Tim Plester on the Red Wedding and the possibility of returning to Game of Thrones

Black Walder

People will certainly be curious about your Game of Thrones character’s fate when he was last seen slashing the throat of Catelyn Stark. A new interview from a British magazine provides the opportunity to learn more about the Frey who wielded the knife. We also have a character return confirmation to share today.

British actor Tim Plester, who played Black Walder in season 3, discusses his experience on Game of Thrones and whether we might see him again in the November edition of UK’s Your Letterbox magazine.

Plester has appeared in a wide variety of productions including historical series Wolf Hall, crime drama WPC 56, and the musically comedic Galavant, plus films such as Kick-Ass, Bone in the Throat and Cuban Fury. He’s also co-starring in the 2016 HBO mini-series Lewis and Clark. Despite the lengthy résumé, the actor acknowledges that though he only appear in two episodes of season three, “Game of Thrones is probably the thing I get asked about the most – due in no small part to the now infamous nature of one of the scenes I was involved in.”

Of the Red Wedding scene, he says, “It took us a whole week to shoot, so we didn’t see much daylight, and my over-riding memory of it now is just how badly the set-dressed food (particularly the dead fish) had begun to stink by the end of the Friday afternoon.”

As for whether we’re going to see Black Walder again, Plester offers this evasive but still intriguing response. He tells Your Letterbox:

“As you’d expect on such a phenomenally popular TV show, there’s a complicated veil of secrecy that surrounds any future storylines, and as an actor you’re never shown full shooting scripts – only the scenes which refer specifically to your role. And even then, some of the character names are occasionally changed on the scripts in order to try and further limit the chances of any leaks. So yes, when people ask me if Black Walder and his trusty blade will ever be making a re-appearance in the fictional realm of Westeros, all I’m (contractually) allowed to say is that he’s not dead yet, and so there’s always a chance… Although I think it’s fairly safe to assume that I won’t be getting invited to anymore weddings!”

GoT cast members have stated before that in earlier seasons they received entire scripts, but in recent years, as a precaution, the show has stopped this and gives out portions of the script as needed. For example, in a recent interview with the Luxemburger Wort, Lino Facioli (who plays the Starks’ weak and ill-tempered cousin Robin Arryn) stated that after the third or fourth season, the show started only sending him the dialogue of scenes he was in.

Plester’s answer was vague, as he’s required to be, but since he mentions this practice of sending out only the scenes specific to his role, it does seem like he’s been filming GoT more recently than season 3. And actors who are done with the show have a tendency to answer a lot simpler. I wouldn’t call this a confirmation but it’s very interesting, indeed.


Speaking of Facioli- while his Luxemburger Wort interview doesn’t come right out and say it, his newest CV info does confirm the season 6 return of the young actor. He was reportedly spotted in Belfast back in July, around the time of the cast table read. There were rumors of filming near the shooting location for Runestone in Garron Point, N.I., around that time. His agency CV seals it. The only question now is how involved will Robin Arryn be, in season 6?

Lino

Thanks to WotW reader Biorn for sending us the Your Letterbox find!

83 responses

Jump to (and Always Support) the Bottom

    1. Glad Lino is returning !

      He’s often overlooked, but he does a really solid job at portraying Robin ! I hope he’ll get interesting material this year !

      Crackpot theory but I wouldnt be surprised if Littlefinger’s line “sickly little boys sometimes become powerful men” is foreshadowing and Robin, in the end, will receive a Neville-Longbottom treatment ! ^^

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    2. If they were filming at the Runestone location (incidentally, that’s on the very short list of places we’ve visited in the show but not the books), the most obvious reason would be that we’re going to see Baelish go there to start gathering his army.

      If so, that’s worth factoring into the “how quickly does Baelish and his army go North?” debate, since it seemed quite possible that the show would have had him do that in the period he was offscreen toward the end of Season 5.

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    3. Well, that sounds like he’s back. Probably at the siege. Hopefully soon to be at rest.

      Sean C.: incidentally, that’s on the very short list of places we’ve visited in the show but not the books

      Unless I’m forgetting some other location, it’s gotta be just Runestone, Stokeworth and the Lands of Always Winter, right? All in the last few seasons.

