Screeners of the first four episodes of Game of Thrones Season 5 were sent out to the press and various people of import over the last few days… including our very own Sue the Fury.
We previously rounded up some post-London premiere reviews, but these new ones offer a more rounded opinion as a result of more content having been viewed.
Below are some snippets from said reviews. We can’t really expect any notable spoilers – or in fact much detail at all – but they do serve as a preliminary taste of what the season has to offer as we slowly approach the premiere over the next week.
Review snippets below the cut.
Would-be kings and queens are shoring up their alliances for battle, which is smart for GoT, too. Having killed off so many characters, it needs to repopulate. But too many of the new faces look like they’re on the wrong show. When Cersei enlists a religious leader, the High Sparrow (Jonathan Pryce), to help her politically, his bald devotees, who carve stars into their foreheads, resemble cult figures from a Kevin Williamson drama. And when the show introduces Oberyn’s revenge-thirsty daughters (Keisha Castle-Hughes, Rosabell Laurenti Sellers, Jessica Henwick), they’re closer to B-movie bad girls than warriors. George R.R. Martin’s characters are always psychologically compelling, but as they say on Project Runway, the styling needs work.
Happily, and not surprisingly, “GoT” itself hits the frozen ground at a full gallop, with multiple dramas blossoming North and South.
Many shows are starting to run out of gas by Season 5. “Game of Thrones,” partly because it’s as cold-blooded as its characters in treating personnel turnover as the natural order, seems to have little trouble keeping its pedal to the metal.
More reviews will be added as they appear.
So a B+….She rated Season 3 an A-, which in my opinion was the weakest debut to a season for Thrones.
Not very encouraging 🙁
O_o
B-movie bad girls sounds really bad.
Ozymandias,
Season 3 had ‘And Now His Watch Is Ended’ and ‘The Walk Of Punishment’ in the first 4 episodes, which were sent out as screeners. I knew people would overreact to this one review.
Ozymandias,
I personally would rate the premiere a “B” flat grade I think. Eh, maybe B+.
Maybe that rating could go up on re-watch, but I have not had time to sit and watch the episodes again just yet. Maybe tonight if I’m off work early…
I think it was a fairly strong start to what looks to be a very promising season, but it did not start off with a bang. I say that as someone who was not as excited for this season as past seasons. I was pleasantly surprised on how a few arcs are set up.
There’s a nice interview with Cogman in the Observer, on how the show gets written:
http://observer.com/2015/04/blood-caffeine-sex-magic-how-game-of-thrones-gets-written/
Darquemode,
Have you seen any other episodes, or just the premier? I expected the season to be a slow burn. Only season 4, and to a certain extent season 3, had an eventful first few episodes. Season 5 sounds like it will be closer to the beginning of seasons 1 and 2. Only the happenings at the Wall sounds like it will be eventful in the first 3 or 4 episodes.
Now I hope this gets me to the point if expecting little, if the opinions of the reviewers are ones I’d share. Because then I could only be positively surprised and thus enjoy the show.
The trouble right now is that the expectations are sky-high and it is just so easy to disappoint.
I’ve had a recent experience with expectations and disappointments when I went to see Insurgent – i didn’t expect anything great, in fact, I expected to be extremely disappointed and that allowed me to enjoy the film much more than I would have, had I expected it to be a great one and it eventually lead to the point where I consider it only a step away from great.
I guess that I’ll go lower my expectations concerning Game of Thrones to be positively surprised when I get to watch it.
But the truth is that we all have different taste and so maybe I’ll be satisfied where the reviewers weren’t.
We’ll see, only 10 days now and then it all begins again 🙂
this is bad…..
I knew the first 4 episodes couldn’t top kissed by fire and now his watch has ended!
bad girls…..loooks like we gat charliez angels!
No analysis of why she gave the B+.
Every skimpy if almost non existent info for having seen ~ 4 hours of the season.
Tyrion Pimpslap,
I’ve seen the first two only.
A slow burn is the perfect description for it I think.
I’m okay with that honestly.
dob,
It’s one review. But please, take it as gospel.
Tyrion Pimpslap,
And that’s what you want really at the start of the season, because lots of characters are in new places/positions. I’m really happy that they are taking a litle more time, so that the story can breathe. The second half of the season has a lot of potential for these ‘big’ moments, so it’s not like we won’t get them.
It’s so funny how “fans” psyche themselves up to be disappointed by the season.
D&D HAVE RAPED YOUR CHILDHOOD JUST LIKE YOU ALWAYS EXPECTED NOW YOU CAN DIE HAPPY.
But not unexpected really.
Totally here for a slow-burn and a big climactic second half to the season.
Shaz,
Me too!
I think instead of psyching myself up for the new season like many do I somehow managed to psych myself down for this season… While the episodes I saw were more of a slow burn they did reignite my energy and passion for the season. So I think they are a success even if I rated them a bit lower than the start of previous seasons.
Nice try troll. Too bad the reviews are still positive considering the facts the it has yet to meet the climax of the storylines.
Did I mentioned that this season is based on the fourth and fifth book? That should tell you enough if you’re a purist disguised as a troll.
I’m worried about the fight scenes with the Sand Snakes. I don’t like what I’ve seen so far, but so long as they don’t have Tyene Sand stabbing straight through plate armor with her silly double daggers, It shouldn’t be that horrible.
Tyrion Pimpslap,
The first three episodes of Season 3 are some of my least favorite episodes of the series especially the first two. ‘And Now His Watch is Ended’ absolutely crush them though.
I had a feeling that the first few episodes would be uneventful when they sent FOUR to the critics but what worries me most is that the Sand Snakes introduction sounds awfully like a jump the shark moment .
Lets see if Sandsnakes are better than Arianne….
It saddens me that there are people who take glee in tho show getting weaker than amazing reviews (and the same for the books). Why don’t people simply hope that the rest of the episodes/chapters live up more to their own expectations, rather than revelling in the fact that things aren’t unbelieveable good in what they have heard about/read..
Disclaimer: not aimed at anyone specificcally in either thread; just a general observation.
Cult figures from a Kevin Williamson show? That must have literally been the only cult related thing this author knows. I feel safe in disregarding that review
Ouch. Maybe we were better off just getting Griff and Young Griff instead of the Sand Snakes after all. Though I would hvr settled for Ellaria and Arianne minus the sand snakes
Ozymandias,
So you believe that the SS fight signifies that they have run out of ideas and are throwing it in there to try and boost ratings?
Martial skills of the B-movie bad snakes can be only rivalled by Daenerys’s governing performance.
Hopefully we’ll get Sue’s review soon. Monday, wasn’t it? 😉
This EW reviewer gave Marvel’s Agents of Shield Season 1 a higher score than Season 5 of GoT.
Don’t know if I should cry or laugh…..
Ozymandias,
You do realize that this is opinion of one person?
A second reviewer has an excellent evaluation of the season.
Turncloak,
I don’t see how replacing cheesy characters with an incredibly lame plot twist would have helped.
Jeb,
That was an excellent interview. Much more interesting reading than either of these reviews, to be honest. 🙂
minty,
On other hand it came from the person who wrote this about Cersei: “The queen who claimed power as her birthright is now a leader who actually earns it.”
Ozymandias,
It’s one person! Somehow I don’t think you’ll comment on the dozens of glowing reviews that will be published next week. This critic also once mused that Cersei would make a good ruler. So perhaps her opinions of the characters don’t mesh with the majority?
Actually, it is not remotely like one. Remember, Happy Days was an old show by then, and it had one about as much as it could do with it’s limited tropes and motifs. Fonzie jumping the shark was about the 12th time the show had done something like that: and that just emphasized to the audience that they basically were getting reformatted reruns at that point. (Happy Days continued a slow-decline over the next few years after that: it was not as dramatic is the eponym suggests!) Whatever else the Sandsnakes are, they are not a “been there, done that” for GoT.
Given that Arianne is GRRM’s nadir as a writer, they will almost have to be!
I, for one, would have been happier to cut Dorne completely. However, the show has cut the most egregious character and it has transferred Jaime’s storyline from the flogged dead-horse of the Riverlands to Dorne, so it might work out.
The Griffs make only a minor contribution to Tyrion’s storyline in the Crows/Dragons story: the cost:benefit ratio (in terms of both film-time and money) would have been too low to justify this year, and it is quite possible that the audience would have missed their point. (That is not shark-jumping, but it does turn off audiences nonetheless.)
The Sand Snakes are going to be incidental or possibly supporting characters in Jaime’s storyline. The big mistake would be to try to make them new leads: but that pretty clearly is not happening. Instead, they look like they are going to be a Dornish chorus shouting for avenging the death of one of the show’s most notable characters. If done properly, they could be great foils in Jaime’s storyline of
I have a feeling this will be the season of backlash against GoT, regardless of quality. It’s gotten so incredibly popular that people are going to feel they need to take it down a peg.
mau,
I thought the second reviewer only saw the season premiere?
Tyrion Pimpslap,
We’ll find out soon enough man, at the moment I’m not feeling it.
Ozymandias,
Were you feeling it before? Or does this confirm your fears?
Yivo,
The lion doesn’t concern himself with the opinions of the sheep.
He saw at least 2 episodes.
Ozymandias,
What were your expectations? Keep in mind that the critics are reviewing only the first 4 episodes of a season that is adapting material from books that were not considered that eventful, especially at the start. If we were to compare the show to the books, a lower opinion should be expected, just go look at the reviews for AFFC/ADWD on Amazon and compare them to the first 3 books.
So this is why I am avoiding spoilers, critiques, analysis, etc. prior to the start of the season. I will form my own opinion because that’s the one that counts-
Luka Nieto,
Tyrion Pimpslap,
I was optimistic that Dorne wouldn’t be as bad as a lot people predicted, I really was but it doesn’t seem I was right after all…..now it’s time for David and Dan to be buried by Arianne fans. sigh
As for the overall Season, I still have high hopes for the second half and I’m sure it will deliver in a lot of ways.
I read her article as being spoiler free, that’s why its so uninteresting, and her B+ is meant for the first episode not all four.
Ozymandias,
I’m confused. You thought Dorne would be so good that all reviewers and viewers could like it? I consider myself optimistic, and not even I think that! This is just one review criticizing them.
Ozymandias,
Tbh, I don’t care much for reviews anyway (unless I think they’re so badly written that I get angry over it). Most reviews are nothing more than opinion pieces with out much actual constructive criticism or analysis and that’s fine with me, but let’s not pretend just because somebody is a critic his or her opinion is by default more important or illuminative then the one of your average consumer.
In my experience the younger generation (and maybe the older too, but I can’t speak to that) dosen’t give (professional) reviews much weight when deciding to start watching a show in the first place. Word of mouth is much more important.
Of course all of that doesn’t matter when it comes to GoT anyway. Reviews might still play a part when it comes to the success of new shows, but GoT is a leviathan by now and no bad review will change that.
We know about these big or dynamic events at the beginning of the next season:
– death of Mance R.
– abduction of Tyrion
– Sansa in WF
– maybe death of Barristan in E4
– Loras’s arresting
– Jaime in Dorne
– Cersei, every scene
– Jon as LC
– Arya and her mysterious training
It is really enough for the start. And there will be more, the things that we don’t know yet.
Luka Nieto,
I just wanted the Sand Snakes to be taken a bit more seriously by show only watchers. btw I just have a thought of Obara beating Jaime and I’m already giggling in a very bad way……..oh my god this has the potential to be the worst scene of the entire series.
mau,
I’m more concerned about the others scenes.
Ozymandias,
Interesting reaction. Personally, I like the little we’ve seen of that fight. Jaime with a sword and his golden hand as a shield against Obara with her spear; Bronn against Nym with her whip and Tyene with her knives. I think it has the potential to be one of the best fights yet. In that stunts video they talked about how hard they all trained to choreograph it. I don’t see any reason to worry, myself 😉
Congratulations!
The biggest overstatement I read on this site.
That scene has a potential to be a new Brienne and Hound. Awesome fight scene!
mau,
To be fair plenty of book readers hated that amazing fight too.
I hope they are making the Sandsnakes seem really B-movie and cocky to only get brought down a few pegs when they do something stupid and get one of themselves killed.
Luka Nieto,
Again, the lion doesn’t concern himself with the opinions of the sheep. 😉
Lol I don’t know why some people are freaking out already. The reviews weren’t horrible and it having a slow pace does not mean is the end of the show.
Btw does anyone remember the reviews for season 4 screening?
Abyss,
I tend to take heed of the opinions of critics that have been following the show since the beginning and that have had sound analysis in the past and none of the others. Many of the newer reviewers seem more influenced by the shows popularity
King Stannis,
All the reviews for the first three episodes were very positive except for The New York Times one, as always. It has a 94 on Metacritic, I don’t expect Season 5 to be above 90. Probably in the 85-88 range.
mau,
I thought Brienne vs The Hound was the best fight of the entire show, even better than the Trial by Combat.
great. you’ll get another one.
Ozymandias,
Here, here. Such an amazing fight!
Hopefully we get something just as great this season.
Ozymandias,
Out of the 29 reviews collected on Metacritic for season 4, 6 of them gave the same grade as this EW review, or worse. I expect the same to be the case for season 5, maybe slightly lower scores, in line with season 2 and 3 reviews.
Luka Nieto,
Maybe that Obara/Jaime and Bronn/Nymeria scene? :sarcasm:
I’m sure the Daznak scene will have some great fights. My man Jorah look pissed in the trailers!
Luka Nieto,
I think the reason why the Sand Snakes resonated in AFFC was probably due to their limited page precense. They made good intros and then were
So there wasn’t really much filler for them. I can see how some reviewers might find them out of place if they get lots of screentime.
I really enjoyed their 3 short scenes in he books.
Short and sweet with impact.
Now Arianne’s plot was interesting enough to stand on its own. So I imagine Ellaria will be compelling this season. I’m not looking forward to the Trystane One Direction Martell’s romance with Princess Peach Myrcella though.
On the opposite side, I wouldn’t have minded if I never had to read those Hotah chapters. And I’m not crying tears over the lack of Quentyn Martell and Darkstar either.
So I think the show Dorne storyline will be on par with AFFC in terms of enjoyment
Tyrion Pimpslap,
I really do not see any reason to be obsessed with critics.
GoT is one of the most popular, the most beloved, the most critically acclaimed shows of all time.
There isn’t any indication that there will be a decline in quality in S5.
Sue said that this season is equally good as previous ones.
mau,
We didn’t see Brienne doing pointless 360 spins mid fight though… I know its to make the combat be more “flashy” but I find it really unnecessary and unrealistic. At least Oberyn did it before the fight started to show off.
Sorry for ranting about such a minor detail.
What’s comical about one of the sand snakes defeating Jaime(who is now fighting with one hand) in a battle. They do not fight by the same technique and style as in the rest of Westeros so it may be a style or weapon that Jaime has no experience in combating. Most people in Westeros who weren’t worldly would laugh at the prospect of someone like Syrio Ferrel defeating any Knight in Kings Landing.
Armsbendback,
You see, she’s a woman.
That’s the gist of the criticism, it seems.
mau,
I’m really curious about Sue’s review. I don’t care that much about what other reviewers think, but I will take into account Sue’s views.
Abyss,
Exactly! I stopped caring what the TV critics think of a particular show long ago. Their opinions are no more and no less subjective than anyone else’s opinions.
Yes, it is annoying when the NY Times can never give GOT a positive review. Perhaps they just feel the need to be contrarian. At this point, they are just one voice among many.
As Abyss says, a less than glowing review will not deter the majority of viewers.
Luka Nieto,
To be honest the only thing I want to know is how these first four episodes compare to the previous seasons and how she ranks them. And please let the premiere be the weakest episode.
Ozymandias,
The SpoilerTV guy said episode 2 was better, for what it’s worth.
Did you watch the premiere? You didn’t like it?
Darquemode,
Hi. Could you or Sue answer a couple of completely non-spoilery questions?
