Kit Harington has read the scripts for season 8 and now bears the burden of knowing how Game of Thrones ends but not being able to talk about it. Harington was on The One Show recently and discussed how it feels to be facing the end of his tenure as Jon Snow (for real this time).
“I’m really emotional about [the end],” Harington told Alex Jones and Ricky Wilson. “We had the read-through last week, in fact, so I know everything now.”
Harington admitted that he cried at the end, though he clarified that it didn’t necessarily have to do with the content of the script itself.
“You have to remember, I’ve done eight years of it. I think, no-one really cares about [Game of Thrones] more than us… It’s been an institution longer than any other institution I’ve been in. School, drama school, anything … I get a bit weepy thinking about it. It’s going to be to a strange year. Saying goodbye to everyone, having your last scene with this person or having your last scene with that person. Not only [are you] attached to it, loads of people around the world are attached to it.”
According to Harington, production is doing its best to remain as secretive as possible for season 8. “[I was told], ‘Don’t tell them when you’re filming. Don’t take pictures in Belfast. Don’t do all of that’,” he said. “It’s on lockdown!”
That stated, Alex Jones still kicked off the interview by announcing that Harington will start filming season 8 next week. Maybe “lockdown” is a relative term with Game of Thrones.
It seems that Gwendoline Christie’s getting ready for her return to set as well. Thrones hair designer Kevin Alexander posted a selfie he took with Christie after styling her Brienne-length locks.
“Had a fab afternoon with Gwen doing her colour and giving her a new hair do,” he wrote.
Hodor…
I’m already crying…
Let’s hope these scripts don’t find their way to reddit.
So sad to see it end!
Morgoth,
Let’s hope they do.
Can you imagine Tormund’s face if he saw Brienne’s locks all wavy and free? 😄
Melt down the Iron Throne Aegon!!! Break the wheel!!! Aegon made it, Aegon will destroy it bitchezzz.
Violator,
At least one page – one single page, please!!!
for a moment there I saw ‘Alex Jones’ and was incredibly and sincerely confused
I sympathize with Kit. He’s lived with Jon Snow for going on a decade, he’s embodied him, he’s brought him to life, he’s made him an icon that millions of fans around the world love. Now he knows how his story ends, and he can’t talk about it with hardly anyone, except for his fellow cast and crew members, who are all saying goodbye to their own characters and friends as well! The set is probably one big stew of emotion and memories. The only consolation is that they all have one another to lean on.
We’re going to be seeing a lot of these reflective, emotional interviews with cast members over the next several months as Game of Thrones approaches the end. If I read enough of them, I’m going to start crying too! As eager as I am to know how it all ends, I’m not ready to say goodbye to this wonderful show. Not yet.
On a happier note, I didn’t expect Brienne to have a new style going in to the final season. But she looks stunning, as Gwendoline always does. Tormund and Jaime are sure to take notice.
Violator,
I second that!
I’m going to be so depressed when this brilliant show ends. It’s still hard to believe there’s only six episodes left. I’m going to have to do a lot of rewatching in order to cope.
I wonder if Rose knows how it ends.
Jared,
That was my first thought: Jaime and Tormund vying for Brienne’s affections. Love Gwen. Love her hairdo.
And I wanna see Brienne & Arya team up and fight side by side: The Dynamic Duo.
For that matter, I wanna see Jon f*ck with Jaime a bit – payback for the way Jaime insulted Jon in S1 snd questioned his fighting abilities. (Look who’s the reknowned swordsman now, Kingslayer…)
Jon Targaryen I,
I don’t want the show to end either. I’d be on board with spacing out S8 over 10 episodes, even if each one is only ~ 40 minutes long.
It seems like a long way off, but 2019 will be here before you know it. And once S8 begins, it will be over in five short weeks. 😩
Gayle,
Of course. He told about his resurrection 😉
Ditto to all of this.
Plus, we should remember that several cast members who were hired fore the original pilot have been with the show since the summer of 2009 – eight years ago. They have been invested in this for years.
You and me, both lol
What am I going to do with a Game of Thrones-sized hole in my heart? 🙁
What will I fight with random strangers over? :O
Ten Bears,
Supposedly all the episodes are going to be longer next year, which makes me wonder why they don’t just have the regular 10 episode season. Maybe we’ll see why when the episodes come out, but I’m still a little bitter over it, ha ha.
Is 8 years a HBO thing?
Alba Stark,
“Plus, we should remember that several cast members who were hired forthe original pilot have been with the show since the summer of 2009 – eight years ago. They have been invested in this for years.”
____________________________
I’d made a list of characters who appeared in S1e1 and are still alive as of the end of S7. It’s not very long anymore. I think it’s down to 12 or 13. [I think the only casualty in S7 was Benjen Stark (Joseph Mawle) though he was kind of dead already; and I forget who “Qotho” (#13 below) is/was.]
S1e1 Characters Still Alive as of S7e7:
1. Jon Snow – Kit Harington
2. Arya Stark – Maisie Willuams
3. Sansa Stark – Sophie Turner
4. Bran Stark – Isaac Hempstead-Wright
5. Sandor Clegane – Rory McCann
6. Jaime Lannister – Nikoloj Coster-Waldau
7. Cersei Lannister – Lena Headey
8. Tyrion Lannister – Peter Dinklage
9. Daenerys Targaryen – Emilia Clarke
10. Jorah Mormont – Iain Glen
11. Theon Greyjoy – Alfie Allen
12. Illyrio Mopatis – Roger Allam
13.? Qotho ? – Dar Salim
Is it time for a “deadpool”, with odds, to wager on who doesn’t make it to the end?
HBO will drag out this farewell for years but enough about True Blood.
