Filming in Spain begins, main characters collide & a forgotten character returns

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These last few weeks, the Game of Thrones crew has worked hard to put the final touches on the new locations in the rockiest shorelines of the Basque Country, and just yesterday the cast appeared on set. All of this was merely the preparation for what was to come, and it has finally happened. Filming has begun in Spain, particularly in Barrika on Muriola Beach, in the Basque Country. Despite the tight security measures, plenty of curious onlookers have managed to sneak a peek at what was being filmed. It should go without saying, but there are major spoilers ahead. Just as Benioff and Weiss promised, characters that have never met before collide for the first time ever. Moreover, a character we have not seen for a long time returns to the fold.

As keen followers of recent spoilers might have surmised by now, there will be a major North-meets-South encounter in more than one of the Spanish locations. Our speculative minds can rest for a bit, however, as we now have a pretty clear view of what this first encounter may look like. The video shared by Basque newspaper EL CORREO shows us beyond a shadow of a doubt an encounter between Tyrion Lannister and Davos Seaworth on what very much looks like the shores of Dragonstone.

As you can see, in this beach scene next to a small boat we can see Tyrion dressed in black, following his queen’s lead from last season’s finale, and Davos, dressed exactly as we have seen him dress for the last five years, working hard on preparing the boat either for disembarking or embarking, while he has a conversation with Daenerys’ new Hand.

This meeting holds a particular interest for those of us who are invested in the inner lives of these characters. The political reasons for this meetup will surely breed hundreds of new theories, yet we should also pay attention to the shared history of Tyrion and Davos, however tenuous. The characters may have never met in the show, but Tyrion was responsible for the defense of King’s Landing during Stannis’ attack, and his wildfire trick resulted in Davos witnessing how his son Matthos disintegrated just before his eyes. Considering they have —as of very recently— fought in opposite sides of a war, it is worth wondering how well they will be able to work together, if that is indeed their aim as counselors for their respective leaders, King Jon and Queen Daenerys.

Now, if a meeting of two major characters such as these were not considered momentous enough, we have another piece of information from today’s filming that may blow your minds… and put an end to a tiresome meme, as well. Unfortunately, this one is not yet accompanied by any visual evidence of any kind, but Los Siete Reinos claims they have it in good authority that none other than Joe Dempsie was spotted on set. You read that right: Gendry is back in the story after a three season absence, and surprisingly he will return to the place we saw him last: Dragonstone. We already had some compelling evidence that Dempsie would return this coming season, but seeing him here is certainly a bit of a shock. What are the possible circumstances of Gendry ending up in Dragonstone again, after keeping on rowing for so many years? Did he circumnavigate the Earth in his little boat, and ended up where he started? I haven’t the slightest. And isn’t that part of the fun?

428 responses

Jump to (and Always Support) the Bottom

    1. Tyrion and Davos are two of my favorite characters. I hope this is a positive meeting, and that Seaworth’s boat is full of dragonglass.

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    2. Congrats Luka 🙂 awesome article, I Just post the same video in the last post :s I’m glad to Know tha Gendry is back 🙂 ……

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    3. I love spoilers so much. Davos & Tyrion scenes is great news, can’t wait for their scenes together. Do we know anything about Kit being already in Spain? There is a rumor he is in the same place as Emilia…

      Hopefully Gendry’s return isn’t fan service and he actually does something important… And please don’t kill him off.

      Oh and congrats Luka!

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    4. They seem to have friendly conversation given that they were enemies and fought against one another.

      I wonder why Gendry at Dragonstone? What is his purpose? Forging Valyrian steel swords?

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    5. Does anyone else find interesting that they are just the two of them walking down towards a boat that has been left there instead of Davos coming e.t.c?

      Rhaenys Stark,

      I didn’t see any local report that they have seen Emilia or Kit, i don’t know where this “rumor” comes from.

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    6. Geralt of Rivia,

      I dont think there was any images of the real-footage in that video, it was just between takes, I assume, so I dont think we can deduce the tone of their conversation from just what we saw.

      And congrats Luka ! And thank you for all your reports !

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    7. Congrats Luka! Is it confirmed that this location in Dragonstone and not KL?

      Rhaenys Stark,

      Javi Marcos has claimed on twitter that both Kit and Emilia will be involved in the Zumaia filming. We will have to wait for next week for confirmation though.

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    8. Apparently awayforthelads has admitted that the spoilers he circulated the last few weeks are fake. Can we heave a sigh of relief!

      Considering he did get some things right like

      Jon meeting Theon and the dragonpit being used for diplomatic purposes

      he probably had some real info and he added his own inventions to that.

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    9. Arkash,

      It looked partially between takes and during filming. At least one part looked that way. Either way interesting that they’ll meet here, as it wa reported Davos elsewhere on top of it. A lot of meetings.

      Zumaia are indoors, outdoors or both scenes? If someone can manage to get photos or video like here. If Kit and Emilia are truly shooting scenes there.

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    10. At the 3:59 mark in the video, that looks like a gold cloak walking down the stairs. There is a Kingsguard on Dragonstone I tell ya.

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    11. Oh great!How am I supposed to wait until next year.Their conversation are going to be so great.I also find it funny that tyrion and Danny go through so much clothes and Jon and Davos have changed maybe twice lol.And yeah they fought against each other in the battle of blackwater but now it’s different.They are advising completely different people.Like Tyrion knows Jon and Davos knows they need dany and her dragons he knows what’s at stake here.They are level minded people I’m sure they will be fine.I can’t even begin to speculate about gendry.I’m just happy he is back.

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    12. Just had this thought… if Gendry returns, there is only one last character still alive with spoken lines that has yet to make a return : Roselyn Frey, right ?

      But maybe I’m missing someone…

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    13. From 3:59 to 4:03 there’s someone in costume going down the stairs holding some papers. You can only see his lower half. His clothes are gold mixed with some brown I think. Who is it? Is he holding a helmet?

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    14. The video was exciting to watch. Amazing if you consider the distance between the camera and the action.
      And the other news….I know of at least a couple of fans rejoicing, LOL. Well done Luka.

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    15. Great article, Luka!

      Gendry is still in Dragonstone? Mind blown. I don’t know what Tyrion and Davos are planning, but it may be to get Gendry to go to Flea Bottom as a spy.

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    16. Beach sweeper on GoT is a real job! This is fun to watch. Watching the pull back left me thinking “How fair away was this filmed from? Miles?” And Gendry, where was he been in the TV show? Book readers know about his story ( no spoilers from me)

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    17. Flayed Potatoes:
      From 3:59 to 4:03 there’s someone in costume going down the stairs holding some papers. You can only see his lower half. His clothes are gold mixed with some brown I think. Who is it? Is he holding a helmet?

      To add: could it be Gendry in a new outfit?

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    18. Good news all around. I really hope they take full advantage of Tyrion and Davos’ shared history, especially given the location. Though I suppose that so many characters have shared history they may struggle to find the time

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    19. Wow, that is one powerful camera… When that guy kept zooming back and zooming back and I realized how far away he was to the actual filming. Yeah, it won’t be possible for GOT to keep filming under wraps even with all that security.

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    20. Is Gendry the heir to the Stormlands now that all the Baratheons are gone? Maybe that’s why he is important to Dany. After all, Davos knows that Gendry is Robert’s bastard.

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    21. Geralt of Rivia,

      Looks more like a gold cloak to me from the type of armour they’re wearing. And there’s two of them.

      I wonder what the piece of green screen is intended for?

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    22. ghost of winterfell,

      That’s my guess too. There’s no reason for Davos, Tyrion and Gendry to be sharing scenes unless they intend to legitimize him and have him bring the Stormlands into the fold.

      I imagine that Davos might suggest this to Jon initially, but Daenerys will come into the equation once Davos is down south.

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    23. Vally:
      What do they need Gendry for? Is Dany going to marry the Usurper’s Bastard? LOL

      That wouldn’t be completely absurd, would it? I mean, she may consider herself the rightful ruler of Westeros but she’s probably also aware not everyone sees it that way.
      By legitimizing Robert’s bastard, which I assume is well in her power as queen, and marrying him, she could further bolster her claim.

      Well, not that you really need much of a claim with three fire-brathing dragons.

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    24. Flayed Potatoes,

      Looks like a helmet to me. And who ever it is they are wearing all brown leather including the boots. Do the gold cloaks dress like that? Kingsguard wears armor right not the leather like that?

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    25. Greywind,

      Great catch! Tyrion and Davos sailing to KL to organize a revolt confirmed; some of Davos’ old buddies (hope, it won’t be Gendry) selling them to Cersei right on the beach confirmed. Or is it just a city guard from the casting calls catching a “suspiciously looking person(s)”?

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    26. Ramsay’s 20th Good Man,

      Yeah, that would suggest that Davos, and probably Jon as well, are getting into the political game. Interesting. If the North, Vale, Stormlands, the Reach and Dorne are all allied with Dany, what chance could Cersei possibly have lol, with just Euron as an ally?

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    27. Vally,

      It depends.

      If Davos initially plans to find Gendry in order to ally the Stormlands with the North, it’s possible that circumstances could lead him to bring Daenerys into the equation without necessarily meaning that Jon and the North have accepted her rule over them.

      Davos could offer to help bring the Stormlands under Daenerys’ rule peacefully as part of a compromise/allegiance with the North.

      That’s just an example, but Davos helping bring the Stormlands (or Dragonstone) under Daenerys’ control doesn’t necessarily mean that Jon has bent the knee.

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    28. Ramsay’s 20th Good Man:
      ghost of winterfell,

      That’s my guess too. There’s no reason for Davos, Tyrion and Gendry to be sharing scenes unless they intend to legitimize him and have him bring the Stormlands into the fold.

      I imagine that Davos might suggest this to Jon initially, but Daenerys will come into the equation once Davos is down south.

      I agree with this guess and think about what a brilliant political maneuver it would be on Daenerys part to bring Gendry into the fold as a reinstated new Lord of House Baratheon. It would go directly against Cersei. “The Bastard Who Got Away” is a great story to tell. Joffrey/Cersei tried to have them all destroyed and now one of them is going to join the forces to destroy her instead.

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    29. Arya Serious,

      Yeah it’s not heavy enough like the Kingsguard armor and the guy wearing it looks too lean for the role. It could be a guard, or Gendry…who knows? He’s certainly not The Mountain though lol.

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    30. Ok So Dany will be ok with the sons of Ned and Robert who actually took the throne from her.. she will even restore the Baratheon line….with who does she has problem?

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    31. I like the theory of legitimizing Gendry to bring the Stormlands into the fold.

      I’ve always felt that Gendry (in show universe) being the last living “Baratheon” has some importance to the story.

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    32. Arya Serious,

      IMO it’s exactly what the KL city guards (gold cloaks) wear. The guy looks to be a city guard catching (or trying to catch) a suspiciously looking person from the casting call we heard of several months ago. He will be interacting with Davos.

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    33. I think Gendry should marry Arya because it would finally have the Stark and Baratheon tie like Robert always wanted. They had good chemistry so I’m more for that than Dany marrying him. But that’s just me lol! How old is Arya now in the storyline? I lost track but you would think by now she should be close to the age.

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    34. Maggie:
      Ok So Dany will be ok with the sons of Ned and Robert who actually took the throne from her.. she will even restore the Baratheon line….with who does she has problem with?

      Cersei and Euron I guess.

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    35. Arya Serious,

      It looks like the knee-length chainmail armour that the gold cloaks wear to me. And there are two of them dressed identically.

      You can see the first person’s boots/shin-guards glinting in the sunlight. It could be buffed up leather, but it appears metallic to me.

      I just had a look at the gold cloaks costumes in Season 1 and they definitely wear golden, metallic boots/shin-guards.

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    36. Flayed Potatoes,

      I agree. I just looked at pics of the gold cloaks and that does look super similar so that’s probably what it is. I wonder if they are doing their meeting and get busted by them in the process!

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    37. Thank you all for the warm welcome! It will be a pleasure to write for WOTW 🙂

      It felt just right to begin with such an interesting piece of news, and one that concerns my area, too.

      caliopesnow,

      Sadly, I was not chosen. There were plenty of tall buff candidates, and I’m neither of those things (well, halfway to buffness, I hope). That’s the reason I came on board now, by the way. It would be a bit awkward to report on leaked spoilers while I’m under an NDA not to do so based on what I learn on set (even if I didn’t divulge any of it myself, and merely reported it from other sources.) So, in a way, I’m happy I wasn’t chosen. I get to write for WOTW as of right now! I also get to sleep, instead of waking up at 4AM as extras must, which is also nice 😛

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    38. Maggie:
      Ok So Dany will be ok with the sons of Ned and Robert who actually took the throne from her.. she will even restore the Baratheon line….with who does she has problem?

      Remember that key important scene from last season with Theon, Yara and Tyrion meeting in Meereen? Daenerys told everyone “We’re going to do better than our Fathers” … which is a clear indication she’s not going to hold a grudge anymore against the children of her enemies.

      She’s as much a victim of “Terrible Fathers” as the rest of them. She’s accepted Tyrion … a Lannister, as her Hand. The New Order is beginning. 🙂 I believe that introduced to Gendry or Jon, she would treat them with the same respect as she has shown Tyrion, Yara and Theon. She’s even got Varys on her side and he was working directly with Robert Barartheon to have her assassinated!

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    39. Flayed Potatoes,

      Cersei was actually supporting so much Rhaegar win and she wasn’t even near Kings Landing.
      I understand her allies want her dead…but the rebellion started from Robert and Ned, if what fathers did is not important why Dany wants the throne? It’s not like she grew up there..she wants it because her father had it.

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    40. Envie,

      I think he may have just been acting like he was helping Robert. Remember when Arya heard Varys and Illyrio talking where the skulls are under the red keep? I think he has been watching her and planning with Illyrio the whole time (in the show only of course) and had to have some sort of participation in reporting on her or Robert would have known what he was up to.

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    41. Arya Serious:
      Envie,

      I think he may have just been acting like he was helping Robert.Remember when Arya heard Varys and Illyrio talking where the skulls are under the red keep? I think he has been watching her and planning with Illyrio the whole time (in the show only of course) and had to have some sort of participation in reporting on her or Robert would have known what he was up to.

      Yes, I’ve read theories that perhaps Varys was actually misdirecting the assassination attempts. The Manticor was sent by the warlocks of Qarth, right? Still not sure on the wine seller from way back when though.

      I’m actually supportive of Varys being on her side and knew he probably was from that first secret meeting he had with Illyrio which Arya overheard. My point still stands though that Daenerys is making a strong effort to put aside old enemy grudges in order to “Break the Wheel” and rebuild a new future.

      Her biggest enemy is not Cersei/Euron, it’s Winter. 😉

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    42. Flayed Potatoes:
      Kay,

      Los Siete Reinos said

      They are saying that Emilia Clarke and some Unsullied will be filming tomorrow at Bermeo. They are also still maintaining that Kit Harington will be arriving to film. I do hope they are right lol.

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    43. After Jaime kills Cersei with Joffrey’s sword Widow’s Wail (Brienne’s sword’s counterpart made from ICE), Jaime will give it to Brienne and make her promise to stab him through the heart, as he can no longer live without his one and only true love Cersei. Upon killing her own true love (Brienne loves Jaime) the two swords in her possession are primed to be reforged into LIGHTBRINGER by Gendry. Who knows who gets the sword to use in the final battles to come…

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    44. ghost of winterfell,

      That’s why I’m questioning whether this particular scene is at Dragonstone.

      As far as I’m aware from these recent articles it’s not been confirmed that these scenes are definitely taking place at Dragonstone, it’s only been rumoured that some of the scenes being filmed in these locations may be Dragonstone and that Daenerys will be spending some time on Dragonstone this coming season.

      Perhaps someone will correct me if I’m wrong.

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    45. Congratulations on joining the WOTW writing staff, Luka! 🙂

      Tyrion and Davos’s scenes should be fantastic. I can hardly wait. As Luka notes, I do hope that Davos mentions his son at some point during this encounter. Unlike Brienne, the Onion Knight isn’t likely to hold an enduring grudge – they were at war, after all. But Tyrion’s use of wildfire cost Davos dearly. It’s surely one of the most painful memories of his life, so the inherent potential in such a partnership is very rich. I expect that he will bring it up, and Tyrion will be fairly apologetic, if not remorseful. Being eminently practical men, I expect that one good conversation would be enough for them to make peace in the service of a higher goal.

      The writers have done an excellent job in recent seasons of calling back to prior interactions between characters who were once antagonistic but now find themselves on the same side (Brienne recalling her encounter Davos and Melisandre in the Stormlands, Tyrion recalling meeting Theon at Winterfell, etc). This has all the makings of a classically great Game of Thrones scene!

      Speaking of Brienne, I wonder if she will be part of these scenes as well. We’ve heard that Davos and Brienne will both meet Dany, so it seems reasonable that they might travel south together (unless Davos goes with Jon, and Sansa sends Brienne south for other reasons). I’ve seen some people above speculating that the figure who can be glimpsed coming down the stairs between 3:59 and 4:03 might be her. That would make more sense to me that that person being a Kingsguard, but perhaps it’s just an extra playing a dignitary of some kind.

      The return of Gendry to Dragonstone is also big news. Poor guy – he’s going to have some residual trauma to deal with, even if Melisandre isn’t there! If the only purpose of bringing Gendry back was to tie off that story thread – and end all of the “still rowing” jokes forever – then that could be accomplished with a simple cameo in the streets of King’s Landing, letting everyone know that Robert’s last surviving son is living out his life in relatively peaceful obscurity.

      Bringing Gendry back to Dragonstone suggests that he has a more substantive role to play. I was pretty skeptical of the idea that he would be legitimized as an heir to the Stormlands, but perhaps such a fate in his future after all.

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    46. Luka Nieto:
      Thank you all for the warm welcome! It will be a pleasure to write for WOTW ?

      It felt just right to begin with such an interesting piece of news, and one that concerns my area, too.

      caliopesnow,

      Sadly, I was not chosen. There were plenty of tall buff candidates, and I’m neither of those things (well, halfway to buffness, I hope). That’s the reason I came on board now, by the way. It would be a bit awkward to report on leaked spoilers while I’m under an NDA not to do so based on what I learn on set (even if I didn’t divulge any of it myself, and merely reported it from other sources.) So, in a way, I’m happy I wasn’t chosen. I get to write for WOTW as of right now! I also get to sleep, instead of waking up at 4AM as extras must, which is also nice ?

      I’m glad you found a silver-lining in the cloud of not being chosen. Again, congrats Luka, you deserve this!

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    47. Ramsay’s 20th Good Man,

      I wonder what is green screen for. Any ideas?

      If Dany is marrying Gendry, then Jon marriage is off the table. Don’t think he’ll agree to anything like this, nor it would be that profitable for her. Stormlands can’t mount orsuch a strong force but we know little since it’s few seasons we’ve been there.

      As Dany can’t have children, who would continue line when you got two husbands. It creates chaos in succession and further conflicts. Maybe, she wants to legitimize him and give him Stormlands? But I agree that unless he’s skilled maker of Valyrian steel swords of legitimization.

