The visions of Game of Thrones Season 5 debut

The SightHBO’s promotional tie-in website, ThreeEyedRaven.com, began its teasing campaign tonight, sending out messages via raven (well, text message), to give viewers their first real taste of Game of Thrones season 5 footage.

The campaign is off to a bit of a bumpy start, with not all fans able to access the website and many not receiving their notification yet, but the Game of Thrones official Twitter has confirmed they are working on the issue.

Luckily several viewers have summarized the teaser footage contained in the promos.

But they had to do it quickly, because it seems that, like Bran’s visions, these visions only happen once and then they cannot be viewed again.

UPDATE: One of the teasers was captured on video, and is available below.

The comments below are gathered from WatchersOnTheWall readers, in this post:

From Jared:

Sansa, staring straight ahead at the camera. The image was a bit distorted, like the effect that movies and TV sometimes use to dramatize someone waking up from a dream. Couldn’t tell if it was part of the shot or an intentional effect, but the footage looked like it might be new.

-A shot of Tyrion (no beard) sitting in the dark, looking sullen. I’m pretty sure that this was old footage from when Oberyn visits him in “Mockingbird”.

-A face carved into a Weirwood tree. Probably old footage – it looked similar to the one at which Bran had the vision in Season 4. However, even if it is new, there would be nothing to identify it as such since the face on the tree occupied the entire shot.

-A raven cawing. Possibly old footage. Didn’t notice if it had three eyes or not.

-The Braavosi captain and Arya in rowboat, moving left to right across the screen. Some gray stones like those we saw from the filming reports of Kastel Gomilica behind them. Definitely new footage!

-A hand (it looked like it belong to a woman or a girl) trailing over a dark pool of water. Definitely new.

-Cersei, peering out from behind a ornate grate. It looked like she might be in a litter. Definitely new footage!

-The white book being closed. Possibly old footage, although I don’t remember the exact angle of the shot from the show.

Morgan:

Sansa
-Tyrion
-the Braavosi captain rowing a small boat
-Arya touching the water (well I don’t think it showed her face but it was obviously her)
-Cersei behind a screen of some sort (I couldn’t tell what t was, I first thought it was a litter but I’m not sure)
– a weirwood tree – – the White Book being slammed closed.

The shots of Arya and the captain were obviously new but I wasn’t sure if any of the other shots were.

Greatjon of Slumber:

–A quick shot of Sansa’s face looking directly at the camera (looked new)
–The face of a heart tree
–Tyrion’s face, looking grim. Did not see facial hair. Not sure what it was, old or new.
–A raven cawing (I think old image)
–A small boat rowing past a portcullis – not Sansa leaving with Dontos, this was sunlit, and it was going from left to right
–Cersei’s face, obscured by a wicker-type criss-cross thing.
–The Kingsguard book, being slammed closed (may have been the Jaime image from Season 4)

Update: There was indeed a shot of the throne room — but it looked very similar to Season 2 House of the Undying footage – it was a front-view shot of the Iron Throne, with a roofless throne room covered in snow. Was it an exact angle we saw during “Valar Morghulis?” I’m not sure -it was a closer-in shot than the far-shots we saw in that episode, but doesn’t mean it wasn’t older footage.

The Sight Receiver:

Three Eyed Raven texted me! Got a very quick video of a sword that looked like Ice, Arya opening an eye, Jaime waking up with a start. It went by so fast, no reruns allowed.

 

Sue the Fury says: Hopefully the bugs will get worked out and everyone will be able to view the teasers soon. Thanks to our eagle-eyed readers for their descriptions.

UPDATE: A reddit user recorded one of the teasers on screen-capture video, so it’s a little rough, but we can see the footage. Looking at it now, we can see the new glimpses of season 5 in the teasers are the shots of Arya and the Braavosi captain in the rowboat, and Cersei looking out from behind the grate in the litter.

180 responses

Jump to (and Always Support) the Bottom

    1. Yikes at my typos. That’s what I get for trying to type everything out as fast as I can. 😉

      Hopefully, the people behind this promotion will fix whatever issues that they’re having at the moment so that everyone can watch the video(s) and judge what they see for themselves.

        Quote  Reply

    2. Just got a reply from the support email:

      “A raven will bring you a new vision soon. Thank you for keeping watch.”

      Basically this is the same thing Game of Thrones has been tweeting. Terrible marketing job.

        Quote  Reply

    3. last years vine videos were perfect. it’s a shame they stopped doing it for this stupid thing.
      and what use is a game of thrones teaser if you can’t watch it a thousand times??

        Quote  Reply

    4. dragonreborn:
      last years vine videos were perfect. it’s a shame they stopped doing it for this stupid thing.
      and what use is a game of thrones teaser if you can’t watch it a thousand times??

      ^This. Should have stuck with Vine

        Quote  Reply

    5. It was ok, honestly I’m ok with only seeing it once. I prefer the experience of trailer rather than frame by frame analysis.

        Quote  Reply

    6. Tansy,

      I think the problem is that people can only watch it once. So people get sent the link, click on it, watch it without realizing they can only watch it once before they get a chance to record anything. Then it’s too late.

        Quote  Reply

    7. No fair. I didn’t get my text! Nthing everyone who preferred the vine promos last season. What’s the fun of teasers if you can’t watch them over and over, check out screencaps and analyze it death.

      Neat idea. Shitty execution.

        Quote  Reply

    8. Sue the Fury,

      From what I understand from reddit you can only watch through mobile or hand held devices. So if you’re not techie its hard to find an app to record the video.
      I have not received a DM yet though so I am not sure if thats true

        Quote  Reply

    9. Sue the Fury,

      To respond to some of your tweets:

      There was indeed a shot of the throne room — but it looked very similar to Season 2 House of the Undying footage – it was a front-view shot of the Iron Throne, with a roofless throne room covered in snow. Was it an exact angle we saw during “Valar Morghulis?” I’m not sure -it was a closer-in shot than the far-shots we saw in that episode, but doesn’t mean it wasn’t older footage.

      The “Jaime waking up” and “Arya’s eye” stuff wasn’t something I saw, however.

        Quote  Reply

    10. I got an email that had a link to the “vision” which could only be viewed through a phone or other handheld devices for some reason. so i got on my android and it had trouble loading and i tried to refresh it and then it said vision has come and gone…and i was like wtf i shouldn’t have clicked the refresh button bc as soon as i did i saw the video screen with sansa’s eyelids closed…oh well im sure it will be good to go in a few days…it’s not like those short teasers will reveal much anyway

        Quote  Reply

    11. -The Sansa shot is from Season 2 right before she meets Shae.
      -The Tyrion shot is from season 4, when he was in his cell.
      -The weirwood shot seems very familiar, so we’ve probably seen it already.
      -The book shot is from Season 4 when Jaime was reading it. I think we got the same one in the S4 promo too.
      – The Iron Throne shot is from S2 when Dany had a vision of it when entering that place where her dragons had been locked after they were stolen.

