Game of Thrones keeps hitting us with new content, but never fear — we here at The Night’s Cast, the official podcast of Watchers on the Wall, can keep up!
On the heels of a big batch of new Season 8 still photos released earlier today, join Petra and Samantha as they break down each and every one and what they might for the final season.
The Night’s Cast is available on iTunes and SoundCloud, and you can follow us on Twitter as well. Happy listening!
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Thanks!
Jonsa fans probably they will have issues with the Jon /Danny instagram photo that look at each other with love into the eyes ..I can see them screaming on Quora ..”that is not real”or ”he is using her ”…and blah blah blah ..as always ..They are so sickly obsessive with it ..I can imagine that they will need psychotherapy after S8 ends ..Sansa will not survive S8..unfortunately ..Her fate is fixed since S1
Maybe Jaimie is in armour because he’s been appointed to Dany’s queensguard?!!!
Medusa,
How can I like and love your comment..i love your opinion so much..jonaerys for life
Danny will probably will be heartbroken when Bran reveals what happened with Viserion after his death..She will be shocked.
Jon and Danny in the outside photos ..maybe they are in the Last Hearth
Thank you Samantha and Petra for the analysis! You know, regarding Jaime’s outfit – I too originally thought it looked Northern, but after review, I noticed he is wearing the same leathers from when he left King’s Landing. The only difference is the shoulder and chest armor (sorry Patrick, I already forgot what they were called). He could have put them on before entry to Winterfell since he knows is rapport with the Starks is not great. And his photo can simply be him being received.
And thank you for pointing out the man of the Night’s Watch in the Arya photo! I don’t think, however, that Arya is looking at Jon but I do think her look is appraising. Given that she’s there and the diversity of the background characters’ wardrobes, I think everyone is coming out to see dragons. I also think the Sansa, Brienne, and Davos images are all from the same scene.
Lastly, I think someone on Instagram had noted, quite hilariously, that there is more chemistry and a believable love connection in that one photo of Jon and Dany gazing at each other, than the entirety of Season 7, which I have to agree with.
Medusa,
Well I hope Sansa doesn’t die, her story line has been interesting in terms of what she’s been through. I’d like to see her stay Lady of the North. I do think that Sansa and Jon have more chemistry than Dany and Jon do – not romantic chemistry, I just mean they (the actors) play off each other really well. The only ‘love story’ I’ve ever seen on GOT has been between Jamie and Brienne. Nothing physical has ever happened between them yet their relationship has me fully invested in their ultimate fates on the show. That is really a credit to both actors.
Interesting discussion.
I was quite confused about the discussion of Jaime in armor. I may have misunderstood but I think a number of minutes was spent on discussing why he is the ONLY person in armor. Brienne is also in armor, no?
And since this is a new alliance he would wear his armor until he has established a personal security zone. (Bronn may not be around.) The Lannisters soldiers ate dinner at the Freys wearing their armor. Robb and company would be alive now if they were this sensible. Hound wore his armor nearly all the time as well.
Jaime has both an identity arc (inside the character own life choices) and a redemption (really inside the reader/viewer opinion of him). If it is ham-fisted, it would appear that both GRRM and D&D have failed in the most ambitious undertaking in the story. GRRM is really putting an effort in crafting this particular storyline. It has worked for many but for many others it has not.
kathy,
I also believe that Brienne and Jaime are the prime love story in the series. The acting has been beautiful and the story runs nearly the entire series.
Gwen Christie has not had much screen time to show her talent but she has put in an excellent performance especially in scenes with NCW and Pod. NCW is one of the best talents in GOT and has done well with Jaime’s complicated love life despite the decision to keep him so long with Cersei.
I expect them to both have heroic stories in Season 8.