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    48. tiny direwolf,

      Gendry won’t be legitimized as a potential heir to the Stormlands (at least not this season), however he will become the or one of the leaders of the public revolt in KL. Think or of it: he is a commoner who managed to survive in KL un-betrayed for several years which implies that he should have a lot of good friends. He knows Davos, Davos saved his life once and thus is entitled to ask him to risk it for a right cause. And finally, Gendry has a major spite on Cersei who ordered murder of all his brothers and sisters (in fact it was Joffrey, but Cersei did not stop him, so she does share the responsibility). Gendry never new those siblings but still a kin is a kin and he could have dreamed that he could possibly meet and befriend some of these siblings. Moreover, he knows that Cersei is responsible for the death of his father, who was far from perfect but still tried to take care of his scions. And yes, in the eyes of the public he would be “the bastard who survived” – the lucky one who might be worth to be followed. So, he would be a perfect leader for the common folk.

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    49. Maggie,

      Don’t think she’ll marry both or even needed to. She might give Gendry Stormlands, Jon agrees to swear fealty to her in exchange for support against white walkers. Don’t know how it would work out really double marriage.

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    50. I don’t think that Tyrion would be bold enough to show up at kings landing without a giant army and dragons at his back. He is wanted for regicide and patricide. I think he very much would like to stay alive.

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    51. Maggie: Davos, Gendry and Tyrion are returning from another location to Dragonstone.

      Why not? she did name tyrion as her Hand, even though his brother murdered her father. Jon and Gendry weren’t even born yet when all of this happened, btw. They have nothing to do with what his parents did to Dany’s family.

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    52. Envie,

      The wine seller was part of Varys’ plan to kill Daenerys on Robert’s orders.

      However, I also believe Varys made sure that Jorah received his royal pardon before Daenerys’ death, which would act as a warning that an attempt was to be made on her life.

      Why would he receive his pardon if she was still alive and a threat to Robert’s rule?

      It’s shortly after receiving his pardon that Jorah spots the wine seller’s intentions.

      Varys was always playing both sides.

      He did what Robert/Cersei/Tywin told him, while simultaneously trying to get Ned and Tyrion to exert their good influence on the Seven Kingdoms, and while also supporting Daenerys’ potential return whenever the opportunity arose.

      As he said himself, “I serve the Realm”.

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    53. Ramsay’s 20th Good Man,

      Exactly! Varys tries to serve the interests of the realm at large rather than the interests of the nobles up top or himself the way Littlefinger does. This strengthens my belief that his joining openly with Daenerys and Team Targaryen is another indication of new change coming to Westeros via both Daenerys and Jon Snow. Both of them believe in embracing those who were once your enemies for the greater good. Jon has brought Wildlings south of the wall and the Northerners are accepting it. This is something no other Northerner would have ever dared to do.

      People are skeptical that Daenerys would accept Gendry or ally with Jon Snow but we have plenty of proof she’s willing to change her own beliefs for that greater good. That’s why I am pretty sure once Jon Snow shows her the real threat to Westeros coming from up north, she’ll do everything she can to make a super alliance (but that’s probably in Season 8).

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    54. Myname,
      Inga,

      L7R confirmed the three Basque locations would portray just one place in the fiction, and that’s probably Dragonstone. These beaches and Gaztelugatxe look nothing like the sort of place you’d go for a King’s Landing lookalike.

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    55. Inga:
      ghost of winterfell,

      If you ask me, it’s definitely KL, not the Dragonstone and they are carrying the greenscreen to CGI the required landscape on the background of the Gold Cloaks.

      But Javi has confirmed the three locations filming there are all different parts of Dragonstone, no?

      Why would Tyrion go within 50 miles of King’s Landing considering it would mean instant death if one of Cersei’s spies or soldiers caught him? This beach scene seems very wide open and in broad daylight with him in full Hand-of-the-Queen costume. I don’t think it’s King’s Landing Davos and Tyrion are riding in a boat to or from.

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    56. Nikki

      I cannot imagine that Daenerys will marry Gendry. Though it’d be somewhat hilarious if she did. It’d shoot the hell out of the 15+ year Jon/Dany and Gendry/Arya theories.

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    57. orange,

      It seems imo Gendry is getting Edric Storm’s role again, so if there’s some sort of union or alliance, it would not be very shocking.

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    58. Myname,

      I think so too. And even if the info that Tyrion and Davos are returning to Dragonstone from another place, it can be safely interpreted that they are LEAVING KL, not ARRIVING to it. Think of it: the boat is standing on the shore and it is covered with a cloak which Davos uncovers. Clearly they are preparing to LEAVE (probably after meeting with Gendry and other Davos’ old buddies), and at the last moment the Golden Cloaks show up and arrest them (and probably Gendry, too). Little birds, you know… That’s how we should read the scene IMO.

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    59. Flayed Potatoes:
      orange,

      It seems imo Gendry is getting Edric Storm’s role again, so if there’s some sort of union or alliance, it would not be very shocking.

      It would be pretty shocking as there has been zero build up to it. There is no foreshadowing or groundwork for such a union. Gendry is coming back after missing for three seasons. Whatever his role, it won’t be husband to Daenerys.

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    60. Myname,

      That section about Jon and the other characters is an introduction for readers who don’t watch the show. Revealing Jon’s parentage would be a spoiler. I wish we had a picture of the other page from the article. It’s pretty interesting.

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    61. moiaf,

      They gave him Edric’s arc in Dragonstone in season 3. But I agree, they won’t marry. That would be a huge departure from the source material. They could use him as an ally or for his blacksmith work.

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    62. Vally:
      What do they need Gendry for? Is Dany going to marry the Usurper’s Bastard? LOL

      Well Mel told him he has the power to raise or make Kings, or something near that statement.

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    63. moiaf: It would be pretty shocking as there has been zero build up to it. There is no foreshadowing or groundwork for such a union. Gendry is coming back after missing for three seasons. Whatever his role, it won’t be husband to Daenerys.

      Thank you, a voice of reason. Was tinfoil on sale?

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    64. I wish people would stop with this marriage thing..
      If jon being King and having support of three kingdoms does not equal to dany’s power..
      How does gendry a bastard ( who many don’t even know existing) is a match to her…

      If you ask me the whole Marriage if it is suppose to happen than its been pretty much confirmed after the casting of characters way back in season 1 ..kit and Emilia being of same age and Maisie and Joe

      Maggie,

      Maggie,

      I dont see What does wanting to take back the throne have to do with her not faulting children for their father’s actions.. She can take the throne and still can forgive them..
      She is doing it as a duty for her entire family and ancestors since she is the last targaryen ..

      Even in books her gripe is not that the rebels killed her father but they killed her entire family including aegon and rhaenys..and the anger never went into the children or family as a whole…

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    65. This has set my mind to tinfoil, lots of possibilities and no answers till next year.

      Brienne knows Oathkeeper was forged from Ice, Varys most likely knows by who. He also knows Gendry was his apprentice. Davos is hands (heh) down the best person to smuggle anyone into either KL or Dragonstone, it was his trade and he also knows the layouts of both places well.

      Varys knows the hidden tunnels in KL, he would also suggest dressing in disguise, for example Greyworm in Gold Cloak uniform. There is so many interesting possibilities from all this.

        Quote  Reply

    66. Flayed Potatoes,

      I think they’ll be allies. Dany could legitimize him, which would make him Lord of Storm’s End and make the Stormlands allies of her, to an extent. Additionally, he’s yet another child of a horrible father, which Dany seems to be collecting as of late. Gendry would be someone who would understand Dany’s vision for destroying the wheel as he himself as been trampled by it.

        Quote  Reply

    67. There’s been rumors all over social media Kit Harington is in the same hotel as Emilia Clarke. And I believe one even said they saw the two of them having breakfast or something. But of course…amazingly, like any good Bigfoot sightings, no camera in the moment of truth.

        Quote  Reply

    68. Inga:
      Myname,

      I think so too. And even if the info that Tyrion and Davos are returning to Dragonstone from another place, it can be safely interpreted that they are LEAVING KL, not ARRIVING to it. Think of it: the boat is standing on the shore and it is covered with a cloak which Davos uncovers. Clearly they are preparing to LEAVE (probably after meeting with Gendry and other Davos’ old buddies), and at the last moment the Golden Cloaks show up and arrest them (and probably Gendry, too). Little birds, you know… That’s how we should read the scene IMO.

      No, that’s how you may be reading the scene and everyone sees it differently but the article confirms (and Luka Nieto addressed it in comments here) that this location is being filmed as part of Dragonstone. Not King’s Landing.

        Quote  Reply

    69. Luka Nieto,

      What was exactly the wording? That Davos and Tyrion are returning to Dragonstone from another place? But that’s exactly what they are doing: the boat is covered with a clock, so they are preparing to LEAVE, not to LAND. Remember Syrio Forell and how he taught Arya to SEE not only watch or listen to what other people are saying.

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    70. Myname,

      Okay thanks.

      He will film a fight scene at Dragonstone? That’s surprising, whom would he fight, Dany’s people? That’s not likely to go well for him lol.

        Quote  Reply

    71. Nikki,

      Then no reason to marry Jon or is show going route with two marriages that might more complicate matters.

      She can concieve? Last time we saw her she said that she couldn’t to Khal Moro or any other men. But for the argument sake, let’s say she can eventually. Then marrying tqo guys would create problems for her and the realm.

        Quote  Reply

    72. grailking,

      That was more or less towards those leeches Stannis throw into fire. Joffrey, Renly, Robb and Balon. Mel then believed that it will make them fall and others rise as result of it.

        Quote  Reply

    73. grailking,

      Oh, I missed that (have to rewatch), but if Mel really told him something like that the foreshadowing can’t be more obvious: he will become the leader of the public revolt that will overthrow Cersei (or he will become the so called sacred victim whose death and/or sufferings will ignite the revolution), but even if he dies that won’t be in vain. Jon and Dany will take care of that.

        Quote  Reply

    74. ghost of winterfell:
      Is Gendry the heir to the Stormlands now that all the Baratheons are gone? Maybe that’s why he is important to Dany. After all, Davos knows that Gendry is Robert’s bastard.

      Maybe Gendry arrived with Davos. Poor Gendry has been wandering around, no family. Could be he heard about the Starks being back at Winterfell and decided to visit Arya. Didn’t find Arya but became part of team Stark.

        Quote  Reply

    75. Arkash: Just had this thought… if Gendry returns, there is only one last character still alive with spoken lines that has yet to make a return : Roselyn Frey, right ?

      But maybe I’m missing someone…

      The one* other character I can think of in that department is Quaithe, who hasn’t appeared or been mentioned since Season 2 (although Qarth has been mentioned several times). People have been speculating about the potential that she could return for years, and of course she did come back in ADWD as part of the Meereenese Knot – a storyline that the show mercifully condensed.

      *The other is Wilko Johnson as Ilyn Payne, who was phased out of the show (and off Arya’s list) for health-related reasons. He’s recovered now, so I’d love to see him come back. However, Bronn has effectively absorbed his role, so the only real narrative purpose he could serve at this point is to be Arya’s victim. That might be a little morbid, and probably isn’t worth it.

      I expect that she won’t return, because she doesn’t really need to – unlike Gendry and other missing characters, the storyline that she was part of came to a relatively definitive close. Furthermore, there’s a good chance that we won’t spend any time at all in Essos going forward – it depends on how seriously the show is going to have Jorah attempt to find “the cure” for Greyscale, and how much time they want to devote to such an endeavor. Most fan speculations have him heading to Oldtown to link up with Sam and the maesters, which does seem the most likely course (at the very least, it gets him onto the same continent as the rest of our relevant players).

      Bu if the writers wanted to go a different way … then Quaithe is a mystical character who the show has already introduced, and it’s plausible to imagine her possessing such arcane knowledge. Benioff and Weiss have stated in interviews that for the remaining two seasons, they want to play with the pieces they have left on the board, and for what it’s worth, Quaithe does a connection with Jorah, so it wouldn’t come entirely out of nowhere. Again, however, it’s not necessary, and I’m not putting any money on it.

      As for Roslin – I expect that her potential return is contingent on whether or not Arya decides to break her uncle Edmure out of his cell before she leaves the Twins.

        Quote  Reply

    76. Myname,

      Kit fighting? Probably not Unsullied or any of Dany’s forces, that means Cersei’s forces or someone else? This is confusing.

      orange,

      It’s GRRM after all. Never say never with him but in all honesty she dosn’t have to marry anyone, she can give or grant each region to someone that will be loyal to her. But it’s fun to play with ideas. Yara Iron Islands, Gendry Stormlands, Jon or Sansa might be having North. Bending the knee can be done in various ways, not literally bending but sort of swearing loyalty like Ned did with Robert. Although, Jon got some army behind him with the Knights of Vale, the North and possibly Riverlands. They’re not that far and it would make sense for Jon to try establish alliance with them.

        Quote  Reply

    77. Envie: No, that’s how you may be reading the scene and everyone sees it differently but the article confirms (and Luka Nieto addressed it in comments here) that this location is being filmed as part of Dragonstone. Not King’s Landing.

      Confirmed “most probably”. And what are the Golden Cloaks doing on the Dragonstone?

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    78. Gendry is back! I hope he returns to the north with Davos and meets up with Arya!

      Especially since in a prior photo it seems like she was in Stark leather armour.

        Quote  Reply

    79. ghost of winterfell,

      Don’t know if he is really going to fight someone because the person who wrote the article put the fighting part in quotes, ’luchará’. Maybe he thinks Kit is going to have fighting scenes because his character is better known for the fighting scenes.

      We’ll have to wait until monday to know what he’s going to be filming :/

        Quote  Reply

    80. Inga,

      I don’t think those are goldcloaks, I’m not sure how that idea got started as the one I can see at the very end of the video footage looks nothing like a goldcloak in full armor but more like a tall man dressed in goldish/brown long tunic, light colored cloth pants and brown leather boots. That looks like a Lord or Noble’s clothing to me.

      Maybe we’re not talking about the same figure? I’m talking about: http://i.imgur.com/H9udZ4J.png

        Quote  Reply

    81. Flayed Potatoes,

      They filmed the coast of Croatia in a single scene: when they had to get Myrcella to be brought to the same point from which she left.
      As for the other places around KL they can use whatever they want: the coast around KL is also rocky, there are caves etc. And even if some difference occurs, just compare Vaes Dothrak of S1 and S6. Even the temple looked rather different.

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    82. Why would the Stormlands go to an unacknowledged bastard of the Usurper when there is a well-respected, name-dropped Storm Lord available and we know Dany is going to have at least one meeting with that man’s daughter and heir?

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    83. Geralt of Rivia:
      grailking,

      That was more or less towards those leeches Stannis throw into fire. Joffrey, Renly, Robb and Balon. Mel then believed that it will make them fall and others rise as result of it.

      I’m one who thinks it has more then one meaning, but yours is also just as correct.

        Quote  Reply

    84. We are talking of the same person, but the thing he is wearing is an armor made of tiny rings (forgot the English term), not a cloak tunic. You can see it’s that type of armor from the way it moves when the guy goes down the stair. And that type of armor is exactly what is worn by the Gold Cloaks and no-one else. You should have noticed that everyone has a very distinct armor in GoT.

        Quote  Reply

    85. They really are going to make us sweat for that picture of Kit and Emilia lol.But people in Spain are better than the CIA so I have faith.

        Quote  Reply

    86. Nikki:
      Geralt of Rivia,

      In ADWD, she had, what was describe as a miscarriage. A witch telling her she cant have kids and her believing that doesn’t mean it’s true.

      As for the location. It’s Dragonstone. I refuse to believe Tyrion is dumb enough to go to Kingslanding with just Davos.

      She almost certainly had a miscarriage at the end of ADWD and I do believe she will have a child by the end.

      Completely agree about Tyrion, given what we know it would make very little sense for him to come anywhere near KL.

        Quote  Reply

    87. Envie:
      Inga,

      I don’t think those are goldcloaks, I’m not sure how that idea got started as the one I can see at the very end of the video footage looks nothing like a goldcloak in full armor but more like a tall man dressed in goldish/brown long tunic, light colored cloth pants and brown leather boots. That looks like a Lord or Noble’s clothing to me.

      Maybe we’re not talking about the same figure? I’m talking about: http://i.imgur.com/H9udZ4J.png

      I agree, it does not make sense. The location was confirmed to be Dragonstone. There is no indication that the person in shiny boots represents Gold Cloaks. You’d think the camera person would have shown a full shot if that would be the case. They have a shot of a friggin boat going by, for Christ’s sake. I don’t think they would have omitted that important fact.
      Tyrion must be full-fledged insane going to KL without an army. Furthermore I cannot see Dany approving such a foolish quest. She needs him as her advisor.
      Gendry? A gifted blacksmith. Valyrian steel is desperately needed.
      You know, sometimes it is not as complicated.

        Quote  Reply

    88. dragonbringer,

      Age difference is not a problem.

      Maybe she’ll take two husbands like Aegon who is she often compared to, maybe she will just gave him Stormlands like she did with Yara, with him respecting her as Queen. She will be rulling on her own. It could go either way. Nobody in terms of powers is equal to her now or in the future. Fun to speculate.

      Jon got support of the Vale and the North that’s two. not three. Also, the Vale with LF in the shadows, who knows what he’ll do and how Jon’s parentage will play role in this.

        Quote  Reply

    89. Gendry becoming Lord of the Seven Kingdoms (or however many are left in the last season) would be a fitting tribute to Ned Stark’s original plan for him. He’s also as hot as a kidney pie fresh out the oven and could easily catch Dany’s eye the instant he comes ashore with his (pardon the pun) dinghy.

      I also have a theory about Arya running into and falling in love with Hot Pie, but that’s another story for another time, and the puns are just as bad.

        Quote  Reply

    90. dragonbringer:
      I wish people would stop with this marriage thing..
      If jon being King and having support of three kingdoms does not equal to dany’s power..
      How does gendry a bastard ( who many don’t even know existing) is a match to her…

      If you ask me the whole Marriage if it is suppose to happen than its been pretty much confirmed after the casting of characters way back in season 1 ..kit and Emilia being of same age and Maisie and Joe

      Maggie,

      Maggie,

      I dont see What does wanting to take back the throne have to do with her not faulting children for their father’s actions.. She can take the throne and still can forgive them..
      She is doing it as a duty for her entire family and ancestors since she isthe last targaryen ..

      Even in books her gripe is not that the rebels killed her father but they killed her entire family including aegon and rhaenys..and the anger never went into the children or family as a whole…

      Joe is the same age as Kit.

        Quote  Reply

    91. Nikki,

      I agree about books but what about show? They just said that she can’t and I thought they might include this aspect.

      It would’ve been interesting but Dany really just can hand regions to people, they would respect her rule.

      It’s for sure Dragonstone and there was the bit that Unsullied are part of this. And other one about Kit fighting here but not sure about his. Not the best way to start negotiations.

      Jon and Arya? Eww hope not. Incest happened even in the Stark family and but these two think of each other as brother and sister.

      mandzipop,

      Didn’t know that. Age is fine.

        Quote  Reply

    92. jdtargstark,

      Not to even mention what Dany’s father did to Lord Rickard and Brandon Stark. That was even worse, the Baratheons and the Starks wouldn’t even have thought about “usurping” the throne if Dany’s wacko dad did not decide to decimate House Stark. So Dany has really nothing to forgive. Her golden brother was the one who was planning on taking down dear old dad in the first place.

        Quote  Reply

    93. Nikki,

      Refusal to believe is not the best thing, when it comes to any kind of analysis. One way or another it’s already confirmed that Davos and Tyrion will go from Dragonstone to some other place (in the neighborhood apparently), and there is no other place near Dragonstone accessible by a small boat than KL.
      Or you assume that those two will be simply going on a fishing trip? LOL

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    94. lol I knew people would start pairing up Daenerys and Gendry. She’d gain absolutely nothing from him. He’s an unrecognized bastard (no one, but a handful of people, knows who he is) with no penny to his name, no loyalists, no armies, no reputation, no achievements. He’s a nobody.

