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After a truly epic finale to season 5, fans and critics alike are still buzzing with comments, questions, and discussion points. With so much given to us in the finale, it’s no surprise we’re still talking about it. So, without further ado: let’s get to it!
And of course, let’s not forget Watchers’ own Sullied and Unsullied recaps!
Reviews for Book Readers:
Alyssa Rosenberg, Washington Post
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Sean T. Collins, Rolling Stone
James Hibberd, Entertainment Weekly
Neil Miller, Film School Rejects
Unsullied Book-Spoiler-Free Recaps:
Laura Stone, Hey, Don’t Judge Me
Stephanie Merry, Washington Post
Let us know what you thought of the critic’s reviews in the comments below!
And that is all my friends! Until Season 6!
When does season 6 start filming?
Hoyti Von Totiy,
Need more casting lists…. More information.. anything.
Hoyti Von Totiy,
I saw July in another thread
The most pertinent link is that Kit Harington HAS actually cut his hair.
I’m going to throw this on here, because it’s a really great article on GoT’s themes on morality, written by regular recapper Sean T. Collins. Hope you enjoy.
http://www.vulture.com/2015/06/game-of-thrones-no-good-deed-go-unpunished.html
Nadia,
Do you have a link for that?
Nadia,
the interview was back in Jan2015, his hair has grown since then. He was on a talk just last week , his hair’s longer and he’s looking scruffy
Ser Florian,
It’s from earlier this year, after filming was done (I believe), but it puts to rest the idea that he can’t cut his hair at all. Either he CAN cut it, or he can’t but he did it anyway, which means he’s out for the year.
It’s definitely still much much shorter than Jon Snow length, even currently.
http://entertainthis.usatoday.com/2015/01/08/game-of-thrones-kit-harington-hair-spoilers/
Compare how long it is on the show to this:
http://tomandlorenzo.com/2015/06/kit-harington-heads-to-the-jimmy-kimmel-live-studios/
maia,
Indeed… Here is his hair from 4 days ago.
http://tomandlorenzo.com/2015/06/kit-harington-heads-to-the-jimmy-kimmel-live-studios/
He mentioned the hair thing in January, then got a very slight trim… Probably because after he brought it up, someone said “hey, it’s ok to take a few inches off, it’ll be back to the required length by July”. Unless he’s had a buzzcut since Saturday.
maia,
It’s longer, but look at season 5 pictures. It’s much longer than it is right now.
I just don’t think judging his hair length is a real indication of whether he’s dead or not.
Nadia,
Your first link is from the 8th of January. Your second link is from the 12th of June.
I´m actually banned from speaking on this matter for my previous crimes so ill just throw this link in here:
http://www.hitfix.com/harpy/everyone-shut-up-about-kit-haringtons-non-existent-haircut
Ser Florian,
Yes, I am aware. I’m saying that this talk that he’s contractually not allowed to cut his hair is meaningless.
He DID cut it in January, after filming.
It’s still not as long as Jon Snow’s in season 5. It’s significantly shorter, honestly look at multiple stills of JS in Season 5.
He HAS cut his hair, whether he is or isn’t under contract for season 6. It has a ways to grow still to be at JS level, so maybe he isn’t filming right away in July.
Nadia,
It’s not a drastic haircut.Definitely,not like the one from NCW between S03/S04 or God forbid bald like Varys.That would be a problem.
Actually,he’s allowed to cut his hair to a certain length.No more than that and that’s our case.He always said,how he’s gonna cut his hair(drastic change),and be done with it.His current haircut looks Jon Snow type very much or slightly shorter.Maybe Jon wil have a bit shorter hair.Are we seriously debating his haircut? What the… 😀
Geralt of Rivia,
Haha this is what the troll GRRM’s delays have reduced everyone to – measuring the length of Kit Harington’s curls.
He did the Coldplay video 3 weeks ago and his hair was show length.
I don’t see why his hair has to be the exact length it was during S5 filming for it to be “Jon Snow” hair. It’s plenty long enough now that nobody would notice the 1/2-1 inch difference, and if they do I honestly don’t think it matters. Maybe dying caused a growth stunt.