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    4. Nodor,

      In the show he’s a bastard. The character in the show is an amalgamation of Black Walder Frey and Ser Walder Rivers. It’s confirmed in the Season 4 Viewer’s Guide.

      Sean C.,

      How could I forget!

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    5. Wow, now that is some dancing around the subject. It almost makes me feel sorry for these actors, having to be so coy and low key, even at the most tertiary level. But, I am happy that he’s almost certainly back to receive his comeuppance!

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    6. Luka Nieto: Unless I’m forgetting some other location, it’s gotta be just Runestone, Stokeworth and the Lands of Always Winter, right? All in the last few seasons.

      Old Valyria is in the grey zone. The show went there, though admittedly it’s only the retooled city of Chroyane on the Rhoyne.

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    7. Mr Fixit,

      Old Valyria! Yes, that still counts, even if the context is taken from another place. Most of the locations that we saw before they appeared in the books came from season five. I imagine this will continue in the future, now that the show is overtaking the books and making further changes too.

      FreeParking,

      That still counts, just as Runestone and Stokeworth. Good one! 🙂

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    8. Huh, so now we are reading again that the cast only gets their portions of the scripts! The story on this seems to change from year-to-year.

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    9. Wimsey,

      The main cast (the 25-28 of them) always get everything, the complete scripts. That has never changed. It seems the recurring and guest cast also got them back in the day, but they have not for a few years now.

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    10. So, what are the odds these days that Winds comes out ahead of Season 6? Slim to non-existent? Though, interestingly enough, I don’t think Season 6 will cover all that much of Book 6, certainly less than I thought a few months ago. My guess is that it will double back on story elements from AFfC/ADwD that it left out in previous seasons + the material from roughly the first third of TWoW, i.e. the stuff that was meant for Dance but was edited out because Martin ran out of space (and time).

      For the “true” Winds spoilers, I’d wager we’ll have to wait until Season 7. By then, Martin will surely (ahem) publish the damn thing.

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    11. Phil Necro:
      Black Walder is in that leaked ”fake(?)” script too…just sayin.

      We’ll see.

      Oh, FFS, what part of “the leaked script is fake” are you still not understanding?

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    12. Mr Fixit,

      By EP 5-6 with minor exceptions like Jaime all the AFFC/ADWD stories will be done and we will be well into TWOW.

      People said this last season too. There can’t be spoilers, and then we got Stannis, Shireen,..etc.

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    13. Mr Fixit,

      I agree a fair chunk of TWOW will be dealt with in season 7 but not as much as you might think. Personally I’d expect at least 50% of Winds content covered in season 6.

      (ADWD spoiler)

      Especially considering one huge chunk of that content which was pulled from ADWD to be used in TWOW instead, The Battle of Fire, probably isn’t happening in the show at all. Nothing requiring anything like as much setup with all those Essos factions joining in, anyway.

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    14. Nymeria Warrior Queen,

      There might be something in there that people like. So they will keep hoping that’s real.
      Like Dany dying or things like those mostly.

      While saying that they got some things right, but in truth they took those spoilers from sites like this. That’s why they got some things ”right”.

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    15. Mr Fixit,

      That depends on the content of Winds of Winter as well. There’s a strong possibility that the material that was meant to be part of Dance (and now meant to open Winds) will cover a longer part of the book than we might think. After all, the average chapter number of a ASOIAF book is around 70-80. How many will be devoted to the Battles of Ice and Fire? Do you really think Martin will wrap that up in 10 chapters or less?
      Think about Dany for example. She has never had more than 10 chapters per book. How many of them do you think Martin will need to tell her story with the Dothraki/Meereen? Do you believe she can include all that plus the journey to Westeros in the same book?
      Then think about King’s Landing. Anything that happens there is book 6 material. Anything that happens with Sansa/Theon is post Dance material.
      And of course, we are now officially spoiled about a certain character who is not dead after all (and we will know how he returns!)

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    16. Mihnea,

      There’s nothing wrong with people liking some of the stuff in there, not at all, but when we’ve been told over, and over, and over it’s fake, by Sue, no less, who has also explained exactly what you did…that the accurate stuff was taken directly from this site and sites like this, it’s just absurd to me some people continue to harp on how this or that was in the leaked, fake script, so, hey, maybe it’s really not fake. *facepalm*

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    17. Rat Kook,

      Hell we might get some things from early TWOW in S7 and some middle/late parts in S6.