      The only shots that seem new are the Cersei, the boat and the hand in the water ones. Compared to last year when we got spoilery stuff with 3 main characters this is not at all impressive.

        Quote  Reply

    12. Stephen,

      So it’s all recycled footage except for Terys rowing the boat and Cersei in the litter. Still nice to see what folks were talking about.

      Let’s hope we get the other one and there’s some more new shots there.

        Quote  Reply

    13. They’re trolling us right ? These guys SUCKS at promoting Game of Thrones, they give us some shitty ass posters every year, some random promo with a NBA player, a joke of a Mixtape and now this…….
      I’m tired of this shyte, this is too much

        Quote  Reply

    14. The Hound:
      They’re trolling us right ? These guys SUCKS at promoting Game of Thrones, they give us some shitty ass posters every year, some random promo with a NBA player, a joke of a Mixtape and now this…….
      I’m tired of this shyte, this is too much

      Perhaps time for an early night?

        Quote  Reply

    15. Technical hiccups notwithstanding, what did you guy expect? We already saw the first teaser, which included only a still image of new footage right at the end. This one had more new footage than that. Also, it’s freaking december and we’re already getting teasers, however brief. How are you even complaining?

      Now, I’m interested in the alternative ‘Ice / Arya’s eye / Jaime waking up’ teaser. Jaime sounds like the only new footage there, doesn’t it?

        Quote  Reply

    16. Charlie of the EmergencyAwesome youtube channel just posted a discussion video about the trailer. He included a fullscreen version of the teaser trailer at the very beginning of the video, followed by a discussion of the camera shots and the poor execution of HBO’s advertising.

        Quote  Reply

    17. Greenjones,

      So I went back and watched the Ramsay-Reek scene from 4×06 on YouTube, and you’re right – that hand is Ramsay’s and that particular footage is old. A shame – that was one of the shots that I found most intriguing when in flashed by for half a second across my phone’s screen. I had thought that we might be seeing something from Arya’s storyline, possibly even our first oblique glimpse at the Waif. Oh well.

      I don’t feel too bad about the mistake, however. The footage went by extremely fast, and while that scene was certainly memorable, the shot in question wasn’t. Although it is amusing that both Morgan and I thought that Ramsay’s hand looked so feminine at first glance that we speculated that it could belong to Arya. Iwan Rheon would probably think that was funny, but I doubt that Ramsay would.

      And the Sansa scene is indeed old footage of her looking into a hazy mirror. So only two new shots.

        Quote  Reply

    18. The Jaime one sounds mildly more interesting. Hopefully it goes up soon.

      These could work out ok if they would give us quick shots of something we don’t know about already, but right now it’s all Arya stuff we know about. A quick shot of Sam in a boat or Yara in the snow or Davos in front of an Umber flag or Sansa doing anything or something would answer a ton of questions, but right now this seems like a lot of frustration for nothing.

        Quote  Reply

    19. Luka Nieto,
      The two new shots were nothing special. One great shot is better than 5 shots of nothing. Trust me.

      Their promotional technique is very questionable here….this teaser is a mix of recycled clips of all and nothing there’s no narrative. It’s lame for a show of this caliber, people are expecting MORE so they complain.

        Quote  Reply

    20. Sue the Fury,

      Yeah, his commentary for most of the shows he posts about does tend to be a bit behind some of the breaking news. But he gets the videos up quickly, so I tend to give him a little leeway.

        Quote  Reply

    21. Only people from Canada, USA, UK and Brazil can receive the SMS? I signed in with my Twitter account but i haven’t received anything.

        Quote  Reply

    22. High Sparrow,

      I’m Brazilian and I have not recieved a thing, so I guess it has nothing to do with countries. Fortunately they’ve already posted the links to the youtube videos so you can see them.
      About the teasers: I expected more. An year-ender with 6 seconds of new footage like last year would have been so much better. Now I’m praying we get something on January 11.

        Quote  Reply

    23. Just watched the video above which is definitely not the one I saw! We should get a trailer next month, right?

      Also, are we sure that’s not Gendry still rowing?

        Quote  Reply

    24. Turncloak:
      Hoyti Von Totiy,

      When did GRRM disrespect you?

      He’s probably referrring to the 12 days of Westeros thing on twitter. It was a stumble timing it with the first day of winter, but Hoyti doesnt realize is GRRM doesnt run his twitter account, his assistants and publishers do it. GRRM doesnt want to know whats up on social media and didnt think much of it. I imagine it’s too distracting.

      He’s already said cleared his schedule in 2015 until august because he needs to write Winds. He wouldnt be finished this early in the process.

        Quote  Reply

    25. cubicz,

      If that’s the reason than I’m disappointed in Hoyti. He/she should know better than to expect a 2014 release date. Especially after GRRMs publisher Jane said as much in her tweet a few months back. Also multiple people have said that GRRM is “half way through the book”. In other words “it’s not close to release”

        Quote  Reply

    26. cubicz,

      No one with a clue was expecting a TWoW release announcement. But folks were hoping for a creative way to celebrate the winter solstice with TWoW in mind. The tweets even had the hashtag “#books” within them, which got some folks excited. Instead of having fun with the idea and teasing the community positively, the fandom got another terse dismissal from GRRM and some really stupid Xmas messages. Sort of disappointing, but oh well.

        Quote  Reply

    27. Hodor’s Bastard,

      If people were expecting something like a sample chapter than I agree, that is pretty reasonable. But I think GRRM was upset because so many people were actually expecting TWOW (for unknown reasons). I’m sure GRRM is tired of getting “when will twow be finished?” questions.

      Also this is the best time to be an ASOIAF fan. The wait for the next book is made so much easier thanks to us having game of thrones seasons to look forward to every year. There’s also a wealth of ASOIAF material that many people have not even read yet (The Princess and The Queen, The Rogue Prince, the Dunk and Egg Novelas, The World of Ice and Fire, TWOW sample chapters, etc).

        Quote  Reply

    28. Turncloak,

      Also some other things to keep you occupied while you wait for TWOW.
      1) Use Boiled Leather’s guide to read AFFC and ADWD
      2) Read some other great fantasy books. I’ve started reading “The First Law” trilogy a few months back for example

        Quote  Reply

    29. Turncloak:

      If people were expecting something like a sample chapter than I agree, that is pretty reasonable. But I think GRRM was upset because so many people were actually expecting TWOW (for unknown reasons).

      Yeah, the “books” hashtag was not misleading at all.

      All I can think of is that GURM Inc. is prepping his Twitter account to be another merch platform. Because he’s a horse.