To cross fandoms here, Dan Radcliffe’s hair changed drastically between each HP film. Granted, we hadn’t seen Harry for 3 months (HP universe) between each film but even then the growth was unrealistic. If they bring him back mid/late s6, I don’t think the hair will be an issue.
Hodor Targaryen,
I really really like that. Think I’ll send it to some of my disheartened friends…
Oh, um, sorry didn’t mean to post this in the middle of such a serious discussion 🙂
Feel as though a lot of great tuff in the episode has been overlooked because of the fuss around Jon Snow and to a lesser extent Stannis.
OK, really ??
Are we making Jon Snow´s return in S6 dependent on Kit Harrington´s fucking haircut ?
Hey mods, can we please install a *Kit Harrington Hairlength Counter*, so we can monitor this from now on ?
In the war of 5 Kings only Balon Greyjoy is still alive according to the show…SMH – Seriously….Balon Greyjoy is still alive and Stannis is dead…. take a minute and digest this folks. I am not a fan of Stannis by any stretch of the imagination and I have loved the show from S1E1…but I find this to be a form of Adaptation Malpractice!!!!
After reading all these comments, I find it kind of funny how Kit’s hairdo is what determines a character’s fate.
Oh Prophetic hair, what will become of his welfare?
Should we all care that is body wasn’t flared?
flintwielder,
If you don’t think they’re deliberately playing that up to be trolls, you’re wrong. They WANT people to be talking about his hair — there’s a reason it’s brought up both by journalists and D&D/Kit consistently, especially in the aftermath of season 5. You think it’s just random that the article made a clear point to reference the hair/contract + that the cut his hair a week after the interview?
Everyone knows the length of his hair isn’t determining whether Kit is on the show. The point is that they use it on purpose.
Does anybody consider the possibility that his hair could simply be different after a resurrection event perhaps involving fire? It would also help signify a change in “Jon” as I am sure there will be changes.
Buzzfeed always updated their worst-best episodes list at the end if each season. It’s a fun read. http://www.buzzfeed.com/adambvary/all-30-game-of-thrones-episodes-ranked-from-worst-to-best#.jmVkzGeQZk
TheTouchOfFrost,
In some ways, it’s kind of justified. Questions over Jon Snow’s fate were pretty much invited when they had Melisandre show up at the Wall, and questions like that really do affect the impact of that scene.
I find it strange that people think Stannis is still alive though. I thought that was pretty clearly final – I hope in the future they decide to show the body, even after a sword stroke. First the Hound (probably dead) and now Stannis, it is too much.
I felt that, despite some really good scenes with Cersei, Stannis and Jon Snow, there were so many cliffhangers jammed into this episode that it felt like an unsatisfying end to the season. The fate of the Tyrells, the Sons of the Harpy conflict, Arya’s training…all things that had been built up to in the season, and they don’t feature here. That reflects on the season generally, but it also hurts my enjoyment of this episode in particular.
If you want to read even more, and from a non-professional writer to boot, my review is here: https://brendantbewley.wordpress.com/2015/06/16/review-of-game-of-thrones-season-5-finale-mothers-mercy/
Also, I recently updated my ranking of the Season 5 episodes. https://brendantbewley.wordpress.com/2015/06/07/game-of-thrones-ranking-season-5-so-far/
BlackGirlNerd,
King Balon! It is a bit chronologically messy but I think Uncle Euron will sort that problem out next season!
Hodor Targaryen,
I know it’s the big event but what more can be said about it really? People have resorted to talking about Kit’s bloody hair for goodness sake! 😛
As much as I’d like him to still be alive as I find him a well-acted and interesting character, I think Stannis is dead too. The ambiguity of the death stroke is puzzling though. Have they deliberatetly set up a cliff hanger to avoid fully killing Stannis unti GRRM release tWoW before Season 6 or were they jsut going for as many cliffhangers as possible?
Oh…My…God !!
It´s Hairgate !
Call the Washington Post !
flintwielder,
Stop being such a jerk. It’s part of them trying to cover or not cover Jon’s storyline, it’s been brought up multiple times over the years and again now, they want fans to talk about it and fans are talking about it on a fan site. The end, goodbye.
Jon is actually Samson reborn. Do not underestimate the power of a haircut to determine his ultimate downfall. 😉
Ah the off-season, how I missed you!