Mango,
Thanks for listening! My point was that in the context of what we assume is Episode 1, it was odd that he was the only one pictured in armor (Brienne doesn’t appear to be wearing hers in the great hall, just the Northern-style leather tunic and cloak she’s been sporting the last two seasons). And yes, it could be that he wants to feel protected until he’s accepted by Dany, but that feels out of step narratively at this point — Jaime has abandoned KL and his sister and is throwing in his lot with the opposing forces because he believes it’s the right side (otherwise he wouldn’t bother going north at all), and I don’t believe he’d show up in armor and then try to cut his way out of Winterfell if Dany doesn’t accept his fealty. He’s choosing to stand in front of the woman whose father he killed and he knows there’s a good chance she’ll have his head off, and I think he’s made peace with that fact. Like we mention in the podcast, though, it could mean nothing, and that this particular shot is just him having been taken into the ranks and trying on hand-me-down armor that he’ll need in the battle(s) to come.
Samantha,
It seems lots of folks have stood in front of Dany with a reasonable chance of getting their heads lopped off (or dragon-roasted), eg
• Jorah (twice)
• Tyrion
• Varys
• Viserys… whoops 🤯
Samantha: We must be seeing different things – Brienne is wearing the kit Jaime gave her. She has been wearing it since Season 4. At the Dragonpit and in the North she wears a cloak over it. I think I may define armor incorrectly to include the entire outfit. Unfortunately, they do not wear those things in my neighbourhood but at the museums, the entire outfit is displayed as “armor”. Brienne may not be wearing the shoulder bit under the coat but I could not tell.
The rest of what you wrote is a bit surprising for me – why would Jaime swear fealty to Daenerys? To prevent being burned to crisps? He might. The Westerosi need the dragons to deal with the AOTD.
He is choosing to stand in front of the woman whose father he killed? Your wording is almost comical. Jaime killed a mad man that threatened the lives of millions.
Daenerys herself is a threat to Westeros. If her dragons die in the fight, she is a dead woman before the last one hits the ground. Any of the Starks and the northern lords would take her out.
Mango,
Agree to disagree on some of your points. That’s the great thing about this fandom — we can respect differing opinions and know that ours in turn will be respected.
Samantha,
All good!
Wow! I didn’t even make it halfway though the podcast with my spare thirty minutes.
Sansa isn’t dying. Lady dying didn’t represent Sansa’s fate, it represented the death of her childhood. One of the main themes of Sansa’s story is overcoming overwhelming trauma and loss while surviving.
The last scene between the Stark sisters was all about the Starks working together and suriving now, they are a pack and they will live on. She’s been set up as the leader of the North and all the payoff to her storyline will be in the final season. If she dies now her story was utterly pointless, utterly nihilistic and completely without any sort of pay off or anything, she’ll just have absolutely no glory moments in the show and just constant stream of suffering and loss, that’s shit, that’s not what GRRM is about.
Sansa can only die in 2 storylines now, the undead one where her dying would feel completely hallow since she’s had no part in it and would mean she gets denied the foreshadowed and built up showdown vs Cersei, something that’s been teased since the beginning of their relationship and far too important not to happen. The second is the KL showdown, where Sansa dying to Cersei would again be completely against character progression and would just net Cersei yet another victory, Sansa is the more beautiful woman who’s going to strike her down, she’s the one who’s taken her the most serious and the one who’s no doubt going to be the most prepared to face off with.
The only delusional people are the Sansa haters, who strongly believe she’ll die despite the contrary. You don’t have years of build up to have zero pay off, especially not with one of the main characters.
Stop looking at her like that, Jon! You still love Ygritte!
Medusa,
Are you Artemisia? You have the same writing style.
Just remember folks – ASOIAF was not written as a fairytale. If season 8 does justice to the story, then I wouldn’t be holding out hope for any heroic endings or happy ever afters.
The story has always been brutal in cutting down whoever, wherever. Personally, I’m not hoping for a happy Sansa, or Arya (my favourite), or John and Danny love story. I’m hoping for a more realistic ending that pays hommage to the original story concept.