First of all, who is bumped to the opening credits this season? Are McElhatton, Varma, Huisman, Emmanuel, Chapman, Wlaschiha and Rigg there?
Secondly, can you tell us who plays the Waif, Lollys, Varamyr and the woman who helps Brienne? Thank you!
Luka Nieto,
I read the full synopsis and I wasn’t impressed. It’s probably going to be on par with the Season 2 and 3 premiere.
Quite bold of me I know.
Heraclitus,
That’d be great to know for the wiki, and non-spoilery.
I’m not sure the Waif and Varaymir would necessarily be in the first 4 episodes, though. But I hope Sue answers the other questions 😉
Ozymandias,
That’s one word for it.
Not surprised. The two elements that have given me the most negative vibes are the was the sparrows look and the way the sand snakes look. We will see, and it may seem counterintuitive, but i think visually both would look better with less distinctive looks I.e. star on forehead, armor.
It’s hard for me to put much stock in a review for the first FOUR EPISODES (!!!) that blasts the High Sparrows, Faith Militant, and Sand Snakes (and I think she’s criticizing their aesthetic?) and then praises Cersei’s leadership qualities. And that’s it.
Excited for some more reviews. All I need is a few reviews that like the Sand Snakes and I’ll be happy.
Sue!
The world is on pins & needles…Is it “Dorne” or “Sunspear”? Can you confirm?
There is more than one of them? Man, humanity has gone down hill…..
😀
Hodor’s Bastard,
Yeah, that too.
I wonder if that was a “work in progress” shot of the new intro credits or not. “Dorne” was just weird. Should be “Sunspear.” Then again, Castle Black reads “The Wall”, so it’s not unprecedented. But it’s still weird. Sue, save us with sweet non-spoilery information! 😛
Every year the same people come in here spelling doom and gloom because of one review that isn’t super positive… and then the week of the premiere they are like “oh that was better than I expected.”
That should also be a warning to book purist who get upset at D+D for not introducing their favourite characters.
Brienne vs. Hound was in my opinion the most thrilling one-on-one fight of the series. So i’m not worried about Sand Snakes vs Jamie/Bronn. Even if Obara loses, I see some Oberyn-style flexes.
Those of us who never liked the Dorne part of the story knew that all along.
Critical reviews affect ratings only for very new shows. It is the same thing with movies: the audiences that “novel” movies draw is strongly correlated with critical reviews (as well as distribution) whereas the audiences that sequels draw are independent of reviews of the sequel: instead, they are based on audience reactions (which in turn correlate with critical reviews) of the prior film.
At this point, nothing that the critics say is going to put people on or off of the show. What it will take is for the show to be bad for a prolonged period of time. And given that they aim to wrap it up in two more seasons after this, it probably will end before it can “die.”
GeekFurious,
And then comes the time for “the ratings are gonna finally go down.”
LOOOOOOOOOOOL SAND SNAKES GETTING SNUBBED ALREADY and the season hasn’t even started. Double daggers AWAY!
I’m sure Jonathan Pryce is perfect though. I don’t get how the Sparrows seem “out of place”, but.. whatever. I guess they will be quite a shock to show only viewers.
Renly’s Peach,
The reviewer meant visually out of place, both for the Sparrows and the Sand Snakes. The Sparrows are getting just as “snubbed” as the Sand Snakes here (not much), so isn’t your reaction a bit… you know, exaggerated?
Luka Nieto,
The Walking Dead turned into sh*t after Season 1 and the ratings keep growing as of now……We shouldn’t care about the show’s popularity!
And who was killed in the premieres of those seasons (2,3,4)?
What do you expected in the first episode? Hardhome? WoS? FTW?
Yea lets see… two ugly crazy heroic zombies, one dark nipple, two pirate idiots, a wannabe and one who claims is from the night.
Sounds like Guardians of The Galaxy Westeros.
mau,
I don’t need deaths or action to enjoy an episode, I just want some good interactions developping the story in a satisfying way. I mean the first episode got some of that but also some filler……but I won’t get into spoilers anyway.
And some of my favorite episodes like “Kissed By Fire” “What is Dead May Never Die” and “The Pointy End” doesn’t contain “big” events.
A B+ isn’t bad. That’s how I’ve gotten through my last 8 years of schooling. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Ozymandias,
This last season of walking dead was on par with season 1.
Luka Nieto,
Not at all.
Crabber’s Son,
I liked it, the Cannibals storyline was exciting and the Alexandria arc is solid so far. Season 2, 3 and 4 on the other hand….are horrible but that’s just my opinion.
Heraclitus,
Episode 5×01 Credits:
Listed in order individually…
Dinklage, NCW, Headey, Emilia Clarke, Kit Harrington, Aidan Gillen, Charles Dance, Natalie Dormer, Stephen Dillane, Liam Cunningham, Carice van Houten,
Then..
John Bradley, Sophie turner, Kristofer Hivju and Hannah Murray in one batch…
Conleth Hill and Gwendoline Christie at same time…
Michel Huisman, Nathalie Emmanuel and Dean Charles Chapman in the final batch……
Episode 5×02:
Dinklage, NCW, Headey, Emilia Clarke, Kit Harrington, Aidan Gillen,
Stephen Dillane, Liam Cunningham, Indira Varma…
Then..
John Bradley, Sophie Turner, Maisie Williams, and Hannah Murray in one batch…
Conleth Hill and Jerome Flynn at same time…
Michel Huisman, Nathalie Emmanuel, Gwendoline Christie and Tom Wlaschiha in the final batch…
As for the new roles..
I think Elizabeth Cadawalder plays Lollys, but I am just guessing.
We do not see The Waif or the woman who helps Brienne as I recall. We do not get introduced to Varamyr, but there are a couple of very short camera pans on groups of wildlings standing with Tormund. I didn’t recognize them though, sorry.
Wimsey,
That’s what I said. I guess we are in agreement then?
Co-sign to this. I’m always extremely interested in which actors get promoted to main cast each year, so I hope one of the reviewers could let us know!
James,
Us Game of Thrones fans are spoiled with A’s……so we tend to be a little anxious when we don’t get what we usually have 🙂
Jonathan Pryce will be great. No worries there.
Darquemode,
Thank you so much! That’s amazingly awesome of you!
There’s really no filler in E1. Each scene is important.
Darquemode,
So no Winterfell in episode 2 either? Iwan Rheon would show up on the list wouldn’t he? I really hope I’m wrong.
mau,
So you read the full synopsis too? Bad boy!
Premiere episodes always have a lot of hype and this season’s will probably get a tepid reaction as many previous season’s premieres have gotten especially from casual fans. Last year’s got a positive reaction and had that great scene with Arya and the Hound to end with a bang, this premiere doesn’t seem to have anything like that. I think the biggest mistake was not including Arya in the premiere. She should have been in the premiere instead of Sansa. She is a fan favorite and you know her stuff is going to be entertaining this year. Including her at the House of Black and White with
reveal at the end would have been a perfecting ending for the episode.
Luka Nieto,
Oddly, I don’t recall seeing Dorne in the credits for either episode I watched even though Dorne is in Episode 5×02. Maybe it will show up in later episodes but they left it off the second episode? Maybe it was left out and will be amended in the final episode? Maybe I missed it… Lemme check real quick.
ETA:
5×01 – KL to The Eyrie to Winterfell to The Wall to Pentos to Meereen.
5×02 – KL to The Eyrie to Winterfell to The Wall to Braavos to Meereen.
Huh, no Dorne …
Darquemode,
Is Winterfell in the second episode?
Darquemode,
I guess this means that there is no Winterfell in the opening 2 episodes.
One of Roose Bolton’s leeches,
Nope.
It is in the credits like every episode of the series, but no scenes at Winterfell itself in the first two episodes.
Darquemode,
So Tyrion and Varys are in E2?
Interesting. So they want to shock the audience when Sansa gets there in E3.
mau,
Yes. There is one brief scene with them in Episode 5×02.
mau,
I could be wrong, but I think Witnerfell has been shown in the credits of every episode whether or not scenes have taken place there, hasn’t it?
I think it is more like a touchstone for the audience to always keep in mind as the location the story began maybe… However, you’re right, reminding people of Winterfell is not a bad idea considering the rumored storylines.
JamesL,
i don’t necessarily think that’s a mistake. That just shows D&Ds confidence. They don’t feel compelled to include a fan favorite in the premiere if it doesn’t fit with the plot timing.
Arya was also absent from the season 3 premiere episode. She showed up in Ep 2 to help introduce us to the brotherhood
Darquemode,
Thank you, fantastic info. So we have 5 new actors in the opening sequence so far…
Darquemode,
Hey Darquemode, how did you end up with screeners? Do you write for a website/newspaper?
mau,
I hope we will be getting several episodes with them once Sansa arrives. 4 episodes without Roose Bolton’s voice is torture for me.
B-movie bad girlsAs expected. They should’ve cut Dorne and kept the Iron island + Riverlands plots.
heh, I rather think that the Brotherhood showed up to further Arya’s storyline and plotline…..
the other guy,
While I agree that the Kingsmoot would have made a strong scene, I don’t understand how the Riverlands would have been more compelling than Dorne. Sure it’s fun to read about the Blackwoods and Brackens, but I don’t think it would have been that fun to watch.
Jeb,
So Maggie was a troll? She did say that Winterfell was in Episode 2……….f*ck.
Mayhaps ;). I hope we will be seeing atleast Thoros again. I wouldn’t mid if he took the place of Moqorro. It’s fascinating thinking about the people that Dany might run into in TWOW (
)
the other guy,
Doran > B-movie pirates.
Heraclitus,
A site I’ve done posts for got a handful of screeners for select people to review and/ or watch. I was lucky enough to get one this year.
Ozymandias,
Screw LS, I was hyped for the Jon/Stannis material that was described. I’m sure it will still be great, but still, it sounded perfect in his/her writeup.
Turncloak,
I agree for the most part, but I would have loved seeing Jaime scenes with his aunt Genna Lannister and Emmon Frey!
ETA:
I did not name the right actress for Lollys… Ooops!
Elizabeth Cadwallader is her name I believe.
Any ironborn info/sightings in the first 4? Balon news? Yara? Any pirate or Viking introductions?
Tyrion Pimpslap,
I’m bummed right now, her Episode 2 was perfect……..Arrrgh why Maggie? 🙁
—
nvm
Darquemode,
Can you say without going into spoilers whether Brienne is in the Vale or the Riverlands (or both?) in episode 2? The trailers are confusing on this issue. Thanks.
Reading the review…it doesn’t seem nearly as bad as some are taking it.
I’m not sure to which 360 spin you are referring, but they are not anywhere close to pointless during a fight. Not only can they momentarily disorient the opponent, and by that I mean make it difficult to predict what is coming at them, and thus make it more difficult to defend against it, it also increases momentum and thus power.
Waldo Frey,
It is not entirely clear in the episode either since she is on the road, but I think she is in the Vale outside Runestone moving West toward The Riverlands…
Here is the CV for the actress that plays Lollys.
http://www.stantondavidson.co.uk/ViewProfileX.aspx?id=9
Season 5 needs build up again, after all many of the characters are on new journeys since their old stories have had closure. Tyrion saying bye bye to KL and hello to Essos, Arya heading to a new future and new persona, Jon’s wildling story will shift to WW and Sansa has become Dark Sansa and a possible very dark future, even Jaime will move toward unknown horizons. Only Dany and Cersei stories are continuing to unfold.
For all intent and purpose, season 5 is like season 2 all over again, but hopefully it will have more great episodes than its predecessor.
Top ten episodes -10. 3. 3-6 The climb 9. 4 -2 2 The lion and the rose 8. 1-5 The wolf and the lion 7.1-9 baelor 6 . 1-7. You win or you die 5. 3-9 reins of castamear 4. 4-10 the children (these two are a tie for me ) 4. 3-4 And now his watch has ended 3. 4-9 Watchers on the wall 2. 4-8 The moutain and
The vipor. 1. 2-9 Black water
Darquemode,
Excellent! Thank you!
Darquemode,
Glad to have this confirmed!
This post doesn’t make sense lol
I’m confused as to why David Hinckley thinks Jon would be up for execution.
One of Roose Bolton’s leeches,
“Stannis Baratheon has an army at Castle Black. He means to take the North.”
The voice!
OrtMeyer,
Haha I’m writing from a cracked phone sorry
For my part I’ll see for myself, don’t put much stock in official reviewers and sometimes even fans can be OTT or pedantic
Makes sense to have a slow burn first half of season, like the books there is a lot of action and character deaths which character arcs and plots have to adjust. Episodes 6-10 should be action-packed
For mine it makes sense in a TV adaption to switch Loras and Marge, eg Marge gets married to Tommen, Cersei wants out of marriage to Loras so devises to get High sparrow to lock him up, only it’s her turn at he end of the series
I can understand also if they feel they have to condense the Winterfell/Vale arcs, as long as they pay homepage to Manderly and Duatin. Sansa in Winterfell does seem a bit odd but I think I can see how it can make sense and work in terms of the TV show
My only criticism isn’t that they had to make adaptions it’s more strategic, eg Breaking Bad and Walking Dead made excellent use of flashbacks to give visual cue to fleshing out backstory which GoT also needed as they now suffer from plot decisions making no sense plus they have overly sacrificed mystery that is life of the books to drive the show on shocking bloodiness and VFX etc, this is good but they’ve overdone it, eg I liked that Tyrion plays Pycelle/Varys/Littlefinger scene but then they come out with overly brazen reveals like Olenna admitting to Marge and Lysa blurting out and going on and on about “Jon’s wine”
“resemble cult figures from a Kevin Williamson drama. ”
Is this a reference that people would get? I have to google it, because the name isn’t familiar to me at all. Dawson’s Creek? The Following, is that about a cult? Vampire Diaries, does that have cults in it? I’m sure it has vampires. This reference is meaningless to me, does it mean anything to someone?
Grand maester giz,
Here’s mine pal
1. Blackwater (Season 2, Episode 9)
2. Kissed By Fire (Season 3, Episode 5)
3. The Rains of Castamere (Season 3, Episode 9)
4. The Children (Season 4, Episode 10)
5. The Lion and The Rose (Season 4, Episode 2)
6. Baelor (Season 1, Episode 9)
7. And Now His Watch Is Ended (Season 3, Episode 4)
8. Fire and Blood (Season 1, Episode 10)
9. What is Dead May Never Die (Season 2, Episode 3)
10. The Pointy End (Season 1, Episode 8)
5 Episodes written by David Benioff and Dan Weiss (3,4,6,7,8)
3 Episodes written by George R.R. Martin (1,5,10)
2 Episodes written by Bryan Cogman (2,9)
HM : The Mountain and The Viper, A Golden Crown, The Laws of Gods and Men.
As for Sand Snakes, I’ll wait and see but you could hear the collective silent groan at Comic Con
They actually are good characters in the books, nice and clear but it seems like they meshed them together into one, and then split them up into three
Well, one could imagine it, anyway…..
mau,
I think
That’s what’s gonna happen and areo will chop Brons head off
Jared,
Also worth noting: they kept Charles Dance in his usual slot for his posthumous cameo instead of billing him as a guest star for his farewell appearance. So that would technically make him main cast for Season 5, as well.
Also, Indira Varma jumped straight to the top tier of actors who get just their single name on-screen (e.g Dinklage, Headey, Dance, Gillen). Benioff & Weiss said in a recent interview that they’re doubling down on Ellaria this season, and the billing sure seems to reflect that.
Grand maester giz,
There gonna create this epic fight between Jaime and Bronn vs the sand snakes hotah gets involved slip Brons head right of than escorts Jaime to doran
Top 5 Weakest Episodes :
1. The Night Lands (Season 2, Episode 2)
2. Dark Wings, Dark Words (Season 3, Episode 2)
3. Valar Dohaeris (Season 3, Episode 1)
4. Lord Snow (Season 1, Episode 3)
5. The Bear and The Maiden Fair (Season 3, Episode 7)
3 Episodes written by David Benioff and Dan Weiss (1,3,4)
1 Episode written by Vanessa Taylor and George R.R. Martin (2,5)
A scene like the Kingsmoot could work well only if it was an intersection of 2+ lead characters. As it is, the only established character there is a secondary one. (This was a major argument by the “Pirates were worse!” side in the “Dorne was worse!” “No, Pirates were worse!” ‘debate’ from 10 years ago.)