        Quote  Reply

    95. mandzipop,

      I know But it doesn’t look like that right…same goes for jojen reed actor he was too old but looked very young ..

      When we think about gendry do we think about him as equal age of dany and jon or equal to arya’s age

        Quote  Reply

    96. HotPinkLipstick,

      Because Gendry clearly has the best claim, despite being a bastard.

      An oath of fealty in return for legitimizing him is a simple way to peacefully secure the loyalty of the Stormlands.

      And Lord Tarth has only Brienne as an heir and she is sworn to serve the Starks.

      Why would they give the Stormlands to an old man with no heir to inherit the title?

      Brienne and her father (whose name-dropping I agree was deliberate) will probably be used to support Gendry’s claim.

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    97. Actually, Tywin brought a smith over from Volantis to forge Oathkeeper and Widow’s Wail. So unnamed Volantene blacksmith can do it.

        Quote  Reply

    98. Geralt of Rivia:
      Nikki,

      I agree about books but what about show? They just said that she can’t and I thought they might include this aspect.

      It would’ve been interesting but Dany really just can hand regions to people, they would respect her rule.

      Jon and Arya? Eww hope not. Incest happened even in the Stark family and but these two think of each other as brother and sister.

      mandzipop,

      Didn’t know that. Age is fine.

      The only thing the showrunners have said is that Dany believes the dragons are the only children she’ll have. They never said that she can’t have kids, just that she believes she can’t. I think that’s why we will see part of MMD’s prophecy coming true so the audience will figure it out before her the way the readers have figured it out before her.

        Quote  Reply

    99. HotPinkLipstick,

      He only re-forged the steel. He didn’t create it from scratch. Nobody knows how to do that, otherwise Valyrian steel wouldn’t be so rare.

      Tywin would’ve just paid that smith for some, rather than relying on Ned Stark dying and leaving Ice lying around King’s Landing in order to get his hands on some.

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    100. Ramsay’s 20th Good Man,

      No. Just no. Gendry does not have the best claim. He is an unverified, unacknowledged bastard who looks like Renly. You could troll through Fleabottom and find ten other guys to say they are Robert’s bastards who would have just as much proof as Gendry does.

      I get that he’s a fun character, but no one in the Stormlands will give two shits about him and certainly won’t follow him.

      And Dany, of all people, will probably be just fine with Brienne inheriting the Evenstar title. Brienne isn’t going to be a glorified bodyguard for life.

        Quote  Reply

    101. HotPinkLipstick,

      He was only reforging an existing VS sword though. I don’t know how Gendry reforging existing swords will matter to the story.
      I think it’s more likely he will matter because he is the last person with Baratheon blood alive.

        Quote  Reply

    102. dragonbringer:
      If you ask me the whole Marriage if it is suppose to happen than its been pretty much confirmed after the casting of characters way back in season 1 ..kit and Emilia being of same age and Maisie and Joe

      Despite his baby face, Joe is only a year younger than Kit and Emilia.

      Maisie is a decade younger than all three of them.

        Quote  Reply

    103. dragonbringer,

      Correct me if iam wrong Ned stark never planned making gendry lord of anything. He chose stannis right ..

      Oh jeez, you’re totally correct. Don’t know what fan fic that came from. 😉

        Quote  Reply

    104. HotPinkLipstick,

      Yes, Gendry does have the best claim. That’s just reality.

      He is Robert Baratheon’s son. All he needs is to be legitimized and gather support.

      With the support of the King in the North, Stannis’s former Hand and a prominent Storm Lord (thanks to Brienne) his claim would be very strong. If Daenerys agreed to legitimize him then his claim would be unquestionable.

      We don’t know and don’t care about any of Robert’s other possible bastards. And none of them would have the endorsement of Kings, Lords, knights and so on.

      We do know, however, that Davos could convince Jon, Brienne and Daenerys (or her advisers. Tyrion was Hand of the King when Joffrey tried to slaughter all of Robert’s bastards) that he is Robert’s heir.

      As we have seen repeatedly throughout this show, the key to power is having the means to exert it.

      With the backing of some of our other main characters there’s no reason why the Storm Lords wouldn’t accept Gendry as the heir to the Stormlands.

        Quote  Reply

    105. Inga:

      I don’t think it matches either, certainly not enough to say that it is 100%. If you watch some clips of the gold cloaks next to that image it’s hard to say they’re the same. The gold cloaks armor is pretty bulky full chainmail, includes the rather large, draping cloak that billows when they move, and a hanging chainmail face guard, not to mention a sword. There has been quite a bit of chainmail armor on random people during the course of the show, if that’s what this even is as it’s hard to tell. It’s most definitely not kingsguard armor.

        Quote  Reply

    106. Ramsay’s 20th Good Man:
      ghost of winterfell,

      It is an infuriating assumption that makes absolutely no sense and would be an awfully contrived plot device, but it keeps rearing its head for some reason.

      LOL, I agree!!! Just as verkacked as Dany marrying him…sigh…
      Or someone thinks she knows it all and her POV is correct.

        Quote  Reply

    107. Geralt of Rivia:
      Maggie,

      Don’t think she’ll marry both or even needed to. She might give Gendry Stormlands, Jon agrees to swear fealty to her in exchange for support against white walkers. Don’t know how it would work out really double marriage.

      The North is a huge part of Westeros and the Long Night will impact each Kingdom. The White Walkers are a threat to everyone south of the Wall. if Daenerys wants to rule over Westeros and for it not to be a wasteland with everyone being undead, it’s her duty to help protect it. Jon shouldn’t have to ask for it or swear her the loyalty of the North as some payment as if it doesn’t concern her and her plans for her future in the first place. Her assistance is not some grand favour, it’s her obligation. If she wants the place, she has to work for it.

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    108. A claim to a Major House requires some sort of proof. Gendry has one. Who is going to verify him? His non-existent mother? A smuggler with half a hand? Even Gendry didn’t think he was Robert’s bastard.

      The characters in the story don’t know what we, the readers of the story, know. Why would anyone, Brienne, Selwyn, that guy over there standing by a rock, the local oar-maker, some woman selling shoes on the street, support some kid who has been farting around for three seasons? Oh wait, they wouldn’t.

      And again, the Stormlords aren’t going to give two shits about this kid who has never been trained to lead and can’t verify his parentage.

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    109. HotPinkLipstick:
      A claim to a Major House requires some sort of proof. Gendry has one. Who is going to verify him? His non-existent mother? A smuggler with half a hand? Even Gendry didn’t think he was Robert’s bastard.

      The characters in the story don’t know what we, the readers of the story, know. Why would anyone, Brienne, Selwyn, that guy over there standing by a rock, the local oar-maker, some woman selling shoes on the street, support some kid who has been farting around for three seasons? Oh wait, they wouldn’t.

      And again, the Stormlords aren’t going to give two shits about this kid who has never been trained to lead and can’t verify his parentage.

      We need a Like button. ???

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    110. Congratulations Luka on joining the writing team of WotW! You’ve always been one of my favourite commentators to read as you write eloquently and always come up with some interesting points, so it is very much deserved, and I’m delighted for you (and look forward to reading many more of your articles here).

      Intriguing news, great first post! One thing I am really pumped about in Season 7 is all these characters interacting, and storylines converging. It’s going to be epic!

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    111. orange:
      There’s been rumors all over social media Kit Harington is in the same hotel as Emilia Clarke. And I believe one even said they saw the two of them having breakfast or something. But of course…amazingly, like any good Bigfoot sightings, no camera in the moment of truth.

      Rumour mill is going crazy. Kit’s been spotted in London today.

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    112. grailking,

      Maybe we’re both right. A lot of scenes do have a double meaning.

      Glad we’ll see Gendry and hopefully he’ll be reunited with Arya later on.

        Quote  Reply

    113. Newbietothegame: I agree, it does not make sense. The location was confirmed to be Dragonstone.There is no indication that the person in shiny boots represents Gold Cloaks. You’d think the camera person would have shown a full shot if that would be the case. They have a shot of a friggin boat going by, for Christ’s sake. I don’t think they would have omitted that important fact.
      Tyrion must be full-fledged insane going to KL without an army. Furthermore I cannot see Dany approving such a foolish quest. She needs him as her advisor.
      Gendry? A gifted blacksmith. Valyrian steel is desperately needed.
      You know, sometimes it is not as complicated.

      Totally agree with you here. I don’t think this is a Goldcloak.

      Sure that costume looks very like the goldcloaks from a distance and the actor is definitely wearing mail from the movement of the fabric. But there’s one thing missing. A GODDAMN GOLD CLOAK. Clue’s in the name. And if he/she is carrying their helmet then they’d sure as hell be carrying or wearing the cloak..as are Davos and Tyrion.

      For all we know it could be Brienne, Gendry (no clue what he’d be doing there) or even one of Dany’s new household guard/ Queensguard.

      They’re on Dragonstone from the looks of things according given the reports we have, and regardless of various theories here and elsewhere.

      Davos is clearly preparing to leave the island-most likely to join a larger ship offshore and possibly with a cache of obsidian (which was likely the reason he went there in the first place). There’s clearly NO indication of any conflict (quite the opposite) so lets now put to bed the theories of Jon and Dany being at war…

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    114. maeve,

      You raised some god points. It’s in her nature to look after them too. As it was said here, Dany is above all a rescuerer. Might be that they agree to some alliance but don’t know than how Gendry plays in it. Double marriage would be a problem. It wsn’t for Aegon who married his sisters. So bloodline was kept pure and it belonged to Targ family. Truly interesting to what these negotiations will be about.

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    115. Jack Bauer 24:
      Can anyone make out the dialogue in the Tyrion/Davos scene?

      The only thing I heard were the folks with the camera. I believe they were too far away to pick up any dialog.

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    116. maeve: The North is a huge part of Westeros and the Long Night will impact each Kingdom. The White Walkers are a threat to everyone south of the Wall. if Daenerys wants to rule over Westeros and for it not to be a wasteland with everyone being undead, it’s her duty to help protect it. Jon shouldn’t have to ask for it or swear her the loyalty of the North as some payment as if it doesn’t concern her and her plans for her future in the first place. Her assistance is not some grand favour, it’s her obligation. If she wants the place, she has to work for it.

      This!!

        Quote  Reply

    117. maeve,

      So if north wants the help of other kingdoms and stand united then they better stand united as one instead of a lone kingdom..
      Because we know they don’t have a chance of winning if they stand alone

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    118. Arya Serious,

      Oh I can see now I thought you guys were talking about the Kingsguard. And one of the guys in video has the helmet on his hand. They’re definitely gold cloaks. What they’re doing in Dragonstone!?

        Quote  Reply

    119. Geralt of Rivia,

      Nobody alive knows how to forge VS swords. There are around 4 people in the world, including that Volantene smith, who know how to rework an existing VS sword.

        Quote  Reply

    120. Clob,

      I won’t argue. The dude in chainmail armor may be a “city guard” catching a suspiciously looking person mentioned in the casting call, or someone else. But what about the overall purpose of Tyrion and Davos going somewhere on a small boat? Fishing? OK, I can accept this as an alternative version…

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    121. Maybe Gendry is being brought in to see if he can forge weapons and / or armor out of obsidian? He has much more smithing experience than he has “being a lord” experience. I don’t know, and would be fine with being proven wrong, but I just don’t see him taking over the Stormlands or marrying Daenerys. But, anything that de-rails the Jon / Dany theories makes me happy 😉

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    122. Myname,

      Yeah doesn’t help that they all have cloaks lol! KG is white and CW is gold :). I wonder if Tyrion somehow managed to keep some of these people in his pocket! Maybe he still has friends after all? Long shot I know with crazy Cersei running around with a crown and no kids to keep her leveled.

        Quote  Reply

    123. dragonbringer,

      He is the last person with Baratheon blood. So maybe somebody will try to put him up as the next Baratheon, whether they succeed or not.
      Or maybe he is being brought back just so that he can meet Arya in the future. There are other possibilities than forging VS swords out of nowhere.

        Quote  Reply

    124. ghost of winterfell,

      In the books that reforging was done by gendry’s master ..so a lot of people thinking that he transformed this knowledge to gendry and he will reforge the oathbreaker and widows wail back into ice as light bringer..

      I never understood the need for this since two swords are better than one and the fact that we never get to see about what happened with widows wail

      On topic of costumescostumes that’s been discussed up thread.. Dany has been travelling lots of new places and been a part of new cultures and same goes for tyrion ..whereas jon doesn’t meet any new cultures or go that many places…he did have wildlings costumes though and now is stark gear..same for Davos

        Quote  Reply

    125. dragonbringer,

      Again, that’s reforging, which really adds nothing. What’s the point of reforging swords into different swords? And yeah, I really doubt anybody is going to rejoin Oathbreaker and Widow’s wail. It seems like wishful thinking, tbh.

        Quote  Reply

    126. ghost of winterfell:
      Newbietothegame,

      Why do people assume Gendry will know how to forge Valyrian steel? Nobody alive knows how to do that.

      Because he was a very skilled apprentice under Tobho Mott. Tobho was the one that reforged Ice into Widow’s Wail and Oathkeeper in the books. Tobho is very skilled and learned in Qohor where some blacksmiths claim they know how to forge Valyrian steel. It can be assumed Gendry learned a lot from Tobho and perhaps with some additional knowledge can learn the process. That’s why Sam and his book-learnin’ is included in theories about Gendry and Valyrian steel.

        Quote  Reply

    127. ghost of winterfell,

      I was one of the people who believed we will never see him again in show ..so imagine my surprise ..

      I dont think anyone is going to legitimise him..Only thing I now have is that there will be something with arya and him …

        Quote  Reply

    128. TargyMcTargface,

      Gendry was not apprenticed to the man who reforged Ice into Oathkeeper and Widow’s Wail. Tywin called him in from Volantis or something like that. The man Gendry was apprenticed to lived in Kings Landing.

        Quote  Reply

    129. dragonbringer,

      He’s going to Dragonstone for a reason. Either he will be legitimized or VS swords. If Arya was main or the only point of his return, why make him part of plot in Dragonstone and KL. Why not with Arya straight away? They’ll meet but there is something else in play.

        Quote  Reply

    130. Geralt of Rivia,

      Yes, a lot of scenes have double meaning, and Melisandre is known for misinterpreting things. Gedry’s blood can and most probably will be related to making and unmaking the kings (or queens), but not in a way Melisandre imagined: he will be either the leader of the KL revolt, or the last victim that will make the commoners to overthrow Cersei (I lean towards the first option though).
      And now I only think what was the gods’ plan for poor Shireen? Maybe, if she remained in Castle Black, she would have wormed the atmosphere and the coup against Jon would have been prevented? Damn, you Mel!..

        Quote  Reply

    131. Inga:
      Nikki,

      Refusal to believe is not the best thing, when it comes to any kind of analysis. One way or another it’s already confirmed that Davos and Tyrion will go from Dragonstone to some other place (in the neighborhood apparently), and there is no other place near Dragonstone accessible by a small boat than KL.
      Or you assume that those two will be simply going on a fishing trip? LOL

      Umm… how about, say, to a ship anchored out in the bay where they could then travel further?? Come on now, Inga, you can’t come up with your theories and then ignore other possibilities. So you think Tyrion and Davos are sneaking into King’s Landing to lead/start a civil uprising. Fine. It does sound like a foolish act for an easily recognizable dwarf in KL to go into KL, and all the civilians of said city already should be uprising as they already hated Cersei before she blew up a chunk of their city, and beloved HS and queen. You can go with that, but there are other possibilities.

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    132. HotPinkLipstick,

      I’ve already answered all the points you raise. For some reason you’ve chosen to ignore it all.

      What proof was there that Joffrey was Robert’s son? What proof was there that he wasn’t?

      None.

      But the Lords of the Seven Kingdoms still went to war over the issue.

      All it took was the word of a respected Lord (Ned Stark) and the Storm Lords were only too happy to rally to Renly’s and then to Stannis’s side against the supposed rightful heir.

      Answer me this: do you think that Davos could convince Jon Snow that he knows of the whereabouts of one of Robert’s bastard sons?

      I say, unquestionably yes, he could.

      There you go. Gendry now has the endorsement of the King in the North, on top of the endorsement of Stannis Baratheon’s former Hand, a Knight of the Realm and the man who saved Storm’s End from capture during the Rebellion.

      Do you think that Davos (plus Jon and/or Sansa) could convince Brienne to petition her father to endorse Gendry’s claim? I think so, yes.

      Do you think that Davos (and Brienne) could convince Tyrion, let’s say, that Gendry was one of the bastards that Joffrey tried to have killed while Tyrion was serving as Hand of the King? Yes, I think they could.

      So, there you go. There’s the potential support of a King, the Hand of the Queen, a Lord, a Lady and the Hand of the Stormlands’ former ruler.

      Honestly, I don’t know how anybody who has been paying attention could overlook some of the most basic power dynamics that have been outlined throughout the show.

      “Power resides where men believe it resides”.

      All Gendry would need is the backing of powerful allies to assert his claim. And, as I’ve repeatedly outlined now, he could potentially gain the support of some very powerful people.

      The characters in the show don’t need to know what the viewer knows. They only need to know what the other characters know and tell them. And Davos believes that Gendry is Robert’s son. Everything else follows from there.

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    133. JPatch:
      Clob,

      In the show, Gendry’s mentor and the man who reforges Ice are NOT the same person.Tywin summons someone from Volantis to reforge Ice.

      On the SHOW, yes, because it probably sounded way cooler than Tywin saying he drug this scrub blacksmith out of the slums to reforge this mystical steel into two magnificent family swords.

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    134. moiaf,

      Either way I just can’t see her getting pregnant. Pregnancy taks few months and white walkers will attacking them. She will play a part in this fight. Also, fighting while she is pregnant is not the best way. Or getting pregnant and then fighting. We have like 13 episodes for bunch of things. How they’re going to manage Dany pregannt, than cary her child, give a birth and than fight?

        Quote  Reply

    135. Well this is great confirmation, though we’ve already had word of all this floating around – great that Gendry is coming back.

        Quote  Reply

    136. This article gives me life. I’m so excited about Gendry returning. I always shipped him and Arya. <3 But who knows how things will turn out next season!

        Quote  Reply

    137. Inga,

      Clob,

      Added to that, some of these theories are based on exaggeration, misinterprtauon and fabrication.. there is no report on Tyrion and Davos leaving and going anywhere together (certainly not KL), or that Davos will instigate some sort of KL uprising- based on a scene where Tyrion saw Davos paying someone in S2 to diss him publically (on another thread- and fabricated).

      It’s fine to have theories, even fine to change them every 5 minutes, but when they become completely ludicrous and based on falsehoods then they lose credibility.

        Quote  Reply

    138. Rhaenys Stark,

      These polls represents fraction of our fandom but sure Jon is a really popular character. Over the course of last three seasons, ha raised quite a bit. Until then it was Dany and Tyrion. DAKINGINTHENORF

        Quote  Reply

    139. Arya Serious,

      Hi! I didn’t think it was either until I looked at the pic gallery. Look at the last pic of the gold cloak holding the crowd back. Looks super similar!