Bring on the bloodbath and shocks!
Pauldrons and gorget! (You don’t have to remember them, but that’s what they’re called. I think. Maybe I should be fact-checked…)
I don’t ship anyone on this show (except maybe Grey Worm and Missandei a little) so I don’t care but a chair and a table have more chemistry than Jon and Dany. And those are objects, not living beings. Last Season was so painful, having writers resort to using the characters around Jon and Dany to tell us how they feel or that they check each other out because there was no chemistry between the actors. Not to mention the lack of screen time to make that ship in any way believable. Dany had chemistry with Drogo, both Daarios and even Jorah (not romantic chemistry, just chemistry). Jon had plenty with Ygritte and even Sansa (at least in S6, and again not romantic chemistry). Of course chemistry is subjective but for me Jon and Dany have zero. All I see is the conventional ‘hot guy+cute girl =they gotta bang’ Hollywood nonsense.
Every Season people are so sure Sansa will die. How many essays and youtube videos exist about that? And every year she survived the Season. IMO D&D have written themselves into a corner, in that they can’t kill her off. Because what is the message then? That survivors of years of abuse will never get anything but a temporary break? That they won’t ever come out on top again? If D&D had ever bothered to develop her character at all besides making her a punching bag for villains, then they could kill her off. Or at the very least hadn’t derailed the path she was on at the end of S4 and didn’t do the nonsense that was S5. But what do I know, I wouldn’t put it past D&D to kill her off in the dumbest way possible. Because they are hacks.
JR,
Damn. You had me interested in what you were saying until the very last sentence. 🙁
I’d be okay if Sansa died since she’s my least favorite Stark, and since GRRM’s realism ensures that you aren’t safe regardless of your “development”…irl you could seem as if you’d be the most survival-destined person with a foreseeable arc IF you were a fictional character, but that affords you no protection. ;p
My main GoT ships are the healthy, non-incestuous canonical ones (Sam/Gilly, GW/Missandei), and the possible Braime and Tormienne. ;-} At first I did feel like Jonerys was a little rushed or forced just because “two hot leads obviously HAVE to bang,” but I warmed up to it a bit more on my subsequent viewings. Still not into it in that I hope it’s short-lived after the big reveal–not that I want them turning on each other or anything.
JR,
Funny how different people see different things. I saw plenty of chemistry between Jon and Dany and absolutely none between Dany and Drogo, which to me was the most farfetched love story I’ve seen on screen.
I love the chemistry between Jon and Dany. Chemistry in realife has ontving to do with ratio. 11 years ago my best friend and I went out. My best Friends is gay and soms unknown man came teasing him. I didn’t like him at all. But at the end of the night my best Friends surprisingly went home with that man. Now 11 years later he still hasn’t left that man, they are still together and they are the most stable couple I know.
Medusa,
Yikes, everyone was just chilling and you chose to bring Jonsa’s into this. Sounds like you’re either obsessed or threatened by them…
If you have so much faith in Jon and Dany, which I don’t, but lol I don’t ship Jonsa.. Braime is the only true ship imo.
Here are my two bits on all of this. One Dany and Jon are only a thing until season 8 starts. Thats all hype from Game of thrones and will set up the huge betrayal. Jon (in season 7) acted like he was sleeping until dany walked away. He has alternate plans, and he even told the guys while beyond the way that they don’t understand that only dany can be the game changer. I don’t think it has to do with her dragons, I think it has to do with her. I think John will kill dany to create the needed sword. I also think that Jon and Sansa may be a couple but only at the end to mirror Ned and Katlyn. The wolf pack survives.
Chilli,
Damn autocorrect, I thought I had changed everything.