However, I do agree that the Riverlands are a dead horse: GRRM kicked that for no good reason for far too long in Crows.
Ghost’s Lunch,
I’m guessing you didn’t read the interview with Jessica Henwick and Rosabelle Lorenti-Sellers that was posted a few days ago. They discussed the difference in the SS personalities. It hardly sounded like they were all meshed together.
Ozymandias,
Are top tens are similar , the moutain and the vipor was the best for me cause I read to right before the fight that week than just watched it on tv and all I knew was eventaully Tyrion would live so I thought Oberyn was gonna win , it was the best . I couldn’t let the books spoil
The show for me . I waited till
The end
Of the season than banged the rest of Asos and feast/dance . At that point the show was the best show ever and the best fantasy story of our generation
For obsessive fans who want to try their hand at deciphering actor’s and their roles, here are some actors’s names I do not recognize that appear in the credits …
Episode 5×01: Marcos James, Allan Gildea, Stephen Brown, and Joe Hewetson.
Episode 5×02: Winston Daviis, Jonathan Gunning, and Alan McKee.
I’m guessing they are background players and featured extras etc..
A number of other actors listed with them at the end of the credits played roles like “Street tough”
Darquemode,
Not sure if this is moving too much into spoiler territory or not, but is there Sansa/Brienne interaction in episode two, or do those paths not cross?
Darquemode,
If there are no Boltons in the first two episodes, I think that’s another point in favour of Sansa getting to Winterfell in episode 3. It sounds like they’re waiting for her and LF to get there to start that plot, and if they wait until LF’s detour is done, we wouldn’t see them for nearly half the season.
Ozymandias,
I can’t rate certain episodes as week cause even in the nights lands and I’d say that’s prolly the worse episode I still loved the Tyrion -varys , little finger , master pycelle set up
Grand maester giz,
And the worst episode of game of thrones is better and way more intelligent than the best episode of the walking dead . Jesus . I’m surprised that is so popular , I think it’s garbage
Grand maester giz,
It’s almost on a true blood kind of level but it’s trying to be serious
Ozymandias,
I’d say:
1. The Nightlands
2. Cripples, Bastards and Broken Things
3. The Bear and the Maiden Fair
4. Lord Snow
5. The Ghost of Harrenhal
Afeastfordances,
I think I will let that question go unanswered or let Sue answer it in her upcoming review.
Sean C.,
I would guess that’s a good theory….
Do you think Sansa and LF will appear in 3 or more episodes in a row? I wonder if they could skip them for Episode 5×03 and return to them in 5×04? Sure will probably know.
The TV critics and a big contingent of scifi/fantasy fans disagree with you, as does the general public!
That written, it is possible that Walking Dead has “jumped the shark” in the true sense, in that a lot of people think that they’ve run out of ideas for the show.
Yivo,
The Ghost of Harrenhal is probably the episode that I remember the least, I don’t know why…..Cripples, Bastards and Broken Things is an honorable mention of mine. Basically all my least favorites episodes of the show with the exception of TB&TMF are from the first half. And I suppose this trend will continue with Season 5.
I never trust these professional reviwers much. As a lot of people, I’ll wait for Sue’s review, that one I’ll take seriously. Not much to say really, I’d rather form an opinion on the episodes by myself.
BTW: I’d like to thank all the people that commented complete and utter nonsense, I laughed a lot, specially reading the comments concerning the sandsnakes, truly hilarious.
RandomSand,
Glad to hear that you’re having a good time reading my posts, Mister Sand.
Darquemode,
Ahh, good points! Thanks.
I have not paid as close attention as I should have with all the productiondetails this year… Not sure I knew he would be in KL for 5×04…
RandomSand,
I like reading the reviews of people I know watch the show closely and put a lot of thought into their reviews.. Andy Greenwald(Grantland) is probably my favorite.
Darquemode,
Fair enough! Had to ask. Thanks for what you’ve given us so far.
Tyrion Pimpslap,
Greenwald’s the best. He’s a great writer, and he’s extremely passionate about the show. His reviews are always thoughtful and entertaining (I also enjoy the discussions that he has on his podcast with his friend Chris Ryan during the season – they’re a bit more irreverent and free-flowing, but always fun). He also happens to be Unsullied, so he’s able to analyze the show purely on its own merits – free from any preconceived notions about what the story should be and where it’s going. It’s refreshing, to be honest.
Ozymandias,
Oh, even though you did comment on them you were reasonable enough to say “Now I’m worried that they may suck” unlike others who seem to think the season is 100% ruined already and stuff, so your comments are not the ones I was refering to 😉
Tyrion Pimpslap,
Thanks for the tip! I’ll check out his reviews. It’s always good to know the person writing it is actually a fan and not some random guy that watched the episodes just for the sake of reviewing it for a site.
So… Any idea where this Mr.Greenswald’s usually does his reviews? We need more reviews to make this report card more interesting. 2 people with positive reviews is not enough for us.
Sean C.,
It also possible that he’s there
I’m beginning to think it’s more plausible that he’s there in 503, parting from Sansa in 502 and then they show up to WF together in 504.
King Stannis,
Andy Greenwald works for Grantland, a sports and pop culture website affiliated with ESPN. He writes weekly recaps of every Game of Thrones episode during the season in addition to his annual preseason review. If you’re interested, I would encourage you to seek out some of his reviews of previous seasons to get a sense of his writing style. Here’s his pre-season review of Season 4 ( http://grantland.com/features/game-of-thrones-season-four-hbo-returns/) and his recap of the Season 4 finale. http://grantland.com/hollywood-prospectus/game-of-thrones-season-4-finale-recap-a-lannister-repays-his-debts/
He has not published his review of the new season yet, but that isn’t a cause for concern. U.S.-based critics only received their screeners for the first four episodes of Season 5 a few days ago. Most of them aren’t likely to publish their reviews of the new season until some time next week (The ones who have done so this early are the exception, not the rule). I think that we can expect his review of the new season to go up by next Wednesday or so, along with a virtual avalanche of reviews that will start appearing as soon as Monday. They’re unlikely to contain many specific spoilers, but the vast majority of them should be very positive.
Jared,
Thanks a lot for the great info Jared. Will keep my eyes open for the coming week ahead
Grand maester giz,
That was in ep. 203 actually. “What is Dead May Never Die”.
King Stannis,
Andy Greenwald is awesome. You can find his reviews on Grantland. His reviews are always fair. You could argue that he goes above and beyond what is expected of a show only watcher. He goes through the trouble of inspecting the GOT wiki to refresh his memory in characters/locations/spellings/etc 🙂
Wimsey,
The Walking Dead is not taken seriously by critics actually. It wasn’t even near the top 10 shows in Hitfix’s 2014 critics poll.
It is a very popular show however.
A new photo from the HBO site. http://postimg.org/image/u8pjdu2ez/full/
Pretty much the same as one of the shots from the trailer (can’t remember which one) but there you go anyhow.
Darquemode,
Confirmed by her CV. Interesting. According to it, she’s only been directed by Slovis, so she will only appear in episode 2. Not surprising, but it’s good to know.
Darquemode,
The ones from 5×02 are already in the wiki. The ones from 5×01 are new. Thanks!
It is gradually becoming more popular amongst critics too, I think.
Here are two lists from recent times that rank it quite high (interestingly, both have Game of Thrones at #1):
http://whatculture.com/tv/10-greatest-tv-shows-decade-far.php/10
http://waytooindie.com/features/best-50-tv-shows-decade-5/
Luka Nieto,
I hadn’t looked at the wiki lately. Thanks for reminding me!
Here are two more I missed from Ep5x02 and do not see on the wiki…
Cedric Henderson and Curtis-Lee Ashqar..
ETA:
Maybe Curtis-Lee Ashgar as listed in the credits is Bobby Asghar on the Wiki?
Nvm… Different spellings. It’s late… Time for sleep! XD
ETA #2:
I think Curtis-Lee Ashgar may be one of the Meereenese freed slaves in one of the last scenes of the episode.
Allan Gildea is listed as Master of Arms
http://www.universalartists.co.uk/Producer/Artist.aspx?ID=86e2d114-9fe1-40e2-9c18-0e99d5baf3d7 (click on Television tab)
Darquemode,
Added to the wiki. Thanks!
Darquemode,
Darquemode I know you had to answer a lot of question… sorry for adding one : can you tell anything about Ghost presence and screentime in what you’ve seen so far ?
Darquemode,
Arkash,
Yes, good question!
Darquemode, now that Summer is taking a vacation alongside Bran and the other cave-dwellers, does Ghost hog a little more of the Direwolf screen-time? Is he in the first four episodes at all?
Arkash,
The AFOIAF thread got shut down again btw. And it’s Enmity/the Poet Laureate’s fault again. If only they’d ban him over there, we wouldn’t have to worry about this happening again.
Greenjones,
What did he do exactly?
Luka Nieto,
He keeps trying to get into some big anti-feminist debate which naturally brings a lot of posters down on him and gets a multitude of different posts from different positions reported. And all of it off-topic.
He got the thread shut down yesterday because of this and now again today. It’s ridiculous.
Greenjones,
Can’t they ban his IP or something? :/
sati,
The problem is when people’s comments get reported the mods often just shut down the thread instead of getting rid of the poster. As far as I know, that is.
But twice now in the past two days or so… you’d think they’d make an exception and shut him down. But they have yet to.
Greenjones,
A sexist arsehole then? Unfortunately there are quite a few in the general fantasy fandom :/
Greenjones,
The people running the site are just incompetent, and they have been for a while.
About episode 2 does we know if there is only Ellaria from Dorne? Any chanches for the Sand Snakes?
Saimon,
I think it’s only Ellaria, but the Sand Snakes are for sure in one of the first four eps
sati,
Ellaria and Doran and Areo, right?
Maybe it was just an assumption, but I was sure the scene described in the EW issue and glimpsed in that Spanish interview would take place in episode two. That’s where it fits in my mind, anyway; it’s when Ellaria goes to Doran to ask him what he’s going to do about Oberyn’s death (adapted from Obara asking him the same thing in “Chapter 2: The Captain of the Guards” of A Feast for Crows.) If that’s not it, then what does Ellaria do, all by herself, in episode two?
Luka Nieto,
Yes, that scene is in 5×02. I think it was confirmed in one of the EW articles.
Dutch maester,
Then Doran isn’t part of the main cast, unfortunately. He wasn’t in Darquemode’s list of the main cast in the first couple of episodes.
Sort of shame they are giving Obara´s dialoque to Ellaria and skipping introduction of Sand Snakes via their confrontation with Doran. I really liked that introduction and it could work as good as Tyrion´s “I plan to wed Myrcella to Trystane/Theon/Robin.”
On brighter side atleast they will not spend whole time locked up.
Some of those insecure guys are really laughable. A woman could not possibly beat a man under any circumstances right? Nevermind the man is suffering from serious infection (Hound vs Brienne), spend one year chained in the cage (Jaime vs Brienne) or he is a cripple (Jaime vs Obara) and his diminished fighting capabilities are the integral source of his grow as a person.
Btw. EW reviewer´s comparison of Faith militant to The Following cults is far worse offense then B-movie bad girls.
Wimsey,
The walking dead is the Big Bang Theory of drama. Its incredibly popular but absolute rubbish.
Luka Nieto,
Not unexpected, though. We haven’t had a new cast member directly join the main cast since season 2 (with Dillane, Cunningham, van Houten and Dormer).
And seven promotions (assuming Rigg and McElhatton also join the main cast) is a lot anyway. Highest ever, in fact (S2: 6 promotions, S3: 3, S4: 4).
Dutch maester,
I know, I know… Still, I hope Siddig gets plenty of screen-time 😉
Me too, Doran is the best thing about Dorne. I really hope they don’t go the Ciaran Hinds route, I think the wildling storyline really suffered because Mance didn’t appear enough.
Dolorous Ned,
I like Hinds, but I think he was miscast. I’m pretty sure other actor could’ve pulled off more with the same material. Anyway, I’m pretty sure Doran will have more screen-time. Even if he doesn’t, I’m hopeful he will have will have a greater impact than Mance ever had.
Jon’s storyline did not suffer any for Mance’s lack of screen time, and that was the only storyline there. We learned plenty about the Wildlings in Mance’s short time to understand Jon’s evolution, so that mission was accomplished well enough. It also did a bit to develop the perceived threat of the White Walkers: and that almost certainly will be critically important to understanding what happens this season and in the last season.
Wimsey,
Agreed, but a more memorable Mance, without needing to change a single line of dialogue, would have improved Jon’s storyline.
That EW review is really half-baked and full of typos
I hope we get some better ones later.
I don’t think the NY Daily News review is for the 1st 4 episodes. It’s only referencing events that occur in the premiere and the title of the review even says “Season 5 premiere”.
I think the full reviews are still embargoed with EW, as always, getting some kind of exclusivity window.
I’ve seen on Twitter a bunch of more well known critics stating they’re watching their episodes or are about to so we’ll hear their thoughts in due time.
This was a decent laugh: http://www.mtv.com/news/2100799/game-of-thrones-mall-stores/
Greenjones,
Ah, that’s a pity 🙁
I have the feeling we’ll get to V. 20 till the season starts, if we (resp. the mods) follow this trend.
I hope someone (alcasinoroyale? Arkash?) will soon open a new one; this legit Review on reddit is interesting and surely something better to talk about than… certain other topics.
Really worrying. Mainly because that’s exactly the impression I got from the trailers. That The Sanke Snakes would be cardboard ‘strong chicks’. One is a femme fatale, one is a warrior princess, and one is seductive siren. God knows what they’ll turn Trystane Martell into.
If this is true it’s really going to compound the serious disappointment for me, personally. Arianna was one of my favourite characters, and she has *a lot* of character for them to explore. They ditched her for three briefly sketched characters, seemingly so they could exercise their creative license with the story. Which, as I’ve said before, I believe rarely ever works well.
But still, I held out hope. Even without Arianne, even with them taking creative liberties, the Sand Snakes leave an impact. They’re cool, a little mysterious, and interesting. Their introductions in book 4 are, in my opinion, some of the coolest character introductions in the entire series. Then I saw who they had cast, and how they would be styled. And I pretty much just gave up all hope there, but still a flicker remained.
And then we got the script leaks. And then we get the interviews. And now we get this review. All very pessimistic, but hey, I suppose with my expectations now through the floor, I’m more likely to be pleased.
One last thing: book four is my favourite. Cersei’s machinations of Cersei’s political games, the excitement of the Dornish plot, the horror of Brienne’s story. I think there was enough there for a more languidly paced season, but no matter. I understand that wasn’t possible.
But that leads me to something I can’t understand. With the whole of book four and the whole of book five, there is *tonnes* in there, too much in my opinion to really do it justice or make it satisfying in one season, so I am bemused when I see people complaining that this season might be too boring. The biggest concern should be that they’re going to skimp on the build up for many of the big scenes, hence not creating enough suspense. Or that things won’t be explored in enough depth to really make them compelling.
Was Mance unmemorable? I didn’t find him to be so. However, this just might be a subjective taste issue.
One thing that might have affected the portrayal is that BookMance is a bit like BookBronn: wise-cracking, irreverant and a bit devil-may-care. Given that Bronn had already been established, and given that people might have a hard time seeing that sort of character as the “savior” of the Wildlings, they might have focused on SeriousMomentsBookMance instead. (Still, I saw a bit of the “maverick” in a few of the scenes.)
Still, taste is subjective! (Or one of us is the spawn of a Balrog….)
But Arianna is in the show. Just her name is Ellaria Sand.