      Like Ramsey/Theon taking MC for example in S4. They like to change this sort of things so they fit better in the story.
      So I don’t think we will have less spoilers this season. I think we will have quite a lot.
      Especially looking at the spoilers so far.

      But of course, here will be the bigest ”conflict”, when something that they don’t like happens people will insist that it isn’t from TWOW same with what they will like, claiming it will be from TWOW.
      I personally think will have a mix of these, but I’m fully prepered for people yelling ”fan-fic!!11!”.

      Note: I’m not talking abour Mr Fixit here but about people in general.

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    18. Let’s play whack-a-Frey!

      The Blackfish stands in the shadows
      The BwB preps the nooses and selects the trees
      Arya comes well-trained
      SweetRobin shall have his day!
      The North remembers
      Nymeria hungers

      Val-Frey-ar Morghulis!

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    19. Mr Fixit,

      You forgot something: characters like Jon, Dany and Tyrion (the big three, no less!) are now completely out of book material. There will be spoilers. Time to face it, mate.

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    20. Nymeria Warrior Queen,

      Oooo… another layer to my imagined sweeping revenge against the Boltons –

      Rickon, Shaggydog and the North to her left, Robin and the Vale to her right, and then Littlefinger 2.0 AKA Sansa takes control and directs them against the Boltons instead of the Wildlings… *shiver*

      There is honour in tricks after all!

      Who needs season 6, I’m enjoying my imagination enough in the meantime…

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    21. Mihnea,

      Very true. However, it would make complete sense to have him in Ep 1 as even my other half (who has not read the books, but does generally watch each episode more than once), completely forgot that Rickon even existed. I suspect that is the case for many viewers – the type who can’t list the names of the houses, or who have completely forgotten Greatjon Umber (as well as any other character who hasn’t appeared in the last two seasons.)

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    22. Mihnea:

      By EP 5-6 with minor exceptions like Jaime all the AFFC/ADWD stories will be done and we will be well into TWOW.

      People said this last season too. There can’t be spoilers, and then we got Stannis, Shireen,..etc.

      I didn’t say there won’t be any spoilers; there most certainly will be plenty of them. However, I believe many if not most of those will be stuff from early TWoW.

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    23. Phil Necro:
      Black Walder is in that leaked ”fake(?)” script too…just sayin.

      We’ll see.

      Okay, this idiocy is beyond tiring. Just sayin’. Why have mods when such irritating repetition isn’t blocked?!

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    24. Owww im so happy with Black Walder coming back. (Probbably).

      With he coming… Lothar Frey will probably come toguether.

      Im the only one here who always wanted the return of Black walder and Lothar Frey. They made such a impression on me. I need they dead.

      Hahaha.

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    25. MeeraReed,

      That is meaningless. When people find out that someone is appearing in a season of Game of Thrones, their names are entered into the first episode by fans, because no one knows which ep they’ll appear in yet. That applies to everyone. So please disregard IMDB.

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    26. Arkash:
      Glad Lino is returning !

      He’s often overlooked, but he does a really solid job at portraying Robin ! I hope he’ll get interesting material this year !

      Crackpot theory but I wouldnt be surprised if Littlefinger’s line “sickly little boys sometimes become powerful men” is foreshadowing and Robin, in the end, will receive a Neville-Longbottom treatment ! ^^

      I hope not… He’s too entertaining as a creepy child… “ffuuuuuusss fly through the Moon Door”!

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    27. About the increasing secrecy around the show, and the increased script security… I’m actually really pleased – don’t get me wrong, I love reading the snippets of information the good people of this site garner – but there is so much of the coming season we know so little of.

      Last season I think we knew a lot more by this point, and the season before we knew even more. Yes, of course, we had the books to go on, and perhaps that’s why they’re being stricter with the secrecy, but all in all I think we now have a good balance between what we think will happen and what is unknown.

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    28. Luka Nieto: The main cast (the 25-28 of them) always get everything, the complete scripts. That has never changed. It seems the recurring and guest cast also got them back in the day, but they have not for a few years now.