Ten Bears,
Qotho died back in Season 1. He was Khal Drogo’s bloodrider. Jorah killed him in S1E9 when he tried to stop Mirri Maz Duur’s ritual.
Yeah, the number of cast members who will have appeared in all eight seasons is quite small. If you extend it beyond the cast members who appeared in the pilot to include those who made their debut Season 1 and are still with us, the list still doesn’t expand that much. The only further additions I can think of besides the ones you named are Samwell Tarly (John Bradley), Jerome Flynn (Bronn), Conleth Hill (Varys), Joe Dempise (Gendry), Lino Facioli (Robin Arryn), and Hot Pie (Ben Hawkey). And I think we’ve seen the last of Robin Arryn and Hot Pie. And character-wise the Mountain, though he’s been recast.
It’s quite an exclusive club. The few, the proud, the Originals! That being said, people like Liam Cunningham, Gwendoline Christie, and Carice van Houten have been such prominent and loyal cast members for so long that they feel like they were there since the beginning, even though they joined up in Season 2.
Ten Bears,
Jared,
And to clarify, if you specify those cast members whose characters actually appeared in all eight seasons, the list grows even smaller. I believe it’s just Kit Harington, Maisie Williams, Sophie Turner, Nikolaj Coster-Waldau, Lena Headey, Peter Dinklage, Emilia Clarke, Iain Glen, Alfie Allen, John Bradley, Jerome Flynn, and Conleth Hill in that case.
Morgoth,
I look foreard to…I am this kind of person that needs to know. It does not affect my exeprience AT ALL, but I understand that spoilers are anoying to most.
so…we are all going to die from agony next season…OMG..Could be he to is depressed bcoz of his character are not going make it to the end?could be this?
Good. Now leak it!
Violator,
I agree.
Artemisia,
No, I don’t think that matters. It’s depressing because it’s gonna be the last time he sees all these GoT people. Whether his character dies or not doesn’t make a difference there.
Frey pie,
i agree..Of course will we have to wait to see what happens next
If he said that he cried at the end, THEN added the part about living with the character for eight years because he caught himself being too spoiler-ish – I would think it means that characters he’s grown to care about within the context of the show have a tragic ending, not his own character.
Without hearing the actual interview, I’m not willing to speculate on that so I’ll just assume that knowing the ending made the finality of it all seem more real to him.
LadyGoodman,
I far as I remember Elijah Wood also said that he wept after seeing the ending of the LOTR (the Return of the King). I did so too, but that’s off topic. The point is that the ending wasn’t tragic – Frodo sailed to the Undying Lands with a smile on his lips and everyone else lived happily ever after. So, the edding doesn’t have to be unhappy to make people cry – a happy ending may be even more tearful if done right. It’s just harder to make a happy ending right, than simply break viewers’ hearts by killing a beloved character.
Jared,
Thanks! I don’t recall a Curtain Call for Qotho. (Just kidding. I assume he was kind of a redshirt Dothraki?)
Season 1 seems like … a different lifetime.
Yes.
Dead
5.
6.
7.
10.
Never see again
12.
13.
The rest survive
You know everything Jon Snow!
Ten Bears,
GHOST!!! Please say he is still with us even though we haven’t seen him for ages. BTW missed ‘The One Show ‘ must see if I can catch on tinternet. Looking forward to Kit’s new series tonight whilst being battered by Brian🌧Also Rose says she is in Iceland with Kit in November.
LadyGoodman,
it could be and that …maybe Sansa dies [the one that he sworn to protect from any danger]by the hands of the NK..and he cant be able to defend her …bcoz of fighting with the others in the same time..In my book she will die apparently
LadyGoodman,
it could be and that …maybe Sansa dies [the one that he sworn to protect from any danger]by the hands of the NK..and he cant be able to defend her …bcoz of fighting with the others in the same time..In my book she will die apparently..Unfortunately
House Monty,
IMO, Tyrion will die, instead of Daenerys. Daenerys will simply discover that there are more important things that the Iron Throne.
House Monty,
House Monty,
House Monty,
Inga,
Ten Bears,
Inga,
Inga,
Inga,
Inga,
Arya,Jon,Danny,Jaime,Bran,Gendry and Breanne will survive at the end..bcoz they representing the 7 pointed Star …The Father=Jon,The Mother=Danny,The Warrior=Jaime,The Crown=Bran,The Smith=Gendry,The Maiden=Breanne and The Stranger=Arya…the rest along with Tyrion,Cercei,Euron,The Hound,Mountain,Beric,Mellisandre and the rest will die
Carole H,
You read my mind. Was adding Ghost and Nymeria to my S1e1 list.
Artemisia,
I like this theory.
Inga,
Daenerys discovering there are more important things than the Iron Throne to me is unsatisfactory ending since she already discovered that.
In Season 3 she decides ending slavery is more important.
In Season 5 she begins to focus on it again but only in order to “break the wheel”
In Season 7 she decides defeating the Nk is more important.
Artemisia,
Whilst I absolutely agree about the seven you have misread the crone and put the crown. IMO it will be Father – Jon, Mother- Daenerys, Warrior-The Hound, Maiden – Brienne, Smith – Gendry, Crone- Mellisandra, Stranger – Ayra
Daenerys will die in childbirth, perhaps giving birth to twins. Death by childbirth is one of Martin’s recurring themes. Her child will be the prince/princess that was promised.