Messy Justin Massey,
Do you have a link to the reddit review?
Can someone please explain why someone said that “SH fans will be so pissed?” Has she been 100% confirmed cut by somehing in the opening 4 episodes at this point. Gah.
Not the fault of whoever said that and not having a go at them, but nothing more annoying than reading a huge reaction comment like that then not being able to track the source or post from which the observation originated …
http://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/comments/31a2k4/spoilers_all_my_advance_review_of_season_5/
I meant Arianne* of course – damn autocorrect. And I’m not sure that’s really fair to say. We understand that Ellaria will fulfill the plot purposes of Arianne, but their characters will likely remain totally different.
King Tommen,
Here’s the reddit review. No
confirmed (atleast no hints in the 1st 4 episodes). Thank God. It would have been stupid to do it this late in the game. Also the review implies that
. A lot of you are 3-4 episodes away from eating a ton of crow
http://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/comments/31a2k4/spoilers_all_my_advance_review_of_season_5/
Luka Nieto,
I think so, there was a clip of her yelling at Doran, this must be that scene
Damien,
All the poster said was there is simply nothing pointing to her being in the show, that there are no hints for her to appear later on.
Chriss,
Outside of the obvious family relation differences, everything we’ve seen so far seems to have Ellaria acting very much the same way Arianne did in the books.
You can see why the show did this, as Ellaria is a more obvious audience link to Oberyn and she has already been introduced in the previous season. Why have her simply fade away as she does in the books when you can simply assign her the role and personality of a newly introduced character?
As long as Arianne being the heir of Dorne is not an important plot point, then this is the type of character consolidation that is a no-brainer.
If so, then GRRM hid that well. Arianne came across as nothing more than a petulant young-lady who foolishly believed that she was much more clever than people who actually were considerably more clever than she is. Really, Arianne’s entire storyline was just Cersei’s storyline: “watch me be as subtle and politic as my father or even more so, and fail spectacularly in doing so!” Both were trying to kill the spoiled girl and become the Éminence Grise, but without realizing that they were starting at spoiled girls, not incipient power-brokers. To top it off, Arianne’s storyline was much less effective than Cersei’s because Cersei’s character already was pretty well developed whereas Arianne came at us de novo. (Attempting to make up for this also burdened the tale with two additional PoVs that served largely to develop Arianne from a 3rd party perspective: but those still were inadequate to the task.)
Full disclosure: I really dislike Crows and that actually put me off of SoI&F for a while. However, it was stuff like Arianne that I disliked so much: having to use 3 PoV’s to communicate helped muddle the storytelling to the point that I couldn’t tell what the story was until 6 years later when I read Dragons!
Darquemode,
That’s odd but then again you said they kept WF on everything.
Thanks for all the info.
Even if it is, then that probably can be replaced by someone else as an heir. However, it is difficult to imagine exactly how that could be given that none of the main protagonists have much to do with Dorne.
Turncloak,
I would not take that as a confirmation, he says weaker storylines from the book, which could easily refer to Jamie in dorne.
You describe Arianne’s character well, if unkindly, in order to convince me she has no character.
I think you sum her up fairly enough. I find characters who are flawed, and not a fount of unending genius, much more compelling than masterminds like Littlefinger. If everyone is infallible, then no one is really particularly special.
Besides, if Arianne’s queen maker plot had succeeded, and she had wrested control of Dorne away from Doran, who knows what would have happened. The Lannisters couldn’t have taken Dorne, and with Tywin dead, they would have continued to weaken. The Martells could indeed have ended up in a very influential position.
It also seems unfair to suggest Arianne was stupid for not realising Doran’s plot. No one did. And as much as I loved the whole thing, I’m not convinced that his more cautious approach is all the better than Arianne’s. At best he ends up with a tenuous marriage pact, if Arianne succeeds, they end up with the heir to the Iron Throne. Both have their pros and cons.
As for Arianne, she’s driven, ambitious, willing to use her feminine weapons – which I also really like – loyal, and motivated. She’s also no fool, even if her trust in her friends blinded her to her betrayal.
I look forward to seeing where she ends up in TWOW.
It’s good to hear that they are finally giving us the backstory of the
this season. But I just wonder why they didn’t give it to the Reeds. It would have made their story a little less droll. I could have used less complaining about how to skin rabbits between Meera and Osha :/
That’s not the quote I was referring to. The one I was referring to was this one which seems to be D&D mixing
into Sansa.
I understand why she was cut. The Dornish exist to intermingle with the Griff storyline. That’s the heart of it, and the whole point of building the Dornish up. With D&D’s decision to cut Griff, their only purpose is Lannister revenge mode. So any character who doesn’t fit that narrative is cut.
Which is my point. Ellaria will be motivated purely by revenge, and that’ll be her sole purpose. All of Arianne’s motivations and nuance will obviously not exist. Again, I understand why she’s had to go, I’m just not happy about it.
I also think sometimes some of us are too forgiving of choices they ‘had’ to make.
Can I play too?
On a rewatch a year ago, I found Lord Snow to be a much stronger, more compelling episode than I remembered. It pales a bit compared with the late-year Season 1 stuff, but it stands up better than a few of the real slow ones from early Season 2/3. Cripples, Bastards, and Broken Things is a fine episode.
I’d go like this for weakest:
1. The Bear and the Maiden Fair – The 7th episode of Season 3 nearly grinds the damned season to a halt. I’m still not sure how it happened, but it’s really utterly uncompelling.
2. The Night Lands – Yeah, agreed. This one is pretty slow.
3. Breaker of Chains – An otherwise solid episode with some great stuff in it, but it has “That scene.” D&D have had modest choices I disagree with from time to time, but they’re so minor as to be a lot of who-cares moments. But the scene in Baelor’s Sept is really jarring in how badly it comes across.
4. Dark Wings, Dark Words — This one’s pretty slow, too, agreed.
5. The Ghost of Harrenhal — Another slow-ish one.
From then on, there are a handful of solid ones (like Lord Snow), before you get to the upper tier, which is now half or more of the episodes.
Turncloak,
Thanks! Interesting review without giving too much away.
King Tommen,
Agree. I was initially disappointed at the loss of Arianne. However, if the broader design of that story arc is being given to Ellaria (and the the wonderful Indira Varma), it will be fine. I actually regretted the minimal time devoted to Ellaria in AFFC.
Chriss,
Should’ve whether or not we are “too forgiving” be determined once we’ve seen the damn season???
I was talking about seasons we’ve already seen. No need to get defensive!
I think it’s worth pointing out that the EW review is not written by Hibberd but by some guy we’ve never heard of. I’ll trust their review when their regular recapper comes out.
Chriss,
point taken
HBO schedule has been updated with episode 7 “The Gift” (57 minutes).
Interestingly enough, it airs on the 24th of May, so we won’t have a holiday break this season (which we’ve had since season 3).
BenesHacha,
It’s better that the review was not written by Hibberd. Hibberd has a very close relationship with the show so it’s easy for his opinion to be bias in favor of the show.
I’m waiting for the Andy Greenwald review. An unsullied can truly tell us the quality of the show since he doesn’t have book reader blinders affecting his thought process
Excellent news. I guess HBO no longer cares as much for viewer numbers now that GOT has surpassed The Sopranos in terms of viewership
Turncloak,
Andy Greenwald’s reviews are the best by far.
mariamb,
I would have preferred Ellaria + Arianne and just cut the 3 sand snakes. They are not needed anyway
Wimsey,
It’s subjective, certainly 😉
Anyway, it’s not like I don’t like him: Hinds did deliver one of my favorite funny lines in the whole show. When the wildlings arrive at the Fist and see the aftermath of the battle, which in the show includes the White Walkers’ strange ritualistic art pieces with body parts, Mance says “Always the artists…” Always found that so funny.
Turncloak,
Thanks! At last, a proper review of the first four episodes.
“People who greatly enjoyed Season 4 will greatly enjoy this season.” I shouldn’t be worried then. Season 4 is my favorite so far.
“The Jon scenes, for me, were the highlights of this part of the season. […] Harington really shines here, giving off a sense of power and even sometimes menace.” I’m so happy to hear that. I liked Harrington well enough in season one, and then found him incredibly dull in most of seasons two and three. However, in season four he amazed me. Suddenly he was just so good. By the end of the season, thanks to Harrington I was rooting for Jon Snow in a way I’d never done before, and he’s become one of my favorite characters. It’s great to hear he’s a big focus this season and that Harrington’s scenes are the highlight of those episodes. It doesn’t shock me, but it’s reassuring that he continues with his season four roll.
“For the most part, things are very well-handled, despite my initial surprise at hearing the line “Olly, fetch me your sister” (kidding).” I find this ‘your sister’-ing grating at times from book purists, but I admit, I laughed out loud.
“The show has an uphill battle to justify an invented plot point that 99% of book readers are predisposed to think is truly insane. Do they succeed? Well, they gamely try, and they make use of some existing divergences in show continuity to present their case.” As we predicted, Alayne is Littlefinger’s niece and not his bastard daughter so that she can be believably married to Ramsay. At first I found this supposed storyline absurd, but the more I hear about it, the more I like it, particularly because I’m convinced D&D won’t backtrack on Sansa’s amazing development at the end of season four. This won’t be Joffrey 2.0. If anything, I imagine her relationship with Ramsay will parallel Joffrey only in how completely differently it goes.
“But there are signs now that they’re ready to delve more into the backstory, particularly a conversation that starts with the line ‘Lord Whent held a great tourney at Harrenhal…'”. There are many backstory tales I would’ve swore with some certainty they wouldn’t ever touch, and the famous tourney at Harrenhal was one of them. I wonder if it’s merely a passing reference, mostly to please book readers, or if the story of the tourney is actually delved into. The reviewer implies the latter, which surprises me quite a bit.
All in all, this is a great review. From previous experiences, I can say that the things that bother that kind of book reader don’t bother me at all, so I can discount most of his issues, for my personal taste. A really exciting read!
I agree with this.
Chriss,
No, they don’t. I guarantee you the average ASOIAF fan can’t even name most of them or describe them individually. I know I can’t.
Gaius B said earlier:
“Sort of shame they are giving Obara´s dialoque to Ellaria and skipping introduction of Sand Snakes via their confrontation with Doran. I really liked that introduction and it could work as good as Tyrion´s “I plan to wed Myrcella to Trystane/Theon/Robin.”
On brighter side atleast they will not spend whole time locked up.”
So, although my love of book four may be somewhat… unusual, surely Gaius and I can’t be the only people who enjoyed the Sandsnakes’ introductions?!
(Hey, mods. There’s this infuriating bug that stops you from bringing up the select/copy/paste menu when commenting on the iPad.)
I agree that Andy Greenwald’s review is one to look for. James Poniewozik from Time is always worthwhile too. He’s a book reader.
Joanna Robinson (Vanity Fair) and Maureen Ryan (HuffPost) are superfans and bookreaders as well and their opinions I like to hear from.
In terms of top of the TV critic food chain, it’s Alan Sepinwall and Dan Feinberg over at HitFix who I want to hear from. Alan has not read the books and Dan has and they always have a lot to say on GoT. They’ll probably give their review a good 10-15 minutes on their podcast too which should be interesting.
Dutch maester,
Wow, really? HBO is finally embracing the Memorial Day weekend? That’s fantastic!
Chriss,
You’re not the only one. I loved the introduction of the Sand Snakes, though it didn’t pay off, sadly. The show will remedy this, it seems.
“The Captain of the Guards” is my favorite Dorne chapter. That and “The Watcher.” Yes, the ones from Areo’s POV, but not because of Areo himself. They are both great setup —the former for the Dornish plot in AFFC, though it didn’t end up being as interesting as that first chapter promised, and the latter for TWOW. It’s rather strange that “The Captain of the Guards” frames the Dornish storyline as “Oberyn’s patient brother vs Oberyn’s bellicose daughters”, yet the story takes another path completely, until it goes back to that initial promise in “The Watcher.” No wonder they cut Arianne. She and Arys Oakheart have the less interesting Dornish chapters, the ones in which the plot supposedly happens, but not much happens at all.
They are doing the smart thing: adapting “The Captain of the Guards” rather faithfully, except with Ellaria instead of Obara (and then Nymeria and Tyene), and then making use of the show’s more open POV structure to introduce the Sand Snakes through Ellaria herself, loosely based on the same chapter. Then, they will give the role of Arianne & her many forgettable cohorts (Gerold ‘Batman / Darkstar’ Dayne was memorable for the wrong reasons) to Ellaria and the Sand Snakes, with the added complexity of Jaime and Bronn; and finally, the story will culminate with an adaptation of ‘The Princess in the Tower’ and ‘The Watcher.’
Chriss,
Going by the books this season should be boring though. The issue with AFFC/ADWD isn’t just their length, they are filled with unengaging plotlines and characters with a few exceptions. You can edit those books all you want and you would just end up with smaller boring books.
Turncloak,
Thanks as well for the link! The Meereenese Blot guy is excellent.
Again, I disagree with the book four and five comments, and in fact, my worry is instead that they’ll compound too much into one season, thus really being unable to do the material justice.
As for the promise of The Sank Snakes, I have no doubt that will be delivered on in book 6.
Turncloak,
Wow, so many whiners on Reddit.
And I’m glad someone liked Dany’s arc in ADWD. I certainly did not.
I’m cautiously optimistic about this season, based on the reviews we’ve seen so far. Dorne is the only big worry, and it least it has Siddig and Varma.
Turncloak,
For me it is very promising that person who is in some way book purist (He is not a fanatic, but you can feel it in the way he writes that there is puritanism) don’t hate Ramsey and Sansa.
So it’s done well and logically , at least at the beginning. I am optimistic for this storyline.
Darquemode,
I’m guessing Dorne will be added when Jaime lands there. So that would mean:
5×03 – KL to Winterfell to The Wall to Braavos to Volantis to Meereen.
5×04 – KL to Dorne to Winterfell to The Wall to Braavos to Meereen.
With the final version for the rest of the season, presumably.
GRRM didnt do the material justice. The last two books are objectively weak. You can love them or hate them, but they have a fairly huge structural problems.
Not so different from here actually. Many have a hard time separating book from show. I like to judge scene by its own merits. For example I loved the Brinne vs Hound scene but hated the Yara rescue scene. Both of these were show changes which can be judged on their own. A change in the show is not necessarily bad a purist often believe
When some talk about a “slow burn” start to the season, it’s almost assuredly because of a lack of “big events” that the show is able to cover off in the first four episodes. Unless they are inventing significant action pieces or shocking reveals, the adaptation of AFFC/ADwD’s first halves don’t really leave you with a lot of meaty “OMG” moments. What you’re left with is a fair amount of resetting of character arcs, moving them in the direction they need to go as well as character and location introduction/building.
In Seasons 3 and 4, the adaptation of ASoS left a number of exciting set pieces and events that could be slotted into early episodes of the season to help break up some of the slow burn that was leading to the season climaxes.
In Season 3’s first 4 episodes, we had Jaime losing his hand, his fight with Brienne, the Hound vs Beric, the mutiny at Craster’s and Dracarys.
In Season 4, we got the Purple freaking Wedding in E2 as well as Arya/Hound at the Inn vs Polliver and co, Dany’s taking of Meereen, Bran getting captured at Craster’s and the White Walker HQ reveal.
There is pretty much nothing book material wise from ADwD/AFFC that happens at this point of the story that they can use to compare to most of these events. I’m looking forward to the back end of the season for some of big book events but when I hear the term “slow burn” being used to describe E1-E4, I’m not that shocked.
Actually, objectively, I’d suggest they’re better written than the first three. GRRM is unconcerned with rushing through the story to fulfill the needs of the adrenaline junkies in the audience, thus allowing him to fully flesh out the world he has created, whilst he expertly shuffles between tone and genre, whether it be drama to horror, or romance to thriller. The atmosphere he crafts, and the languid pacing, served only to fully immerse me in his world of ice and fire, and I only grew to become more invested in characters I had otherwise seen as nothing more than chess pieces before.
