incorrectly?

  416. QueenofThrones: Do you dislike characters that are complex and have many conflicting emotions/motivations?Why shouldn’t she both be a badass and also have trust issues and also generally be good?Why should Sansa have to be either an uncomplicated badass OR a frightened little girl?Why not both?

    See also: Jaime Lannister.Dany Targaryen.Tyrion Lannister.Arya Stark.

    If you want simple characterizations and no character development maybe you should consider watching a different show…

    Well said! This is typical of the Jaime redemption crowd.. he can’t love both Cersei and Brienne… maybe he can and he’s conflicted on the issue. He’s done really bad things and he’s done really good things, does it make him a Good Guy or a Bad Guy.. there isn’t one of those in Game of Thrones.

  417. Listen to the soundtrack and you’ll know how it ends. I mean, the last track for the last scene.

  418. Newbietothegame: THIS!!!

    Not this. Depending on what she knew and thought, she is either a dolt with complicated issues, or evil as all hell. Neither is something that is good for the story.

    There is simply no good reason for her to have kept the Vale secret. If the battle had been delayed even a day, thousands of lives could have been saved…and there was no reason it couldn’t have been delayed for one day or a few.

    If Sansa was a general in the US Army, she’d be court martialed in a heartbeat for what she did.

  419. viki,

    Yep. .. this. ..mostly. only thing I wonder about, someone please ‘splain. .. or sum up if there is too much, about the Iron Throne.

    Because, like, okay. The Baratheons are in power. (Okay, theoretically.) And yes, Dany is on her way and stuff. But for now, the Baratheons. So how would an heir of the Targaryan line be next up for the Throne? (Dany and the Dragons – cool band name – swooping in not yet withstanding.)

    Just a distractionary musing.

  420. Demon Monkey: Does anyone think that the Blackfish threw Edmure under the bus and that he is therefore less honorable / his arc is shit? I haven’t seen that.

    Well personally I think the Blackfish threw Edmure under the bus 100% and I am not a fan of his. I also think he’s a stubborn fool for not going north and at least trying to do something worthwhile rather than getting himself and his men killed for no reason. His arc isn’t shit though – that’s just who he is, love it or hate it.

  421. Mawk

    Jaime would then be lead to find some honour back because reminded that he did not keep his promise, so he becomes the instrument of the vengeance with the Freys, and then leave for Winterfell.

  422. Chad Brick: Not this. Depending on what she knew and thought, she is either a dolt with complicated issues, or evil as all hell. Neither is something that is good for the story.

    But the point is Sansa is a little of each of these things and more as well. It’s exagerating to say she’s “a dolt” – but it’s the case that she’s made some emotional/short sighted decisions. Nor would I say she’s “evil” (don’t believe people are “evil” except in rare cases) – but she’s made some calculated/ruthless decisions too.

  423. QueenofThrones,

    If you want simple characterizations and no character development maybe you should consider watching a different show

    And you should consider being as respectful of my opinion as I am of yours. If I wanted to read your every post and post something nasty in reply I could. But I don’t. Believe me there are plenty of posts I’d love to reply to but do not.

  424. LL of Darkwater:
    Sam,

    Not that I buy into the whole Robert Father thing. .. but if Rhaegar (and Dayne) didn’t actually realize it was someone else’s baby.

    Just musings. Clouds that fluff through my addled brain in the wee hours before sleep takes over.Which it rarely does, seeing as how until Episode 10 of Season 6 airs, I shall be ruled by insomnia.

    Ah, I see your point. Yeah, a lot of “theories” have swirled in my mind as well. Thankfully, they haven’t caused sleepless nights. Not yet, anyway. 🙂

    To me, the biggest question is why Ned would pretend to be the father of Jon, risk his reputation, and cause pain to his beloved wife. The only compelling reason, it seems, is he wanted to protect Jon from Robert. Surely, Lyanna will know if the baby is Robert’s or not (even if Rhaegar and Arthur didn’t know). So if it’s Robert’s, she wouldn’t need to ask Ned to protect Jon.

  425. Chad Brick,

    For the love of God this is fiction.
    The whole bloody story is made up.