Just to clarify, the fake script leaks and photosopped twitter feeds this year are going to be about Kit Harington, and not Michelle Fairley, correct?
Just read a review at tower of the hand, and I must say I’m truly disappointed at the harshness of some of my fellow fans, some of the personal nature of the criticism just feel unnecessarily over the top and exaggerated, I really hope he keeps his word and never watches the the show again, because it’s just no way the finale was that bad, maybe not the best but not that bad. Anyway and now my watch begins for a long 10 months I do hope t.he show does not garner quite so much gnashing of teeth and renting of clothes next year, I read the books after the first season and the books are hands down better and more complex in my mind, but I would have NEVER read them if not for D&D And the show so thx guys i will man the wall until season six. Peace and remember it’s not real life it’s a show about dragons
Kit Harington was never banned from cutting his hair, if that were true his hair would be down to his knees by now. He is contractually obliged to have it at a certain length by the time GoT filming starts, that’s it. So he can get a haircut but he has to have his hair Jon Snow length by the time filming starts every year. His hair looks about Jon Snow length right now and he wouldn’t have to start filming until another month or 2 if he is coming back. I think his hair length lends credence to the idea that he will be back for season 6 because he has always said he wants to cut it off when he is done with the show.
If he is coming back I’m not a fan of them going to great lengths to lie and trick fans into thinking he is dead. There is no reason for that. GRRM isn’t going around telling everyone Jon is dead only to go “lol just kidding” when TWOW comes out. They could have just refused to comment on his fate like GRRM. It’s not like it is a good plot twist they should be proud, there is no reason they should be so desperate to convince fans this crappy cliffhanger is sincere if it is not. And if it is sincere and Jon really is dead well that is even worse.
Hodor Targaryen,
Its been a while since I read it – didn’t Stannis die in the book?
ash,
Ramsay claimed he had in the pink letter but an extract from tWoW (as I remember) have him about to execute Theon. So , yeah. Who knows what’s happening now!
ash,
ash,
Oh yeah, I think he’s definitely dead. But some are unsure since we didn’t see the sword actually slice his head off. I’m just saying I hope they, in the future, take the next step and show the person dying or the body or something. I don’t fault the showrunners, though, I think they made it clear but the fandom will always question.
ash,
Suoer ambiguous in the book. Not that ambiguous on the show.
1.) HBO/D&D intentionally started a rumor years ago that Kit Harrington is contractually barred from cutting his hair.
2.) Jon Snow “dies” on the show.
Everyone in the world knows that JON ALWAYS COMES BACK, but it would kind of kill the impact of the finale if nobody believed he was really dead… they realized this would be the case years ago, and decided to run a long con to try to make us all doubt Jon’s resurrection (see item 1.)
3.) So for phase 1, Kit and others immediately have interviews insisting WAY TOO HARD that he’s really, really, for seriously, totally, really, actually dead.
compare Kit’s “DAMN! I’M REALLY GONE FOREVER OH FUCKING GOSH! POOP, I HATE BEING DEAD AND OFF OF GAME OF THRONES FOREVER WITH ABSOLUTELY NO CHANCE OF EVER RETURNING!” to any other GoT alum’s “exit interviews”… Sean Bean’s stuff about how it’d be cool to come back and do a cameo… Ser Meryn Fucking Trant’s joke about wanting D&D to introduce his secret twin… or Rory McHound, who is in a pretty Jon-like situation, and amusingly HID UNDER A FUCKING TABLE RATHER THAN ANSWERING when someone at a con asked a panel of GoT actors to self-identify as either an alive or dead character by raising their hand.
4.) For phase 2, Kit gets the world’s least-noticeable and most-publicized haircut after filming wraps up. This is an obvious throwback to the fake “anti-haircut contract” rumor, intended to “prove” that he is REALLY FOR SURE 100% TOTALLY NON-JK DEAD.
5.) you people eat it all up like a bowl of delicious taco meats.
TheTouchOfFrost,
oh, ok thanks
Lena Headey and Emilia Clarke wore wigs.
Hair length means nothing.
Harma Dogememe,
/thread.
The best scene in the episode was Cersei’s WOS. It was as if it leapt right off of the pages of ADWD and onto my TV. And no, the body double did not effect the impact of the scene, IMO.