House Monty,
she in S8 will discover that a family with Jon is than far more important than the Throne…In the HOY visions she leaves the Thrones room and reunited with Drogo and Rhaego..All they think that she will dies and reunited with them in the afterlife…WRONG …There is no afterlife after death…That prophesy shouldnt taken literally..Its a metaphor for FAMILY ..She will leave her idea for the Throne and will want to create a family with Jon..that support the HOY visions actually..She always have wanted to be on a family..with husband and child…She had realise that will fix the problem that she was grew up on a family ..she grew up as a orphaned beggar along with her abusive bro ..who never trait her as his real sister but as his own toy of torture..and her to be on a family and to raise kids with the things she never got as kid ..Love,respect and protection ..The same for Jon..He always had wanted a family to love him ..he never got that ..Only Ned ,Robb,Bran and Arya they had love him as true family member..but he hasnt a mother to love him..Cat treated him with hate and rejection,Sansa/Rickon ignored him and treated him like a bastard …He as Danny did find the respect and the love from strangers to them peoples..Danny find respect and love in Jorah,Ser Barristan,Missandei,Grey Worm,Tyrion ,in Dothraki and in the Meerenese citizens who she got conquered and ruled in S3-S6..Jon finds the respect and the love in Sam,Tormund,Ygreete,Nights Watchs,the Widlings,Davos,Lyanna Mormont and the Northeners ..They both wants to have their own family..and in the end at least will have a son/daughter who will be represent them and will be sit on the Iron Throne restoring a New House coming from and Ice[Jon] and Fire[Danny] and give in Westeros the King/Queen who they deserve ..There wont be bittersweet ending without that..They may die both and that could be the bitter part of the end ..but their child will be the sweet part of this…There is no logic Danny to die and Jon to live happily ever after on a Throne who he doesnt want ..Or both will die or both will live…There is no middle ground
Gerdhansel,
The child will be the future King/Queen of Westeros..The Prince that was Promise is already Jon and the Azor Ahai is already Danny
Carole H,
Thanks ….but also Bran making for the Crone ..He has also significant magical powers who could make him one of the 7 points of the star
Inga,
Thanks
Artemisia,
Absolutely, you may be correct and I read with interest your comments regarding family for Jon and Daenerys. Sadly Jon may well end up on the throne simply because he does not want it. But if he has to die (I hope not) I just want one scene where he is teaching his child to fight and he says ‘keep your shield up or I’ll ring your head like a bell’ or the next best thing Ayra teaching him/her and saying the same thing.
“The One Show” conversation was a good one – I saw it last night. The reason for having Kit on it now is that “Gunpowder” starts tonight on BBC1! (I’m sure somebody will have commented on this before now, so can only add I’m much looking forward to it. And that it’s good to have something about that time that doesn’t focus on Guy Fawkes but on the context…)
On the “One Show” it wasn’t so much an interview as Kit being the main ‘guest’ on the show. He was his usual polite, humorous and somewhat laid-back self and it was a joy to watch.
I don’t tend to be too annoyed by spoilers. I spoiled much of S7 for myself…accidentally, and I enjoyed the season all the same.
But when it comes to the ending of the series, I’d like to see it knowing as little information as possible, without having to dodge spoilers in social media or having a relative or friend saying “Hey did you see this spoiler?? This happens!”.
spaewife,
Just watched on catch up. It’s a pity he doesn’t like his hair, I love it. I am hoping he will loose his lovely locks in series 8. At least his hair is down in Gunpowder😘When he does cut his hair and shaves his beard he looks very young.
Carole H,
it could be but who knows…He ending on the throne and is very predictable and very cliche..because every fan almost expect that
Artemisia,
Sansa is unlikely to die. I can’t see how her death at this stage would serve any narrative purpose.
They’ve spent three seasons placing her at the centre of Northern politics and re-affirming her Stark-ness. Bran has relinquished his claim to Winterfell. They specifically focused last season on Arya coming to terms with her being Lady of Winterfell. Going forward, she is clearly meant to be the face of House Stark.
That’d all be a waste of time if they were just going to kill her off in the final act.
Plus, she is one of the few characters left in the show whose arc has been almost completely free of magic and focused purely on the personal and political side of the show. No visions, resurrections, warging, face-changing, dragons etc. Nor is she a “badass” fighter, knocking seven shades out of people left, right and centre.
The political side of the game will be represented come the end of the show and she is the prime candidate for that role.
The only possible circumstance in which I could see her dying would be if it was somehow Dany’s fault and served to turn Jon against her. But I think that’s extremely unlikely.
There are other big characters whose story arcs are more likely to culminate in their death next season, e.g. Jaime, Dany, Cersei, Jon, Theon…
Sansa seems like an obvious candidate to be killed off because she’s not a fighter and is more personally vulnerable than other characters. But narratively and thematically, her death at this stage wouldn’t make much sense.
r-hard,
SO MUCH YES.
Ten Bears,
Jaime and Bran is one of the reunions I’m most looking forward to. Jaime confessed to Catelyn, but do any of the other Starks know? The fangirl in me wants to see Jaime arrive at Winterfell (having been granted an armed escort by Edmure, of course), ask for an audience with Bran, and tell him he’ll accept any judgment he sees fit to pass–but that if granted mercy, Jaime will give his life defending the North from the Army of the Dead.
Too much?
Ramsay’s 20th Good Man,
Wouldnt?Do you think that GRRM my friend will let in the end all the characters[including Sansa] be happy or have a happy ending?..NO..There is a lot of sense if she dies…will have some Jonsa shippers crying over their TV or their PC and trying to burning everything with wildfire ….Of course im lol with this…In my opinion there she or will die or will stay unmarried in the end and be Lady of Winterfell alone…there is no other choice for her…There are no happy endings..just bad endings or bittersweet endings..no other choice…you choose what will take..
Ramsay’s 20th Good Man,
She is also a more obvious pick since she is not one of George’s five so if you wanted to pick a main character to go down but don’t want to bet against what George wrote in his original outline she is a good pick.
Having said that I think she lives partly for what you said. She is not a warrior. So harder to see her in direct danger.
