The Lannisters march in Malpartida & The Handsome Tarlys triumph in Cáceres

JT1

Photo: instagram/holapipiola

Cáceres shooting is in full swing, and there’s still weeks of filming to go in the province. Only a few days after being recognized, Tom Hopper has been seen again in Cáceres city with his Game of Thrones castmate, James Faulkner. The show has begun a 25 days-long shoot in Malpartida, creating a major action scene for season 7. And today, there’s new video footage of a scene filmed yesterday that’s tied to this big moment!

Spoilers below the cut!

We just found out Tom Hopper joined the show, likely as an even hunkier Dickon Tarly, when he was seen with James Faulkner —And the sightings haven’t stopped since:

Faulkner and Hopper aren’t just visiting Cáceres, of course. They have been filming these last few days at Las Breñas, in Malpartida, alongside Nikolaj Coster-Waldau and Jerome Flynn… and hundreds of extras. Thankfully, yesterday Javi from Los Siete Reinos managed to record some of the filming that went on between the 16th and the 18th:

Apparently, this brief Las Breñas portion of the long shoot in Malpartida concerns the Lannister army marching with their Highgarden booty back to King’s Landing, before Daenerys attacks. L7R reports that more than “300 troops on foot and about 70 horses” are part of the scene as filmed, and that Matt Shakman is directing the sequence for episode 4 of next season. Today was the first day of filming at El Barrueco de Arriba, also in Malpartida, and they will be playing in the mud there until December 10th.

A Thrones base camp full of trailers in Los Barruecos was spotted today:

In addition, Los Siete Reinos also saw a huge green screen on site:

Photo: Los Siete Reinos

Photo: Los Siete Reinos

The cast and crew have three whole weeks to capture the much-teased Targaryen ambush, so there’s plenty of time to make this battle scene a highlight of season 7.

113 responses

Jump to (and Always Support) the Bottom

    1. Could someone do me a big favor and put down their thoughts maybe in a list form, of how this ambush scenario is supposed to play out – I can’t keep proper track. Where do the Tarlys fit into this? or Dany? from what’s been posted, are dragons going to be involved? I have only been on here sporadically, and have lost track.

      As near as I can make out, somebody is leaving Highgarden with wagons of food and supplies and they get attacked, but I’ll be darned if I could say who was running the shipment or who attacks them. Is Lady Olenna supposed to be involved in this somehow? If so, why is she there and not in Dorne? Please get me straight 🙁 thanks

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    2. Leak speculations

      If the ambush battle is indeed in Ep 4, and Jon arrives to Dragonstone in Ep3, then one more crazy thing from the leak may prove to be true: Dany might indeed leave Jon on Dragonstone going to her war with Cersei. Not that I complain, but Dany haters’ numbers will swell immensely after such decision, and though I do understand the showrunners’ intent to show that power corrupts, I feel like they might be going too hard on her. On the other hand, they have always been hard on the characters, so “killing” Dany’s character is a fair game I guess. One way or another she will get her redemption/resurrection.

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    3. Great new videos but can I make a suggestion?

      Can we please get back to debating who has the biggest balls between Jon and Dany, cos I real don’t think we’ve covered that enough in the last 75 threads. Thanks ?

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    4. Apollo,

      Inga,

      I’m actually laughing my ass off because in the space of time it took me to write my comment.. lo and behold, it goes straight back to Jon and Dany. Literally 4 comments in. SMH.

        Quote  Reply

    5. Inga,

      It’s a weird decision but not something people should be hating her for.

      Leaks spoiles.

      Tarlys and their deaths? I can see comments such as Aerys daughter burns innocent, evil tyrant strike again or she’s a Mad Queen reborn.

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    6. Zurik23M,

      If you are THAT Zurik23 on youtube. I love your videos, especially Warriors, War Pigs and one about Jon Snow The White Wolf.

      Hope you plan some videos for next year and befoe Game of Thrones season 7 or some promo for it.

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    7. Why are much of those videos so out of focus? I appreciate whoever took them did so secretly from a distance, but cameras these days have auto-focus and should self adjust when zooming in? It just seems pointless to upload videos of such a poor quality. Would have been better just taking a series of stills.

      PAP4U ought haul his ass and camera to these locations. At least we’d get some good photos to see 😉

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    8. Apollo:
      Great new videos but can I make a suggestion?

      Can we please get back to debating who has the biggest balls between Jon and Dany, cos I real don’t think we’ve covered that enough in the last 75 threads. Thanks ?

      Hahaha … Well said 😀 😀 😀 😀

        Quote  Reply

    9. Matt Shakman is directing the sequence for episode 4 of next season.

      I’m surprised the show runners are giving the ambush to the young newbie (to GOT) director. But then, they did the same with Miguel Sapochnik and Hardhome so they obviously know what they’re doing. It’s also good to know in which episode the ambush will take place, since it helps me move the pieces of the puzzle we have (the leaks and filming spoilers) into a clearer picture. Now I have a better grasp of who meets who when, and where those people will be & what they’ll be doing during the middle part of the season.

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    10. Well at least this will shut Mark Mylod haters up since they were so concerned that he might botch up the sequence,now that it’s confirmed that it’s not him who is directing the episode with the ambush hopefully we won’t have to hear anymore of that .

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    11. Black Raven:
      Why are much of those videos so out of focus? I appreciate whoever took them did so secretly from a distance, but cameras these days have auto-focus and should self adjust when zooming in?It just seems pointless to upload videos of such a poor quality. Would have been better just taking a series of stills.