My least subjective point is the one you don’t agree with? ‘aww shucks’
Dany and Drogo was awful but the actors had chemistry IMO. The problem with Dany’s and Jon’s love story is different. Lack of time to develop it doesn’t hinder whether or not people would root for it but then you need chemistry to make up for the lack of a romance story. If two characters meet for the first time and the romantic/sexual chemistry is off the charts, then a rushed love story can work. Because the chemistry is there, you can believe two people who barely know each other would fall into bed together. Unfortunately sometimes writers want to put people together who have no chemistry and that’s when they resort to the good old ‘have characters around them mention how into each other they are’. Because there is nothing coming from the two people in question. When did all this ‘Jon staring at Dany’s boobs (under all that fur LOL)’ happen that Davos mentioned? Threw me for a loop because. The only time I saw interest from either character was from Dany when Jon pet Drogon. But her reaction could be read as either interest or anxiousness.
Considering D&D have created the most popular and critically acclaimed show ever, have won multiple awards, and that the vast majority of viewers love what they have done with the show, I would say your opinion on them is quite subjective.
There was a pretty obvious look of a connection when Jon said goodbye to her on the beach. “At least you won’t have to put up with the King in the North anymore.” “I’ve grown used to him.” Daenerys looked like she wanted to cry or kiss him, but of course did neither. That was even before all the rescuing, boat cabin and Dragonpit chatting too.
That’s a funny pull, but to offer defense, Artemisia’s writing was quite a bit different. It had a lot of [brackets] and tons and tons of commas,,, and periods… in odd places. 🙂
Medusa,
bran wont reveal that, it will be way more shocking when she sees viserion flying at her through the sky while she is riding drogon rather than just learning about it while sitting inside winterfell
Terrible things happen in the story, realistically, but you’re fooling yourself if you think George is going to end ASoIaF in a manner where everything awful happens and there is nothing happy about it. Most people aren’t psychopaths that would desire such an ending either. 😛
Clob,
True, those were emotional moments and i could see the attraction between the two then, but there was no build up to it. D&D sacrificed the build-up in order to progress the story and try to wrap things up. We had to rely on Davos to let the audience know there was a growing attraction. I just wish we had at least one awkward dinner scene at Dragonstone where Tyrion, Davos, Missandei &Greyworm are chaperones. Tyrion tries to fill awkward silences, tries to get everyone to drink and yet again attempts to finish his honeycomb and jackass joke.
Y’all, be careful how you come for writing styles here. Sure Artemesia was aggressive and took YouTube theories as fact, but obviously English was not her first language…
Dark Sister,
Yeah, I overlooked the manner of writing… It was the things written and the aggressiveness that I had issue with.
Clob,
1. Plenty of terrible things have happened already. To just about everyone. (Are there any main or secondary characters who haven’t had loved ones murdered, or have themselves been mutilated, beheaded, gutted or incinerated?)
2. I hated, hated, hated the ending of “The Sopranos.” But you know what? I would not be incensed if the very last scene of GoT is the Jon, Arya & Sansa WF crypts teaser scene. Jon Snow drawing Longclaw, Arya drawing Needle, standing side by side to face whatever threat was approaching…. I could live with that (and imagine my own “ending”).
On the other hand, Jon, Arya, Sansa and Dany sitting at a table at the Crossroads Inn as Hot Pie serves kidney pie with a Journey song playing in the background when the screen suddenly fades to black would evoke a collective “that sucked!” heard ’round the world.
Dark Sister,
Davos did a better job hitting on Missandei than Jon did with Dany.
JR,
It was the offputting last sentence: “Because they [D&D] are hacks.”
Until then, you made some interesting arguments why Show! Sansa wouldn’t be killed off because of the divergences in her storyline from the books, eg after Show! Sansa spent most of seven seasons as a crash test dummy it wouldn’t make sense to kill her off at the end.
Although I do feel that a self-sacrificing, courageous death for Sansa to save others would not be unsatisfactory. (Which goes back to my ultra tinfoil, admittedly ridiculous observation that but for one altered vowel, “Sansa Sansa” is an anagram for “Nissa Nissa.”)