        Quote  Reply

    30. Cumsprite:
      cubicz,

      Cleared his schedule through August of 2015 in order to write TWOW? That’s awfully specific.

      And not true.

      I have to admit, i dont remember which video interview it was ( i think for TWOIAF) when asked about why he didnt write an episode for season 5, GRRM replied he thought his time was better used for writing Winds, and that’s why he cleared his schedule (mostly) for the year – except for some WOIAF promotion.

      I see he’s added some dates to 2015, but at the time he said it, he had nothing until Augist

        Quote  Reply

    31. The hand in the water seems rather small. Given that blue lighting, could it be Arya?
      Here’s a s4 gif http://38.media.tumblr.com/6067fbbb9fbfcff2308296f84fe0ceb9/tumblr_n3xy7oNLu81sodzwvo2_250.gif

      No, as Greenjones detected rightly, it’s Ramsay’s hand in Reek’s bath from last season.
      (But funny how many people think/thought it’s a small hand of a female person XD)

      ETA: Ninja’d by Greenjones himself

        Quote  Reply

    32. Cumsprite:
      cubicz,

      Cleared his schedule through August of 2015 in order to write TWOW? That’s awfully specific.

      And not true.

      found it

      http://www.wetpaint.com/game-of-thrones/articles/2014-07-28-george-r-r-martin-time

      Vulture asked George which new set location from the show he would be visiting this year, and George gave a surprising answer: none. “I might make it over there early next year, but I’ve got to finish the book The Winds of Winter,” George reveals. “So I’m making the trips I’m already obligated to make, but I’m not adding any new trips at this time. So I don’t think I’m going to do a set visit this year, sadly.”

      George also revealed that for the first time in the show’s history, he will not be writing an episode for the new season.

      “Once again because I have this book to finish,” George said. George also said that he wasn’t really involved in the casting process for Season 5. “This season, most of those cast members are new to me as well because I haven’t been involved in the process,”he explained. “I’ve been doing a lot of other stuff. In the earlier seasons I was much more involved with casting. I would review tapes and comment, but that’s a time-consuming process.”

        Quote  Reply

    33. Rygar,

      Good eggnog is a rare treat, both literally and figuratively. I make a mean one myself: but most of the eggnog I ever have consumed is awful.

      Incidentally, this is why I don’t worry or care about trailers: nobody is going to guess anything substantial from these things. (Didn’t the Lord of the Rings and Harry Potter trailers teach us that? No? Well, they should have done….)

      We have to keep in mind that these things serve one purpose and one purpose only: to put the phrase “Game of Thrones” back into peoples’ brains. They aren’t going to sell anybody on the show at this point: the last 4 seasons (as well as the critical and public laudations of those seasons) are doing a much, much better job of that than any trailer could do. They just need to remind people when it’s returning.

        Quote  Reply

    34. cubicz,

      I heard the same thing as you. He made it sound as though he was going to cut back on appearances, but this is not so. He has already added one convention to his schedule since making this statement. Maybe he’s going to cut back on his evening talk show appearances, but that’s no great sacrifice as he’s already done them all and he’s not a “get” any more.

      And, honestly, the one script a season he used to write only took a few week’s time and he had help with them. Basically, Martin is dicking around. Which wouldn’t be so bad if he wasn’t being interviewed all the time showing us he is dicking around.

      ETA: ““So I’m making the trips I’m already obligated to make, but I’m not adding any new trips at this time.”

      Finland is a trip. When GURM speaks, the smart person leaves the room. Thanks for the quote.

        Quote  Reply

    35. Turncloak,

      Many were simply hoping that he would have more fun with the situation, rather than be obviously pissed. What would Tyrion say? Maybe “Twitterspeak is the sauce fools spoon over the truth to hide the flavor of their own incompetence.” would have been a better response….or “Keep it up and I’ll kill off Sansa!”

        Quote  Reply

    36. AryaStark ;p:
      Messy Justin Massey,

      Lol omg I totally thought it was a female hand. Ramsay’s hands are rather delicate and graceful, I must say.

      Agreed.
      While Book!Ramsay has coarse hands like a butcher, and is big-boned and fleshy, Iwan Rheon has a rather short build (1,73m / 5″8′, I believe) and is really much more delicate.

        Quote  Reply

    37. Cumsprite,

      “When GURM speaks” hand him a mint. I still suspect that his breath reeks due to all that lip smacking he does in interviews. Dry mouth = bad breath.

      That’s not to say that I wouldn’t give the old badger a smooch. I’d make out with him just for the satisfaction of seeing Elio cry in fits of jealously.

        Quote  Reply

    38. cubicz: found it

      http://www.wetpaint.com/game-of-thrones/articles/2014-07-28-george-r-r-martin-time

      . “I might make it over there early next year, but I’ve got to finish the book The Winds of Winter,” George reveals. “So I’m making the trips I’m already obligated to make, but I’m not adding any new trips at this time. So I don’t think I’m going to do a set visit this year, sadly.”

      That interview was in the summer, after it had finally dawned to him that HBO was not going to do three seasons of Brienne wandering back and forth Riverlands and Dany mucking about in Meereen and would instead squeeze AFFC and ADWD into a single season.

      After finishing the World-book, there seems to have been a couple of month window, when he was concerned about the show passing the books and putting genuine effort into Winds. This was in the late spring, early summer

      Then July came, and conventions, and talkshows, and interviews…

      now he’s back to his back to his former self, blogging about NFL and adding new appearances on his calendar… and you know how it is: I don’t write while travelling, I don’t write in planes, I don’t write in hotel rooms, I don’t write while picking nose, since I type with one finger and need the other one for eating tortilla. When I write, I need large chunks of unallocated time. That’s why I allocate myself conventions every month…

        Quote  Reply

    39. Can we arrange a football strike? I hate football more since it’s distracting GRRM.. and I’m surprised that is possible…

        Quote  Reply

    40. I’m not impressed with this new approach to marketing: rather than trying to tantalize viewers with promises of new things to come, they seem to think that the show is so big at this point that simply flashing an image of “Arya!” will make people excited…even if it’s actually stock footage from the LAST season. We’re not even seeing established characters in established settings, perhaps with new costumes — even, say, Cersei in the Red Keep, just standing around, even if she was just wearing her normal costumes, would be sort of okay for me.

      This isn’t even a “teaser trailer” when there’s hardly a new frame in it.

      That kind of attitude that “it sells itself, we’re trending” is what leads to a show resting on its laurels. We need quality, not quantity.

        Quote  Reply

    41. Pj:
      Rowing? Is someone rowing? F*Tyrion and his pity party… PLEASE LET IT BE GENDRY!!!!!!

      It’s been discussed in depth- it’s clearly the Braavosi captain Arya sailed with.