      PAP4U ought haul his ass and camera to these locations. At least we’d get some good photos to see ?

      Yes, someone should lend Javi a real camera and explain how focussing works 😉 .

      Great job sneaking in there, but at the same time – what a missed chance!

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    12. Apollo,

      Oh my sweet summer child!!!
      What do you know about debating .
      Debating is for Danyfans ,when someone posts “the leaks are true haha” for the first time and people start saying Jon should kneel! Debating is for Jonfans when people say that Jon deserves the throne and he is not Dany’s bitch! And little children are born and live and die all during an argument about “boat sex” , while the shippers go crazy and the non-shippers grow angry! That is the time for debating my little lord!

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    13. So i guess kneeling and love boat are our new favorite words of the season just like last season was agency and the past character assassination ? Oh and let’s not forget butchering and hacks of course .

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    14. Stannisisdead,

      We are the GOT fandom, we are the people who joke about Tommen’s death (King’s Landing) , “for the watch” (Jon shouldn’t steal all these people watches !) and Littlefinger-Varys jetback , of course we are going to joke about boat sex!

      Also
      Am i the only one here who has no idea who Beany is ?!

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    15. Stannisisdead:
      So i guess kneeling and love boat are our new favorite words of the season just like last season was agency and the past character assassination ? Oh and let’s not forget butchering and hacks of course .

      Don’t be forgettin “Deux ex machina” and “Chekovs gun”, and this year we got “Peggy Sue” or whatever the fuck it is ?????

        Quote  Reply

    16. Nice to get confirmation that The Ambush is in Ep. 4. The Tarly boys, Jaime and Bronn, Daenerys and Drogon. Plus Staz Nair’s character. Looking forward to a non-snow, non-Northern battle after a looooooong time.

      Stannisisdead:
      So i guess kneeling and love boat are our new favorite words of the season just like last season was agency and the past character assassination ? Oh and let’s not forget butchering and hacks of course .

      Please don’t forget about last season’s “Jonsa” shippers. I still shudder when I recall the endless Jonsa posts.

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    17. Zurik23M,

      Indeed, if you are THE Zurik23M from YouTube (and I hope you are, as it would be worthy of a Septa Unella “Shame” if you had appropriated the name), your tribute video, “(GoT) Jon Snow||King in the North,” (with over 1.28 million views) is one of the best videos ever to be on YouTube.

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    18. Armin,

      Why is Bronn still with Jaime (Cersei team) and not with Tyrion ? We know he is not loyal and he liked Tyrion more and Tyrion’s team is the one with the freaking dragons!!! Watching out for Jaime because Tyrion aksed him perhaps?

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    19. Konna,

      Last year, a GoT fan climbed up a mountainside (was it 3 miles?) and got a spoiler video of the Tower of Joy fight scene. Believing Sean Bean to be in the fight, he couldn’t help himself from saying, “Get ’em Beany!” Unfortunately, he kept crawling to get closer and actually ended on the set!

      [This, unless they’re old enough to remember the 1960’s cartoon, “Beany & Cecil, the Seasick Sea Serpent”).

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    20. I have a couple of Tarly questions: (1) Was Sam formally disinherited by his father/forced to renounce his heirship, or just privately threatened with death if he didn’t join the Watch? (2) If Randyll and Dickon died, and if there were no longer a Night’s Watch (if the Wall fell), would Sam have any “legal” right to Horn Hill (also assuming that he had not become a maester)?

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    21. With Westworld being a huge hit (bigger than GOT season 1 and better show than GOT has become) as well as Stranger Things and some other newcomers, and GOT s7 being a long way off, HBO must be thrilled about the free buzz they’ve caused so that GOT stays relevant during off-season.

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    22. Kay,

      Do you dislike Jonsa(these nicknames for ships are just too damm cringeworthy, is it becuse of Jon/Dany? Btw Iam not a fan by any means(don’t want family boinking), just curious.

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    23. keltia,

      I know I just meant that HBO didn’t want GOT to get obscured by those new hit shows so they’ve taken steps to create buzz for the longest off-season yet. Free publicity. It’s ‘Jon Snow is deader than dead’ in reverse now.

        Quote  Reply

    24. Konna,

      No you don’t. ? It was a funny little moment in a very ‘dedicated’ fan’s sneak peek. I had to go run to intervene in a feline disagreement and didn’t have a chance to elaborate before submitting, wasn’t meant to be rude! ☺

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    25. So much talk about kneeling and boat sex.

      Have we even had anyone mention the possibility that these these two scene will not be two separate scenes but supposed to be a one scene..
      As in the scene starts with Jon offering to bend the knee and dany refusing it and one thing leads to another and eventually ends with them making love..

      Anyone thought about it this way

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    26. Geralt of Rivia:
      Kay,

      Do you dislike Jonsa(these nicknames for ships are just too damm cringeworthy, is it becuse of Jon/Dany? Btw Iam not a fan by any means(don’t want family boinking), just curious.