      By coincidence, I just happen to be watching that episode, “The Old Gods and the New,” right now, and an outstanding one it is. 😉

        Quote  Reply

    140. Geralt of Rivia:
      dragonbringer,

      He’s going to Dragonstone for a reason. Either he will be legitimized or VS swords. If Arya was main or the only point of his return, why make him part of plot in Dragonstone and KL. Why not with Arya straight away? They’ll meet but there is something else in play.

      Because they don’t want Arya to meet him at this point? She probably needs to do other things before she can meet him.

        Quote  Reply

    141. Ramsay’s 20th Good Man,

      Sorry, but you totally misinterpret the power dynamics and the motivations behind the attempts to overthrow Joffrey. These attempts were primarily caused by the fact that Joffrey was totally unfit to rule and Cersei was endorsing his cockiness as much as she could. Him being a bastard was just an excuse – Renley was even ready to ignore that thinking that the boy could be controlled, if they could isolate him from Cersey. And later lords rallied behind Renley with no legitimate claim whatsoever simply because they thought that Stannis might be even worse than Joffrey, etc. Yes, power resides where people believe it resides, but people can be very creative when making theories supporting their beliefs.

        Quote  Reply

    142. Arya Serious:
      Envie,

      Hi! I didn’t think it was either until I looked at the pic gallery. Look at the last pic of the gold cloak holding the crowd back. Looks super similar!

      http://gameofthrones.wikia.com/wiki/City_Watch

      Yes I have looked at the goldcloaks uniform for comparison but I just don’t see the similarity in the actor seen in that video other than the color. I don’t even think it’s chainmail though. To me it looks like heavy material similar to what we see other noble lords and knights wearing as part of their ‘skirt’ pieces at the bottom over their legs.

      The bigger argument here, is why so many of you think this is King’s Landing when Luka Nieto has stated in the article he wrote as well as in a comment reply to another poster here that Los Siete Reinos in Spain is confirming the three filming sites (Zumaia) are being dressed/filmed as Dragonstone.

      I mean, I guess it’s valid to doubt LSR and Javi. They haven’t been right about everything in past seasons – but they have been right more often than not. There would have to be a lot more compelling filming evidence to support it being King’s Landing to me. The few seconds we glimpse another character (who’s head has been cut off in the video) isn’t enough to say who it is or where they are located. I tend to believe LSR reporting here, backed by Luka Nieto and WotW until it’s proven otherwise.

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    143. Geralt of Rivia,

      Dany can get pregnant after the war and call her firstborn son Drogo – that’s how Drogo will return to her. And afterwards she will live ever unhappily trying to figure out how to pay back the Iron Bank all the loans the Seven Kingdoms have accrued during all these wars. LOL

        Quote  Reply

    144. Myname,

      OMG I just laughed so hard reading that! I know this isn’t how you meant it but I have red hair and my husband jokes with me that all redheads are cousins so you saying “do you know him” put me in a fit of laughter! But no I’m not sure who he is. I’m sure someone will find it today they always do ?

        Quote  Reply

    145. ghost of winterfell,

      They obviously need Gendry for something important at Dragonstone because they would not pout Gendry there for fun. They need to make every scene count and especially since they’re cutting out stuf to finish it in 8th seasons.

      Inga,

      People think she’ll die fighting white walkers, really can’t see both Jon and Dany surviving or living afterwards together at KL or some small place. Fighting while being pregnant in her situation is risky thin to do.

        Quote  Reply

    146. JPatch,

      Gender was apprenticed to Tobho Mott in KL and in the show he is an older guy. The one in 401 is a younger guy from Volantis from what it says on the wikia (I always thought Quohor or however it is spelled). I don’t think they named him in the show but I think either in the show or the lore from the show Tywin says he brought in someone special to do it.

        Quote  Reply

    147. ghost of winterfell,

      Honestly, I’d hold off on thinking this is 100%. The “admission” is in a private message. It’s possible someone made a fake screenshot where he supposedly admits this.

      Considering he said in recent days (warning potential spoiler):

      “Tyrion and davos are going on a secret mission to kl, There they meet gendry”, that’s an awfully good guess about a character not seen in 3 years that now seems to fit with the above news, for supposedly making something up.

        Quote  Reply

    148. orange:
      ghost of winterfell,

      Honestly, I’d hold off on thinking this is 100%. The “admission” is in a private message. It’s possible someone made a fake screenshot where he supposedly admits this.

      Considering he said in recent days (warning potential spoiler):

      No, he posted a video to prove it to the sceptics

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GuW_mfyHZ00

      It’s not forged. Funny how some people doubt this but didn’t doubt the obvious contradictory BS that is the ‘leak’.

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    149. Name *:
      Has this been posted?

      http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-3852426/Game-Throne-s-Peter-Dinklage-Liam-Cunningham-land-unknown-shores-film-series-seven.html

      It looks like there are Gold Cloaks in the fourth picture down.

      Now those DO look more like goldcloaks with the same pointy/veiled helms on. The shots from the video didn’t look like it to me. Here’s the image you’re talking about right?

      http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2016/10/19/17/3985B56B00000578-0-Out_of_the_frying_pan_and_into_the_fire_while_it_s_not_known_whe-m-11_1476894888025.jpg

        Quote  Reply

    150. Maggie,

      I don’t know about Kit but Emilia should be there soon, even if she has no scenes on the beaches of (dragonstone) as they are meant to be filming in Spain next week in (the dragon pit). People have just assumed since they said Jon would be traveling south, he would be in Spain, he might be eventually or it could be at another time or another country.

        Quote  Reply

    151. Flayed Potatoes,

      “Keep the coast on your left side til you reach kings landing.” Isn’t dragon stone an island? I have yet to see dragon stone in an image from KL. I’d assume they aren’t visible to each other. If Henry kept the shore to his left then he has been rowing around DS for 3 seasons. Will be funny when he confronts Davis for telling him that. “Did what you said and here I am. WHY?!?” Gendry*

        Quote  Reply

    152. maeve,

      I saw the video. I honestly don’t know, what to think though. Is it not possible he was telling the truth and freaked out how much it exploded? And now is trying to cover himself.

      It was in additional messaging before any news about Dinklage and Cunningham came out by the way, that he said Tyrion and Davos will meet for a secret mission in King’s Landing. There they will run into Gendry. This looks to be exactly what is happening. Don’t you think that’s an awfully good and specific guess for it to be totally made up? Would you have guessed that would happen before the season started? Especially since it surrounds a character not seen since the third season? Yes we had knowledge Dempsie would have a role in the season, but he appears to have guessed 100% on the money what that role is. If he truly just guessed it, then perhaps he should play the lottery.

        Quote  Reply

    153. Ramsay’s 20th Good Man,

      Because it’s ridiculous.

      Can you prove I’m not the illegitimate son of Robert Baratheon? NO. I don’t think you can. That might have been my father’s name, but it might not have been my father’s name. You can’t prove anything.

      Just because no one can prove my father isn’t Robert Baratheon doesn’t mean anyone will accept that he is. Again, you’re making arguments based on what readers know and not what the characters know. Under your thinking, Jon could have grabbed Olly by the scruff of his neck, declared him the illegitimate son of Stannis Baratheon and named him the rightful heir of Storm’s End. Power resides where people think it resides and it’s unfreakinglikely that anyone is going to think power resides with a lowborn bastard with no discernible leadership skills.

      Furthermore, I don’t think Davos, the man who supported Stannis, the man who support Stannis during the time he knocked of Renly with a smoke monster, is going to be able to convince Brienne of Tarth that some rando is really the heir to the Stormlands.

      Moreover, why would anyone bother to support Gendry, of all people. Gendry. A lowborn blacksmith of questionable parentage. The way to rally the Storm Lords is to convince someone they respect to side with Dany. Someone with a long history of being a “good man” and “good soldier.” Someone they’ve known and respected for years. If you want the Storm Lords, you’re going to have to go through the Evenstar, Selwyn Tarth, not through Gendry.

      Gendry is an adorable woobie of nice muscles and stupid hair, but he’s not a leader, nor is he a rallying point.

        Quote  Reply

    154. Jenny,

      Yep, many people weren’t pleased with the way Arya’s Braavos arch ended and Dany’s arc in Meereen (and Essos as a whole) was really drawn out. It will definitely be interesting to see if this bracket remains the same by the time next season ends..

        Quote  Reply

    155. orange,

      It doesn’t look like it at all. It’s Dragonstone. And there’s no mention of Gendry being on Dragonstone with others in those spoilers and we now know he will be there. The leak is nothing more than illogical and inconsistent BS mixed with a few educated guesses.

        Quote  Reply

    156. Maggie,

      I don’t think she hates people with the just the same last name just look at Tyrion and Jon wasn’t born until after the war. She knew her father was a monster, who needed to die but what she won’t look past is the slaughter of her family aka the Mountain even reanimated, that would be probably the person she would hate the most, practically everyone else involved is now dead. I look forward to seeing Dany and Jamie’s reaction to each other, it could go any way. I imagine that could be quite a heart wrenching scene wherever it leads.

        Quote  Reply

    157. orange,

      oh and it’d make no sense to try to cover himself in a pm to a single poster, he’d have done it publicly then. he’d also have been a right dumbass to think it wouldn’t explode. he came clean about his bs to that person because he had his fun trolling the fandom and wanted to have a laugh with someone about it.

        Quote  Reply

    158. Name *,

      Yup, we got ourselves some Gold-cloaks, people… back to the drawing board! ?

      Ok so is this one isolated scene, intended to be in KL, even though the remainder of the beach scenes are posing as Dragonstone?

      It can’t be Dragonstone as the city watch wouldn’t surely leave KL.

      So I’m guessing this could possibly be a late S7 scene where Davos leaves KL, perhaps after the Dragonpit scene. It’s clear Dany has secured KL by this point.

      Seriously I’m reconsidering trying to even theorise cos just about everything I propose turns out to be wrong! ??

        Quote  Reply

    159. Myname,

      Definitely two GCs, they have chain mail visors and the shape of the one in the shade is an exact match for the GC helms.

      There’s a third guy with Davos/Tyrion as well as another in a pale green tunic to the right of the pic, with the crew.

      Could one of these be Joe Dempsie? Impossible to tell from that distance.

      Hypetastic!! ?

        Quote  Reply

    160. The helmets from those guys look like Baratheon men, curiously… But that doesn’t make much sense, does it? Unless Stannis left a few guys to hold the castle, which I guess does make sense. We’ll see. At any rate, I can’t see how that could be King’s Landing, even if those happen to be part of the City Watch. The location looks absolutely nothing like King’s Landing. They don’t even share a basic climate, or geology.

        Quote  Reply

    161. OK. I changed my mind after re-watching the video several times: Tyrion and Davos indeed may be LANDING, not leaving: there is a trace of the boat been pulled out of the water in the sand, and it looks like Davos is preparing to tie the boat to a peg he also has. Besides that, you can see some guy spraying water on the nose of the boat, so it could look right out of the waves. But I still wonder why the boat is covered with a cloak? Maybe Tyrion was hiding under it and then threw the cloak backwards?
      And afterwards they look to be filming the scene where Davos is going down the stairs and Tyrion looks like waiting for him and then both of them look back rather abruptly (like someone called them?) and then the big group with the men in chainarmor rush down the stairs.
      Maybe they are filming to different scenes: landing and an attempt to reach the boat before being noticed by some city guards (assumption based on the casting calls + outfit).
      Tried to be open for other theories, but can’t see anything else but a secret mission out of major despair. Under normal circumstances two Hands wouldn’t be travelling on their own and I’ll say no more.

        Quote  Reply

    162. HotPinkLipstick,

      They melted down a previously made large Valyrian Sword that belonged to Ned Stark and made it into two.
      A simple blacksmith can’t make it from scratch, they need dragon fire and ancient witchcraft spells.

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    163. I haven’t read the books, so any help on this question would be appreciated-

      Has there ever been a blacksmith with King’s blood? That is to say, not just Robert’s bastard, but doesn’t Gendry also carry Targ blood?

      Maybe that has something to do with making valerian steel?

      Also, CONGRATS Luka! ?

        Quote  Reply

    164. Geralt of Rivia,

      The show runners have stated before that Dany BELIEVES she can’t conceive, that to me is quite telling.
      Also agree that in the book she has now lost her infertility after that miscarriage and poisoned berries.

        Quote  Reply

    165. HotPinkLipstick,

      It’s really not ridiculous at all. It’s entirely in keeping with everything that has been depicted on the show so far.

      Frankly, I’m staggered that anybody who’s been watching this show could fail to comprehend that.

      Under your thinking, Jon could have grabbed Olly by the scruff of his neck, declared him the illegitimate son of Stannis Baratheon and named him the rightful heir of Storm’s End.

      Yes, he absolutely could.

      And if he could convince other powerful/influential people to back Olly’s claim and was willing to go to war to put him in power should the Storm Lords reject that premise then Olly could end up ruling the Stormlands.

      There have been numerous pretenders to thrones and titles throughout real history, who have assumed the identities of people or been used as pawns by those who want to control the throne.

      Obviously, convincing the Storm Lords of the legitimacy of the claim would be extremely unlikely in Olly’s case.

      But in Gendry’s case a trusted adviser of the last ruler of the Stormlands would vouch for him.

      Jon is highly likely to believe that man, meaning that the King of one of the Seven Kingdoms could be willing to back his claim.

      It’s possible that one of the most respected Storm Lords could be convinced that his claim is genuine. I do believe that Brienne could be convinced by Davos, despite their differences. Plus, there’s an outside chance Arya could be around to vouch for Gendry too.

      And if that’s not enough for the Storm Lords, I believe that Daenerys, via Tyrion, could be convinced to legitimize Gendry and back his claim in order to peacefully gain the fealty of the Stormlands.

      Just for the record, I’m not saying that this definitely will happen. But it is undoubtedly possible.

      I certainly do believe that Davos will suggest Gendry as a potential means to rally the Stormlands to Jon’s cause. Otherwise, why would Davos and Gendry even be sharing scenes again? Davos must have sought him out for a reason.

      Can you offer any other explanation for Davos going anywhere near Gendry?

        Quote  Reply

    166. Luka Nieto,

      I do believe now that this one scene is possibly KL as those are definitely goldcloaks due to the helm profile and the chain mail visors. Baratheon helms are not so highly peaked.

      Is it possible that they can use filtering though to better depict KL and also bearing Winter had arrived? There are coves in and around KL, thinking specifically of when Arya escaped the Red Keep in S1.

      Itzurun is obviously DS now due to the set dressing… I had wondered why they’ve used so many beaches I guess this could explain it.

        Quote  Reply

    167. Envie,

      Oh! I wasn’t disputing the location I trust what this site posts over anywhere else!! I was just trying to find the closest thing to what we were seeing in the video as I could. There are probably more comments about this I haven’t caught up on yet cause there are soooo many!

        Quote  Reply

    168. MeeraReed:
      I haven’t read the books, so any help on this question would be appreciated-

      Has there ever been a blacksmith with King’s blood?That is to say, not just Robert’s bastard, but doesn’t Gendry also carry Targ blood?

      Maybe that has something to do with making valerian steel?

      Also, CONGRATS Luka!

      His great grandmother was Rhaelle Targaryen. But Rhaelle wasn’t pure Targ but a Targ-Blackwood. There’s a drop of Targ blood in Gendry.
      There’s no record of blacksmiths with King’s blood.

        Quote  Reply

    169. Ramsay’s 20th Good Man,

      A Pig could also fly across the screen to get from one end of a sty to another and I’m astounded that anyone who watches the show doesn’t realize that, but also doesn’t realize that it’s stupid and pointless to work up a far-fetched theory and silly motivations for a pig to fly across the screen when it’s much more likely that they will have the pig walk from one end of the sty to the other.

      Just because Stannis, who ended up being a total flop, burning his own daughter and having the men who didn’t desert him get slaughtered, trusted Davos doesn’t mean any of the Storm Lords would. Stannis was a failure. OoOO, let’s buy into the ridiculous position of Stannis’ trusted adviser to back a lowborn bastard for a position as lord! That sounds fabulous.

      Or absolutely not.

      Gendry’s a loose end and fan favorite. They are tying him off nicely. Not elevating the character.

        Quote  Reply

    170. We all know who Dany is going to marry, Dany and Jon union has been built up for 20 years. Sam is at the Citadel learnig the secrets of the forge of valyrian steel, Gendry is a great blacksmith… 1+1=2, it’s not that hard to put toghether. I know Jon’s fans are in denial mode right now, but Dany marrying Gendry – a very minor character who was completely absent for years!-?? and Gendry king of Westeros over Jon?? c’mon now…

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    171. Came in late but really happy to see that Luka is now a writer in WOTW!!! Super, Luka! Many congrats to you!!!!!! Feliz por tí 🙂 🙂 🙂

        Quote  Reply

    172. I am excited for Davos and Tyrion convo. I am also curious to see what Gendry role in all this.

      Side note: Rheagar and Mad Kings death were justified. Killing Elia, the kids and hunting Viserys and Daenerys were not. Tywin and Robert only did that to protect his claim. It’s no better than what Joffery did. I’ve always understood Daeny’s hatred for them for this reason.

      I would like to see her reaction Gendry but I doubt they’ll even have a convo.

        Quote  Reply

    173. Ramsay’s 20th Good Man,

      Just to add my thoughts on your point 🙂 …both Ned (best friend) and Stannis (brother) were definitely convinced that Gendry was Robert’s son. Ned died in an effort to expose it he was so convinced. I don’t think it’s so much about legitimizing him for his sake but because he has a bloodline that is special to the story. That’s my belief anyway. He was Roberts son and could be Cersei’s son that supposedly died (someone else’s tinfoil). This is completely nuts but what if they did a quick flashback (like Cersei’s prophecy from Maggie) and it starts as darkness (eyes are closed) a woman singing and when the camera looks up like the eyes are opening it is Cersei singing to him and then Gendry wakes up GASP! Don’t flay me for that snippet it’s fun to speculate!!!

        Quote  Reply

    174. WDT,

      Dany doesn’t need to marry anyone, this isn’t the bachelorette show.

      Sure they’ve mentioned the fact she needs to marry when she gets to Westeros, but when she lands I kinda think she’ll be pretty busy from the get go.

      Jon won’t accept a marriage to his aunt. Period.

        Quote  Reply

    175. HotPinkLipstick,

      Wow! How many times do I have to repeat myself before you grasp the basic point?

      The Storm Lords don’t have to believe only Davos.

      If Davos can convince Jon then Gendry’s claim strengthens from thereon.

      The support of the King in the North, the highly respected Storm Lord that you think will end up ruling the Stormlands, and potential support/legitimization from Daenerys could be enough to convince them.

      Instead of rushing back with another sarcastic response that avoids most of the points I’ve made, why don’t you take a moment to actually consider what I’ve suggested in the context of what has been depicted on the show and what has happened numerous times in the course of real history.

      And if you’re still so adamant that there’s no possibility of Gendry being legitimized or touted as a the heir to the Stormlands perhaps you could kindly clear up the final question in my last comment.

      For what other reason would Davos come into contact with Gendry again?

      Especially with Tyrion in tow?