    But lets humor ourselves and pretend a young girl had to live through all the crap she had to deal with.
    I would see that girl in a mental institution or in need of of serious counseling.
    Apparently none of that exists in this make-believe kingdom of Westeros.
    So she deals with it as best as she can.
    Hell yeah, she has issues.
    Before you judge her on one mistake she made, why don’t we look at her whole life story.

    Just for once I would like to see a thread that does not get derailed by the ‘Sansa is evil, stupid etc’ crowds.
    Take it to the forum and start a bitching thread.

  426. Chad Brick: Not this. Depending on what she knew and thought, she is either a dolt with complicated issues, or evil as all hell. Neither is something that is good for the story.

    There is simply no good reason for her to have kept the Vale secret. If the battle had been delayed even a day, thousands of lives could have been saved…and there was no reason it couldn’t have been delayed for one day or a few.

    If Sansa was a general in the US Army, she’d be court martialed in a heartbeat for what she did.

    Just because you aren’t able to understand her reasons, it doesn’t mean they don’t exist. This is something you should probably come to terms with if you’re ever going to deal with women in your life.

    I think that there’s been sufficient plot, dialog and character building to establish for the majority of viewers why it is that Sansa would withhold her relationship, meeting and offer by LF, and they have all been cited here endlessly.

    It’s not really a question of opinion as much as empathy. If you don’t get it, that should probably be telling you something.

  427. ghost of winterfell,

    Oh, I’d like that. I imagine their convo could be like this:
    (after hugging it out and crying a little bit)
    Arya: Sansa, look! Here’s my friend, Sandor. You know him, right?
    Sansa: He’s your friend?
    Arya: (shrugs her shoulder) Yeah.
    Sansa: Hmmn. I’m actually not surprised.
    🙂

  428. Darkrobin:
    QueenofThrones,
    If you want simple characterizations and no character development maybe you should consider watching a different show

    And you should be as respectful of my opinion as I am of yours. If I wanted to read your every post and post something nasty in reply I could.But I don’t. Believe me there are plenty of posts I’d love to reply to but do not.

    I’m sorry the last bit was nasty – I just don’t think this is that kind of show and was going for a “mic drop” kind of statement to wrap up. I will try to be more civil. Have I been harassing you? I don’t remember replying to any post of yours before.

    In general I’d say go ahead and reply to any post you like. Feel free to tell me you think I’m wrong anytime. :p

  429. Arya’s List (my thoughts in italics)

    Joffrey Baratheon: Dead
    Cersei Lannister: No way she goes this season
    Walder Frey: He’s gone I think
    Meryn Trant: Dead
    Tywin Lannister: Dead
    Melisandre: I think she hangs around cause she told arya they’d meet again. Davos did have crazy eyes after the battle though when he looked at her.
    Beric Dondarrion: Please no

    if I can’t have LSH, please keep Beric aroud

    Thoros of Myr: See above
    Ilyn Payne: This is a wash imo. nice read about the actor: https://www.theguardian.com/music/2015/jul/10/wilko-johnson-interview-ive-got-a-future
    Gregor Clegane: Hmm. I’ll say yes, he’s gone this ep.
    Sandor Clegane: No way, right? He just came back!

    That’s only two and I am not even confident about The Mountain.

  430. Timmon the Timorous
    Timmon the Trepidarious
    Timmon the Tentative
    Timmon the Tame
    Timmon the Tractable
    Timmon the Tenuous
    Timmon the Trepidarious
    Timmon the Temporary

    LL loves alliteration

  431. Mihnea:
    Here we go again.

    There are no brakes on the Sansa train!

    I can see why some of the regular off-season posters stay away from these threads.

  432. Kay,

    I doubt Jon would accept that. I seem to recall that he’s said before that Winterfell is Sansa’s. And I believe that Sansa, as Sophie has said, will have Jon’s back. She won’t turn on him. She’s going to turn on LF.

  433. Sam,

    Cersie… she did kinda go on a tear that time. .. well. .. lots of times. But there was that specific time.

  434. iridium,

    Sophie did say somewhere that “at the end of the day they have each other’s backs”

    ❤️❤️❤️❤️

  435. A flayed man none: Just because you aren’t able to understand her reasons, it doesn’t mean they don’t exist. This is something you should probably come to terms with if you’re ever going to deal with women in your life.