Ten Bears,
hahahhahhahaaa! True dat!
Davos has game….
Dark Sister,
As I’ve written at length on before, I think they (D&D) did right in not overdoing (forcing) the relationship building for them. Neither of the characters are/were in a position to be thinking about love and romance. They’d actually be purposely trying to push that aside to focus on what is important. As Jon said, “there’s no time for that.” I personally believe they did do enough though to show them growing closer, respecting and caring for each other. Their final scene was just them surrendering to physical urges. Some people look at them as if they’re a married couple now and say there was nothing to show how they got there. What we actually witnessed was just the beginning of their relationship. We need to wait for this season to see how it continues and what they’re like together when they’re, you know, actually ‘together.’
As a non-book reader (I have aphantasia so fantasy books don’t really appeal to me http://aphant.asia/have-i-got-aphantasia) I understood Sansa was not a major Point of View character so I’m always surprised at how invested many book purists are in her character.
I disliked her immensely in the beginning because she was such a petty, judgmental child. However, I appreciate the progress she’s made on her harrowing journey. She started out from a place of privilege, expecting everything to go her way and why not? It always had, as the pretty first daughter of a great Lord. With each successive setback she tried to please those who had power over her fate, hoping to survive. This lasted right up until she trusted Little Finger in the Vale, who promptly bartered her to the Boltons for his own gain.
Then, as she stated, she learned. Her character progression is one of discovering one’s own agency and self-reliance. Each wolf must contribute for the pack to survive and she has done this. She’s a strong, resourceful woman of substance now.
To simply pair her off at the end with Jon, Tyrion or some other Lord in a fairy tale version of a dynastic marriage alliance puts her right back where she was at twelve years old.
That, to me, makes as little sense as putting Dany on the Iron Throne. We could’ve wrapped the whole show up in Season 2 if it was all about childish wish fulfillment. Dany revenges her family and rules, Jon earns his name and honor, Sansa gets a husband and babies, Arya gets a boy’s life of adventure, etc.
THAT would be hack storytelling!
When it first aired, I hated it too. I didn’t like the ambiguity. Now that a good amount of time has passed, I’ve actually come to appreciate the ending a little bit.
What kind of ending would it have been if Tony was whacked? It would’ve been one hell of a depressing ending. A blood bath at the diner and then….fade to black or something? Eh, that doesn’t sound very satisfying.
What kind of ending would it have been if Tony lived? I think that would’ve gone down the road of “Tony was a bad guy, but got away with it”, and that wouldn’t have been very satisfying either. I really liked the character Tony Soprano, but he didn’t deserve to get away with everything.
I kind of like that they left it up to the viewer to decide what happened after the screen faded to black. I imagine that life simply went on the way it always had, with Tony trying to balance being a family man with being a made guy. Will he eventually go to jail? Will he eventually get whacked? What will come of his family? I find that these questions are more interesting than being spoon-fed the answers.
Having said that, I still want to know what happened to the Russian in the Pine Barrens 🙂
The Captain,
To me unexpected can also be happy though. Everyone expects Sansa to marry or get the throne, but I think doing neither would be the best end for her story. Instead, she could rule Winterfell and not have any partner or children – just her knowledge of ruling she learned throughout her life. It’s also a fitting end because it’s the exact opposite of how she started out as a character, hating her home and wanting to run south and marry the prince.
Same goes for Arya. She’s expected to grow up and be a fearsome warrior which is what her whole arc has been about, but what if she falls in love with Gendry and settles her life down and has kids – furthering the Stark/Baratheon line with him?
I’d rather see more endings like that than just people dying. If any Stark will die it will probably be Bran (already kind of soulless anyway) and Jon (heroic death).
Listening to the pod, a lot of discussion comes from the assumption that all the promo pics are from episode 1 and that some characters are in the same scene. This may not be a great assumptions to make since season 7 promo pics were from different episodes.