      This is him rowing her into Braavos.

        Quote  Reply

    42. Greenjones,

      Added to the wiki. There is certainly something big happening in episode 8, with wildlings, wights, White Walkers and Night’s watchmen. There’s been lots of small casting news around that episode with those roles. What about the report of that extra who talked about White Walkers falling off a cliff and being resurrected by the White Walker leader? Do we know the episode it was supposed to be? Anyway, there’s something we’re missing here.

        Quote  Reply

    43. Pj,

      It’s Terys.

      Luka Nieto,

      Thanks again.

      I think the show version of Hardhome will be in 508.

      That reddit source didn’t specify ep. 508 though but it is all beginning to fit together, isn’t it?

        Quote  Reply

    44. Simon or Garfunkel?

      I mean Simon wrote the shit and was the only one who could play an instrument, but Garfunkel was the voice and sex symbol.

      Motherfuck.

      Ceilia you’re breaking my heart you’re shakin my confidence daily.

        Quote  Reply

    45. Greenjones,

      It’s pretty hard to ignore the amount of evidence pointing that way at this point.

      Also, was there an episode number associated with the Baratheon general from a while back? Wonder how that ties into all this.

        Quote  Reply

    46. Luka Nieto,

      My guess is that what it actually is going to be are killed wildlings getting resurrected. It would be a pretty simple Grimmsian evolution from that to the current rumor. (So many of the “false” rumors turn out to be just one or two small steps away from the truth, after all.)

      Rygar,

      Pj: What are the chances that Gendry is in Braavos? Seeing that they merged his character with Edric Storm and he ran away from Westeros as well.

      And from this, no doubt, a “Gendry is in Braavos” “theory” will spawn and have many advocates by the weekend!

      🙂

        Quote  Reply

    47. Wimsey,

      C’mon, you can’t blame me!

      Ok, so I am totally Gendry obsessed but still; House Baratheon in contrast to the books they aren’t looking really good on tv since Stannis and Shireen are the only ones left. We still don’t know if Sansa is going to have a bff in the Vale (Mia) and Weiss and Benioff have totally set up Arya and Gendry on tv. Queue in ‘I can be your family’ and Arya teaching Gendry how to fight; cough: checking him out, in Harrenhall.

        Quote  Reply

    48. Rygar,

      Those poor Crownlands girls who’ll miss out. Can’t they call it ‘climbing the nine’ or something.

      PS I see you’ve shed your fur.

        Quote  Reply

    49. Pj: We still don’t know if Sansa is going to have a bff in the Vale (Mia) and Weiss and Benioff have totally set up Arya and Gendry on tv.

      Martin totally set it up well enough in the books that there was a thread devoted to this on the old Usenet group back in the 1990’s. The idea then was that this is essentially foreshadowed by Robert wanting to unite his house with the Starks the way it should have been done: a “true” (albeit not true born) son winds up with the daughter who is actually a lot like Lyanna.

      As for the omitted Baratheons, they are not important to the story. Edric’s sole purpose was to show Davos’ working out how to be loyal to Stannis in principle vs. in deed: and using Gendry for that on the show was a smart idea, as it allowed the show to invest enough development in Gendry for the audience to care. It also provided an opportunity to further develop the Church of R’hllor. Ultimately, it was not Edric that was important: it was a son of Robert that was important. As for Mia, she’s a very minor player in the books: I suspect that most book readers don’t even remember her! (It took me a moment to remember who you meant, to be honest, and I’m a “diehard.”)

      I do not recall if I’ve pondered this before, but it is interesting that Martin did not make a single Baratheon a protagonist. It probably isn’t relevant: really, only Renly and Gendry would have been good candidate: being gay in that culture would have fit into the “bastards, dwarves and cripples” motif, and being a bastard certainly fits into that motif!

        Quote  Reply

    50. Pj,

      “Beinioff and Weiss have setup Arya and Gendry in the show”.

      Nope. In one of his flicks and the city interviews Joe Dempsie mentions that Arya is not a romantic interest for Gendry because of their age gap. I’ll try to find the link

        Quote  Reply

    51. Wimsey,

      Exactly what I mean, the way Martin wrote them I doubt the Baratheons are going to be another extinguished house. The little tidbits on the books, the merging of Gendry and Edric plus that Martin actually has had some kind of say on GoT is what leads me to think that there is still hope.

      Rygar:
      Gendry is too busy making the eight.God bless him and his abs.

      Agreed, mighty fine abs. #bringbackthebull

        Quote  Reply

    52. Wimsey,

      Simon was the songwriter/musician of his generation, helped bring world music into the mainstream, accumulated a stupendous amount of honors, hosted SNL numerous times (once in a turkey outfit), and married Edie Brickell and had 3 children with her….so yeah, I’d say he was the sex symbol. 🙂

        Quote  Reply

    53. Pj,

      Ya gotta love those Baratheon bastards and bastardettes. They’re everywhere.

      I have a feeling Sansa and Mya will create a few key plot points in TWoW. 🙂

        Quote  Reply

    54. Turncloak,

      I actually saw that interview but he also said once that as the show progresses and Maisie grows older that she will be 18 and above so it won’t be exactly awkward if it came to that. He said “Plenty of 27 year olds have hooked up with 18 year olds”. Look it up! Also in their final scene where Maisie said that she could be his family; that basically she meant it like a ‘I love you’.

      Mi point is (setting aside my bastard feels) is that there are too many breadcrumbs in both the books and in the tv show to not at some level say that they are going to see each other again.

      I am also loosing hope on seeing Gendry for yet another season as Joe Dempsie is walking around with very light, almost blond hair… well, at least there’s hot psycho Ramsey 😛

        Quote  Reply

    55. Pj,

      Didn’t find the flicks and the city interview but I found a different one. I think Joe Dempsie sees Gendry and Arya as more of a brother/sister relationship.

      “I think it’s that thing where everyone always has their first crush, and I think Gendry is Arya’s first crush, so I’d imagine it’s young girls, young women who are keen on this happening. It’s a romantic idea, and it’s a nostalgic idea as well, but I don’t know if it’s plausible for the story line. I think it’s far more interesting whether or not they will ever meet again.”

      http://www.vulture.com/m/2013/05/game-of-thrones-gendry-joe-dempsie-interview.html

        Quote  Reply

    56. Pj,

      I think you may be confusing the interviewer with the interviewee, unless we are talking about two different interviews. The “interviewer” is the one who says “as Arya gets older can you see that happening?” Joe Dempsie doesn’t see that working on the show again because of the “character” age gap. although Maisie the actress might be older her character “Arya” is still very young.

      That might be something the books explores however since apparently

      GRRM has no problem with 11 year old Arya having sexual contact with Raff the Sweetling. But I dont see the show going the Gendry/Arya romance route due to character age.