      Ah, that explains the conflicting stories: they were both true! Sometimes we do not ask the right questions.

      Mr Fixit: For the “true” Winds spoilers, I’d wager we’ll have to wait until Season 7. By then, Martin will surely (ahem) publish the damn thing.

      That is almost impossible. Remember, the season has to tell a story, and presumably GRRM has devised lots of the plot so that it sets up a story about INTERNAL CONFLICT X. To get to a conclusion of that story, the show will have to get to some of the later plot-points. (Remember, they have only this season and the next two to get through Winter and Spring.)

      As for when we get to read Winter, I honestly would not be surprised if it does not come out until after the series is done at this point.

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    29. Wimsey: As for when we get to read Winter, I honestly would not be surprised if it does not come out until after the series is done at this point.

      I have requested Thoros to set aside three thirsty leeches for you, ser. They are to be applied (and subsequently barbequed) immediately upon Gendry’s return.

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    30. Luka Nieto:
      The main cast (the 25-28 of them) always get everything, the complete scripts. That has never changed. It seems the recurring and guest cast also got them back in the day, but they have not for a few years now.

      I believe the more notable recurring cast still do, e.g., Finn Jones evidently got the script for 510 even though Loras wasn’t in it (hence the “throwing it across the room” anecdote).

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    31. Sean C.,

      I’m not sure Jones is the most reliable reporter. He tends to be over the top in a lot of his interviews.

      Anyway, I definitely remember other cast members discussing how they don’t get all the scripts anymore but I couldn’t remember who it was- hence me only mentioning Lino’s recent quote. I’m sure the leads like Dinklage, Headey, etc get the entire scripts.

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    32. Hodors Bastard,

      Well, my blood is kind of special: thanks for noticing!

      Hey, what do you think will be happening at the Wall? I now am thinking that Thorne has support lined up among northerners who dont like all of the Wildlings coming south…

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    33. BigFerk,

      Anyone can post that information, so HBO cannot tell anybody to keep it off. (They could delete it themselves, however.). As for Rickon being listed in the first episode, as has been noted approximately one googleplex times, that is the default for actors who will be in a series before it is specified in which episodes they will appear.

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    34. Sue the Fury,

      I would think that the actors playing lead characters almost need to see the broader script. After all, they are the ones paralleling each other in different ways: and if you are playing Jon Snow, then it actually is useful to know what Daenerys Targaryen is doing because the stuff that they both are doing clearly is the “meat” of the story.

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    35. Mr Fixit,

      The next season has Bran, and everything related to Bran is Winds of Winter material, there is nothing left from Dance of Dragons, as they will skip his training.

      Also the mess they made with Jon Snow is obviously fan fiction and that story-line belongs to Stannis, so you might not count that as spoiler for book, but the rest is definitely going to be WoW material as well.

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    36. Wimsey: Well, my blood is kind of special: thanks for noticing!

      Hmmm…somehow my diabolical attempt at a veiled threat got inverted. Foiled again! :/

      …what do you think will be happening at the Wall?

      Well, from what I recall from past posts (since consistency matters!), what happens in the first few minutes after FTW is key. In addition to Jaime and Brienne’s dinner date with the hearty BwB, Stannis’ actual demise, Dany getting her Targ on with Drogon and Khal Jhaqo, Arya’s post-mummery trajectory, Sam’s fate with Pate, and Varys’ little birdy fallout, the CB play-by-play is part of what immediately matters (to me) in TWoW.

      As far as the broader tale at the wall goes…

      — The fact that the Ides of Marsh was carried out in ADwD while Thorne was on a ranging mission makes me wonder about Thorne’s leadership future at the wall. Given the show’s direct implication of Thorne, it makes me wonder if Thorne was behind it in ADwD as well, while conveniently separated from his brothers. He comes back from his “ranging” and restores order at CB, escalating him to LC temporarily. So may go the show as well…with Thorne as the 999th LC, quite possibly rallying anti-refugee support from the other conservative northerners, as you mention.