Ramsay’s 20th Good Man,
Artemisia,
House Monty,
Everything depends on what arch or purpose Sansa is having next season. IMO, her main purpose will be orchestrating or instigating Cersei’s demise: she will be the one reminding Jon (and Dany) that Cersei is dangerous. But that implies that Cersei may hire assassins to take her out and maybe even succeed: in other words, Sansa’s death may serve the purpose of reminding everyone that Cersei poses a real threat. And all those talks about her not being safe in Winterfell and needeng some better guards may be a foreshadowing for that.
But on the other hand, Sansa really looks like a potential survivor and she and Tyrion may really end up as the regents of Westeros, if Jon and Dany die (it wouldn’t be the ending of my choice, but it still may happen).
Hahaha, I see what you did there. I’d thank you for a great laugh, except I had to clean a spray of Dornish red off my tablet #not_on
I’m usually not one for “celebrity gossip” but this makes me go a bit “aww…” It’s where these two young actors first met and fell in love, back in 2011, filming S2. They’ve taken their time, not rushed into things, but now they’re ready to make the big commitment. Iceland must be a special place for each of them.
Now, the interesting thing is: will Kit be filming GoT stuff in Iceland in November and Rose has time in her schedule to tag along for old times sake, or is it just a private romantic holiday?
I can’t imagine Iceland in November being a prime holiday destination, if it’s anything like my northern country at the time. Horizontal sleet, hardly any daylight and really, really dark before proper snows come (the white snow reflects some of the sparse light so it’s not so bad after that – if we get proper snows #damn_climatechange!) The conclusion I’m drawing from this tidbit is that Kit will be filming, Rose tags along for their private reasons.
Kit filming in Iceland means Jon Snow going beyond the Wall, is all I’m saying. The land of always winter, the WW ice stonehenge etc… Or maybe I’m totally mistaken and Kit and Rose both have a window in their busy calendars to have a romantic mini-break in the country they fell in love in, and it means nothing for GoT, haha!
Gerdhansel,
Dany’s mom and Jon’s mom both died giving birth to them. If Dany’s knocked up, you’re probably right. She’ll die in childbirth too.
Wolfish,
No, that sounds about right. Bran is finally going to remember Jaime pushed him, right?
The problem I have with this interpretation is that the North don’t adhere to the faith of the seven, so this ending would seem like an annihilation of their First Men, Old Gods worshipping culture. A cultural “assimilation” forced from above, deculturation of the northern people.
I don’t think the Faith is the answer. Rather the problem – or one of them.
Bran may remember, but will he tell anyone other than Jaime himself? Will he believe that his fall set him on the path to becoming the Three-Eyed Raven and fighting the War for the Dawn and therefore it was always meant to happen?
Alba Stark,
Plus, we should remember that several cast members who were hired fore the original pilot have been with the show since the summer of 2009 – eight years ago. They have been invested in this for years.
And for the younger cast, that’s been almost half of their life!!!
Jared,
And to clarify, if you specify those cast members whose characters actually appeared in all eight seasons, the list grows even smaller. I believe it’s just Kit Harington, Maisie Williams, Sophie Turner, Nikolaj Coster-Waldau, Lena Headey, Peter Dinklage, Emilia Clarke, Iain Glen, Alfie Allen, John Bradley, Jerome Flynn, and Conleth Hill in that case.
I believe that’s called ‘Making the Eight’ by the cast. When Sophie and Maisie got matching tattoos in 2016, they mentioned some cast agreement that all survivors into Season 8 would get a special tattoo, like the Fellowship members did for LotR (all but one). But IIRC they narrowed it even further to survivors from S1E1. If so, the future tattooees will be Kit, Emilia, Lena, Nikolaj, Peter, Maisie, Sophie, Iaaac, Alfie, Rory, and Iain. That’s 11 for the Eight. Crikey!
talvikorppi,
I think I wrote it in another thread, but filming in Iceland makes a lot of sense. The showrunners made a big stress on the mountain shaped as an arrowhead last season and the fandom imediately identified it with the location of the Night King’s creation we saw in S6. It reallly looks like the location should come up in the final season and the actual mountain is in Iceland. So, maybe Jon’s last one-on-one combat with the Night King will happen there or something equally pivotal. I hope we’ll get some reports: if the whole crew goes there it will be hard to miss.
Wolfish,
Jaime and Bran reunion is one of the things I’m most looking forward to in S8. They both have to confront the past, but in the light of the present. If Bran-bot lets his murder-crazy sister slash Jaime’s throat just like that, I’m going to be soooooo disappointed in Bran.
BTW, one thing I don’t like about the book to screen adaptation is that Jaime pushed Bran oot the windoo with his left hand in the show. In the books it was his right hand. The hand he did all the bad things with, starting with holding on to Cersei’s foot when he was born. The hand he loses in S3.
This is O/T but I’d also like to point out that both book and show, Jaime’s first instinct is to save the boy. He even tells Bran “Take my hand!” (and boy, didn’t his hand got taken! lol!) It’s only after he looks to Cersei/is prompted by her that he pushes Bran oot the windoo. With loathing. “The things I do for love.”
OK, y’all know I’m a huge Jaime fan, but Jaime + Bran reunion is top of my list, and I’m hoping Bran isn’t a petty, vengeanceful child but the three-eyed raven who realises that however bad Jaime’s act towards him was (and it is BAD, Jaime tried to kill him), it also set him on his path to realise his true potential – if Jaime hadn’t pushed him oot the windoo, Bran would’ve gone to KL with Ned and the girls, his head filled with songs and dreams of knighthood and glory – not unlike Sansa. Who knows what would’ve happened to him then. Dead or a hostage? With no way to pursue his psychic powers.
So yes, I want Jaime and Bran to meet and have a meaningful conversation. It’s important to Bran and it’s important to Jaime. I hope the show gives us at least something in the way.