He manages all this whilst planting the seeds and laying the foundations of the story arcs which will take us through to the end of the series.
But, I’ve long accepted there will never be any agreement on this fundamental divide within the fanbase.
King Tommen,
Exactly. I think a “slow burn” is what is to be expected.
I just want to sit back and enjoy the first few episodes for what will hopefully be great dialogue and acting.
I like the quieter moments.
I expect that the Loras’s fight scene be his trial by combat. He will ask for it, and HS will agree. He will win and will be found innocent, but he will be wounded just like in AFFC.
What do you think?
mau,
Did the actor say he had a fight scene or something?
Still, good speculation.
I’m with you on that. I think that’s why you still get some people pining for season 1. Because it was less packed, and D & D had more room to breathe, they were able to create some really superb character moments, and create the suspense for the bigger later episodes. Season 4 was kind of the opposite of that. Something big happening all the time.
And that’s great too, but sometimes you just can’t beat a slow burn leading into a bang.
Chriss,
Objectively a 2000 pages of exposition is a complete disaster. That is not a characteristic of a good writer. He lost his focus , plot, perspective,structure .. “Fleshing out the world” is just an excuse… He fleshed out his world in the first books as well.
These books are the reason why GRRM will probably never finish this story.
Everyone has the right to loves those books , but that does not mean that D&D have to make the same mistakes and destroy the show.
Luka Nieto,
I heard here that he did say.
Dutch maester,
I think It would also be interesting if they show hardhome in the credits, like they did with moat caillin last year, and hardhome will be a much bigger event in the show so it would make more sense. Personally I believe they will do it
Turncloak,
This is my first exposure to the r/asoiaf folks (I didn’t realize there was any show talk there), but they seem whinier than the people here, who by and large want the show to be able to stand on its own. In that regard, we’re more like the r/gameofthrones community (minus the memes), whereas r/asoiaf is more like the Westeros.org community. But I shouldn’t be mean; different strokes for different folks.
In any case, I appreciate the link to the review.
Joffrey’s Cunt,
They hopefully will 🙂
I didn’t see a 2000 page exposition. I saw two books weave an intricate tale of politics, conquest, and adventure. Which was indeed structured. Particularly Cersei’s storyline – which I felt was extremely tight.
For the first time in the books, I was totally immersed in the dialogue and characters, rather than hurriedly flicking the pages to see what happens next. The slower pacing makes for a more relaxing read. Again, objectively, I believe they’re better written. But they are different.
Dnis,
Exactly, they do not hate the show as Westeros.org, but they are very close to the stage.
Their discussions about books are generally boring and tedious. But they talk about them less than before.
Dnis,
The people who are whiny in reddit/asoiaf tend to get downvoted. Once the season starts u are going to see a lot of whiners on this site too. Many are just lurkers until the show makes them piss their book britches
Dutch maester,
That’s great! I’ve appreciated the Memorial Day break in prior seasons because it helped preserve live viewership for the episode that would have been the most talked-about of the season (In Season 2, Blackwater aired over Memorial Day weekened and suffered in the ratings for it. In Season 3, The Rains of Castamere would have aired on Memorial Day weekend if they didn’t take a break. In Season 4, it would have been The Mountain and the Viper). However, the fandom generally goes a little stir-crazy during that two week block when there’s no new episode to discuss. So it will be nice to have 10 consecutive weekends with new episodes this year. It will make for a slightly longer off-season, but hey, that’s a worthwhile tradeoff.
I would guess that HBO is doing away with the Memorial Day break this year for two reasons. One, they’re now placing far less emphasis on live viewership, so a dip in the ratings over the holiday weekend is less consequential from a PR perspective (they will no longer announce viewership numbers for episodes the day after they air, though other outlets will still report them). Two, because of Season 5’s late premiere date and when Memorial Day will fall this year, the episode slated to air on Memorial Day weekend – The Gift – won’t be one of the climactic episodes of the season. It will likely to focus more on setting up the final three episodes (which will be insanely packed), and probably won’t contain a major watercooler setpiece of its own. In other words, the conversation won’t be hurt by so many people waiting a day or two to watch. It should still be a great episode, however.
mau,
Well said, GRRM bit more than he can chew and he’s paying for it.
After reading Sansa’s chapter yesterday and realised that he’s busy with introducing more characters and exploring the Vale political machinations than moving the actual plot , i don’t think that we ever getting the ending in book form.
Her story is poorly structured. Cliffhanger, than 6 years gap than 2 chapters and another cliffhanger…. Very bad.
I feel like this place can become the anti-Westeros.org. Whereas they will bitch about every little detail that’s changed from the books, so many peeps here will wail against any criticisms of the show.
Wait. I may be totally blanking out here, and it is possible. But I swear on my life I can’t remember there being a six year gap in Cersei’s storyline.
Luka Nieto,
It would be really cool! Going far up north in the map really interests me, and hopefully later, let’s say season 7 we will get a view of the lands of no winter with the white walkers main city, now this would blow my mind :P…Oh a man can only dream.
Chriss,
This place is also becoming Anti-GRRM @ the moment.
GoT actors were interviewed for an issue of a romanian magazine, nothing really new in it, but Kit said “this season is so big that we shot 3 weeks for a battle sequence that will only take 18 minutes of the episode”.
So it looks like the Hardhome battle will be around 18 minutes, if there are 18 minutes of pure battle, that should be epic!
I’m excited, episode 8 is up on the HBO Latino schedule, but no title so far, I hope we’ll get one this weekend.
Yeah, there’s a lot of GRRM hate. Sometimes I think D&D fans do it in an attempt to balance out the hate. I think they’re all great.
Joffrey’s Cunt,
Actually Hardhome is not that far up North. It’s just a tad north of Eastwatch, as you can see here. Granted, it’s even further North than the Fist, but it’s also in the Bay of Seals, so the “real North” (the Frostfangs and the Lands of Always Winter) is even farther away.
Balerion The Cat,
There is not going to be an actual “battle” in Hardhome.
Chriss,
Actions and reactions . For me, it is expected.
It was a matter of time before amount of hate there will create new hate here.
It is lika a conflict between conservatives(weteros.org) and liberals(TWOW,IWC,…)
Not gap in storyline, but the gap between publications of books….
Ghost in in the season premiere I know.
He’s gnawing on some food in the foreground as Jon spars with Olly in a scene. I think that is the only time he’s on screen in the first 2 episodes…
No Sand Snakes n the first two episodes. Doran, Areo, Trystane, Myrcella and Ellaria can be seen however and Indira Varma kills it! I’m happy they expanded her role!
Luka Nieto,
You probably did not see it since it went on moderation. Allan Gildea role will be “Master of Arms” the link is in another post I have above (just search for Allan Gildea)
Is the moutain/Robert strong in any of the first 4 episodes
Interview with Bryan Cogman…
http://observer.com/2015/04/blood-caffeine-sex-magic-how-game-of-thrones-gets-written/
Ah, I see. I think that’s an interesting point, by the way. I came to the series after book five. So I was able to read the five books one after the other. I can see why books four and five would be incredibly frustrating for anyone who had waited all those years for them.
I also take your point about westeros and here. Agreed.
I think the reason for this is that the criticism of GRRM on westeros. org is censored. Any negatively thread about the books or him is closed.
Luka Nieto,
Yes I know that, by far up north I meant on the credits, I read they actually made the fist of the first men for the credits but it did not ended up on them unfortunately, but now with Hardhome I’m really confident that it will. Enventually we will get to see more places in the north just like George said, and hopefully the White walker empire in the real north too.
Oh I knew it!
http://www.ew.com/article/2015/04/03/george-rr-martin-winds-date
This is a pretty cool development.
Everyone’s going to speculate like crazy on which character he is referencing. My wild guess is either Jon (who the show may have a different path for than For the Watch) or Tyrion (who meets up with Dany on the show). These might be the decisions he’s talking about or it could be someone completely different. Hard to know until Season 5 has finished airing.
Dutch maester,
Makes sense.
Interview with GRRM on ew.com about the publication of TWOW:
http://www.ew.com/article/2015/04/03/george-rr-martin-winds-date?hootPostID=825bc23d3ba638ecb4306aa66a415b67
This is interesting and may be considered a little bit spoilery so…
Edit: KT beat me to it.
Chriss,
GRRM deserves a lot of the critisism he gets, and i’m saying that as a fan. what we got in 15 years was two mediocre books that moved the plot at snail’s pace, how is our frustration unjustified? D&D haters usually ignore tv limitatios and adaption choices and no matter how great the show is they are unable to judge it on it’s own merit.
I judged AFFC/ADWD on their own merits and they aren’t enjoyable
Balerion The Cat,
Thanks for this info! Hope that’s 18 continuous minutes and not intercut with other storylines.
Darquemode,
I’m really happy to hear about Indira being great 🙂
Are Myrcella and Trystane as intolerable a Twilight of a romance as some people fear? I’m not that concerned, myself. Am I wrong?
ace,
Thanks! Adding it to the wiki.
I can’t really argue with that. You’re willing to give D&D slack because of limitations but unwilling to do the same for GRRM. I’m pretty sure if he could write any faster he would.
You also dismiss any criticisms of the show because they’re just haters, but yet are happy to criticise the later books. There’s nothing I can say to combat that.
Grand maester giz,
I don’t think so, no….
King Tommen,
Maybe he’s thinking that
If that’s the case, Mind. Fucking. Blown.
Who could it be then?
Luka Nieto,
They’re only in the background looking happy – not Twilight-like! XD
However, seeing them together does inspire Ellaria to storm off to see Doran!
Chriss,
Funny enough, in the article I referenced above, Martin talks about his writing process after publishing ADwD and regrets basically not “getting on it” afterwards and shelving the process for a while which more or less put a stop to his hot streak of writing.
And the show appears to be the thing that’s actually getting him off his ass and serious about completing TWoW. The problem with a writer of his stature (and he’s not alone in this) is that he can write at his own pace and take as long as he likes. There are no real deadlines which means he can write and write and write which often (and again, he’s not alone in this) leads to volumes that have more and more bloat attached to them. It’s not always a great thing to have all the time in the world to get through your series. Without deadlines, you become undisciplined and world-building becomes more a priority than actually getting through your story that you wanted to tell in the first place.
Remember that the original outline he had in his head for ASOIAF was for 3 books. This has expanded now to seven and he’s hinted a few times that it could take 8. That’s completely unnecessary but it’s what happens when you want to continue to add more and more layers of locations, characters and history to an already complicated universe. Five books in, his world needs to be contracting, not expanding.
King Tommen,
He just wants to sell his books after they are spoiled by the show.
I expect it to be something totally irrelevant. Dany with dothraki or Sansa with Harry Hardyng.
Rygar,
If that’s the twist, there’s nothing on the show that they’ve done with that story that is significantly different than the books so they could certainly go the same way if they wished.
I think Martin is referencing something fundamentally different that the show has done with a major character that means whatever twist it is, it wouldn’t make sense on the show.
Darquemode,
Does Ellaria essentially take Obara’s role in “The Captain of the Guards”? We already know she has some of her dialogue directly taken from the page, thanks to the Entertainment Weekly issue.
King Tommen,
I assume it’s something essential about a non-POV character who is a POV character in the show. I’m not saying this is the case, but let’s say Margaery wasn’t, after all, a “player” at all in the books. Just a puppet with no original thought of her own. Well, that couldn’t be done in the show now, could it? That’s not a twist, but you get what I’m saying. It’s gotta be a secondary non-POV character that’s been developed more in the show, so whatever the twist is it couldn’t happen in the show because it’s already been contradicted.
In this interview he admits that he did not write much after 2011. Only recently he has become more serious.
I expect that he really started to work on TWOW in 2013 or 2014.
So disappointing.
King Tommen,
Gotta be jogen reed
Hi there,
I’m not prepared to reveal who I am or how/why I saw them (because reasons), but I have watched the first 4 episodes and would be prepared to answer any not too spoiler-ish questions about them if anybody is interested.
Maybe he changed his mind and has decided that Jeyne Westerling really is pregnant which changes the whole “heir of the North” storyline. Obviously the show isn’t going to be able to use that route.
Sansa, Dany and Tyrion or Jaime with LSH.
But I really do not expect that twist the lead the story in a totally different direction.
This is just his hype.. “books won’t be completly spoiled by the show”… We already know that.
Incognito,
Who are the contenders for the Choosing of the next Lord Commander of the Night’s Watch? Does Sam meddle with the Choosing, as he does in the books? Does Sam have any significant scenes? What about Gilly, Tormund and others like that?
Does Ghost appear?
Who does Jon interact with? Does he interact with Davos, Shireen, Selyse; anyone he doesn’t at that point in the books?
Do we learn Littlefinger’s plan for Sansa, or are the details a mystery for the audience as well? Does it make sense, within the context of the show (i.e. does Littlefinger justify leaving her off at such a dangerous place)?
Is the Tourney at Harrenhal discussed? If so, at what length?
Does Barristan finally tell Dany about the madness of his father?
What about Dorne? Are the Sand Snakes different enough? Do you like Myrcella and Trystane? What does Ellaria discuss with Doran in episode one? Is it essentially Obara’s conversation with Doran from “The Captain of the Guards”, as we’ve been led to believe by the piece of dialogue in the Entertainment Weekly issue?
What about mentions of possible future storylines? Is Hardhome mentioned? Eastwatch? The Shadow Tower (Denys Mallister is cast, so I assume so)? Oldtown? And Sunspear? Is the Dornish storyline confined to the Water Gardens or is Sunspear featured, or at least hinted at to be featured?
We know the Jaqen actor is back. Is he playing Jaqen, as some hope, or the Kindly Man wearing Jaqen’s face, as the leaked script summary seemed to reveal?
Incognito,
Any sign of yara and the iron born ?
Incognito,
I’ve seen the first 12.
Incognito,
Thanks for this.
Do you think the reasons for Sansa going to Winterfell are explained well and make sense within the internal logic of the show universe?
Do you think you have a good hint as to where Brienne and Pod are heading in the second half of the season?
What are your early impressions of the Sand Snakes and the High Sparrow?
Is LF in King’s Landing before or after they go to Winterfell?
Chriss,
Please tell me what are the limitations Mr. GRRM have to face that he didn’t when writing the first 3 books other than him losing his story somewhere around 2001-2002?
Hi!, basically 3 questions:
1. How are the new actors? Which are the best and which the worst?
2. Do we see other flashbacks except that in the premiere?
3. Are there significant deaths in the first 4 eps?
Thankyou!
Yes, I anticipated that he is developing a series for HBO. I did not anticipate it would not be GoT-related. HBO must have some kind of deadline, so Martin has to make that a priority.
Incognito,
We know how to recognize a troll. If you ‘are a troll do not waste your time here.
mau,
There’s no harm trying 😉
If his information is incorrect, we will probably know.
Luka Nieto,
Essentially, yes.
Incognito,
Only one question: What will it take to see Kenny topless and when will Sue go out with me?
Ok two questions.
I agree, I will wait for his next post.
Darquemode,
Does Varys explain to Tyrion his assassination attempt in S1? I’m speaking about Dany.
if this is a troll it better at least be an amusing one.
mau,
It explains itself, but it’d be great for Varys to just tell Tyrion, because some people don’t seem to get it.
mau,
I won’t get into specifics, but Varys does briefly discuss motivations for some of his actions … Mostly though he and Tyrion just discuss how and where they fit into the world.
Incognito,
Can you give some details on
scenes?
Darquemode,
Ok. Is there any logical hole in his plan?
Luka Nieto,
That is the reason I asked.
Incognito,
Hey there! I just want to know one thing. I heard there was shocking finale in one of the first episodes, I’m not sure if it’s episode 3 or 4. Could you tell me if thats true? And if true How much did it shock you, and at what level, considering all the seasons shockers?
Kay,
It sounds like a straight drama series, I was hoping he would be developing another genre series for HBO.