      [Then again, what if Thorne brings back Benjen from his ranging mission?] 🙂

      — But the wildling and giant force and the NW loyalists and Mel will not handle post-FTW well. Their reaction could be quite quick and lethal to the few mutinous nationalists, while preserving/prepping Jon’s body. I predict chaos at CB…until JS superstar opens his eyes again and exits his ice cave (or burning pyre) via help from old and red gods. He may then appoint his successor (and send a gut-wrenched-but-inspired Davos on a mission) before he heads to the Bastard Bowl with his hodgepodge wildling and giant army.

      — In either scenario, the 999th LC might be the last LC…instituted shortly before the horns start blaring three times in succession, repeatedly. Soon their watch will come to an end.

      — But before any attack on the wall, I believe weirnet central in the Haunted Forest will be attacked by WWs, with the CotF/BR killed and Bran/Meera/Hodor/Summer barely escaping (more Coldhands adventures!)…hence compromising the essence of any historical CotF/WW/Giant/FirstMen/AA treaty that may have existed. The Wall may do more than weep afterwards. Then the WW attack and penetrate the wall (early S7?). Hopefully, Sam and Bran can communicate their findings too!

      — As we have discussed before, I also find Jon’s internal identity debate, as well as his acceptance/wariness from other northerners, NWmen and the wildlings, to be a fascinating aspect of this storyline.

      Cheers!

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    37. Jaime’s girl,

      I suspect pie time won’t be happening this season. Or if it does, the set up will be completely different than the books. I kinda think that the pies will happen during the much speculated “Red Wedding 2.0” instead and that’ll be in season 7.

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    38. i dont think robin will have much role this season…..littlefinger, in my opinion will play the waiting game..with the north . he might help loras and margery escape from kings landing when cersi will declare the war against high sparrow …im just speculating here .. i think the tyrells might trick tommen to go with them to high garden…with marcella dead tommen gone to high garden..cersi will be mad king part 2..total chaos….. just what littlefinger likes….

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    39. This pretty much confirms Sansa isn’t going with LF at the start if LF is still in the vale at vale af the beginning.

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    40. Hodors Bastard: The fact that the Ides of Marsh was carried out in ADwD while Thorne was on a ranging mission makes me wonder about Thorne’s leadership future at the wall. Given the show’s direct implication of Thorne, it makes me wonder if Thorne was behind it in ADwD as well, while conveniently separated from his brothers.

      I wonder if Thorne somehow detoured south, and is bringing in Northern reinforcements. Something that we have left out of the Loyalists vs. Nationalists discussion is, which side will the Northerners still at the Wall take? I think that we got lulled into assuming that because they are all so pro-Ned that they would forgive Jon anything: but they were not happy about Wildlings being south of the Wall.

      An alternative is that this is just adaptation: Show!Thorne is taking Book!Marsh’s role and Book!Thorne is just off ranging. If GRRM is having Marsh take over, then it would make sense for the show to use Thorne: that is one fewer character for the already-overwhelmed audience to remember, and even if they do not remember Thorne’s name, they will remember him as the Alpha A-Hole at the Wall.

      (If this is correct, then I do now wonder if Thorne’s decision to allow Jon and the Wildlings through the Wall reflects him not having the Northern reinforcements yet; in this version, I would expect that he sent ravens out while Jon was gone warning them that the traitorous LC was threatening to bring Wildlings into Westeros under the pretext that White Walkers were returning. Alternatively, he might have needed the Wildlings south of the Wall to convince the Northerners that the threat is real: or he might even have thought that he needs the Wildlings slaughtered south of the Wall so that they do not turn into wights!)

      As for how they die, I still suspect that it will be Ramsay who does it, at least in the books, and possibly on the show. After all, Ramsay will think that Sansa is going to Castle Black to find her brother. What would he do when Thorne “claims” that the lady is not present? And, of course, in the book, the Rosy Note basically threatens to do just that. Of course, I still favor some “human” agency being responsible for a breach in the Wall rather than some arbitrary magical agency (e.g., Sam thinking: “Do you know what would be fun? Sneaking into Randyl’s room and making a really loud sound? Hey, here is an old horn: that would be obnoxious….”)

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    41. True King: Also the mess they made with Jon Snow is obviously fan fiction and that story-line belongs to Stannis

      Stannis only gets storylines in fan-fiction: he’s a secondary character in the books. Besides, at least on Jon’s book timeline, Stannis is

      already dead.