      Just curious? Okay then. My dislike of JONSA has nothing to do with JONERYS (and yes, ugh to shipping names). I believe I’ve had this conversation a long time back with you, but I’m really not into the Jon/Daenerys shipping AND I don’t see them as endgame (however, unlike you, I don’t see the medieval dies-in-childbirth ending for Daenerys either). I’d much rather see what Jon the man achieves in the end, than have him be some kind of a special-snowflake prize for one of the star-struck females in the show.
      By the way, your question raises one of my own. Does every fan HAVE to be into shipping Jon with someone or the other? If it isn’t Jonsa, does it have to be Jonerys, or Jonya? 😉 If so, then I vote for Jonsei (Jon + Cersei), the King in the North with the Queen in the South! YAY!!! 😀

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    27. konna:
      Stannisisdead,

      We are the GOT fandom, we are the people who joke about Tommen’s death (King’s Landing) , “for the watch” (Jon shouldn’t steal all these people watches !) and Littlefinger-Varys jetback, of course we are going to joke about boat sex!

      Also
      Am i the only one here who has no idea who Beany is ?!

      I have no idea about be any either.
      By the time I get to the bottom I expect I will .

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    28. Thronetender: No,I don’t either.

      To add a ‘y’ (or ‘ey’ or ‘ie’) to a person’s surname (in the UK) as a nickname is quite common? It can’t be added to all surnames unless it sounds right. The British actor Sean Bean who played Ned Stark in S1 being called Beany in this case. Another example is my surname is Mills and close friends often call me Millsey 😉

      The guy who was secretly filming the ‘Tower of Joy’ scene last year (much to the displeasure of B&W when that clip was leaked) thought that Sean Bean had been re-cast to play Ned Stark and not a younger actor. So when the action started he shouted “Come on Beany!” as if to give him moral support – Its as simple as that 🙂

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    29. Apollo: Don’t be forgettin “Deux ex machina” and “Chekovs gun”, and this year we got “Peggy Sue” or whatever the fuck it is ?????

      Peggy Sue was a rock n’roll song from the 1950’s recorded by Buddy Holly
      “If you knew Peggy Sue, then you know why I feel blue, ’bout Peggy – my Peggy Sue-ooo – etc, etc LMAO hehe 😀

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    30. Thronetender,
      Hi TT *waving*. Hadn’t seen your name for a while, I thought you might be one of those who are avoiding the site because of leak discussion. Talking of which as far as I know the ambush is something like this. The bits in italics are from the spoilers, the rest is speculation by me or that I’ve read. Fellow spoiler readers please correct anything I got wrong or missed out. There was so much info in the spoilers I can’t recall all of it and although most of it was from one person I think others joined in and there is less certainty that they were genuine:

      LEAKED SPOILER INFO

      Jaime and the Lannsiter army attack Highgarden. Exactly why we don’t know, it might be because the Iron Bank are demanding their due, or just because they can. Someone suggested Cersei convinces Jaime that the Tyrells destroyed the Sept and Tommen’s death is their fault. Olenna is at HG and confesses to killing Joffrey. We don’t know if she implicates LF in this. Jaime allows Olenna to drink poison and kill herself.

      This ambush is on the way back from HG. Bronn is with them at this point, it’s not clear if he is at HG or joins later. The wagon train of loot is attacked by Dany and at least one dragon. Presumably she has at least some of her army with her, but I don’t think there has been any mention of who else from her side is there. Randyll and Dickon Tarly are there too but we don’t know what they have been up to before this. We don’t know how they fit in but it’s been speculated they do a Roose Bolton and strike a deal with the Lannisters to betray House Tyrell. Dany burns them both alive, presumably using a dragon.

      Jaime tries to attack the dragon but is grabbed (saved) by Bronn, who I think pulls them both into water, I assume to avoid fire? I know there was speculation that a major character fell into water which was then discounted, but I’m pretty sure that’s what the leak said and they did film some stuff in a swimming pool. Also the Lannisters have an anti-dragon weapon of some kind designed by Qyburn and I think it has a name like “The Scorpion” or something? No idea if it gets used.

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    31. dragonbringer,

      I don’t think so, it would have to be two separate scenes otherwise an even bigger shitstorm would start between the fandoms saying they fucked because he kneeled or something which will not be the case at all.
      We know that chronologically he

      comforts her over the loss of Viserion and tries to kneel while still at Eastwatch after the whole wight disaster and the love boat takes place at the very end of the season, after they’ve shown the wight at the Dragonpit and after Dany sends her army North.

      But none of that is confirmed now so nevermind.

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    32. Apollo:
      Inga,

      I’m actually laughing my ass off because in the space of time it took me to write my comment.. lo and behold, it goes straight back to Jon and Dany. Literally 4 comments in. SMH.

      Yeah, this whole fucking Jon/Dany debate is getting on my tits! However, it would cool if in this so called ‘Love Boat’ sex scene, when they reach orgasm and Jon ‘shoots his packet’ up Dany the ice wall comes tumbling down as the next shot – Now that really would show the REAL POWER of King’s blood – hehe 😀

      Although I’m not a book reader, I’ll be glad when GRRM finally brings out the WoW? Just to give the fandom the chance to pump out their vitriol between the differences between the book ‘canon’ and the TV show rather than speculating on all the other shite that’s been permeating throughout each thread over the last few weeks due to leaks and spoilers!

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    33. Lulus Mum: Talking of which as far as I know the ambush is something like this. The bits in italics are from the spoilers, the rest is speculation by me or that I’ve read

      Oh dear girl, HELLO. It’s always a pleasure to see you on here, too! and thank you for responding to this. It cleared some things up for me so that I understand better what the other posters are talking about. I had a lot of other stuff going on and just didn’t get here the way I used to, and didn’t have the time to go back and read all the posts, so I got a little lost. I usually try to respond with at least one post once a day. Again, always glad to see you.