Does Illyrio appear at all? who is on Cersei’s small counsel? and where does Brienne seem heading after the Vale?
mariamb,
King Tommen,
Exciting times indeed! A lot of words and promises….hopefully inspired by real progress.
And I really like that he is still crafting his story and not simply filling in the blanks per an HBO-sponsored outline. By this time next year, we may know many more things…
A warged Ghost PoV…?
Does JW matter…?
Any truth to the Pink Letter…?
A successful Davos quest…?
Much faceless fuckery in Oldtown with Euron, Sam, and an SS…
BF resurfacing…
Dany flies west with the survivors…and her fleet follows…
A faceless girl sails west with an agenda…
Aegon & JonCon and Arianne sail/ride into KL…
Greywater Watch awakens!
Sansa overplays LF…
Bran flies…
The true integrity of the wall….
…among many others…
Go GRRM go! Burn the midnight oil on that DOS & Wordstar box!
mau,
I would say no…
It is one of those broad and vague conversations without many details from Varys.. and only briefly on that topic. Mostly it’s commiseration and motivation.
it was the only thing that mattered to me. Dany or Aegon, … never mind…
KrakenDaughter,
In name only, sadly.
Her Small Council is as expected. To me at least.
You will know what Brienne and Pod are up to and why… For the most part.
Darquemode,
Maybe you can answer this, without being in any way specific about it. No spoilers necessary! Someone reported episode 3 (or was it 4?) had a pretty shocking ending. Is that true?
Oh, and what’s Cersei’s Small Council like? I assume no new characters? Any Tyrells on her Council, or just Qyburn and Pycelle? It seems an awfully small Small Council.
IMO Kevan will be HoK .
And he will be in E2.
Luka Nieto,
I have only seen the first 2 episodes, sorry.
I won’t give specifics on her SC, but I will say that scene is quite good!
So we will see SC in E2? Great!
I have one question .
Will they appoint new Hand of the King? You do not have to say the name.
mau,
Hm… they kinda have to… right? I hope they address this.
A patsy like Harys Swift worked for the books but I’m not sure that’d work for the show. Also, of course, none of those other Small Council characters have been cast that we know of. So it’s gotta be either no one at all or Kevan. Or… Mace? He’s more malleable (i.e. stupid) in the show; maybe Cersei doesn’t see him as such a threat.
mau,
There will be new appointments and there will still be positions unfilled when the scene ends. All I will say. 🙂
Luka Nieto,
I think that Mace will be Hand after Kevan. He didn’t have “hand” in his Bravos scene. Mace will be Mater of coin IMO.
Darquemode,
I’m so jealous of you. xD
Darquemode,
Oh cool 🙂
Oh, one thing, without getting into any specifics whatsoever: in episode two, does Littlefinger reveal his plans to Sansa, whatever they are? If so, does he justify sending her to such a dangerous place, the place in which we saw her in the second trailer? Are the justification and his plans to your satisfaction, personally?
Just a question, Darquemode. If you can answer, of course.
How is Jaime in episode 2? We already know what he does in episode 1 and we know he has a scene in episode 2 that appears in the trailer. I am just wondering how is his characterization. the whole dynamic with Cercei from the books is changed in the show at this point. So I would like to know if he appears likeable, his witty self, or just Cercei’s puppy. does he show the political intelligence he shows in the books? Having free will etc or not? Thanks so much in advance
mau,
If Kevan is made HoK they having to change the dynamic between him and Cersei completely, Or maybe he’ll accept at first than quits after some wine ” accidently” get spilled on him.
I do not think they have to change the dynamics. She will think that he is a puppet, and he would later prove to be independent.
I can see your post.
Luka Nieto,
LF does not get too into his plans in the first 2 episodes, in fact there is only one snippet of information (a big one though) that we are left to decipher. So I cannot really say if his plan feels organic or well-constructed etc..
KeeperOfOaths,
It feels like Jaime is getting closer to his old self with confidence and cockiness. Not a lap dog, but not barking at Cersei for no reason either. I like what I have seen.
Nice try 😀
To be honest, I was hoping for a GoT-related offshoot, so that HBO could capitalize on its enormous popularity and we could be kept happy. 🙂 Perhaps that is still a possibility but hush-hush at the moment.
Incognito,
If you attempt to reply to more than two or three commenters at once, your post will automatically go into moderation. That happens because each reply includes its own unique link to the comment you’re responding to, and too many links in one post will trigger the spam filter until a mod can clear it manually. Your best bet is to reply to only one or two commenters in each post, and make several posts if need be.
Incognito,
It’s in moderatation because you replied to too many people probably. Too many links, mistaken for spam. Reply with less than three links per post.
Darquemode,
No Alfie Allen, Iwan Rheon, or Michael McElhatton in the first two eps?
Off topic but I just saw this…
http://www.ew.com/article/2015/04/03/george-rr-martin-winds-date
At first I thought it might be some sick (and late) April Fools joke, but it seems legit. WTF? I thought GRRM was done with making optimistic speculation about the release date for TWOW and was done teasing us.
Unless he’s actually that close to finishing that he feels comfortable being a troll?
EDIT: Beaten to it–twice over in fact (at least). Seems I need to up my game!
Roose Springsteen,
No.
Incognito,
JamesL,
Jaqen’s character was a “character” inside the fiction too; an identity for a Faceless Man. So I assume this Jaqen will have the same speech patterns and personality (and memories, too!); those belong to the original Lorathi Jaqen whose face these two Faceless Men have doned.
Looks like “Incognito’s” posts are being deleted, he responded to my question about Arya and Jaqen and now it is gone.
Darquemode,
A big Thank You.
This is all I wanted to know. 🙂
JamesL,
For what it’s worth, I read the e-mail notification reply of Incognito’s comment where he responded to 5 or 6 people and it seemed legit to me. The responses matched up with what I have seen in the first two episodes as far as I could tell.
*Shrug*
Darquemode,
Anything interesting? That won’t get your post deleted… For some reason.
Darquemode,
Maybe they deleted it because it was real?
Are they seriously deleting those comments??
If anyone wants to let me know of somewhere else I can answer questions without being deleted please do.
mau,
I agree, with Mace off on his misson and the minor characters from the book cut that only leaves Kevan Qyburn and Pycelle, if Kevan wasn’t on it that would leave only 2 people on the councel and it no longer qualifies as one.
I hope Mace is less of a buffon than he was last season or Cersei’s SC would be a bigger joke than it was in the books.
Incognito2,
I really apreciate what you’re doing man, it’s a shame they are deleting your posts. I wish I knew where you could post without getting deletd, maybe on reddit? what do you think guys??
Incognito2,
reddi/r/asoiaf is the best place for public discussion , and if you don’t already have an account it only takes 5 minutes to set one up.
Incognito2,
Try again here. I don’t know what’s happend.
Or reddit.
Incognito2,
reddit asoiaf maybe?
Drogon S5!!
http://interactive.nydailynews.com/2015/03/game-of-thrones-calendar/images/day_23_exclusive_dragon.jpg
1. Brienne and Pod storyline
2. Eps with the Sand Snake
3. Other flashbacks?
Luka Nieto,
I won’t copypasta them.
There must have been a reason why they were deleted and I don’t want to go against whoever deleted them. Sorry.
Incognito2,
There’s nothing there already :/
Great now Incognito’s comment with the link to his post on reddit was deleted too.
Who really believes in words coming from an entertainment magazine review?
I need to get going, but I may be back on later tonight in 5 or 6 hours.
I will try to answer more if I can then.
Joffrey’s Cunt,
In what subreddit was it, because i can’t find any post about on r/asoiaf.
Joffrey’s Cunt,
I checked both /gameofthrones and /ASOIAF reddit subs and I don’t see his post…
Love it! I especially like “Going into the new season Daenerys needs her fire-breathing kids for military purposes, but she also needs to make peace with them first.”
It was a betrayal for a “mother” to lock up her “children” in a dark dungeon. She needs to resolve that troubling issue.
The reddit moderators deleted his/her post 🙁
(it was on r/asoiaf)
Joffrey’s Cunt,
I don’t understand.
JamesL,
https://www.reddit.com/user/IncognitoFromWOTW
He made a comment with the link and was deleted right away, I managed to get it but the post was also deleted on reddit. here’s the link anyway: https://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/comments/31buih/spoilers_all_qa_re_season_5/
JamesL,
I saw.
aryamad,
from what i remember, first reactions to Brienne were mixed and they bacameuniversally positive once she had enough screentime , it ‘s too early to judge them.
Incognito3,
I’m gonna message r/asoiaf mods , i don’t think your threads is against the subreddit rules
Balon01,
God damnit, why does the internet hate “Incognito” so much???
Seriously though, why does he keep getting deleted. People have posted details about upcoming episodes on here before without being deleted. There have been numerous posts on reddit giving spoilers about upcoming episodes without being deleted, why is he the one to get deleted? He should try r/gameofthrones instead.
mau,
I was just about to post that!
I first thought it was a puppet because it looked too real! The CGI is stellar this season!
Wait I want all of these spoilers wtf
k
I now believe that Incognito is a troll who deletes his own posts because it would be a really big coincidence that the mods here and on reddit delete everything instantly. I also don’t believe that a mod from WotW would delete that many posts without writing a single comment.
Well Incognito left his name on outlook but he didn’t say what mailbox was his, in outlook you can use different mails, so I have no idea
mau,
It’s an email account .
Dragonslayer,
Yes, i now belive this too.
Anyone remember his spoilers?
Dragonslayer,
Yeah , something is definitely off with this guy i sent him a message on reddit and he’s not responding
It’s only possible if he is a moderator of the WOTW staff. Many other post was deleted too, not just his/hers
Dragonslayer,
“Darquemode” already confirmed that his spoiler details about the episodes was correct.
Why haven’t they denied it yet then? If they are not deleting his posts wouldn’t they have said so by now and informed us that he is a troll.
KrakenDaughter,
That’s if he is still on reddit, he’s probably gone now…
Although I suspect he’s a troll (why else would their posts be deleted here?) I am curious too about that question RE Jaqen/TKM.
Edit- If Darquemode could comment on this, that would be great.
Oh fuck them…. he’s gone now….
Darquemode,
Hi Darquemode:
Do Brienne and Sansa mention Catelyn at all in the first 2 episodes? Thanks.
I wrote a mail to Incognito about the reddit back up.
Non-book reader here – can someone please tell me what happens to Shireen in the books?
From Westerosorg on Twitter:
I may be getting paranoid about Shireen – I hope she is not getting killed in the first four episodes by that clueless witchy woman, Melissandre, and it’s not THAT scene that these guys are talking about. #Worried
His thread is back up. Hopefully he sees it soon.
Kay,
Elio & Linda admit that a non-book scene is the highlight for them. I admit, it shocks me a little. But it’s a breath of fresh air.
They also say in that tweet-chain that Stannis is in all four episodes. Woah. That’s great!
As for Shireen, if you really wanna know what happens to her in the books:
Nope, brand new, not from the books scene. Beautifully written and acted.
Ellio wrote this? Oh may gooooooooooood!
Luka Nieto,
Well, they praise Bryan Cogman.
That is a way for every book purist to praise the show , but not D&D.
mau,
Stop the presses!
I’m sure they just wanted to be positive in their first tweets. That scene must be really good if they comment on it, though. Anyway, I’m sure there’ll be plenty of criticism about all the deviations and book scenes which D&D fucked up in their eyes.
Incognito’s answers:
http://www.reddit.com/user/IncognitoFromWOTW
Thanks Luka Nieto. Sadly, that remains a strong possibility then, for this Stannis scene. The show has always made Shirren completely adorable, and many spoilers for Season 5 talked about a death that would be gut-punching to most viewers. Plus, the shot of her mother on the ground. And yes, the Season 4 scene between Selyse and The Witch strongly suggested this.
Luka Nieto,
I can’t wait for book purists reaction to Sansa and Ramsey. LOL
Kay,
I don’t… even wanna think about it. I’ll cry. I know I will. She’s the most intelligent, adorable child in the whole show… in the whole damn world. I won’t bear it :/
Balon01,
Oh, and the Tourney at Harrenhal is “discussed in full albeit with a tinge of ‘what if’ sadness had things happened differently.” I’m quite surprised about this. I didn’t expect that piece of backstory to be discussed at all, let alone told in full.
Luka Nieto,
Curious about the Stannis,Davos,Mel scene
Balon01,
If you belive him , he wrote tthat LF’s plan makes sense , but it’s pretty bold. He does justify to her why he is leaving her alone. He
He wrote that LF is not in KL yet. But that doesen’t make sense. We know he will be in KL in E3 or 4.
mau,
That reassures me. Though it’s a bit silly to think D&D wouldn’t have thought through his plan, precisely because it seems so “bold” (or stupid) at first glance.
He also says the Sand Snakes appear only briefly (in episode 4), in an introductory scene, and that he didn’t like the scene itself much but he DID like the Sand Snakes. He mentioned they have potential.
Luka Nieto,
I’m not.
Make sure you use spoiler tags in your titles if ur going to post to reddit. Posts with no spoiler tags get automatically deleted by bots.
Tyrion Pimpslap,
Undoubtedly, it makes sense. I just thought we’d get the Tower of Joy story and that’d be about it. It’s surprising for me that we’ll get the full story of how it all begun, in the tourney at Harrenhal.
I wonder who relays this story, and to whom. Barristan to Dany, maybe?
Luka Nieto,
I wrote him a message and he answered me. I’m still not sure what to think.
And what about Vale army? What LF gets from this marriage?
LF & Sansa have an escort, not an army, what LF gets from it isn’t fully clear yet, what he tells Sansa seems to be a lot of ‘IF this and IF that’.
Can you tell me does Varys explain to Tyrion his assassination attempt in S1?
Not as yet no.
And who will be new Hand of the King?
It is yet to be decided…1 offer rejected.
Still not sure I believe him about all the stuff.
Luka Nieto,
Feldman confirmed that the Tourney Story is not in Barristan’s arc. I’m guessing it will be Littlefinger who tells us about the Tourney at Harrenhall since he likes talking during Tourneys on the show and he will be attending a short vale Tourney in ep 1
Turncloak,
If he told the story in full, and not as a passing reference, people would have mentioned it in the reports of the premiere. Actually I’m sure book readers would’ve mentioned it either way. So it can’t be in episode 1. Also, what they attend in episode one doesn’t seem to be a tourney in truth; as far as I’m aware, we will simply see Robin failing to fight. But it certainly can be Littlefinger telling the story to Sansa, in another episode. I wonder why it’s brought up, though.
mau,
Conleth Hil, confirmed that he will be talking about the assassination attempt in S5.
The order not to kill her came from someone, just as the order to kill her. And maybe that will come out in future episodes, so I don’t want to talk too much about it.
https://watchersonthewall.com/conleth-hill-discusses-game-thrones-season-five-rare-interview/
This incognitos’s info about Varys and information that LF is not in KL in first 4 episodes (and we know that he is) seem suspicious to me. I don’t belive him.
As for Cersei’s Small Council…
Mace Tyrell as Master of Ships (which he already was) and Coin (which we knew he would be, from the beginning or eventually, as he will travel to Braavos instead of Harys Swift, who was demoted to Master of Coin and sent to negotiate with the Iron Bank.)
Qyburn Master of Whisperers, just as in the books.
Pycelle remains Grand Maester, of course.
Kevan is offered the position of Master of War (which is a new position, as far as I’m aware), though he apparently rejects it.
And most importantly: the Hand. Apparently, “Cersei receives a couple of offers to serve as Hand which she swiftly dismisses stating the king will choose his own hand when he comes of age.” So the post will remain vacant, at least until Cersei is imprisoned, then.
He wrote
Not new characters, new faces to the Small Council yes; Mace Tyrell as Master of Ships and Coin, Qyburn Master of Whisperers which Pycelle objects to, finally Kevan is offered the position of Master of War. Cersei receives a couple of offers to serve as Hand which she swiftly dismisses stating the king will choose his own Hand when he comes of age.