        Quote  Reply

    57. Hodor’s Bastard
      Simon was married to Carrie Fisher for a couple of weeks, too. However, a sex symbol, he never was.

      Hodor’s Bastard: I have a feeling Sansa and Mya will create a few key plot points in TWoW

      Hmm, I have problems seeing Mya (or Mia or whatever her name is) being very important in the story. She’s been pretty superfluous so far. But, then, I will be surprised if Sansa spends too much time in the Vale.

      Turncloak: That might be something the books explores however since apparently

      I suspect that it will be in both. Arya isn’t supposed to be 11 anymore in the show (it’s implied that a bit more time has elapsed than has in the books.) In the books, once Arya hits menarche (which will be soon), then she won’t be a child despite modern sensibilities, so it will not be an issue. However, the original plan was for Winter & Spring to take place 5 years after Storm; that looks like it’s being a bit modified, but Arya will be in her mid-teens before this is done. That’s equivalent to being a 20-something in our world.

        Quote  Reply

    58. Greenjones,

      Didn’t think they would be doing in-show music. Heavy Metal doesn’t fit the show. However I would have enjoyed it if Killswitche did the music for the first official season 5 trailer

        Quote  Reply

    59. Hodor’s Bastard,

      Now I would be very enthused if he did something for the show but I doubt it’s his cup of tea exactly.

      Turncloak,

      Plus D and D seem to like Alt Rock when they pick bands to do songs for the show. Rap and Metal get relegated to the mixtapes.

        Quote  Reply

    60. Rygar,

      Sometimes being a bit obtuse is more fun. 🙂 You’ve been zinging us with indirect GoT music references for a while. Loved “Maisie” (from PF’s Syd B days) the other day…although it took me a while.

      I get the ~chills~ when I hear BOTW. Perfect song.

        Quote  Reply

    61. Turncloak,

      Ugh, finally found it:

      http://www.accesshollywood.com/game-of-thrones-star-joe-dempsie-reacts-to-saturday-night-live-parody_video_1397981

      Scroll down and look at the one that says: ‘Joe Dempsie on his character on Game of Thrones Secret Lineage and learning what shipping is…’

      Like you said Joe mentions their sibling relationship BUT the age will not be an issue in the future. Come on, it’s Game of Thrones, they don’t shy away from situations like these. Also the gap between Dempsie and Williams is less severe than if they would have gone the Sansa / Sandor way. Don’t even get me started with Danenerys age and her various love interest. The road is already paved if the Stark and Baratheon houses have a chance of having their long awaited match.

        Quote  Reply

    62. Rygar,

      I actually preferred your other name. Maybe you could have a composite name like ‘Rygar the Furry’. Also I will always have a soft spot for the frightened gazelle that is Art Garfunkel.

        Quote  Reply

    63. Hodor’s Bastard,

      Some day I will write a book for you with no protagonists, just a lot of minor characters. (OK, I’m lying: I won’t do that.) Seriously, I don’t mind minor characters in books: in fact, I think that they help written story telling. Just keep them off of the screen: they are just clutter there! (My sharks and T. rex analogy works here: minor characters in books and on screen are like fins on a shark and a T. rex: great for letting the shark be a voracious predator, but pointless and even downright detrimental to letting the T. rex be a voracious predator.)

        Quote  Reply

    64. Wimsey,

      Unless they are very minor (as in extras) of course. I don’t think the Unsullied army would be very impressive on screen if it only consisted of Grey Worm for example.

        Quote  Reply

    65. Of the Night,

      If gazelles had angelic falsetto and the ability to harmonize tastefully…

      Morgan,

      As people observed above, Iwan Rheon has dainty hands. It’s funny that they’d show that clip, of all the possible clips to reuse, in the promo though.

        Quote  Reply

    66. Of the Night,

      Did he really? They probably did say some harsh things about one another in the early seventies, I suppose.

      BTW I’m really glad to find a venue on which to talk about S and G, even if it’s majorly off topic…

        Quote  Reply

    67. Of the Night: I don’t think the Unsullied army would be very impressive on screen if it only consisted of Grey Worm for example.

      But they effectively did do that for the Unsullied: Grey Worm is the only one with a name or any development. All of the other minor character Unsullied from the book are unmentioned. It is a classic Greek Chorus approach, which works wonderfully on screen or on stage, but which is death on page. I suspect that Northerners will be like that: we won’t get the specific names like Manderly or Dustin, just a bunch of Northerners representing the general moods of a people. Again, that’s the best way to do it on screen, although it’s a bad way to do it on page.

        Quote  Reply

    68. Greenjones,

      “Hello darkness, my old friend,
      I’ve come to talk with you again,
      Because a vision softly creeping,
      Left its seeds while I was sleeping,
      And the vision that was planted in my brain
      Still remains
      Within the sound of silence.”

      Oh…some S&G stuff totally applies to ASoI&F. 🙂

        Quote  Reply

    69. Wimsey,

      Protagonists may be the mountains, but the supporting characters provide the cliffs, tundra, valleys, rivers, glaciers, evergreens, marmots, rams, pine beetles, waterfalls, snow, etc…..everything that we find interesting along the way as we explore each active or dormant volcano.

        Quote  Reply

    70. “And look around you, the leaves are brown now,
      And the sky is a hazy shade of winter.
      Hang on to your hopes, my friend.
      That’s an easy thing to say but if your hopes should pass away,
      It’s simply pretend, that you can build them again.

        Quote  Reply

    71. They didn’t announce Wyman Manderly because they wanted to surprise us by dedicateding the third teaser only for him .. It’s known 🙁

        Quote  Reply

    72. Hodor’s Bastard: everything that we find interesting along the way as we explore each active or dormant volcano.

      The thing is, I do not think that is true. Or, if it is, then it’s true for a very specific “we.” Readers and viewers are, by and large, interested in the mountains: and they don’t want to lose sight of the mountain for the valleys, rivers, etc.

      I do realize that there is a subset of readers (that disproportionately represent the hardcore fans) that are in it for the tertiary, quaternary, etc., characters. (I’m not sure how many levels down you have to go to get someone like Mya: even to call her a tertiary character is to overstate her importance greatly.) Similarly, others are in it for the “world building” as you put it elsewhere. That’s the specific “we.” However, that “we” is a small proportion of the readers and an even smaller proportion of the viewers. For every person who posts on places like this or other SoI&F outlets, there are dozens of other book readers, and dozens more TV viewers.

      (I, myself, am intrigued by the mysteries of SoI&F, although I do admit that I’ve always been drawn to stories about internal conflict. Other authors do it better than Martin does, but Martin does it fantastically: that lets him put his protagonists into completely hypothetical situations that can be more fun to ponder than are the realistically constructed situations of other authors, and it also allows for mysteries beyond that you can contrive in realistic settings.)