      No, I can’t avoid the spoilers the way Dee and some others do, I read them, then usually wish I hadn’t but still read the next ones. It does help keep me connected to and interested in the show. I’ve stopped watching other series when their new seasons have been delayed a long time.

      Some years ago, there was a writers’ strike in the States, and the new season of shows was delayed for months. I found other things to fill in the time between, and when the season restarted, I just didn’t go back to watching some of the shows that I had followed. Either the network had changed the airing time, or day of broadcast, or whatever, but I just stopped. Granted, I wasn’t nearly as invested in those network shows as I am GoT, but I have to think a great part of my interest continues because of regularly visiting this site, and learning what’s going on.

      All that being said, what you wrote about the ambush clears up some stuff. I do remember reading about Olenna and responded that day:

      some of the posters couldn’t believe that she would kill herself or implicate herself in Joffrey’s death. I could absolutely see her preparing herself for suicide when word of an attack on Highgarden reached her. Much like Cersei prepared for hers and Tommen’s deaths during the Battle of Blackwater. Olenna would know that Cersei would do horrible things to her, and would much rather die by her own hand than go back to KL to face that.

      As far as telling Jaime about her hand in Joffrey’s death, I think that doing that would be her last great pleasure, since Jaime probably would show her no mercy. Especially not if he was convinced the Tyrells had something to do with Tommen’s death. I hadn’t read or heard that before. Anyway, she’d delight in telling him what a horrible father he’d been, and what an even worse King’s Guard. She’d rub in that Joffrey was killed under Jaime’s nose, so was Myrcella. Now, those are my own thoughts, I have no idea if that’s what will happen, it’s just how I envisioned it going. Maybe her death will be off-camera, like the Blackfish. Or Jaime will scour Highgarden and find her dead. But she was a main character for so long, it seems the writers would want to give her one last, grand mouthy, Olenna style send-off before she bites the dust.

      Stay well Mum. Smiles and good wishes to you 🙂

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    34. Lulus Mum: Fellow spoiler readers please correct anything I got wrong or missed out. There was so much info in the spoilers I can’t recall all of it and although most of it was from one person I think

      On rereading what you wrote about the ambush (thanks again) I saw what u put about Randyll and Dickon.

      oh drat, even though I don’t like Randyll, I kind of liked the idea of him roaming around for at least a while longer. And I was sure that Dickon 2.0 was going to be saved. I already had in mind a whole courtship of Sansa. Rats. Yeah, they probably will be dragon toast. The anti-dragon machine sounds interesting, but I will hate seeing a dragon go down.

      How much longer until the season starts? Sigh, well at least we have the holidays to keep us busy, but that time from January on until, what did they say, JULY? ye gods, that’s going to be ratty to get through.

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    35. Lulus Mum,

      Jaime attacks Highgarden because they declared war against his family and because he needs the food. He doesnt need any other reason..if we are on ep 4 Dany has already attacked.

      He was sure Sansa killed Joffrey but send Brienne after her to protect her. Allowing Olenna do die with dignity and when she wants shows that he doesnt have that strong revenge feelings. Olenna is alone and old. She lost the war she started and doesnt want to be hostage or kneel to Cersei. It will be great scene…[\spoiler]
      Tarlys didnt take part in the castle shooting,so maybe that means they join them after Olenna’s death.
      [spoiler] She has the Dothraki with them

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    36. Kay,

      Usually, I’ve seen wars of Jonsa and Jonerys shippers going at it and insulting each other. Who’s ship is superior.

      Jon and Cersei? Just imagine hilarity of their conversations. Cersei would start drinking wine in gallons. I love Jon too much for that. 😀

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    37. Geralt of Rivia,

      Jon and Cersei?! I ship it!

      (This is my attempt to unite the Jonsa and Jonaerys shippers in mutual loathing of my new Jonsei ship.)

      For the record, if what I’ve heard of the Winterfell storyline is true, I’m looking forward to it, and I hope it gets a decent amount of screentime.

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    38. Lulus Mum,

      I looked at the top of this feature – then unusually for me applied some willpower and scrolled down to the comments without reading the comments and have managed not to click on the greyed out portions. I want to be surprised next season to some extent at least. I think I can say this without being spoilery – in the books Dany receives a prophecy among other things that she will ride 3 mounts…the last one being “one to love” and there is some speculation that the “one to love” might be Jon Snow. So there is some book hinting that they might be attracted when and if they finally meet…but then GRRM does love his red herrings* .

      For the people who hate “Jonsa” as a term – is it any worse than “Sansan” – which really drives me bananas. I know book Hound is younger than show Hound but I really don’t like the idea of them as a couple.

      Incidentally, there is one YouTuber who has put out some YouTubes with alternate actors to play certain roles. Now myself I never had a problem with Mark Addy as Robert but Rory McCann (who isn’t that bad looking in real life) has the height to be book Robert.

      * Just in case anybody for whom English isn’t a first language reads this and is wondering about the meaning – a ‘red herring’ of course has the literal meaning of a dried smoked herring turned that colour by the smoke but has another meaning to quote the Oxford Dictionary “A clue or piece of information which is or is intended to be misleading or distracting”. That’s probably the more common use of the expression in modern English – a smoked herring in England (can’t speak for Scotland or Wales – or other English speaking nations) at least tends to be called a “kipper”.

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    39. There were rumours about sex scene with Grey worm and Missandei. Well, guess what. We know no sex scene in the North, but the sex scene with Dany and Jon.

