Game of Owns: The House of Black and White

14 Comments

1. Eric is in Europe! Well, not on the continent but still.

2. If Brienne was wise, she would have pledged her sword to Sansa, swearing to protect her, yet not trying to take her away from Baelish.

   1) What can Brienne offer her otherwise? With Baelish, Sansa has swords, money, and an actual plan. What would Brienne have done with her if Sansa did agree to leave? They have no where else to go. No plan from Brienne.

   2) But by joining Baelish, she can keep an eye on Sansa and Baelish has a strong sword besides them. Win-Win for everyone.

   Meanwhile… Hey, Brienne: How come you didn’t mention to Sansa YOU SAW HER SISTER?!?!

3. JoJoSoPhat,

   Actually I thought Brienne played that pretty well. LF was clearly fine with Brienne hanging around, so she could have done the “sworn sword” option, but then Brienne would be somewhat under control of LF. I think the “follow and lurk just in case” option is the best, because then she retains her autonomy and is there when LF’s plans inevitably benefit him at the expense of Sansa. Brienne really seems to be learning how to play. She sized up the situation and acted fast, probably in the best possible way. If she’d stayed I think LF would have forcibly gotten rid of her in his own way; he knows she actually does have Sansa’s best interest at heart and would eventually be competition for Sansa’s loyalty.

   And I think Sansa made the right choice, too, btw. She actually is better off with LF *at the moment*, because he has plans and resources. But I’m sure at some point she’s going to want another option.

4. Doran was in a wheelchair. It makes Ellaria’s comment “You sit here in your chair doing nothing” that much more insulting.

5. Blind Beth,

   Your points are sound. Yes, if Brienne just lurks and waits for her chance then she has the opportunity to assist Sansa when absolutely necessary. I actually think Baelish will be leaving Sansa alone since we see that scene of his giving Sansa words of vengeance while she’s teary-eyed. If that’s the case, then Brienne will be able to swoop in and be her muscle.

   And you’re right about Sansa making the right choice. In the big picture, Baelish would have never let her go since she’s pivotal in whatever plan he has right now. Stay on his good side until he shows his hand.

   They look like they’re heading North. Sansa’s territory. Once she’s on her own land she has all the advantage.

6. JoJoSoPhat,

   I wouldn’t call a Bolton stronghold completely Sansa’s territory… this could go equally as badly as it could good… leaves me a little nervous

7. Baelish met with Cat in season 1, so it wasn’t just the Bitterbridge meeting along with Brienne.

   Sansa doesn’t know of any connection between Jaime & Brienne.

   Letting underlings take too much initiative is how Japan got entangled in WW2. Good on Dany for smacking that down.

8. I’m coming to terms that zach does read the books Cuz I think it be much more enjoyable for him. But I love Eric’s unsullied takes. Either way as I was listening to this episode and stewing over the omission of Ariane I was thinking to myself”I hope Micah doesn’t tell the other two unsullied about the changes from the books”, because I was thinking of the enjoyment I would get from later reads hearing Zach and Eric’s reactions when realizing how changes effect the storyline. So going forward I ask please, refrain from dropping Book changes to the unsullied. And I vote Zach reads ahead and Eric stay unsullied.