      (People need to quit telling themselves that the Coral Communication is a hoax: it wasn’t!)

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    42. It looks like Carice Van Heuten is back in Belfast. I think L7R were really off when they said she will have a very samll role next season.

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    43. True King,

      Thats not entirely true. Bran still has one chapter worth of material left from dance, the one where he’s actually in the cave, jojen-paste and all that. They could built a lot from that one chapter. Remember, Aryas whole s4 arc was taken from only 2 chapters, her stay in the farmer village was changed and adapted, as was her meeting the dying soldier (a dying farmer in the show). Theons season 3 arc was taken mainly from flashback we got in the very first theon chapter in dance. Bran himself had only a few chapters from which they created his s4 arc. My point is that while people call storylines like these ‘fillers’ they are always somewhat grounded in book material. Crasters keep mutineers plot is a jarring example, most of it was invented, but people forget that bran actually did fall upon the mutineers in the book but in a very different manner. I’m sure for s6 bran Will probably get Winds material, but I Think the first Half Will be mainly that one dance chapter. I Mean, it looks like they’re doing the same with Jamie. Instead of rushing into Winds, they’re giving us his riverlands-arc from feast. I’ve said it many times, D&D are going out of their way to addapt it closely.

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    44. Wimsey: And, of course, in the book, the Rosy Note basically threatens to do just that.

      I interpreted the PL to be a lure for Jon to come south (initially I thought it was a ploy by Stannis but now it does indeed seem to be the work of Ramsay). And Jon took the easy bait…then FTW happened. In any case, it seems the lure will work…eventually…but I don’t believe Ramsay will travel to CB.

      If folks believe that Thorne was/is rallying northerners, then why not the Boltons? Maybe he had something to do with the PL as well? In any case, I can’t imagine the mutinous nationalists lasting for much longer. Ghost should have a field day, if so inclined.

      MuhiyaDON: Pie anyone?

      I don’t know what Wimsey is thinking…a just dessert is yet to be served!

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    45. pras:
      i dont think robin will have much role this season…..littlefinger, in my opinion will play the waiting game..with the north .

      Waiting for what? He has no reason to expect any other Northern rebellion to happen. The only conflict in the offing was Stannis vs. Boltons, which is over.

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    46. Hodors Bastard: In any case, it seems the lure will work…eventually…but I don’t believe Ramsay will travel to CB.

      My response to that is (as per usual!) another question: where else would Show!Ramsay go once he figures out that Sansa is not hiding somewhere in Winterfell? Where else would Book!Ramsay go after he fails to find his bride in Stannis’ army? In both media, the wife is important to Ramsay’s status. And in both media, Ramsay is a possessive sociopath: he would have a very hard time giving up any of his “toys” on any terms other than his own.

      One thing that has not yet happened in the show that still might is Jon and the Wildlings going to Hardhome. My suspicion is that Jon & Co. will flee there (in part to escape Castle Black, in part to relieve the Wildlings, and in part to get more people) before turning south. The show has just mixed up the order. (I would not be surprised if a certain Princess Roast happens in association with that!) If so, then that gives a fair bit of time (off-page and off-screen largely) for the NW to re-organize and create more problems for Jon.

      As for who Thorne gets, it would have to be peoples close to the Wall. However, it would be the show replacement of the Northerners already at the Wall in the book. It’s not the sort of thing where the show would (or should) spend much time showing anything other than the result.

      Damphairintheshowplease!: They could built a lot from that one chapter.

      Eh, not really: I think that they are correct that training montages are dull. Moreover, the part that fed the “Kill the Boy, Let the Man be Born” story was used in the “Conflicted Love Hate” story in the prior year.

      Damphairintheshowplease!: Crasters keep mutineers plot is a jarring example, most of it was invented, but people forget that bran actually did fall upon the mutineers in the book but in a very different manner.

      Again, it was not “invented”: it was adapted. Basically, something like that did happen in the book. However, a non-protagonist dealt with the problem “off-page.” If they were to adapt it to the screen, then: 1) one or more protagonists had to be in real danger, not just apparent danger; and, 2) one or more protagonists had to provide the solution. So, the incidental Coldhands is replaced by Protagonist #1 and the apparent danger to Bran is replaced by real danger to Bran. That’s just lungs and limbs replacing gills and fins!