        Quote  Reply

    73. Of the Night:
      Rygar,

      I actually preferred your other name. Maybe you could have a composite name like ‘Rygar the Furry’. Also I will always have a soft spot for the frightened gazelle that is Art Garfunkel.

      Damn it. I’m not going back. 🙂

      I love Arts singing and afro, but Paul was the man. He wrote and played on all the songs. Kathy’s Song is my favorite of theirs and Artie doesn’t sing on it.

        Quote  Reply

    74. Pj,

      That video just kind of reinforces my point. Joe Dempsie says “the way the casting has happened on the show that (relationship) is not going to happen”.

      I believe Joe has been told by D&D already that they won’t take his character in that route which is why he’s so adamant about denying the possibility of a relationship. Also, I don’t think Joe would feel confortable having a romantic scene with an 18 year old Maisie due to his many interviews discussing this topic.

      I personally don’t think it will happen due to the “character” age differences. In the show Dany has been aged up from 14 to atleast 18 so the Drogo relationship makes sense. In season 3 when Tyrion asks Sansa for her age before the bedding she says “I’m 13”. Meaning that Arya is 11 on the show as of season 3.

      A show relationship btw Arya and Gendry is just not going to happen.

        Quote  Reply

    75. In season 3 when Tyrion asks Sansa for her age before the bedding she says “I’m 13″.

      Not to nitpick, but I thought she said she was 14 to Tyrion in that specific scene?

      I do remember back in the pilot episode Sansa told Cersei at the Winterfell feast she was 13.

      Back on topic, my mother thinks

      Gendry will get the Iron Throne, with Arya as queen. My money is on Shireen getting the crown. We’ll see if either theory pans out!

        Quote  Reply

    76. Turncloak: A show relationship btw Arya and Gendry is just not going to happen.

      Ah, but you are assuming that only one year at a time is going to happen.

      It probably won’t affect things, but I would expect Maise Williams to push for this sort of thing. Besides the fact that it’s impossible to hide that she’s a woman now, she does not want to get typecast as a tomboy girl. Arya will be a woman before the stories are done, too: I’ll be surprised if she’s not one by the end of Winter. They can blur the ages if they like, but I think that most viewers realize that real societies on which Westeros is based distinguished only between marital and non-marital sex: there was no such thing as “underage” sex because women were of-age upon sexual maturity. The kind of people who don’t get that also are not watching this show!

        Quote  Reply

    77. Wimsey,

      “she does not want to get typecast as a tomboy girl.”

      Where are you getting this from? This doesn’t correlate at all to Maisie’s actions. If she was worried about this than she wouldn’t be trying to land the role of “Ellie” in “The Last of Us” movie.

      What you describe as “Tomboy” I describe as woman empowerment.

        Quote  Reply

    78. Flora Linden,

      “Gendry will get the Iron Throne, with Arya as queen. My money is on Shireen getting the crown. We’ll see if either theory pans out!”

      This is not the way GRRM works im afraid. No fairy tale endings for this series. Expect a “bittersweet” ending.

        Quote  Reply

    79. Flora Linden: I do remember back in the pilot episode Sansa told Cersei at the Winterfell feast she was 13.

      As multiple years seem to have elapsed, that would make her 15-16 now on the show. Given that they were working with maturing young adults, it would be impossible for them to not do this. It’s been impossible for them to hide Williams bust: in fact, their attempts to do so paradoxically seem to emphasize it more! Similarly, Hempstead-Williams obviously cannot pass for a kid anymore.

      Turncloak,

      I’ve read her state a few times that she wants to see Arya get a more feminine portrayal. She also has spoken a couple of times about how she covets the Clarke’s roll because of the good mix of strong but feminine. And, of course, her agent(s) will certainly be pushing this on her: they would be remiss if they are not! Being in a fantasy series is dangerous enough in terms of typecasting an actor or actress: getting the tomboy typecast is an added problem here. (And, as Miranda Otto noted during Lord of the Rings, true empowerment would be doing this stuff in a skirt! Otto was miffed that her one scene of fighting orcs in a gown was cut, because otherwise she was only empowered while pretending to be a man: Williams should have the same fear.)

      To some extent, Williams can get this from other roles. However, those are shots-in-the-dark in terms of getting people to watch them. Thrones is her big audition tape for all future work. At any rate, as Arya will be a young woman before the story ends, this shouldn’t really be an issue.

        Quote  Reply

    80. Turncloak:
      Flora Linden,

      This is not the way GRRM works im afraid. No fairy tale endings for this series. Expect a “bittersweet” ending.

      Yeah, yeah, I get it, GRRM hates happy endings. No need to rub it in.

      I think I can still engage in some fun what-if possibilities, even though I know full well it’s not gonna happen in either the books or TV show.

      And I’m sick of the whole tomboy thing. The idea that a girl isn’t “empowered” unless she’s a tomboy or acts like a guy has become a tired cliché itself. An independent person, male or female, chooses who they are freely and how to express that, whatever form it is. Arya is her own person, and Sansa is now becoming her own person. They just use different ways to show it. I love them both for who they are.

      Hodor’s Bastard, I agree. Supporting characters FTW! They could do a better job than the mess some of the main characters have made.

        Quote  Reply

    81. Wimsey,

      I think you are overestimating the power of Maisie’s agents over HBO. If they had that much influence over HBO than Maisie would have been on the tier 1 character payroll instead of the tier 2 payroll. D&D will not change their vision of the story because of what an actor/agent wants(with a few exceptions ofcourse)

      If the story calls for such a romance(which I find unlikely) than they will do it. If that was not in their plans than they won’t. Also you’re not taking into account Joe Dempsie here. He seems to be averse to the possibility of a relationship with Arya. If in theory agents have as much power as you think they do than Joe Dempsie would have some say in the matter.

      Maisie is more likely to end up with Ben Hawkey’s Hotpie than she is with Dempsie’s Gendry on the show Imo

        Quote  Reply

    82. Flora Linden,

      Oh ok. Sorry for sounding like an a-hole. Wasn’t my intention to come off that way. It’s fine to hope for the best for your favorite characters. For example I want Stannis to survive and be the hand of the King at the end of the series/books. But I find that incredibly unlikely given GRRMs track record :/.

        Quote  Reply

    83. Turncloak: I think you are overestimating the power of Maisie’s agents over HBO.

      Given that I did write that “it probably won’t affect things much,” I obviously am not doing so! However, I think that you are wrong that it won’t come up in the books: after all, Martin did intend for 5 years to elapse between Storm and Winter before he decided to write Crows & Dragons. Arya isn’t going to be 11 when the story ends: more probably, she’ll be around 16 or 17. On TV, they basically seem to be going a year per year, so she’ll be even older.