Frey pie,
No, I don’t think that matters. It’s depressing because it’s gonna be the last time he sees all these GoT people. Whether his character dies or not doesn’t make a difference there.
Working together, sharing camaraderie,whinging about weather and studio conditions, etc–yes. But happily for them, they’ll see much of each other at awards shows, cons, film premieres, etc. Several of those currently based in London socialise frequently–Kit, Maisie, Sophie, Isaac for sure. However, even that will come to an end as Kit and Sophie will be old marrieds soon enough (I wager ST moves to the States), Maisie has a beau, and Isaac’s going to Uni in Birmingham. Whom GoT hath brought together, life will break asunder. Sigh.
Dead
4.
6.
7.
10.
11.
Everyone else survives, though needs be with the bitter balancing the sweet. I suspect much of that will involved bereaved survivors getting something good but not what they wanted. Ramsay’s 20th made a good point about Sansa being the face of the North. It’s ironic, since in S1 she desperately wanted to get away, and aped the Lannisters in hopes of becoming a proper Queen of the South. Since her and Arya’s arcs are often opposite sides of the same coin, Arya’s irony would be ending up in the South married to Gendry or even Tyrion, maybe as queen (though still living by her own rules as much as possible). As she said, “The world doesn’t just let girls decide what they want to be.” In point of fact, the GoT world doesn’t just let anyone decide what they want to be. And so it goes.
Slightly OT, but since it has been mentioned a few times, I have binged Gunpowder (although BBC aired episode 1 in the UK tonight, they released episodes 2 and 3 as a box set on their internet streaming platform BBC iPlayer) and it was completely worth the time I invested in it.
A fantastic series – with graphic violence at times, though anyone who has sat through Thrones will be able to watch it! It is a wonderful historical drama that really shows the truth of the times. It is honest and incredibly powerful viewing.
Kit’s performance is beautiful to watch, and Thrones wise it also features Mark Gatiss (Tycho Nestoris) and Kevin Eldon (Camello/Fermented crab Goldcloak #1).
I recommend it to one and all! 🙂
Ten Bears,
Alba Stark,
I go back and forth between believing that Bran remembers and believing that Bran doesn’t. In like fashion, I wonder whether he holds on to any negative thoughts about Jaime, since his crippling has, paradoxically, contributed to his understanding of his identity as the 3ER.
talvikorppi,
I couldn’t agree more!!!
talvikorppi,
So many great points! As for Arya and Bran… 1) It didn’t even occur to Arya to kill Jaime at the Twins, which is one of the things that indicated to me, even after she’d become the Teenage Mutant Ninja Murderqueen, that she was still discriminating in her killing. After all, she could have deeply hurt Cersei by killing Jaime, but not having anything to hold Jaime accountable for, didn’t. 2) I really don’t think Bran would/will want to punish Jaime. Most obviously, he no longer feels human emotion as we know it. Slightly less obviously, if he remembers (or is driven to remember by a confession) he will either recognize, or use his Bran-O-Vision to recognize, that Jaime’s act, despicable and unforgivable as it was, was akin to a crime of passion… committed in a very particular moment, and not indicative of everyday behavior (as it would be in, say, the Mountain). The idea of a Jaime/Bran reunion appeals to me because I see in Jaime the potential for the same thing that has already manifested itself in the Hound: true regret about past actions, and the capacity to do something tremendously good as penitence.
Wolfish,
About Bran… Do you know what the 3ER was talking about in this scene in 4×10 (in 3ER cave), i.e., what has Bran “lost” that he can/will find?
****.
3ER: Now you’ve come to me at last, Brandon Stark. Though the hour is late.
Bran: I didn’t want anyone to die for me.
3ER: He [Jojen] died so you could find what you have lost.
Bran: You’re going to help me walk again?
3ER: You will never walk again. But you will fly.
Ten Bears,
I don’t know, and if the answer is in the book(s), I don’t remember. But it’s a great question to consider!
On another note… Where have Wimsey and ACME been? I miss those two!
Wolfish,
I want see that too. In the main hall, and in front of everyone I want Bran to say something about having seen Jamie saving KL from the Mad King … which would also make it difficult for Danny to pursue Jamie for the death of her father.
But he’s arriving as an ally, so they may not address his past at all (expect for Bran). I don’t know what the other Starks know, but Brienne knows.
talvikorppi,
There are many hints who represent that ..The new gods are are the new faces of the old gods..Rhilor=Father=Jon,Faceless God=Stranger=Arya,Weirwood tree God=Crone=Bran,The Lion of the Night=Warrior=Jaime,The Weeping Lady=Mother=Danny,The Moon Pale Maiden=Maiden=Breanne and the Goat God=Smith=Gendry..The news gods are actually the old gods with other appearance
So, filming starts Monday and there is only one unit? We can bet they are starting in NI, right?
I wonder if it is as simple as him rediscovering purpose in his life? I remember a scene in season one (I think in 103, Lord Snow) in which Bran asks Robb if it is true that he won’t walk again, and Bran says he would rather be dead.
Bran’s dreams of being a knight and joining the Kingsguard are over and as much as Ned tries to make the best of things to Arya, listing off what Bran may do instead, Bran himself doesn’t have those dreams. Training to become the Three-Eyed Raven gives him a focus.
Alba Stark,
Thank you about the OT about the Gunpower. As a historian (and historican fiction writer) I’m interested in that almost more than in GOT. It’s a unique case to see a story addressed by an descendent of one of the “bad guys” and trying to explain or even justifie (?) his ancestor’s standpoint. I really wonder how our dear Kit – or I should rather say Mr. Christopher Catesby Harington – dealt with all that moral complexity and its implications. Please, tell me that it’s more than just “good Catholics” vs “bad Protestants”.