I also enjoyed the Dany/ Dothraki scene, though I would have liked to have seen Drogon by her side when the Dothraki arrived.
Arya’s scene with Trant was more gory than I expected. And I’m not sure I understand why the faceless men had duplicates of Arya and Jaqen’s faces. I thought the whole point with washing the bodies was preparing them to take their faces? What’s the point if they can copy a face without removing it from the person’s body?
The Winterfell and Dorne scenes were a letdown. Dorne in general was a complete waste. Why did they bother casting 3 SS? Why did they cast Hotah, when he did absolutely nothing this season? Money and time would have been better spent on fleshing out other storylines, namely in Winterfell.
This should be an eventful offseason. Kit Harrington watch will be on full alert in Belfast. Casting season should be fun. And perhaps we may even get TWOW in the next 10 months…okay, probably not, but a man can dream.
Tyrion Pimpslap,
If TWOW is released this off-season, GRRM will make TONS of money.
People overseeing Kit’s hair as an indication of his participation (or not) in Season 6 should contemplate this possibility.
There will have to be some scenes featuring Jon’s body next season surely.
Who gives a shit about that? Digest on this, Hodor and Sam has outlived Stannis.
The Greyjoys are in next season. Besides, Balon have not been doing shit besides sit his ass down in his castle. Quit reaching
Lol, it wasn’t a massive haircut
As we can see from those dinner party pre-season interview things it grows back into the same general ballpark
Marco,
OMG!
As stated, I wouldn’t read too deep into the haircut as Jons body may need to be filmed for a scene (ala Tywin)
Question though, with Stannis and his whole family wiped out, who possesses Dragonstone? Does it go to Tommen because he’s the last kin left on paper, and if so does he also inherit Stannis’s debt to the iron bank (which would be ironic if he had to pay off funds lent to destroy him)? Does it pass back to the hand/regent of the Crownlands to be awarded to someone else?
Sane in Sothroyos,
Storm’s End would indeed go to Tommen, although he’d likely end up naming a castellan or outright granting it to someone else.
Also, good call on transferring the debt to Tommen. This sounds exactly like something the Iron Bank would do and I wouldn’t be surprised if Mace brings that news back to King’s Landing.
Lord Gendry of The Rowboat,
ahhhh…you’re offended…how unsportsmanlike. Well how about this…Shireen is burned to melt snow and it worked…yet Sansa and Theon jumped fifty feet to what? melted snow that hardens as it melts….LOL… if you cannot laugh at the inconsistencies of the adaptation, then you are to be pitied…
*sigh* I meant Dragonstone. No idea why I even said Storm’s End. >_>
I don’t know who it goes to right now, but I really, really hope Daenerys and her three “children” first land over there. I have a feeling Drogon and siblings will really like it as a homebase. Lots of good fishing.
Overall, I thought this season was really good, despite a slow start.
I did have some problems though.
The Dorne storyline was… yeah…
Admittedly, I didn’t really like it in the books either, but the one part of it I DID like was Doran’s speech/masterplan… which wasn’t in the show.
Also… wasn’t there supposed to be some “secret” actor in Dorne this season? I guess that was bullshit…
I also didn’t like how Stannis’ storyline ended (and NO, I am NOT a Stannis fanboy).
It wasn’t the fact that he failed in his attack, or even that he died, that bothered me (in fact, I felt the way he died was very fitting and in character). What bothered me was that, after all the buildup, the whole thing ultimately felt anticlimactic and pointless. If he (or one of his men) had killed either Ramsay or Roose, I may have been satisfied. As it was though, it seemed to accomplish nothing, and he kinda came across as incompetent…
I also kinda feel it would have made a better story if all the black magic DID get him what he wanted, but then maybe what he did to everyone he loved made him feel it wasn’t worth it… or something.
Otherwise though, I felt every storyline ended (if you can call it that, lol) in a satisfactory way, and had appropriate buildup.
I will say though… I’m not exactly horrified at the prospect of waiting 10 months for the next season. As much as I love this show, I feel like I could use a bit of a break.
Kay
I was thinking that Dorne was a most likely landing spot because of geography but the wiping out of Stannis makes Dragonstone more likely. And it’s appropriate as the original seat of Aegon.