      Flora Linden: The idea that a girl isn’t “empowered” unless she’s a tomboy or acts like a guy has become a tired cliché itself.

      That is the modern point of view. Mind you, an empowered woman would never act like Sansa has acted the first few stories: but it is possible to be empowered AND feminine at the same time. Women these days are not just trying to do away with the Betty Draper/Catelyn Stark image: they also are trying to do away with the idea that they have to become men to succeed with men. (Men, of course, resist the idea because, well, in general we are a bunch of unthinking pigs.) That is particularly big in my world (academia): young women scientists no longer are willing to not have kids, but they also have to fight with a system that assumes you can and will work 80 hours a week just like the old boys all did.

      It will be interesting seeing Sansa turn into a person in the next story (book and TV). I now suspect that she and Arya will represent two different models for empowered women. Dany, of course, will represent another, although I think that Arya ultimately will be closer to her. (Sansa will be more like Cersei with a conscience, if that does not seem too much like a contradiction in terms!)

        Quote  Reply

    84. Turncloak,

      I’m sorry too for sounding so defensive, and if you’re offended. (I’ve been on other fan sites where some of the commenters seem to enjoy raining on other people’s parades – obviously, this doesn’t happen here.) Don’t mind me, I sometimes rant and then immediately I’m over it.

      I like Stannis in the TV show, I hope he makes it too, but he might not.

      And, you could be right – I don’t think Shireen will make it either

      🙁

      I know, let’s be mad at GRRM instead, he has no sense of conventional storytelling!

      🙂

      Wimsey, if Sansa did become Cersei with a conscience, she’d be one dangerous person to mess with! That would be quite a transformation from the naïve girl she was at the beginning. Her Season 5 arc will be interesting.

        Quote  Reply

    85. Wimsey,

      i see your point about the time gap but I still don’t think that Arya/Gendry will happen in the books. Given Arya’s actions, I see a much darker path and end for her. I’m thinking along the lines of the Medea Greek tragedy.

      (Lady Stoneheart killing her own daughter Arya not knowing it is her as she is wearing someone else’s face)

        Quote  Reply

    86. Wimsey: Given that I did write that “it probably won’t affect things much,” I obviously am not doing so!However, I think that you are wrong that it won’t come up in the books: after all, Martin did intend for 5 years to elapse between Storm and Winter before he decided to write Crows & Dragons. Arya isn’t going to be 11 when the story ends: more probably, she’ll be around 16 or 17. On TV, they basically seem to be going a year per year, so she’ll be even older.

      That is the modern point of view.Mind you, an empowered woman would never act like Sansa has acted the first few stories: but it is possible to be empowered AND feminine at the same time.Women these days are not just trying to do away with the Betty Draper/Catelyn Stark image: they also are trying to do away with the idea that they have to become men to succeed with men.(Men, of course, resist the idea because, well, in general we are a bunch of unthinking pigs.)That is particularly big in my world (academia): young women scientists no longer are willing to not have kids, but they also have to fight with a system that assumes you can and will work 80 hours a week just like the old boys all did.

      It will be interesting seeing Sansa turn into a person in the next story (book and TV).I now suspect that she and Arya will represent two different models for empowered women.Dany, of course, will represent another, although I think that Arya ultimately will be closer to her.(Sansa will be more like Cersei with a conscience, if that does not seem too much like a contradiction in terms!)

      But he did NOT do the 5-years-jump, he considered it, but then decided against it, so she won’t be 16 or 17 in the end, but rather around 13 or maybe 14, IMO.

      And I don’t see what you mean with “Sansa being like Cersei with a conscience in the future”?!
      (Now I’m just waiting for Annara Snow to hear that…)

        Quote  Reply

    87. Turncloak:

      (Lady Stoneheart killing her own daughter Arya not knowing it is her as she is wearing someone else’s face)

      With ideas like that, you are quickly becoming my favorite plot speculator! 🙂

      although my personal speculation regarding LS-Arya is that LS will discover who Arya is (as she lays there wounded from a mortal injury) and give her the kiss of life a la Beric.

        Quote  Reply

    88. Turncloak,

      I think that A-G was foreshadowed in the opening chapters of Thrones, personally. And I doubt that

      LS

      is ever going to be that relevant to the plot or story!

      Messy Justin Massey: But he did NOT do the 5-years-jump, he considered it, but then decided against it, so she won’t be 16 or 17 in the end,

      That isn’t quite what happened. The original plan was a trilogy. Book two turned into Clash & Storm. Book 3 became Winter/Spring. Martin decided that he wanted to fill up the gap with stuff that became Crows/Dragons.

      So, presumably, we will proceed a few years into the future over the next book. I would expect that they will do this on TV, too, simply to explain how adult the young actors have become.

      Messy Justin Massey: And I don’t see what you mean with “Sansa being like Cersei with a conscience in the future”?!

      Well, Sansa presumably has been learning all of this time. One thing that she has learned from Cersei is that women can have ambition of their own, and that women have their own arsenal of tools. (We saw an unveiling of that at the end of last year with Maleficent Stark.) Sansa will almost certainly be angling to take back Winterfell. This is where things will get interesting: she has no reason to think that Arya or Rickon are still alive, and presumably she’s also finally started to learn the relationship between actual deeds and the song that later are sung about them. Martin is setting up Three Heads of the Wolf here: and that promises to get interesting.

        Quote  Reply

    89. Wimsey:
      Turncloak,

      That isn’t quite what happened.The original plan was a trilogy.Book two turned into Clash & Storm.Book 3 became Winter/Spring.Martin decided that he wanted to fill up the gap with stuff that became Crows/Dragons.

      Not quite. The original first book of the intended trilogy (AGoT) ended up being three books (AGoT, ACoK, and ASoS). The original second book (ADwD) was split into AFfC, ADwD, and I believe a significant chunk of TWoW (since Martin’s plan was for Daenerys to arrive in Westeros during Dance). The last book of the original trilogy, then, will encompass a part of TWoW and the whole of ADoS, plus a more than likely eighth book.

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    90. Well that escalated quickly…

      Ok, just to be clear the whole Gendry/Arya is my opinion, I’m not trying to push it down anyone’s throat(Arya ending up with HP other than Gendry blew my mind away FYI) BUT I still think that it’s a path they are going down on the series although not with a happy ending.

      I have always thought that Arya will be the one to give the North back to the Starks but I don’t think our favorite Wolf will live by the end. Either because she is in too deep in The Faceless Men or she will be willing to give her life for the cause.

      As for the Baratheon House? I also think that Shireen is not going to make it …
      And on the topic of ‘minor’ character? Patchface anyone? I think it would be a great addition to the story since in the books he is fairly creepy, entertaining and seems to know more than a thing or two.