From an historical point of view (and I’m also a bit of a history nerd!) I don’t believe you will be disappointed. It rightly places Catesby at the core of the plot and relegates Guy Fawkes to the supporting role he actually played and not the overstated myth that has been sustained for the last four centuries.
Gunpowder is a reflection of the time in which it is set and is an accurate depiction of the persecution and violence that existed at the time. It can be uncomfortable viewing at times, but that is intentional. It is meant to force you to think.
And Gunpowder is about much, much more than good Catholics vs bad Protestants. Each historical character is complex and rounded, and the show explores the why of the plot – essentially what drove these men to such lengths. I was very, very impressed with it and will definitely re-watch.
Agree
Alba Stark,
Thank you very much for your answer. Could you recommend some proper analysis of the Gunpowder series? I have found a few today on the mainstreem media but they were rather shallow. We have a lot of debates over all kinds of historical fiction in our region, so it would be really interesting (and useful) to learn how these issues are addressed in the Anglosaxon world.
talvikorppi,
Or honeymoon 💖
Alba Stark,
Aghh no spoilers, I don’t want to know how it ends lol 💣💥🔥But yes I really enjoyed it, quality drama again from the BBC.
This has probably been mentioned elsewhere, but in case it hasn’t, there was an interview with Kit in the Guardian yesterday. He talks a bit about himself, GoT, Gunpowder and what he may do in the future. No spoilers though. Fave bit: when talking about the pilot for GoT he says: D&D “have a copy they use to keep him in line. “They say, if I ever piss them off too much, they’ll release it on YouTube. Every now and then, they send me a screengrab, just as a threat.”” 😀
Lulus Mum,
Yes, read that. I’d love to see the pilot, perhaps they will put it in the extras of the DVD for the last series 😭
Haha!!! That’s too funny. 😜 Although from the reception we hear that they got for the pilot, I think it’s more of a threat for D&D themselves than anyone! 😉
Pigeon,
Eh,i’m sure they are used with the bashing that they received over the years from some stupid individuals of this fanbase .
All the reviews I’ve seen have been in mainstream media too. I don’t tend to read a lot of TV reviews and analysis. Sadly too many of the pieces I have seen focus on the use of violence (which was both period-relevant and integral to the plot) and not on the amazing storytelling, acting and production.
Agree! 🙂
Carole H,
The people involved keep saying the pilot’s awful but I took that to mean in comparison to how the rest of it turned out. So not terrible, just not very interesting/difficult to follow, which isn’t the same thing. I’m sure they’ll do some fabulous warts and all mega box set collection with more extras than you can shake a stick at when S8’s finished, so they might include it.
Pigeon,
Mutual blackmail: we go down, we’re taking you with us. They have learned from GRRM’s best plotters! 😉
Lulus Mum,
Yup, which means I’ll have to fork out for the mega box set with dragons, eggs, Longclaw, direwolves and the whole shebang even though I’ve already forked out over seven years. I could buy a small house with what this programme has cost me by the time it finishes.
Carole H,
Not to mention the emotional toll! 😜
Alba Stark,
Thank you anyway. I guess I’ll have to do some search and research myself after the Gunpowder series are over. From what I saw in the comment sections in your mainstream media, not everyone is happy with the provided interpretation but I couldn’t quite get why.
Lulus Mum,
Thank you for the link to the interview. A great read: now I want to see the pilot even more:). But not as much as I want to see the Gunpowder.
Alba Stark,
It may well be as subtle as that. Not that I’d mind. 🙂
Alba Stark,
Any idea if it will come to BBC America channel eventually?
Inga,
Hi Inga *waving as always*
I haven’t watched Gunpowder yet but just seen that it has been strongly criticised for “graphic” and “gory” violence, including a woman stripped naked in public and tortured to death by pressing and a priest being disemboweled. Apparently it’s all based on historical fact and warnings about the content were broadcast beforehand. Sounds ok for seasoned GoT fans though, if we haven’t got used to horrific sights by now we never will 🙁 As a bonus, the picture they’ve used makes it look as if Kit is in the place under King’s Landing where Qyburn was showing Cersei his anti-dragon gun: cross-over alert! 😉
Edit: I see Alba Stark has already effectively said this, so I’m seconding them.
Lulus Mum,
go see Hannibal …eating/cooking human flesh/meat for dinner..more gore violence there
Artemisia,
I’m not a fan of gore at all, but watching GoT has hardened me to it, to an extent. I only find what to me is really realistic stuff disturbing and saw a bit of Hannibal, but it was so stylised and unreal looking that it had no effect at all, whereas I had to shut my eyes watching the guys on Jackass giving each other paper cuts. I’m squirming just thinking about it. If GoT had death by paper cut I’d have to skip that scene entirely. That’s why I like spoilers, so I’m ready, just in case. Mountain comes into view holding a box of photocopying paper, I’m changing channels pronto! 😉
I hope that’s not how it ends. That would be a terrible, ‘simple,’ and dare I say cliché ending for her story. With her we have one of the primary protagonists, a heroine of the people and one namesake of the story’s title. We’ll have followed her young life as she survives all the struggles and warfare through eight seasons and books… To finish her off in childbirth would be horrible. I would be seriously pissed if that’s George’s intention.
Stark Raven’ Rad,
Neither Bran nor the Hound appeared on screen in season 5, though. Guess it’s up to the cast how to count that.
Lulus Mum,
you are lol..ok everyone with his phobias …i agree and .for me seeing Ramsay flay peoples in S4-S6 it was too much..Imagine someone to remove your skin slowly like a paper…its painful and nightmarish as fuck
Lulus Mum,
They are all getting their knickers in a twist about the violence, which is gory, but nothing that hasn’t been seen before, the only reason GOT has been made a comparison is because Kit is in it and it is his project and on that subject, he takes his part very well and he has let his locks loose (I think I have said that already, I think I’m obsessed with his hair) lol
Lulus Mum,
Hi, wawing back.