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    176. I’m trying to think of what would possibly get Tyrion to sneak into KL with just Davos that makes sense. Even if those other men are on their side and just disguised as gold cloaks, what purpose would there be for Tyrion to go with? He could just tell them how to sneak into the Red Keep if that is an objective. There only seems like one reason to sneak in there though and why would Davos go with for that? If they know Gendry is there and that’s the reason to go why wouldn’t Davos and a couple other unknown men go alone and just walk in? I just can’t come up with a reason good enough for Tyrion to risk his life by going there…

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    177. Envie,

      Whoa! Wait a minute…who is the person standing toward the bottom with a suspiciously Littlefinger look to it? It’s just to the bottom right of the screen. And on the other side of the screen I see 2 gold cloaks, Davos, Tyrion and is that Gendry in there in front of the one gold cloak or is it someone else?

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    178. maeve: His great grandmother was Rhaelle Targaryen. But Rhaelle wasn’t pure Targ but a Targ-Blackwood. There’s a drop of Targ blood in Gendry.
      There’s no record of blacksmiths with King’s blood.

      Thank you for this! Could it be possible a blacksmith with King’s blood is *one* of the missing ingredients?

      He’s obviously extremely talented. Maybe if his heating source was unconventional for the time, we could really see what he is capable of.

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    179. Ramsay’s 20th Good Man,

      The Tarths have their own links to both the Baratheons and the Dundarrons before them. That’s before you factor in other speculated family ties. It’s very, very likely that their house is the next in line in the Stormlands. That’s important. Gendry is a bastard who’s also happens to be highly skilled blacksmith, unlike Jon who is an extremely accomplished fighter. He’s not becoming Lord Paramount anytime soon. Nobody would follow a man with no military experience during a time of war, and Dany’s not about to legitmise the illegitimate son of the man who usurped her father’s throne. It serves zero purpose.

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    180. Clob,

      Well there is a chance that Tyrion is sneaking into the Red Keep, with Davos’ smuggling skills being a great asset. He is allied with the one person who knows the secret passageways better the Keep after all.

      That said, it wouldn’t explain the goldcloaks or the fact Varys is absent.

      Like I said, I think this is Davos saying farewell to Tyrion, late season- after KL had fallen.

      But if that’s the case..where’s Brienne, since we had reports he has scenes in the Dragonpit with her…

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    181. maeve,

      Gasp! He has first men (blackwood), valyrian (targ), and Baratheon blood that is a trifecta there! Don’t the Baratheons have the blood of Durran Godsgrief since when the Durrandons were taken out by Targs, didn’t they marry Aegon’s possibly half Targ bastard sibling or cousin to a female from that house’s line?!!

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    182. OMG, so many spoilers! My head is spinning.

      Put me down for those 2 men on the beach as Gold Cloaks. The man that is standing in the sunlight facing the camera has what I first thought was a scarf around his neck. But now I think it’s the chain mail that hangs down from the Gold Cloaks’ helm that kinda bunches around the neck and shoulder.

      Of course, I can also see the resemblance to the Baratheon soldiers; especially the ones that were in the North who wore scarves to protect them from the cold. But I just don’t see how Baratheon soldiers could still be around. Who would they be taking orders from? If this scene is on Dragonstone, why would they still be there if Dany has claimed it as her base? Would she really take the Usurpers’ (both Robert and Stannis) soldiers into her employ? Has a skeleton crew of Baratheon soldiers been hanging around Dragonstone for a year knowing Stannis is dead? For me, it’s a big stretch that the soldiers on the beach are Baratheon men.

      If they are Gold Cloaks, then this scene is probably taking place on the shores of King’s Landing. Maybe Davos and Tyrion are there in search of Gendry? Maybe Davos has already secured dragonglass and now needs an armorer to forge weapons with it. He did tell Gendry to have a bowl of brown for him once he reached King’s Landing. I agree with Inga (I think that’s who said) that our 2 Hands look to be arriving rather than departing. The tracks on the sand are visible and Davos seems to be covering up the boat and preparing to anchor it on the beach. But if this is KL, why in the bloody hell are there no soldiers with Davos and Tyrion?? Davos isn’t much of a fighter and Tyrion even less so. Season 7 is too far away… 🙁

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    183. Cragen,

      Thought of that, but as there was a casting call for:

      City Guard, in his 30’s. The show is casting for a city guard who intercepts a suspicious-looking person on his nightly patrol. They require an RP accent for this one. He’s set to shoot for a week in mid-October. http://watchersonthewall.com/variety-new-roles-cast-game-of-thrones-season-7/

      I think the GC is this newly cast city guard, not Gendry.

      And though the filming happens in broad daylight, they can use a filter and make it look like night (that’s what they did with Bran & Meera being rescued by Uncle Benjen scene too).

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    184. Mel:
      HotPinkLipstick,

      They melted down a previously made large Valyrian Sword that belonged to Ned Stark and made it into two.
      A simple blacksmith can’t make it from scratch, they need dragon fire and ancient witchcraft spells.

      I’m not sure if they need the spells to put ICE back, in the books it’s stated that VS swords have a memory and it tries to keep itself together, so for ICE maybe dragon fire is enough, but for virgin VS spells may be needed.

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    185. Apollo,

      She will marry to strengthen her position on the Iron Throne, she said it herself, dialogue on the show doesnt happen just because.
      Jon holds the north and needs Daenerys forces.
      They didn’t grow up as family, they didn’t even know each other.
      Marriage between members of the family is a common practice in Westeros (Tywin married his cousin, and they did grow up as family), so that excuse is not valid.
      They will unite Westeros under their rule and march to war against the WW.
      They WILL MARRY, it’s the natural progression of their story, whether his fans like it or not. Period.

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    186. Ramsay's 20th Good Man,

      A further thought about Gendry as Lord of the Stormlands: wasn’t the original Baratheon a bastard who was legitimized and placed in power by Aegon the Conqueror? I don’t know how relevant it will be in the show, but the books seem to emphasize the parallels between Aegon I and Dany.

      I find your arguments convincing. I’m not sure it will happen, but it certainly could. If a conquering queen with dragons grants someone a title, picky details like absolute proof of parentage probably become less important than the fact that she has the power to back her choice.

      Luka, I don’t often post, but I do frequently read the comments here, and always enjoy yours. Congrats on the new writing position!

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    187. Clob,

      I’m also skeptical about Tyrion being stupid enough to go back into KL until it’s under Dany’s control, but one motivation does come to mind: a face-to-face meeting with Jaime. This is one of the few things that I think powerful enough to draw Tyrion into KL while Cersei’s still there. Davos’ experience with smuggling would be important here.

      I’m almost always wrong when I speculate about stuff like this, though. But it’s still fun.

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    188. maeve:
      We’re being trolled left and right. Any comment from WOTW on the latest leak frenzy? it’s getting ridiculous

      Seriously, fuck both those trolls.

      I don’t think you can look to Sue for clarification on those leaks, she usually stays out of things like that. She does want us to keep it out of the threads and in the forums, though. Last year, when we got accurate detailed BOTB spoilers and the legendary “Truede” spoilers, WOTW’s stance seemed to be “no comment”. Which I think is the wise move.

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    189. Arya Serious,

      I do think that’s possibly Gendry standing in front of the ‘guard’ (or goldcloak if that’s what it is) and Tyrion and Davos on either side nearest the white screen. As for the guy on the far right side, I don’t know… it’s too hard to tell if they are in costume or just wearing a longer tan jacket.

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    190. Apollo:
      BunBunStark,

      I wonder the same thing. I suspect KL has been liberated by team Dany in this scene.

      Does not make sense. Why would Dany keep the GC around? Those belonged to her enemies. You’d think she have Greyworm and his Unsullied take care of the security in KL.

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    191. BunBunStark: Seriously, fuck both those trolls.

      I don’t think you can look to Sue for clarification on those leaks, she usually stays out of things like that. She does want us to keep it out of the threads and in the forums, though. Last year, when we got accurate detailed BOTB spoilers and the legendary “Truede” spoilers, WOTW’s stance seemed to be “no comment”. Which I think is the wise move.

      Surely because those leaks were true. Wouldn’t it be better to shoot down any fake ones?

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    192. fierce as a wolverine,

      I think you’re right about the origins of House Baratheon. That could hint at a possible nod from the producers towards the history of the House.

      I’m not saying that this will happen either. I’m just touting it as a possibility.

      I do think Davos will suggest Gendry as a means to gains the support of the Stormlands to Jon though, even if it isn’t seen through to completion. Mainly because I can’t think of any other legitimate reason for Davos to come into contact with Gendry again.

      And because, frankly, I’d consider it a bit of an oversight on the writers’ part if, at a time when Jon is searching for as many allies as possible in preparation for the invasion of the White Walkers, Davos didn’t bring up the fact that he knows a potential heir to the Stormlands.

      Setting up a potential alliance between the North, the Vale and the Stormlands also has obvious echoes of Robert’s Rebellion.

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    193. Apollo,

      I don’t know why everyone thinks Dany would be the one offering marriage, if she finds out her and Jon are related she would have no interest in marrying him. Don’t forget it was shown in Qarth that she doesn’t have a high opinion of her own family, she knows her father was a monster, she herself was a conceived in rape, her brother abused her and treated her like his property. The fact that romantically she has shown no interest in lighter hair color instead tanned skin and dark features show she isn’t interested in a Targaryen man.

      If her and Jon become involved in some way I imagine it would be neither knowing at the time they are related.

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    194. fierce as a wolverine,

      Exactly. Tyrion will be going to KL to rescue Jaime, but not him alone. IMO, Dany will be landing on Dragonstone after her first attempt to land in the Stormlands (?) fails, which means that Cersei will be holding many captives from the Danys crew. I’m almost sure Missandei will be among them, and now it looks like Varys too (otherwise why would Tyrion would be going with Davos, and not Varys who knows KL far better). IMO, Cersei will be planning a massive public execution of the captives at the Dragonpit, which will force the united Team-Dragonston to take action in haste. And it will get very very dark, before it gets better as someone from the cast has promised.

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    195. newbietothegame: Does not make sense. Why would Dany keep the GC around? Those belonged to her enemies. You’d think she have Greyworm and his Unsullied take care of the security in KL.

      Another good point, I honestly don’t know.. nothing seems to make sense to me anymore ?

      I would say though that the GCs are just citizens of KL… they’re not Lannister officers they simply serve who pays them.

      But I guess that we’d be just as likely to see Unsullied guarding the city if Dany is occupying it.

      So what else could it be? Tyrion/Davos sneaking in to the Red Keep through Maegors secret tunnels to kill Cersei with the help of Gendry and some GCs?

      Jeez my head hurts!

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    196. maeve: Surely because those leaks were true. Wouldn’t it be better to shoot down any fake ones?

      WotW does not get involved with things posted some place else. We are asked to take those discussions to the forum. Many of us appreciate spoilers like this one posted by Luka, but don’t want to know EVERYTHING. We still want to enjoy the show. I for one believe it takes away from the viewing enjoyment if I would know what would happen. And we would not discuss/argue about the things we think we know. It is half of the fun not knowing and throwing some theory out there. I would miss those heated discussions….well, some subject matters maybe not so much.

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    197. Apollo,

      So what else could it be? Tyrion/Davos sneaking in to the Red Keep through Maegors secret tunnels to kill Cersei with the help of Gendry and some GCs?

      THIS only GC excluded.

      Valonqar is coming.

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    198. Inga,

      But there are GCs there in that scene that need explaining (as well as the other guy with the pale green tunic).

      They could always be Varys’ agents I guess- this is all so confounding.

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    199. Apollo: Another good point, I honestly don’t know.. nothing seems to make sense to me anymore

      I would say though that the GCs are just citizens of KL… they’re not Lannister officers they simply serve who pays them.

      But I guess that we’d be just as likely to see Unsullied guarding the city if Dany is occupying it.

      So what else could it be? Tyrion/Davos sneaking in to the Red Keep through Maegors secret tunnels to kill Cersei with the help of Gendry and some GCs?

      Jeez my head hurts!

      I am right there with you. I am confused as heck. Maybe they try to sneak in and just blow up the Red Keep with Cersei in it? Tyrion knows about the tunnels and the wildfire.

      Argh, I want to know and on the other hand I don’t..
      Let’s all rejoice that filming is in full swing and we are blessed to get spoilers like this. How boring would it be without those. There are not a lot of shows I like to watch. I usually have the news on and do other things.

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    200. moiaf,

      And don’t forget that the mom was Argella Durrandon (married to Orys Baratheon) so wouldn’t they have the Durrandon blood as well?

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    201. Amira,

      I’m not surprised. I was leaning this way too and even posted that he may have faked the denial. The original guy has not been wrong so far. And in fact as I mentioned earlier the developments today make me lean towards the guy being truthful. There is no way he could have randomly guessed today’s developments. No one could have. If you could guess that well you ought to gamble. So at least so far, you have to conclude he has some inside info. The rest? We’ll have to wait and see. But it’s getting more difficult to dismiss.

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    202. newbietothegame,

      I’d wondereded the same thing. Maybe Cersei is holding KL to ransom with wildfire, barring the gates just as Aerys did.

      Team Dany would never risk destroying the city and Dragons are pretty darn useless if there’s a risk of them igniting the whole city.

      I think they’ll fail though and Jaime will do the deed, beating them to it (as commonly thought) after Cersei has burned half the city down.

      If only they still had Mel- Gendry coulda given her some lovin again to make shadow baby 2, with Davos having a hand in slaying yet another pretender to the throne ?

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    203. A very important factor in verifying Gendry’s claim that has not been brought up and is being ignored by those who dismiss it is his looks. Gendry apparently looks so much like Robert at his age that Jon Arryn, Ned and Stannis immediately and (we saw in the case of the latter two) without doubt, recognized him as Robert’s son.

      There are still a lot of lords that would remember well enough what the great Robert Baratheon looked like during his prime years to easily believe that, yuppers, this is his son. Especially when 3 of the people who knew him best recognized him right away.

      Gendry would not be some random, black-haired bastard claiming to be Robert Baratheon’s son. He’s a black-haired bastard who looks just like Robert and the former Hand of Robert’s brother claims he’s Robert’s son.

      In addition to potentially having the support of the King in the North, Queen Daenerys, the Wardeness of the North, a few other Ladies and Lords (such as Theon, Yara, Lady Mormont, Arya, Brienne), yeah… Gendry definitely would have all the political support he’d need.

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    204. Oh my! Just had a thought…if Gendry and Arya get together they will have kids with a magnificent mashup of DNA! Gendry has blood of Targaryen mixed with unknown maternal blood, then that was mixed with Durrandon blood (think the daughter of the Gods, Elenei!!) and then however many layers later gets some Targaryen and Blackwood blood! Blackwoods and Targaryens have prophetic ability (sometimes) and then mix that in with Arya and all of the current magical abilities the Starks now have and those kids would have to take meds to sleep every night lol!! But for real, if Gendry’s mom really was Cersei like some tinfoil suggests then they would have the blood of all the major houses right?! Well almost anyway.

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    205. Ramsay's 20th Good Man: If Davos can convince Jon then Gendry’s claim strengthens from thereon.

      The support of the King in the North, the highly respected Storm Lord that you think will end up ruling the Stormlands, and potential support/legitimization from Daenerys could be enough to convince them

      Let me get this straight. According to you, Davos, former hand of self-proclaimed and follower of Red Priestess, King Stannis, strongly supports Gendry as future Lord of the Stormlands. He convinces Jon, King at Winterfell, of the same. He convinces Brienne (who supported Renly while Davos was all A-OK with Stannis), who convinces her father. They all convince Tyrion, who then convinces Daenerys. Whew!
      How about a far more direct chain of events? Daenerys likes the looks of Brienne. She, Daenerys, bypasses EVERYONE, including daddy Tarth, and elects a WOMAN (gasp!!!) as Lady of the Stormlands! Why not? Did Daenerys not go by her own wishes and counsel over the matter of the Iron Islands and Yara?

      As for your repeated issue as to WHY Gendry would be brought back, I’ll go with the simplest possible answer. He was a blacksmith, and he will have a role doing just that, especially with a bit more knowledge coming in from other sources (perhaps Sam, perhaps Jorah via someone in Essos etc).

      HotPinkLipstick:
      Why would the Stormlands go to an unacknowledged bastard of the Usurper when there is a well-respected, name-dropped Storm Lord available and we know Dany is going to have at least one meeting with that man’s daughter and heir?

      Because she is DAUGHTER (not a son), 😉 and apparently the end-all of her existence is to serve Sansa Stark! LOL!

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    206. JenniferH,

      Actually I just thought of something from AFFC.. Brienne meets Gendry at the inn at the crossroads and thinks she’s seen Renlys ghost. Obviously this didn’t happen on the show (and let’s face it, the two actors look nothing alike), but I wonder if Brienne could play a role in his legitimisation?

      Still unsure what value that would bring (if any)… My reckoning is Gendrys purpose is to fashion Valyrian steel weaponry with dragonflame and Magic (Mel/Marwyn/Sam?)

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    207. I don’t Gendry is being brought back to marry Daenerys or as a possible heir to the Stormlands or anything like that. Ned once said to his then blacksmithing master something like, “If he ever gets tired of wielding a hammer and wants to wield a sword, send him to me.” I think Gendry is going to become a fighter/soldier and maybe earn a knighthood at the end

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    208. orange,

      The original leaker said nothing about Gendry being at Dragonstone, if in fact that is Dragonstone. He also said that Brienne stays in Winterfell all season but we know she goes to the Dragonpit. Some of information is definitely accurate but not all of it.

      His description of Euron in the Dragonpit is absolutely ridiculous.

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    209. Joan,

      Are you serious? First of all, she doesn’t hate her family. Actually, she highly respects Rhaegar. And, contrary to popular belief, mad Targaryens weren’t a common thing, actually a lot of them were great kings and she knows that.
      Second of all, what does she having a relationship with someone tanned skinned has anything to do with her taste in men or her future marriage?? She was forced to marry Drogo and he raped her several times, it wasn’t like she chose to get intimate with him because she liked him.
      “romantically she has shown no interest in lighter hair color” Even when this makes no sense at all and have cero evidence, do you see Jon as blonde or something? He doesn’t have a single Targaryen feature.

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    210. Kay: Let me get this straight. According to you, Davos, former hand of self-proclaimed and follower of Red Priestess, King Stannis, strongly supports Gendry as future Lord of the Stormlands. He convinces Jon, King at Winterfell, of the same. He convinces Brienne (who supported Renly while Davos was all A-OK with Stannis), who convinces her father. They all convince Tyrion, who then convinces Daenerys. Whew!
      How about a far more direct chain of events? Daenerys likes the looks of Brienne. She, Daenerys, bypasses EVERYONE, including daddy Tarth, and elects a WOMAN (gasp!!!) as Lady of the Stormlands! Why not? Did Daenerys not go by her own wishes and counsel over the matter of the Iron Islands and Yara?

      As for your repeated issue as to WHY Gendry would be brought back, I’ll go with the simplest possible answer. He was a blacksmith, and he will have a role doing just that, especially with a bit more knowledge coming in from other sources (perhaps Sam, perhaps Jorah via someone in Essos etc).

      Because she is DAUGHTER (not a son), and apparently the end-all of her existence is to serve Sansa Stark! LOL!

      THIS!!

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    211. Edd,

      Tomorrow I’ll go back to Zumaia. It’s the last day anyone will be able to access the beach before they close it down on Friday. Hopefully everything will be pretty much ready and I’ll be able to report on a largely complete set. Obviously they’re hiding lots of modern elements with prop walls and rocks, which should make the set look more all-around immersive, even without CGI.

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    212. JenniferH,

      In the books maybe, but on the show the actor who plays Gendry doesn’t resemble Robert at all. At the end of the day, if he gets legitimized it will be by royal decree, regardless what he looks like.
      I think his presence on the show has to do with his skills as a blacksmith, and not with his claim as Robert’s bastard, but we’ll see.