      So until I say a big old blue eyes bastard I will continue to ask:
      WHERE IS GENDRY?!

        Quote  Reply

    91. Mr Fixit,
      The explanation in the early 2000’s was that Crows/Dragons was filling in the gap that Martin initially intended to leave empty. Moreover, I never read at that time that Thrones was split from Storm & Clash: it was always that Clash & Storm were split. The plots structures of the different stories suggests this: both Thrones & Storm have neat tie-up points for ending one story and setting up another, whereas Clash doesn’t have that at all: with one possible exception, the story lines just continue on with no major zeniths.

      It was made very clear around the time that Storm came out that the 5 year gap plan had been altered, and that we’d be getting stuff from in between. Indeed, I remember being one of the people who dismissed the rumor as wishful thinking: more of a good thing seemed too good to be true! (I think that the rumor first surfaced around 1998 or 1999: but it was a long time ago.) Of course, had we known that it would delay getting to the climax by over a decade, then I might have reconsidered the “too good” part of that….. 🙂

      Pj: Ok, just to be clear the whole Gendry/Arya is my opinion, I’m not trying to push it down anyone’s throat(Arya ending up with HP other than Gendry blew my mind away FYI) BUT I still think that it’s a path they are going down on the series although not with a happy ending

      There are many possible unhappy endings: if we knew that was to be the case, then it would not be evidence for any particular unhappy ending. Moreover, Martin has said something a bit different: it will be bittersweet. That is not the same as “unhappy”: there will be good and bad. (Harry Potter had a bittersweet ending, after all: the protagonist and the secondary characters survived, but a few popular tertiary characters snuffed it.) Moreover, there are numerous protagonists, of which Arya is only one. There is no particular reason to single her out as a candidate for a bittersweet ending: for example, there is no foreshadowing of her death or anything like that.

      Indeed, Arya is one of the few with something we might call a “happy” ending foreshadowed: “I have a son, you have a daughter.” Like all good foreshadowing, it would be ironic: neither the son nor the daughter are the people to whom Robert refers, but the “son” actually is a son this time and the daughter is still a daughter.

      Keep in mind also that the bittersweet ending need not involve death of any of the protagonists. Death of wolves, death of secondary characters, etc., could all qualify what Martin has described. He has left this very open.

      I cannot think of any obvious cases of foreshadowed death any protagonists. We do have one prophesized death at least a second tier protagonist:

      Cersei’s death at her little brother’s hand.

      (Of course, there would be some bittersweetness in that for at least one other protagonist.) I suspect that “A Lannister always pays his debts” will have some ironic finale, too, but that could be any number of things: it won’t necessarily be bittersweet, never mind involving the death of a protagonist.

        Quote  Reply

    92. Wimsey,

      Well yeah, it ended up that Feast/Dance became bridge novels, but Dance wasn’t always intended as such. Actually, and someone will correct me if I’m wrong, from the earliest days Martin planned to call the second book of his original trilogy A Dance with Dragons. Goals changed, and now we have what we have. The greater chunk of the original Dance will end up in Winds, so much so that the title of Book 5 seems off now.

        Quote  Reply

    93. Mr Fixit,

      A Game of Thrones, A Dance with Dragons, The Winds of Winter, if I remember correctly. AGoT became the first three books (which is in a way noticeable —book 3 sort of ends “Act 1” of the whole story), Dance became Feast and Dance and Winter became Winter and Dreams (at least.) All of this didn’t happen at once, of course.

        Quote  Reply

    94. Mr Fixit,

      Yeah, titles frequently are in flux: we see that a lot in movies and other book series. I seem to recall that we thought that A Storm of Swords was going to have a different title than it did back in the late 1990’s. (I don’t remember what we thought it was anymore: it is not a case of, say, “Revenge of the Jedi” or “Doomsday Tournament,” where the title got used on now-valuable merchandise!) There was nowhere near as much information available then, either: Martin was not the “hot” interview topic that he now is, and it was long before he started (not) blogging.

      The titles certainly can be misleading, too: I remember many people jumping to the conclusion that “Feast for Crows” meant that book was going to delve heavily into stuff North of the Wall. (It was, after all, time for Martin to develop stuff about the Others, right?) And, of course, there was always a cadre of fans who pushed that the original title for the last book (now two books, of course!) meant that “Wolves” was going to be entirely Stark focused, which proved that all of this stuff with Dany was just a run-around. (The Dany haters always clutched for any straw!)

        Quote  Reply

    95. Luka Nieto,

      The original title for the last book was going to be Time of Wolves or Hour of the Wolf or something like that. (I just remember “Wolves” being in the title: people referred to “Wolves” and “Dragons” when talking about the last two books.)

        Quote  Reply

    96. Wimsey,

      I been Norman Mailered, Maxwell Taylored. I been John O’Hara’d, MacNamara’d. I been Rolling Stone and Beatled till I’m blind. I been Ayn Randed, nearly branded, Communist ’cause I’m left handed, that’s the hand to use…. Well never mind.

        Quote  Reply

    97. Just finished Marco Polo and it’s a good show but the wooden writing and the main protagonist ruined the season. The acting is solid but nothing special.
      Visually it’s simply the most stunning TV show I’ve ever seen and I’ve seen a lot……it looks much better than Game of Thrones because of the wide shots and the scale of some scenes is impressive.

      I give the show a 7. It’s not a must-watch but I would definitely recommend it.

        Quote  Reply

    98. Rygar,

      *bing* “What is the sound of one 60’s ‘sex-symbol’ parodizing another? *ding ding* Excellent, I’ll take ‘That’s not character development’ for $500′ for $500, Alex.”

        Quote  Reply

    99. The Hound: Just finished Marco Polo and it’s a good show but the wooden writing and the main protagonist ruined the season.

      I’ve been watching that, too. It’s a classic case of all plot, no story. The problem, of course, is that there is no story in the “source material”: it’s history, after all. They do not take enough creative license to rewrite things severely enough to impose a story on it. The Tudors succeeded in doing that (to the howls of rage from the historians!), but, then, Henry the 8th led a life that was borderline fantastic: it took much less adaptation to turn his life into a story.

      But that is the problem when you get handed a plot that was not created with a story in mind.

        Quote  Reply

    100. I finally received the link. But when I clicked on it the site says ‘cannot be viewed at the moment pls try again later’. But when I checked the link again it expired wtf. I just want to see the Jaime waking up scene.. please someone who has seen it please describe it in detail.

        Quote  Reply

    101. I am no longer positive the place you’re getting your info, but good
      topic. I needs to spend some time finding out much more or understanding more.
      Thank you for great information I was looking for this info for my mission.

        Quote  Reply

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