I’ve just watched the first part of Kit’s “baby”. OK, there was an execution of an old Catholic lady and a young priest but it haven’t seen anything to whine about “graphic violence”: those who faint at the sight of blood shouldn’t watch hisorical fiction at all.
However, I had a problem with the interpretation of the historical events – at least so far. Forgive me for being a dumb foreigner from the other side of Europe, but I’ve always thought that it was good that the Gunpowder plot failed. It would have been an act of terrorism, had it suceeded, right? But from what I saw it looks like the plotters are presented as protagonists… So, my brain is in short circuit: can anyone explain me why the guys who wanted to blow up the parliament are seen as good? Was it a band parialment or a bad king? I remember there were series called “Gunpowder, Treason, and Plot” which also showed King Jaimes in a rather negative light and I was also quite confused about it. Sorry for OT, but it would be nice to get an explanation.
Clob,
Don’t get me wrong. I’d hate a “Dany dies” ending. In fact, I don’t understand why so many have seized on the word “bittersweet”, and interpreted it to mean either Dany must die or Jon must die.
I do NOT want to finish watching this show feeling bummed out and pissed off.
I was once watching a movie and really liked it… until the very end when I hated, hated, hated it:
A soldier braves the horrors of war and endures all manner of hardships to make it home to his sweetheart. Then, five minutes later, for no reason at all, he runs outside and gets killed. The End. The movie was
Wolfish,
Yeah, where’d they go?
Wolfish,
“Teenage Mutant Ninja Murderqueen”
– 😁 I may have to steal that!
Most people I know rate Jon’s King in the North moment as one of the best moments in the show.
I have a hard time believing this show is going to go with a Dany dies in childbirth scene in its last episode versus a Dany and Jon coronation scene with a special Ramin Djwadi score.
I have (or had) long thought Dany would die at the end, probably in childbirth. I am beginning to think she and Jon will both survive. But — she HAS to either be pregnant, or already have given birth. For a barren Queen to be on the Throne, alone or as consort to Jon, is a lousy end for Westeros, leaving the future fate of the continent in limbo. Monarchs without legitimate heirs and no close relatives to create them in their stead are bad news for their realms; look where it got the kingdoms of King Arthur and Alexander the Great. Yes, heirs can be named, but named heirs tend to be challenged by force. And with a populace mostly illiterate, Westeros is not remotely ready for any semblance of modern representative democracy; democracy, representative or direct, would be much easier to implement in a city-state like Meereen. Jon is too honorable to take a concubine on whom to sire legitimized heirs, so unless Tyrion or possibly Jaime turns out to be a secret Targaryen and can take on the function of designated Targaryen baby maker (I doubt this scenario) Dany must either die, prove fertile, or fail to gain the Throne. Her having a child may be her ticket to live. If she remains barren, the bittersweet ending could be that Jon, in love with her, refuses to marry her because he knows as the true heir he has the obligation to produce heirs.
Ten Bears,
The way I see it, there seem to be two main reasons why people think one of them has to die:
1. Jon and Dany ending the series married and ruling together is too “Disney,” but both of them dying is too tragic, so in order to fulfill the bittersweet ending that GRRM wants, one of them has to die.
2. They can’t stay together because of the incest, so one of them has to die in order for the other to sit on the Iron Throne.
I actually used to think Dany would die because of her seeming inability to have children, but they brought that fact up WAY too many times the last two episodes for that to be the case. And her dying in childbirth does seem like kind of a weak end for her character, regardless of there being foreshadowing for it (I’ve never really thought Jon would die because that would make his parentage pointless).
Plus, Melisandre referring to them as “ice and fire,” in addition to all of the parallels between the two, seems to be setting them up for ruling together, incest be damned!
Jon Targaryen I,
MSM,
I love how the incest ending is too disney
House Monty,
Exactly, LOL. When’s the last time a major motion picture or television show has portrayed a relationship of this sorts in such a sympathetic way? Not exactly Hollywood.
Inga,
I’ve watched all three episodes, and while I kind of agree with you that the plotters seems to be the protagonists, I think the second episode in particular shows that what they’re planning is a bad thing. And I honestly can’t wait for the reaction to the other two episodes when the first had people buzzing like this! It’s been three days and people are still discussing its content on social media, there’s think-pieces in the papers from historians etc (which I’ll assume was the point of the show, but congratulations to Kit and the rest for creating it).
Ten Bears,
Do not watch the movie Claire in motion. Started off promising. Guy goes missing after he set out on nature hike, wife and kid dealing with his disappearance, wife meets and is suspicious of female friend of his.
This drama is told primarily (though not exclusively, we see a reasonable amount of Cecil & Wade) from the perspective of the plotters. The intent is to demonstrate WHY these men were driven to plan an act of extreme violence. A key aspect of this was the oppression they faced simply because they wished to practice their religion.
If we look at the modern world, whenever an act of extreme violence takes place (a bombing, mass shooting etc) we all ask why? What drove this person/these people to do such a thing? For me, that is what the first episode of Gunpowder is about. It is about giving the audience an insight into the reality of being a Catholic in early 17th Century England and how this contributed to the plotters following the path they did. If isn’t about justifying it, but trying to explain how it came about – if that makes sense? And, I think, about demonstrating that if you oppress people for long enough, whatever the circumstances, they will eventually fight back.
Don’t worry, Inga, about being unsure of the historical context – people in the UK are raised with the story of Guy Fawkes and the Gunpowder plot and many have no idea who Catesby was and how he was involved. The mythology focuses on Fawkes.