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    40. Thronetender,
      S7 leaks:

      I don’t know, I can’t see Olenna going out in a vengeful spirit, at least not once she’s fully accepted her defeat and faced Jaime. Yes she declared war on his entire family and they are enemies but she was never directly antagonized by him nor has he personally ever given her cause for cruelty (Cersei would be a different story).

      I think she deserves a more dignified and meaningful end. Perhaps even exiting with some words of wisdom. Reflecting with Jaime on the suffering their ambitions and power struggles have brought them. After all, they both lost their entire families in the conflict. She might even point out his relationship with Cersei isn’t what he thinks it is as Jaime probably needs some extra groundwork for his eventual break with Cersei later in the season anyway.

      Of course, that is if there’s still any skill to their writing. If they go the cartoony route they so excelled at this past season, they might just choose a tacky clash instead. Because who cares about subtlety and poignancy when the masses cry out for loud spectacles.

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    41. Kosten,

      I didn’t read the greyed out part of your comment. I think you are being somewhat hard on “the masses”. Earlier (when the show still had existing novels by GRRM to work from but a more constrained budget) some people complained that the battle scenes were not spectacular enough or that they took place offscreen (the battle involving Jaime’s capture for example- the one at the Whispering Wood not the one when Brienne was accompanying him to Kings Landing) – now there are complaints that the clashes are too spectacular. Of course, whether you like a season or not is a personal reaction. I didn’t dislike season 6 the way you obviously did and while I don’t claim to be the female equivalent of Einstein I hope am a reasonably intelligent layperson so trust you’ll have enough courtesy not to dismiss me as a “fangurl” who is incapable of independent thought. There have been some aspects of the adaptation I’ve not been happy with but I’d say find more positive than negative on average. I don’t think if I were a screenplay writer I would ever take on the dramatisation of an unfinished series of novels (and I bet D&D don’t ever again after all the flack they’ve received from some people). Having said that I don’t want to come across as being discourteous to you.

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    42. Emma,

      I think the fact that Martin went out of his to show in the books and to discuss in various interviews the fact that incest between ‘royals’ only ends with death and destruction for the ‘little people’ has many of us now going WTF? What was all that talk for if you are just going to end up have the two so called ‘heroes’ of the story doing the exact same thing. Break the wheel how? By replacing Lannister incest with more Targ incest? It’s not the actors, it’s not the incest per say – it’s the storyline itself and his comments that led us to believe that the story would end another way and now we see the wheel is just going to keep going around. The idiots will keep ruling and produce more idiot children while those that really should be ruling – like Tyrion- get sidelined bowing and scraping and cleaning up after the messes the spoiled royals make. Maybe that will be the start of another series – Tyrion Strikes Back!

      Very disappointing for long time fans of the books. It is what it is but being a democracy we have the right to protest the ruination of what potentially could have been a better lead up to the end.

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    43. Dame of Mercia,

      That has got to be the nicest reply I’ve ever read, I would not dream of dismissing you as a fangurl.

      I wasn’t really refering to battles and action scenes specificially although they still make for a valid argument.
      Never really minded the absence of large-scale battles in the early seasons but I more than welcomed them later on in the show – it was a great addition as long as it didn’t deter storytelling.

      Sadly, I now feel the story began to suffer at the expense of spectacle and shock value – large scale battles and action sequences being only a small portion of the problem.

      Still, season 6 may well have been just a anomaly. There’s still two seasons and ample time left for the show to dispel my concerns and prove its quality.

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    44. Kathy:
      Emma,
      Very disappointing for long time fans of the books.It is what it is but being a democracy we have the right to protest the ruination of what potentially could have been a better lead up to the end.

      It is not the artist’s job to give the people what they want.
      Quality art has never been produced by the people educating artists but by artists educating the people.

      Either way, you’ve nothing to worry about; The way the story is headed there is not a snowball’s chance in hell the precious hero gets tainted. They’d never have saint Jon knowingly acquiesce to incest.

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    45. Kathy,

      I understand your rant, but what do you expect in terms of political development? What we have in Westeros is basically a traditional medieval ruling model in which the power of the monarch was balanced by the power of lords, and that model has never been replaced by any kind of democracy. Quite on the contrary, the next stage was always absolutism (sometimes enlightened, sometimes tyrannic) but absolutism nonetheless. Democracy came after (often through the guillotine) and brought A LOT of problems to everyone including “little people” to whom it was supposed to serve, but that’s the theme for another fantasy. For GoT, the only reasonable development would be absolutism, and the three major players whom we saw rising at the end of the S6 can be seen as a three forms of absolutism: Cersei is a clear tyrant, Dany is an enlightened radical reformist with all these wheel-breaking ideas which usually result in even bloodier tyranny, and finally we have Jon who basically represents the way of recovering and reinterpreting good old tradition, rather than breaking the wheel and trying to invent a square one. Therefore, shipping Dany and Jon is basically shipping reform and tradition and that’s a right instinct IMO, because history proves it again and again that reforms that are not implanted into tradition bring much bigger disasters, than the ones they were supposed to rectify.
      And that said, there’s still a chance that Jon and Dany will be wiped out at the end of the series, and Tyrion will get his chance to get all the credits for cleaning rubble of the wars. So, no-one writes him down: it’s just that now is a time for Dany and Jon (reform and tradition revival), and not for Tyrion’s Realpolitic.

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    46. Kosten: Because who cares about subtlety and poignancy when the masses cry out for loud spectacles.