Another thing that puzzled me in the discussion is the suggestion that episode 1 will have Eastwatch survivors arrive to Winterfell to tell everyone about the Wall being down and the ice dragon. But in season 7 finale we are explicitly shown that Bran saw everything that happened in Eastwatch being warged into a raven. I would assume that they have all intel in Wintefell by the time Jon and Dany arrive.
Chilli,
Clob,
Good spot. It is Artemisia. The telltale signs are all there in comments on other articles.
If she starts writing repulsive things again, I hope that someone will alert the moderators.
Although, if I remember correctly, she was banned last time for being insulting to Luka, so they may wish to know regardless.
Clob,
Yeah, I can understand that but I wish there was some build up like Robb and Talisa had. I may have been spoiled with that relationship, and I don’t meam I wanted Jon& Dany to succumb to their desires but some scenes of them getting to know each other would have been nice. But i am looking forward to how their relationship will further build in the next season.
Ten Bears,
Davos the onion knight and charismatic wordsmith!
Patrick Sponaugle,
Thank you!! I did a Google Image check- you’re right! 😂
Mr Derp,
“Having said that, I still want to know what happened to the Russian in the Pine Barrens 🙂”
________
Why of course, he became the Night King.
Drew,
“Same goes for Arya. She’s expected to grow up and be a fearsome warrior which is what her whole arc has been about, but what if she falls in love with Gendry and settles her life down and has kids – furthering the Stark/Baratheon line with him?”
_________
“No. That’s not me.” – Arya Stark
Ten Bears,
“And I don’t want to be a lady.”
– Arya Stark
LadyGoodman,
Yes, that would be interesting storytelling.
Drew,
Also interesting possiblities.
I want the end story to be worthy of the years of build up and to find an emotionally, complex ending. I want the best for my favourite characters but more than that, I want an ambitious, nuanced end.
Mr Derp,
Yes, I think the Sopranos ending has stood the test of time. You stated the artistic reasons very well as I think about it.
This may not have been the intent as I do not think Chase will want to go back to that story, but the way it ended was also commercially best as it left the option to revisit the story will all paths still available.
Considering that The Walking Dead always beat out GoT until not long ago, most popular is not correct. Awards are nonsense since they are often bought and not every voter actually watches them, they just vote for what is ‘popular’. And just looking at the awards list on IMDB, most of the big wins were all from the Emmy Awards. The other huge amount is for technical stuff. So it seems it’s just the Emmy Awards that love the show. And unless you can provide me with scientific research, making an assumption that most viewers love the show seems like a personal opinion, not fact.
Might be off putting but it’s my opinion. They are terrible writers and storytellers and it doesn’t help that they didn’t hire people who can make up for their flaws. Or better yet that they didn’t hand the show to more capable people because it was clear that they only wanted to get to the Red Wedding and then they were ‘done with the show’.
JR,
The Walking Dead is declining in viewership, because people feel the quality is declining, whereas GOT ratings increase every year.
Ah yes, the “awards are bought” argument. People say this every year when their favorite show doesn’t win, yet they provide no evidence. I find that to be very petty.
As I said above, my evidence that people love GOT is its rising viewership. If people stopped loving it, as they have with the Walking Dead, people would stop watching.
I just watched the latest episode of The Good Doctor. They actually had a FACE transplant! i thought maybe the good doctor was promoting GOT for a second. They showed them removing the face just like Jaqen (except they said something about finding some important arteries before they cut). Seeing Arya’s incredible still shot and now seeing the doctors successfully do a face transplant I am ready for April.
…oh yeah, I did like Dany/Drogo. And Jon/Ygritte. If I were Dany, Jorah wouldn’t have been friendzoned, though, so…:p
Young Dragon,
Some of us liked the first 4 seasons and are now past the point of return.. even though it annoys me to watch what is just poorly written fan fiction (s5 onwards)
Production values have gotten better. Storytelling… so bad, I mean reaaallly bad. No surprise DnD are going to make some star wars films after this.