Artemisia,
Realistic probably wasn’t the right word to use, but I can’t think of another one at the moment. Your phrase “the stuff of nightmares” sums it up really. Things which are horrible but incredibly unlikely to happen to me, or don’t seem very real, don’t bother me much to watch. But something I have experience of, like paper cuts, makes me wince at the memory.
Ten Bears,
I’ve watched the film, but never read the novel (on my shelf with a zillion other things in my reading queue). It won the National Book Award!
Regarding Dany, I think people keep on forgetting the recurring ‘Home’ theme in her arc. Last season they very pointedly had her say that Dragonstone didn’t feel like home to her. Is Westeros in general going to feel any different? She’s spent practically her entire life on another continent that operates under different laws and belief systems. I strongly doubt that she’s just going to slot in as Queen in a country she doesn’t know, and with subjects who won’t necessarily trust her, especially as the bulk of her military strength comes from ‘foreign hordes’. It’s doubtful that her dragons will survive anyway, but how/where would she keep them when King’s Landing, the seat of Targaryen power, is densely populated and she knows that chaining them up in the dragon pit led to the demise of her House’s power? If Dany lives, I suspect she’ll head back to Essos with Jon’s children and go about founding an Eastern dynasty.
At this point, I can’t even see Jon ruling either. For sure, he has many qualities that Dany lacks, but his knowledge and acceptance of what it takes to be King is limited. Before heading to Dragonstone, he’d never even left the North before, and a working knowledge of the country and the people he’s governing over is absolutely essential. I really don’t want Jon to die, but him being the sacrificial lamb in some way is really plausible. I sort of subscribe to him becoming Night King 2.0 as well.
If there is any sort of throne to rule from by the end of all this, I really think people are going to be surprised by the identity of the person who sits on it. I keep wracking my brains about who’s best suited to be King, and I keep on coming back to Jaime. He’d be as reluctant to rule as Jon already is, BUT he understands the politics and has an almost encyclopaedic knowledge of Westeros and it’s noble families thanks to Tywin forcing him to read as a boy. He’s also had a ringside seat for three terrible rulers, Aerys, Robert and now Cersei, and so he knows how not to do the job.
Jon Targaryen I,
Lone Star
Wolfish,
I’m sure the book is great. The movie made no sense. Here are a few more movies with dumb deaths at the end:
ygritte,
Thanks. I’ll avoid it.
Dani,
Well, Jon actually has a highborn education just as Jaime does. While their first-hand experiences and applied knowledge of politics may differ (both have served different leadership positions), they were both educated under a maester. At the very least, in the books, Jon’s thoughts in his POV reveal his thorough knowledge of Westerosi history and noble families. What you describe as Tywin forcing Jaime to learn how to read sounds a bit like Maester Luwin making Jon and the other Stark kids learn their history:
The show does not outright mention Jon’s knowledge of Westerosi history much, particularly because we don’t have access to his inner thoughts as we do in the books, but it is there. He does know who the various noble families are and is aware of historical events and stories as would any other child who has been raised with a noble’s education under a maester. As a result, I’m not sure that limited knowledge of the realm is an argument – particularly if (as D&D said) the show’s story is heading in generally the same direction as the books, based on the outline GRRM provided in the case that the show went beyond ADWD.
However, Jaime has witnessed more scheming at a southern court and he has travelled more in his lifetime, yes. At the same time, Jon has also worked with a king (Stannis) – plus, he has been a king himself. Jaime has worked with two notorious kings. Jon’s first-hand knowledge of King’s Landing is limited but he has been brought up in the North (the largest and most unruly region in Westeros), worked in the North, lived beyond the Wall and knows those cultures well – which is a unique experience. Jaime’s first-hand knowledge of the North is limited, but he has lived and worked in King’s Landing and travelled to all of Westeros. As a result, I think the two characters have different sets of knowledge 🙂
By that same token, I think Dany also has unique experiences of her own to bring to the table as queen. Yes, Dany wants to be queen while Jon (and probably Jaime) don’t want to be king. However, Dany has lived and led different cultures as a queen and a khaleesi, and worked to change things, as Jon had tried to do as Lord Commander with the wildlings and the Night’s Watch. Yes, neither was terribly successful but it does add to their first-hand experiences.
I think all three would bring something to the table. I can’t predict how well it would go for any of them, but they all have experience for the position. I honestly don’t know who would be best.
Inga,
Hi again. Sorry, wasn’t ignoring you. Tbh the gunpowder plot, like many other historical events, is something most of us Brits don’t know that much about ourselves. People tend to know at least some of the main facts, like on 5 November 1605 a group of plotters were caught trying to blow up Parliament and kill King James I, in the hope of restoring a Catholic monarchy. But that’s it, not the context of how things came to be that way, what happened as a result, how much support they might have had etc.
Guy Fawkes is the one who’s almost always mentioned in connection with it. November 5th was always called Guy Fawkes night when I was kid and everyone assumed GF had been burned at the stake, because a bonfire was a big part of it.
Most people’s knowledge could probably be summed up by some hash tags: #Guy Fawkes #5 November #blow up Parliament #kill the King #bonfire #fireworks #Catholics. History buffs (or Kit fans) aside, I doubt many people know who Robert Catesby was.
Ten Bears,
I don’t know much about it, but I’ve seen that movie mentioned around here. I was referring to movies and TV shows meant for a wide audience though, so I believe my point still stands.
Jon Targaryen I,
I’m not sure what you mean by “movies and TV shows meant for a wide audience” – and honestly – I’m not trying to argue with you.
“Lone Star” (1996) was written and directed by John Sayles, and has some big name stars. The cast includes: Chris Cooper, Matthew McConaughey, Elizabeth Pena, Frances McDormand, and Kris Kristofferson. If you’d like to check out a relatively spoiler-free review by
Siskel & Ebert, here’s a link.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eCVzzRXc5Ws