Who wants to bet the scene they’re praising is from episode 4, which is Dave Hill’s episode? I can’t imagine they’d give those devils D&D such credit.
Luka Nieto,
I don’t think that Kevan rejects it.
But who are candidates to serve as Hand?
And he says the tourney is told by Barristan to Dany.
Hm… who was it that said otherwise? Because then there’s a contradiction.
mau,
Yivo,
Bryan Cogman. I wrote somthing similar above.
We must wait for Darquemode to confirm all this.
Where is this info come from? I hear about this for the first time.
Balon01,
I’m pretty sure LF won’t be in KL in the first four episodes… or not the first three, at least.
mau,
That’d be nice.
mau,
Darq said he only saw the first two episodes, though.
In all honesty, I’m super surprised someone hasn’t completely come out with all the spoilers for the first 4 episodes yet.. come on peeps… THROW US SOME CRUMBS
He said to me that Brienne
I know. he can confirm info for episode 1 and 2.
mau,
I don’t think Cogman wrote episode 4, but you’re right, they’ve said similar things about stuff written by Cogman in the past.
mau,
Well of course she is 😛
Yivo,
Cogman wrote 5 & 6. Dave Hill wrote 4. D&D 1, 2, 3, 7, 8, 9 and 10.
mau,
He already confirmed in an earlier post that they were accurate-
mau,
Nymeria Warrior Queen,
And also giving your opponent a perfect opportunity to thrust his sword through the back of your skull before you can even turn all the way around.
JamesL,
Catelyn went from Winterfell in 1×02 to King’s Landing in 1×03. It’s not impossible. It’s implied that time passes, especially between some episodes. However, I don’t think that’s what’s gonna happen. I expect to see him again a couple episodes after leaving Sansa.
SPOILER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Our King Tommen on westeros.org confirmed that Sansa will be Sansa in WF.
she will marry Ramsay as Sansa Stark
Luka Nieto,
mau,
Huh? When? Where? And what do you mean exactly?
Luka Nieto,
Go and read last 10 pages on S5 thread on westeros.org.
OMG!
mau,
I’m on it 🙂
mau,
So “the North remembers” is at least uttered.
I want to say here that incognito’s info is legit. I’m sorry that I doubted his legitimacy.
mau,
Really disappointed to learn that. Was still holding out hope that Sansa would be playing a sort of Lady Dustin role and coaching a new character.
mau,
That can be quite creepy. Let’s see how it goes. I mean, Tommen is almost an adult in the show, so it’s not as creepy as it would be in the books, of course.
About the Red Priestess at the Long Bridge of Volantis, seen in the trailer:
So, essentially she takes the role of the Red Priest from Selhorys and the High Priest of Volantis, Benerro. That’s really exciting. “She was reborn from fire.” A vague reference to Azor Ahai reborn, who hasn’t been mentioned in the show yet (though we’ve had other references to the Prince that was Promised; the Son of Fire, Warrior of Light.)
Back..
Looks like someone else has leaked some spoilers.
Cool!
Link please.
Everything that “Incognito” is spoiling sounds fun. “King Tommen”‘s spoiler sounds horrid. Can we get a link to this other spoiler?
Mace & Pycelle each offer to be Hand which Cersei rejects.
Kevan will reject position on SC.
Lady Wolfsbane,
They both are speaking the same thing.
Yeah please couldn’t find
No… you said someone else said Sansa will be Sansa in Winterfell. This Reddit thing has no reference to that at all… unless that was before it went down?
Anyone else confirming that anywhere, by any means?
Chriss,
That’s because you are a purist. The griff storyline took me by surprised however as I kept reading it did not seem legit. The show can do without the Griff and YG. I’m assuming it is all bullshit in the books. The story up to A Storm of Swords have been great and to have have these two assholes waste my time by misleading I’m not up for it.
King Stannis,
http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/126975-season-5-casting-news-and-speculation-v1-spoilers-all-the-way/page-19
Go to page 10.
It’s so interesting that an old lady in Winterfell tells Sansa that “the North remembers.” I wonder if it’s just a way to show us the Northern smallfolk still support the Starks, or if she will have a bigger, conspiratorial role.
Also, we’ll see Moat Caitlin again:
To ALL,
The person posting as Incognito has violated a HUGE rule about screeners. People who are given the privilege to view the screener episodes, the first four this season, are NOT supposed to spoil them. They can review them in general but giving out details is verboten and will get their privileges as a screener revoked. Furthermore, she puts this site’s privileges in jeopardy, including Sue’s ability to be a screener. That is NOT cool and will not be tolerated.
We warned Incognito about this and have deleted (and will continue to delete) his/her comments giving out spoilers on WotW. Furthermore, any comments that the rest of you make that contain his/her spoilers will also be deleted. Please respect us and don’t ruin the very good thing we have going here at WotW, which by necessity includes having access to inside information. If we lose the inside track, we might as well pack up and go home.
Because it is a better placement to tell that story now as we are getting closer to the mystery in the show. Rather than 3 seasons(3 years ago) to remember.
Hmmm… so this person is just claiming someone told them all this info secon-hand. Well, I guess I can hold out hope that it’s lost in translation… 😉
Whoops, I’ll shaddup now – very sorry for all I knew it was just a usual troll (with fun-sounding ideas), and we were vainly speculating.
Luka Nieto,
Only the purist will be upset. As the biggest Stannis and Jon fan I approve and that’s what counts.
King Stannis,
Apparently we can’t discuss this but… yeah, it sounds really cool 😉
Luka Nieto,
Hope this doesn’t cause another “Your Sister” controversy, lol
mau,
I feel dirty after venturing into the ‘AFOIAF’ TV show page. There is only so much “Fuck D&D” or “Fuck this show” I can take. It’s fiction for Christ’s sake! Get over it.
HelloThere,
I hope it does. D&D are showing that they do not care about opinions of book purists and that is great!
Dame Pasty,
Oh, so this isn’t a site that will discuss spoilers, then? Hmm for spoiler junkies like me I guess I will have to move on. Once you start drawing the line about discussing spoilers it won’t stop. People will be afraid to post them or they will be deleted. Bummer.
Dame Pasty,
I encourge the mods to delete any comment violating the rules, mine included.
WotW should not be punished for our impatience.
Dame Pasty,
When did this nonsense become a rule? Posting spoiler leaks about upcoming episodes never used to be banned. Hell, one of the people who know works on this site, formally “FireandBlood” now “Axechucker”, got screeners a few years ago and answered tons of spoiler questions before season 3 on WIC.net.
JamesL,
I’m guessing people involved with the show let it be known, and this new policy is in response. This is the premier TV show fan site, after all.
mau,
Considering the quality of AFfC/ADwD , D&D should ask book purists what they want and then do the exact opposite
Tyrion Pimpslap,
The premiere fan site in the pocket of he producers. If comments / spoilers are being silenced at the show runners bequest, how can we ever trust the impartiallity of this site ever again. Terrible development
Dame Pasty,
The more I think about it the less it makes sense because this website regularly posts spoiler information that they have learned from their “sources” about the upcoming season. I could go through the archives and find a bunch of spoiler posts made by the WOTW staff about season 5.
asdf,
what?
so…..
u want the site to go away ?
k
asdf,
I think there is a difference between minor spoilers, and telling us exact plot details. The site has a good reputation. Too many spoilers, and you begin to ruin things for casual readers of this site, who would not expect such details here (especially when some people don’t use spoiler tags). Besides, even if they ignored these casual readers, they would lose screeners themselves in the future, plus all those wonderful leaked casting calls. Once the site loses that trust it is gone forever, so I completely agree with them.
There are countless other sites where I’m sure you could discuss them, but perhaps the integrity of those sites are not quite so high.
HelloThere,
It just means that cutting edge spoiler info will not be coming here anymore. It’s not a problem for a lot of people who enjoy the content here (though I’d expect show criticism to go down here now so that they can stay on shows good side). But for people like me who come here almost exclusively for spoilers my faith is shaken and it is what it is.
JamesL,
*now
I know the difference between now and know, I just need to proofread better…
asdf,
JamesL,
1) No one from HBO has contacted us and we are self-editing. 2) Putting out spoilers from screeners and/or allowing them to be posted is against the rules….always has been. 3) Forbidding these kinds of spoilers is not the same as putting out information that has appeared in the news and has been confirmed by “in the know” sources. Once something is spoiled (non-screener stuff), it’s open season on it and then we try to always confirm with a solid source or two–kind of like journalism is supposed to work but no longer does.
Don’t get your panties in a twist over this. The issue is spoiling screeners. Period. Dot.
Jeb,
Thank you, Jeb. You said it better than I could
JamesL,
It is nothing new.
I have gotten screeners for a lot of TV episodes and movies…
They always have a warning to not duplicate or share … and to not share explicit spoilers.
Sometimes writers, shworunners or publicity people will give people exclusive scoops in interviews and of course they can give explicit information. It’s not the same thing as getting a screener though.
The GOT screener had this attached:
“GAME OF THRONES, executive producers D.B. Weiss and David Benioff have requested that you not reveal any of the plot surprises or spoilers in advance of an episode’s debut.”
Dame Pasty,
Yesterday was a great, inspiring day. Today is a stupid day. It is naive to think that the screeners won’t get compromised. With great power comes great irresponsibility. Trying to keep an open mind and hopes up but some of the leaked info is God-awful stupid.
One of Roose Bolton’s leeches,
Sure, if you’re turning at a snail’s pace/in slow motion, which, of course, someone in the midst of a fight would never do. Moreover, the head turns at a much faster rate than the body. One sets their sight on their target, and whips their head around so quickly, one never really loses sight of said target.
Hodor’s Bastard,
You are one of the last people I would expect to pile on here and that’s the only reason I’m going to respond to you.
It is definitely naive, but that naivete doesn’t exist here. That is on the part of Hollywood because they are the ones that release the screeners in the first place. There are, however, still rules that we have to play by in order to maintain a good reputation. We play by those rules, cynically of course, but we still play. If other websites, who will remain nameless, want to violate those rules and allow people in their community to do so, that’s on them. We’re not lemmings and I don’t think you would like us very much if we were.
Without saying anything specific I will also second the sentiment that everything I’ve learned today via spoilers was like, God i hated it so much.
Nymeria Warrior Queen,
It’s not about losing your sight on the target, its that your leaving yourself open to attack with pretty much no way to defend yourself. You can descend your sword or simply thrust it into someone much faster than they can spin. Its simply not worth the risk.
asdf,
Only one piece of info(WF), I’d say. The rest sounds good, as I don’t really care about LS.
asdf,
But surely that is exactly why you should wait until you watch the episodes, because without proper context you can’t fully judge it for sure. It will be interesting to discuss the episodes when they are broadcast, but until we have it really is futile to discuss them.
No TV/film company, theatre director, magician, or author wants you to know exactly what happens before experiencing it in the real format. There’s a reason episode synopses are vague, and episode previews don’t go into intricacies. There is a reason they are called spoilers, and whilst I like a few minor ones, this is far too much.
I hope this is the end of the topic here, so we cam get back to the excitement of waiting to for the season to start.
asdf,
The logic behind that statement doesn’t make any sense.
We are here as guest in someone’s house we should respect their rules or leave.
We got a good thing going on here let’s not ruin it guys.
Poor Annara Snow, I hope she’s not going to kill herself.
Tyrion Pimpslap,
Yeah that’s really the only thing that bothers me very much, and I do hope there’s some set up or explanation for it that makes the idea more appear sensible.
I’m quite looking forward to Stannis and Jon this season. Should be some interesting stuff.
Also did the casting thread just get deleted on Westeros?
I hope this is just my paranoia speaking, but it sure seems like whoever is behind the id that posted the spoilers from the screeners is trying to do damage to this site. It isn’t like they didn’t know what they were doing was strictly verboten, so why would they do it?
If that is the case, it’s beyond pathetic.
Dame Pasty,
I think I was misinterpreted. I wasn’t “piling on.” The “naivete” comment was directed to the org (HBO?) that supplies the screeners, not to WotW. I appreciated your original comment and respect your words greatly. I hate what is going on today, especially the support for unscrupulous leakers by some of the major commenters here.
Nymeria Warrior Queen,
Chaos isn’t a pit, chaos is a laddah.
Ohhhhh, I feel like an ass now. I apologize. Others had set me on edge so I was itching for a fight. Sorry again. /blushing
KrakenDaughter,
No I respect that they make their own decisions. My point was only that I would prefer to consume somewhere that had a different policy is all
Jeb,
I mean now you’re lecturing me on looking up spoilers in general. It’s just something I like to do and I don’t feel need to defend it. Of course if the show is good I will like it, I just also like having this sort of info and making instant judgments about it. It’s a hobby
well, it is possible those places have similar policies, as those leaks have now been deleted
Either that or extraordinarily, mind-bogglingly naive. They posted and got deleted on three major sites. Thankfully they didn’t see all ten episodes or they would have spoilt the entire season. It’s always nice, as a viewer, to go into watching most episodes with some anticipation of unspoilt things.
One of Roose Bolton’s leeches,
If someone is foolish enough to turn when the opponent’s distance is such that they could simply thrust their sword into them, they have no business fighting. As far as “descending a sword,” as you put it, if someone chooses to turn when the opponents sword is at the apex, or close to the apex of their swing, such that their opponent could just descend their sword, that, too, is foolish, and they are not experienced fighters.
ace,
True that other thread got deleted. That’s wild. Down with censorship!
As someone who has information about what will happen in the North in first four episodes ( and Luka Nieto can confirm this) I’ll just say that the story is logical and interesting. There is no reason for skepticism.
Kay,
Oh, I didn’t realize this had happened on other sites. My bad! I guess I was just being paranoid.
I prefer to go into season with some things left unkonwn, myself. In fact, other than really vague summaries, I don’t want to know what happens in the episodes before I see them, beyond what I know from the books.
KrakenDaughter,
I think any site that wants to be taken seriously would. The poster seriously overstepped the mark, and I hope they haven’t spoilt the show for people who didn’t want to be spoiled.
asdf,
I think you will struggle to find a site that would let you discuss it, because the leaker has shown a serious lack of respect to the show. If you don’t mind spoilers, that’s your prerogative, but I have no respect for people who flagraantly abuse the gift they had to preview the season.
Nymeria Warrior Queen,
How would they know what they were doing was strictly verboten? Posting spoilers about future episodes has been common on this website and WIC.net since the beginning. As I mentioned, one of the contributors to this site answered spoiler questions about season 3 when he got screeners a few years ago on WIC.net.
Jeb,
Its gotten shut down on sites that all have relationships with the show and whose operators get screeners. There are certainly other places that this sort of stuff can be discussed. It’s information that’s out there, it isn’t illegal, the only reason the discussion is being squashed is because of the the stake the site operators might lose because of it
JamesL,
Well, back then Phil was running WIC.net. Things change. I’m not gonna act like leaks haven’t been allowed to be discussed in the past, but it seems like multiple sites are cracking down on them this year.
Dame Pasty,
No apologies necessary. We need your vigilance. I can imagine what you’ve been going through lately. Probably similar to a DOS attack. 🙂 Hopefully, you get some apologies from some others who are surprisingly naive to WotW’s concerns.
If you’ll read back, you’ll see where others have already addressed that.
asdf,
Yeah, of course. But then it’s these big Game of Thrones sites that are more likely to have better discussions. I would, however argue that the site isn’t losing out at all. This is a community for all fans to enjoy. It isn’t here for financial gain, so if it loses a few people who are upset that an individual, who has a serious lack of respect for the show, got deleted, then so be it. Boundaries need to be enforced otherwise it is no longer a community ( with more people inenvitably leaving).
I will repeat that I don’t blame people for looking at the spoilers, but they have no place in the public domain.