I find Stannis’s sudden fall after sacrificing his daughter fitting. It made perfect sense to me that much of his army would desert him given the horrific act he just committed in front of them, especially mercenaries who afforded him little loyalty to begin with and were already starting to leave.
“Old gods or new, it makes no matter, no man is so accursed as the kinslayer.”
I think it was also a real shock for Melisandre. She was so sure Stannis was her man, but when the soldier reported Stannis losing half his army she just knew that it was over. The look of utter defeat on her face said it all. It’s like she’s questioning her very faith now, both in R’hllor and in herself.
I think she might have some inkling of who the true Warrior of Light could be though… and that’s why I think Jon will live agin. His story can’t be over, especially with so many things leading up to the moment of his revival.
I agree that this season was pretty goddamn grim. Beautifully shot and acted, well-written and sharp all around, but fucking grim nonetheless. I think it’s the bleak nadir before the rise of the heroes though. Kill them all Arya!
As for Jon –
So, just to be clear, I have no doubt that Jon Snow/Stark/Targaryen will be back, and that Kit will be playing him. It just might be later in S6 or early S7. I love Arya, Sansa and Brienne but without Jon and Stannis, let’s just say Euron better be bloody entertaining!
BlackGirlNerd,
I completely agree – we all know that Stannis was the last standing (even if not for long)!
PS. Love your tweets
Don’t worry, Ramsay is next on Brienne’s hit list and I am sure D&D will make that one bloody and explicit. After that, she’s on to the Night’s King, Godzilla, and Galactus. It gets a bit fuzzy after that.
Inconsistent just how you stay on topic. I thought this was about Stannis dying before Balon but since I sliced your complain/whining down like Valyrian Steel you’re gonna switch up to Sansa and Theon scene? We could have talked about Kingsmoot and what happened on the bridge. Haha purist!
This is my theory. Jon is part Targaryen so he must be important. If he is dead and gone here is what could happen. His little half brother Bran looks into a wheirwood tree for past information. He witnesses Rhaegar and Lyana wedding in front of one of the trees (northern weddings are held in front of one, just look at Ramsay and Sansa’s wedding). Basically he comes to the realization that Jon is half Targaryen and the rightful heir to the throne. Bran tells his sister Sansa about what he saw. By this time Sansa has developed a backbone and she decides to fight for the Throne in honor of Jon’s memory. Jon was truely the Prince that was Promised. But he was taken away from us. This whole story is loosely based on The War of the Roses. Sansa most closely resembles Queen Elizabeth I, who won the War of the Roses. Queen Elizabeth’s father was decapitated in front of her just like Ned, for being a traitor. And some creepy guy took her away (littlefinger) until later in her life when Queen Elizabeth took the throne back for her family. And Dany dies. the end! This is my proposed theory. Tell me if you like it. Trust me, no one wants Jon back more than me. But if he is dead, i think this is a possibility at the very least.
Completely agree with everything you said. The Stannis material did not feel rushed to me…it was getting worse and worse, but every moment still felt true, and was given time to breath. Everything that happened was a practical and forseeable consequence of what he did in the episode before.
I was just thinking, Jon Snow got namedropped by Ramsay in a scene with Sansa back during “The Gift.” I assumed that would lead to the show’s version of the “Pink Letter,” which didn’t happen, but I don’t think the namedrop happened for no reason. So that feels like even more evidence that something is being built up to with Jon – not the strongest bit of evidence, but combined with what else we’ve seen, it seems like several markers are in place for Jon to be relevant in the near future.
Harma Dogememe,
About comparing Kit’s description of his departure with other alums – Richard Madden gave a moving description of how he felt on leaving, right down to having a quiet cry on the flight back to London.
Or, as another Genius Named George once said
Well, around here, I’d dare to care about his hair. So there.
You mean Queen Elizabeth’s mother, Anne Boleyn – her father was Henry VIII. And this was long after the Wars of the Roses, which was won by Heny Tudor at the battle of Bosworth Field – who became Henry VII (Elizabeth’s grandfather).