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    47. ghost of winterfell,

      They could be right. From what we know. Mel will play a role in Jon’s resurrection and there was no report of her presence at Saintfield or in Belfast around that time. You would expect her there if Sansa of all people will be present at the battlefield.

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    48. Nobody said it has to be a montage. I enjoyed what they did with Aryas training in s5. And yes, there is quite a lot of material. SPOILERS:

      Bran is taught more about the children, bran starts warging crows, Bran eats a paste and becomes the forrest seing ned and lyana through the tree. That Can be different sequences in different episodes, something like ep 1, 3 and 5, that’s half the season, and then Winds material. Seems very plausible to me

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    49. Damphairintheshowplease!,

      That’s all plot. Where is the internal struggle part? This is what was very different for Arya, and why it worked for her when it would not have worked for Bran. For one thing, there was almost no training shown: that was “interrupted” in every scene for actual story. And the story came from constant spoken recitation: Are you Arya Stark or are you No-One? That was the story: Arya’s “kill the girl and let the woman be born” struggle is how to become a Faceless Woman without losing Arya Stark. The show presented that quite well.

      The show would have needed to contrive some “Are you Bran Stark or are you an Old God” with Bran trying to become a Tree God without ceasing to be Bran Stark. However, we do not know that this will be a dilemma for Bran (to the contrary, I suspect that he will very much give up being Bran Stark). Alternatively, it would have had to find some analogous “I want to be X and Y, not X or Y” scenario. Regardless, the mechanics for doing this would all have been much less intuitive for the audience to follow than it was for Arya’s internal struggle.

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    50. Wimsey: In both media, the wife is important to Ramsay’s status. And in both media, Ramsay is a possessive sociopath: he would have a very hard time giving up any of his “toys” on any terms other than his own.

      Yes, I agree to both assertions. However, I must tie my rationale primarily to the book. fArya ain’t Sansa and Theon/Asha (assuming they survive Stannis’ last stand) won’t seek out Jon. Hence, I see the letter as a lure. All the activity/interest for Jon is at or near WF.

      In the show, Sansa/Theon don’t have the means to go north and will get local support instead (Brienne/Pod most likely, with support of the aging “north remembers” coalition). Maybe Sansa sends a raven to CB instead, from a supporter’s village, asking for family help? Jon 2.0 could read the revised “PL” and react.

      Meanwhile, Ramsay will pillage everywhere nearby to find his Reek and wife, probably with some success, given the pics we’ve seen already. I’m assuming that the northern conspiracy, prep for the Wot6A and internal family inheritance squabbles will give the Boltons plenty of distraction as well.

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    51. True King:

      Also the mess they made with Jon Snow is obviously fan fiction and that story-line belongs to Stannis, soyou might not count that as spoiler for book, but the rest is definitely going to be WoW material as well.

      Haha, I’m a Stannis fan alright, but are you really trying to say that Jon is a supporting character in Stannis’s story?

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    52. Wimsey: I would think that the actors playing lead characters almost need to see the broader script. After all, they are the ones paralleling each other in different ways: and if you are playing Jon Snow, then it actually is useful to know what Daenerys Targaryen is doing because the stuff that they both are doing clearly is the “meat” of the story.

      Most actors are focused on their own character and the other characters with whom they interact. Knowing what a character their character knows nothing about is doing on the other side of the world, whether their stories parallel, or not, is not going to be very helpful in terms of making choices for their own character.

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    53. Sean C.,

      SORRY FOR LATE REPLY…..littlefinger had his eye on north ..he was hoping stannis vs boltons will leave north weak and he could perhaps attack north ..with the help of knights of vale…knights of vale wouldnt fight for him..but they wouldve fought to rescue sansa..either from stannis …if he had won… or from boltons..but things didnt go as he expected…easy victory for boltons means he cant achieve his goals just yet..and sansa running away (im sure he will know about it soon enough)… means he has no cards to play in north….so wat can he do but wait….wait for ANOTHER OPPORTUNTY……thats what i was thinking…..

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