Armsbendback,
They’ve already distorted Jaime’s fighting ability in the show. He was arguably the best swordsman in Westeros but the show really hasn’t got this over which matters as the whole point is that he is a cocky prick but he can or could back it up. It also emphasises why the loss of his hand is such a big deal. I don’t think the Brienne/Jaime fight was handled very well either as their fight should have been a lot more epic and ended with them both incapacitated making it easier for Vargo/Locke to apprehend them. Having them both just standing there seemed a bit of a weak finish for me. If he loses a fight to Obara in order to put her character over , it’s going to be mighty annoying. The guy needs some combat redemption!
Hopefully my fears about the SS being contrived fanboy/girl fodder won’t come true but that B Movie comment is worrying.
Just read the spoiler on Sati’s Tumblr and it’s quite obvious what happens. Especially if you’ve read GRRM’s latest TWOW chapter.
It’s not that hard to figure out who in the show is replacing Harry.
I wouldn’t call that a ground breaking spoiler especially since we’ve gotten hints of that being a possibility since the second trailer.
Is that all or am I missing something?
Turncloak,
Go back there. I sent her a new spoiler.
Turncloak,
I’ve been banned from westeros for sharing that link so I’ll just hang with you guys now:)
Jeb,
I respect your respectful tone even if I do disagree with some of what you said. Most primarily I am glad that the stuff was leaked, and that I was able to access it (even if indirectly) from my goto fan site. But nonetheless I feel totally able to agree to disagree and respect yor different viewpoint
Luka Nieto,
I’m permanently banned from westeros so if you send me something there I won’t see it
sati,
It was in Tumblr. You actually answered me. I sent you an “ask” to your tumblr and you answered me! Did you forget so fast? 😉
What I sent you is from Incognito, who was legit, so I think it can be considered legitimate. Personally I think it’s pretty big news.
sati,
We must not talk about that spoiler here. xD
Luka Nieto,
Now that is awesome. I’ve always had that Mannis possibility in my head. It’s like LF is a book reader with the way he relayed out that scenario. Hypetastic!!!
Turncloak,
Let’s not get into trouble. Don’t mention specifics here. Also, let’s not link to sati’s Tumblr. If people wanna figure it out, they will 😉
mau,
Hi how I can find said tumblr / spoiler
Turncloak,
I said it is logical and interesting.
asdf,
Sorry, I can’t give you a link
mau,
I hope you guys can embrace my Dillane fangirlism because I have nowhere to post now:D
I’m homeless 😛 I promise I’ll ease out on LS talk!
asdf,
Use your imagination. Or Google. 😛
Sati runs a Game of Thrones Tumblr. That should be enough.
sati,
Water under the bridge, okay? I decided I like you! Your Tumblr is awesome, and your Stannis love is precious to me 😛
Luka Nieto,
Oh sorry I thought I was being incredibly vague with what I commented. And it looks like my damn edit button is gone again. I swear I always have problems when using my iPhone on this site
Seriously, I get that changes need to be made… but why, WHY change such an iconic line from the source for literally no reason? Olly, fetch me my sword.. Is the actor playing Ed not in this season?
Luka Nieto,
I had been recievieng a lot of asks so I may have forgotten the specific one, but no censorship there so ask away if you have more questions 🙂
mau,
Don’t need link will settle for a clue
Luka Nieto,
Thank you!
Luka Nieto,
Thanks so much! my love for Dillane is endless so if anyone is in need of Stannis gifs they will be right there the day after the episode airs 😛
sati,
It wasn’t a question. It was a scoop, originally from Incognito. I think you misinterpreted it as speculation, considering your answer 😉
top kek 420,
Here we go again… just like with “Only Cat.”
The line is iconic because the moment is iconic, not the other way around. The new line works just as well.
This thread will be removed soon, HBO about to come down, unless certain posts concerning certain info have been removed by WotW on their own.
sati,
I love Dillane and I was glad to hear that he is in first four episodes. He will be in 9 or 10 I’m sure. Or both. And in episode 5, because he needs to leave the Wall.
So i can see him in 6, 7, 8 or even 9 episodes. ButI think it will be 7.
sati,
Considering he’s apparently more present in the first four episodes than he’s been for two whole seasons, I’d say I have lots of gifs to look forward to 🙂
The nod. How many gifs will there be about that moment, and that scene? I can see it already, as usual with the original book text superimposed.
top kek 420,
I think they like to troll book purists…
And the best line would be “Man who passes the sentence should swing the sword”.
It is much better than Edd fetch me a block, or Olly fetch me a sword.
mau,
Luka Nieto,
Yeah I’m alreading dreading my computer dying from all the photoshop action 😛 As far as I can tell I’m one of the two people making gifs of him in every ep, I’m just glad David and Dan really meant it about using him more, beacuse it really looks it’s happening, finally 😛
I understand changes like ‘your sister’ and ‘the lannisters send their regards’, which make sense considering the majority of the fanbase hasn’t read the books and wouldn’t know who cat was or be tricked into thinking Jaime was involved with the red wedding. But does this change have any actual basis?
LOL I cant wait for people to rage about this. I’m mostly looking forward to the jokes people make regarding that line change. It’s the little things that piss people off the most I think. I’ll save my criticism for the next next Yara Rescue mission instead ;p
sati,
I think it was wise to keep him until the right moment. He was depressed in S3, we met his family and than in S4 he went to IB and then his big arrival at the Wall.
Now he is really relevant to the plot and show viewers will adore him, I am sure.
sati,
His character and whole storyline suffered the most from the ASOS split into seasons three and four. Others managed, despite a lack of an actual plot (Arya and the Hound during most of season four), but Stannis sulking in Dragonstone for a season and a half while Melisandre burnt people in the beach was a bit much. I’m exaggerating; I like their scenes a lot. But there was too much depression going on for way too long.
Now we’ll get who the book readers are talking about when they talk about “Stannis the Mannis.” It certainly wasn’t Stannis in book 3 (except for the end), or even book 2.
Are GIF Posters reality now? Like the Pictures frames with the people moving inside them from the Harry Potter novels becoming reality thanks to technology.
If there exists such thing as a gif poster, that Nod will be in the entrance to my apt =]
Stannis is in the first four episodes?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLNFloNdJH4
= ASTRONOMICAL LEVEL OF HYPE RIGHT NOW
I can promise you when that nod happens, I’ll make all sort of color combinations with that 😀
mau,
Luka Nieto,
From what I gathered they are finally giving him the time to shine, so it’s wonderful. I was a fan of Stannis in the books, but it’s Stephen who made him my favorite. So excited about his upcoming scenes and I love Harington’s acting now, he has really grown and from what I read in reviews he truly shines so their scenes should be a real treat
top kek 420,
I honestly hope they do it on purpose just to piss off fans like you.
tyjon,
HBO is not doing anything. The moderator on here even said they weren’t removing posts at HBO’s request. This new ban on talking about spoilers from upcoming episodes is self imposed.
Littlefinger better be a good gambler, I’ll be very sad if otherwise .
WunWun,
It’s a big frigging gamble. Either he’s got something up his sleeve that he hasn’t revealed or… I don’t know, too dangerous.
Nymeria Warrior Queen,
You can step forward and stab, which is still much quicker than turning. Even if you have plate armor and chainmail covering the gaps, it’s pointless and I promise you it will do you no good in a fight. Trust me, there are several videos on this topic proving that its just another dumb Hollywood cliché like swords cutting through chainmail. .
LF is probably going to pull a
“The North Remembersh and the Mumersh Farsh is nearly done” -LF
Littlefinger and Stannis are my favorite charcters from the book and show, it’d be cool if they were working together to some extent but I highly doubt it.
WunWun,
They aren’t. They may, though.
One of Roose Bolton’s leeches,
Well, if you want to ignore the fact an experienced fighter would be able to judge the distance, that’s your prerogative. Additionally, if you want to base your statements on some videos you’ve watched, and assume I’m basing my statements on “another dumb Hollywood cliche,” that is also your prerogative.
Turncloak,
He barely brings any Vale soldiers to Winterfell though. From what we see in the trailers, its only a small guard of about 10 men. They could take the Spearwive’s role though. Besides, we do see some Northern lords in the trailer and I’m sure some of them are pissed.
Luka Nieto,
Mayhaps
Some of the more interesting speculation to come out the info is the one that concerns the old lady previously casted that will help Brienne
asdf,
The lack of information, more like. An actress was rejected as a possibility, as she’s only a bartender (Brienne-related, too, but a small role, and she doesn’t help Brienne.) Nothing more, right?
Yeah that’s the exact speculation I’m talking about
Those speculations are giving me a raging clue.
Nymeria Warrior Queen,
Well what are you basing your statements on? If you find any historical manuals or HEMA fighters that actually show this technique and explain how it would be useful then I’ll dress up as Shagwell in public. The manual that states “Unscrew your pommel and throw it at the enemy” doesn’t count. Here is one of the videos I was talking about, which explains my mindset on this pretty well.
Hi people.
I must be really thick but I can’t seem to find the Tumblr of interest. Google isn’t of any help either.
Any help you could provide without getting yourselves in trouble?
Thanks. ( I am /u/TheGhostOfBabyOscar on Reddit if that helps )
All a man wants is the nod that was promised
King Stannis The Purist Slayer,
It’s been confirmed 🙂
Hey guys, I had to go out but now I’m back and missed the all thing, now I’m freaking out by your comments… is there anyway I can still access to those spoilers? because in the links you send they were already deleted :/
One of Roose Bolton’s leeches,
I’m basing my statements on extensive training in rapier and dagger, broadsword, and jang bong (more commonly known as Bo staff). I hold a 3rd Dan (3rd degree black belt) in Tae Kwon Do, so I also have extensive training unarmed combat and in ee chul bong (nun chucks).
I do appreciate you posting that video. If you’ll listen to the very first part, the guy states spinning moves will not be effective, and could very well get you killed, unless you have extensive training/experience, which is what I was getting at, although I may not have been as clear as I thought I was. I agree that without a lot of experience, it would be incredibly foolish. Unfortunately, I’m having problems viewing videos, so I just had to listen. I do know he made arguments against a spinning technique, but, and I may be biased on this, given my background, I don’t think he is taking into account the speed at which some can turn if they’d had extensive training and practice. I’m not trying to say it’s a technique which should be regularly used, but it can be effective with enough practice. Speed, distance, accuracy, sight, and timing all have to be honed for it to work.
Again, thanks for posting the video, as it certainly better helps me understand your argument. Also, please don’t think I’m trying to say I have been in a real combat situation with a sharpened blade. I have not. Finally, if I’ve seemed a bit pissy, my apologies. It has been a long week, and sometimes I come across a bit pissier than I intend.
Luka Nieto,
The Hype is real! The Nod itself will win an Emmy award because one cannot refuse the power. Women will think of the nod while their lovers are inside them. I’m afraid to show my girlfriend that moment honestly :/
WunWun,
My clue is HUUGE
There’s no “new ban.”
The person posting as Incognito was in violation of the screener embargo and their posts were removed since they were putting us in a lousy position. If there was a ban on spoiler discussion, obviously dozens of other posts would have been deleted by now so there’s no need to be dramatic about it.
And yeah, HBO probably would come down on our ass if we just let people run rampant with leaks. There are limits. I don’t think you guys get it, sometimes, how we have to tread lightly here. It’s a delicate balance.
Nymeria Warrior Queen,
Think I lean towards the side of spinning moves being a bad idea in a real fight. Having partaken and watched a fair bit of fencing and kendo, I have never seen anyone effectively use or even try to use such a manouvere. Using it in a fight where your life is on the line wouldn’t be a great idea!
Not going to argue that it’s aesthetically pleasing and has a place in a fantasy show but I think they need to be vigilant that it doesn’t move too far away from the gritty realistic fighting that has come before it.
I think the Hound has the right of it!;
Loved how this scene foreshadowed the Mountain vs the Viper fight!
Nymeria Warrior Queen,
It’s perfectly fine. You have actually managed to persuade me and you didn’t come across as pissy at all. I thoroughly enjoy these kinds of conversation especially involving martial arts.
I will be eagerly awaiting your Gifs My Lady :]
TheTouchOfFrost,
I think it depends on the situation and the weapons being used. I do acknowledge, however, I’ve never seen a spinning technique used in fencing. The good news is, it is highly unlikely any of us will find ourselves in a situation where we have to fight with swords.
One of Roose Bolton’s leeches,
I’m glad to know I didn’t come across as pissy. Like I said, it’s been a long week, and at times I come across as pissy when I don’t mean to, and I was hoping I hadn’t. Once whatever funkiness that’s going on with my computer such that I can’t view videos properly…it’s like the old days when they would constantly stop to buffer…I’ll be watching the video you posted. Needless to say, I love talking about this kind of stuff, especially if it touches on martial arts. Thanks for the conversation.
Sue the Fury,
Sue can you confirm when the embargo lifts? Does the embargo for ep 1-4 end only after each individual episode has first aired?
I do recall season 3 reviewers talking about ep 3-4 before they aired. I remember that’s where we first heard of that reviewer claiming character assassination due to Cat’s speech about Jon.
Turncloak,
I think generally that the review embargo is lifted around a week before the 1st episode airdate but obviously that differs from show to show. At that point, most of the reviews cover off all the screeners provided.
In any case, the request for reviewers not to spoil major developments or give away plot points is maintained throughout the process. Reviews are meant to provide general impressions, not spoil the episodes themselves.
Nymeria Warrior Queen,
Just wait until society collapses. Everyone will be at it! I’ve got a claymore in a glass case ready for that day! 😛
This is a pretty good summary of the expectations. You can get a good feel of the variety of what you can expect (from no spoilers to mild ones) from the reviews we’ve posted so far.
If i were Sophie and / or Maisie i would not have accepted this. Age discrimination at work again. Their characters are infinitely more important than some tertiary character that got promoted to secondary. Not to mention the actual actresses are actually bigger names than Indira Varma already at this point in their careers. (just look at roles they got elsewhere). I really assumed they would be mentioned seperately this year but no. It bothers me. Probably more than them. More so when a far less important person is mentioned seperately. I do hope they secured sizeable salary increases at least.
I don’t get too stirred up about book to show changes , but I am worried about this one-
They are not complaining and neither should you. How old are you? Because you sounds more immature than Sophie and Maisie at this point.
bobbybolt,
Unfortunately, that’s how the film world works. It’s very common even in movies to see supporting actors/actresses lead the way in terms of opening credits, if they’re popular and might bring in extra attention to the show. I agree it seems kind of unfair though.
King Stannis,
Exactly. It won’t bother Sophie ot Maisie where they are in the credits. They know the status quo, and how things operate. Mouthing off would only reflect badly on them. I doubt they will even really notice that Indira will be credited before them. They’re delighted to be part of this great show, and they are both picking up lots of fantastic roles elsewhere too. They won’t be bothered about something as inane as this.
Nessa,
Except Indira Varma is not even remotely as popular as either at this point and if you ask a random group of 100 people who is who with their pictures i have little doubt more will know Maisie and Sophie by now. That’s my point. In Season 1 sure… But not at this point. I highly doubt Indira Varma brings any extra attention to the show whatsoever. Maybe in India?! Not worthwhile to be mentioned ahead of Maisie, Sophie or John Bradley for that matter.
I dont see Indira Varma at Comic Con and show events but they are always there. That says enough.
It does bother me just a little bit though. There are worse things. Fans know who is who…
What’s the deal? Where are the reviews? We’re five days out, and I feel like we’ve gotten way more in the past at this point than we have now. How is it that screeners have been out for a while now, but there’s only ONE review catalogued on metacritic for Season 5?
Is it like this every season and I’m just misremembering? I feel like I’m taking crazy pills!
Having practiced HEMA for the last 3 years I can tell you are 100% wrong. Is something you learn on the first day.
Also, momentum and power are your enemy; you never want to overcommit.
But they are using swords in armored combat, wich is silly in itself.
Looks like I was late to the party. What the other people have said.
Ps: the guy in the video is a bit of a clown though. If you wanna learn about HEMA check the scholagladiatoria ones