      I, for one, do care for the poignancy if it’s not laid on too thickly. You might have a point about Olenna

      I wrote that she will be bitter and vengeful with Jaime because that’s how they have portrayed her the whole way through. She was rough and nasty with everybody, even the well-meaning grand niece that showed her the embroidery of a rose; she was always horrible to Mace; she was automatically horrible to everyone.

      But perhaps you are right, at the very end, after a lifetime of bitter comments, she will tame down a bit. If, as you suggested, she gives Jaime some quiet advice about Cersei being a very bad influence on him, it will cause him to rethink his relationship, and be the last straw that tips the scale toward him going to Brienne. That would be more dignified, certainly. Somehow I doubt that she will refrain from making at least a couple of scathing remarks about someone, because that’s who she is. Only eight more months to wait to see.

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    47. Kosten: If they go the cartoony route they so excelled at this past season

      I’m sorry you didn’t love Season 6 – I did, for the most part. To me, the only “cartoony” part was the Arya/Waif chase, but I’ve ranted about that elsewhere, and don’t want to go through it again. The rest of the season moved along beautifully, and I will be rewatching the whole thing at least twice before Season 7 starts. But I’m glad you are here – your comments are thoughtful, well-reasoned and well-written and we will need more of that to get through the next eight months.

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    48. Kathy,

      Art is not a democracy.
      George does his thing, we can either embrace it and love it or refuse it. Displeasing us was never a fear of his. He’s not here to make you happy, he’s here to tell a story with a beginning, a middle and an end. GRRM is not our bitch.

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    49. H.Stark,

      It looks increasingly likely that Greyworm will be part of the ambush. I don’t think his chances of survival are very high unfortunately.

      Leaks:

      Anger at his death might be the big reason for Dany burning the Tarlys.

      If he is part of the ambush, when is he attacking Casterly Rock? Does he first attack CR and then join this ambush. If so then Jaime could be attacked from 2 directions at the same time.

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    50. Ah, I suppose then that the older Tarly brother is the handsome young lord casting. Poor Sam. His brother is handsome, brawny and oh, so very tall.

      About the Missandei and Grey Worm supposed sex scene, just no. There is something sweet and sad about their forced platonic relationship that works wonderfully as an undertone. But the few times the show has tried to expand this, give Missandei and Grey Worm proper scenes, the result has been unbelievably boring. They don’t interact that well together, frankly.

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    51. dragonbringer:

      Have we even had anyone mention the possibility that these these two scene will not be two separate scenes but supposed to be a one scene..
      As in the scene starts with Jon offering to bend the knee and dany refusing it and one thing leads to another and eventually ends with them making love..

      Like a contemporary silly affectionate “Hang up!” “No, you hang up!”? It doesn’t seem plausible to me. But hey! Love and plausibility…

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    52. lucy,

      Dickon is the younger brother. That is why Sam was forced to give up his inheritance and take the black. I am still not convinced that this new actor is playing Sam’s brother. He looks older than Sam. Also, it seems like such a small role for an actor with his experience. However, I guess they could be writing a larger role for Dickon.

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    53. Irina Stark,

      Has anybody actually said GRR Martin is their bitch (well maybe Rygar trolling once…or was that on the site that (almost) died of shame)? To some extent I agree with you but GRRM surely is taking his sweet time about providing the middle and the end of the story…and from the sample chapters of TWOW that have been released he seems to be expanding rather than streamlining the story. I’m getting on in years now – I’m not a whole lot younger than GRRM – and I don’t want to have to wait till I’m a skeleton wight to find out the end of the tale – unless something really untoward happens I think at least I’ll get an ending from the show.

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    54. H.Stark,
      ghost of winterfell,

      You are probably right: the Unsullied have to be involved in the ambush battle, and I think there were rumors that the showrunners were looking for extras who could play them in Cáceres. But then it makes more sense to assume that they will go to CR after the ambush battle, rather than before that. On the other hand, it may be visa versa too. The problem is that so far Dany’s offensive makes absolutely no sense on the map. It’s like she lands on Dragonstone in Ep 1, and then ambushes Jaime somewhere in the middle of Westeros mainlands in Ep 4, and there is a naval battle somehow involving the Sand Snakes somewhere in-between and the Unsullied in the CR which fit nowhere.
      When and where exactly will Dany land in Westeros mainlands? Will there be any attempt to prevent her landing: probably not, if all the leaks and spoilers are right, but WHY? And why will Dany go to ambush Jaime somewhere in the middle of Westeros, instead of sacking KL in his absence? Equally, why will Jaime draw his force to Highgarder, when Dany will be directly threatening KL: will he leave to Highgarden before Dany arrives? And what about Euron, Dorne, CR, etc.? Some crucial piece of this puzzle is obviously missing, and I am thinking now: could this crucial piece be the Riverlands? They are relatively close to Dragonstone; their political situation is such that Dany won’t encounter any resistance upon landing; and finally the Riverlands could work as a jumping ground both for the attack on the Westerlands/Casterly Rock and the march south towards Highgarden/KL/Roseroad.
      Sadly, we have almost no spoilers about the Riverland plot, apart from intensive burning traces on the Riverrun inner gate on the PAP4Y photos. And, of course, all my guesses may be totally wrong (I have made plenty of wrong guesses already), but I’m just don’t know what to think about it any more.