LadyGoodman,
I don’t even want to talk about the show and how they dealt with Sansa’s storyline.. because it was terrible
But in the books Sansa is only just starting to become interesting. I’m interested in her storyline now because she is based off the queen lizzie 1. So she’ll most likely beat Cersei. Then survive Dany like queen lizzie survived the spanish armada. The interesting bit is how she’ll get there from a naive little girl/pawn into a proper player of the game.
JR,
haha omg yes finally!!
It was painful. Blatantly just fan service. The writing since the show caught with the books (and GRRM left) has been awful. The Dany+Jon was so forced. That DnD are absolutely stealing a living.
But a lot of the happy clappers on this site seem to love it. Oh well.
One of Euron’s mutes,
I’m aware that some viewers feel that way, but you are in the miniority.
The show is an adaptation, not fan fiction, and is still a high quality show even after leaving the books. Perhaps it’s a high quality show because it left the books. AFFC/ADWD were not very good, imo. The show made the right choice cutting out all the filler and focusing on the main characters. Right now, I would say that the show has surpassed the books in terms of quality as well. That is how much Martin has screwed up his last two books. Maybe he’ll be able to salvage his story if he actually finishes, but I’m not getting my hopes up.
This is a fan site, after all. Is it really so surprising that people here are fans of the show? If you want to come here and be critical of D&D and their hard work, that’s your business, but don’t act like we’re the weird ones.
a comment starting with “haha omg” must be full of deep thoughts. and indeed, you don’t disappoint me. you rip apart years of sheep like us clapping at fan service and a storyline which has in no way been developped since episode one, has in no way been synched with GRRM’s idea of where the story goes and is lacking any sort of logic and conclusion since the end of season 4.
because since then, D&D have been checking their mailboxes after the finale of each season, piled up the different wishes of the fans and then went to their employers and told them which fans have won the f*uck-continuity-contest in storytelling. then: money, scripts, production, release, happy-clapping.
you caught everyone pants down. congrats! aka: i didn’t expect more from a comment starting with “haha omg”.
death by chickenfire,
In all fairness, whose fault is it that the show passed the dense, intricately plotted source material?
An author has the luxury of years to write, rewrite, and find just the right words and storylines to tell his tale.
The TV showrunners have to script, produce, film, edit and score seven-ten episodes every year on time, under budget, and with no opportunities for “do-overs” or untangling Mereenese knots (or whatever roadblock GRRM was talking about).
Look, I’ll be the first to bitch and moan about the occasional misfires, eg Sansa’s regression to crash test dummy by agreeing to the stupid Jeyne Poole-derived Bolton marriage plan; Sansa inexplicably concealing the KotV; the stupid wight hunt plan; the tedious Sansa vs. Jon bitchathon followed by the PsychoArya Lecter vs. Sansa “Only a Fool Would Trust LF” trusting LF vs. Petyr “I Have No Reason for this Stupid Plan” Baelish nonsensical detour; Tyrion transforming from a witty, brilliant character into a grumpy-faced sourpuss; turning delightful cad Bronn into a non-stop “cock”, “no cock”, “cockless” cringeworthy character; and dispatching Master Gameplayer LF in a cheap “Gotcha!” scene by transforming him into a whimpering dodo bird who inexplicably confessed to flimsy charges even Orson Lannister, Esq. could’ve torn to shreds in five minutes.
However, those occasional misfires – which naturally stick out like a sore thumb – are
are far outnumbered and outweighed by the “high thread count”™️, high quality scenes and character interactions.
From my own personal perspective, a disproportionate number of those misfires were the product of one particular director’s dubious on-location decisions and script “interpretations”, in a misguided, unnecessary and unsuccessful attempt to “ramp up the drama” – which in some cases required a smart character to behave like an oblivious idiot.