9. I have kind of an issue with people who are looking at the Small Council scene and saying “yay, Kevin! boo, Cercei!” From our perspective, we know that Cercei’s decision making skills are questionable and that Cercei and Margery are both trying to use Tommen for their own ends regardless of what he wants. HOWEVER, that is not the perspective Kevan Lannister is coming from. He hasn’t been in the capital, he doesn’t know who’s been making what decisions. He just straight-up doesn’t respect Cercei based on the fact that she is neither the king nor Tywin. And no, Tommen surely did not say all the things Cercei claims. But Tommen is, what 14? He’s never been in a position of power. Kevan’s certainly right in saying that Tommen should be present, active, and learning. But everything after that is out of line. Cercei has actually been in a position of responsibility, navigating the murky waters of Kings Landing, dealing with kings, hands, and everyone else. And she is Tommen’s mother, which means that she is on his side. She’s not trying to usurp the throne from him or anything. From Kevan’s perspective, there is no legitimate reason to dismiss Cercei, and his little “you’re not the king, I’m going home!” tirade is WAY out of line. He’s not questioning her based on real reasons, simply on the fact that she is “just” the Queen Mother. The fact that Queen Mother is considered a position of no authority is ragingly sexist in itself (in RL and Kevan’s Westerosi views). There are no “King Fathers”. Kings have authority until they die. I’m betting even a King Consort would not be summarily dismissed as having no authority once his wife died. As far as Kevan knows Cercei is performing a perfectly legitimate function (seriously have we EVER seen a king at a small council meeting in the whole series?), and if he has doubts he should go to her and Tommen privately. In regards to Cercei “sending Kevan away,” that’s actually not true. He’s sending himself away to sulk because…the king was not at the Small Council meeting, as per usual? Oh, and how many dissenting voices did Tywin keep around? Don’t recall anyone arguing with him much. Just lots of people either saying “yes, Tywin” or getting verbally skewered. And when did Tywin ever take anyone’s advice, including his children’s–or Kevan’s? And how many secret plans did Tywin enact without feeling it was anyone else’s place to know about them? But when Cercei wants loyal allies around her they are “sycophants.” And when Cercei wants to keep a super-sensitive secret mission on the DL she is The Worst. Show-Kevan’s misogyny is really obvious and gross.

   (In the show) Tywin should have just made Cercei his heir instead of horse-trading her to get in with the new king. Would have saved everyone a lot of trouble.

   (But I love the podcast! Secretly devoured it at work! Just keep hearing all this “go Kevan!” stuff in lots and lots of people’s reactions to the show and needed to soap-box.)

10. Blind Beth,
    Excellent points. I’m of two minds on the whole council scene. Kevan is certainly right to be suspicious of Cersei’s decisions because if past is prologue none of it bodes well. But that wasn’t the entire basis of his distrust. It was also based on “you are ONLY the Queen Regent”. So yeah, it’s not all “go Kevan!” for me. I mean, I can’t stand Cersei (Lena does such a good job of making you despise her) but that doesn’t mean I’m gonna let Kevan’s blatant patriarchal BS slide either.

11. I’m just gonna go ahead & attribute that Braavos gutter shot to Mike Slovis

    #podsmile

12. Kevan knows Cersei has made some terrible decisions, for instance in handling Joffrey (since he was Tywin’s right hand man prior to him sending Tyrion to King’s Landing because Cersei was making a mess). Most likely, Tywin has continued to converse with Kevan through all the letters he was writing in season 3. So yes, Kevan probably has an inkling of what was going on in King’s Landing.
    Moving on to the council scene, it’s blatantly obvious that Cersei is deciding everything, and, even worse, is not prepared to have a Hand named until Tommen comes of age. Moreover, there is no regent appointed. I see why Kevan takes offense: Cersei does not respect Tywin’s legacy, tradition, nor any of the councilors who are present. Mace falls for her bribery because he is an oaf, Pycelle has no real power. She has just appointed a disgraced maester as Tommen’s master of whisperers because he is loyal to her, something she openly states.

    Let’s dissect Kevan’s argument with Cersei. He has just witnessed Cersei deciding everything to consolidate her informal hold over the iron throne, so he asks that the king will give his own judgment, and that he should learn. Cersei’s reply is that he is learning, by giving her the authority to decide. This deepens Kevan’s concern. Following this, he explicitly states he came to the capital to mourn Tywin and pay his respects to Cersei too, but that he will not be used as a puppet in a cabinet of puppets. This is a core concern: Kevan has lived in Tywin’s shadow all his life, actually is quite capable, but is not recognized as such by many people. After this, Cersei discloses Jaime is on a mission, but refuses to share with the council the contents of this mission. This is the final straw: Kevan sees Cersei is usurping all authority, and refuses to acknowledge it. For me, the main element which speaks for Kevan here is that he does not attempt to convince the other councilors of Cersei’s illegitimacy because she is a woman, he merely leaves, not wishing to participate in what is a mockery of the small council.

    Is there some misogyny? Perhaps (and seeing the sharpness he lays on the word ‘mother’, perhaps likely), but their discussion cannot be reduced to this. It’s a mutual demand for respect.
    It would be a shame if they made Kevan a misogynist, perhaps we’ll see further in the season.

13. Lollius Palicanus,

    Well, every other male Lannister is a raging misogynist… except Tommen, and Lancel I suppose?

14. I love Eric’s own <3

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