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    55. Kosten,

      Maybe I have become apprehensive because of the toxicity of certain parts of the fandom – probably a small minority but a very vociferous one. Perhaps I was being wary of a censure in your comment that wasn’t there and to be fair you didn’t criticise people who do like the show. There are a (mercifully few) folk who who are more “into” the books than the show who seem to have the idea that anybody who likes the show must be short on grey matter and neurones. Also people who seem to set themselves up in judgement of others are a pet peeve of mine (and I’m not accusing you of that). That’s in general – not just in the GoT/ASOIAF fandom. I had a friend who was a communist and he mentioned people to whom Karl Marx referred to as the “lumpen proletariat”. I thought that was terrible – I thought Marx was supposed to be a fan of equality. When a majority (of the ones who could bestir themselves to vote; not everyone did) of the UK electorate chose “Leave” some (again not all) people who didn’t like the result started belittling the people who had voted to leave. I actually voted “Remain” but I was talking to a lady who voted “Leave” and she said she thought the EU would implode within a few years so the UK might as well leave now – she’s certainly not a stupid woman.

      I’ve got off topic a bit – I was trying to give examples of folk being judgemental that I don’t like – and why I am apprehensive sometimes that if I make a statement I’ll get a dismissive reply but from what you have said that is not your way.

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    56. Dame of Mercia,
      I completely understand !
      If I had a coin every time a fan accused another fan of being a racist or a misogynist or ever mentally ill because he doesn’t like his favorite character ,i would be rich as a Lannister !!!

      I am huge fan of the show , i love the books and i am proud to say that i managed to separate them in my head. I don’t judge the show ,never did .I loved s6 and i am one of the few people who didn’t disliked the show just because my personal theories didn’t come true. Actually my only “problem” with s6 was that Arya didn’t say “Not Today” before she cut the candle ( that would have been so cool!!!). When i meant make fun of the show i didn’t mean it in a bad way, am glad you understand that. I often like to steal fries from my friends plates with my fork while saying “for the watch
      ” !!(Do try it, apparently people don’t find it funny when you steal their fries!!!)

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    57. Dame of Mercia: When a majority (of the ones who could bestir themselves to vote; not everyone did) of the UK electorate chose “Leave” some (again not all) people who didn’t like the result started belittling the people who had voted to leave. I actually voted “Remain” but I was talking to a lady who voted “Leave” and she said she thought the EU would implode within a few years so the UK might as well leave now – she’s certainly not a stupid woman.

      In my earlier post I didn’t make it specifically clear I was referring to the Brexit vote.

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    58. konna:
      Black Raven,

      Imagine if it was Podrick instead of Jon !!!!

      Yes, that would be interesting! We never got to hear what was said when Podrick returned the purse to Tyrion for payment to the whores after Tyrion said: We need details – copious details – One can only imagine 😉

      That scene from way back when still creases me up 😀 😀

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    59. Inga,

      I wrote parts of this in the forum a while back…
      I still think the Kingswood could be one good location for some of her troops to hit the mainland. They could sail deep into it well east of King’s Landing via the Wendwater River which is easily accessible from Dragonstone. We don’t know exactly where the ambush happens other than it’s presumably between Highgarden and KL – so on the Roseroad somewhere. The Roseroad goes right through the Kingswood. If she has a strong encampment set up in there then they’d be in good position to intercept a caravan returning to KL from that direction.

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    60. Thronetender, Shy Lady Dragon, Hello lovelies, great to see you both and thank you for your kind words, very happy to see you too *me and the cats waving all over the place*.

      LEAKED SPOILERS DISCUSSION

      As for Olenna, I thought she and Jaime might have a crossed purposes discussion at HG. He says “you killed my son/nephew” meaning Tommen, but she replies “I had to, to protect my family” meaning Joffrey. It carries on for a bit until they realise they are talking about different people.

      I like that idea that Olenna would, in her final moments, just be nice for a change and tell Jaime honestly what happened, the way he did in the baths with Brienne. If Cersei has convinced Jaime the Tyrells are responsible for the Sept and Tommen’s death and Olenna tells him her version of events, this could plant seeds of doubt in his mind. Him being blindly in love with Cersei seems a step back in character development, but him allowing Olenna a dignified(ish) death on her own terms gives me hope he is not going back to being the Jaime from the beginning of the story. There is other evidence in the leaks that this might be the case but it’s nothing to do with the ambush so I won’t mention it here.

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    61. sebaciel,

      Stranger Things is overrated and nowhere near the quality of GOT,Breaking Bad or any other top quality show,i can’t speak for Westworld since i haven’t watched it .

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    62. Kathy,

      Uhh,dear,sorry to break it to you but democracy is not a thing you can bring out in an artistic medium because unlike say politics,you can choose to ignore it or not whereas more important stuff like voting is far more influential for a country or nation for example,having your own opinions and thoughts is democracy,equality is democracy,it’s not definitely not a fucking tv series .

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    63. Maggie,
      Thanks for that. The leaks are lacking context, so even if they are factually correct there’s still lots of why and how questions to fill in and plenty of speculation to have fun with.

      LEAKED SPOILER DISCUSSION

      I don’t actually like Olenna, her being incredibly rude to everyone does not appeal to me at all, but her final scene with Jaime could be awesome if they do it right *fingers crossed*

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    64. lucy:
      Ah, I suppose then thatthe older Tarly brother is the handsome young lord casting.Poor Sam.His brother is handsome, brawny and oh, so very tall.

      LEAKED SPOILER DISCUSSION

      And oh so very dead if the leaks are correct.