I think Arya hallucinated the whole face sequence. Waif-Jaqen stated the faces were poison to those who were not FM. They might have a substance on it only the true FM have resistance to. Since Arya was Arya when she wore the girl’s face to kill Trant, she was poisoned by the drug and hallucinated all the faces, before the poison made her blind.
I think so too, the clincher being when she saw her own face.
All I know is that Jaqen totally owned the Waif’s dress..
I knew Tom W would look good in anything, and man this proved it.. hahahaha
Arya Havin’ a Larf,
This is fantasy, guys. There doesn’t have to be an explanation.
Just had a look at ‘The Ugly little Girl’ chapter again. After getting the new face Arya has dreams of of the Hall of Faces where she sees in the walls her father, mother, brothers, Dareon; the stableboy, the pimply squire and the Harrenhall Guard she killed, and The Tickler. It could just be a bad dream of course but maybe it actually is some side effect of the ‘skin’ itself or some substance on it.
you have slashed nothing but your oversized ego. As far as i know, none of those you mentioned are dead in the book.
sharpen your argument.
and fyi – I was not complaining / whining… just sarcastic humor but I see it was lost on you.
So the season 2 quote from Mel to Stannis was really narrating Jon Snow’s storyline, if our speculation is on point.
“You will betray the men serving you. You will betray your family. You will betray everything you once held dear… and it will all be worth it, because you are the Son of Fire. You are the Warrior of Light.”
He betrayed the men serving him by allying with the wildlings. He betrayed his family by not riding off to avenge Ned. Hmmmmm…
Now back to haircut and hair length and whether or not Kit uses 2 in 1 conditioner AND shampoo.
Arya Havin’ a Larf,
Yeah I read that going WTF? Im American and even I know my history better than that
BTW why do ‘they’ always say the book was based on War of the Roses? Yeah is about kings fighting for a crown and it takes place in the middle ages but besides that? Nah/
well… I think we could find of other similarities besides that… for one, claimants to the iron throne base their cause on the fact that they were descendants of the King… in this case it’s hard to tell cause Robert Baratheon proclaimed himself king but it was after a sound defeat of Rhaegar – this fight for the throne caused major civil unrest in the realm like it did during the Lancaster v. York matter – – in the seven kingdoms, liege lords could call their banners and raise private armies with allegiance only to the house they serve and not to the crown. – Mental illness in the Lancastrian Henry VI is eerily reminiscent of the Targaryen madness of King Aerys(sp.)
Henry VI had a rather more benign affliction though than Aerys! Actually Henry VI was more like Baelor ‘The Blessed’ Targaryen.
GRRM has cited Maurice Druon’s ‘The Accursed Kings’ series as an influence too, which is also based on a dynastic clash but in Mediaeval France which leads up to the 100 Years War. So yes more than one influence to base his own story on.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-26824993
What if it does a LSH and turns white? He could wear a wig. Maybe he could borrow Dany’s.
See….problem solved.
flintwielder,
One reason his hair is a big deal is because Kit has said on numerous occasions that he deeply regrets signing a contract to keep his hair long, that he “screwed himself over.” But the biggest reason we’re on hairwatch is because the first Jon-Snow-Is-Really-Dead article used Kit’s January haircut as proof that he wasn’t coming back, even though his hair is the right length now.
You are right of course – I definitely got an Anne Boleyn vibe (though I didn’t watch “The Tudors” – diverged a bit too much from real history for my taste) when Margaery was dragged away this season:- “I am the queen”. I can’t remember the exact wording but Anne Boleyn said something like “that I a queen should be treated thus” when she was arrested though of course I’m paraphrasing. It wasn’t THAT long after the War of the Roses when you think how long the planet has been in existence; Henry VIII did execute Margaret Pole who was his relative on his mother’s side during his lifetime – she was 67 [of course you probably know this].
Dame of Mercia,
Well certainly after Henry VIIs accession and marriage to Elizabeth of York it wasn’t a case that everyone shook hands and agreed to put it all behind them. Henry VII faced many rebellions with other claimants/pretenders to the throne being brought forward. Even in Henry VIIIs time there were strong efforts to prove his lineage as based on illegitimacy and therefore no claim to the throne ( Yorkists still at it today!).
There was a long legacy of malcontent for decades after Bosworth. It’s all very fertile ground to base a fiction on 😉