    I think that there’s been sufficient plot, dialog and character building to establish for the majority of viewers why it is that Sansa would withhold her relationship, meeting and offer by LF, and they have all been cited here endlessly.

    It’s not really a question of opinion as much as empathy. If you don’t get it, that should probably be telling you something.

    I don’t feel any empathy for a character who put her petty personal issues in front of the lives of thousands of those following her and damned near her brother as well. Why should I? Either she understood that was what she was doing (evil) or didn’t (dumb). Neither option is good for the story.

    If she tells Jon, they can delay and maximize the chances of pulling the Bolton forces into a Vale trap while minimizing allied casualties. Instead, their forces launched on a doomed Hail Mary mission, only slightly worsened by Jon’s failed heroics, and only bailed by storybook miracle timing.

    What really drives me nuts about this silly subplot was that it was unnecessary. If the writers wanted a smart, good Sansa they just needed to have her come up with the plan to beat Ramsay (whereupon Jon almost screws it up by getting things started too soon and in the wrong position). Instead, there was no plan, just deus ex timing. If she knew when the Vale was coming, she is evil for using Jon and their men as bait. If she didn’t, she is just lucky, not smart.

  436. QueenofThrones,

    Oh… okay. (I was referring to the Loras Trial. I might not be paying close attention. A little too close to home. Too soon. Not the show’s fault. .. just bad timing.)

    And as usual, Helen Sloan’s photos are incredible.

  437. Chad Brick: I don’t feel any empathy for a character who put her petty personal issues in front of the lives of thousands of those following her and damned near her brother as well.

    Do you hate the Blackfish too? Haven’t seen as many rants about him. He put his petty personal issues in front of the lives of his men, the Lannister men, and his own Nephew.

  438. Sansa didn’t tell Jon about the Vale because it wouldn’t fit the now overused narrative of last minute intervention of a rescue party when all hope seems lost for the fan favorite hero. Unfortunately for Jon Snow, second time he finds himself as the damsel in distress in need of rescue.

  439. Chad Brick,

    Um no… Your option wouldn’t work for me at all.. Sansa is no military strategist to lay down plans to defeat Ramsay. That would just be unrealistic. And Jon screwing up because he saw his brother in danger, I can understand. But Jon making tactical errors the way you suggest would be character assassination, imo.

    I did not like Sansa withholding info from Jon, too. But calling her trauma petty, personal issues is ridiculous, I am sorry.

  440. Im in a training session at work and I’m bored. Let’s play

    I’m so over the high sparrow

    My death HOPES for episode 10
    High sparrow
    Pycelle
    The mountain
    Walder Frey and all his annoying sons
    LF (oh please )

    I doubt any of my hopes will come true except HS and pycelle

  441. Also, over 85,000 votes for episode 9 on IMDb and still holding a strong 10

    So amazing ???

  442. QueenofThrones,

    We can come up with as many examples of self-serving characters in GoT, but Sansa will always come up No 1 on the hit list. No point trying to convince them, the anti-Sansa brigade will continue until she dies.

  443. LL of Darkwater:
    Sam,

    Cersie… she did kinda go on a tear that time. .. well. .. lots of times. But there was that specific time.

    I may be wrong, but at that time Cersei is not yet married to Robert. Hence, no way for Lyanna and Ned to worry that Cersei will have the baby killed.

  444. QueenofThrones: Do you hate the Blackfish too?Haven’t seen as many rants about him.He put his petty personal issues in front of the lives of his men, the Lannister men, and his own Nephew.

    I wouldn’t call the desire to defend ones home a petty personal issue, even in the modern world, let alone Westeros. But allowing thousands to die and putting both your own life and that of the only siblings you have left at risk so that you can avoid having a private conversation about an old guy that was creeping on you? Yes, that is petty, especially when she wouldn’t have to mention the creeping. All she needs to say is that she has a good relationship with LF, SweetRobin, Royce etc based on her time there and that they sent a private message to her while she was at CB. She held off responding but know sees the need for outside help.

  445. ghost of winterfell:
    Chad Brick,

    Um no… Your option wouldn’t work for me at all.. Sansa is no military strategist to lay down plans to defeat Ramsay. That would just be unrealistic. And Jon screwing up because he saw his brother in danger, I can understand. But Jon making tactical errors the way you suggest would be character assassination, imo.

    I did not like Sansa withholding info from