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    213. WDT,

      You obviously read the scripts.

      She doesn’t need to marry anyone to strengethen her position. Her position is strong and will be in future. She can take or simply tell him to bend the knee but not literally like Yara did. She even said she might not marry after all. They’re not cousins like Tywin and Joanna, heck Jon and Sansa are cousins. Would they marry? They were never that close. And doubt Jon would be cool with it is another things to consider.

      Uniting Westeros under their rule? It’s not as simple as you think it is. So I’d be careful with stating it as a fact.

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    214. Geralt of Rivia,

      So… she will not marry and when she dies a random character will succeed her, making the whole Targaryen restoration plot (and Jon true parentage by extention) completely pointless, and she will give up the whole north and go help them without asking anything in return because of reasons, and Jon will refuse a marriage that basically favors everyone involved and sentence the whole human race to death because “Eww I won’t marry my hot aunt, who I dont never know and happens to have my same age and the greatest army ever, because Yucky!”.. That makes much more sense…

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    215. Gendry could be Robert’s legitimate son and sitting on the Iron Throne at the moment and it wouldn’t change Daenerys’ plans. The point is, it doesn’t matter because as long as it’s not a Targaryen she’s going after the throne. She doesn’t need to dig up bastards of the Baratheon line to marry as it doesn’t change anything.

      The consideration of marriage would be with current Lords of the regions in order to have him and his bannermen become allies and make it easier. Legitimizing Gendry to be the Lord Paramount of the Stormlands seems a bit unnecessary as it’s not that strong. As it stands currently that would seem to limit the suitors to Jon, Sweetrobin, and possibly the new lord in The Riverlands (a random worthless, ugly Frey? or the married Edmure?). I suppose Jaime could accept the position of Lord of Casterly Rock, but that and marrying Daenerys seems highly unlikely. Euron is obviously out. There’s really only ONE that truly makes any sense…

      I CAN see Gendry being legitimized near the end of the story but not for the purpose of marrying Daenerys.

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    216. Kay,

      So, let me get this straight. Daenerys randomly declares Brienne ruler of the Stormlands, because…?

      She’s a woman?

      She happens to have appeared in her presence out of the blue?

      Because, completely out of character, Brienne begs for the role?

      Seriously, why on earth would that happen?

      Not only is it nonsensical, with absolutely no foundation on the show so far, but it totally overlooks that Brienne has sworn to serve Sansa and Arya. You remember that little stumbling block, right?

      Brienne has been clearly characterized as eager to pledge her life and service to first Renly, then Catelyn and now Sansa. Yet you have decided on the character’s behalf that this is beneath her and that she must be randomly declared ruler of the Stormlands instead, because…reasons?

      Why are you even bringing sex into this anyway? Where has anybody said anything about Gendry or Brienne’s sex being relevant to ruling the Stormlands?

      You’re projecting your own little hang-ups onto a discussion that hasn’t mentioned that matter at all. If you want to make an issue of supposed sexism then talk to somebody else about it, because it’s irrelevant to anything I’ve said on this matter.

      What’s even more laughable than your baseless suggestions of sexism, however, is the fact that you consider Davos and Jon working to legitimize a character who we know would be the direct heir to the Stormlands, and with whom there are numerous symbolic parallels with the history and characters of the story so far, to be more unlikely than Daenerys randomly deciding, completely and utterly out of the blue, that Brienne is to be ruler of the Stormlands.

      Oh, and that Gendry has been brought back because of magical blacksmithing skills which exist purely in the fantasies of people posting on fan forums, as opposed to the question of his lineage which has been clearly established on the show.

      Sure. That makes so much more sense.

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    217. icequinn,

      Well, giving up an island it’s not the same as losing that big chunk of territory that is the North.
      I can’t see Jon bending the knee and I can’t see Dany giving up the North, so the logical solution would be a wedding, I don’t know what is so hard to understand, It’s definetly most likely than those crazy fan theories I hear everywhere.

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    218. WDT,

      Jon is in no position to demand anything from Dany. That he’s king and she’s queen doesn’t mean that they’re equal. She’s Dany. That should be the end of the argument, but if more is needed, Jon is getting the brunt of winter and will be the first to feel the wrath of the Walkers. He needs her help; if she orders him to crawl naked through a sewer, he would have to obey. She doesn’t need his help, and he has no bargaining chips. What can he say? Marry me, or I won’t let you help me? Things don’t work that way.

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    219. Ellie: In the books maybe, but on the show the actor who plays Gendry doesn’t resemble Robert at all.

      Beside the point. First, we don’t know how Robert looked 20 years ago; he may well have resembled Gendry to an extent. Second, in-universe he is supposed to look like Robert because Ned recognised him on sight.

      I also find the arguments put forth by Ramsay’s 20th Good Man convincing. Not that his theory is necessarily true, but it is plausible enough to be a possibility. If Gendry strongly resembles Robert, has the right-hand man of the last Baratheon ruler of the Stormlands confirming his identity, and has the support of some of the most powerful political figures in Westeros (Daenerys and Jon), his claim is at least worth considering.

      It’s worth noting that bloodlines are very important in a feudal society. If Stormlords have to choose between a likely Baratheon bastard and some other lord, it is possible they would choose Gendry because of his blood (+ the support of 2 monarchs and 3 dragons).

      ETA: just remembered another thing. Back in Season 2 Joffrey ordered Gold Cloaks to look for and kill Gendry and other Robert’s bastards. So there are probably quite a few people in the “administration” and among the nobility who know that Robert had a bunch of bastards and that Gendry could easily be one of those bastards.

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    220. Ramsay’s 20th Good Man,
      I brought up the Brienne issue NOT because I think for a second that Daenerys will actually declare her the ruler of the Stormlands, but because of your insistence that Gendry has been brought back only because of his lineage and that a whole, complex chain of events has to happen because it is absolutely vital that there be a Lord of the Stormlands. However, when I offered up a perfectly good alternative as to why he has been brought back, you replied:

      Ramsay’s 20th Good Man: Oh, and that Gendry has been brought back because of magical blacksmithing skills which exist purely in the fantasies of people posting on fan forums, as opposed to the question of his lineage which has been clearly established on the show.

      Blacksmithing skills DO exist on the show, as also his lineage. Why should one be far more important than the other? I have NEVER, EVER been on a fan forum, except this one and this one is more than enough for me. But your choice of words in your reply clearly tells me that I do not wish to engage further with you on this.

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    221. Luka Nieto,

      Hi! I just did the translation on the one with the artwork pic and verbiage on the side. It gets a bit jumbled with google translate but it’s the phrasing differences is all. I wish I could’ve copied and pasted would’ve taken way less time lol! But all in all the picture depicts what the words say so save your time if you were wanting to translate it hehe! I totally felt like Raphie from a Christmas Story getting the “don’t forget to drink your ovaltine” message on his Little Orphan Annie Secret Message Decoder lol!! And then my husband sat down when I was done, looked at me completely crazy and said did you really just sit down, write a bunch of jibberish on paper then type it in to translate? And I just said, why yes I did! Can’t copy text from a photo dude!

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    222. Ramsay’s 20th Good Man,

      uhm… you know that valyrian steel forging involves magic right? And that Sam is at the Citadel with the only purpose of learning how to forge it? Remember that plot line? Well, it’s not that hard to believe that Gendry , whose only skill consist in being a great blacksmith, it’s way more relevant than his bastard status. Do you really think Daenerys would give a sh#t about restauring the Baratheon lineage? Than Jon and Davos, who are with their minds on the White Walkers, would put everything aside to go ” working to legitimize” Gendry??!! A very secondary character who wasn’t even on the show for years??.
      Sure, thats way more likely than Gendry being there to forge the only weapons (besides obsidian) than can actually be useful …

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    223. Mr Fixit: Beside the point. First, we don’t know how Robert looked 20 years ago; he may well have resembled Gendry to an extent. Second, in-universe he is supposed to look like Robert because Ned recognised him on sight.

      I also find the arguments put forth by Ramsay’s 20th Good Man convincing. Not that his theory is necessarily true, but it is plausible enough to be a possibility. If Gendry strongly resembles Robert, has the right-hand man of the last Baratheon ruler of the Stormlands confirming his identity, and has the support of some of the most powerful political figures in Westeros (Daenerys and Jon), his claim is at least worth considering.

      It’s worth noting that bloodlines are very important in a feudal society. If Stormlords have to choose between a likely Baratheon bastard and some other lord, it is possible they would choose Gendry because of his blood (+ the support of 2 monarchs and 3 dragons).

      ETA: just remembered another thing. Back in Season 2 Joffrey ordered Gold Cloaks to look for and kill Gendry and other Robert’s bastards. So there are probably quite a few people in the “administration” and among the nobility who know that Robert had a bunch of bastards and that Gendry could easily be one of those bastards.

      There are a lot of IFs in that sentence. And I am pretty sure almost all of the administration is now dead. Well Cersei still lives. Hmm, I wonder if she would support Gendry.

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    224. maria,

      She does need him, I dont think her intention is to make more enemies than she already has. The North want their independence and I don’t see Dany agreeing with that. Why risk a future rebellion and Jon looking like a weak leader if they can marry and help each other’s interests? He will continue to be kitn and would have the help he needs and she would secure the North (and the wildlings under Jon command)

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    225. Kay,

      So, to counter my suggestion which you consider highly unlikely you offer up an alternative that you don’t think for a second will ever happen? Hmm…

      The “magical blacksmithing skills” I was referring to is the fantastical idea that Gendry, of all the blacksmiths in the Seven Kingdoms, would be the first in thousands of years to be capable of smithing Valyrian steel.

      I find it utterly incredible that anybody could consider that the character would be brought back for that reason ahead of his lineage.

      I can just picture it:

      Daenerys: “Well, we’ve found the secret to forging Valyrian steel. If only there was a blacksmith somewhere in the Seven Kingdoms”
      Davos: “If it please, your Grace, I think I know just the guy for the job”

      …..

      Tyrion: “Has anybody ever told you that you look strikingly like Robert Baratheon”
      Gendry: “Well, actually he’s my father. But apparently that’s less relevant to the story than the fact that I’m a blacksmith”

      As for Gendry being named Lord of the Stormlands, it’s really not a complex series of events at all. Something resembling:

      Jon: “We need to rally as many of the Seven Kingdoms to our cause as possible. Anybody got any ideas?
      Davos: “Well, funnily enough, I know the heir to the Stormlands”
      Arya (possibly): “Yeah, I know him too.”
      Jon: “Do you think the Storm Lords would accept his claim?”
      Davos: “Well, if you backed his claim, perhaps. Maybe we can convince Brienne to ask her father to back his claim too. Anyway, we’re in desperate times so there’s surely no harm in trying”.
      Jon: “Cool. You head south and see what you can do. Sansa says Brienne can go too. Oh, and if you run into a Dragon Queen while you’re down there, tell her her nephew says hi and could do with her assistance at some point”.

      While down south…

      Tyrion; “We need to find a way to secure the loyalty of the Stormlands because [insert reason / plot device]
      Davos: “Well, as it happens…”

      Not complex at all. But, also, not necessarily going to happen. But it’s certainly possible.

      As for my choice of words, I wasn’t the one dreaming up suggestions of sexism out of nowhere, LOL’ing and using emoticons to belittle somebody else’s opinion. Perhaps you should reconsider your own conduct.

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    226. Kay,

      You can lead that horse to water, but you can’t make him think. I went to dinner and had a nice glass of wine. I’d offer you one too. 🙂

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    227. Ellie:
      Geralt of Rivia,

      So… she will not marry and when she dies a random character will succeed her, making the whole Targaryen restoration plot (and Jon true parentage by extention) completely pointless, and she will give up the whole north and go help them without asking anything in return because of reasons, and Jon will refuse a marriage that basically favors everyone involved and sentence the whole human race to death because “Eww I won’t marry my hot aunt, who I dont never know and happens to have my same age and the greatest army ever, because Yucky!”.. That makes much more sense…

      There is a thing called naming an heir, even if she potentially an heir. Targaryen restoration and Jon’s parentage tied to it? Might end with a Targ restoration. It could be more about war of dawn as it was one of the visions of his, everything tied to white walkers. Jon’s parentage, creation of white walkers and Hodor. So it has some relevance to that, also to him as a person. His conflict of not being Ned’s son by blood will be huge for him.

      Exchange of support to her claim and fight against white walkers. I mean, she might not be convinced of their existence at first. It could go out plenty of ways. They agree to work, so both can gain something. Jon is surely looking “oh yeah hot auntie, let’s marry”. You know that alliances do work even without marriages like with Yara but there might be marriage. We shall see.

      maria:
      WDT,

      Jon is in no position to demand anything from Dany. That he’s king and she’s queen doesn’t mean that they’re equal. She’s Dany. That should be the end of the argument, but if more is needed, Jon is getting the brunt of winter and will be the first to feel the wrath of the Walkers. He needs her help; if she orders him to crawl naked through a sewer, he would have to obey. She doesn’t need his help, and he has no bargaining chips. What can he say? Marry me, or I won’t let you help me? Things don’t work that way.

      Well, the North is part of 7 Kingdoms, She can watch them die, but then she comes next and it will be against her character who tries to look after people.

      If she orders him to crawl naked through the streets. I know how you mean it, but a bit extreme don’t you think.

      Weather works against her whether it would come down to fight with the North (I doubt that) or white walkers. Northerners knows winter, Jon knows white walkers.
      Alliance much like with Yara could be on the cards or even if they push it marriage.

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    228. Ramsay’s 20th Good Man,

      “Oh, and that Gendry has been brought back because of magical blacksmithing skills which exist purely in the fantasies of people posting on fan forums, as opposed to the question of his lineage which has been clearly established on the show.”

      But think about it, Everything in the books and on the show has a reason to be, Gendry could have been a pie maker or work in the stables or whatever else, but George rr Martin decided he should be a blacksmith, and not a mediocre one but a very good one. Why make emphasis on his great blacksmith skills if it will be irrelevant in the future?
      He doesnt know anything about being a Lord, or basic politics, let alone leading soldiers to war. He could be legtimized and named Lord, of course, but so could anyone else, strategically it wouldn’t make sense to put someone with zero experience in such a position, it would only be a liability.
      He does have a great experience as a blacksmith though, so he could do the most good forging valyrian steel than as a Lord imo

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    229. Ellie:
      JenniferH,

      In the books maybe, but on the show the actor who plays Gendry doesn’t resemble Robert at all. At the end of the day, if he gets legitimized it will be by royal decree, regardless what he looks like.
      I think his presence on the show has to do with his skills as a blacksmith, and not with his claim as Robert’s bastard, but we’ll see.

      Yes, it’s in the books, but everything I was describing was specifically FROM the show. Ned saw Gendry, he recognized him and said to Jory once outside the shop that he’d just net King Robert’s bastard. And when Stannis met Gendry, he grabbed his face, stared at him and said he was clearly half Robert, half tavern wrench.

      So, yes, it’s established very clearly on the show, that Gendry does look very much like Robert did in his younger years. You can’t base it on how Robert looked upon his death since he’s older, overnight, red-faced, etc. and it’s been made clear how different he looks now.

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    230. WDT:
      maria,

      The North want their independence and I don’t see Dany agreeing with that.

      Did you miss Ep09 of the last season? Thats exactly what Yara and Theon asked her.

      Its the same when people say they don’t see Dany being cool with Gendry or any of the stark kids because of things that happened in the past. She won’t blame them for other people’s fault same way she didn’t blame Tyrion for Jaime killing her father.

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    231. maria,

      The north is larger than the other 6 Kingdoms combined. Jon Snow would reign over larger territory than she would. If he asks her for help and her response is, only if you bend the knee to me, what does this say about her character? Hey, ice demons are coming to kill all of us, can you help? Not unless you bend the knee. This also makes her stupid. So she’d allow the entire North to be wiped out and even more of the dead be re-animated into Wights simply because he wouldn’t bend the knee? And where does she think they’d head after the north was wiped out? And all this would happen with Tyrion advising her?

      A much more likely route is the marriage one. She asks for him to bend the knee (which is still going to be idiotic out of character writing in my opinion), he refuses. They squabble back and forth. Tyrion and Davos hammer out the marriage agreement.

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    232. HotPinkLipstick,

      You can lead that horse to water, but you can’t make him think.

      You can say that again.

      I’ve outlined all the reasoning you could possibly need to support my suggestions, and a few other users have concurred with their plausibility, and yet you can’t even proffer an answer to a simple question.

      Why would Davos be coming into contact with Gendry again if not for reasons regarding his lineage?

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    233. WDT,

      He’s on the verge of getting whacked by Walkers. He knows that he’s screwed. Back in season 5, he told Sam that if the Walkers got past the Wall (imo they will) the North, probably all of Westeros, is lost.

      Then a queen appears. She has Dragonstone, with dragonglass. She has King’s Landing (or what’s left of it) with wildfire. She has dragons that spew fire. She has Tyrion, probably the most brilliant strategist on Westeros atm. She has everything Westeros needs, and all Jon has is “please help us.”

      Jon gains nothing by threatening her. He’s in no position to demand a marriage alliance. He’s not going to declare independence in the midst of a zombie apocalypse. Maybe Davos underplays the trouble they’re in to get a better deal for Jon, but if Davos goes south after the Wall has fallen, he won’t be playing games.

      Jon bends the knee, and Dany, magnanimously, helps him. Which doesn’t mean that Dany will always be much more powerful than Jon: They’ll be fighting the apocalypse. They might in time make an alliance, even marry and rule Westeros together. I don’t see that happening as a result of Jon’s initial approach to Dany.

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    234. WDT,

      If Gendry ends up forging Valyrian steel it would be the most corny, contrived, ludicrous plot device they could possibly dream up and, as far as I’m concerned, would really undermine the quality of the show.

      Some people are talking about Jon and Daenerys marrying being fairytale nonsense, but to have a secondary character suddenly develop the ability to do something that people haven’t been capable of for thousands of years, just in time to fight the ultimate baddies, would be genuinely awful.

      In the books it might be credible, and George RR Martin can spend the next couple of books making it even more so.

      But on the show as it is so far, if they have Sam miraculously find the key to forging Valyrian steel and Gendry miraculously learning to forge it overnight, it’d be so corny from a show that has tried so hard not to be.

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    235. It’s ok to make assumptions because well, that’s mostly what we all do here but why some people don’t even use logic when it comes to Dany?

      Why on earth are people assuming she WILL tell Jon to bend the knee? Did she ask Theon or Yara to do that? And that’s when the two were in worse position than Jon is now. At most he’d bend the knee in a more organic way, like how Tyrion did.

      Same about saying she’s gonna treat the stark kids bad because of Ned’s relationship with Robert. Did these people forget how her relationship with Tyrion is now, when his brother killed her father? Or how even Varys is in her team now despite their past?

      As some have said in past posts, it’s like some people just want to find reasons to criticize her. We have similar situations that already happened in the show that can kinda tell how her behavior with some characters will be.

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    236. Kargaryen,

      She said the others were free to ask as well, implying that it doesn’t mean she would give independence to everyone who ask her.
      An island is not the North, look at the map of Westeros and tell me if its the same thing.

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    237. maeve,

      If Jon is a Targ and Dany IS a Targ,wouldn´t StormsEnd belong to one of them or both? I mean,Robert Baratheon took the IT above everyone else based on that his grandmother was a Targ…no direct Baratheon left( not counting Gendry) ; wouldn´t that make them the heirs to SE?