      I am cautiously optimistic that Sam and Gilly (and baby Sam) are some of the few to make it out of the whole thing alive and relatively happy. It can’t all be doom and gloom she said, ignoring all evidence to the contrary 😉

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    65. Emma:
      How is possible that someusers never get tired of the same Jon vs Dany debate in EVERY THREAD.like wtf.

      Lulus Mum
      November 20, 2016 at 4:44 pm

      Maggie,
      Thanks for that. The leaks are lacking context, so even if they are factually correct there’s still lots of why and how questions to fill in and plenty of speculation to have fun with.

      Yeah agreed – As I mentioned further up this thread, this whole Jon V Dany business is getting on my tits!

      TBH, I don’t take much notice. When S7 airs I’ll probably remember some scenes from filming spoilers – Like when Dany meets Jon on that steep footpath or when Gendry attacks those guards on the beach with his war hammer, but not much else. Its impossible to piece together how S7 will play out in detail from episode to episode from bits of leaked information.

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    66. Dickon is the younger Tarly brother. That is why Randyll forced Sam to take the black. Dickon could then inherit land and title over Sam.

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    67. Clob,

      Yes, Kingswood could be one good location for landing in the mainlands, but on the other hand the entire Black Water Bay should be blocked with every ship available. So, unless Yara lures Euron/Cersei’s fleet out somehow… but on the other hand, it doesn’t look like the naval battle is going to be on her terms: it looks exactly the opposite. So, one way or another something doesn’t line up. And though all these inconsistencies can be simply explained with D&D simply not knowing how to write and paying no attention to the maps, such explanation is not acceptable for me (sorry for being obsessive and tiresome).

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    68. Inga,

      Blackwater Bay is actually a very large body of water, essentially a sea itself, and considering the fact that entrance into the bay is guarded by those inhabiting Dragonstone I’d wager to say that Euron’s fleet is not within it when Daenerys arrives. The only place to ‘block the bay’ effectively with ships would be very close to KL or at the mouth by The Narrow Sea, right where Dragonstone lies. Since it appears Daenerys will arrive at the island pretty much unimpeded I don’t think there is a fleet nearby. There’s probably a good chance that the small number of royal fleet ships remaining were docked up the Blackwater Rush from KL where they were moved prior to the BotBW. They may move them to directly outside KL but scattering them too thin to go as far as the Wendwater would be bad for them. We should remember that the mouth of the Wendwater is also where Stannis anchored his fleet safely prior to beginning his attack on KL. “Knowing” what happens to Yara, Theon and the Sand Snakes I’d say Euron’s fleet is either down near Dorne waiting for them or runs into them at some point between there and the Iron Islands.

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    69. Clob,

      Reasonable, but then again your scenario implied that KL will be left almost unprotected. So, why would Dany be ambushing Jaime instead of sacking the capital? Why would she split her forces sending the Unsullied to the CR and Yara gods know where, when her fleet would be obviously needed in the Black Water Bay to cover the landing operation from the rear? And what kind of ambush could she arrange, when her every single move would be visible in the Red Keep? Makes little sense at least so far. I would be so happy, if someone spoiled the overall scenario of war to the point of the ambush battle or at least gave us more clues, because for the moment it looks like D&D are making Dany and Cersei to compete over which of them will be a bigger idiot. I hope it’s not the case, but my trust hangs by a thread.

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    70. Inga,

      Cersei is absolutely crazy , especially now with all her children dead. Tyrion knows this. The mad king had store wildfire in all the key spots in KL.Cersei used only the ones under the Sept. She is practically holding the entire population of KL hostage. It makes sense for Tyrion to advise Dany to trap Cersei or go for her allies first ( CR) instead of directly attacking the capital. Cersei is a wild card and they have to be very careful if they don’t want thousands of innocent people burned alive. A dragon attack will only make things worse . Dany has the same disadvantage others (Lannister enemies) had, she is not willing to kill and burn entire villages or cities (like Tywin did) to win the war, but Cersei is .

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    71. Inga,
      I believe you’re thinking ‘too small’ of Westeros if you think ground movement in the Kingswood or ships at the Wendwater would be visible from the Red Keep, day or night. Even from a tower of 100 feet the horizon will be under 20 miles. The woods isn’t just a grove outside of KL but incredibly vast with hills and valleys most certainly as well. Fan estimated distances from book descriptions and maps:
      King’s Landing to the Wendwater = 210 miles/338 km
      King’s Landing to Highgarden = 760 miles/1223 km
      King’s Landing to Storm’s End = 385 miles/620 km
      The Kingswood covers more than half of the distance to Storm’s End.

      KL wouldn’t be completely unprotected, just not as far away as the Wendwater. The very reason why I think Daenerys would initially move troops to the Kingswood is for positioning for an eventual attack on KL. We know she wants to hit it but has to do it in a less destructive manner than fire-bombing. And as I mentioned, the Roseroad that the caravan would take back to KL goes through the Kingswood. If Daenerys hears about the sacking of her ally at Highgarden she could then already have troops in position to intercept the caravan somewhere along the Roseroad.

      I don’t think Daenerys will ultimately attack KL by sea at all. Not only will she not want to hit it like the Masters did Meereen, but she also will know from Tyrion of the manner in which Stannis failed. To me it seems normal for her to send battalions to different locations in an attempt to sack enemy strongholds; Yara/Theon for the Iron Islands and western shore, CR as the (believed to be) “bank” of the crown, etc.

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