So much of the show is pure gold. [*Insert ASNAWP reference here*.] There are scenes I can enjoy on a perpetual rewatch loop. I think some of the big(ger) budget action spectacles have prompted the hokey “fan service” label – when all the showrunners have done is given us sequences (and seamless CGI) that surpass so-called Hollywood blockbusters.
I’d bet if the showrunners had 5-6 years between seasons to polish and refine scripts, re-shoot scenes, edit out dead-end story lines, and rewrite some wonky dialogue, we wouldn’t be seeing so much of this “fan service”, “D&D are hacks”, and Season X was “piss poor” criticism.
Sorry about the mini-rant. We’ve seen 67 episodes, and there’s so much to like and celebrate – and on balance really not that much to whinge about.
™️ Thronetender 2017
Well said! Anyone can nitpick flaws with 20/20 hindsight but it doesn’t make them geniuses.
OT…
Wight coyotes proliferating in California:
https://www.nationalgeographic.com/animals/2019/01/blue-eyes-mutation-coyotes-spreading-in-california/
Ten Bears,
thank you for the mini-rant! i agree with 99.5% of what you wrote. just the fact you did write this makes me fear i’ve become really bad at sh*tting into the neck of trolls from below. because, my comment was surely not agreeing with Euron’s sadly not so mute…
It’s always so great when people pop up and start posting shit comments believing every opinion they have is fact. I’m glad it’s a weekend I won’t be spending much time reading and I can ignore later.
death by chickenfire,
Nah. Have no fear. I caught and got a chuckle out of your troll-bashing sarcasm. It was right on the money. 💰
Excellent podcast as always ladies!
I wrote my notes on these photos on the main article but they are pretty much aligned with your thoughts.
A few more thoughts now listening to you:
– Jon and Dany presumably north of the wall is confusing but I love your suggestion of them being at East Watch this would make a lot of sense.
– I also saw sadness in the Dany pic and again like your idea of her hearing about Viseryen at this point.
– In terms of Sam finding out I think it will be either end of episode 1 or the second episode. I feel they will drop the bombshells to generate maximum chaos before the big battle in episode 3.
Ps. what is happening with the old podcasts that used to be linked from Watchers? They were great.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0la5DBtOVNI
It’s okay to not like things but don’t be a dick about it…
Are you sure GRRM actually left? Whilst watching S5 audio commentaries Dave Hill says that George reads the outline for each season and gives them inputs. Whilst he may not write anymore it sounded to me like he still had some engagement with the show (at least up to S6).
Watch the S5 audio commentary and Bryan Cogman explains everything very honestly. The show runners have Sansa on the path which is coming in the books which he says is to help reclaim Winterfell for the Starks. This confirms to me that Sansa will bring the Vale army north like in the show. The difference being that they gave her Jayne Poole role which would never have worked on TV so they wanted to up the stakes rather than have Sophie sit in the Vale. Cogman also explained the rape scene was not by choice but they wanted to keep things realistic and that this would happen. I know the arc merging and content was controversial but I believe the underlying rationale was sound when producing the adaptation for TV.
On a lighter note….
Happy Birthday, Queen Margaery (Natalie Dormer) ! 🎉🎂
Jon Snowed,
I’ve never understood this “contraversy” around Sansa’s rape. It’s not like she got it worst of all: Shireen was burned alive by her own parents according to GRRM’s canon, and? Three episodes later we were hailing Melissander for resurrecting Jon, even pittying her, and now she is a goddie, – that’s the probem!
Inga,
Oh, I’m not hailing Melisandre for anything. Nothing she has done or can do can make up for burning the Princess Shireen. With all of her Lord of Light babble about “purifying” souls by barbecuing people, she deserves to be roasted alive by Gendry on WF’s forge while impaled on Needle, while in the background Das Sound Machine (starring Karsi) performs their “Fire” song:
“So light ’em up, up, up
Light ’em up, up, up
Light ’em up, up, up
I’m on fire!”