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    238. Ramsay's 20th Good Man,

      Well, it would obviously not be just him. Remember why Sam is at the Citadel, his purpose is to find the secret behind valyrian steel forging. For what we know, it is believed to involve magic and dragons, and a good blacksmith I suppose.
      I think it makes more sense if he is the one that, with the help of Sam, magic and dragons can bring the art of forging valiryan steel back. It has more meaning fot the story if its Gendry and not some random blacksmith the one to do it.

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    239. Just my thoughts on Gendry, who I’m very happy to see return and do hope he reconnects with Arya in some way. None of them need to be married off to anyone really, but it’s very likely some marriage/s might occur. All the possibles are highborn to some degree, even if not all have been legitimised.
      Dany, Jon, Arya and Sansa come to mind for this instance, but there are others for a different topic. Some of those have an ‘ick’ factor to some people.

      I believe Gendry has returned for multiple reasons, the catalyst being his excellent blacksmith skills, the need of Dragonstone obsidian, and the possible forging of Valerion steel that might happen. I think Sam will feature here in some way. How Gendry re-enters we’ll have to wait and see, but it’s possible he and Davos reconnected in Fleabottom, either accidentally or intentionally, or he may have even pulled back into shore on DS. Or not 🙂

      Any of the three ladies I mentioned *should they marry in the show* would need suitably highborn husbands. Dany is a Targ of royal blood. Sansa and Arya are daughters of Winterfell. Should Gendry be legitimised as Robert’s son and heir, he then becomes a good possibility, though in my mind more so for the Winterfell girls. It also removes the ‘ick’ factor as he’s not related to any of them. It fulfills Ned’s and Robert’s wish to unite their houses, just as a nice nod back to them. If it goes that way I’d be hoping for Arya since they already have history that worked pretty well, but have to concede Sansa is also a possibility. (Notwithstanding where the Tyrion/Sansa situation might be at this stage).

      I do believe Gendry has more purpose than just being a well-toned, good looking blacksmith who just happens to be the only surviving Baratheon bastard 🙂 I don’t see it as corny, it just seems a natural progression of the story so far, as we know it.

        Quote  Reply

    240. Kargaryen,

      Totally agree.
      tbh, as it happens in every single fandom, the fans of the “hot dude” hate the guts of the girl that is, or they suspect it will be, their love interest and will find any excuse to criticize her, even if what they say doesn’t make any sense.

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    241. Kargaryen,

      I think the reason is those fake spoilers floating around the internet these past weeks, which said

      that Dany would make Jon kneel in exchange for help against the WWs, even though that is contrary to how she dealt with Yara.

      . That’s when all these comments about Jon kneeling to Dany started.

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    242. Ramsay's 20th Good Man,

      Oh please, it is a fantasy. 3 dragons hatching and Dany being fire proof would be just as corny. Jorah and Daario not encountering more than two Dothraki at Vaes Dothrak, very plausible. Oh, and let’s not forget Bran, the mighty three-eyed raven.
      Davos knows first hand that Valyrian steel kills WW and he just happens to run into a talented blacksmith and they just happen to be in close proximity of some dragons.

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    243. WDT,

      It’s really, really, really, really, really, really corny though.

      I pray they don’t go down that route but, as you say, with Sam at the Citadel that could well be the direction they’re going.

      I’ve had this discussion previously on this site with somebody else, so I don’t really want to get bogged down in it again, but from my point of view it’d be far more in keeping with the tone of the show and it’d generate more drama in the final battles if they limited the Valyrian steel to just the four swords we already know of and have some of the rest of the forces armed with dragonglass weapons (which would be less effective than Valyrian steel, but still make it possible for ordinary soldiers to kill White Walkers if necessary).

      If they find a way to churn out some more Valyrian steel I feel like it has the potential to undermine the importance of our main characters in the final battles and undermine the threat that the White Walkers pose.

        Quote  Reply

    244. ghost of winterfell:
      Kargaryen,

      I think the reason is those fake spoilers floating around the internet these past weeks, which said

      . That’s when all these comments about Jon kneeling to Dany started.

      That would explain a lot. How dare they bring this crap here. I am outraged. ?

        Quote  Reply

    245. Newbietothegame,

      Yeah, some of the things that you mention could be considered corny.

      But the miraculous discovery, after thousands of years, by one of our lovable plucky underdog characters, of the magic formula to forge the weapons needed to defeat the bad guys?

      And having another well-liked underdog secondary character, who just happens to have arrived back on the scene at exactly the right time, be the one to master it?

      That’d truly take the biscuit.

      I mean, it’s off the chart corny.

        Quote  Reply

    246. Luka Nieto,

      Cool! You DID say you lived near Zumaia…It is on my future travelling menu,though:the Basque Country…Never been there even though part of my family is from there…My other family being from Torino,Hannover and Galicia…a real melting pot 🙂 🙂 🙂

        Quote  Reply

    247. Holy crap, people. Gendry wasn’t simply dropped into the story to begin with just for his pretty face, his return won’t be to walk by in the background or get offed like Osha either. You don’t just lay the groundwork and background for that character to not have it mean something. Jeebus.

        Quote  Reply

    248. Ramsay’s 20th Good Man,

      Calm down. People have different opinions, you gave yours and a lot of people didn’t agree and gave you their reasons, yours are not more valid than the others.
      Lets be generous and say that Gendry comes back and is named Lord of the Stormlands… and then what? Does that move the story forward? No.
      Gendry comes back and help to forge the ultimate weapon against the White Walkers. Does that move the story forward? Yes.
      Between Gendry coming back to fulfill a role than anyone else could fulfill or playing a role that it’s much more related to the actual problematic, why do you think people desagree with you?

        Quote  Reply

    249. Ramsay’s 20th Good Man,

      Well to be fair I dont quite get why they would need so much obsidian or valyrian swords, because we haven’t seen as many WW. Wights, hell yeah, we’ve seen a LOT, but how many WW are out there? I dont know, Ive always have the impression there werent as many.
      But I think its obvious Sam will find the “recipe” to forge valiryan steel, with him stealing his father sword last season.
      I don’t find it particullary corny because it’s fantasy, so a LOT of things could be considered corny.
      I think because of the tone of the story so far, people can’t conceive something good happening to the “good guys”. But we are at the final arc now, the time for big plot twist has past, and Martin is much more of a “traditionalist” than people give him credit for. So, imo some things could seem cheesy or predictable (like Jon and Dany marriage, or Jon parentage back in the moment), but if you think about it ist jus the logical conclusion.

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    250. Luka Nieto,

      Luka… Sorry to hear you wasn’t selected as an extra. However, getting to write for WotW as their ‘Man in Spain’ is even better. As you say, having to be on set as an extra at 4am would have been bad news !!

      A great article you wrote and looking forward to reading some more in the future… Buen suerte mi amigo 🙂

        Quote  Reply

    251. WDT,

      Craster had 99 sons(little Sam is 100th) and all of them turned into White Walkers. We saw three white walkers being killed by Sam, Meera and Jon. A lot of white walkers should be still alive. We got mentioned ice spiders. Would be cool to see them.

        Quote  Reply

    252. Arkash wrote: “Just had this thought… if Gendry returns, there is only one last character still alive with spoken lines that has yet to make a return : Roselyn Frey, right ? But maybe I’m missing someone…”

      Illyrio Mopatis. Roger Allam is pretty busy, but I’d happily welcome his dulcet tones back. Besides, his being present towards the end of Dany’s political arc would bookend his setting her off on her ‘journey’ as well as giving her the dragons. Syrion Forel could conceivably also be alive, but I saw an interview with Maisie where she said D&D told her he wasn’t.

      And felicitaciones, Luka. You’ve started with an exciting contribution. And your English is excellent.

        Quote  Reply

    253. SJH:
      Just my thoughts on Gendry, who I’m very happy to see return and do hope he reconnects with Arya in some way. None of them need to be married off to anyone really, but it’s very likely some marriage/s might occur. All the possibles are highborn to some degree, even if not all have been legitimised.
      Dany, Jon, Arya and Sansa come to mind for this instance, but there are others for a different topic. Some of those have an ‘ick’ factor to some people.

      I believe Gendry has returned for multiple reasons, the catalyst being his excellent blacksmith skills, the need of Dragonstone obsidian, and the possible forging of Valerion steel that might happen. I think Sam will feature here in some way. How Gendry re-enters we’ll have to wait and see, but it’s possible he and Davos reconnected in Fleabottom, either accidentally or intentionally, or he may have even pulled back into shore on DS. Or not

      Any of the three ladies I mentioned *should they marry in the show* would need suitably highborn husbands. Dany is a Targ of royal blood. Sansa and Arya are daughters of Winterfell. Should Gendry be legitimised as Robert’s son and heir, he then becomes a good possibility, though in my mind more so for the Winterfell girls. It also removes the ‘ick’ factor as he’s not related to any of them. It fulfills Ned’s and Robert’s wish to unite their houses, just as a nice nod back to them. If it goes that way I’d be hoping for Arya since they already have history that worked pretty well, but have to concede Sansa is also a possibility. (Notwithstanding where the Tyrion/Sansa situation might be at this stage).

      I do believe Gendry has more purpose than just being a well-toned, good looking blacksmith who just happens to be the only surviving Baratheon bastard I don’t see it as corny, it just seems a natural progression of the story so far, as we know it.

      I couldn’t agree more.

        Quote  Reply

    254. maeve,

      That post was a fake, though. u/dragonmcmx/ admitted in a second post that the screenshot and video he posted were faked, just to show that it can be done. I don’t know if the leaks are true or not, and I’ll only be able to decide after more shooting info or even the season itself is released, but the leaker himself has not admitted to faking it.

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    255. Kargaryen,

      Well are you saying that dany is not mad power hungry who just can’t see reason nor want to help people …
      Why one must bother with canon when we have this perfect picture painted in minds..

      ghost of winterfell,

      Yeah that one crap about tyrion and varys doubting because dany acted on impulse and won..
      I guess we have to forget about all those instances tyrion and jon acting out of impulses
      Cersei manages to convince randyl tarly that she is true heir so hard that even when he us defeated he won’t change is alligience.. So dany will burn him to tyrion’s horror..

      This is just dany ..I don’t even need to go with what he said about arya’s cersei and euron and jon is a prisoner for all season ..

      Just ridiculous..like all leaks he got some things right and most are ridiculous.

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    256. Random thought: I don’t trust Varys, never have. I love the character and I love Conleth, I just have never bought the good guy image the show likes to hint at giving him.

        Quote  Reply

    257. Pigeon,

      Me too .

      For me he is just in the same league with LF but at least LF is honest with his ambitions while varys hides behind the mask of good for realm ..

      It’s very clear in the books but in the show I don’t see them going that way ..I guess they have just dropped that whole thing and have him support dany stay as good guy.
      And I think that they decided on this only after season 4.

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    258. My, its all kicked off overnight! ?

      Geralt of Rivia:
      WDT,

      Craster had 99 sons(little Sam is 100th) and all of them turned into White Walkers. We saw three white walkers being killed by Sam, Meera and Jon. A lot of white walkers should be still alive. We got mentioned ice spiders. Would be cool to see them.

      Agree that we’ll probably see just how many WWs there are and that’ll be a significant number. However, ice spiders are simply wights I believe, it kinda occurred to me during “The Door” when they were crawling upside down. I imagine reality has been distorted over 8000 yrs.

      There’s also this:

      “Burning shafts hissed upward, trailing tongues of fire. Scarecrow brothers tumbled down, black cloaks ablaze. “Snow,” an eagle cried, as foemen scuttled up the ice like spiders. Jon was armored in black ice, but his blade burned red in his hand”

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    259. Rhaenys Stark,

      Rhaenys,

      I can’t remember offhand whether you are a book reader or not but I think I can say this without it being a spoiler – in the books there were a couple of other of Robert’s bastards who lived – a boy at Dragonstone and a girl in the Vale but they have (thus far anyway) cut them from the TV show. GRRM apparently has said that Robert’s (book) living bastards have a part to play in the endgame so hopefully Gendry coming back isn’t just fanfic.

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    260. Arya Serious,

      I’ve heard a theory – that Gendry was the baby Cersei aborted in the books only somehow the abortion didn’t work. Seems there is a Greek myth that has one of the gods cast down by his parents and becoming a blacksmith and some folk think GRRM might have taken inspiration from that. Doesn’t fit in with the Maggy the Frog prophecy which only credits Cersei with three children though.

      I join those offering congratulations to Luka on becoming a writer for the site.

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    261. So Daenerys will appoint Gendry as Lord Paramount of Stormend, Can’t wait to see Daenerys appoint Jon Snow as lord of the Winterfell and appoint Tyrion or Jaimie as lord of the Castrely Rock

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    262. Kargaryen,

      Why would Dany allow nonsense such as KITN ? bend or die , same for Cersei , The north is part of 7 kingdom and Jon Snow is nothing to Daenerys ,just insignificant insect

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    263. Apollo,

      Hello again.

      IMO, the role of the presumed Gold Cloaks in this scene is explained by the casting call for a city guard who was supposed to intercept some suspiciously looking person during his night patrol.

      Of cause, the shooting happens in broad daylight, but that was also the case with Bran & Meera being saved by Benjen scene, so it’s safe to assume that some filter will be used again.

      There are two presumed city guards (Gold Cloaks) in the scene, but IMO only one of them will have a speaking role in the form of a verbal exchange with the suspiciously looking person Davos (and Tyrion).

      As for other potential actors in costumes, IMO they can be either traitors (someone who have noticed the boat approaching and informed the guards) or saviors (someone who will notice Davos and Tyrion being intercepted and help them out). I lean towards the later, but one way or another I suspect them to be some band of smugglers/outlaws (who else could be expected on the shores near KL at nighttime?) conveniently involving Gendry (not a stretch at all, cause Gendry was hunted and the underworld of the Flee Bottom was his only chance to survive in KL). So, maybe Gendry will recognize Davos and decide to save him from the GC, or… It looks like one of the potential cast members is a dwarf, just like Tyrion, and Cersei has been hunting every dwarf in the country, so maybe something about “dwarf solidarity” will play out.

      One way or another, Davos and Tyrion might receive an unexpected help which in turn might make make them alter their initial plan of killing Cersey/freeing the convicts of the Black Cells/burning the Red Keep with wildfire or whatever. Gendry might play a pivotal role in that: by now he could have turned into a legend of the Flee Bottom – the last surviving bastard of the royal blood and the successful outlaw combined. It’s worth to mention that the public tends to worship successful outlaws, when the government is deemed to be illegitimate. It’s often called a Robin-hood phenomenon and Gendry has been given every possible reason to evolve into a sort of urban Robin-hood: admired, supported, and followed. So, yes his blood might play a role and he might turn into king-maker by becoming the leader of the public revolt against Cersey in favor of Dany and Jon.

      And afterwards Gendry might go into studying Valyrian steel secrets and reuniting with Arya. He may be offered lordship and the Stormlands too, but I don’t see him accepting. Gendry is an embodiment of a commoner, not a lord, and Arya is not a lady too. So, they may sail west of Westeros or simply open a smithy and establish the Guild of the Valyrian Steel Smiths, but first they have to win the War for Dawn.

      As for the Valyrian steel secret itself, now it looks to be the plot for S8. Eventually, it should be broken to secure the ultimate victory. But after rethinking our earlier discussion with Ramsay’s 20th Good Man, I tend to agree: the first battle (or battles) will be fought only with the Valyrian steel swords we know: namely the Longclaw, the Oathkeeper, and maybe the Heartsbane. Not sure about the Widow’s Veil: it looks like it was indeed buried with Joffrey, but the explosion of the sept could have brought it out and the burned blade could have been found by Gendry or been brought to him for remaking. BTW, in bigger battles (Hardhome, Cave) the WW were coming in a company of four, so initially four swords will be required to fight them and therefore finding and fixing the Widow’s Veil may be crucial (and it looks like a right task for Gendry).

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    264. Dame of Mercia,

      Thanks for the reply 🙂 Yeah I know these things, I’ve read the first three books and some snippets of 4 & 5. Let’s see what happens with him, I’m very curious. Hopefully it will make sense. I’d hate another Osha situation.

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    265. dragonbringer,

      There are so many things that are off in these so called “leaks” in terms of the characters, their motivations and actions, this thread is probably not the right place to discuss it, but they better be fake lol.
      Halfman,

      Ugh… I was hoping those denials were real.

      This guy definitely seems to have real info in terms of the characters and the locations they are going to be in. But I am really hoping that he filled up all the details by himself as a lot of his replies were contradictory.
      Anti dragon spear guns , anyone??

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    266. I see #kitwatch continues. Bigfoot Harington.

      Normally Jon shouldn’t have to ask Dany to help him save Westeros. If she wants to be queen it would be her duty to do it and earn her crown. Her asking him to kneel if he wants her involvement would make her look bad because once the WW are done in the North, they’ll be coming for her and her people. Normally Dany would want to save innocents instead of being queen of the ashes.

      But….this is the show…so ‘normally’ doesn’t usually apply.

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    267. Flayed Potatoes,

      If they refusing to bend then they’re rebels same as Cersei and Euron ,as the queen of the 7 kingdom she have to punish rebels, execute/exile/imprison and take back the northern lords titles/land, if they’re rebels then they all deserves to die for making trouble in unification , come for what lol? they’re insignificant ants to Daenerys

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    268. Dani,

      But it could serve Jon and Dany’s purposes very well.

      Dany could bring the Stormlands to heel through Gendry (perhaps it will not be a case of whether she wants to or perhaps that she has to. With Stannis, Shireen, Renly and Robert dead, who else could lay claim to it? The only person that springs to mind (and I am talking strictly about the show here) is Cersei. Would they follow her? I can imagine seizing it and the military forces there will be one of her top priorities, seeing as she’s only got Euron as an ally). Backing Gendry isn’t great either but if you are a Stormlord commoner or a Lord like Selwyn of Tarth, who would you back? With Brienne in the fold, I can easily see them opting for Gendry and supporting him with military expertise, strategies and troops. What’s their alternative??

      Secondly, it could also serve Jon’s purposes. He gets the might and support of the Stormland troops to help defeat the Walkers.

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    269. ghost of winterfell,

      Anti dragon spear guns… A ballista would be a more appropriate word, IMO. But you don’t need a friend of a friend of a friend in the writing team to figure out that one would need a ballista to take out a dragon (just watch the Hobbit/The Battle of the Five Armies for instance). My basic problem with this “leak” is that according to it ballistas will be used by the Night’s King. We haven’t seen the WW wielding anything else but ice swords, and it would be really weird, if they appeared to have any kind of mechanical artillery or any other sophisticated mechanisms. They are few (event if Craster was not the only supplier of the baby-boys, the WW should count in dozens, hundreds at best); they sleep for thousand years, they have awaken only recently (maybe several decades ago), so, how would they get a ballista? Moreover, I don’t think that the WW expect to fight dragons: their ascending started after all dragons died out and the hope to hatch new ones was lost (hardly that can be a coincidence). And the WW are not mastermind planners: they rely on the numbers of the wights they can raise and the hardiness of their own race (they wore no armor, before Sam stabbed one with dragonglass spearhead/dagger). So, their best technological achievement is a dragonglass-proof armor, which gives little to no protection from Valyrian blades BTW. All in all, the WW should have no ballistas in their arsenal.

      Meanwhile, humans should have them in spades. I’m not sure whether we saw ballistas on the show, but we definitely saw Joffrey’s crossbow, and a crossbow is one of the results of ballista development. Therefore, ballistas can be expected to be used against dragons, but only by Cersei, not by the WW. And IMO that’s exactly what’s going to happen during the big battle in the south resulting in Dany’s epic fall into the water and temporary incapacitation of the dragons. I mean, that dragons should be incapacitated, if Davos and Tyrion are so desperate that they go on a secret mission on their own. And just a thought: maybe it’s a dragon rescue mission? That would explain necessity of Tyrion’s involvement as well as introduction of the Dragonpit, where Dany (and Jon) will finally arrive on the surviving dragon to meet Davos and other characters and for the “parlay” with Cersey scaring her to death?

      As I said IMO the “leak” was manufactured on purpose to misguide the viewers in their interpretations, because that’s the only way you can conceal any vital information nowadays with all the drones and super-optic cameras.

      Sorry, couldn’t help it.

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    270. ghost of winterfell,

      Try it, it works.

      duvrov,

      Jon aka the insignificant ant is her only family. If you want to troll, be better.

      Flayed Potatoes,

      Better pray that these are not true Jon giving up title, becoming hostage, love slave and lap dog for Dany. Dany becoming illogical, tyrant. They’re looking really silly like that.

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    271. Apollo:
      My, its all kicked off overnight!

      Agree that we’ll probably see just how many WWs there are and that’ll be a significant number. However, ice spiders are simply wights I believe, it kinda occurred to me during “The Door” when they were crawling upside down. I imagine reality has been distorted over 8000 yrs.

      There’s also this:

      “Burning shafts hissed upward, trailing tongues of fire. Scarecrow brothers tumbled down, black cloaks ablaze. “Snow,” an eagle cried, as foemen scuttled up the ice like spiders. Jon was armored in black ice, but his blade burned red in his hand”

      Hey guys…didn’t Jaime have a similar dream of being in Casterly rock with all his dead family and Brienne and both their swords were burning? Cersei said to him in his dream something about as long as he is alive the sword will burn bright? I don’t have the books (which saddens me greatly) so I can’t look it up.

      Also with the 100 sons of Craster…do you think they will come looking for their little brother that was stolen from them? And a side note, WHY did that WW look Sam right in his face and them let him live? I thought they just want to kill all living things!! It wasn’t mentioned in the show but in the books Sam was bathed in Auroch’s blood by Warlocks hired by his father to try and make him a man! Could that have some magical thing that will help him in the war??

      Another theory I have about Craster is that he was a Stark bastard. His wildling mother from White Tree was impregnated by a ranger of the Nights Watch and when she tried to give the baby to them they turned her away. Doesn’t mean it was a Stark but it is possible. Seems like the Starks are not strangers to loving those they shouldn’t so I really like the idea of the WW having Stark blood (due to Craster) and then there is the whole Night’s King story too that could’ve been a Stark. It’s a twisted little world they live in!

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    272. Geralt of Rivia,

      I read the same “spoilers” you did, but no matter my opinion of them, I definitely did not get “love slave” and “lap dog” from them. Jon kneeling to Dany does not make him a” love slave” or a “lap dog”. That’s ridiculous.

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    273. HotPinkLipstick,

      Just read through your comments again and, no, you haven’t answered my question.

      You haven’t offered any explanation as to why Davos and Gendry would come into contact again.

      If you can’t even be honest about that then feel free to ignore me in future, because there’s no point in having further discussions with somebody who can’t even answer a simple question to back up their point of view but snarkily pretends that they have in order to avoid doing so.

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    274. Blue,

      The problem is that there is absolutely no basis in the story on the show so far for Gendry being brought back to miraculously smith Valyrian steel.

      Whereas the issue of his lineage has been the main reason for his presence in the story from the very beginning.

      To suggest that it’s more plausible that he’s been brought back to miraculously become the only blacksmith in thousands of years capable of forging Valyrian steel, rather than to tie up the issue of his lineage is nonsensical. Sorry, but that’s just the truth.

      As I’ve asked other people, what justification is there for Davos to come into contact with Gendry again if not (at least initially) regarding his lineage?

      You think it’s more likely that a situation will arise where Davos seeks out Gendry, of all the blacksmiths in the Seven Kingdoms, in order to forge Valyrian steel rather than him seek him out because he happens to be the potential heir to one of the Seven Kingdoms?

      You think they’re going to bring him back into the story and overlook the fact that he’s Robert’s son? Really?

      How would Gendry’s lineage move the story forward? Well, I’ve already offered a suggestion. It would provide a reason for Davos, and possibly Brienne, to head south on Jon’s orders. That would put them in the right place at the right time to treat with Daenerys once she’s taken King’s Landing.

      Of course, Jon could simply send Davos and Brienne directly to negotiate with Daenerys later in the season, but where would Gendry factor into that equation?

      I must reiterate, I’m not saying this will definitely happen. But I do take issue with people dismissing it out of hand in favour of Gendry conveniently returning to the story, out of the blue from nowhere, simply in order to play a role in a shameless plot device regarding the forging of Valyrian steel.

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    275. ghost of winterfell,

      He’s been kept hostage “guest”. Then he’s supposed to be cool with her killing people. Also, giving up title of KitN from his own will, while making hearty eyes for the whole season. Ending up making love while they’re invading.

      Iam not a fan of this union but it can be done in a way that could be good. But this stuff just rings Jon just being lap dog around her, basically doing what she wants. While being this agressive, then falls in love. You can do much better. These leaks might be partially true and other stuff just bs.

      But we should debate it on forum more likely.

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    276. Envie:
      Inga,

      I don’t think those are goldcloaks, I’m not sure how that idea got started as the one I can see at the very end of the video footage looks nothing like a goldcloak in full armor but more like a tall man dressed in goldish/brown long tunic, light colored cloth pants and brown leather boots. That looks like a Lord or Noble’s clothing to me.

      Maybe we’re not talking about the same figure? I’m talking about: http://i.imgur.com/H9udZ4J.png

      I totally agree with you. It didn’t look like Gold Cloaks to me either. So much speculation and so much time to pass before we get to see S7:)

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    277. Geralt of Rivia,

      I agree it sounds pretty cheesy and I don’t want it to go down like this at all. And I even agree that both the characters are not presented well here and a lot of it seems to be out of character for them. But still, nothing written in those spoilers suggests that Jon is her lap-dog, he still has a mind of his own and a will of his own. Obviously we can’t go into details here so I can’t give examples.

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    278. Arya Serious,

      The WW like to come in quartets, so Jon will have to form his own quartet I suppose. Brienne is one of the best fighters in Westeros, so she should be in. Jaime is not so good at fighting after he lost his right hand, but if he could fix the Widdow’s Veil to the stump (and Tyrion could definitely come with some elaborated solution) he could recover his fighting skills pretty soon (of cause, first someone – Gendry? – has to find the Widdow’s Veil in the rubble of the sept. The Heartsbane can be wielded by the Hound or Joran or even Sam himself (he was the first to kill a WW after all). Or maybe there will be only 3 heads of the dragon (3 persons with Valyrian swords) initially.

      Regarding Sam and why the WW left him unharmed, IMO it’s pretty simple: they wanted to spread the message, so every time they saw someone freezing in panic, they let that person go. You, see I don’t think that the WW want to kill all and everyone: for them the only way of reproduction is conversion of human babies (adults can be converted too I suppose, but it’s more risky: you may get another Uncle Bejen). So, one way or another the WW need human babies and for that purpose they should force the humans into some pact to promote regular baby offerings. And probably they think that it’s a great idea: they don’t harm those babies – the one we saw converted looked quite happy in the WW’s hands; and after all the humankind has always sought immortality which they can secure almost for free. But that’s the point: immortality comes at a price of life itself, cause “only death can pay for life” – not the life of other person, but for own life primarily. Every living being has to accept its own mortality and bow to Death as the only true god at some point. IMO that might be one of the fundamental ideas of the GoT/ASOIAF.

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    279. Ramsay’s 20th Good Man,

      You are repetitive, so sorry for being repetitive too.

      1) What makes you think that Davos will be seeking out Gendry? From what I saw it’s pretty clear that Davos will be simply using his smuggling skills to smuggle Tyrion somewhere (presumably KL), and Tyrion apparently has his own agenda (kill Cersey, meet Jaime, rescue a dragon, set the Red Keep on fire or whatever else, if their destination is not KL).

      2) I bet that they will run into Gendry by accident or rather by the will of gods. Will his lineage play a role? Of cause. The hunted royal bastard from the Flee Bottom makes a perfect leader for a potential public revolt (and you have to take into account that Dany tried to provoke public revolts wherever she could). And it will be very important that Targarian rule in KL will be restored by the son of the man who deposed them. Afterwards he may be granted lordship and Stormlands, but I don’t see him accepting – Gendry is an embodiment of the third estate and that’s where he belongs.

      3) Will Gendry have something to do with the Valyrian steel? Probably in S8. And he won’t break the formula out of the blue. Maybe, his first experience will be finding and fixing the Widow’s Wail which ended somewhere in the rubble of the sept after being buried with Joffrey. In a situation where every Valyrian steel blade counts, that would be a major input too. And that may lead Gendry into better understanding how the Valyrian steel works and his royal (Valyrian) blood droplets may help him, and Sam will be able to bring his knowledge too. But don’t worry: they won’t break the formula until the end of S8, and though that will secure the victory, the ultimate battle will still be fought with 4 swords (+ 1 dagger + 1 battleaxe, maybe).

      4) Will Gendry have a certain role in Arya’s storyline? Also possible.

      In general, Gendry can do a lot of things and move the story forwards in a number of ways, but out of all him becoming Lord Paramount of the Stormlands is the most unlikely. In fact, the very institution of lord paramount and/or warden will disappear along with the great houses. Checks and balances will go to the middle-level nobility which will probably form something like a House of Lords, and, if Dany indeed ascends to the throne through a public revolt, the House of Commons may be established too. In other words, the feudal system as GRRM understands it will be replaced with something more fit for the Modern Times. In other words, Dany will break the wheel and reinvent it in a new form, rather than try to replace the broken spokes of the old one with random bastards with no ruling skills.

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    280. Apollo,

      Hi! I love that little bit about Jon on the wall! Only thing is they left sooo many dreams put of the show except Bran (and Ned). The show didn’t do any of Jaimes dreams (like the one with his mom in it!!!), Jon and Arya’s wolf dreams, sweet robin, etc. We just didn’t get all of those in the show because it was just too much to cram in I think! So I wonder if they would actually do those scenes in the show like that if the dream wasn’t in the show. Would be awesome to see but that makes it seem like the wall is still standing when this battle takes place. Hmmm…lots to think about!

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    281. Inga,

      Hi Inga! Widows wail is most definitely still around there is no way that Tywin would have let that priceless Valyrian sword be buried with Joffrey. It probably passed to Tommen and is now in the red keep where Jaime just happens to be right now. I know so many people think he is too far gone and is destined to die with Cersei. But I think it’s possible with the good deeds we have seen him do that he can come back and possibly finally turn on his crazy lover/sister. He has helped the Starks several times and has a connection with Brienne (not saying they will get married or anything) and has blatantly disobeyed Cersei in doing so. His reaction to Cersei’s utter obliteration of the Sept and all of the people, I hope, will be nothing but contempt. I actually really hope that he just disappears and leaves KL on her just before the forces come in!! She seems to send him away just before she needs him every time so makes sense he would conveniently not be around to me. Or maybe that’s just what I want to see happen! I think that Jaime and Brienne’s conversation about the book with all of the Kings Guard will come around again and his page will be updated as tribute by Brienne. Just need that book to get out of the red keep before any kind of fire breaks out lol! Eh probably not enough time in the show but maybe the books 🙂

      Ummm…I wonder who the new advisors will be to Cersei. Who is gonna run the money? They will run the gold cloaks. So I guess there could be some interesting twists this season with how different characters would be involved and how those Gold Cloaks would be on Dragonstone.

      But anyway…I am hoping that Jaime takes widows wail and escapes from there and joins the fight for the living!!! Then maybe those swords will come together and they can tag team some WW!!! I know many people think that Jaime will fight for Cersei but I don’t know we haven’t truly seen his reaction the sept incident (that mirrors what he prevented and has been called the Kingslayer since). Or to the death of his last child at the fault of his mother (a child that he was never allowed to be a father to). I think that may mess with his mind more than a little. I don’t know if Cersei is even capable of love at this point so she may be really cold to him and make it that much easier for him to leave. She is, after all, a hateful woman lol!!!

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    282. I JUST FIGURED IT OUT! The reason Tyrion would risk his life to sneak into KL and the Red Keep is to steal that copy of An History of the Great Sieges of Westeros by Archmaester Ch’Vyalthan

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    283. maria,

      Why do so many posters act like Jon needs to beg Dany for help, give up or offer something to her, when it’s the whole flipping realm of people at risk of the WW threat and Jon is only trying to warn of the danger and help save humanity? Why do we need to pit them against each other in this regard? If “Jon needs her army and dragons” to help fight annihilation then it is not just for him and his people personally, it is for every living soul in the land who does NOT want to turn into a zombie, which also included Dany and her people. Alas it is in the best interest of everybody to ban together to fight the otherworldly beings including Dany, it is not just Jon’s problem!

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    284. Envie,

      Yes but Tyrion came to her as the murderer of Tywin Lannister, who had a lot to do with the destruction of her family, with Varys vouching for him. Killing Tywin must have made Tyrion a more sympathetic figure to her.

      IMO, the real test would be if Jaime somehow arrives on the scene, either as commander of Queen Cersei’s forces to battle Dany, or as a man on the run after killing Queen Cersei. Jaime swore to avenge his father and kill Tyrion, and he killed Dany’s father, so there’s a lot of repair to be done.

      Tyrion is the one character who seems to be able to get along with everyone right now. They all have baggage. He can make peace and allies of Dany & Jon, he loves his brother, and he obviously has forged peace with the Martells & Dorne thanks to Varys.
      In fact, as far as I know, Littlefinger and Cersei are his only sworn enemies.

      I can see Jaime wanting to kill Tyrion for Tywin’s death, and Ellaryia and the Sand Snakes for murdering his daughter. Jaime’s a problem. Will be interesting to see how he’s handled.

      Only Brienne and Tyrion would be willing to speak up in his defense. I like Jaime’s character arc and I was hoping he would be there for the reckoning with the Wight Walkers.

      As we speculate about Gendry’s role in the wars to come, maybe we should remember he is an armorer, and a skill that will be very valuable. I don’t believe he is going to be a candidate for marriage to Dany. I think it will be Jon & Dany. Gendry & Arya.

      One thing I’m thinking about right now is the fact that the City of King’s Landing might still be infested with fire pots. All the underground tunnels. Would Cersei blow up King’s Landing before giving in to Dany? Does a bear shit in the woods?

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    285. With all Cersei’s bastards dead, there isn’t really anyone (established in the show) that can claim Storm’s End and lead the Stormlands, and they may be one of the only places to stay loyal to Cersei. Gendry should be the rightful lord (although Cersei would probably claim she is the Lady of Storm’s End as Robert’s widow, but everyone hates her so it wouldn’t take too much cajoling to convince them otherwise), but no one will believe him. There is really only 1 person who can validate his claim, and that is Davos. Maybe he told Jon Snow about him and Jon asked him to look for him to try and ally with the Stormlands. Whether its that way or another, I have a feeling if Gendry is really coming back, it is going to be as Lord of Storm’s End & Lord Paramount of the Stormlands. I would say Dragonstone too, but I think Dany’s much more likely to claim that for herself considering its her ancestral home (other than the Red Keep).

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    286. ygritte:
      maria,

      Why do so many posters act like Jon needs to beg Dany for help, give up or offer something to her, when it’s the whole flipping realm of people at risk of the WW threat and Jon is only trying to warn of the danger and help save humanity? Why do we need to pit them against each other in this regard? If “Jon needs her army and dragons” to help fight annihilation then it is not just for him and his people personally, it is for every living soul in the land who does NOT want to turn into a zombie, which also included Dany and her people. Alas it is in the best interest of everybody to ban together to fight the otherworldly beings including Dany, it is not just Jon’s problem!

      thats why I will always dislike Dany. Like some of her fans think like she is entitled and everyone needs to bow down to her *eyeroll*. Other female characters on the show, that I admire much more than here dont have the luck to have dragons and are more badass, best example is Arya.

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    287. Arya Serious,

      Hi Arya Serious! You are one of the most pleasant people in this community.

      Regarding the Widow’s Wail: I also though that it shoudn’t have been buried with Joffrey, but on re-watch of the series I noticed that the sword was indeed placed on his lap when he laid in the Sept of Baelor. Hardly there is a custom to take away the burial goods from the dead body or replace them with less precious ones after the burial ceremony (sounds like abomination to me), so, IMO there is a big probability that the Widow’s Wail was indeed buried with Joffrey. And if it is discovered in the ruins after the fire dies out, it would also give some meaning to the blowing of the Sept. Something like “Bad things happen for a reason” or similar. Moreover, the fire could have been a necessary ingredient to give the sword the power to kill the WW. Let’s be frank: we don’t know for sure, whether the Longclaw proved it’s efficiency because it was Valyrian, or because it has been in the fire and was used to kill a willing sacrifice Qhorin Halfhand. I know, everyone thinks that Nisa-Nisa and her equivalent has to be young and beautiful, but IMO it’s worth to think outside the box. If the sacrifice is needed for the sword to gain the soul of that sacrifice, then the Longclaw gained the soul of Quorin Halfhand with his last words “I am the watcher on the wall” and Ice probably embodied Ned’s who also whispered something before beheading and now that soul is split between the Oathkeaper and the Widow’s Wail.
      One way or another, I believe that the Widow’s Wail will do its job in the War for Dawn.

      As for Jaime, we have similar feelings about him, however my predictions are different. The In Production Teaser showed used his shot from S2, when Jaime was hold captive, and since then I have a feeling that he will be a prisoner this season too. Cersei simply can’t afford having around someone with king-slaying record and such a deadly look on his face. And remember their mute exchange in 610? Cersey looked at him with pain and regret, but after that SHE TURNED AWAY while Qyburn was saying “Long may she reign.” So, it’s pretty clear: she already sacrificed him for the sake of the length of her reign, cause she is perfectly aware what he is capable of, and she will be locking him ASAP, probably right after the coronation ceremony or even continuing it as the firs act of the queen.

      And then she will torment way in every way possible. It’s worth to admit that for Cersey her love for her children (and Jaime too, I imagine) was a heavy burden, not a joy, and that she hated the inevitability of that love. So, now when she has finally reached the point of no return, she will be trying to destroy that last bond with Jaime in the most sadistic and gruesome manner. And there was a bit of foreshadowing, when Jaime asked the High Sparrow what kind of atonement he needed for his sins. This: he will have to suffer Cersei’s hatefulness to the skin of his bones, but that will free him and he will reemerge as a changed man.

      And yes, I believe that Brienne will save him at the last moment or at least give him a chance to die in her hands risking her own life, which might be even more tragic, if she develops some relationship with Tormund by that time. IMO, they might meet in the Dragonpit and that will be like the Bearpit II. But that won’t mean that they should be shipped. Their relationship is of different kind: Brienne for Jaime is like a mentor, and he for her is like a bad pupil in whom she believes against all odds. And he won’t fail her, but before that he will have to do his walk of atonement alone.

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